Ichiro to the Yankees

[clutch]

Going to be weird seeing Ichiro in anything but a Mariners uniform.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-big-league-stew/ichiro-now-yankee-trade-york-222315672--mlb.html

[ErieHog]

Yeah.  Not a Mariners fan, but it just seems wrong.

[bsking]

Just another reason to hate the empire.

[clutch]

Yeah.  Not a Mariners fan, but it just seems wrong.

Not a Mariners or Ichiro fan either. Was weird seeing him in a Yankees uniform though, especially in Seattle.

[hawkhawg]

Most great players seem to end up on Yankees at some point in their career.

[Hawg Balling]

Yankees fan here.  I greeted this with a big "meh" mostly because Ichiro is on the backside of his career and in the final year of his contract.  I don't know much about the two prospects we gave up or their potential, but we gave up two young guys for .261 hitter on the backside of his career in the final year of his contract.  Despite our record, we only have two guys - not counting Brett Gardner - hitting above .300 this year (Cano and Jeter). 

[bsking]

Yankees fan here.  I greeted this with a big "meh" mostly because Ichiro is on the backside of his career and in the final year of his contract.  I don't know much about the two prospects we gave up or their potential, but we gave up two young guys for .261 hitter on the backside of his career in the final year of his contract.  Despite our record, we only have two guys - not counting Brett Gardner - hitting above .300 this year (Cano and Jeter). 

The prospects were scrubs.  You got a veteran, perennial gold glover, and one of the best hitters to ever play the game.  What's not to like?

[clutch]

The prospects were scrubs.  You got a veteran, perennial gold glover, and one of the best hitters to ever play the game.  What's not to like?

The fact that he isn't one of the best hitters anymore. I can understand how people would like it, but I can also understand how some fans wouldn't like it at all.

I guess I could understand it a little better if the Yankees needed a veteran presence on their team. They don't though.

[ErieHog]

The fact that he isn't one of the best hitters anymore. I can understand how people would like it, but I can also understand how some fans wouldn't like it at all.

I guess I could understand it a little better if the Yankees needed a veteran presence on their team. They don't though.

He brings a number of things to the table as a hitter that they simply don't have right now;  he's still among the best bunters in baseball (arguably the best),   fantastic at hitting behind runners, and is still an efficient runner on the bases-- at least on par with anything the Yankees already have, without Gardner at top condition.    When you consider how little success the Mariners have had at getting guys on base, it's little wonder his overall number have bottomed out-- he is the guy that thrives on chopping balls between 1st and 2nd when the runner is being held.   

Is he going to be a .300 guy with 200 hit potential?  Nah-- but that's not what they need.   

[bsking]

Veterans shine in August, September, and the postseason.  Plus Ichiro rakes against Yu Darvish and a couple other aces.  He will undoubtedly be a very valuable piece to their team.

[Hawg Balling]

The fact that he isn't one of the best hitters anymore. I can understand how people would like it, but I can also understand how some fans wouldn't like it at all.

I guess I could understand it a little better if the Yankees needed a veteran presence on their team. They don't though.

Agreed.  I don't dislike the move, as Ichiro's a good clubhouse guy and might be a stable veteran hitting presence in the fall (when Teixeira and Swisher tend to go in the tank).  If anything, I'd have rather made a move for a pitcher.  It's not like we gutted our farm system for him, so we're not a huge loss if he's a failure or walks after the season.

[ErieHog]

Will Ichiro be the 1st Mariner in the baseball HOF?

Junior -- Ichiro will play on a while longer, and Junior is already out of the game.

[MikePiazza]

Honestly, I think going to the Yankees might revitalize Ichiro's career, even though he'll be 39 in October.

His rookie year with the Mariners, they won 116 games and went to the ALCS before losing to, ironically, the Yankees.

Since, they haven't even gotten close. Three of the last four seasons, they've won under 70 games. His numbers aren't what they used to be, but he could be a valuable asset to the Yankees this year in their postseason run. Wouldn't be surprised if the Yanks are in the World Series and Ichiro might get himself a ring.

[bsking]

O yeah, how could I forget Junior. If injuries had not got the best of him he would have set the overall homerun mark so high it would have been difficult to ever match. In 22 seasons he was only able to play in 150 games or more 6 times, 140 games or more 11 times, yet he still hit 630 HR's.

In my book Griffey was the greatest to ever play the game.

[clutch]

In my book Griffey was the greatest to ever play the game.

Mine too and nobody can convince me otherwise haha. He was all around great. Power, average, speed, gold glover, strong arm. I hate that injuries limited what he was able to accomplish.

[Jackrabbit Hog]

Griffey may have been the most talented to play the game, but I don't think he can be classified as the best to play the game because durability is part of the equation too.  Mays and Aaron both had better overall numbers and played most of their careers in the deadball era.  Their longevity has to be factored in when you think about best ever.

[bsking]

Griffey may have been the most talented to play the game, but I don't think he can be classified as the best to play the game because durability is part of the equation too.  Mays and Aaron both had better overall numbers and played most of their careers in the deadball era.  Their longevity has to be factored in when you think about best ever.

Neither of those guys played within 30 years of the deadball era.

And when you say "talented" what do you think of?  If Mike Trout hurt himself tomorrow and never played another game you wouldn't still consider him immensely talented?

[clutch]

Griffey may have been the most talented to play the game, but I don't think he can be classified as the best to play the game because durability is part of the equation too.  Mays and Aaron both had better overall numbers and played most of their careers in the deadball era.  Their longevity has to be factored in when you think about best ever.

When I think of greatest player, I think of who was the best baseball player I've ever seen when they were healthy. Griffey Jr. was that. Like I said, my mind can't be changed on it. I do understand why a lot of people say others such as Mays though.

[Jackrabbit Hog]

Neither of those guys played within 30 years of the deadball era.

And when you say "talented" what do you think of?  If Mike Trout hurt himself tomorrow and never played another game you wouldn't still consider him immensely talented?

Maybe I'm misnaming my eras, but the '60s was an era when pitching dominated, particularly the mid to late '60s, and both Aaron and Mays were in their primes at that time. 

Regarding your other comment, I think you are making my point.  Most talented doesn't equal best ever; lots more goes into it.

[bsking]

Maybe I'm misnaming my eras, but the '60s was an era when pitching dominated, particularly the mid to late '60s, and both Aaron and Mays were in their primes at that time. 

Regarding your other comment, I think you are making my point.  Most talented doesn't equal best ever; lots more goes into it.

So you think both of these guys would be equally "great":

A guy who hit 50 homers per year for 10 years then had a career ending injury 
A guy who played 30 years who hit 16 homers per year?

[Hawg Balling]

So you think both of these guys would be equally "great":

A guy who hit 50 homers per year for 10 years then had a career ending injury 
A guy who played 30 years who hit 16 homers per year?

Sounds about like the Mickey Mantle argument. 

[Jackrabbit Hog]

So you think both of these guys would be equally "great":

A guy who hit 50 homers per year for 10 years then had a career ending injury 
A guy who played 30 years who hit 16 homers per year?

  No, obviously not.  But I don't think Mays or Aaron averaged 16 homers a year for their career.  And Griffey didn't play for only 10 years.

[bsking]

  No, obviously not.  But I don't think Mays or Aaron averaged 16 homers a year for their career.  And Griffey didn't play for only 10 years.

All I'm saying is that being "great" has little to do with how long you do it if there are extenuating circumstances.  I'm a Braves fan and have no problem saying that Hank Aaron wasn't the greatest of all time or even in the argument.

If a player doesn't get called up till he's 30 and he posts 8 years of .350 40 and 120 he wouldn't be anywhere close to a statistical great.  But I'd consider him one of the greatest ever.  Because he did it better than everyone else in the time he was given.  Just like Griffey did.

[Jackrabbit Hog]

All I'm saying is that being "great" has little to do with how long you do it if there are extenuating circumstances.  I'm a Braves fan and have no problem saying that Hank Aaron wasn't the greatest of all time or even in the argument.

If a player doesn't get called up till he's 30 and he posts 8 years of .350 40 and 120 he wouldn't be anywhere close to a statistical great.  But I'd consider him one of the greatest ever.  Because he did it better than everyone else in the time he was given.  Just like Griffey did.

Well, there are degrees to everything we're talking about.  It's not like Griffey put up huge numbers for 5 years and then disappeared.  He had a long career, was hampered by injuries, but clearly was one of the most best, if not the best, during his time in the bigs.  I think Bo Jackson is a better example, albeit extreme.  Freakishly talented, did amazing things during his very short time in the majors, but the hip injury left us all wondering what might have been.  One of the greatest ever?  No. 

When I think of someone who was "good" but not "great", but the long career led to padded stats, I think of Rafael Palmeiro and Eddie Murray.  Maybe even Cal Ripkin.  But I don't think of Mays, Mantle or Aaron.  Those guys had it all, and maintained a level of excellence for a long time.  To me that is relevant when discussing who was the "greatest ever."  And yes, I'd put Griffey in the top 10, just not at the very top.