Bielema's Draft History and Recruiting rankings

[hawgsalot]

You look at draft history and shake your head....Just how in the world were we able to not only compete, but was arguably the 2nd and 3rd best team in the SEC in 2011 and 2012? No first and no second round picks....MSU in the same period had 2 1sts and 2 2nds...11 total....Ole Miss had 2 1sts and 1 2nd, 10 total..Kentucky had 1 2nd, 13 overall in the same period....Even Vandy had a 1st rounder and a 2nd rounder with a total of 10. By all rights we should have been fighting these teams for 9~12 place in the league. If you are looking at the quality of picks (round), maybe the fight should have been for 11th~12th place.

We were able to compete because CBP had such a great QB and WR to go along with his playcalling.  History shows when you have a draftable qb you win alot of games if you have talent around him.  The reason we didn't win the west is CBPs Achilles heal, no defense.  Decent D we had a chance in 2010, 2011 we weren't good enough.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Since you already have the data, can you show the draftees from 2008 on?

No, but I can give you the season results from 2006-2013 and the average SOS as well as the number of draft picks from the 2007 NFL Draft through the 2014 NFL Draft for the teams that I have tabulated for those results. Sorted by win percentage from 2006-2013.

Team             Draft Picks           Avg P/Year          Win %           SOS

Boise St               20                      2.5                .876            .488
Ohio St                41                      5.1                .804            .543
LSU                     52                      6.5                .792            .586
Oregon                 29                      3.6                .790            .558
Oklahoma             38                       4.8                .787            .591
Alabama               44                      5.5                .771            .576
USC                    51                       6.4                .750            .536
Florida                 41                       5.1                .736            .620
Wisconsin             30                       3.8                .726            .533
Texas                  32                       4.0                .721            .560
Georgia                43                       5.4                .698            .580
S. Carolina            29                       3.6                .673            .590
Auburn                 25                       3.1                .673            .596
Clemson               35                       4.4                .670             .554
Florida St             37                       4.6                .663             .550
Michigan St          20                       2.5                .648             .544
Stanford              23                       2.9                .621             .549
Texas A&M           21                       2.6                .602             .578
Michigan              27                       3.4                .598             .569
Arkansas              27                       3.4                .578             .595

It appears to me, based on this data, that LSU and Georgia have both undeachieved compared to the talent that they had available to them and their average SOS over that time from 2006-2013.

[Peter Porker]

We were able to compete because CBP had such a great QB and WR to go along with his playcalling.  History shows when you have a draftable qb you win alot of games if you have talent around him.  The reason we didn't win the west is CBPs Achilles heal, no defense.  Decent D we had a chance in 2010, 2011 we weren't good enough.

Defense didn't lose us games in 2010 and 2011. Especially 2011. Booby's baby crapped the bed in those years.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Defense didn't lose us games in 2010 and 2011. Especially 2011. Booby's baby crapped the bed in those years.

A lack of sound defense has most always contributed to our losses in games. Not always, but a lot of the time.

[Peter Porker]

A lack of sound defense has most always contributed to our losses in games. Not always, but a lot of the time.

2011 vs Alabama. Defense holds Alabama to 17 points while Booby's offense scores 2 TDs in 13 drives.

2011 vs LSU Defense scores a TD and holds LSU until late but wears  down due to the offense scoring just 1 TD on 11 drives.

[Peter Porker]

A lack of sound defense has most always contributed to our losses in games. Not always, but a lot of the time.

2010 vs Alabama Defense holds Bama to 14 points going into the 4th quarter. Booby couldn't muster a running game and defense gives up 10 points including a TD on a 12 yard drive after the offense turns the ball over. Last 3 Arkansas offensive drives are punt, INT, INT.

Auburn 2010 this is the only loss in which the defense could possibly be blamed,  but the offense punted 3 times and turned it over 4 times including the last 4 drives ending in FUM, INT,  INT, turnover on downs.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

2010 vs Alabama Defense holds Bama to 14 points going into the 4th quarter. Booby couldn't muster a running game and defense gives up 10 points including a TD on a 12 yard drive after the offense turns the ball over. Last 3 Arkansas offensive drives are punt, INT, INT.

Auburn 2010 this is the only loss in which the defense could possibly be blamed,  but the offense punted 3 times and turned it over 4 times including the last 4 drives ending in FUM, INT,  INT, turnover on downs.

You cite games aganst two teams, that isn't all that we lost. We were out-talented and out-schemed. I don't disagree with you on your points about these games, but a more talented, better coached, better schemed defense might have turned the tables in more games that were either close  or that we lost.

You cannot win consistently in the SEC, year in and year out, in the absence of a quality defense. Have to have at least an average or better offense, but quality defense is the key to winning in the SEC when coupled with an average or better offense.

[Peter Porker]

You cite games aganst two teams, that isn't all that we lost. We were out-talented and out-schemed. I don't disagree with you on your points about these games, but a more talented, better coached, better schemed defense might have turned the tables in more games that were either close  or that we lost.

You cannot win consistently in the SEC, year in and year out, in the absence of a quality defense. Have to have at least an average or better offense, but quality defense is the key to winning in the SEC when coupled with an average or better offense.

Those are the 2 regular season losses. Offense shows up and we win the West. Defense did it's part in those losses. I don't care about what happened in the wins because,  well, we won those games. Losses keep a team from playing for championships.

[Peter Porker]

You cite games aganst two teams, that isn't all that we lost. We were out-talented and out-schemed. I don't disagree with you on your points about these games, but a more talented, better coached, better schemed defense might have turned the tables in more games that were either close  or that we lost.

You cannot win consistently in the SEC, year in and year out, in the absence of a quality defense. Have to have at least an average or better offense, but quality defense is the key to winning in the SEC when coupled with an average or better offense.

Sugar Bowl vs Ohio State Arkansas punts 7 times, turns it over twice in 14 drives. 1 drive ended at halftime. We had 2 TDs on 14 drives.

[Wants2Win]

Sugar Bowl vs Ohio State Arkansas punts 7 times, turns it over twice in 14 drives. 1 drive ended at halftime. We had 2 TDs on 14 drives.

I'd say we were up against some pretty good competition. In an ideal situation the offense would score on every possession.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Sugar Bowl vs Ohio State Arkansas punts 7 times, turns it over twice in 14 drives. 1 drive ended at halftime. We had 2 TDs on 14 drives.

Like I said, better defense might have offset some of these liabilites, or am I not being clear?

[Peter Porker]

Like I said, better defense might have offset some of these liabilites, or am I not being clear?

Apparently, I'm not being clear.  Defense played well enough to win. Especially,  when the team is geared to be an offensive powerhouse and all of the talent was on offense. Imagine had Booby played Joe Adams at CB and had special packages for him on offense what that would have done to help the defense.

[Jek Tono Porkins]

Those are the 2 regular season losses. Offense shows up and we win the West. Defense did it's part in those losses. I don't care about what happened in the wins because,  well, we won those games. Losses keep a team from playing for championships.

Well doesn't that prove the point that defense wins championships? Coulda, woulda, shoulda, they didn't show up. And it wasn't necessarily that the offense didn't "show up." It's that Alabama and LSU's defense were better than Bobby's offenses those years.

You can't rely on your offense to beat Alabama and LSU. It just doesn't work. And our defense really did not "do its part" at all. Your defense has to MAKE PLAYS and you have to have a little bit of luck.

Alabama had three drives in the fourth quarter against us in 2010...one was a field goal, one was a TD, and the other ran out the clock. In fact, against Alabama in 2010, the defense gave up 421 yards and in the 2011 LSU game they gave up 494 yards. How is that doing their part? Now you can say that offensive turnovers contributed, especially in the Bama loss, BUT

Let's look at the the biggest game Bobby won at Arkansas: 2010 LSU, and a few key drives.

Early 3rd quarter: botched punt by Arkansas. LSU gets the ball on the 9-yard line. Result? Defense holds them to 3-and-out and a field goal.

Mid 3rd quarter: Mallet throws interception that gets returned to the 50-yard line. Result? 3-and-out by the defense, sack on 3rd down. LSU punts.

Late 4th quarter: LSU drives down to the 8-yard line. On second down, snap goes over Jordan Jefferson's head, (there's the luck) and defense holds them to a field goal

Very late 4th quarter: LSU down by 8 with one chance to drive down the field. Arkansas gets sack and recovers fumble. Game over.

The difference in that game was that the Arkansas defense made key stops and didn't allow LSU a single touchdown in the second half. THAT will win you games. LSU was in the red zone twice in the second half and came away with 6 points instead of 14 which would have sent the game into OT.

Yeah, the offense showed up in that game and played pretty well. But the DEFENSE is what WON the game.

[Peter Porker]

Well doesn't that prove the point that defense wins championships? Coulda, woulda, shoulda, they didn't show up. And it wasn't necessarily that the offense didn't "show up." It's that Alabama and LSU's defense were better than Bobby's offenses those years.

You can't rely on your offense to beat Alabama and LSU. It just doesn't work. And our defense really did not "do its part" at all. Your defense has to MAKE PLAYS and you have to have a little bit of luck.

Alabama had three drives in the fourth quarter against us in 2010...one was a field goal, one was a TD, and the other ran out the clock. In fact, against Alabama in 2010, the defense gave up 421 yards and in the 2011 LSU game they gave up 494 yards. How is that doing their part? Now you can say that offensive turnovers contributed, especially in the Bama loss, BUT

Let's look at the the biggest game Bobby won at Arkansas: 2010 LSU, and a few key drives.

Early 3rd quarter: botched punt by Arkansas. LSU gets the ball on the 9-yard line. Result? Defense holds them to 3-and-out and a field goal.

Mid 3rd quarter: Mallet throws interception that gets returned to the 50-yard line. Result? 3-and-out by the defense, sack on 3rd down. LSU punts.

Late 4th quarter: LSU drives down to the 8-yard line. On second down, snap goes over Jordan Jefferson's head, (there's the luck) and defense holds them to a field goal

Very late 4th quarter: LSU down by 8 with one chance to drive down the field. Arkansas gets sack and recovers fumble. Game over.

The difference in that game was that the Arkansas defense made key stops and didn't allow LSU a single touchdown in the second half. THAT will win you games. LSU was in the red zone twice in the second half and came away with 6 points instead of 14 which would have sent the game into OT.

Yeah, the offense showed up in that game and played pretty well. But the DEFENSE is what WON the game.

Like a fumble recovery for a TD? Gave up nearly 500 yards to LSU because THE OFFENSE SCORED 1 TD ON 11 DRIVES.  WHAT WERE THEY DOING ON THE OTHER DRIVES? putting the defense back on the field.

[Jek Tono Porkins]

Like a fumble recovery for a TD? Gave up nearly 500 yards to LSU because THE OFFENSE SCORED 1 TD ON 11 DRIVES.  WHAT WERE THEY DOING ON THE OTHER DRIVES? putting the defense back on the field.

Again...the point is that defense wins championships. Why did the offense not play well against LSU in 2011? Why did 47 rushing attempts get 28 yards? BECAUSE LSU'S DEFENSE WAS BETTER THAN ARKANSAS'S OFFENSE. BECAUSE DEFENSE WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS.

[Peter Porker]

Again...the point is that defense wins championships. Why did the offense not play well against LSU in 2011? Why did 47 rushing attempts get 28 yards? BECAUSE LSU'S DEFENSE WAS BETTER THAN ARKANSAS'S OFFENSE. BECAUSE DEFENSE WINS CHAMPIONSHIPS.

Booby built teams to outscore opponents. The defense in 2010 and 2011 played well enough to win HAD THE OFFENSE DONE ITS PART. IT DID NOT. That's the issue. The offense failed to show up. Booby's baby failed the team. Defense did enough to win but was worn down due to the offense failing to show up.

Arkansas Drive Summaries
START   QTR   POSS.   YARD   PLAYS   YARDS   RESULT
15:00   1   01:44   ARK 20   3   9   Punt
11:08   1   02:53   ARK 41   6   15   Punt
05:18   1   05:24   ARK 38   11   62   Passing Touchdown
05:15   2   01:51   ARK 44   3   6   Punt
03:24   2   01:25   ARK 20   4   41   Fumble
00:59   2   00:59   ARK 10   4   17   End of Half
10:53   3   03:11   ARK 12   9   76   Field Goal Good
02:14   3   02:14   ARK 20   3   -8   Punt
11:04   4   00:07   ARK 20   1   0   Interception
10:09   4   01:29   ARK 20   3   -9   Punt
05:08   4   01:34   ARK 18   4   31   Fumble
LSU Drive Summaries
START   QTR   POSS.   YARD   PLAYS   YARDS   RESULT
13:16   1   02:08   LSU 8   3   9   Punt
08:15   1   02:57   LSU 3   5   17   Punt
14:54   2   02:43   LSU 20   6   27   Fumble
12:11   2   06:56   LSU 23   14   77   Rushing Touchdown
01:59   2   01:00   LSU 34   5   66   Passing Touchdown
15:00   3   04:07   LSU 15   10   68   Interception
07:42   3   05:28   LSU 20   10   76   Field Goal Good
00:00   3   03:56   LSU 45   9   45   Rushing Touchdown
10:57   4   00:48   LSU 50   2   50   Rushing Touchdown
08:40   4   03:32   LSU 39   8   41   Field Goal Good
03:34   4   03:34   LSU 33   5   13   End of Half

[Razorbax]

I thought we didn't win the West because 3 of the 4 years the winner of the West was the National Champions...

We were able to compete because CBP had such a great QB and WR to go along with his playcalling.  History shows when you have a draftable qb you win alot of games if you have talent around him.  The reason we didn't win the west is CBPs Achilles heal, no defense.  Decent D we had a chance in 2010, 2011 we weren't good enough.

[buldozer]

No matter what statistics we look at, the bottom line is BB has to win in the SEC to be a successful coach at the UA.... and if he does this, no one will care what his statistics are and if he doesn't he will be just another blip in the history of the HOGS.

[Jek Tono Porkins]

Booby built teams to outscore opponents. The defense in 2010 and 2011 played well enough to win HAD THE OFFENSE DONE ITS PART. IT DID NOT. That's the issue. The offense failed to show up. Booby's baby failed the team. Defense did enough to win but was worn down due to the offense failing to show up.

Arkansas Drive Summaries
START   QTR   POSS.   YARD   PLAYS   YARDS   RESULT
15:00   1   01:44   ARK 20   3   9   Punt
11:08   1   02:53   ARK 41   6   15   Punt
05:18   1   05:24   ARK 38   11   62   Passing Touchdown
05:15   2   01:51   ARK 44   3   6   Punt
03:24   2   01:25   ARK 20   4   41   Fumble
00:59   2   00:59   ARK 10   4   17   End of Half
10:53   3   03:11   ARK 12   9   76   Field Goal Good
02:14   3   02:14   ARK 20   3   -8   Punt
11:04   4   00:07   ARK 20   1   0   Interception
10:09   4   01:29   ARK 20   3   -9   Punt
05:08   4   01:34   ARK 18   4   31   Fumble
LSU Drive Summaries
START   QTR   POSS.   YARD   PLAYS   YARDS   RESULT
13:16   1   02:08   LSU 8   3   9   Punt
08:15   1   02:57   LSU 3   5   17   Punt
14:54   2   02:43   LSU 20   6   27   Fumble
12:11   2   06:56   LSU 23   14   77   Rushing Touchdown
01:59   2   01:00   LSU 34   5   66   Passing Touchdown
15:00   3   04:07   LSU 15   10   68   Interception
07:42   3   05:28   LSU 20   10   76   Field Goal Good
00:00   3   03:56   LSU 45   9   45   Rushing Touchdown
10:57   4   00:48   LSU 50   2   50   Rushing Touchdown
08:40   4   03:32   LSU 39   8   41   Field Goal Good
03:34   4   03:34   LSU 33   5   13   End of Half

I think we're agreeing here but I'm not sure. You're correct, Bobby's teams were built to outscore opponents. The question is whether or not that's a good strategy.

Certainly, that strategy will win you some games. But football has three phases of the game...offense, defense and special teams. Ideally, you want to be strong in all three areas. Why?
Sometimes, your offense is going to let you down.
Sometimes, your defense is going to let you down.
Sometimes, special teams is going to let you down.

Inevitably, that's going to happen. At that point, one of the other phases has to pick up the slack. Against LSU in 2010, the defense did pick up the slack when the offense and special teams failed (Mallett throwing a pick getting returned to midfield and the punt team botching a snap). Against Alabama in 2010 and LSU in 2011, the defense did not pick up the slack when the offense failed.

That is the whole point here. When your strategy is to outscore your opponent, when your offense fails, and inevitably, it will, you're screwed. And when your defense utterly fails, you have to win in a shootout. How did that work for Kevin Sumlin? How did that work against Auburn in 2010?

The way to win championships is to have solid offense, solid defense, and solid special teams. That's they way it always has been and the way it always will be.

[Peter Porker]

I think we're agreeing here but I'm not sure. You're correct, Bobby's teams were built to outscore opponents. The question is whether or not that's a good strategy.

Certainly, that strategy will win you some games. But football has three phases of the game...offense, defense and special teams. Ideally, you want to be strong in all three areas. Why?
Sometimes, your offense is going to let you down.
Sometimes, your defense is going to let you down.
Sometimes, special teams is going to let you down.

Inevitably, that's going to happen. At that point, one of the other phases has to pick up the slack. Against LSU in 2010, the defense did pick up the slack when the offense and special teams failed (Mallett throwing a pick getting returned to midfield and the punt team botching a snap). Against Alabama in 2010 and LSU in 2011, the defense did not pick up the slack when the offense failed.

That is the whole point here. When your strategy is to outscore your opponent, when your offense fails, and inevitably, it will, you're screwed. And when your defense utterly fails, you have to win in a shootout. How did that work for Kevin Sumlin? How did that work against Auburn in 2010?

The way to win championships is to have solid offense, solid defense, and solid special teams. That's they way it always has been and the way it always will be.

My point is the defense got blamed for the losses even though it played well enough to win if Booby's offense qould have done what it was supposed to do. Thus, the offense failed us in those losses and should get the blame, not the defense.

[Jek Tono Porkins]

My point is the defense got blamed for the losses even though it played well enough to win if Booby's offense qould have done what it was supposed to do. Thus, the offense failed us in those losses and should get the blame, not the defense.

And all I'm saying is that employing a strategy that depends on your offense putting up enough points to win every game every time is a faulty strategy to begin with.

[Peter Porker]

And all I'm saying is that employing a strategy that depends on your offense putting up enough points to win every game every time is a faulty strategy to begin with.

Totally agree.

[RAZORBACKER60]

Great post and information.

I have to admit I am not so sure CBB is the right man for the job mainly because I worry if our three star average can compete with Bama's and LSU's.

But in the same thought maybe I should stop worrying about what Bama and LSU has and start think that CBB can first evaluate and then coach our boys to greatness. I sure hope he does.

Again great info!!!!!

Go Hogs

[Bubba's Bruisers]

My point is the defense got blamed for the losses even though it played well enough to win if Booby's offense qould have done what it was supposed to do. Thus, the offense failed us in those losses and should get the blame, not the defense.

What losses can be attributed to defense?

[Peter Porker]

What losses can be attributed to defense?

Which year? I don't think you can blame any of the 2011 losses on the defense. Maybe the Auburn game of 2010, but as I wrote earlier in the thread,  even the offense failed.

If you've read the thread you'd know my opinion and you wouldn't have had to write the question.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

Which year? I don't think you can blame any of the 2011 losses on the defense. Maybe the Auburn game of 2010, but as I wrote earlier in the thread,  even the offense failed.

If you've read the thread you'd know my opinion and you wouldn't have had to write the question.

Any year under BP.  Only 2010 AU (even though though the offense failed too) Nevermind, I'll read the entire thread.

[Hogjim]

no decent season this year no Coach B next year,Jeff Long will not get rid of him Empty seats will.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

no decent season this year no Coach B next year,Jeff Long will not get rid of him Empty seats will.

It would have to be a colossal melt down for that to happen. 

[Steef]

What losses can be attributed to defense?

Imo....the only loss we suffered during the Petrino years that can be laid COMPLETELY at the feet of the defense is the first Georgia game.

The 2010 debacle at Auburn....defense held them to fewer points than we scored. But special teams coughed up 2 scores and zebras game them 2.

Nope. Only the Georgia game. Offense did their job. Defense did not.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

Imo....the only loss we suffered during the Petrino years that can be laid COMPLETELY at the feet of the defense is the first Georgia game.

The 2010 debacle at Auburn....defense held them to fewer points than we scored. But special teams coughed up 2 scores and zebras game them 2.

Nope. Only the Georgia game. Offense did their job. Defense did not.

In those season, which was better...our offense or our defense?

[Steef]

In those season, which was better...our offense or our defense?

Do you have a point?

[Bubba's Bruisers]

Do you have a point?

Sure, I find it hard to believe our defense was so good that in 4 seasons under BP it was only responsible for 1 loss...that all other loses should be laid at the feet of the offense. 

Maybe a better question is this...how many games during that span was the defense responsible for winning?

[Peter Porker]

Sure, I find it hard to believe our defense was so good that in 4 seasons under BP it was only responsible for 1 loss...that all other loses should be laid at the feet of the offense. 

Maybe a better question is this...how many games during that span was the defense responsible for winning?

Dispute my opinion on those losses. I showed stats that backed my argument.  Your turn.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

Dispute my opinion on those losses. I showed stats that backed my argument.  Your turn.

I don't dispute at all tha most of our losses were due to the offense under achieving in games we lost.  Do I think the defense is responsible for only 1 loss?  well, and I admittedly haven't gone back to research it, no, I find it hard to believe.

So, What games, when the offense struggled, did the defense come up big and win the game for us?  Not saying it didn't happen.  Just can't recall.

[Peter Porker]

I don't dispute at all tha most of our losses were due to the offense under achieving in games we lost.  Do I think the defense is responsible for only 1 loss?  well, and I admittedly haven't gone back to research it, no, I find it hard to believe.

So, What games, when the offense struggled, did the defense come up big and win the game for us?  Not saying it didn't happen.  Just can't recall.

Off of the top of my head Vandy 2011, Ole Miss 2011. SCAR 2011 tye defense was dominant and the offense did ok but did struggle some.

[Steef]

Sure, I find it hard to believe our defense was so good that in 4 seasons under BP it was only responsible for 1 loss...that all other loses should be laid at the feet of the offense. 

Maybe a better question is this...how many games during that span was the defense responsible for winning?

Yeah. I thought that was where you were going.

Thing is, that isn't what I said.

Most of our losses were team efforts, with failures that weren't particularly lopsided. For instance, the pummeling Texas gave us, 52-10.  Everyone on here screamed "the defense gave up 52 points!". Very few of us were reminding, " yeah, but the offense only scored 10...too".

Team loss.

The Georgia game, Ryan was hitting every he aimed at and we scored almost at will. Our defense could not stop Georgia from responding. Defense lost that game.

Otoh...offense single handedly lost the Florida game. Defense took the ball away from Gators half a dozen times, with zero points from our offense.

And defense single handedly won the Freezer Bowl against ECU.Cause offense couldn't BUY a first down in that game.

None of that means "defense is better" or "offense is better". It means a game is a dynamic thing and both sides have to contribute.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

Off of the top of my head Vandy 2011, Ole Miss 2011.

I can buy that.  So Only 2 games in 4 seasons? 

I suppose my point, and maybe I'm on a different page, but people are acting as if our defense carried us throughout BP's tenure, and if only the offense hadn't screwed it all up, we'd have won some championships.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

Yeah. I thought that was where you were going.

Thing is, that isn't what I said.

Most of our losses were team efforts, with failures that weren't particularly lopsided. For instance, the pummeling Texas gave us, 52-10.  Everyone on here screamed "the defense gave up 52 points!". Very few of us were reminding, " yeah, but the offense only scored 10...too".

Team loss.

The Georgia game, Ryan was hitting every he aimed at and we scored almost at will. Our defense could not stop Georgia from responding. Defense lost that game.

Otoh...offense single handedly lost the Florida game. Defense took the ball away from Gators half a dozen times, with zero points from our offense.

And defense single handedly won the Freezer Bowl against ECU.Cause offense couldn't BUY a first down in that game.

None of that means "defense is better" or "offense is better". It means a game is a dynamic thing and both sides have to contribute.

You clearly said UGA was the only loss on the defense, so you did say it. The rest I agree with you on.

[Peter Porker]

I can buy that.  So Only 2 games in 4 seasons? 

I suppose my point, and maybe I'm on a different page, but people are acting as if our defense carried us throughout BP's tenure, and if only the offense hadn't screwed it all up, we'd have won some championships.

What costs us any championship? Losses. Obviously. Which unit didn't show up in those losses? The offense. Obviously. Logic. Offense cost us championships.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

What costs us any championship? Losses. Obviously. Which unit didn't show up in those losses? The offense. Obviously. Logic. Offense cost us championships.

Literally speaking, absolutely.  And if only the defense had done more to offset a struggling offense in those games, we'd have won some championships.  It's what really good defenses do.  I do agree that our defense usually did "enough" for us to win a game we lost, but it was rare for it to take control of any game.

Would have been nice to have a consistent running game too.

[Steef]

I can buy that.  So Only 2 games in 4 seasons? 

I suppose my point, and maybe I'm on a different page, but people are acting as if our defense carried us throughout BP's tenure, and if only the offense hadn't screwed it all up, we'd have won some championships.

At its best, our defense was not even close to our offense, when it was at its best..

Thing is, our entire offense was a lot like Matt Jones. Sometimes it was great. Sometimes it wasn't.

As has been pointed out before, during Bobby's four years, we had a real running game only twice. The first year, with Michael Smith. And seven games of year three, when Knile got his lightbulb.

If Knile hadn't gotten hurt, we might have gone undefeated in year four. Because a double headed offense is formidable by itself, but in Bobby's hands, it was art.

But we DIDNT have that dual threat for long. And when that happens, you jam Bobby's receivers and spook his QB...and you can  beat him.

ECU almost did it. Vandy and Ole Miss almost did it. Bama constantly did it. Chavis at LSU figured it out.

It was a mystery to me, in Bobby's last trip to Baton Rouge, why he was so predictable. The second half of that game was truly ugly.

Cotton Bowl....Broderick decided to go out with a bang. Shame he couldn't have done that all year. But even that only lasted one quarter.

[rzrbackramsfan]

To the original post, good job and this is the sole reason I believe he gets 4-5 years... As long as he keeps it up.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

At its best, our defense was not even close to our offense, when it was at its best..

Thing is, our entire offense was a lot like Matt Jones. Sometimes it was great. Sometimes it wasn't.

As has been pointed out before, during Bobby's four years, we had a real running game only twice. The first year, with Michael Smith. And seven games of year three, when Knile got his lightbulb.

If Knile hadn't gotten hurt, we might have gone undefeated in year four. Because a double headed offense is formidable by itself, but in Bobby's hands, it was art.

But we DIDNT have that dual threat for long. And when that happens, you jam Bobby's receivers and spook his QB...and you can  beat him.

ECU almost did it. Vandy and Ole Miss almost did it. Bama constantly did it. Chavis at LSU figured it out.

It was a mystery to me, in Bobby's last trip to Baton Rouge, why he was so predictable. The second half of that game was truly ugly.

Cotton Bowl....Broderick decided to go out with a bang. Shame he couldn't have done that all year. But even that only lasted one quarter.

And I completely agree.  Your first statement is my point.  Out offense carried us.  We won because of the offense, and we usually lost because of it.  But we were winning a lot more than we were losing.  And I know Bama owned our offense.  They owned everybody's offense.  We were talented at the skill position, but not so much on the line.  We could have beat them in 2010, but BP took his foot off the gas in the third quarter.

It's kind of like Mallett getting so much heat for having a knack for throwing that pic at the most inopportune time.  We focused on it.  Of course, he was the single biggest reason we were winning any games at all.

[Steef]

And I completely agree.  Your first statement is my point.  Out offense carried us.  We won because of the offense, and we usually lost because of it.  But we were winning a lot more than we were losing.  And I know Bama owned our offense.  They owned everybody's offense.  We were talented at the skill position, but not so much on the line.  We could have beat them in 2010, but BP took his foot off the gas in the third quarter.

It's kind of like Mallett getting so much heat for having a knack for throwing that pic at the most inopportune time.  We focused on it.  Of course, he was the single biggest reason we were winning any games at all.

The opposite side if the coin is, our defense overall might not have matched our offense, but the defense didn't slump as bad, either.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

The opposite side if the coin is, our defense overall might not have matched our offense, but the defense didn't slump as bad, either.

Goodness, Steef.  Yeah, sure...the defense was more consistent, but that isn't saying much.  I mean it's not like the defense was high enough to slump very far.  Too bad they didn't go out and win more games When the offense didn't do enough.

Bottom line...we didn't have the offense or defense to win anything of significance.  But it was the offense that gave us any real chance to win anything.  Was the offense great?  It was by AR standards, but not by national standards.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Literally speaking, absolutely.  And if only the defense had done more to offset a struggling offense in those games, we'd have won some championships.  It's what really good defenses do.  I do agree that our defense usually did "enough" for us to win a game we lost, but it was rare for it to take control of any game.

Would have been nice to have a consistent running game too.

We can say the offense failed us at times and that might be true, but when one unit has to carry the load for the entire team, there are going to be times that this unit sputters, and when it does, you lose.

I'll just say this, and I am going to compare us to two other teams. I looked at how much overall talent we have produced on offense and defense, by position, in terms of NFL Draft choices since 1998. Some may find this relevant, others may not.

                  DE     DT      LB        DB
Arkansas       7       3        3         7
LSU             12     12        5        16
Ohio St         8       2       17        19

Why haven't we had a defense that can hold up its end when things get tough, when the offense needs some help? I think the reason is clear.

[Bubba's Bruisers]

We can say the offense failed us at times and that might be true, but when one unit has to carry the load for the entire team, there are going to be times that this unit sputters, and when it does, you lose.

I'll just say this, and I am going to compare us to two other teams. I looked at how much overall talent we have produced on offense and defense, by position, in terms of NFL Draft choices since 1998. Some may find this relevant, others may not.

                  DE     DT      LB        DB
Arkansas       7       3        3         7
LSU             12     12        5        16
Ohio St         8       2       17        19

Why haven't we had a defense that can hold up its end when things get tough, when the offense needs some help? I think the reason is clear.

Looks like you and I are on the same page.

[PonderinHog]

Looks like you and I are on the same page.

Is having both too much to ask?

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Is having both too much to ask?

No, but the emphasis has never been on having both at the same time, at least not since Nutt arrived here. Hopefully, that changes with Bielema in the years to come.

[Steef]

We can say the offense failed us at times and that might be true, but when one unit has to carry the load for the entire team, there are going to be times that this unit sputters, and when it does, you lose.

I'll just say this, and I am going to compare us to two other teams. I looked at how much overall talent we have produced on offense and defense, by position, in terms of NFL Draft choices since 1998. Some may find this relevant, others may not.

                  DE     DT      LB        DB
Arkansas       7       3        3         7
LSU             12     12        5        16
Ohio St         8       2       17        19

Why haven't we had a defense that can hold up its end when things get tough, when the offense needs some help? I think the reason is clear.

When back Bobby offense sputters, there are an inordinate number of QUICK...3and outs. Meaning your defense never gets a break...and...realizes quickly they have to hold back the other team AND score points.

That's a tall order. To blame any defense for not being able to shoulder that load...in the SEC no less, is a little unfair.

Youre right that our talent level was not up to SEC levels. But they did journeyman duty under adverse circumstances.

If I was a defensive recruit today and Petrino called me, I wouldn't answer the phone.