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Author Topic: Petrino Lovers  (Read 4877 times)

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porkrindjimmy

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #300 on: September 19, 2017, 09:43:55 pm »

Without a bumper crop of in-state recruits? This coach, whoever it may be, is going to suddenly do something that no other coach in our school history has done - climb to the national top without a lot of in-state players?

That would be nice, but I would have to see it to believe it.

Yes...without a bumper crop of instate players. Look, Texas is going to be our hotbed. Find a coach with a unique offensive system who has ties to Texas and can recruit his tail off...you will see it. I promise you.

PRJ
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DoctorSusscrofa

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #301 on: September 19, 2017, 09:44:14 pm »

Eh... He left some pretty good pieces.  More than what Nutt left for Bobby, IMO.

Those pieces list 17 games in the two years immediately after BP. Seventeen out of 24. Two of the worst back to back seasons in our history. No way they'd have won 10 either year. None.
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ChitownHawg

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #302 on: September 19, 2017, 10:01:13 pm »

Yes...without a bumper crop of instate players. Look, Texas is going to be our hotbed. Find a coach with a unique offensive system who has ties to Texas and can recruit his tail off...you will see it. I promise you.

PRJ

I hope you are spot on with this analysis.
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toxichog

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #303 on: September 19, 2017, 10:25:01 pm »

I travel to Louisville quite a bit and Cardinal fans aren't quite as enamored with Bobby as they were at first.  Losing the last 4 out of 6 games ( including getting beat at home to the hated Kentucky Wildcats ) will tend to do that.  They don't understand why he won't recruit defensive players........sound familiar?  Petrino is the perfect offensive coordinator, as the head administrator of a program........not so much. 
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EastexHawg

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #304 on: September 19, 2017, 11:20:27 pm »

What did his recruits do the following 2 years? Are you trying to sell the idea that those recruits were going to win 10 games, but their talent, knowledge, and skill flew away when BP left? What a con!

Spurrier dominated at Florida.  He left, Ron Zook took over, and they immediately became mediocre.  Zook was fired, Urban Meyer took over, and Florida again dominated almost immediately, to the tune of two national championships.  Meyer left...and Florida has become a shell of what it once was.

Meanwhile, Jim Tressel won big at Ohio State.  He was fired,  an assistant was promoted, and they finished below .500.  Urban Meyer was hired and they went almost two seasons without losing a game...and smoked Saban and Bama to win a national championship shortly thereafter.

It's really not that hard to understand.
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HognitiveDissonance

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #305 on: September 19, 2017, 11:32:27 pm »

Bielema hasn't gotten that special offensive talent.  Our backs are good and highly recruited.  But they aren't in that special range.  No transcendent player like MJ DMac or combo of Mallett and WRs pressuring a D vertically.  No return guy like Joe.  Good players but we need that rare player or group every now and then. 

I'll add if he has recruited them he isn't playing them.
Alex Collins was a 5-star RB.
Hunter Henry was a 5-star TE.

Many other good players.

Bielema has actually recruited equal or better than Petrino...but he's not in the same league as a coach.

This is the biggest knock of CBP: luck. You want to mention Mallett? Joe Adams?
Ok, I just mentioned Collins and Henry. Now what did they do with those guys?

Secondly, forget those fringe guys and compare the rosters of the two teams. The 'core' of the 2010-11 teams looked like your traditional Arkansas squad: lots and lots of 3-star guys, good but not great talent. Alvin Bailey, Cobi Hamilton, Dennis Johnson, Tramain Thomas, Jerry Franklin, Chris Gragg, Zach Hocker, Jake Bequette, Travis Swanson. I could go on. All of those guys were 3-star guys. Greg Childs---3 star. Chris Gragg was actually a 2-star.

Take the full roster and average the 'stars' and you might actually find CBB has had more talent than CBP.

But that's irrelevant. The fact remains CBP is an elite offensive mind and can outsmart nearly everyone he coaches against with Xs and Os. Give him decent talent and he can win.

By the same token, he 'lucked' into Lamar Jackson. Ha. Lamar Jackson was a 3-star recruit, the kind Louisville is able to get. (similar to Arkansas) Petrino saw the guy couldn't be tackled and decided to build his offense around him, even though his offense is really a pro-style offense. But he's smart enough to do that. He turned Jackson into a Heisman Winner.
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jkstock04

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #306 on: September 19, 2017, 11:49:26 pm »

Alex Collins was a 5-star RB.
Hunter Henry was a 5-star TE.

Many other good players.

Bielema has actually recruited equal or better than Petrino...but he's not in the same league as a coach.

This is the biggest knock of CBP: luck. You want to mention Mallett? Joe Adams?
Ok, I just mentioned Collins and Henry. Now what did they do with those guys?

Secondly, forget those fringe guys and compare the rosters of the two teams. The 'core' of the 2010-11 teams looked like your traditional Arkansas squad: lots and lots of 3-star guys, good but not great talent. Alvin Bailey, Cobi Hamilton, Dennis Johnson, Tramain Thomas, Jerry Franklin, Chris Gragg, Zach Hocker, Jake Bequette, Travis Swanson. I could go on. All of those guys were 3-star guys. Greg Childs---3 star. Chris Gragg was actually a 2-star.

Take the full roster and average the 'stars' and you might actually find CBB has had more talent than CBP.

But that's irrelevant. The fact remains CBP is an elite offensive mind and can outsmart nearly everyone he coaches against with Xs and Os. Give him decent talent and he can win.

By the same token, he 'lucked' into Lamar Jackson. Ha. Lamar Jackson was a 3-star recruit, the kind Louisville is able to get. (similar to Arkansas) Petrino saw the guy couldn't be tackled and decided to build his offense around him, even though his offense is really a pro-style offense. But he's smart enough to do that. He turned Jackson into a Heisman Winner.
These guys want to act like Greg childs and Chris Gragg were blue chip once in a lifetime 5* recruits out of Arkansas high school and Petrino just lucked into them. The spin on this thread has been unbelievable...but not really.
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Iwastherein1969

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #307 on: September 20, 2017, 12:08:51 am »

These guys want to act like Greg childs and Chris Gragg were blue chip once in a lifetime 5* recruits out of Arkansas high school and Petrino just lucked into them. The spin on this thread has been unbelievable...but not really.
you pretty much nailed it....besides, I'd rather be lucky than good any ol' day...anyone who thinks Petrino has accomplished what he has in his career as a coach and believes its merely luck, bets on their lucky number and gray horses exclusively when they go to Oaklawn Park
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Sweet Feet

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #308 on: September 20, 2017, 12:10:57 am »

BP only beat 2 SEC teams with winning conference records over those 2 years. TWO! Remember Troy and the Vanderbilt games? Yeah, very similar to the Toledo game. Very lucky to win either of those games. Whenever he played a good team (Alabama) he got blasted just like he did Saturday night vs Clemson.
Also, he fell into a natural lucky recruiting situation. Chris Gragg, DJ Williams, Tyler Wilson, just to name a few were razorbacks no matter who was here. Put all the in state talent combined with an SEC that was really, really, down equals an overvalued 2 years and fools gold. He did beat LSU with Jordan Jefferson. Congrats to him for that feat. Not that we haven't done that in the past few years or anything (cough cough)
At Louisville last year he had the Heisman Trophy WINNER and still struggled with that team. Losses to Virginia and Kentucky combined with several close calls to teams like Duke. He is one of the most overrated coaches in the history of college football when you really dig into his record. Do not just look at W's and L's but who he beat. Point is stop acting like we had an elite coach ... truth is we never had one.

Petrino in those 2 years defeated 7 ranked teams, including 5 who finished the season in the top 25 and 2 in the top 10. His 2 regular season losses both years were to either the defending national champ, the eventual national champ, or the eventual national runners up. Petrino also had Arkansas in a Major Bowl game for the first time since 89 and finishing in the top 5 for the first time probably since the 1977 season.

At Louisville last year, he did lose games he wasn't supposed to, but I guess we are going to forget how be MURDERED Florida St last year and at least PRODUCED a heisman?

While we are at it, lets forget about how in his first 4 year stint at Louisville alone, he is the first coach in school history to have 2 11+ win seasons, the first coach in school history to win 12 games, the only coach to finish in the Top 10 (twice at that), finish in the AP top 5, and the first coach to win a BCS bowl for the school.

You and some of these other posters can have this bitter ex-girlfriend delusion about Petrino all you want, but a REAL fan with College Football IQ knows that Petrino is a dam good coach, whether your feelings say he is or not.
« Last Edit: September 20, 2017, 12:42:01 am by Sweet Feet »
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Biggus Piggus

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #309 on: September 20, 2017, 12:15:17 am »

How about this? Blah, blah, blah...Petrino sucks...can't coach...blah, blah, blah...I love Bret...you don't question when it is a reasonable expectation for Bret to improve because Petrino sucks...blah...blah...Bret...great...blah..blah...the end..

PRJ

Blah, blah, blah...TCU's really good, you'll see...blah, blah, blah...you should be satisfied with this...blah, blah, blah...
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Sweet Feet

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #310 on: September 20, 2017, 12:38:10 am »

No luck at all. Didn't need it. Played 80% of the games vs lesser talent

Petrino in 2010 and 2011 alone beat 7 teams ranked at gametime, 5 teams that finished the season ranked and 2 that finished in the Top 10.
Bielema in all 4 years combined beat 7 ranked teams at gametime, beat 4 teams that finished the season ranked and 1 that finished in the top 10.

But carry on....
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bvillepig

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #311 on: September 20, 2017, 01:04:16 am »

Another knock on him was he doesn't recruit defensive players.
Philon,Flowers,Winston,Wise,  can't remember a few line backers and d backs that are now in the pros.  That is a myth

I wouldn't mind a few of those on this roster. 

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ChitownHawg

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #312 on: September 20, 2017, 04:51:04 am »

Another knock on him was he doesn't recruit defensive players.
Philon,Flowers,Winston,Wise,  can't remember a few line backers and d backs that are now in the pros.  That is a myth

I wouldn't mind a few of those on this roster.

His issue was hamstringing the defense during practice. Made his defense ill prepared for the game.
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Porkchop#1

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #313 on: September 20, 2017, 06:41:58 am »

His issue was hamstringing the defense during practice. Made his defense ill prepared for the game.
Anyone even remotely familiar with a football practice can go ahead and call BS on this one.
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ChitownHawg

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #314 on: September 20, 2017, 07:07:30 am »

Anyone even remotely familiar with a football practice can go ahead and call BS on this one.

You be wrong. Too many have reported on it.
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IronHog

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #315 on: September 20, 2017, 07:47:48 am »

His issue was hamstringing the defense during practice. Made his defense ill prepared for the game.


He set up situations for teaching QBs.


That's why his guys made plays.  It did probsbbly hamstring the defense a bit.


His real issue was not delegating to a real D.C.  However in the 5 losses his last two years the offense or special teams were the primary reason for the losss.
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Tiredofhogssucking

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #316 on: September 20, 2017, 08:02:53 am »

I think most Razorback fans simply long for the days when our games were relevant.  If that makes me a Petrino Lover...then I'll take that type of football over what we have today.   Unfortunately, I think we're going to be in the 11am kick-offs for most of the remaining games this year.  What I cannot fathom is why CBB sold us that he was going to change ARK to a power running team that would break the other teams "will to compete" and it would take time to build. 

Ok...we've given him time...and where's the power running game?  He and Jeff Long tout we have kids that go to class and graduate...but our 2017 APR scores are 10th in the SEC...just a tad higher than the football team at this point. 

Our fan base has been patient and we've left him alone to build this thing.  And from what I can see, it still needs some MAJOR work to complete. 
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ChitownHawg

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #317 on: September 20, 2017, 08:03:38 am »


He set up situations for teaching QBs.


That's why his guys made plays.  It did probsbbly hamstring the defense a bit.


His real issue was not delegating to a real D.C.  However in the 5 losses his last two years the offense or special teams were the primary reason for the losss.

Yep, he probably didn't care how his DC looked on game day as long as the media was singing his offensive genius. I'm surprised Willie didn't snap him like a twig.  ;D
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Atlhogfan1

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #318 on: September 20, 2017, 08:29:51 am »

Alex Collins was a 5-star RB.
Hunter Henry was a 5-star TE.

Many other good players.

Bielema has actually recruited equal or better than Petrino...but he's not in the same league as a coach.

This is the biggest knock of CBP: luck. You want to mention Mallett? Joe Adams?
Ok, I just mentioned Collins and Henry. Now what did they do with those guys?

Secondly, forget those fringe guys and compare the rosters of the two teams. The 'core' of the 2010-11 teams looked like your traditional Arkansas squad: lots and lots of 3-star guys, good but not great talent. Alvin Bailey, Cobi Hamilton, Dennis Johnson, Tramain Thomas, Jerry Franklin, Chris Gragg, Zach Hocker, Jake Bequette, Travis Swanson. I could go on. All of those guys were 3-star guys. Greg Childs---3 star. Chris Gragg was actually a 2-star.

Take the full roster and average the 'stars' and you might actually find CBB has had more talent than CBP.

But that's irrelevant. The fact remains CBP is an elite offensive mind and can outsmart nearly everyone he coaches against with Xs and Os. Give him decent talent and he can win.

By the same token, he 'lucked' into Lamar Jackson. Ha. Lamar Jackson was a 3-star recruit, the kind Louisville is able to get. (similar to Arkansas) Petrino saw the guy couldn't be tackled and decided to build his offense around him, even though his offense is really a pro-style offense. But he's smart enough to do that. He turned Jackson into a Heisman Winner.

Alex was a good college RB.  Talented.  But not the level I am talking about.   HH great TE.  TE don't transform and elevate teams.   

Petrino didn't luck into Jackson.  Lamar Thomas talked him into giving him a scholarship to play qb where other major programs wouldn't. 
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Atlhogfan1

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #319 on: September 20, 2017, 08:32:23 am »

These guys want to act like Greg childs and Chris Gragg were blue chip once in a lifetime 5* recruits out of Arkansas high school and Petrino just lucked into them. The spin on this thread has been unbelievable...but not really.

Not acting like he lucked into them.  The timing of when these players would come to our program at the same time as Mallett was good for him.   Fit what he wants to do offensively and he was successful at putting them in positions to succeed. 
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hogsanity

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #320 on: September 20, 2017, 08:40:46 am »

Yes...without a bumper crop of instate players. Look, Texas is going to be our hotbed. Find a coach with a unique offensive system who has ties to Texas and can recruit his tail off...you will see it. I promise you.

PRJ

You do know, in this day of college football, a unique system would be like the wishbone or veer. Spread is everywhere.
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RebHog

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #321 on: September 20, 2017, 10:41:00 am »

Good point as they are in a different conference this go around. And he lost to Kentucky last year. Can you imagine this board if he were our coach with a Heismann QB and we lose to Kentucky.

There would not be a single BP lover on the board.

That 3 STAR Heisman trophy winner I would be thrilled to have. Hmm Gee is this worse than promising tough play at half time for all 4 quarters then getting blown out AGAIN in the 2nd half with the commentators calling it "Comeback for the ages"  weak stuff.....
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RebHog

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #322 on: September 20, 2017, 10:48:41 am »

Sure that's what he meant...Bielema hasn't had an in state class of that much "prowess" yet so we can't expect him to do as well as Petrino...blah blah blah.

What's funny about that is all I've heard the last couple of years is how awesome and much better Bielema has recruited than Petrino. Supposedly the deepest we have been since joining the SEC and so and and so on. I'm not buying this BS anymore. Ill have to actually see it first before I start believing.

And yet when the win/loss facts comparing the two are presented it suddenly shifts to Petrino having the best instate talent of all time yet he left the cupboard "bare" for CBB...funny isn't it?
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The Hawg Marshal

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #323 on: September 20, 2017, 10:55:50 am »

Sure is a lot of time and energy spent on here arguing over something that is never gonna change. Bobby is gone and is never coming back. Bret is here and may never leave.The latter is a problem , the former has already remedied itself.
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shown006

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #324 on: September 20, 2017, 11:05:21 am »

There were three teams ranked #1, #2, and #3 in the West when Petrino coached his last regular season game.....that's #1, #2, and #3 in the country...not in the SEC.  He only lost 2 games that year, to the #1 and #2 teams in the country (Bama and LSU).  That #3 team in case you've forgotten, was Arkansas.  The year before....he lost 3 games, again to the #1 team in the country...another team from the West...this time Auburn.  That's 4 teams of 6 that were ranked in the Top 3 in the country Petrino's last two years.
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Swestwill66

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #325 on: September 20, 2017, 11:48:58 am »

Sure is a lot of time and energy spent on here arguing over something that is never gonna change. Bobby is gone and is never coming back. Bret is here and may never leave.The latter is a problem , the former has already remedied itself.

Double depressing!
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HognitiveDissonance

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #326 on: September 20, 2017, 12:29:02 pm »

Back to the 'luck' thing...I didn't even mention the fact that all those guys were recruited and convinced to come to Arkansas by CBP

As I recall, the very next day after taking the job, CBP and Tim Horton traveled to Warren to start recruiting those guys. He worked hard to get them.

J Wright: Was committed to Nutt, re-opened after Nutt left, then was recruited again by CBP and signed
R Mallett: Was considering Ark and Tenn. It was not a slam dunk he was coming here, since he went to Michigan originally. Mallet's family actually contacted Brian Brohm to get a feel for Petrino, etc.
J Adams: Was commited to USC. Was convinced to flip his commitment
C Hamilton: Came down to Tex and Ark.
D Johnson: Was a very late offer, wasn't being recruited that hard. You could say that was an insightful move by the coaches, became the all-time SEC kick returner
G Childs.

All these guys chose Ark BECAUSE of Petrino, not in spite of. Why, because they knew they were going to throw the ball around the field. They could very well had ended up elsewhere, especially Adams, Mallett, and Hamilton. I suspect J Wright would have come anyway since he was already committed to the previous staff.
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Redhogs

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #327 on: September 20, 2017, 12:37:10 pm »

Back to the 'luck' thing...I didn't even mention the fact that all those guys were recruited and convinced to come to Arkansas by CBP

As I recall, the very next day after taking the job, CBP and Tim Horton traveled to Warren to start recruiting those guys. He worked hard to get them.

J Wright: Was committed to Nutt, re-opened after Nutt left, then was recruited again by CBP and signed
R Mallett: Was considering Ark and Tenn. It was not a slam dunk he was coming here, since he went to Michigan originally. Mallet's family actually contacted Brian Brohm to get a feel for Petrino, etc.
J Adams: Was commited to USC. Was convinced to flip his commitment
C Hamilton: Came down to Tex and Ark.
D Johnson: Was a very late offer, wasn't being recruited that hard. You could say that was an insightful move by the coaches, became the all-time SEC kick returner
G Childs.

All these guys chose Ark BECAUSE of Petrino, not in spite of. Why, because they knew they were going to throw the ball around the field. They could very well had ended up elsewhere, especially Adams, Mallett, and Hamilton. I suspect J Wright would have come anyway since he was already committed to the previous staff.
Nice to hear some facts for a change. He actually went out and got a kicker who was committed to Hawaii too, his name would be Hocker. All that luck.........
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Atlhogfan1

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #328 on: September 20, 2017, 12:39:00 pm »

Back to the 'luck' thing...I didn't even mention the fact that all those guys were recruited and convinced to come to Arkansas by CBP

As I recall, the very next day after taking the job, CBP and Tim Horton traveled to Warren to start recruiting those guys. He worked hard to get them.

J Wright: Was committed to Nutt, re-opened after Nutt left, then was recruited again by CBP and signed
R Mallett: Was considering Ark and Tenn. It was not a slam dunk he was coming here, since he went to Michigan originally. Mallet's family actually contacted Brian Brohm to get a feel for Petrino, etc.
J Adams: Was commited to USC. Was convinced to flip his commitment
C Hamilton: Came down to Tex and Ark.
D Johnson: Was a very late offer, wasn't being recruited that hard. You could say that was an insightful move by the coaches, became the all-time SEC kick returner
G Childs.

All these guys chose Ark BECAUSE of Petrino, not in spite of. Why, because they knew they were going to throw the ball around the field. They could very well had ended up elsewhere, especially Adams, Mallett, and Hamilton. I suspect J Wright would have come anyway since he was already committed to the previous staff.

This group fit well with BPs offense. 
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HognitiveDissonance

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #329 on: September 20, 2017, 12:39:07 pm »

Alex was a good college RB.  Talented.  But not the level I am talking about.   HH great TE.  TE don't transform and elevate teams.   

Petrino didn't luck into Jackson.  Lamar Thomas talked him into giving him a scholarship to play qb where other major programs wouldn't.
Ha, more Petrino discrediting.

Just like 'someone' talked him into giving Zach Hocker a scholarship. I've heard that before. Likewise, 'someone' else talked him giving Lamar Jackson a scholarship, and they deserve the credit. Anything to discredit and fit the agenda.

That's beside the point, anyway. The real intelligence is recognizing and building an offense around this player, and going against what you normally do. Being adaptable to fit the player(s).

Alex Collins, 5-star RB, one of only three players to have 1000 yards his first three years in the SEC. And yet he's still not special enough, guess you have to be Herschel or Bo or DMac to warrant that kind of special-ness.

I don't understand people with agendas. I don't love CBP. But I can compare different coaches with an open-wide and just go where the evidence points.
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IronHog

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #330 on: September 20, 2017, 12:42:55 pm »

Back to the 'luck' thing...I didn't even mention the fact that all those guys were recruited and convinced to come to Arkansas by CBP

As I recall, the very next day after taking the job, CBP and Tim Horton traveled to Warren to start recruiting those guys. He worked hard to get them.

J Wright: Was committed to Nutt, re-opened after Nutt left, then was recruited again by CBP and signed
R Mallett: Was considering Ark and Tenn. It was not a slam dunk he was coming here, since he went to Michigan originally. Mallet's family actually contacted Brian Brohm to get a feel for Petrino, etc.
J Adams: Was commited to USC. Was convinced to flip his commitment
C Hamilton: Came down to Tex and Ark.
D Johnson: Was a very late offer, wasn't being recruited that hard. You could say that was an insightful move by the coaches, became the all-time SEC kick returner
G Childs.

All these guys chose Ark BECAUSE of Petrino, not in spite of. Why, because they knew they were going to throw the ball around the field. They could very well had ended up elsewhere, especially Adams, Mallett, and Hamilton. I suspect J Wright would have come anyway since he was already committed to the previous staff.


B Green transfer

D. Johnson
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Atlhogfan1

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #331 on: September 20, 2017, 12:43:36 pm »

Ha, more Petrino discrediting.

Just like 'someone' talked him into giving Zach Hocker a scholarship. I've heard that before. Likewise, 'someone' else talked him giving Lamar Jackson a scholarship, and they deserve the credit. Anything to discredit and fit the agenda.

That's beside the point, anyway. The real intelligence is recognizing and building an offense around this player, and going against what you normally do. Being adaptable to fit the player(s).

Alex Collins, 5-star RB, one of only three players to have 1000 yards his first three years in the SEC. And yet he's still not special enough, guess you have to be Herschel or Bo or DMac to warrant that kind of special-ness.

I don't understand people with agendas. I don't love CBP. But I can compare different coaches with an open-wide and just go where the evidence points.

Dumb.  No discrediting.  How many times do I have repeatedly praise BPs coaching ability?

BP started thinking about a qb like Jackson in his offense back when he thought he was going coach Vick.  Not luck.  But there is a backstory as to how Jackson ended up at Louisville. 
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Atlhogfan1

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #332 on: September 20, 2017, 12:46:13 pm »

Ha, more Petrino discrediting.

Just like 'someone' talked him into giving Zach Hocker a scholarship. I've heard that before. Likewise, 'someone' else talked him giving Lamar Jackson a scholarship, and they deserve the credit. Anything to discredit and fit the agenda.

That's beside the point, anyway. The real intelligence is recognizing and building an offense around this player, and going against what you normally do. Being adaptable to fit the player(s).

Alex Collins, 5-star RB, one of only three players to have 1000 yards his first three years in the SEC. And yet he's still not special enough, guess you have to be Herschel or Bo or DMac to warrant that kind of special-ness.

I don't understand people with agendas. I don't love CBP. But I can compare different coaches with an open-wide and just go where the evidence points.

Yes. DMac. MJ. Players capable of taking over games and elevating teams. Unique talents.  AC was a good college RB as I've already said. 
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IndianaHog

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #333 on: September 20, 2017, 12:55:45 pm »




Here is your 2009 class of in-state players. While I appreciate each of these players and envy them for getting to be a Hog they do not come close to the level of the previous class.

Colbi Hamilton WR
Turell Williams RB
Austin Tate TE
Neal Barlow WR
Telvin Griffin WR
William Serano WR
Justin Wortman WR

http://247sports.com/college/arkansas/Season/2009-Football/Commits

Your Honor the Defense rests its case. ;D

Confused to how you "lucked" into a bunch of 3 stars? Isn't like he "lucked" in a bunch of 4 and 5 stars.  CBB instate class in 2015 is rating MUCH higher.
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HognitiveDissonance

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #334 on: September 20, 2017, 12:56:06 pm »

Petrino didn't have a DMac either.
None of those guys exaggereated as 'special' (Mallett, Adams, Wright, etc) are in DMac's level as special.

CBB has had equal or better offensive talent, and it mostly came in that first class with Collins and Henry. Enos has done a good job with it, better than Chaney.

I stand firm in saying CBB has had good or better talent overall than CBP. And equal or better than Nutt. Nutt recruited better than given credit for, it seems.

That's the problem with Bret though. He's not an expert in anything.
Petrino: offensive guru
Saban: defensive mastermind
Nutt: terrific motivational skills
Beamer: special teams expert

Sticking to Arkansas, you had Petrino and Nutt who excelled in at least one area.

What is Bret's expertise? Nothing, really. Definitely not special teams, ha.

I like CBB a lot, terrific face of the program, man of integrity, values academics, his players, etc. This is a professional evaluation, not personal.
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IndianaHog

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #335 on: September 20, 2017, 01:08:55 pm »

Petrino didn't have a DMac either.
None of those guys exaggereated as 'special' (Mallett, Adams, Wright, etc) are in DMac's level as special.

CBB has had equal or better offensive talent, and it mostly came in that first class with Collins and Henry. Enos has done a good job with it, better than Chaney.

I stand firm in saying CBB has had good or better talent overall than CBP. And equal or better than Nutt. Nutt recruited better than given credit for, it seems.

That's the problem with Bret though. He's not an expert in anything.
Petrino: offensive guru
Saban: defensive mastermind
Nutt: terrific motivational skills
Beamer: special teams expert

Sticking to Arkansas, you had Petrino and Nutt who excelled in at least one area.

What is Bret's expertise? Nothing, really. Definitely not special teams, ha.

I like CBB a lot, terrific face of the program, man of integrity, values academics, his players, etc. This is a professional evaluation, not personal.

Yep you would be correct. In Arkansas 2015 instate class they had 5 freaking 4 star recruits! Petrino never had that in any class in the state.  CBB been out recruiting Petrino and had higher ranked classes but way less results.  CBB best season main contributes was Petrino players and once they exited CBB been average as best.


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Atlhogfan1

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #336 on: September 20, 2017, 01:09:11 pm »

Petrino didn't have a DMac either.
None of those guys exaggereated as 'special' (Mallett, Adams, Wright, etc) are in DMac's level as special.

CBB has had equal or better offensive talent, and it mostly came in that first class with Collins and Henry. Enos has done a good job with it, better than Chaney.

I stand firm in saying CBB has had good or better talent overall than CBP. And equal or better than Nutt. Nutt recruited better than given credit for, it seems.

That's the problem with Bret though. He's not an expert in anything.
Petrino: offensive guru
Saban: defensive mastermind
Nutt: terrific motivational skills
Beamer: special teams expert

Sticking to Arkansas, you had Petrino and Nutt who excelled in at least one area.

What is Bret's expertise? Nothing, really. Definitely not special teams, ha.

I like CBB a lot, terrific face of the program, man of integrity, values academics, his players, etc. This is a professional evaluation, not personal.

Petrino didn't need it as he had more "stars" on his 2010 offense than any Ark coach has had.

You seem to think you are arguing Petrino is a better coach than BB or Nutt. Waste of time.  He is.  Best we have had as far as Xs and Os.

Petrino didn't have luck.  He had good timing which matters.   And the coaching ability to have had success with it.

Nutts Ark career extended because he was coach when MJ and DMac came put of Ark HS

Anderson with Portis.  Think where that would have gone without Bobby. 

Talent available and timing matters.  Schedule matters to success.  Doesn't mean BP isn't a great offensive coach.  If you want to see luck look to AU 2013. 
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Swestwill66

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #337 on: September 20, 2017, 01:09:41 pm »

Those pieces list 17 games in the two years immediately after BP. Seventeen out of 24. Two of the worst back to back seasons in our history. No way they'd have won 10 either year. None.
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Swestwill66

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #338 on: September 20, 2017, 01:13:19 pm »

Those pieces list 17 games in the two years immediately after BP. Seventeen out of 24. Two of the worst back to back seasons in our history. No way they'd have won 10 either year. None.

I recall Tyler Wilson calling out players in the 2012 season for quitting. BP wouldn't have tolerated that! So the win total would have been different.
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IndianaHog

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #339 on: September 20, 2017, 01:23:42 pm »

Petrino didn't need it as he had more "stars" on his 2010 offense than any Ark coach has had.

You seem to think you are arguing Petrino is a better coach than BB or Nutt. Waste of time.  He is.  Best we have had as far as Xs and Os.

Petrino didn't have luck.  He had good timing which matters.   And the coaching ability to have had success with it.

Nutts Ark career extended because he was coach when MJ and DMac came put of Ark HS

Anderson with Portis.  Think where that would have gone without Bobby. 

Talent available and timing matters.  Schedule matters to success.  Doesn't mean BP isn't a great offensive coach.  If you want to see luck look to AU 2013.

Now it's timing LOL always a reason why CBP had success here.  So what's CBB reason for not winning? Is it also timing even tho his classes are higher?
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Atlhogfan1

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #340 on: September 20, 2017, 01:44:46 pm »

Now it's timing LOL always a reason why CBP had success here.  So what's CBB reason for not winning? Is it also timing even tho his classes are higher?

No not now.  Then and has been discussed since. 

He isn't good enough for this job.?

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HognitiveDissonance

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #341 on: September 20, 2017, 02:29:17 pm »

Petrino didn't need it as he had more "stars" on his 2010 offense than any Ark coach has had.

You seem to think you are arguing Petrino is a better coach than BB or Nutt. Waste of time.  He is.  Best we have had as far as Xs and Os.

Petrino didn't have luck.  He had good timing which matters.   And the coaching ability to have had success with it.

Nutts Ark career extended because he was coach when MJ and DMac came put of Ark HS

Anderson with Portis.  Think where that would have gone without Bobby. 

Talent available and timing matters.  Schedule matters to success.  Doesn't mean BP isn't a great offensive coach.  If you want to see luck look to AU 2013.
-->Petrino didn't need it as he had more "stars" on his 2010 offense than any Ark coach has had.

Again a disservice and I disagree.
You can argue the 2015 offensive weapons were as good(Collins, B Allen, H Henry, D Reed, D Morgan, K Hatcher, J Sprinkle)
You can argue the Quinn Grovey, James Rouse, Barry Foster, Derek Russell offense was just as loaded
You can argue the Bill Montgomery, Chuck Dicus, Bill Burnett offense was as loaded
You can argue the DMac, Hillis, Monk, and Felix Jones offense was as loaded
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DoctorSusscrofa

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #342 on: September 20, 2017, 02:52:13 pm »

Yep you would be correct. In Arkansas 2015 instate class they had 5 freaking 4 star recruits! Petrino never had that in any class in the state.  CBB been out recruiting Petrino and had higher ranked classes but way less results.  CBB best season main contributes was Petrino players and once they exited CBB been average as best.

Because Alex, Denver, Darius P. and Frank were all Petrino recruits, right?
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Wildhog

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #343 on: September 20, 2017, 02:53:30 pm »

Because Alex, Denver, Darius P. and Frank were all Petrino recruits, right?

Philon was a Petrino recruit.
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Atlhogfan1

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #344 on: September 20, 2017, 02:56:48 pm »

Philon was a Petrino recruit.

That was a great gift.   And I say that not to diminish the fact Petrino and staff got him.  Kind of like Grant when Nutt was coach. 
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Wildhog

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #345 on: September 20, 2017, 02:59:05 pm »

That was a great gift.   And I say that not to diminish the fact Petrino and staff got him.  Kind of like Grant when Nutt was coach. 

It is what it is.  He was a Petrino signee.
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Atlhogfan1

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #346 on: September 20, 2017, 03:00:36 pm »

-->Petrino didn't need it as he had more "stars" on his 2010 offense than any Ark coach has had.

Again a disservice and I disagree.
You can argue the 2015 offensive weapons were as good(Collins, B Allen, H Henry, D Reed, D Morgan, K Hatcher, J Sprinkle)
You can argue the Quinn Grovey, James Rouse, Barry Foster, Derek Russell offense was just as loaded
You can argue the Bill Montgomery, Chuck Dicus, Bill Burnett offense was as loaded
You can argue the DMac, Hillis, Monk, and Felix Jones offense was as loaded

I put stars in quotations as I was referring to the recruiting services.  No disservice. 
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Atlhogfan1

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #347 on: September 20, 2017, 03:01:17 pm »

It is what it is.  He was a Petrino signee.

Yep. Helped BB a lot. 
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GuvHog

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #348 on: September 20, 2017, 03:11:17 pm »

Yep. Helped BB a lot. 

At least half of the starters on that 2014 Hog defense that did so well were Petrino recruits.
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EastexHawg

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Re: Petrino Lovers
« Reply #349 on: September 20, 2017, 03:13:41 pm »

I travel to Louisville quite a bit and Cardinal fans aren't quite as enamored with Bobby as they were at first.  Losing the last 4 out of 6 games ( including getting beat at home to the hated Kentucky Wildcats ) will tend to do that.  They don't understand why he won't recruit defensive players........sound familiar?  Petrino is the perfect offensive coordinator, as the head administrator of a program........not so much. 

This sort of thing is repeated over and over.  Here are the facts:

In Petrino's third and fourth years at Arkansas, playing most his own recruits and with his staff's coaching, his teams gave up the following in SEC games:

2010  28.1 points per game
2011  24.6 ppg

In Bielema's third and fourth seasons, when he was playing mostly his own recruits and with his staff's coaching, his teams gave up:

2015  30.1 ppg
2016  37.3 ppg

Consider that Petrino's defenses put up those numbers playing opposite his offense, while Bielema's gave up more points despite the fact that he tries to run clock time on offense.

Oddly enough, Bielema's best defense was the 2014 unit that featured, among others:

Trey Flowers...Petrino recruit.  I said at the time he was the best overall player in the SEC.  Patriots fans might agree
Darius Philon...Petrino recruit
Deatrich Wise...Petrino recruit
Taiwan Johnson...Petrino recruit
Rohan Gaines...Petrino recruit
Tevin Mitchell...Petrino recruit
Martrell Spaight...Bielema recruit
Brooks Ellis...Bielema recruit

Petrino left Bielema Flowers, Philon, Chris Smith, Robert Thomas, Wise, and Johnson on the defensive line.  Name six Bielema defensive line recruits as salty as that group. 

That Petrino never recruited for or cared about defense is yet another myth that is gladly spread by two groups of people...those with an agenda and those ignorant enough to believe what the people with agendas tell them.

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