Question: Would you accept one Arkansas football defeat if the USA won the World Cup?

[root_hawg]

I wouldn't trade a 3rd and long offensive call by HDN for a Cup win

[JayBell]

There is nothing wrong with people liking soccer.  But there is nothing wrong with people NOT liking soccer either. 

No matter what the world says.

Just to clarify, the world may be saying that, but no one on this board is.  Most American soccer fans only get their feathers ruffled by immature and unnecessary insults.

Someone made a great point a couple of weeks ago about the belief that "soccer fans are too sensitive" is overblown.  No one writes a ton of "Hockey is stupid and communist" articles during the Stanley Cup playoffs.  Soccer fans get their glorious moment every four years and they're basically under assault from the old guard for the entire month.

[PonderinHog]

OK, they can pick one of the losses from last year.

[Deep Shoat]

Just to clarify, the world may be saying that, but no one on this board is.  Most American soccer fans only get their feathers ruffled by immature and unnecessary insults.

Someone made a great point a couple of weeks ago about the belief that "soccer fans are too sensitive" is overblown.  No one writes a ton of "Hockey is stupid and communist" articles during the Stanley Cup playoffs.  Soccer fans get their glorious moment every four years and they're basically under assault from the old guard for the entire month.

Americans give two shits about soccer once every 4 years, and every time the media and the few non-Hispanic American soccer fans start telling us, incessantly, that America is finally going to embrace soccer.

Then, we go back to not caring once we are eliminated.  And the media and non-Hispanic American soccer fans get all butthurt and start telling us we just aren't smart enough to understand soccer. 

While you (and a few others) think this thread proves we are ignorant, provincial rednecks, I think it just shows soccer isn't all that interesting when you have other options growing up.

[JayBell]

Americans give two shits about soccer once every 4 years, and every time the media and the few non-Hispanic American soccer fans start telling us, incessantly, that America is finally going to embrace soccer.

Then, we go back to not caring once we are eliminated.  And the media and non-Hispanic American soccer fans get all butthurt and start telling us we just aren't smart enough to understand soccer. 

While you (and a few others) think this thread proves we are ignorant, provincial rednecks, I think it just shows soccer isn't all that interesting when you have other options growing up.

The fact you think "the media and the few non-Hispanic American soccer fans" represent the full, small contingent of soccer interest in America shows just how much of an "ignorant, provincial redneck" you are.

When SEC football programs are going to Major League Soccer for advice on how to engage their fan bases.....oh screw it, you're not going to pay attention to actual facts.  Damn, and I actually defended you while you were trolling the World Cup threads.

[Deep Shoat]

The fact you think "the media and the few non-Hispanic American soccer fans" represent the full, small contingent of soccer interest in America shows just how much of an "ignorant, provincial redneck" you are.

When SEC football programs are going to Major League Soccer for advice on how to engage their fan bases.....oh screw it, you're not going to pay attention to actual facts.  Damn, and I actually defended you while you were trolling the World Cup threads.

I wasn't even trolling them.  Just asking questions and stating opinions.

And I think MLS has done a great job in becoming a marketable sport in the US, something no other soccer entity has ever done.  But to contend there is a LARGE non-Hispanic population of soccer fans in this country is kind of silly.

Is it growing?  Absolutely.  Kudos.

Is it large?  Not even close.

[Ex-Trumpet]

This has to be about the most ignert thread ever on Hogville...someone asks if we would sacrifice a Hogs victory for a non-Hogs related championship in a sport most posters here don't give a crap about?  And some are actually shocked that folks posting here are diehard Hogs fans?!?!  Calling them ignorant rednecks?!?!  And then some wonder why others hate soccer...

For the record, I don't care one way or the other about soccer.  I don't watch it, but I don't watch the NBA either.  To each his own, in my opinion...but I'm definitely leaning towards becoming an anti-soccite!!

[31to6]

Is it large?  Not even close.

Sporting KC sells out a lot. But they were smart.

They built a small stadium (~20k capacity), highly focussed on the field, with seats ranging from "really good" to "awesome".

Parking is plentiful and you can get into and out of a game without making it an all-day adventure.

They stadium is state of the art with modern amenities.

The concessions are very good and generate a lot of revenue.

And, most importantly, the team is a winner.

But they get less attendance per game than the Royals, who usually suck, and who play a zillion games each season.

[Deep Shoat]

Define "large."

http://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2006/06/14/americans-to-rest-of-world-soccer-not-really-our-thing/

2006 Pew Research poll.  Do you think it has changed more than 2-3 percentage points in 8 years?

[Deep Shoat]

the 2014 Harris Interactive Equi-Trends poll puts Soccer in the "other's receiving votes" category.

[Deep Shoat]

Sporting KC sells out a lot. But they were smart.

They built a small stadium (~20k capacity), highly focussed on the field, with seats ranging from "really good" to "awesome".

Parking is plentiful and you can get into and out of a game without making it an all-day adventure.

They stadium is state of the art with modern amenities.

The concessions are very good and generate a lot of revenue.

And, most importantly, the team is a winner.

But they get less attendance per game than the Royals, who usually suck, and who play a zillion games each season.

That's great.  I mean that.  But your last statement is the telling one.

[JayBell]

That's great.  I mean that.  But your last statement is the telling one.

How is it telling?  Who is comparing MLS to MLB?  SKC only sells out at 20,000 because they can't fit anymore people in.  I covered the MLS All-Star game there last year and the entire city was embracing it.  Kansas City is 60% white.

[JayBell]

http://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2006/06/14/americans-to-rest-of-world-soccer-not-really-our-thing/

2006 Pew Research poll.  Do you think it has changed more than 2-3 percentage points in 8 years

I can't emphasize this enough, we KNOW for a fact it has changed.
"MLS equals MLB in popularity with kids:" http://www.espnfc.com/major-league-soccer/story/1740529/mls-catches-mlb-in-popularity-with-kidssays-espn-poll

Seattle sells out at 40,000+, Portland sells out at 20,000+, Kansas City sells out at nearly 20,000. 

Real Salt Lake sells out at 20,000+ for just about every home game.  You really think it's a significant non-white population filling that stadium?

Comparing soccer in 2014 to 2006 is like comparing the NBA in 1990 to the NBA in 1979.  Huge changes have happened in the last eight years.  And I'm downplaying it a little.

MLS had 12 teams in 2006 with an average attendance of just over 15,000.  Now there's 19 teams and they average about 19,000.  The league will have 21 teams next year and at least 24 within the next five years.  That alone engages a much larger segment of the population.  Total attendance has literally doubled in the past eight years.

And that doesn't include the summer friendlies where people pack NFL stadiums to watch foreign clubs play.  Hell, Milwaukee, Wisconsin had 31,000+ attend a game between a Mexican club and a Welsh club the other night.

[JayBell]

This has to be about the most ignert thread ever on Hogville...someone asks if we would sacrifice a Hogs victory for a non-Hogs related championship in a sport most posters here don't give a crap about?  And some are actually shocked that folks posting here are diehard Hogs fans?!?!  Calling them ignorant rednecks?!?!  And then some wonder why others hate soccer...

Except that's not what happened at all.  Someone asked a question and the obvious responses were given.  What then happened was a string of "ignert" responses and insults that were countered with facts from soccer supporters.  Not one person has been called an "ignorant redneck" for simply hating soccer.

[Deep Shoat]

How is it telling?  Who is comparing MLS to MLB?  SKC only sells out at 20,000 because they can't fit anymore people in.  I covered the MLS All-Star game there last year and the entire city was embracing it.  Kansas City is 60% white.

It tells us that even a very well run MLS team that has worked very hard and smart to draw in fans still can't draw with a bad baseball team(at best, 3rd sport in America these days).

[Deep Shoat]

I can't emphasize this enough, we KNOW for a fact it has changed.
"MLS equals MLB in popularity with kids:" http://www.espnfc.com/major-league-soccer/story/1740529/mls-catches-mlb-in-popularity-with-kidssays-espn-poll

Seattle sells out at 40,000+, Portland sells out at 20,000+, Kansas City sells out at nearly 20,000. 

Real Salt Lake sells out at 20,000+ for just about every home game.  You really think it's a significant non-white population filling that stadium?

Comparing soccer in 2014 to 2006 is like comparing the NBA in 1990 to the NBA in 1979.  Huge changes have happened in the last eight year.  And I'm downplaying it a little.  MLS had 12 teams in 2006.  The league will have 21 teams next year and at least 24 within the next five years.  That alone engages a much larger segment of the population.

Although there are no demographics available, the 2014 Harris Interactive poll seems to indicate not much has changed.

And even if your numbers mean what you think it does, we are looking at a couple of percentage points (as I said), which is significant certainly.  Still a long way from a large, non-Hispanic following though.

[Deep Shoat]

TV ratings certainly have. As have the number of tickets sold and number of televised matches.

Soccer is certainly not nearing gridiron football in popularity. But it is growing, which is a good thing. There's plenty of room on the buffet of sports for another side to the main courses of football, basketball and baseball.

How much is it growing, and how much is it "growing" based on the influx from the south?

In 2006, 24% of Hispanics, 1% of whites and 2% of blacks stated soccer was their favorite sport.

I suspect most of that "growth" is from the "growth" of Hispanics.

[Hogsooey]

Sporting KC sells out a lot. But they were smart.

They built a small stadium (~20k capacity), highly focussed on the field, with seats ranging from "really good" to "awesome".

Parking is plentiful and you can get into and out of a game without making it an all-day adventure.

They stadium is state of the art with modern amenities.

The concessions are very good and generate a lot of revenue.

And, most importantly, the team is a winner.

But they get less attendance per game than the Royals, who usually suck, and who play a zillion games each season.

The numbers the Royals release are paid attendance figures.  The Padres have figures over 25,000 per game and it is not close to that unless the Dodgers or a few other teams are in town.  I don't mind them reporting those figures because they make the money regardless.  But, they are not making the money on $10 beer, etc from that many people.  A team like FC Kansas City nearly is because the people are showing up.

I've taken my son to numerous Padres games to try and see if he would like it.  But, when you sit in a cavernous stadium away from the action when there are tons of empty seats way closer, it doesn't help spark interest.  He always ends up at the playground behind the outfield wall. 

[Hogsooey]

The false assumption is soccer can only grow if people are listing it as their A1, top of the heap sport. The growth is coming from people who might list football as their No. 1, but now list soccer as No. 2 or No. 3 - when it wasn't on the radar at all years ago.

That's me (although it's been on my radar for a while).  Football is probably still number one for me with soccer a close second.  Never played soccer in my life other than kicking the ball around with my young son.  NBA is number three for me and that is a sport I played since I was in diapers.  I rarely watch baseball anymore even though I played that too and used to watch 100s of Cardinals games growing up.  It's way down the list for me. 

[Pork Twain]

The false assumption is soccer can only grow if people are listing it as their A1, top of the heap sport. The growth is coming from people who might list football as their No. 1, but now list soccer as No. 2 or No. 3 - when it wasn't on the radar at all years ago.

Much like the Olympics, you only really hear about soccer every four years.  Not so for many other sports in the US.

[Pork Twain]

Except that's slowly changing.

It's why ESPN, FOX and NBC got into a bidding war for rights to televise the top professional league in England. And, again, nobody is claiming soccer is approaching the popularity of the NFL or even college football. But it is growing.

Yet it's one of the oldest sports played in America...  Once it is on television more than the NBA, MLB, NFL, NCAA football, NCAA basketball, NCAA baseball, golf, tennis or NASCAR, I will take note.  Until then it is still just a reason for me to turn the channel and watch something more exciting, like NCAA softball or bowling.

[Fatty McGee]

Where soccer defeats other sports clearly is in the wives and girlfriends department.

[Pork Twain]

It's already on TV more than several of those sports.

Not in the United States and if so it is negligible

[Pork Twain]

It already is on TV in the USA more than several of those sports.

Not buying it, especially not on the major channels.  Maybe on the Ocho

[DLUXHOG]

Do you consider ESPN, ESPN2 and NBCSN to be major channels? What about FoxSports?

We can watch more English club matches here in Arkansas than somebody in London, Liverpool or Manchester.

How much soccer do the big nets put on TV? Starting this week, they'll be carrying friendlies of big European clubs played in the US. Scrimmages, basically, between teams preparing for their fall seasons.

Okay..... you win... turn your TV to whatever channel you thinks shows soccer....   the rest of us will be tuning into "American" games......

[root_hawg]

I see maybe one match a week on tv whereas baseball has several games, so does football and basketball in the seasons...I might give you tennis and nascar but only because NASCAR only has one race a week.

[footballfan]

You really need to look at the world outside of you. 

I get it that soccer is not (and likely will never) be your cup of tea.  That's fine - to each, their own.  However, soccer is on television more than over half of the sports you just named.

Which half? Maybe more than tennis. Maybe golf (though I doubt it). Thats it. Nascar is not not the only form of racing and if you look at all the different types of races they televise, it has soccer beat.

[Pork Twain]

Do you consider ESPN, ESPN2 and NBCSN to be major channels? What about FoxSports?

We can watch more English club matches here in Arkansas than somebody in London, Liverpool or Manchester.

How much soccer do the big nets put on TV? Starting this week, they'll be carrying friendlies of big European clubs played in the US. Scrimmages, basically, between teams preparing for their fall seasons.

Just because you say it is so, does not mean it is so.  I know golf is on now and tennis was on all last week.

[Hogsooey]

I see maybe one match a week on tv whereas baseball has several games, so does football and basketball in the seasons...I might give you tennis and nascar but only because NASCAR only has one race a week.

You don't watch enough TV. Haha. Colorado v Portland is on NBC Sports tonight. LA v KC is on ESPN 2 tomorrow. When LA is not on say ESPN or NBC Sports, every match is on a Time Warner regional sports channel.

As multiple people have pointed out, practically every Premier League Match is on NBC channels. It's like NFL Sunday ticket, but you don't have to pay extra for it. If you get NBC Sports in your package, you can watch more of the best league in the world than you'd have time for unless you just stay home all week. The season starts in mid August and they have already released the first 3 months schedule.

"Below you will find the full schedule for NBC Sports' coverage plans, as all 130 matches during the first three months of the season will be aired live and exclusively across NBC's platforms.

It all kicks off on Saturday, Aug. 16 at 7:45 a.m. ET on NBCSN with Louis van Gaal's first game in charge of Manchester United as they face Swansea.
At least 68 Premier League games (at least five a week in the first three months of the new campaign) will be shown on NBCSN, NBC and CNBC with all games preceded and followed by Premier League Live pre- and post-match shows from the NBC Sports Group International Broadcast Center in Stamford, Conn.

The other 62 Premier League games during the first three months will be aired live on Premier League Extra Time, a package available at no extra cost for customers who receive NBCSN."

http://prosoccertalk.nbcsports.com/2014/07/16/premier-league-2014-15-tv-schedule-for-nbc-sports-group/

And, of course, the Premier League season lasts until next May. Not to mention all the tons of Champions League matches shown on Fox Sports and all the other leagues matches shown on more soccer specific channels.

[Ex-Trumpet]

Some of y'all don't get out from in front of the tv near enough!!

[Hogsooey]

Some of y'all don't get out from in front of the tv near enough!!

I have to hear that from my wife, and now on Hogville, too?!!? lol

[redeye]

I read today that almost a quarter of the world population follows the English Premier League.  I doubt the NFL can compete with that.

[JayBell]

I say it is so because it is so.

It's not even remotely debatable.  There are 32 NFL teams and 120-ish college football teams.  They only play once a week.

There are 19 MLS teams, 18 Mexican teams and THOUSANDS of other clubs throughout the world.  Much of the time they are playing twice a week.

Multiple games are broadcast every single week on ESPN, ESPN2, FOX, Fox Sports 1, Fox Sports 2, beIN Sports, Galavision, Telemundo and more from leagues in the US and Canada, Mexico and England especially, but also Spain, Germany, France, the Netherlands and Brazil.  Hell, we get league games from Japan and Australia.  Then you have the Champions League tournaments in Europe, North America and South America.  You're hard pressed to find a time when soccer isn't on American TV.  Every summer includes at least one major international tournament, sometimes two or three.  2016 will feature the Copa America Centario in the US, the Euro Cup and the Olympic soccer tournament.

That is the daunting challenge staring MLS in the face.  The NFL and college football do not face challenges from other leagues with a comparable product.  MLS has to compete against the world for interest in the same sport.

[Ex-Trumpet]

It's not even remotely debatable.  There are 32 NFL teams and 120-ish college football teams.  They only play once a week.

There are 19 MLS teams, 18 Mexican teams and THOUSANDS of other clubs throughout the world.  Much of the time they are playing twice a week.

Multiple games are broadcast every single week on ESPN, ESPN2, FOX, Fox Sports 1, Fox Sports 2, beIN Sports, Galavision, Telemundo and more from leagues in the US and Canada, Mexico and England especially, but also Spain, Germany, France, the Netherlands and Brazil.  Hell, we get league games from Japan and Australia.  Then you have the Champions League tournaments in Europe, North America and South America.  You're hard pressed to find a time when soccer isn't on American TV.  Every summer includes at least one major international tournament, sometimes two or three.  2016 will feature the Copa America Centario in the US, the Euro Cup and the Olympic soccer tournament.

That is the daunting challenge staring MLS in the face.  The NFL and college football do not face challenges from other leagues with a comparable product.  MLS has to compete against the world for interest in the same sport.

What's telling, is that soccer is on tv as much as you say...and the only time anyone has even remotely heard about it--much less shown any interest--is over the past month during the world cup (real soccer fans excluded).  Soccer is not as main stream as some would like it to be (or lead us to believe).

My wife is not a football fan, but she could tell you what time of the year football season is!  Baseball, too, for that matter.

Soccer may become mainstream here like it is world-wide...but I would be surprised if it happens during our lifetime.

[JayBell]

Jay, did you see this?

http://prosoccertalk.nbcsports.com/2014/07/20/what-do-nasls-attendance-records-say-about-soccers-future-in-the-us/

I hadn't, but I knew that teams in Sacramento and Indianapolis had started off great.  Others like the Cosmos and Scorpions get great attendance in their markets.  Those clubs are doing a great job of growing the sport.  They're following the model that has been so successful for Seattle, Portland, Vancouver and now Orlando.

[JayBell]

Soccer may become mainstream here like it is world-wide...but I would be surprised if it happens during our lifetime.

I love how this qualifier is always inserted into the debate.  Go to Los Angeles and tell me that soccer isn't mainstream.  Or Seattle, Portland or Kansas City.

People making that assumption completely ignore the factors that made other sports "mainstream."  It took Magic and Bird showing up before the NBA Finals would finally be broadcast live instead of on tape delay.  The watershed moments in NASCAR have been very well documented.  It took decades for stock car racing to become more mainstream.  The NFL and MLB have history that MLS doesn't have.

Yes, soccer was close a century ago to being the most popular sport in the country, but during those 100+ years, only approximately 35 years of that time have included actually top flight soccer available to fans.  All of that was within the last 50 years and there was a 10+ year gap where fans of the sport became disconnected.

How about we let MLS get to drinking age before start making Nostradamus-esque predictions about the distant future?

[Ex-Trumpet]

I love how this qualifier is always inserted into the debate.  Go to Los Angeles and tell me that soccer isn't mainstream.  Or Seattle, Portland or Kansas City.

People making that assumption completely ignore the factors that made other sports "mainstream."  It took Magic and Bird showing up before the NBA Finals would finally be broadcast live instead of on tape delay.  The watershed moments in NASCAR have been very well documented.  It took decades for stock car racing to become more mainstream.  The NFL and MLB have history that MLS doesn't have.

Yes, soccer was close a century ago to being the most popular sport in the country, but during those 100+ years, only approximately 35 years of that time have included actually top flight soccer available to fans.  All of that was within the last 50 years and there was a 10+ year gap where fans of the sport became disconnected.

How about we let MLS get to drinking age before start making Nostradamus-esque predictions about the distant future?

FYI...with the exception of KC, I make it to the cities you mentioned on a regular basis; hockey is bigger.  Well, not in Portland; they like cycling.  And they would be NASCAR fans if Subaru's or Prius' were on the track!

[DukeOfPork]

I love how this qualifier is always inserted into the debate.  Go to Los Angeles and tell me that soccer isn't mainstream.  Or Seattle, Portland or Kansas City.

People making that assumption completely ignore the factors that made other sports "mainstream."  It took Magic and Bird showing up before the NBA Finals would finally be broadcast live instead of on tape delay.  The watershed moments in NASCAR have been very well documented.  It took decades for stock car racing to become more mainstream.  The NFL and MLB have history that MLS doesn't have.

Yes, soccer was close a century ago to being the most popular sport in the country, but during those 100+ years, only approximately 35 years of that time have included actually top flight soccer available to fans.  All of that was within the last 50 years and there was a 10+ year gap where fans of the sport became disconnected.

How about we let MLS get to drinking age before start making Nostradamus-esque predictions about the distant future?

Haha...well said. 

These guys don't want facts.  They're just in this for the xenophobia.

[Cinco de Hogo]

So on August 1st this thread disappears....right?

[Cinco de Hogo]

Nope.

Sorry I didn't realize this thread was about Razorback football.  Of course the name calling is alright too.

[Cinco de Hogo]

The thread isn't on MMQB now.

Fools gold, everthing that glitters and all that!

[RAD]

I don't hate soccer, but it's kind of like the Olympics in that I will only casually watch every 4 years.

You can't really compare it to the popularity explosion that NASCAR and the NBA experienced. Those 2 sports blew up easily within a decade of they're becoming "mainstream" on TV. Soccer had it's shot in 1994 with the WC being here in the States, and it hasn't gone much further. That's 20 years now, and you have to take into account that it's a very old sport. It's had plenty of opportunity to "catch on" here for damn near 100 years now.

Some of the markets mentioned as having some success don't really have much else to offer as far as major sports, or if they do, not much recent success. Maybe they're turning to soccer, or maybe they're just looking for something else, idk.

[JayBell]

You can't really compare it to the popularity explosion that NASCAR and the NBA experienced. Those 2 sports blew up easily within a decade of they're becoming "mainstream" on TV. Soccer had it's shot in 1994 with the WC being here in the States, and it hasn't gone much further. That's 20 years now, and you have to take into account that it's a very old sport. It's had plenty of opportunity to "catch on" here for damn near 100 years now.

*facepalm*

How many times do we have to explain it?  You say, "It's had plenty of opportunity to "catch on" here for damn near 100 years now."  How?

The NASL only existed for 18 years and many markets didn't have a team.  The matches weren't broadcast across the nation.  Foreign soccer matches were not on American TV.  The national team was not successful and their matches were not on TV.  Exactly what substance was supposed to keep Americans interested in the sport?  Soccer fans were really screwed between 1984 and 1994 when hardly anything was available except the occasional English Premier League match.  All momentum built up by the Cosmos in the 70's was decimated in the 80's with America's total absence from the sport.

So your hypothesis is that people were supposed to connect to the sport through rec leagues?  Fandom doesn't work that way.  How many parents in Arkansas never played football but built a passion for the sport through the Razorbacks and/or high school teams (which there were not many of in soccer, especially in certain areas of the country)?

[DukeOfPork]

This thread was redneck, jingoistic troll bait from the start.

[Ex-Trumpet]

*facepalm*

How many times do we have to explain it?  You say, "It's had plenty of opportunity to "catch on" here for damn near 100 years now."  How?

The NASL only existed for 18 years and many markets didn't have a team.  The matches weren't broadcast across the nation.  Foreign soccer matches were not on American TV.  The national team was not successful and their matches were not on TV.  Exactly what substance was supposed to keep Americans interested in the sport?  Soccer fans were really screwed between 1984 and 1994 when hardly anything was available except the occasional English Premier League match.  All momentum built up by the Cosmos in the 70's was decimated in the 80's with America's total absence from the sport.

So your hypothesis is that people were supposed to connect to the sport through rec leagues?  Fandom doesn't work that way.  How many parents in Arkansas never played football but built a passion for the sport through the Razorbacks and/or high school teams (which there were not many of in soccer, especially in certain areas of the country)?

I think you hit on the point of many here in your post...no teams in many markets and no tv coverage.  Let's face it, if there's interest, there's money to be made.  Investors will get the product to the people.  In the past, there simply weren't enough interested people to fund teams and their games (profitably anyways). 

As has been said, it remains to be seen if it will be profitable going forward.  I, for one, will be surprised if soccer ever exists in this country on the same level of popularity as football/basketball/baseball or even NASCAR or golf.

[Ex-Trumpet]

Golf? The Master's final round drew the lowest TV ratings since 1957. It had 11m viewers, the USMNT drew nearly 15m viewers for a World Cup match - in 2010, four years ago.

NASCAR's TV ratings have been in a tailspin since 2005. The 2013 Daytona 500 drew a record 16.7m viewers, nowhere close to the 26m in the USA who watched Germany-Argentina.

Soccer is a mainstream sport. It will never beat the NFL or college football. But it has a seat at the table these days - and not the kiddie table.

You're talking about World Cup numbers...if soccer were a mainstream sport, it would be on mainstream tv--drawing mainstream revenue.

It's about the money.  Soccer will be mainstream when it generates mainstream money (and, the reciprocal to this may be true, also).

The Olympics do well on tv, too.  But, not every weekend.  Don't get me wrong, soccer has its place as a legitimate sport--it just isn't a weekly revenue generator in the US market.  Rule changes are mandatory for that to be the case--like tv commercial time-outs.  I don't need to tell you that this is a huge revenue generator!

[Ex-Trumpet]

ESPN, ESPN2, NBCSN, Fox and FoxSports aren't mainstream TV?

NBC is paying $250 million over three years to televise Premier League matches from England. Fox is paying a rumored $150m over two years for the European Champions League tournament. ESPN is paying a reported $45m per year for MLS and US Soccer rights, Fox is reportedly paying $30 million for them as the networks split the TV package.

If those broadcasts aren't making money, then the bidding wouldn't continue to go up each time contracts are negotiated. (And there is no need for TV time outs, they just put the sponsor's logo up in the corner of the screen during play.)

3 years from now, we'll see if NBC wants to renew...this World Cup may have cost lots of folks a lot of money!! 

[Ex-Trumpet]

ESPN, ESPN2, NBCSN, Fox and FoxSports aren't mainstream TV?

NBC is paying $250 million over three years to televise Premier League matches from England. Fox is paying a rumored $150m over two years for the European Champions League tournament. ESPN is paying a reported $45m per year for MLS and US Soccer rights, Fox is reportedly paying $30 million for them as the networks split the TV package.

If those broadcasts aren't making money, then the bidding wouldn't continue to go up each time contracts are negotiated. (And there is no need for TV time outs, they just put the sponsor's logo up in the corner of the screen during play.)

On second thought, those numbers really aren't that high...it's definitely worth the risk.  What's $45M to ESPN?  Superbowl ads cost nearly that much!

[hawkhawg]

You guys that don't think soccer is on TV must not go to many Mexican restaurants. Go in any time of day and one is playing.

[JayBell]

You guys that don't think soccer is on TV must not go to many Mexican restaurants. Go in any time of day and one is playing.

Yeah, but that's like totally not even mainstream.  There's just 30 million people watching.