Tommy Bowden on Arkansas.

[secneahog]

http://arkansas.247sports.com/Bolt/Tommy-Bowden-8-wins-will-keep-you-employed-for-a-long-time-29383580


I like his thinking on the situation here. Getting to 8 wins would be great. Get back to the top 5 when the talent is coming through every year.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

8 wins for "that type of program.". 

[HogFanatic]

Tommy Bowden is right. Arkansas is flying under the radar this season. It may mean that we only win 6 or 7 games, but Arkansas is going to shock some folks this year. It starts week one with Auburn, by god.

[Hawgey-Davidson]

I concur.

[HogFanatic]

8 wins for "that type of program.".

Yeah, he missed the mark there. Truth of the matter is that our Athletic Department turns a pretty healthy profit. It doesn't "cost all the resources they have," as he put it.

Still a stigma around the school, but I don't think that will go away until Arkansas starts finishing in the top 5 consistently.

[secneahog]

Tommy Bowden is right. Arkansas is flying under the radar this season. It may mean that we only win 6 or 7 games, but Arkansas is going to shock some folks this year. It starts week one with Auburn, by god.

That is what jumped out to me. I think we're flying under the radar also. But some on here don't think so.

Also I don't necessarily agree with all of what he said, just want to hear some input on it.

[LRRandy]

Yeah, he missed the mark there. Truth of the matter is that our Athletic Department turns a pretty healthy profit. It doesn't "cost all the resources they have," as he put it.

Still a stigma around the school, but I don't think that will go away until Arkansas starts finishing in the top 5 consistently.

then by your statement and the fact that Arkansas has really never consistently finished in the top 5 the stigma is going to be on the program for quite some time if not always.

[secneahog]

then by your statement and the fact that Arkansas has really never consistently finished in the top 5 the stigma is going to be on the program for quite some time if not always.

Do you think Arkansas if flying under the radar like Bowden said or not?

[Dr Carl aka Shorthog]

Uh, OK. Sounds like Nutt-talk to me. Nutt made a long living off getting just enough wins to get to a bowl and keep his job. Now that BP took us to a new high, that will be the expectation and that will be the standard to measure by. IMO 8 wins is not enough and should be considered a meh season.

[HogFanatic]

then by your statement and the fact that Arkansas has really never consistently finished in the top 5 the stigma is going to be on the program for quite some time if not always.

Arkansas was a top ten program for nearly three decades, man. I just chose the top five number because he quoted that finish in the article.

Arkansas has been at the top of the game before, and it can get there again.

[secneahog]

Uh, OK. Sounds like Nutt-talk to me. Nutt made a long living off getting just enough wins to get to a bowl and keep his job. Now that BP took us to a new high, that will be the expectation and that will be the standard to measure by. IMO 8 wins is not enough and should be considered a meh season.

Ok cool.

Tell me on our schedule this year what the 8 wins would be ?

[secneahog]

Arkansas was a top ten program for nearly three decades, man. I just chose the top five number because he quoted that finish in the article.

Arkansas has been at the top of the game before, and it can get there again.

Of course it can get back there.

[HogFanatic]

Of course it can get back there.

Like the new moniker. That dude looks like a straight blood-thirsty murderer.

[secneahog]

Like the new moniker. That dude looks like a straight blood-thirsty murderer.

Yeah. That extra work he's been putting in is starting to show. He's going to be big time.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

Ok cool.

Tell me on our schedule this year what the 8 wins would be ?

Here's the thing...I can certainly buy that we're flying under the radar this season.  However, IMO, the primary theme of his comments, though, is essentially that we are an 8-win program...A program like Clemson's was under his direction.  Wether or not that's true is irrelevant.  Don't want to hear that.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

Like the new moniker. That dude looks like a straight blood-thirsty murderer.

Agree.  Bet he's nasty.

[secneahog]

Here's the thing...I can certainly buy that we're flying under the radar this season.  However, IMO, the primary theme of his comments, though, is essentially that we are an 8-win program...A program like Clemson's was under his direction.  Wether or not that's true is irrelevant.  Don't want to hear that.

Not saying I agree with him. There could be different ways you can take what he said.

With all the crying a lot of Arkansas do, he's saying if a coach can get to 8 wins in a season your job should be safe.
He stated we got to top 5 before, so it can happen.

[lumphog]

This will be a tell tale year. We ARE flying under the radar. I like it.

[Lake City Hog]

Funny, Mark Richt has AVERAGED 9 1/2 wins per year for his Georgia career and many on this very board think that he is overrated. He has won 6 Division Titles and 2 SEC Championships.
He plays Florida every year at a Florida venue, even though it is considered neutral. He plays Georgia Tech every year as 1 of his OOC games, home and home.

If Bret can mirror Richt I will be ecstatic! If we get to the point of expecting to go to a bowl game every year, winning 8 is a so-so year and actually win an SEC Championship I think every Hog fan would be happy.

I think Bowden is very wrong on our resources, we have and will use the resources required to field SEC teams. We can spend with the top dogs of the conference easily! If BB is the guy that can lead us there we can and will spend the money to keep him here.

[Augustus]

Funny, Mark Richt has AVERAGED 9 1/2 wins per year for his Georgia career and many on this very board think that he is overrated. He has won 6 Division Titles and 2 SEC Championships.
He plays Florida every year at a Florida venue, even though it is considered neutral. He plays Georgia Tech every year as 1 of his OOC games, home and home.

If Bret can mirror Richt I will be ecstatic! If we get to the point of expecting to go to a bowl game every year, winning 8 is a so-so year and actually win an SEC Championship I think every Hog fan would be happy.

I think Bowden is very wrong on our resources, we have and will use the resources required to field SEC teams. We can spend with the top dogs of the conference easily! If BB is the guy that can lead us there we can and will spend the money to keep him here.

I agree on Richt. Before I replied, I went back & looked to make sure my thinking was correct... Since 2001, the only years Richt didn't have a recruiting class in the top 10 was 2010, 2013 (His classes were ranked 11th & 12th respectively in those years), per 24/7's website.

Hopefully, the wins will start coming, and BB can start recruiting somewhere close to that level.

[HiggiePiggy]

Funny, Mark Richt has AVERAGED 9 1/2 wins per year for his Georgia career and many on this very board think that he is overrated. He has won 6 Division Titles and 2 SEC Championships.
He plays Florida every year at a Florida venue, even though it is considered neutral. He plays Georgia Tech every year as 1 of his OOC games, home and home.

If Bret can mirror Richt I will be ecstatic! If we get to the point of expecting to go to a bowl game every year, winning 8 is a so-so year and actually win an SEC Championship I think every Hog fan would be happy.

I think Bowden is very wrong on our resources, we have and will use the resources required to field SEC teams. We can spend with the top dogs of the conference easily! If BB is the guy that can lead us there we can and will spend the money to keep him here.

Georgia recruiting is not the same as Arkansas recruiting. 

[LRRandy]

Do you think Arkansas if flying under the radar like Bowden said or not?

i think they are crawling their way back. I don't think there has been much flying going on lately.

[jgphillips3]

Nobody is a consistent top 5 finisher.  Alabama is as close as it gets today.  Florida State had an amazing 14 year run of top 5 finishes from 1987 to 2000.  Miami had a 7 year run of top 3 finishes in the 80's and 90's but I don't think Arkansas can ever do that.  Those guys had DEEP recruiting bases and phenomenal coaching.  We can finish top 5 sometimes and probably even win a national title but we don't have the recruiting base.  I believe we can finish top 25 at least 8 out of 10 years and be a legitimate title threat about every 5 years.  That would be an awesome result for us.

[Qadi999]

Bowden was right on the mark  Arkansas is an a 8 win a year team. Every 8 to 15 years we should be able to make a run at an SEC title and every 15 to 30 year we should make a run at  NC. The sooner we hog fans accept  that the happier will be and stop firing head coaches every 5 years.

[LRRandy]

Here's the thing...I can certainly buy that we're flying under the radar this season.  However, IMO, the primary theme of his comments, though, is essentially that we are an 8-win program...A program like Clemson's was under his direction.  Wether or not that's true is irrelevant.  Don't want to hear that.

actually slightly less than 8 wins a year over the last 10 years.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

actually slightly less than 8 wins a year over the last 10 years.

And?

[Bebop]

Georgia recruiting is not the same as Arkansas recruiting.

Exactly. Georgia is closer to all types of better talent than Arkansas. Richt should have at least one ring by now, in my opinion.

[LRRandy]

And?

that wether or not you want to hear it, it is relevant. Arkansas is a sub 8 win a year program.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

Exactly. Georgia is closer to all types of better talent than Arkansas. Richt should have at least one ring by now, in my opinion.

I've always thought Richt teams have been too vanilla.  They've typically been very talented and good in all phases of the game, but not great in any.  Most NC teams are typically really special at something, or are led by a truly special player. UGA hasnt seemed to have any of that.  Often Very good teams, but not great.

[Hoggish1]

...for that type a program...?  LMAO because he is one that Long went after!

[Bubba's Bruisers]

that wether or not you want to hear it, it is relevant. Arkansas is a sub 8 win a year program.

I can do the math as well.  My point is that while people are all over Bowden's Johnson about the "under the radar comment", they completely miss his primary point.  That point is exactly the point you're making.  A point that I'm not arguing.  His comments are absolutely Nutt-esq, yet we're lapping it up.  ironic, for a fan base, including me, that loaths Nutt.

[Hoggish1]

8 wins for "that type of program.". 

Right, bruiser! +1

[lefty08]

Dear LRRandy.  Ive tried hard to figure out whichbteam you are a fan of, and wondered why you post here instead of on their fan board. You sir are the epitome of a pot stirrer and are only here for one reason. I really wish youbwould just crawl back in your hole and let hog fans be. We all understand what you are. Thanks

[Bubba's Bruisers]

Dear LRRandy.  Ive tried hard to figure out whichbteam you are a fan of, and wondered why you post here instead of on their fan board. You sir are the epitome of a pot stirrer and are only here for one reason. I really wish youbwould just crawl back in your hole and let hog fans be. We all understand what you are. Thanks

tOSU

[LZH]

This is the same Tommy Bowden that yanked our chain to get a raise at Clemson, right?  Who gives a flip what he thinks.

And Mark Richt does less with more year in and year out.

[Dr Carl aka Shorthog]

Ok cool.

Tell me on our schedule this year what the 8 wins would be ?

I think you missed my point or I wasn't clear. IMO eight wins even on a consistent basis is not enough. I think we win 3 or 4 this upcoming year. Eight wins is minimum two more years away

[ricepig]

Dear LRRandy.  Ive tried hard to figure out whichbteam you are a fan of, and wondered why you post here instead of on their fan board. You sir are the epitome of a pot stirrer and are only here for one reason. I really wish youbwould just crawl back in your hole and let hog fans be. We all understand what you are. Thanks

tatU

[go hogues]

Bowden was right on the mark  Arkansas is an a 8 win a year team. Every 8 to 15 years we should be able to make a run at an SEC title and every 15 to 30 year we should make a run at  NC. The sooner we hog fans accept  that the happier will be and stop firing head coaches every 5 years.

[Hoggish1]

Chris Vannini = Classic fail...

[Al Boarland]

I took it as he thinks we are an 8 win average program. That means we will drop 4 games a year. Unacceptable for what we are shelling out for this staff.

Are we flying under the radar? Absolutely. There's a reason for that. There is no expectation for this team outside of our fan base

[scootriteby]

Doesn't take a "rocket scientist"/former head coach to figure this out. Just look at our last 2 coaches of note; HDN and BP with 7.5 wins and 8.5 wins average per the career here. That averages out exactly...8 wins. Is that what we as Razorbacks should aspire for? I would personally like to see a little more than 8 wins per season on average. But maybe I am aiming to high!

[ricepig]

I took it as he thinks we are an 8 win average program. That means we will drop 4 games a year. Unacceptable for what we are shelling out for this staff.

Are we flying under the radar? Absolutely. There's a reason for that. There is no expectation for this team outside of our fan base

That's average, would you take a 2-10 if it meant a 14-0 was next? That does average 8 wins a year.....

[Locutus_of_Boar]

Uh, OK. Sounds like Nutt-talk to me. Nutt made a long living off getting just enough wins to get to a bowl and keep his job.

Well said.  Bowden sees both Clemson and Arkansas as a place a mediocre coach can hang out for a few years till the heat gets to be too much.  Nutt averaged 7.5 wins per year for a decade.  He knew the system and the PTB just well enough to hang on until almost everyone hated him because he didn't understand that Arkansas fans for better or worse will never be satisfied with 8 wins a year.

[lefty08]

Doesn't take a "rocket scientist"/former head coach to figure this out. Just look at our last 2 coaches of note; HDN and BP with 7.5 wins and 8.5 wins average per the career here. That averages out exactly...8 wins. Is that what we as Razorbacks should aspire for? I would personally like to see a little more than 8 wins per season on average. But maybe I am aiming to high!

Nothing wrong with wanting more. In order to do that we need stability and support. We dont need new coaches every 4 years, we need an identity. I think BB gives us an identity

[Al Boarland]

Nothing wrong with wanting more. In order to do that we need stability and support. We dont need new coaches every 4 years, we need an identity. I think BB gives us an identity

It appears we have an identity. That of an 8 win type program.

That will have to change. We will have to see some serious progression just to get to that identity.

[scootriteby]

Nothing wrong with wanting more. In order to do that we need stability and support. We dont need new coaches every 4 years, we need an identity. I think BB gives us an identity

I think it is too soon to start anointing CBB. But he will have 4-5 years to show progress.

What kind of progress will he need to make? Is an 8 win average going to be enough to appease the fans? I think it should, because for him to get to 8 wins in 5 years would mean a little over 9 wins the next 4. And since he probably won't get close to that this season(let's say 6), then his wins would have to be over 10. We aren't going to fire him if he does that. He should also get COTY for each of those last 3 years!

[GlassofSwine]

I took it as he thinks we are an 8 win average program. That means we will drop 4 games a year. Unacceptable for what we are shelling out for this staff.

Are we flying under the radar? Absolutely. There's a reason for that. There is no expectation for this team outside of our fan base

  So let's look at some perspective on the stats.

From 1958 to 1989, Arkansas won at a 71% clip. That includes Broyles, Holtz and Hatfield. On a 12 game schedule that rounds up to 9 wins a season.

From 1990 to 2007 Arkansas won at a 53% clip. An average of 6 wins in a 12 game schedule. The best coach of that period by win pct,  sadly was Houston Nutt who won at a 61% clip or 7 games a season.

Bobby Petrino in his 4 years won at a 66% clip or 8 wins a season out of 12 games.

Historically, If you take Arkansas's win percentages over a 12 game schedule,  during our best extended time periods Arkansas has been an 8-9 win team per season. Before the Petrino fans chime in,  I think Petrino would have gotten his average closer to 9 games over more time.

Historically, how good is that? Well, a 71% win percentage is good enough to be a Top 10 program all time for win percentage. 8 games a year would come out to around 66.6% on average which is good enough for Top 15 all-time.

  So, if Bielema gets us to 8 wins every year then he will be doing a  good job and have us Top 25 every year. My hope though, is to get us back to that 71% clip we held for 30 years and to 9 wins every season.

[WashUhog6]

8 wins per year may sound like a backhanded comment, but that's winning at a 67% which is pretty good. Of course, we don't want a ceiling of 8 wins under a coach, but if you average it out over a ten year period, we have the potential to sprinkle in 10 and 11 win seasons, as well as seasons with 6 wins or less.

8 wins isn't the goal, but I'd take 8 every year over the roller coaster we've been on in the last decade. Consistency would be great for us.

[Dr Carl aka Shorthog]

You guys are thinking wayyyy too hard about this whole average thing. I'm pretty sure he was just saying arkansas will more often than not win about eight games a year and that is good for them. That is why he made the comment about a coach winning 8 would be around for a while. As if 8 is ok and we should all be happy. Does not mean expect more or accept less, just that 8 gets you a pass to next year. Like I said: very Nutt like

[BrassNunchucks]

I think y'all are missing the point. Eight wins is actually pretty dang good if you spread it out over 6-8 seasons and sprinkle in some 9,10 and 11-win years.

I think Arkansas's model under Bielema should actually be South Carolina under Steve Spurrier. The first few years he was there I think they were like a 7-6, 8-5, 9-4 type team. But they set that foundation so often, suddenly when they started winning 10 and 11 games the last few years, it didn't really surprise anybody.

Bielema's talked about "if you build it right the first time, you don't have to build it again." And we've seen that with all the evaluations they put into recruits, and the emphasis they put on academics and player discipline, so far there hasn't been much attrition. So if he's walking the talk, then a USC-type program is what UA could look like down the line. You have to earn respect over years.