I hope all the IN state recruits will read what Lebron said about NE Ohio

[forrest city joe]

It means something to love home.    http://www.si.com/nba/2014/07/11/lebron-james-cleveland-cavaliers  Leaving home is not always the best decision.

[Shorttimer]

While I would love for all Arkansas kids to recognize that,  it's not in the Hogs' best interest for everyone to decide to play for their home state school.  I want all of those kids from other states to think that playing out of state is the shizzle.

[forrest city joe]

While I would love for all Arkansas kids to recognize that,  it's not in the Hogs' best interest for everyone to decide to play for their home state school.  I want all of those kids from other states to think that playing out of state is the shizzle.

It should mean something to stay home.it's easy to run to Bama and Auburn and other schools. but there is nothing like building something special at home. i have always believed that.

[ricepig]

It should mean something to stay home.it's easy to run to Bama and Auburn and other schools. but there is nothing like building something special at home. i have always believed that.

I hope those kids in Texas or Florida don't buy into this 100%.

[forrest city joe]

I hope those kids in Texas or Florida don't buy into this 100%.

Apples and Oranges. there are 400 D1 players in Texas and FL. there are about 10 in Arkansas. not the same.

[ricepig]

Apples and Oranges. there are 400 D1 players in Texas and FL. there are about 10 in Arkansas. not the same.

There's also a whole lot more D-I schools in those states.....

[ARtillahog]

There's also a whole lot more D-I schools in those states.....

Not enough to take all of them, and you can't commit to what isn't there (scholarship offer).

[forrest city joe]

There's also a whole lot more D-I schools in those states.....

All those teams can get players from FL and TX, and there would still get good players left to leave that state. Apples and Oranges.

[ricepig]

Not enough to take all of them, and you can't commit to what isn't there (scholarship offer).

Do we always offer everyone of our in-state D-I recruit's?

There are 11 D-I schools in Texas, and 7 in Florida.

[forrest city joe]

Do we always offer everyone of our in-state D-I recruit's?

Stupid question.but i am not going to start any piss fights in the recruiting forum. we 100% disagree. i will leave it at that. i hope these Arkansas players who are leaving or thinking about leaving.should read what Lebron wrote today.

[Shorttimer]

It should mean something to stay home.it's easy to run to Bama and Auburn and other schools. but there is nothing like building something special at home. i have always believed that.

I understand the belief that an Arkansas kid needs to stay in Arkansas to play football.  I know all about state pride.  But it seems a bit disingenuous to expect an Arkansas kid to stay home to play while the bulk of the roster by necessity has to come from out of state.

I want kids to go to the situation that best fits them.  Hopefully for in state AND out-of-state kids, that's the University of Arkansas.

[Kenny Hawgins]

Apples and Oranges. there are 400 D1 players in Texas and FL. there are about 10 in Arkansas. not the same.

But we want the best from Texas and Florida.  Good thing Alex Collins didn't think that way.

[forrest city joe]

But we want the best from Texas and Florida.  Good thing Alex Collins didn't think that way.

We got Collins and Kirkland, and the top 3 FL schools still had top recruiting classes. Apples and oranges.

[Wildhog]

We're fans.  It's okay to be hypocritical in what we want recruits to do.

We want them to stay home.  As long as they're from Arkansas.  If they're not, then we need to find a way to make Arkansas home for them.

[Kenny Hawgins]

We got Collins and Kirkland, and the top 3 FL schools still had top recruiting classes. Apples and oranges.

Oh, well good thing they didn't want Collins and Kirkland. 

[passinghog]

It helps; provides a perspective

[forrest city joe]

It helps; provides a perspective

Yep. in my book the old saying is true. THERE IS NO PLACE LIKE HOME.

[RazorbackBurger numba foe]

It's a solid lesson, as long as home is willing to pay max salary... then there is no place like home.

[Wildhog]

It's a solid lesson, as long as home is willing to pay max salary... then there is no place like home.

We could learn from that.

[Shorttimer]

Yep. in my book the old saying is true. THERE IS NO PLACE LIKE HOME.

Unless home is Missouri or Kansas or Tennessee or Florida . . . then there's no place like Arkansas.

[forrest city joe]

It's a solid lesson, as long as home is willing to pay max salary... then there is no place like home.

Miami offered him the max.and he could have got 30 million more to stay with the Heat. sorry but this was not about money.if it was he would still be in Miami. he went home because he loves NE Ohio.and as he said, that love is bigger than Basketball.

[forrest city joe]

Unless home is Missouri or Kansas or Tennessee or Florida . . . then there's no place like Arkansas.

There is no place like home period.i am old school when it comes to that.

[Kenny Hawgins]

There is no place like home period.i am old school when it comes to that.

Too bad.

http://www.hogville.net/yabbse/index.php?topic=570042.0

[HawgAdvocate]

Too bad.

http://www.hogville.net/yabbse/index.php?topic=570042.0

Pears & squash!!

[Porkahontas]

If Gragg and/or Hill were to get on board and start recruiting more future teammates to Arkansas, we could have a class that would be the cornerstone of a national title type team, something that would be special because it doesn't happen here.

I don't see the thrill in going to Bama, Auburn, Oregon, schools like that. National title contention happens a lot at those schools. It doesn't happen a lot here. To me, it would mean so much more doing it here, in your home state, in front of my friends and family, doing something that hasn't (in some opinions) ever been done here.

[poloprince]

I dig

[Pulled(PP)pork]

It should mean something to stay home.it's easy to run to Bama and Auburn and other schools. but there is nothing like building something special at home. i have always believed that.

hows the stomach joe?  all rested up for this coming season of JL ball?


PP

[RNHog]

They will do what LJ did. Go to a place where they can and will win a championship. He just wants to win one for Cleveland now.

Different with these high school kids here in Arkansas. It isn't until later in life that SOME realize staying home would have been the best decision. But I am sure that is rare.

[SPAL]

It's cool to think that way, but these guys are right.... we hope kids from other states spurn the home school to come to Arkansas every day. It is what it is, nature of the beast. Just don't pretend it's different.

[Pulled(PP)pork]

Joe likes his cake and wants to eat it too....then throw it up


PP

[ricepig]

Joe likes his cake and wants to eat it too....then throw it up


PP

+1mil

[muddhogger]

There is no place like home period.i am old school when it comes to that.

I agree with ya. Small states like Arkansas, who have an avg of 7-10 Division I prospects per year, should be considered first by the kids instate who get an offer. I don't blame kids like will gragg and KJ hill for wanting to enjoy the recruiting process because they are kids and they can only do this once.  But I will say, if you grow up living and breathing arkansas razorbacks, you need to finish out being an arkansas razorback. Just my opinion but what do I know, I'm just a "band nerd"

[redeye]

A lot of good points in this thread and they're not all mutually exclusive.

Most schools are heavily dependent on local, or nearby, talent.  Most players have the right to attend the school that fits them best.  But, if you're an Arkansas player on a great Alabama team, then you're an Arkansas player helping Alabama players win games for Alabama.  That's a significant difference between Darren McFadden and Altee Tenpenny.

We all want the best players to stay home, unless that means another school.  Players have to ask themselves what's worth more to them?  Helping a foreign school win football games or helping those that know you?

[GlassofSwine]

Unless home is Missouri or Kansas or Tennessee or Florida . . . then there's no place like Arkansas.

  Lots of you guys bash FCJ just because it is FCJ.  Look at a guy like Altee Tenpenny riding the bench at Alabama. We could use that kind of talent. We lost Frazier this year. What if we lose K.J. Hill and Gragg?  These are players that Arkansas needs, if Alabama, Texas A&M, or Florida lose a guy like that they just go after the next 4 or 5 star on their list.
When your pool of talent is around 20 home state D-1 players a year with only 4 or 5 of those guys being SEC caliber talents losing them to ride the bench at another school is brutal. Alabama produces 4X the D1 talent and Texas 15X to 17X times the  D1 talent that Arkansas does.

[secneahog]

Chasing rings is nice.. But fighting for your home is bigger than football.

[Pulled(PP)pork]

  Lots of you guys bash FCJ just because it is FCJ.  Look at a guy like Altee Tenpenny riding the bench at Alabama. We could use that kind of talent. We lost Frazier this year. What if we lose K.J. Hill and Gragg?  These are players that Arkansas needs, if Alabama, Texas A&M, or Florida lose a guy like that they just go after the next 4 or 5 star on their list.
When your pool of talent is around 20 home state D-1 players a year with only 4 or 5 of those guys being SEC caliber talents losing them to ride the bench at another school is brutal. Alabama produces 4X the D1 talent and Texas 15X to 17X times the  D1 talent that Arkansas does.

you're right


PP

[Break & Run]

So let's throw this out for consideration.

Many on this board have said that in state talent which stays here, and plays at Arkansas will be taken care of after their playing days.  I am NOT suggesting anything sinister or illegal here but I understand this to mean that former Razorback athletes would/should never have much trouble finding a job, etc in this state after their playing days. 

Fine, and fair enough.  That's probably a constant throughout the college football playing states. 

Here is the question: are out of state athletes who come to Arkansas afforded this same sort of affection? 

Yes...see David Bazzel and Pat Bradley.

[HoopS]

Arkansas is just different when it comes to this stuff.  We are the big show in town.  Most of us grew up wanting nothing more than to be a Hog. Leaving our state if given the opportunity to be a Hog seemed unfathomable.  Somewhere along the way, I guess things changed.   The whole state pride thing isn't engrained into the kids like it used to be. 

I had to move away for work but my boys, never living in Arkansas, have Arkansas pride and live for the Hogs like I did.  If they ever get the chance, they'll play for the Hogs.

[hogwild210]

  Lots of you guys bash FCJ just because it is FCJ.  Look at a guy like Altee Tenpenny riding the bench at Alabama. We could use that kind of talent. We lost Frazier this year. What if we lose K.J. Hill and Gragg?  These are players that Arkansas needs, if Alabama, Texas A&M, or Florida lose a guy like that they just go after the next 4 or 5 star on their list.
When your pool of talent is around 20 home state D-1 players a year with only 4 or 5 of those guys being SEC caliber talents losing them to ride the bench at another school is brutal. Alabama produces 4X the D1 talent and Texas 15X to 17X times the  D1 talent that Arkansas does.

Again, I'm all for players staying home...but Tenpenny played as a freshman. He is not a good example.

[Rzbakfromwaybak]

Again, I'm all for players staying home...but Tenpenny played as a freshman. He is not a good example.

Have to disagree.  Tenpenny did play as a freshman....but not that much.  He has not exactly been a starter at Alabama.  He has spent most of his time there, down on the depth chart.... & on the bench. 

[GlassofSwine]

Have to disagree.  Tenpenny did play as a freshman....but not that much.  He has not exactly been a starter at Alabama.  He has spent most of his time there, down on the depth chart.... & on the bench.

TenPenny played in 6 games only 2 of which were SEC games and by the middle of the season he rode the bench until Alabama played Chattanooga. For all that time he got 22 carries and 82 yards. Good enough to tie for 4th/5th in attempts and 5th in yards. He contributed less than 5% of Alabama's rushing attempts and 3% of their rushing yardage. All of the RB's that were ahead of him are back, so Altee will enter the year fighting for 4th or 5th on the RB depth chart. Again, tell me how saying he is riding the bench is a  bad example, when he is riding the bench 95% of the time?

[forrest city joe]

I stand by what i posted. your home state should mean something to you. i love Arkansas, and love Forrest city.and i pull for the Razorbacks in everything.

[ricepig]

I stand by what i posted. your home state should mean something to you. i love Arkansas, and love Forrest city.and i pull for the Razorbacks in everything.

Joe, 99.9% of us on here do too, well, not the love for FC part. However, it's impossible to get every kid, we can only hope that the vast majority care enough to be Razorbacks, and we pick up top kids from other states.

[mizzouman]

It should mean something to stay home.it's easy to run to Bama and Auburn and other schools. but there is nothing like building something special at home. i have always believed that.

I agree Joe, but some kids just want to leave and see something different.  Can't blame an 18 year old kid for that. 

[Shorttimer]

  Lots of you guys bash FCJ just because it is FCJ.  Look at a guy like Altee Tenpenny riding the bench at Alabama. We could use that kind of talent. We lost Frazier this year. What if we lose K.J. Hill and Gragg?  These are players that Arkansas needs, if Alabama, Texas A&M, or Florida lose a guy like that they just go after the next 4 or 5 star on their list.
When your pool of talent is around 20 home state D-1 players a year with only 4 or 5 of those guys being SEC caliber talents losing them to ride the bench at another school is brutal. Alabama produces 4X the D1 talent and Texas 15X to 17X times the  D1 talent that Arkansas does.

I'm not bashing Joe at all . . . I responded to his argument.  I want top shelf talent from every state--including Arkansas--to choose Arkansas because it's the best place for that player at that time. 

It would be great to get every in-state player we want.  But even so, we have to supplement that crop every year with 18 or more kids from other states who, by necessity, must choose us over their home state school(s).  What I believe Joe is saying is that once Florida, Florida State, Miami, South Florida, Central Florida, FIU, FAU and who ever else is down there take the top kids,  we should happily settle for the leftovers.  I disagree.  We wouldn't thrive as a program with the best from Arkansas and the leftovers from elsewhere.

To be a top tier program, the state has to start producing MUCH more high school talent and it all has to stay home OR the Hogs have to raid other states for top shelf talent--not players who were passed over by major, home-state schools.  So, for me to be consistent, I have to be okay with Arkansas players choosing to play elsewhere from time to time.

[hawgsmellgud]

It took Lebron leaving to realize how much he loved home. It's to bad these kids don't get the opportunity to go play somewhere for a couple years, and realize what they miss.

I left the state when I was 20 thinking I was gone for good, but I came back at 24, and will never leave again.

[GlassofSwine]

I'm not bashing Joe at all . . . I responded to his argument.  I want top shelf talent from every state--including Arkansas--to choose Arkansas because it's the best place for that player at that time. 

It would be great to get every in-state player we want.  But even so, we have to supplement that crop every year with 18 or more kids from other states who, by necessity, must choose us over their home state school(s).  What I believe Joe is saying is that once Florida, Florida State, Miami, South Florida, Central Florida, FIU, FAU and who ever else is down there take the top kids,  we should happily settle for the leftovers.  I disagree.  We wouldn't thrive as a program with the best from Arkansas and the leftovers from elsewhere.

To be a top tier program, the state has to start producing MUCH more high school talent and it all has to stay home OR the Hogs have to raid other states for top shelf talent--not players who were passed over by major, home-state schools.  So, for me to be consistent, I have to be okay with Arkansas players choosing to play elsewhere from time to time.

   Are Alex Collins, Denver Kirkland, etc leftovers?
You are trying to make a consistent statement but the situations are not similar. Arkansas can recruit 20% of their class in-state most years. Schools in Texas  and Florida can recruit 100% of their class inside their state, Teams like Alabama and Auburn 40 to 50%. In other-words, there are plenty of athletes in these states who might want an offer from a school and not even get one. Manziel was recruited to play safety at Texas, a school he was a bigger fan of than A&M. Just ask yourself this, when was the last time Arkansas had an in-state talent like Darius Philon and asked him to greyshirt? We wouldn't because talent like that is rare in Arkansas.
   I think everyone understands we are going to lose some recruits, but when recruits leave to these other programs and act as if it is a business decision to get them to the Pro's faster it hurts. So the attitude of "I love the Razorbacks but playing at Alabama,etc will be better for me"  we need that to go away.

[Shorttimer]

   Are Alex Collins, Denver Kirkland, etc leftovers?
You are trying to make a consistent statement but the situations are not similar. Arkansas can recruit 20% of their class in-state most years. Schools in Texas  and Florida can recruit 100% of their class inside their state, Teams like Alabama and Auburn 40 to 50%. In other-words, there are plenty of athletes in these states who might want an offer from a school and not even get one. Manziel was recruited to play safety at Texas, a school he was a bigger fan of than A&M. Just ask yourself this, when was the last time Arkansas had an in-state talent like Darius Philon and asked him to greyshirt? We wouldn't because talent like that is rare in Arkansas.
   I think everyone understands we are going to lose some recruits, but when recruits leave to these other programs and act as if it is a business decision to get them to the Pro's faster it hurts. So the attitude of "I love the Razorbacks but playing at Alabama,etc will be better for me"  we need that to go away.

Collins and Kirkland would have been accepted on any campus they chose to attend.  I want those players at Arkansas.  I want more of them.  I think they chose to come here because that was the best decision for them.  That's why it's consistent for me to say that there are some instances where an in-state kid would choose to go elsewhere and I would not begrudge that decision.  Because they thought it was the best choice for them at the time.  That's a very consistent opinion.

What would be an inconsistent position is the belief that it's best for all Arkansas players to stay home and play for the home-state school, but that the best players from other states should want to come here to play.  It's not apples and oranges.  It's a matter of intellectual honesty.

[GlassofSwine]

Collins and Kirkland would have been accepted on any campus they chose to attend.  I want those players at Arkansas.  I want more of them.  I think they chose to come here because that was the best decision for them.  That's why it's consistent for me to say that there are some instances where an in-state kid would choose to go elsewhere and I would not begrudge that decision.  Because they thought it was the best choice for them at the time.  That's a very consistent opinion.

What would be an inconsistent position is the belief that it's best for all Arkansas players to stay home and play for the home-state school, but that the best players from other states should want to come here to play.  It's not apples and oranges.  It's a matter of intellectual honesty.

  FCJ never stated we should begrudge players who choose to leave, simply that it means something for them to stay and build something at home. I think he would agree with you that in some instances it is in the best interest of a kid to leave, however the majority of the time that is not what happens.
   Secondly, consistency doesn't apply across the board when situations are different. In other-words, applying consistent process across inconsistent areas doesn't yield consistent results. Why? because the situation is different. Recruiting in states that produce enough talent to supply  recruiting for 3 D1 teams a year, like Alabama or 14 like Texas is completely different than Arkansas which doesn't produce enough D-1 talent a year for even 1 D-1 school to claim all of them and not have to go out of the state, regardless of quality.

[hogwild210]

Have to disagree.  Tenpenny did play as a freshman....but not that much.  He has not exactly been a starter at Alabama.  He has spent most of his time there, down on the depth chart.... & on the bench.

He still played. As a true freshman. Look at what was ahead of him...that's saying something. You can still easily make the point that Arkansas kids should stay home without having to try to stretch the Tenpenny angle. It's just not a strong argument.