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Author Topic: Collateral damage to Enos  (Read 3450 times)

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Steef

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #50 on: November 09, 2017, 08:37:46 am »

The offense has NOT sucked under Enos.  Where do you get that from?  It's not true statistically, won us the games that we have won, and has showcased the talent we do have very well.  Unfortunately our OL stinks and it's hampered this year terribly bad because of it.

We will have to disagree.
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Razorfox

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #51 on: November 09, 2017, 08:58:42 am »

We will have to disagree.

Ugh, I hate that.  Back up your claim with something...anything.

2015: Arkansas was #1 offense in the nation in efficiency, #2 offense in the SEC, produced 465.5 yards and 35.9 points per game, and made BA damn good quarterback

2016: Arkansas averaged 30 PPG and produced a 3400+ yard passer and a 1300+ yard rusher, even though both were new starters.  Made AA a good quarterback (although not quite as good as his brother the year before). This while the OL was already beginning its slide.

2017: The wheels have fallen off, our OL is awful, our starter at QB, RB, and best receiver were all injured.  Our defense and special teams are terrible to mediocre at best.  And we've still managed to average 30 PPG. 
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hawgon

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #52 on: November 09, 2017, 09:00:52 am »

Ugh, I hate that.  Back up your claim with something...anything.

2015: Arkansas was #1 offense in the nation in efficiency, #2 offense in the SEC, produced 465.5 yards and 35.9 points per game, and made BA damn good quarterback

2016: Arkansas averaged 30 PPG and produced a 3400+ yard passer and a 1300+ yard rusher, even though both were new starters.  Made AA a good quarterback (although not quite as good as his brother the year before). This while the OL was already beginning its slide.

2017: The wheels have fallen off, our OL is awful, our starter at QB, RB, and best receiver were all injured.  Our defense and special teams are terrible to mediocre at best.  And we've still managed to average 30 PPG.

I’ll say this.  The measure of a good offense has changed.  In today’s college football 30 ppg is not good enough to win many games. 
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Steef

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #53 on: November 09, 2017, 09:06:20 am »

Ugh, I hate that.  Back up your claim with something...anything.


Don't really care what you like or dislike.

2015: Arkansas was #1 offense in the nation in efficiency, #2 offense in the SEC, produced 465.5 yards and 35.9 points per game, and made BA damn good quarterback

2016: Arkansas averaged 30 PPG and produced a 3400+ yard passer and a 1300+ yard rusher, even though both were new starters.  Made AA a good quarterback (although not quite as good as his brother the year before). This while the OL was already beginning its slide.

2017: The wheels have fallen off, our OL is awful, our starter at QB, RB, and best receiver were all injured.  Our defense and special teams are terrible to mediocre at best.  And we've still managed to average 30 PPG.

2015 was our best year. Enos' first year. Alex' last. BA's last (and only really good year).

Not a coincidence.

Downhill since then.

Yes, the Oline is awful. Oh, wait! Whose responsibility is that?

Playcalling is awful. Halftime adjustments are awful. We JUST discovered the screen pass this year after someone (cough...cough....Enos) realized we were getting blitzed every down.

Etc.

If you're happy with Enos' time here, then we really have nothing more to discuss.
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Steef

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #54 on: November 09, 2017, 09:08:03 am »

I’ll say this.  The measure of a good offense has changed.  In today’s college football 30 ppg is not good enough to win many games.

There ARE a number of good, high scoring offenses out there.

But Nick seems able to contain them. As do a few other good defensive teams.

There's really nothing new under the sun.
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hawgon

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #55 on: November 09, 2017, 09:09:06 am »

There ARE a number of good, high scoring offenses out there.

But Nick seems able to contain them. As do a few other good defensive teams.

There's really nothing new under the sun.

If Nick Saban is your standard, then, in your own words, we don’t have much to talk about.
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Razorfox

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #56 on: November 09, 2017, 09:12:10 am »

I’ll say this.  The measure of a good offense has changed.  In today’s college football 30 ppg is not good enough to win many games. 

Like I said, in 2015 we had the #2 offense in the SEC.  The SEC has the best defenses and thus 30 PPG is usually good enough for top 5 in the conference. 
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Steef

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #57 on: November 09, 2017, 09:12:29 am »

If Nick Saban is your standard, then, in your own words, we don’t have much to talk about.

Can't stand the guy, personally.

But he DOES prove a good defense can handle all the current high powered spread offenses. So it CAN be done.

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31to6

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #58 on: November 09, 2017, 09:15:05 am »

Coming into the season, Enos was hitting everyone's radar for landing a major gig in the very near future.
Thoughts?
I think he will be just fine. Everyone with a brain knows our OL is a struggling, patchwork unit and he's managing to be creative enough to adjust the offense to deal with adversity (injured starting QB, inexperienced RB corp, horribly patchwork OL and bad OL coaching, etc).

The problem with having severe weaknesses on offense, particularly in the trenches, is that some of the creative things you may try will blow up horribly. When you have 3-4 DL in your backfield play after play, bad things just happen. And you can only run so many screens, misdirections and draws before the defense catches on. And you will run some trick plays that just blow up badly. If trick plays worked every time, they would just be called plays and they would be part of the every down playbook, not in the "in case we are being dominated up front" appendix.
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hawgon

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #59 on: November 09, 2017, 09:15:37 am »

Can't stand the guy, personally.

But he DOES prove a good defense can handle all the current high powered spread offenses. So it CAN be done.

IF your fourth string players are five star recruits, then yes, it can be done.
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Steef

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #60 on: November 09, 2017, 09:17:38 am »

IF your fourth string players are five star recruits, then yes, it can be done.

How do you think he reached this point?

The guy knows defense and coaching.

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Razorfox

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #61 on: November 09, 2017, 09:18:39 am »

Don't really care what you like or dislike.

2015 was our best year. Enos' first year. Alex' last. BA's last (and only really good year).

Not a coincidence.

Downhill since then.

Yes, the Oline is awful. Oh, wait! Whose responsibility is that?

Playcalling is awful. Halftime adjustments are awful. We JUST discovered the screen pass this year after someone (cough...cough....Enos) realized we were getting blitzed every down.

Etc.

If you're happy with Enos' time here, then we really have nothing more to discuss.

You should care, being able to back up an opinion with something is sort of an adult thing to do. 

That being said, our 2015 and 2016 offenses were better than the 2013 and 2014 offenses under Chaney.  2017, not so much, but it's not because Enos suddenly forgot how to do offense.  He has a terrible line (only marginally his responsibility) and injuries to contend with. 

Of all the things I can be disappointed in the last few years, Enos' offense is WAY down the list.  I would certainly put defense, special teams, and offensive line ineffectiveness much higher on my list. 
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hawgon

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #62 on: November 09, 2017, 09:19:06 am »

How do you think he reached this point?

The guy knows defense and coaching.

Yes, he did well enough that he eventually got a job at Alabama.
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Steef

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #63 on: November 09, 2017, 09:27:58 am »

You should care, being able to back up an opinion with something is sort of an adult thing to do. 


Thanks, mom.

It's a message board, not Wikipedia.

I assume you've watched the same games I have and therefore have the same basic info to fall back on.

Rehashing it every time an opinion is expressed would be tiresome and frankly, dumb.

You watched it. I watched it. You (apparently) thought the offense was acceptable. I did not.

We disagree.



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Steef

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #64 on: November 09, 2017, 09:29:43 am »

Yes, he did well enough that he eventually got a job at Alabama.

Bama didn't have 'fourth string 5 stars' when he got there. He built that up.

Why is this even a question? Are you saying ANYONE could have gotten Bama to where they are now and Saban is overrated as a coach?

He proves that defense can still work. Live with it.
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younghog

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #65 on: November 09, 2017, 09:33:02 am »

I know that lateral call that turned into a scoop and score.. As well as Cantrell running the ball on the 3 was one of the two worse calls of the year..

However I like ENOS when he utilizes the Horses..

GO HOGS

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goodguytex

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #66 on: November 09, 2017, 09:46:04 am »

I fully believe that one reason Enos is so high on CK is that he has been able convince Bert that because of CK’s inexperience and his comfort with the shotgun to do more things from the shotgun and with spread principles.  Whereas with AA Bert insisted on a lot more under center and longer developing plays that got him killed.
Yeah. With our Oline issues, I've noticed way too many plays taking way too long to develop at the LOS.  You can't do that in the SEC and expect to have success. Speed wins games. And the Hogs don't have much right now.
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hawgon

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #67 on: November 09, 2017, 09:48:31 am »

Bama didn't have 'fourth string 5 stars' when he got there. He built that up.

Why is this even a question? Are you saying ANYONE could have gotten Bama to where they are now and Saban is overrated as a coach?

He proves that defense can still work. Live with it.

They always had better talent than everyone else.  Now, if Saban were at Arkansas, there is no question that we would be better in every way, but we wouldn’t be Alabama.

Even Saban himself admitted to changing his offenses to score more because they could not consistently shut down modern offenses.
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goodguytex

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #68 on: November 09, 2017, 09:52:56 am »

They always had better talent than everyone else.  Now, if Saban were at Arkansas, there is no question that we would be better in every way, but we wouldn’t be Alabama.

Even Saban himself admitted to changing his offenses to score more because they could not consistently shut down modern offenses.
Well yeah, that's what great coaches do. They adapt and adjust to win. They make halftime adjustments to give their team a better chance for success over their opponents. For whatever reason, and I don't know what they are, Arkansas coaches haven't seemed to successfully do that
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Con el Cerdos

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #69 on: November 09, 2017, 09:57:37 am »

I still believe that Chaney will eventually show why Chaney is terrible. Although with Georgia level talent maybe he won’t get desperate and call crappy plays repeatedly.

When you have the hosses Ga has up front, and it's running backs, (and the execution is there) it's hard to fail as a play caller.  It seems that a high percentage of Ga plays are runs in the A-gap, or off the left or right tackle.  Occasionally, they will throw a wide play at the opponent just to keep the LBers and safeties  honest.

And when all that works, and it usually does, the play action passes work as well.

If Kirby keeps recruiting at the same level as he's doing, I think Chaney will be there as long as he wants to be.

On another note and that certainly won't hurt Chaney, Bama has some injury problems that will affect the SEC Champion outcome, IMO.  Ga may already be no more than a "tick" away from Bama's talent level, if they are not there now.  I think Ga will beat Bama for the SECC.
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The Kig

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #70 on: November 09, 2017, 10:30:28 am »

Can't stand the guy, personally.

But he DOES prove a good defense can handle all the current high powered spread offenses. So it CAN be done.

Not entirely true... Against less talented teams, yes... He still locks down most teams, but even acquiesced to running more spread RPO (mostly run right now b/c Hurts can't throw) because he found himself having to outscore teams like Clemson, Ole Miss, Auburn and really had eye opening experiences when Johnny Foozeball was beating Bama in Tuscaloosa.   This year, on paper it looks like the D is back, but after breaking FL ST's QB they haven't really faced an efficient Offense since...and may not until the playoffs.
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Con el Cerdos

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #71 on: November 09, 2017, 10:40:15 am »

Enos Bielema's offense has always sucked in the red zone
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Steef

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #72 on: November 09, 2017, 11:20:14 am »

Not entirely true... Against less talented teams, yes... He still locks down most teams, but even acquiesced to running more spread RPO (mostly run right now b/c Hurts can't throw) because he found himself having to outscore teams like Clemson, Ole Miss, Auburn and really had eye opening experiences when Johnny Foozeball was beating Bama in Tuscaloosa.   This year, on paper it looks like the D is back, but after breaking FL ST's QB they haven't really faced an efficient Offense since...and may not until the playoffs.

I would argue that Johnnie Foozball was a phenomenon,  not an entire scheme. So was Clemsons QB/WR combo.

The spread (imo) that Nick had the most trouble with was Ole Miss.

You're right that he had to adjust his offense. But that could be a dual factor....his plodding offenses weren't scoring much at all.
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The Kig

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #73 on: November 09, 2017, 12:09:07 pm »

I would argue that Johnnie Foozball was a phenomenon,  not an entire scheme. So was Clemsons QB/WR combo.

The spread (imo) that Nick had the most trouble with was Ole Miss.

You're right that he had to adjust his offense. But that could be a dual factor....his plodding offenses weren't scoring much at all.

Indeed, he was a phenomenon... Still can't figure out how that scrawny kid wiggled out of so many bad situations and made magic.

Another testament to Saban's legacy is going to be realizing that he had to adjust his offensive philosophy to be able to score against those type teams vs. relying on his D to keep teams from scoring. 
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atom hog

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #74 on: November 09, 2017, 03:54:53 pm »

Don't really care what you like or dislike.

2015 was our best year. Enos' first year. Alex' last. BA's last (and only really good year).

Not a coincidence.

Downhill since then.

Yes, the Oline is awful. Oh, wait! Whose responsibility is that?

Playcalling is awful. Halftime adjustments are awful. We JUST discovered the screen pass this year after someone (cough...cough....Enos) realized we were getting blitzed every down.

Etc.

If you're happy with Enos' time here, then we really have nothing more to discuss.
[/quote
^^^^
This is what I have said all season! Again, the OC has admitted to forgetting Hammonds into games early in the season. Malpractice! Only until they finally woke up to realize they were indeed playing for their jobs, did they pull out the stops to save their bacon.
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ToddW

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #75 on: November 09, 2017, 05:33:23 pm »

after looking at GA and seeing Pittman and Chaney and looking at the decline i'm beginning to think Bert is not a very good CEO coach.  I can see our line play steadily decline.  Enos is really IMHO the only one on staff i like and besides the team feel bad for. 

He will land solid.  If i was him if Bert is retained i would go shopping for another gig somewhere else.
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Ex-Trumpet

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #76 on: November 09, 2017, 05:40:43 pm »

Enis will be fine.  And, I'd be willing to bet that if he were the HC this year, he'd win a minimum of 8 games.
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Razorback7

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Re: Collateral damage to Enos
« Reply #77 on: November 09, 2017, 09:58:30 pm »

Enos is overrated. Not impressed at all. We play like the team he use to coach for crying out loud.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dan_Enos
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