UALR / UCLA

[twistitup]

How did the Little Rock campus fail to grow and be a large, academic & athletically successful branch of the UofA?

Little Rock is not LA, but c'mon - it's in a heavily populated area and should be relevant. Why not a D1 football team?

[hoglady]

How did the Little Rock fail to grow and be a large, academic & athletically successful branch of the UofA?

Little Rick is not LA, but c'mon - it's in a heavily populated area and should be relevant. Why not a D1 football team?

UALR didn't become a part of the UofA until the late 60's.
Prior to that they were a 4 year private university for some years (1957 to the late 60's) - Little Rock University.
They started out as a Junior College and had a highly successful football program during that time. Winning the "Little Rose Bowl" and going undefeated in 1949.

By the time they became a public university the Hogs were entrenched throughout the State - playing more than half their games at War Memorial. No way you go up against that to build a program. If the Hogs had not played in Little Rock - then maybe you  would have seen a strong football program at UALR.

[Hogwild]

I don't know why, but it isn't uncommon in our area.
Largest enrollment in the largest city for the state.

Louisiana- New Orleans- University of New Orleans (x Sun Belt no football)
Mississippi- Jackson- Jackson St (SWAC)
Missouri- Kansas City- University of Missouri-KC (no football)
Oklahoma- Oklahoma City- University of  OkState-OKC (no football)

[Augustus]

I believe UALR has a vast majority of non-traditional student population, vs UCLA or most any other colleges?  I'm wondering how much that comes into play?

Per UALR's website, the average age of UALR students is 27-28.  http://ualr.edu/about/strategicplan/chancellor/ualr-today/3-we-teachand-more/

Now, in the last 5-10 years, I think it's grown to be a (somewhat) large Academic Institution arm of the UA System... but the avg. age/ student should explain it's slow growth in footprint of Athletics?

In contrast, per http://www.aim.ucla.edu/pdf/UCLA2013.pdf ...
The average age of UCLA students is 21. The percentage of undergrads 25 or older is 6%.

[popcornhog]

How did the Little Rock campus fail to grow and be a large, academic & athletically successful branch of the UofA?

Little Rock is not LA, but c'mon - it's in a heavily populated area and should be relevant. Why not a D1 football team?

Little Rock is smaller than many of Los Angeles's suburbs.

UCLA is a well funded, strong academic school.

California has a population roughly 13 times the state of Arkansas, necessitating several large quality public Universities with high quality athletics and academics. The state of Arkansas only really has the population and resources for one large quality academic school with big time sports.

By the way, I don't mean to sound like a smart ass, but why are you comparing ualr to UCLA rather than ULL, UNO, Jackson St, UAB, etc?

[twistitup]

Little Rock is smaller than many of Los Angeles's suburbs


By the way, I don't mean to sound like a smart ass, but why are you comparing ualr to UCLA rather than ULL, UNO, Jackson St, UAB, etc?

I realize LR is smaller, thanks though. I just used a successful urban example of a branch campus- don't overthink it. I'm basically curious why UALR has never reached it's potential based on population base

[Birminghog]

Going further with the process introduced by hoglady, follow the history of the institutions.  I remember UCA as ASTC & SCA before it was UCA. Under all three names it played sports in the old Arkansas Intercollegiate Conference, a part of the NAIA.

Please correct me if I am mistaken, but I understand that many large state universities owe their locations to federal land grants, which would not have been provided in more established, populated areas. In the area where I live, UAB is nearly constantly complaining about being treated as a second-class citizen both academically and athletically, even though it, like Little Rock, is in the largest city in the state and is home to the state medical and dental schools.

FWIW, when I moved to Birmingham in 1988, out of the four 4-year colleges/universities here, only two of them had football teams - Samford University, a small Baptist institution, and Miles College, a small HBCU institution. This in a metropolitan area of over 1,000,000.

[popcornhog]

I realize LR is smaller, thanks though. I just used a successful urban example of a branch campus- don't overthink it. I'm basically curious why UALR has never reached it's potential based on population base

Again, I wasn't being a smart ass, I was just answering your question.

You're saying that you wonder why it hasn't reached that level, based on population base. The answer is that the population base if the state is only 3 million compared to 19 million in CA. There's the biggest part of your answer -- we're not big enough to support a branch of the UA at that level.

The counter argument would be Ole Miss/MSU obviously. If either State or OM didn't have athletics, the one that did would be pretty strong. (Granted, they're not branches of each other).

Anyhow, to my knowledge, Mississippi is the only state with a small population to have to major football programs at the BCS conference level.

[greasy_corner]

Anyhow, to my knowledge, Mississippi is the only state with a small population to have to major football programs at the BCS conference level.

Kansas and Iowa would be others.

[twistitup]

Anyhow, to my knowledge, Mississippi is the only state with a small population to have to major football programs at the BCS conference level.

Kansas, Iowa, Oklahoma and Utah would qualify, true?

http://www.ipl.org/div/stateknow/popchart.html

[Inhogswetrust]

Kansas, Iowa, Oklahoma and Utah would qualify, true?

http://www.ipl.org/div/stateknow/popchart.html

Nebraska, West Virginia.

[popcornhog]

Kansas and Iowa would be others.

Good catch on both fronts.

I am glad that it hasn't happened here though. It's the exception, not the rule in a small state.

Imagine how much better KU or Iowa would be without ISU or KSU.

[popcornhog]

Kansas, Iowa, Oklahoma and Utah would qualify, true?

http://www.ipl.org/div/stateknow/popchart.html

Oklahoma has nearly 4 million people, but, yeah good catch.

Utah does not have two BCS conference schools, but BYU is a BCS quality program, good point.

BYU is a unique case though given its status in the religious community.

Kansas and Iowa are very good on point examples though.

[popcornhog]

Nebraska, West Virginia.

WVU is the only BCS school in West Virginia, right?

[Dwight_K_Shrute]

Just curious, would this qualify as one of the threads not allowed on MMQB come August 1st?

[twistitup]

WVU is the only BCS school in West Virginia, right?

He is considering Marshall a BCS school - CUSA...I know it IS Conf USA, but yes they are BCS

[twistitup]

Just curious, would this qualify as one of the threads not allowed on MMQB come August 1st?

I tried to get it in early - just in case

[hoglady]

Just curious, would this qualify as one of the threads not allowed on MMQB come August 1st?

God this thread is a welcome change from the bickering and posturing that goes on with most of the other threads. A thread like this should be welcomed with open arms.

[Inhogswetrust]

WVU is the only BCS school in West Virginia, right?

I didn't know you meant more than one BCS level school when you said programs as in plural for those states. However as Twist said WV does have Marshall. IF you mean only the big five conferences  AND has more than one then the states I mentioned before does not apply.

[hoglady]

This is a Razorback state from border to border / and has been for decades.
And that was Broyles' vision - he worked hard for that.

[RedSkiesAtNightHog]

UALR didn't become a part of the UofA until the late 60's.
Prior to that they were a 4 year private university for some years (1957 to the late 60's) - Little Rock University.
They started out as a Junior College and had a highly successful football program during that time. Winning the "Little Rose Bowl" and going undefeated in 1949.

By the time they became a public university the Hogs were entrenched throughout the State - playing more than half their games at War Memorial. No way you go up against that to build a program. If the Hogs had not played in Little Rock - then maybe you  would have seen a strong football program at UALR.

Nice job!  My Dad was on that Little Rose Bowl team in 1949.  Then, he was called back into service to fight in the Korean War!   

[Justifiable Hogicide]

Because LRU a/k/a UALR is a suitcase school.

[Sweet Feet]

This is a Razorback state from border to border / and has been for decades.
And that was Broyles' vision - he worked hard for that.

How did he work for that?

[Sweet Feet]

Nice job!  My Dad was on that Little Rose Bowl team in 1949.  Then, he was called back into service to fight in the Korean War!

your dad played?? Awesome!!! Does he have pictures?

[Sweet Feet]

It would take ualr about 5million$ to start up football. If they can get donors like jack stephens when he was alive with the 22.4 million basketball facility, amd coleman giving them that soccer/track facility, then its only a matter of time. Theres a lot of alumni including derek fisher.

[RedSkiesAtNightHog]

your dad played?? Awesome!!! Does he have pictures?

I know there are pictures of him in the Little Rock JC annual, but I don't know if he has any personal pictures. 

[twistitup]

Because LRU a/k/a UALR is a suitcase school.

So is the University of Houston- but they still have a D1 football program. I went there for a short time and only a small percentage of students lived on campus...or in the city of Houston.

Total commuter school, I bet UCLA and most other urban schools are as well.

[Sweet Feet]

So is the University of Houston- but they still have a D1 football program. I went there for a short time and only a small percentage of students lived on campus...or in the city of Houston.

Total commuter school, I bet UCLA and most other urban schools are as well.

Same with USF too

[Ramtough]

When the hogs stop playing in LR I think UALR should seriously think about bringing D1 football to the central part of the state.

[Sweet Feet]

Because LRU a/k/a UALR is a suitcase school.

Not really a reason. South Florida, houston, unlv, boise, indiana, georgia state, FAU, FIU, utsa, and many others all are commuter schools. Majority of the ones on this list have about 90% of students living off campus

[Sweet Feet]

When the hogs stop playing in LR I think UALR should seriously think about bringing D1 football to the central part of the state.

Agreed. Pretty much like uab and legion field

[twistitup]

Agreed. Pretty much like uab and legion field

It's logical w/ the population, wealth and Alum in Central Ark....NW has its own wealth base and UofA would still be the flagship but I seen I reason ualr can't step up

[ricepig]

It's logical w/ the population, wealth and Alum in Central Ark....NW has it's own wealth base and UofA would still be the flagship but I seen I reason ualr can't step up

It won't ever happen.

[Sweet Feet]

It's logical w/ the population, wealth and Alum in Central Ark....NW has its own wealth base and UofA would still be the flagship but I seen I reason ualr can't step up

They can do it. They already have war memorial right there. NW is decent, but there is more people and notable alums in the central arkansas area that can help with funding. I say talk to derek fisher lol

[twistitup]

It won't ever happen.

Ever is a long time. I don't see any reason not to add a revenue generating sport to a branch of the UofA in an urban area

[Hogwild]

It would take ualr about 5million$ to start up football.

does that amount cover just football operation set up cost or does it included the added costs with title IX compliance issues?

[ricepig]

Ever is a long time. I don't see any reason not to add a revenue generating sport to a branch of the UofA in an urban area

Ever is forever.

[HogFanatic]

I know that your OP differentiated Little Rock from Los Angeles, but I am still having a hard time wrapping my head around this, man.

Los Angeles is big enough to support like TEN University of Arkansas's.

[twistitup]

Ever is forever.

Forever is a big word

[twistitup]

Los Angeles is big enough to support like TEN University of Arkansas's.

Let's stay realistic- Ualr is an urban, commuter school in a densely populated area - why not generate the revenue that would come with football?

[HogFanatic]

And to the point of the thread, the reason that the University of Arkansas is what it is, where it is, is because in like 1860 or whatever, the State of Arkansas got a Government Land Grant to establish the University in Fayetteville because it was initially an agricultural school, and you can't quite put an Agri center in Little Rock.

Despite the population of Little Rock, Little Rock has nearly ALWAYS played second-fiddle to Northwest Arkansas. And they're mad about it, guys. Hence the GSD.

[twistitup]

And to the point of the thread, the reason that the University of Arkansas is what it is, where it is, is because in like 1860 or whatever, the State of Arkansas got a Government Land Grant to establish the University in Fayetteville because it was initially an agricultural school, and you can't quite put an Agri center in Little Rock.

Despite the population of Little Rock, Little Rock has nearly ALWAYS played second-fiddle to Northwest Arkansas. And they're mad about it, guys. Hence the GSD.

UALR.... it's PART OF the UofA. This is not a NWA / LR bs thread. I'm not debating the flagship university location - I'm asking why UALR doesn't have D1 football

[chitwnhog]

Ever is a long time. I don't see any reason not to add a revenue generating sport to a branch of the UofA in an urban area

The UofA has moved to keep UALR in check for years. Until very recently dorms were not allowed on campus which killed campus life and kept many who wanted the "college experience" from attending unless they had to hence The University of Arkansas at Last Resort. 

The UofA system will never allow UALR to field a football team.

[HogFanatic]

UALR.... it's PART OF the UofA. This is not a NWA / LR bs thread

Well sure...it is today. And I understand your desire to keep this on terms of football, or whatever, but I was answering the question. For a LONG time the money was flowing from the federal government into Fayetteville, rather than Little Rock, for the reason I brought up.

The football team was established there, and there it remains because first and foremost, UofA is an Agricultural school.

I mean, for an example, you wouldn't expect A&M to merge with Houston, right? They just don't do Agri in Houston.

[HogFanatic]

Or put in other terms, if UALR wants to ever field a D1 football team, they will need to leave the umbrella of the University of Arkansas, and adopt a Sciences based focus. Ala UCLA.

[twistitup]

I mean, for an example, you wouldn't expect A&M to merge with Houston, right? They just don't do Agri in Houston.

Once again, UALR and UofA are part of the same university system - Houston and A&M are not. Your comparison doesn't make sense .

Yes, LR could support a D1 football program in my opinion

[Sweet Feet]

The UofA has moved to keep UALR in check for years. Until very recently dorms were not allowed on campus which killed campus life and kept many who wanted the "college experience" from attending unless they had to hence The University of Arkansas at Last Resort. 

The UofA system will never allow UALR to field a football team.

If that is the case, then thats pretty weak of the UA

[HogFanatic]

Once again, UALR and UofA are part of the same university system - Houston and A&M are not. Your comparison doesn't make sense .

Yes, LR could support a D1 football program in my opinion

I understand your point, man, but I don't think you understand mine.

UofA already HAS a D1 program. In Fayetteville.

ETA: To allow ANOTHER D1 program under the same umbrella to establish itself in another location means to lose money for the school. Which is an agricultural school. Which they don't do in Little Rock.

It's really just that simple. The UofA is the state's flagship program and has been for a LONG time. Why in the HELL would they make a move to cut their own funding? It makes absolutely no sense. They're doing just fine where they are.

[ricepig]

Let's stay realistic- Ualr is an urban, commuter school in a densely populated area - why not generate the revenue that would come with football?

What makes you think it can generate revenue?

[chitwnhog]

If that is the case, then thats pretty weak of the UA

Truth.