Where do we rank as a national power?

[Augustus]

It hurts to say this, but Arkansas has not been a football power since the 70s.

I knew some were going to bring up 2010, 2011... and I was expecting to see "21-5"

But, I'll just throw this out there: I'm not sure a 2 year stretch qualifies a Team as being a "football power?"  Especially with no Conference title or BCS bowl win?

Missouri had a surprising year last year (in a weak East). Are they considered to be a football power if they make it to the Cotton Bowl this year? (or whatever the playoff equivalent for this year would be)

Looking at 2011 specifically... We trailed A&M 35-17 at the half; they had an abysmal 2nd half and we ended up winning by 4. Vandy? we trailed until the 4th quarter and beat them by a field goal.

We trailed a 2-10 (0-8 SEC) Ole Miss team 17-7 at the half; and ended up beating them by 5 points. A team who's 2011 record was worse than ours last year, we beat them by 5 points. Kentucky, La Tech, & Miss St all beat Ole Miss by double digits that year.

Now, were they wins? Yes, obviously. Did I enjoy the 2010, 2011 seasons? Absolutely. Were some of the wins indicative of a "football power?" To me, if I'm being realistic, no.

[root_hawg]

I tend to look at everything in terms of approx 20 years since this is where our recruits would be...so how do we stack up in the last 20 years?

[SouthSide Johnny]

but the other 7 teams list represented 70% of the then SEC

Arkansas wasn't part The Conference then...

[hogcard1964]

I knew some were going to bring up 2010, 2011... and I was expecting to see "21-5"

But, I'll just throw this out there: I'm not sure a 2 year stretch qualifies a Team as being a "football power?"  Especially with no Conference title or BCS bowl win?

Missouri had a surprising year last year (in a weak East). Are they considered to be a football power if they make it to the Cotton Bowl this year? (or whatever the playoff equivalent for this year would be)

Looking at 2011 specifically... We trailed A&M 35-17 at the half; they had an abysmal 2nd half and we ended up winning by 4. Vandy? we trailed until the 4th quarter and beat them by a field goal.

We trailed a 2-10 (0-8 SEC) Ole Miss team 17-7 at the half; and ended up beating them by 5 points. A team who's 2011 record was worse than ours last year, we beat them by 5 points. Kentucky, La Tech, & Miss St all beat Ole Miss by double digits that year.

Now, were they wins? Yes, obviously. Did I enjoy the 2010, 2011 seasons? Absolutely. Were some of the wins indicative of a "football power?" To me, if I'm being realistic, no.

The fact remains, in 2010 and 2011 we were a "national power".

[Razorback_Mack]

I knew some were going to bring up 2010, 2011... and I was expecting to see "21-5"

But, I'll just throw this out there: I'm not sure a 2 year stretch qualifies a Team as being a "football power?"  Especially with no Conference title or BCS bowl win?

Missouri had a surprising year last year (in a weak East). Are they considered to be a football power if they make it to the Cotton Bowl this year? (or whatever the playoff equivalent for this year would be)

Looking at 2011 specifically... We trailed A&M 35-17 at the half; they had an abysmal 2nd half and we ended up winning by 4. Vandy? we trailed until the 4th quarter and beat them by a field goal.

We trailed a 2-10 (0-8 SEC) Ole Miss team 17-7 at the half; and ended up beating them by 5 points. A team who's 2011 record was worse than ours last year, we beat them by 5 points. Kentucky, La Tech, & Miss St all beat Ole Miss by double digits that year.

Now, were they wins? Yes, obviously. Did I enjoy the 2010, 2011 seasons? Absolutely. Were some of the wins indicative of a "football power?" To me, if I'm being realistic, no.

Your argument is that we trailed to 3 sub par teams ON THE ROAD and came back to win so weren't a national power. That legitimizes the fact that we were one to me. Our staff and players were good enough to make adjustments and plays to come back and win AWAY from home.

We finished ranked 12th and 5th in the country those years. Add those to together and that's 17. Essentially we were a top 10 program those two years. That's a national power.

The best college football team in the BCS era was the 2009 Alabama team. A 6-6 Lane Kiffin team had a chance to beat them at the end with a field goal. I guess they weren't a national power.

All that matters is that you win the game. Arkansas fans always talk about games we could've lost. So stupid. I bet you Alabama fans never mention that 2009 Tennessee game.

[hogsanity]

The fact remains, in 2010 and 2011 we were a "national power".

No, no the hogs were not. National powers play for conf titles more than once a decade, Hogs did not even win their division in 10 or 11. Record alon does not make a team a national power.  Do you consider Northern Illinois a national power even though they have won 20+ games the last 2 seasons and played in 2 bcs bowls?

[Etowah]

2010 and 2011 we caught the perfect storm in terms of our schedule.  We were good, very good, but we got a break with the scheduling...played Georgia without their good receiver..etc..  All of that is ok..that is what it takes to be a top five team sometime.

With that said...we were overrated back in the 60's because we really did not play anyone but Texass...and we have been somewhat underrated more recently because of the schedule.

Any way you shake it...we are a 25 to 35 program now and always.  Things don't change much in football.  You get the one or two great years a lot of teams get..but consistently it is the same teams in the top 10 vying for national titles.

[hogcard1964]

2010 and 2011 we caught the perfect storm in terms of our schedule.  We were good, very good, but we got a break with the scheduling...played Georgia without their good receiver..etc..  All of that is ok..that is what it takes to be a top five team sometime.

With that said...we were overrated back in the 60's because we really did not play anyone but Texass...and we have been somewhat underrated more recently because of the schedule.

Any way you shake it...we are a 25 to 35 program now and always.  Things don't change much in football.  You get the one or two great years a lot of teams get..but consistently it is the same teams in the top 10 vying for national titles.

The SWC was very, VERY good in the 60s.

[hogcard1964]

No, no the hogs were not. National powers play for conf titles more than once a decade, Hogs did not even win their division in 10 or 11. Record alon does not make a team a national power.  Do you consider Northern Illinois a national power even though they have won 20+ games the last 2 seasons and played in 2 bcs bowls?

Apples-Oranges

[SouthSide Johnny]

The SWC was very, VERY good in the 60s.

Not really just Arkansas and Texas was very very good.

[RazorbackBurger numba foe]

This thread is hilarious.

[hogsanity]

Apples-Oranges

Why? Are you saying 21-5, with almost all of the 21 being against teams with losing conf records, is worthy of being deemed a national power or not?

Everyone throws out apples-oranges when they cant really refute a counter point

[Hogarusa]

Arkansas  should not be ranked anywhere in the national powers.  National powers shouldn't be ranked after the top 6-7 teams as the teams after that aren't powerful

[NaturalStateReb]

Who's a power tends to fluctuate over time.  Every program has ebbs and flows.  Clearly, this is an ebb time for Arkansas, but this ebb period won't last forever. 

Is Arkansas considered a national power?  Not really, but neither are many other programs with great traditions.  Then there are other programs that are considered "great" by talking heads--I'm looking at you Texas and Notre Dame--that aren't relevant to the national discussion.  I think the whole "great programs" discussion is more about perception than production.

[Hogwild]

I agree with you first part about ebbs and flows, I'm with you about this period not lasting forever.  But Notre Dame and Texas have both played in the national championship game within the last five years, that is being relevant.

[Razorback_Mack]

Why? Are you saying 21-5, with almost all of the 21 being against teams with losing conf records, is worthy of being deemed a national power or not?

Everyone throws out apples-oranges when they cant really refute a counter point

7 of the wins were against top 25 teams. What is an appropriate number?

[LRRandy]

I agree with you first part about ebbs and flows, I'm with you about this period not lasting forever.  But Notre Dame and Texas have both played in the national championship game within the last five years, that is being relevant.

that is a correct statement. It's amazing what the criteria for relevant is when your not.

[hogsanity]

7 of the wins were against top 25 teams. What is an appropriate number?

# of wins don't matter at all when talking about being a "national power". Also, even if yu want to go by # of wins, a 2 year span hardly is enough time to determine national status. Any appropriate ranking has to take into account winning your division, your conference, your bowl games, and your end of year ranking. Finishing top 10 once in 10 ro 20 or 30 years does NOT qualify a program as a national power.

[Pork Twain]

It hurts to say this, but Arkansas has not been a football power since the 70s.

We were "OK" in the 80's.  Sadly many of the fans that act like we are a power, were not alive the last time we actually were.

[HF#1]

Seems to be a dumb question coming off 4-8 and 3-9 seasons. 

We aren't a national power.

[Pork Twain]

Seems to be a dumb question coming off 4-8 and 3-9 seasons. 

We aren't a national power.

Based on the last 25 years, we are not a National Power.

[HF#1]

Based on the last 25 years, we are not a National Power.

That too.  Until we can put together a 5-10 year run of consistent winning.  By that I mean 8+ wins every year, a conference title or two and possibly a national title.   At that point we would be considered a national power. 

[Atlhogfan1]

Unless some unforeseen major changes happen in college football, Arkansas will never be a national power again.  We can have a good program who can have a great team every so often which with the right breaks can compete for an SEC or NC.  But we will never be a consistent national power. 

Current national powers IMO:
Bama
LSU
Florida
Auburn - no matter how I believe they are doing it or what I think of them
Georgia - biggest underachievers in college football but still a power
FSU
Ohio State
Michigan
Oklahoma
Texas
USC

Oregon - Based on the media coverage, they are.  I see a consistently good program in a conference with only one true national power who has been on probation.  But I won't argue if someone wants to put them among the current powers.
Miami - Borderline but it won't take much for them to be a power again.  In terms of modern tradition and recruiting pull, of course they are.
Notre Dame - IMO overrated frauds who shouldn't be involved in the NC.  But unfortunately they still can be.

Clemson - Close to returning to where they were a national power in the 80s if they can ever start winning big games consistently.
Nebraska - Has beens.  Good program and should remain good but on the decline.
Penn St - Has beens. May return someday.

Programs like A&M and UCLA with the right coach could become national powers although I question UCLA's commitment.  Tenn could and should return at some point.

Then you have a long list of programs who could or do have good programs with a great team every so often.  Arkansas falls into this group.  Who else is in it is up for great debate.  I respect programs who have to do it in good deep conferences vs programs the media shoved on us in recent years like WV, Boise and TCU.

Good programs right now I wouldn't consider national powers are Louisville, Stanford, Michigan State, South Carolina, Oklahoma State etc.  This is the group a program like Arkansas, Iowa, Washington should be in for periods of time while those I listed fall back down. 

[Big Poppa Z]

Based on the last 25 years, we are not a National Power.

True statement and coincides with when I was a Freshman to date.

Crap.

[hawkhawg]

I think we are between 20-25 all time. I'm not sure where u draw the line for national power. I would say probably top 15.  Which would put us not too far out.

[AFF]

Arkansas is clearly a top 20 program. Even considering the past couple of years, they're still rated #19 over the past five years according to the CFB Data Warehouse:
http://www.cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/rankings/last_5_years_team_rankings.php

They are also #19 over the past 50 years:
http://www.cfbdatawarehouse.com/data/rankings/last_50_years_team_rankings.php

There's lots of reason for optimism this year, despite what the media experts predict.

[rusvegashog]

2010 2011 we were relevant. Really one of the very few times since I've been a Hog fan that we were. Man those boys from Warren were good.

[GoHogs1091]

Unless some unforeseen major changes happen in college football, Arkansas will never be a national power again.  We can have a good program who can have a great team every so often which with the right breaks can compete for an SEC or NC.  But we will never be a consistent national power. 

Current national powers IMO:
Bama
LSU
Florida
Auburn - no matter how I believe they are doing it or what I think of them
Georgia - biggest underachievers in college football but still a power
FSU
Ohio State
Michigan
Oklahoma
Texas
USC

Clemson - Close to returning to where they were a national power in the 80s if they can ever start winning big games consistently.

You are correct about us not being a national power.  A national power has won their Conference at least once over the last 22 years.  We haven't won the SEC since we have been in the SEC.

Regarding Clemson, they have beat a Top 10 ranked SEC team during the last 2 seasons (LSU and Georgia were both Top 10 ranked when Clemson defeated them).  Over that same time frame, Florida State has only defeated 1 Top 10 ranked SEC team (Auburn), and last season's Auburn team was probably the weakest SEC team in the National Championship game over the last several seasons.

Regarding Auburn last season, when Auburn defeated Georgia, Georgia wasn't the same Georgia team against Auburn as when Clemson defeated Georgia (Georgia was injury decimated when Auburn defeated Georgia).  LSU and South Carolina both last season couldn't beat Georgia when Georgia wasn't injury decimated, but Clemson defeated a non-injury decimated Georgia.