Fans

[bphi11ips]

We sold out season tickets in 2012, go figure.....oh, good thing those Vol fans in West TN don't know about this distance thing.

Maybe you recall that Tennessee played one game per year in Memphis well into the 90's.  Usually a good game.  Interesting that they are paying rent and sacrificing 33,000 seats next year to play UAB in Nashville.  Butch Jones stated reason - recruiting.

Tennessee has a population of 6.5M.  Combined MSAs for Chattanooga, Johnson City, and Knoxville is 1.546M.  All are within two hours of Neyland Stadium. 

Moral of the demographic story?  Arkansas is going to need fans from Central Arkansas to fill RRS.  Always has been that way, always will be.   

[hawg17]

We sold out season tickets in 2012, go figure.....oh, good thing those Vol fans in West TN don't know about this distance thing.

So you are saying that Tennessee has better fans? Sounds accurate. And selling out season tickets is not selling out games. When Bama sold out this year they even said it on the broadcast that it was the first sell at RRS in several years. How do you think that looked to recruits? I am not bashing anyone here, I know we just do not have the fan base to do it. Just saying that there are other factors. I live on the outskirts of LR and i still do not make that drive more than about once every other year. My kids play sports and it is just too much of a hassle. But people further East and South have a long way to go. And lately it has not been worth it.

[ricepig]

So you are saying that Tennessee has better fans? Sounds accurate. And selling out season tickets is not selling out games. When Bama sold out this year they even said it on the broadcast that it was the first sell at RRS in several years. How do you think that looked to recruits? I am not bashing anyone here, I know we just do not have the fan base to do it. Just saying that there are other factors. I live on the outskirts of LR and i still do not make that drive more than about once every other year. My kids play sports and it is just too much of a hassle. But people further East and South have a long way to go. And lately it has not been worth it.

No, they said it was Bielema's first sellout which wasn't correct as there were over 72,800 for the aTm game in 2013. I'm not sure what more you can do on a sellout besides selling all the tickets, I guess in your line of thinking their has never been a sellout anywhere.

[cc]

I could pay for tickets - thankfully money is not a issue right now.

I could make the hour drive, got a good vehicle

I could give up 4 or 5 Saturdays per year.

I could tell my son he can't play fall baseball, so as not to interfere with games.

I could tell my other son, no band and no quiz bowl - those take up lots of Saturdays

In other words, I COULD make every game, home and away, but right now with  a 16 and a 11 yr old, it is not top priority.

I hope to be able to make it to more once my youngest daughter gets older.  We have things every weekend.  Right now, those things that insignificant to everyone else are the most important to us.

[ricepig]

Maybe you recall that Tennessee played one game per year in Memphis well into the 90's.  Usually a good game.  Interesting that they are paying rent and sacrificing 33,000 seats next year to play UAB in Nashville.  Butch Jones stated reason - recruiting.

Tennessee has a population of 6.5M.  Combined MSAs for Chattanooga, Johnson City, and Knoxville is 1.546M.  All are within two hours of Neyland Stadium. 

Moral of the demographic story?  Arkansas is going to need fans from Central Arkansas to fill RRS.  Always has been that way, always will be.   

They don't need SEA, SWA, or NEA fans, too? What about Dallas area fans, Tulsa, Memphis, or Southern MO? I guess we should have quit playing in LR in the 90's in your analogy.

[hogsanity]

Yet fans across the country for generations have been sacrificing Saturdays to drive distances and attend games for their team for a LONG time.

Did not say they had not, that was actually my point.  It is not EASY for many people to attend games. Very few major football playing schools are located in the largest population center of their states. Tuscaloosa, Auburn, Athens, Starkville, Oxford, Fayetteville in the SEC ( maybe both Columbia's could be included too ). None of those are in the largest city in their state.

But here is the difference, When those of us who are now late 30's or older were growing up, if you wanted to see your team regularly, you had to go to the games. Now, you can see every game your team plays without ever leaving your house. At this point in many of our lives, it is neither a good use of our time or money to spend 7 or 8 Saturdays at a game.  For others, that is their family entertainment, and that is great, everyone should have some activity in which they spend time with family and friends.

For others, like myself, we did not go to many games when I was growing up, even though I have lived in FS my whole life. We went to a few, and when i was old enough to drive and ha some spending money, me and some friends would go to a couple football and a couple bball games every year. So, going to games is not something that was ever a big part of my life. When we do go, we have a great time, but it is not our top priority.

[thirrdegreetusker]

It's never going to be, that's correct, that's why the UofA should never consider adding on to the Stadium.  It'd just be a waste of money to do so.  I've never understood why the people of our State think they're the best fans in all of College Football, some crazy notion I guess that someone said many years ago when times were far different, but we wouldn't make the best fan base in a top 25 poll.

All UA home football games, Fay or LR,  regardless of opponenmt, were pre-season sellouts for about 40 years. The RRS expansion about a dozen years ago changed that.

[bphi11ips]

They don't need SEA, SWA, or NEA fans, too? What about Dallas area fans, Tulsa, Memphis, or Southern MO? I guess we should have quit playing in LR in the 90's in your analogy.

Your typical twisted reasoning. 

[hogsanity]

I hope to be able to make it to more once my youngest daughter gets older.  We have things every weekend.  Right now, those things that insignificant to everyone else are the most important to us.

Exactly. It is just not like it was, or at least I think I remember it was when I was growing up. Friday night was HS football, and Sat was college football. Schools did not plan band contests, quiz bowls, etc during the fall on football Saturdays. JRHS and HS coaches did not have practices on college football Saturdays. There was no fall baseball, no soccer. Boys club football, may have been early on Saturdays, but I remember it being on weeknights mostly.

Now, if you have kids between 4 and 18, and if they are involved in ANYTHING other than school, you can bet your Saturdays are full.

I will say this, and I will probably have fire rained down on me from the board, but I have been married over 20 years. When I got married I had a group of friends, probably 10 or so, all about the same age, all got married around the same time. Most of them still played golf, or went fishing, or to all the home games ( football and basketball), or went hunting pretty much every Sat and Sunday of the year. Now they spend one or two weekends a month visiting their kids because all but two of that group are divorced. Was it doing all those things on weekends, no idea, but it is the one common thread they all had.

[ricepig]

Your typical twisted reasoning. 

Well, at least it's reasoning unlike ........

[bphi11ips]

Exactly. It is just not like it was, or at least I think I remember it was when I was growing up. Friday night was HS football, and Sat was college football. Schools did not plan band contests, quiz bowls, etc during the fall on football Saturdays. JRHS and HS coaches did not have practices on college football Saturdays. There was no fall baseball, no soccer. Boys club football, may have been early on Saturdays, but I remember it being on weeknights mostly.

Now, if you have kids between 4 and 18, and if they are involved in ANYTHING other than school, you can bet your Saturdays are full.

I will say this, and I will probably have fire rained down on me from the board, but I have been married over 20 years. When I got married I had a group of friends, probably 10 or so, all about the same age, all got married around the same time. Most of them still played golf, or went fishing, or to all the home games ( football and basketball), or went hunting pretty much every Sat and Sunday of the year. Now they spend one or two weekends a month visiting their kids because all but two of that group are divorced. Was it doing all those things on weekends, no idea, but it is the one common thread they all had.

It is difficult to do the things you once did when you have kids, at least it should be. 

[ricepig]

It is difficult to do the things you once did when you have kids, at least it should be. 

My boys want to go to the games, my girl, not really.

[bphi11ips]

Well, at least it's reasoning unlike ........

The point is that UT needs fans from Chattanooga and Johnson City to fill Neyland.  Nebraska needs fans from Omaha to fill Memorial.  Alabama needs fans from Birmingham to fill Bryant-Denny.  Arkansas needs Little Rock too fill RRS.

That doesn't mean fans from other areas are unimportant, but you know Little Rock and its 750,000 residents two and a half hours away are the bread and butter, and so does everyone else here with any understanding of the situation.   

[MountieDawg]

I didnt go to the University, but I have sent multiple kids there and I am a fan. But I prefer not to spend the $300 bucks to take my family to a game that I know want be interesting after 30 minutes. If they were undefeated and the game meant something, I might... but still not sure that I would.

[hogsanity]

My boys want to go to the games, my girl, not really.

My kids are 16 and 11.  The older one and I went to two games every year from the time he was 5 until he was 12. One he hit jrhs, he had a lot of other things he was involved in, or just wanted to spend Saturdays doing stuff with his friends. Yea, I was kind of sad about it, but I understood. My youngest plays baseball, so that takes up Sept and early Oct Saturdays, and he has never even asked to go to a game. We went to a few, but he is just as happy to stay home, goof around, and then watch the games on tv.

In some ways I envy the guys I see in the stand with their kids, but I have things my boys and I do together, it is just not going to Hog games.

[bphi11ips]

I've read every comment in this thread, and OP, I totally see where you are coming from.  I am almost 60, which means little, except that it gives me a little different take on this topic.  I was born in Rogers, and my parents were fanatic Razorback lovers.  They took us to as many games as possible, home and away, even at Razorback Stadium when there were no lights....all day games.  My love for the Hogs grew as I became older.  For about seven years now, I have been a season-ticket holder, even though I know that I cannot attend but one or two games.  I work on Saturday nights and live in NW Louisiana and must request time off to attend any games.  I do pick and choose the games that I think would mean the most to me.  For the games I cannot attend, I either sell the tickets or, in some cases, give them away to someone who will attend and call the Hogs in my place.  I'm not trying to toot my own horn, but I feel that's what I can do to support the team that I dearly love and give others the joy I receive. 

To those who have other family or work obligations or interests other than Hog football, I do understand.  But to the ones who speak of several games on TV, most of which are conflicting with each other, that's what I use my DVR for.  Also, most games are on later that night or through the week.  It's really all about your personal choices, for the most part, which is an individual thing.  To me, there is no better thrill than to drive up old 71N in the Fall, in the anticipation of reaching Fayetteville to witness the excitement of fans tailgating, general camaraderie, and the sense of coming home.  But maybe that's just me. If I was retired or had a "regular" job, there would be little to keep me from my first love......the Hogs. But, I will never belittle someone or call them "not a real fan" because of their choices.  It would be a perfect world, though, if the stands could be full for every home game. Most of us that live away from NW Arkansas have different perspectives.  We envy those who live within driving distance and can attend the games easily (that meaning short distance). 

I've said all this to say.....fans should try to support their teams to the best of their ability.  That varies from person to person and by individual situations, but in all of our hearts lives the love for our Razorbacks.

Peace.

You, my dear, should post more and read less. 

We are all true Hogs fans here. 

[ricepig]

The point is that UT needs fans from Chattanooga and Johnson City to fill Neyland.  Nebraska needs fans from Omaha to fill Memorial.  Alabama needs fans from Birmingham to fill Bryant-Denny.  Arkansas needs Little Rock too fill RRS.

That doesn't mean fans from other areas are unimportant, but you know Little Rock and its 750,000 residents two and a half hours away are the bread and butter, and so does everyone else here with any understanding of the situation.   

I've never said they didn't, I'm saying you don't have to play a home game in LR to keep them.

[hogsanity]

It is difficult to do the things you once did when you have kids, at least it should be. 

It is difficult to do them in the quantity you once did. I still play golf with my buddies, but now instead of every weekend, it is a few times a year. Now when I go fishing, it is with my dad and my boys.

The last 6 weekends though have seen two baseball games, two hs marching band events, and my oldest son is also in a garage band ( thankfully not my garage ), and they have actually had a couple of shows.  So throw in the normal house/yard work, and Saturdays are full.

[Hawgndaaz]

Nick Saban, who has won 3 Championships recently, complains about fans not showing up for rent a wins too.


You guys need to get a life, hobby, or job.

this happens at most stadiums in college football.

[hogsanity]

I've never said they didn't, I'm saying you don't have to play a home game in LR to keep them.

That is the point many make about LR. At one point, they had to play in LR. Bad roads, low population, and few amenities made playing in Fay tough. But those hindrances are all gone. TN fans travel form all over Tn to see the Vols, same for OU, Neb, Penn St, So Car, Bama, Aub, LSU and many others. People travel from all corners of those states to see their team play. Ar seems to have the only fan base that part of thinks it is the schools obligation to bring the team to them.

[Hawgndaaz]

That is the point many make about LR. At one point, they had to play in LR. Bad roads, low population, and few amenities made playing in Fay tough. But those hindrances are all gone. TN fans travel form all over Tn to see the Vols, same for OU, Neb, Penn St, So Car, Bama, Aub, LSU and many others. People travel from all corners of those states to see their team play. Ar seems to have the only fan base that part of thinks it is the schools obligation to bring the team to them.

it is mostly the sidewalk fans that are obsessed with playing games in WMS. It is seriously a better and cheaper drunk for them.

[swinemaster]

This is just like every topic that gets debated.  Winning fixes everything.  It comes down to passion.  Passion comes from pride and success.  When you have enough of the fan base that is passionate enough about the program, the stadium will be full.  It's what separates the SEC from other conferences.

We don't have a fanbase that expects to win conference games.  Nor should they at this point.  When we get to a place where as fans we have realistic expectations of beating our conference foes, the stadium will be full.  Fans will make choices to come over watching on TV or going hunting etc....

[hawgsalot]

Pretty good post and as usual a lot of reasons why not to go.  My stance on this is quite different in the sense that there is nothing like a family going and loving a razorback game.  It's as quality of time as it gets, I've done the get up early drive home late and the kids were in hog heaven.  I've done the sit on the coach and the kids found something better to do most of the time.  I grew up living for and begging to go to games.  I played every sport and was as active as one can be but deep down it was ingrained in me how special that time was.  Back then it was special to see the Razorbacks live, win or lose.  Now I see it was special because it created so many memories with my family.  I will not rob my kids of that!

Now on to the other thing, money.  Yes it can be expensive and if you can't afford to go to a game don't go.  Those that whine about a $50.00 donation and proclaim to watch it on their $5000 TV shame on you.  If you care enough to get on this board and discuss the razorbacks then you should be giving $50 to the foundation anyway.  Its tax deductible by the way, there really isn't any excuse unless you truly can't afford it and if that's the case you don't need to consider going to a game anyway.  The foundation gift griping a few weeks ago really got under my skin.  I can't imagine griping about donating a $50 gift that's a tax write off, to go see my razorbacks.  It's truly turned my stance on the GSD.  A $50.00 donation get's you the cheapest seat all year to any game you want to go to, yet we had some on here and the radio acting like Jeff Long was stealing their milk.  We as a fanbase can't be lazy, if we are we will lose big.  We want to compete, even expect it, but then proclaim I'm not giving to the foundation and watching the game at home.  It's not just about the money, it's perception, it's also about recruiting. 

I'm proud I've continued my traditions with my kids, they haven't gone to every game and we've skipped some over the years due to financial concerns but year in and year out those few times a year we make some great memories.  20 years from now they will know it's more than just their beloved razorbacks.  Thank god I'm not sitting on my coach watching the game by myself.

[Hogfaniam]

No, they said it was Bielema's first sellout which wasn't correct as there were over 72,800 for the aTm game in 2013. I'm not sure what more you can do on a sellout besides selling all the tickets, I guess in your line of thinking their has never been a sellout anywhere.

That 72800 was not tickets sold.  Attendance includes every person in the stadium.  Staff, players, cheerleaders, band, all workers, refs, camera people,  etc.  it was very, very close to all tickets sold

[bphi11ips]

I've never said they didn't, I'm saying you don't have to play a home game in LR to keep them.

Nor did I. 

[bphi11ips]

Awwww.....thanks so much! I usually only post when something hits home with me.  My skin isn't as thick as it used to be and can't take the potential scathing comments.  Life is too short to criticize and bring down our common interest on here.  It's called Hogville for a reason, and it's a place for me (us) to come to keep abreast of Hog news and thoughts.  It gives me great laughter and joy a lot of the time.  Some posters on here are hilarious and quite smart.  Others, not so much.  But I've learned to skip over the usual suspects of negativity and sarcasm, choosing to stick with upbeat and positive.

Go Hogs all day long!  :razorback:

I was pretty naïve about Razorbacks fans before I started posting here, and even then it took me a while to figure out how much hatred there is among them.  The GSD brings out the worst of them, especially those who resent WMS and everything outside of NWA.  The coaching factions are next, especially those who hate Gus Malzahn.  Lately, those who can tolerate no objective discussion concerning the current team and its coaches are nearing the other two. 

I find myself posting here now more often than not simply to defend rational, good posters like yourself from the bullies, and I really don't care what side they're on. 

[hogsanity]

I was pretty naïve about Razorbacks fans before I started posting here, and even then it took me a while to figure out how much hatred there is among them.  The GSD brings out the worst of them, especially those who resent WMS and everything outside of NWA.  The coaching factions are next, especially those who hate Gus Malzahn.  Lately, those who can tolerate no objective discussion concerning the current team and its coaches are nearing the other two. 

I find myself posting here now more often than not simply to defend rational, good posters like yourself from the bullies, and I really don't care what side they're on. 

If you are getting your read of hog fans from here, well, that is not a good idea. The vast majority of fans think playing in LR is not a great idea. The vast majority think it is unwise to fire coaches after only 2 or 3 seasons.

[ricepig]

That 72800 was not tickets sold.  Attendance includes every person in the stadium.  Staff, players, cheerleaders, band, all workers, refs, camera people,  etc.  it was very, very close to all tickets sold

Yet, they claimed all tickets sold to the Bama game with a crowd of 72,300, please explain.

[bphi11ips]

If you are getting your read of hog fans from here, well, that is not a good idea. The vast majority of fans think playing in LR is not a great idea. The vast majority think it is unwise to fire coaches after only 2 or 3 seasons.

And I think those two consensuses are reflected here, although I question whether you are correct about a "vast majority" where WMS is concerned. 

My point has nothing to do with who is right or who is wrong.  It's the hatred and disrespect  expressed on Hogville that is distressing to many lifelong fans.  They read here but don't post much out of fear of getting flamed by the regular flamers.  I hate to say it because I often agree with you, but you can be pretty rude yourself. 

I don't worry about getting flamed because I have confidence in my experience as a Razorbacks fan and a football fan in general, and I don't mind defending myself.  Occassionally someone changes my opinion, and I am not afraid to admit it when they do.  For example, I have stated many times here that, on balance, it is time to play all games in RRS.  That doesn't mean I am not aware of the risks in doing so.  It isn't about convenience or per game costs.  It is about culture, loyalty, and recruiting.  Those are the considerations trustees, board members, and administrators weigh in the balance along with per game costs.

At the end of the day, I believe Hogville posters are all a bit testy after 3 years of unprecedented failure, even though most of us are enthusiastic about the future and the current staff and team.

[hogsanity]

And I think those two consensuses are reflected here, although I question whether you are correct about a "vast majority" where WMS is concerned. 

My point has nothing to do with who is right or who is wrong.  It's the hatred and disrespect  expressed on Hogville that is distressing to many lifelong fans.  They read here but don't post much out of fear of getting flamed by the regular flamers.  I hate to say it because I often agree with you, but you can be pretty rude yourself. 

I don't worry about getting flamed because I have confidence in my experience as a Razorbacks fan and a football fan in general, and I don't mind defending myself.  Occassionally someone changes my opinion, and I am not afraid to admit it when they do.  For example, I have stated many times here that, on balance, it is time to play all games in RRS.  That doesn't mean I am not aware of the risks in doing so.  It isn't about convenience or per game costs.  It is about culture, loyalty, and recruiting.  Those are the considerations trustees, board members, and administrators weigh in the balance along with per game costs.

At the end of the day, I believe Hogville posters are all a bit testy after 3 years of unprecedented failure, even though most of us are enthusiastic about the future and the current staff and team.

When I joined HV in 2005, it was a lot different. You could have a pages long discussion and never once was anyone called a name, or did they have their fandom questioned. Now, I sometimes think traffic trumps all.  Any thread, and I mean ANY can't make it one page without that stuff. 

[Who is our Coach?]

John Bacon wrote a fascinating article about this issue relative to Michigan football.  I am sure it has been debated and discussed here before.  The issue is that the Athletic Directors around the country are drunk on the TV money, and who can blame them.  The amount of money that is on the table is insane.  But it's not without associated cost.  It's inevitable that the in game atmosphere and attendance suffers.

http://www.johnubacon.com/2014/06/the-real-reasons-why-students-and-others-are-bailing-on-michigan-football-tickets/

When you take all that money to broadcast every game on 60" HD TVs, then soak the most loyal fans for more money, that model is just not sustainable.  Bacon wrote a follow up article and featured a woman who had donated literally for decades to get seats at the Big House on the 30 yard line.  We are talking thousands of dollars.  And within arm's length of her were people who got tickets to the game for buying four 2 liters of Coca Cola at a local supermarket. 

I understand that the ADs around the country are less in the Frank Broyles' mold of former coaches or even from those who ran the athletic department more in a non-profit method.  It's a bottom line, Madison Avenue/Wall Street group now.  And that's fine.  Bigger buildings are being built.  Scholarship figures are flush.  TV revenue is pouring in by the truckload.  But something is lost.  It's that spiritual relationship with the donating fan who is a true believer in their team and who will attend out of a form of Saturday obligation.  As the article says, treat those people like customers too many times, and they'll treat you the same way as they treat the place that sells them a new set of tires.  With cold decisions rooted solely in economics.

Personally, I am a long time donor and fan.  I too have small kids, so attending more than a few games a year is pretty much the limit.  I am for moving all games to Fayetteville because it's time and I am so sick of the GSD.  I had long supported keeping LR games for selfish reasons, in that I got to see an extra game or two and taking my oldest was easier.  But now, it's not worth it. 

I share my personal story for no other reason in that I now feel like that woman who has sacrificed for decades for something anyone on the street can get for peanuts.  I feel like a sucker.  Given the restrictions on my time, why would I pay what I now pay for what I get?  It makes better sense to get tickets for games you want to attend when you want to go.  If you have to throw a few extra bucks on top (which is extremely rare) to get good seats, it's still cheaper than a Foundation donation per seat.  And if I feel this way, I have to think many, many others do since I am what I consider a pedestrian donor and fan. 

[ricepig]

John Bacon wrote a fascinating article about this issue relative to Michigan football.  I am sure it has been debated and discussed here before.  The issue is that the Athletic Directors around the country are drunk on the TV money, and who can blame them.  The amount of money that is on the table is insane.  But it's not without associated cost.  It's inevitable that the in game atmosphere and attendance suffers.

http://www.johnubacon.com/2014/06/the-real-reasons-why-students-and-others-are-bailing-on-michigan-football-tickets/

When you take all that money to broadcast every game on 60" HD TVs, then soak the most loyal fans for more money, that model is just not sustainable.  Bacon wrote a follow up article and featured a woman who had donated literally for decades to get seats at the Big House on the 30 yard line.  We are talking thousands of dollars.  And within arm's length of her were people who got tickets to the game for buying four 2 liters of Coca Cola at a local supermarket. 

I understand that the ADs around the country are less in the Frank Broyles' mold of former coaches or even from those who ran the athletic department more in a non-profit method.  It's a bottom line, Madison Avenue/Wall Street group now.  And that's fine.  Bigger buildings are being built.  Scholarship figures are flush.  TV revenue is pouring in by the truckload.  But something is lost.  It's that spiritual relationship with the donating fan who is a true believer in their team and who will attend out of a form of Saturday obligation.  As the article says, treat those people like customers too many times, and they'll treat you the same way as they treat the place that sells them a new set of tires.  With cold decisions rooted solely in economics.

Personally, I am a long time donor and fan.  I too have small kids, so attending more than a few games a year is pretty much the limit.  I am for moving all games to Fayetteville because it's time and I am so sick of the GSD.  I had long supported keeping LR games for selfish reasons, in that I got to see an extra game or two and taking my oldest was easier.  But now, it's not worth it. 

I share my personal story for no other reason in that I now feel like that woman who has sacrificed for decades for something anyone on the street can get for peanuts.  I feel like a sucker.  Given the restrictions on my time, why would I pay what I now pay for what I get?  It makes better sense to get tickets for games you want to attend when you want to go.  If you have to throw a few extra bucks on top (which is extremely rare) to get good seats, it's still cheaper than a Foundation donation per seat.  And if I feel this way, I have to think many, many others do since I am what I consider a pedestrian donor and fan. 

So, your only reason for donating was for seat location, not to help the overall program? I'm just asking, not making a point either way.

[Who is our Coach?]

Both.  I also donate to non-athletic U of A causes.  The business school, the law school, alumni association, etc.

The point I am trying to make is similar to the one made by Bacon.  More of a macro view than a micro one of my personal situation, other than I think my situation is fairly typical.  It doesn't appear to be a sustainable business model.  And I think that is evidenced by attendance numbers across college football.  It made more sense to charge extra and require donations when you had a commodity (access to watching the game) that you couldn't purchase anywhere else.  Throw TV in the mix, which obviously gives alternatives, and it makes it harder to justify. 

[ricepig]

Both.  I also donate to non-athletic U of A causes.  The business school, the law school, alumni association, etc.

The point I am trying to make is similar to the one made by Bacon.  More of a macro view than a micro one of my personal situation, other than I think my situation is fairly typical.  It doesn't appear to be a sustainable business model.  And I think that is evidenced by attendance numbers across college football.  It made more sense to charge extra and require donations when you had a commodity (access to watching the game) that you couldn't purchase anywhere else.  Throw TV in the mix, which obviously gives alternatives, and it makes it harder to justify. 

So, will you, or have you quit donating to the RF entirely?

[Who is our Coach?]

That's a good question.  I haven't really given that much thought.  If I decide to stop purchasing tickets, I would likely at least reduce my donation from its current level.  But again, that's just a gut reaction based on an economic factors as discussed.

[Who is our Coach?]

And no, I haven't reduced or quit donating to the Foundation yet.  I was a Tush Hog for years out of school, and as I got older became a Wild Hog.

[ricepig]

And no, I haven't reduced or quit donating to the Foundation yet.  I was a Tush Hog for years out of school, and as I got older became a Wild Hog.

Ok, thanks for answering.

[code red]

Im not the expert like most of these posters seem to be.  I have been a hog fan all my life, Im 43 so thats a long time...I can recall when South Carolina came to the SEC with us, and they had the same problems we did.  The one differnce I noticed is that win or loose, that stadium was for the most part full and they were loud and proud.  Saturday, that stadium was not full for home comming.. Those players deserved for that place to be full.. I dont make alot of money, Im just a Paramedic, but I was there and going nuts...Its easy to show up when things are going our way (WINNING).  TRUE fans show UP regardless....Why are we so fickle.   I just dont get it...Now let the smart mouth comments start.  Thats common for this site.  iF YOU HAVE THE MEANS PLEASE BE THERE FOR THESE GUYS.  The corner is about to turn.

I have seen many occasions where SC hasn't filled sorry.

[Who is our Coach?]

Kentucky. who hasn't been in a big game since who knows when, hosted the number one team in the nation last weekend in a 60,000 seat stadium, and it wasn't full.  It's not something that's specific to Arkansas.  There were some empty seats in Baton Rouge last weekend too. 

[code red]

Spurrier used to complain how they filed out at first sign of trouble too....

This is silly. Hog fans have been great this year.

Agreed.  I have been to a lot of games.  I have been to Knoxville in 98 when 110K Tennessians were all hopped up on sour mash....and I got to say that the volume at RRS at Bama was as good as when Henry scored the winning touchdown in Neyland.

[hoghiker]

I didn't go to game. Felt some guilty about it but it was a great day to watch football, take a walk in the woods, and have some beers. Cost, nearly nothing. I've been a fan since I sat on my fathers knee and watched all white teams duke it out. Love game day but lots of options these days.

[Hogfaniam]

Kentucky. who hasn't been in a big game since who knows when, hosted the number one team in the nation last weekend in a 60,000 seat stadium, and it wasn't full.  It's not something that's specific to Arkansas.  There were some empty seats in Baton Rouge last weekend too. 

Kentucky isn't done with renovations and still have some areas not allowed to be seated in.

This is an economic decision for people, pure and simple.  The cost is so great now, so people weigh the emotional benefit vs the actual cost.  The UAB game had zero emotional cache.  Outside of Homecoming, it wasn't worth all the hoops that have to be jumped through for the 12000 that were at the Bama game that chose not to go this last Saturday.  These rentawins are going to have to see a drastic reduction in cost, but they still won't sellout until we have a far superior product on the field.

  Do something more than just the game to get people in the stadium.

[RazorbackRon]

Yeah screw that noise. I'm not driving to NWA and dealing with the traffic and people. Happily sit at home and watch it with friends on the tv.

Same here.  I will gripe and complain and whine about the long drive, the traffic, the cost of our tickets and parking space, the heat........and then when the players take the field I realize why I do it for every home game.

NOTHING like being AT the game.  Yes, it's easy to sit at home and watch the game on TV but once you start attending games, it gets in your blood. 

It's only a 3 hr drive for me from central AR so I do have it allot easier than some on here (like JackRabbit).   The good thing for me is that after driving back and forth to Fayetteville for the last 27 years (with allot of hotel nights and allot of driving back in the middle of the night), I have 2 daughters (who we put through college) that now live in Fayetteville.  For me, it's now a great chance to see my kids and see a game at the same time.  I got it good.   

WPS

[Inhogswetrust]

Did not say they had not, that was actually my point.  It is not EASY for many people to attend games. Very few major football playing schools are located in the largest population center of their states. Tuscaloosa, Auburn, Athens, Starkville, Oxford, Fayetteville in the SEC ( maybe both Columbia's could be included too ). None of those are in the largest city in their state.

But here is the difference, When those of us who are now late 30's or older were growing up, if you wanted to see your team regularly, you had to go to the games. Now, you can see every game your team plays without ever leaving your house. At this point in many of our lives, it is neither a good use of our time or money to spend 7 or 8 Saturdays at a game.  For others, that is their family entertainment, and that is great, everyone should have some activity in which they spend time with family and friends.

For others, like myself, we did not go to many games when I was growing up, even though I have lived in FS my whole life. We went to a few, and when i was old enough to drive and ha some spending money, me and some friends would go to a couple football and a couple bball games every year. So, going to games is not something that was ever a big part of my life. When we do go, we have a great time, but it is not our top priority.

Good response. My issue is those that constantly complain and always have about attendance and ticket prices and distance and stuff like that yet NEVER have been to a game or even tried to go a few times. My point was that despite distances some people do make it a priority to go. I DO understand that not all can do so though.

[Inhogswetrust]

Maybe you recall that Tennessee played one game per year in Memphis well into the 90's.  Usually a good game. Interesting that they are paying rent and sacrificing 33,000 seats next year to play UAB in Nashville.  Butch Jones stated reason - recruiting.

Tennessee has a population of 6.5M.  Combined MSAs for Chattanooga, Johnson City, and Knoxville is 1.546M.  All are within two hours of Neyland Stadium. 

Moral of the demographic story?  Arkansas is going to need fans from Central Arkansas to fill RRS.  Always has been that way, always will be.   

Not to split hairs but NO Tenner didn't play one game PER YEAR well into the 90's in Memphis and it usually wasn't a good game.

Since 1990 until today the've played there only 6 times and only 3 were in the 90's:

1990 - Old Miss
1992,1996,2000,2006 and 2010 - Tiger High

They did play Old Miss and Miss State there quite a bit before that and it was as much to those schools benefit as Tenners.

Source = UT Media guide

[Inhogswetrust]

Kentucky isn't done with renovations and still have some areas not allowed to be seated in.

This is an economic decision for people, pure and simple.  The cost is so great now, so people weigh the emotional benefit vs the actual cost.  The UAB game had zero emotional cache.  Outside of Homecoming, it wasn't worth all the hoops that have to be jumped through for the 12000 that were at the Bama game that chose not to go this last Saturday.  These rentawins are going to have to see a drastic reduction in cost, but they still won't sellout until we have a far superior product on the field.

  Do something more than just the game to get people in the stadium.

Funny since KY's renovations will DECREASE the total number of seats yet you mention not all areas aren't available to sit in making it even more interesting it wasn't full. Costs to attend has ALWAYS been an issue at ALL sporting events for a lot of people everywhere. 

[Inhogswetrust]

I didn't go to game. Felt some guilty about it but it was a great day to watch football, take a walk in the woods, and have some beers. Cost, nearly nothing. I've been a fan since I sat on my fathers knee and watched all white teams duke it out. Love game day but lots of options these days.

Other than more games on TV now there always has been lot's of other options.

[Hogfaniam]

Funny since KY's renovations will DECREASE the total number of seats yet you mention not all areas aren't available to sit in making it even more interesting it wasn't full. Costs to attend has ALWAYS been an issue at ALL sporting events for a lot of people everywhere. 

You can't sell where you can't sit.

[ricepig]

You can't sell where you can't sit.

Jerry does.   

[bphi11ips]

Not to split hairs but NO Tenner didn't play one game PER YEAR well into the 90's in Memphis and it usually wasn't a good game.

Since 1990 until today the've played there only 6 times and only 3 were in the 90's:

1990 - Old Miss
1992,1996,2000,2006 and 2010 - Tiger High

They did play Old Miss and Miss State there quite a bit before that and it was as much to those schools benefit as Tenners.

Source = UT Media guide

I said well into the 90's.  Thanks for reminding me it was later, although it wasn't every year, as you suggest.  The Memphis games, as I recall, were part of a series and not intended to build local support the way the earlier games were.   

I've already detailed the Vols' history in Memphis prior to 1990 and it extends throughout the twentieth century.  If we had a search feature I'd pull that post up. I believe I did the research last year or the year before.