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Author Topic: gotya update--heavy on the avionics  (Read 509 times)

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gotyacovered

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gotya update--heavy on the avionics
« on: October 20, 2015, 04:19:28 pm »

completely open to advice, comments and experience. dont hold back.

for those of you who dont know: i have a 1968 C182L with about 130 hours on a 275hp pponk'd and 3blade done is 09/2014 with an incredibly outdated panel and no auto pilot. 2700 hours on the frame. its a beastly 182. BEAST.

my transponder recently went out and i took it to my avionics shop to explore options. here is what the shop owner suggested:

option 1 (complete upgrade, all prices installed)
PS Engineering GMA340 - $3800
Garmin GTX 327 - $2650
Garmin GTN 650/GI 106A - $14,700
Garmin GDL 88 ADS-B Datalink - $5000
Total - $26k

option 2
Lynx NGT-9000 - $10,000

outside of adding a GTN 750 or an additional 650 option 1 is a top of the line panel. i have no idea about the lynx, other than the price he gave is a limited time offer, think there are some rebates from lynx for wiring harnesses and such and maybe up to a year wait for the install.

now for the nitty gritty and where i would like outside opinions...

i am a 50/50 partner. i fly 120-130 hours/year and my partner is flying less than 20. he has owned the plane for over 27 years; i bought half in august, 2011. as you can may be able to guess, he would rather sell his share to me than upgrade at all--understandable. i am not really interested in owning 100% (and finding another partner in my area is unlikely); if i am going to spend the money to own it out right (i think) i would rather sell and look for another opportunity, faster opportunity mainly, but /Golf equipped of course. 2 problems, i dont think we can sell it for what we feel it is worth and i cant (maybe more of 'dont wanna') go without a plane for an extended period of time.

all that said... the new engine/prop was $55k. would we be money ahead to go with the lynx system and sell it like it is?

Or, just bite the bullet, buy pard out, wait a while to save up and then upgrade it how i want... (and still have a slow-ish plane).

worst of all, until il get all of this done, or some avionics looked at/repaired... i am going to be a VFR pilot--which as most of you know is KILLING me.
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GusMcRae

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Re: gotya update--heavy on the avionics
« Reply #1 on: October 21, 2015, 12:23:41 pm »

Just my $.02,,, when you decided to do the engine upgrade, you were somewhat committed to hang on to 653 for awhile, or take your licks when you sell or trade.
If you upgrade avionics, then you are even more committed than you were after the engine upgrade, to keep 653 in the family, long enough to outlast your next couple of dogs, to justify the investment. 
I know you pondered all of this back before the p'ponk decision.  Go back and read page 1 of your "And so it begins" thread.  I realize situations change.
You are, or were, somewhat sentimentally attached to 653.  And as discussed back then,,, there's a lot of value in "knowing what you have", versus taking a chance on buying someone else's problem when you trade or buy another bird.

I know nothing about that Lynx.  Is it a multi-functional piece of equipment, i.e. trasponder and a radio/gps?
Adding an auto pilot is very expensive.  I'm sure you knew that.

I seriously doubt I will hang on to my 182 long enough to overhaul, but I realize I very well may do just that.  Just not attached to 88R, and want to gain knowledge and experience flying something else, even if it is only upgrading to a 182 RG. 
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john c

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Re: gotya update--heavy on the avionics
« Reply #2 on: October 21, 2015, 08:04:05 pm »

The research can be very confusing but you fly the family a lot and the avionics package is a big safety factor.  Do you have the plastic panel or a flat panel?  When remodeling our 182Q, we went to a metal, flat panel because it was easier on installation, wiring harnesses, future maintenance and looks.  Added a two axis coupled autopilot and just loved it, especially in IFR.  After considerable discussion with other pilots, I went to a shop at New Century (Olathe) that had a lot of experience in major avionics changes.  Price was better and the experience was very good.  Went there later for similar retro of Seneca, same good experience.  But, these guys had done so many of these type re-do's that the knowledge base was great.  You can always shop someone like that even if you don't use them.  The 182 went up in value considerably due to these changes (above costs) and when we sold it (major, major mistake) it was snapped up because of the work.  One other thing is that the Q model is 28 volt.  I believe the earlier models can get a 28v upgrade.  Sadly, these things just aren't cheap.  Family, though.
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gotyacovered

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Re: gotya update--heavy on the avionics
« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2015, 09:01:28 am »

Just my $.02,,, when you decided to do the engine upgrade, you were somewhat committed to hang on to 653 for awhile, or take your licks when you sell or trade.
If you upgrade avionics, then you are even more committed than you were after the engine upgrade, to keep 653 in the family, long enough to outlast your next couple of dogs, to justify the investment. 
I know you pondered all of this back before the p'ponk decision.  Go back and read page 1 of your "And so it begins" thread.  I realize situations change.
You are, or were, somewhat sentimentally attached to 653.  And as discussed back then,,, there's a lot of value in "knowing what you have", versus taking a chance on buying someone else's problem when you trade or buy another bird.

I know nothing about that Lynx.  Is it a multi-functional piece of equipment, i.e. trasponder and a radio/gps?
Adding an auto pilot is very expensive.  I'm sure you knew that.

I seriously doubt I will hang on to my 182 long enough to overhaul, but I realize I very well may do just that.  Just not attached to 88R, and want to gain knowledge and experience flying something else, even if it is only upgrading to a 182 RG. 

thanks gus... and yup, the biggest value at this point is the 'ya know what you got'

the engine had to be done, even in retrospect.  truth be know, and in retrospect, i probably shouldnt have bought her in the first place, from a financially responsible perspective anyways. but, its just money... i'll make more and even if we sold it today, i still wouldn't take a bath and lose any out of pocket money, or very little.

its actually about the same situation, except now that we have a rig that has to be upgraded to fly safe IFR. and being in the system is a major prority that offsets some of the cost for me at this point. i am truely in between a rock and a hard place.

on the Redboard it was suggest to re-do the contract with my pard, i'll upgrade out of pocket and if we ever sell i will get a higher percentage of the selling price. i am pretty uncomfortable with that, and unsure pard will even go for it. plus how do we pay for the ongoing expenses involved? charts, wx packages, mx, ect. would he still be on the hook for 50%???
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gotyacovered

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Re: gotya update--heavy on the avionics
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2015, 09:19:53 am »

The research can be very confusing but you fly the family a lot and the avionics package is a big safety factor.  Do you have the plastic panel or a flat panel?  When remodeling our 182Q, we went to a metal, flat panel because it was easier on installation, wiring harnesses, future maintenance and looks.  Added a two axis coupled autopilot and just loved it, especially in IFR.  After considerable discussion with other pilots, I went to a shop at New Century (Olathe) that had a lot of experience in major avionics changes.  Price was better and the experience was very good.  Went there later for similar retro of Seneca, same good experience.  But, these guys had done so many of these type re-do's that the knowledge base was great.  You can always shop someone like that even if you don't use them.  The 182 went up in value considerably due to these changes (above costs) and when we sold it (major, major mistake) it was snapped up because of the work.  One other thing is that the Q model is 28 volt.  I believe the earlier models can get a 28v upgrade.  Sadly, these things just aren't cheap.  Family, though.

old school plastics with original av package less one VOR. it went on the blink a month ago and my glideslope is coming in slow, like scary slow. no more approaches for me. lotta story to this, but i flew the ILS into KPDK to mins and the we were about to go missed b/c it came in so slow and probably legally should have. as i was about to give her go juice it came alive. i am very glad i had a 30k+ hour pilot right seat. i woudnt have been that big of a deal, b/c i have the 696 with updated plates and should be able to use it for reference, but in my training we have not been using it and when the pressure was on i could not fly and hit all the right buttons to get the pertinent screen(s) up.

additional info...
my day began at 5:30am
worked until 15:00
picked up my son from school 15:30
packed our stuff up and this was probably the most stressful of the whole day:)
hopped in 653 from M18 16:30
picked dad up Country Air Estates just outside of LR 17:50
flew with no autopilot 3 hours in the soup and shot an approach down to mins at 21:45 Central

very fatiguing situation.

back on 653... decisions, decisions. may just grind it out in the 182, stash some cash and make a move this time next year. sigh.
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bvillepig

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Re: gotya update--heavy on the avionics
« Reply #5 on: October 29, 2015, 12:36:55 pm »

Gotya

I hope you get it worked out. Good to hear from you.
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john c

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Re: gotya update--heavy on the avionics
« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2015, 01:37:09 pm »

Saw this while looking at something else.  Posting because 182 guys may find it interesting:

https://www.redskyventures.org/doc/C182_ModelHistory__from_RSV_Cessna_Training_Manual-Apr2011.pdf

Interesting website, if nothing else. Q&A page is free.  Gary Morris and Dave Hayden are who did my two panels.  Find them on the Sales Team page.  Lots of knowledge, well worth the call.  If I remember correctly, Gary (maybe Dave) had recently flat paneled a C-180 when I went there to see about having the 182 done.  Saw their panel and was sold. 
 
http://www.butleravionics.com/
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gotyacovered

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Re: gotya update--heavy on the avionics
« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2015, 03:02:15 pm »

Gotya

I hope you get it worked out. Good to hear from you.

the struggle is real;D

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gotyacovered

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