Hogville

RB Sports Discussion => Monday Morning Quarterback => Topic started by: twistitup on November 09, 2017, 05:40:38 pm

Title: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: twistitup on November 09, 2017, 05:40:38 pm
From interview on Bo....

"When I saw B Allen throw the ball 50 times in one game- I knew they lost their identity. Ark has always been a tough out- but they don't have the players- never in a million years did I think I would ever say Ark is not a physical football team."

Marcus Spears nailed it....we simply lost out identity under CBB
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Ex-Trumpet on November 09, 2017, 05:41:55 pm
Does Marcus not know that B Allen has been gone a couple years?
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: twistitup on November 09, 2017, 05:43:26 pm
Does Marcus not know that B Allen has been gone a couple years?

He knew we were headed downhill years ago...like many of us that have watched this unfold
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: PorkSoda on November 09, 2017, 06:03:44 pm
He knew we were headed downhill years ago...like many of us that have watched this unfold
yeah, we may not have been a good team, but I remember teams commenting that we were the most physical team they played all year.

we were not an easy out for anyone.

somewhere along they way, we lost that.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Pigsknuckles on November 09, 2017, 06:05:10 pm
Waiting for us to show up on a milk carton, or amber alert.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Count Hogula on November 09, 2017, 06:16:06 pm
yeah, we may not have been a good team, but I remember teams commenting that we were the most physical team they played all year.

we were not an easy out for anyone.

somewhere along they way, we lost that.

This ^^^^
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: twistitup on November 09, 2017, 06:25:20 pm
This ^^^^

Exactly...

Spears also said- "Ark was one of my favorite teams because they played tough football the way it was meant to be played." He mentioned our big Olines and talented Dlines and the teams being tough for 4 qtrs every year
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: navyhog24 on November 09, 2017, 06:27:40 pm
Would rather like to hear Bert has lost his appetite for once.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: MuskogeeHogFan on November 09, 2017, 06:28:09 pm
From interview on Bo....

"When I saw B Allen throw the ball 50 times in one game- I knew they lost their identity. Ark has always been a tough out- but they don't have the players- never in a million years did I think I would ever say Ark is not a physical football team."

Marcus Spears nailed it....we simply lost out identity under CBB

I heard him say this over a month ago on the SEC Network show, maybe on Finebaum as well.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: theFlyingHog on November 09, 2017, 06:32:15 pm
BOT spent four hours this morning trying to find our identity. One guy said "It's in Memphis!" and everyone else yelled "Dilly Dilly!" and they decided to fire BB and JL and bring Coke back to Fayetteville and close Bud Walton and move basketball back to Barnhill and also moved the LSU home game back to WMS, but only after approving $1.2B to upgrade it
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Sed76 on November 09, 2017, 06:33:30 pm
In all seriousness, what was our "identity"? Underachieving and blowing games we should have won is all that comes to mind during the Bielema era.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: bphi11ips on November 09, 2017, 06:34:12 pm
Contrary to those who insist otherwise, Arkansasís identity has always been physical football. BP didnít get that. He had a CUSA mentality and that is what started this. I can say that now because I said it when he was winning here.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: From Tusk Till Dawn on November 09, 2017, 06:41:41 pm
So we established ourselves as a tough outing in CBBís first 3 years because of physical oline play.  Yet in that 3rd year B Allen was most successful (everyone was pissed because he wasnt all sec), we probably had arguably our strongest backfield, and we had our best record.  But thats when the slide started, uh huh...
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: rude1 on November 09, 2017, 06:46:11 pm
Contrary to those who insist otherwise, Arkansasís identity has always been physical football. BP didnít get that. He had a CUSA mentality and that is what started this. I can say that now because I said it when he was winning here.
Yeah better to be thought of a physical football team and win 6 or 7 games, than use that CUSA mentality and win 10 back to back...............
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: The Hawg Marshal on November 09, 2017, 06:54:48 pm
Yeah better to be thought of a physical football team and win 6 or 7 games, than use that CUSA mentality and win 10 back to back...............
Exactly +1
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: From Tusk Till Dawn on November 09, 2017, 07:01:55 pm
Exactly +1
The tough part though is only people from Ark remember we were successful, everyone else just remembers the spectacle. 
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: bphi11ips on November 09, 2017, 07:37:41 pm
Yeah better to be thought of a physical football team and win 6 or 7 games, than use that CUSA mentality and win 10 back to back...............

You have no clue what youíre talking about.

Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: bphi11ips on November 09, 2017, 07:38:35 pm
The tough part though is only people from Ark remember we were successful, everyone else just remembers the spectacle. 

The trouble is most of you canít remember anything before 2010.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: hehawg on November 09, 2017, 07:40:32 pm
We went from the biggest offensive line in the country to soft as a sonic vanilla milkshake
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: From Tusk Till Dawn on November 09, 2017, 07:54:36 pm
The trouble is most of you canít remember anything before 2010.

I do.  Im not sure if you are referencing the SWC days which are full of glory and tradition.  I just dont talk about them because I dont think they are relevant anymore.  Weve been in the sec for a quarter century now so I try to stay in that lane.  Unfortunately we are kinda known for our dirty laundry since Nutt and Petrino.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Hawghiggs on November 09, 2017, 08:10:40 pm
You have no clue what you’re talking about.



 Then you should explain yourself.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Rudy Baylor on November 09, 2017, 08:31:33 pm
He knew we were headed downhill years ago...like many of us that have watched this unfold

No he didnít

Such BS
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: bphi11ips on November 09, 2017, 08:35:10 pm
Then you should explain yourself.

If you donít understand Arkansas football and what made it what it is I canít help you much. I explained it here while Petrino was recruiting 18 receivers in every class and changing uniforms every other game. When he was lucking into wins over Vanderbilt, Ole Miss and A&M. And when he was getting plowed under by Alabama and LSU.

I get pretty sick of hearing about nostalgia here. Either you understand fundamentally sound, physical football or you donít. Why do you think Arkansas is still 19 in greatest college football programs of all time?  Because it played physical offense, defense and special teams. For decades. Look at the other teams in that top 20. Almost all of them did.

For all his personal faults, Houston Nuttís teams played physical football. Do you think physical football is limited to the o-line?  No. And that is not what Marcus Spears is talking about. Marcus Spears played against Nutt coached teams. Even when they were mediocre they would hit you in the mouth. So would Fordís teams. Nuttís 2006 team would have beaten the snot out of BPís teams. 2010 was as close as BP got to a complete football team.

Hogville is full of people who donít understand college football.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: bphi11ips on November 09, 2017, 08:36:07 pm
No he didnít

Such BS

Lol. Go back and check my posts. From 2011.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Rudy Baylor on November 09, 2017, 08:36:43 pm
You have no clue what youíre talking about.

Or maybe thatís you actually
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: IronHog on November 09, 2017, 08:40:33 pm
Contrary to those who insist otherwise, Arkansasís identity has always been physical football. BP didnít get that. He had a CUSA mentality and that is what started this. I can say that now because I said it when he was winning here.



BB got soft when he lost BPs battle hardened players.......

Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: bphi11ips on November 09, 2017, 08:40:54 pm
Or maybe thatís you actually

I know you are but what am I?  Lol. Did you learn that in kindergarten?

Go back and youíll see me getting flamed for saying the same things Marcus Spears is saying now, but I said it in 2011.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: bphi11ips on November 09, 2017, 08:42:01 pm


BB got soft when he lost BPs battle hardened players.......



Nonsense. Arkansas got soft when BP stopped recruiting balanced classes.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: hogginbama on November 09, 2017, 08:44:53 pm
I honestly think BB wanted to come here and play smash-mouth football, but realized he couldn't recruit well enough to go toe-to-toe with the Bama's, LSU's and Auburn's and win on a regular basis. When Chaney left, that forced him to hire a new OC, and in came Enos. Enos brought an offense more suited to anything but smash mouth, which I think BB wanted to move to in order to have an option other than smash-mouth. With that move came the O-Line issues since we had linemen suited for smash-mouth and not an outside/passing/screen game. The younger linemen are better adapted to the newer offense, but a terribly out muscled and inexperienced. Switching philosophy's mid-stream is tough on any organization and I don't think BB was prepared for the level of difficulty it would bring.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: go hogues on November 09, 2017, 08:45:34 pm
We went from the biggest offensive line in the country to soft as a sonic vanilla milkshake
Yeah, but we're #Uncommon and #NeverYield
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: IronHog on November 09, 2017, 08:45:58 pm
Nonsense. Arkansas got soft when BP stopped recruiting balanced classes.


BB is in his 5th year

The few tough guys he recruited are already gone.....
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: twistitup on November 09, 2017, 08:48:30 pm
No he didnít

Such BS

Listen to the interview- Spears said he knew we were in trouble back in BA days when we didn't play tough anymore...threw too much- lost identity
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: IronHog on November 09, 2017, 08:49:44 pm
Listen to the interview- Spears said he knew we were in trouble back in BA days when we didn't play tough anymore...threw too much- lost identity


You can recruit QBs and skill players at Arkansas


BB was the wrong identity all along
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: CareBear on November 09, 2017, 09:08:57 pm
Yes indeed Arkansas has been known throughout my 42 yrs on earth as a physical football team. Nuttís teams were the ones that Marcus Spears faced. Marcus Spears was a force to be reckoned with on the D-line. Itís guys like him that wreck a vanilla system like Bert wanted to run. Hatfield had the wishbone & a mobile QB, Nutt had plenty of great backs & was more wide open than CBB. Petrinoís teams were much, much tougher than ANY team BErt has fielded & Bobby could call them plays son!. Bert has problems identifying talent, finding an ideal position for said talent, playing favorites, & is dead set on running that gross BIG Ten Jumbo package that was never gonna work. I love running the football as much as the next guy, but one has to be creative in the way you draw up the running plays. Why handcuff yourself to a sh*tty formation just to prove a point. Bert did not bring physicality to the Arkansas Razorbacks & we have run the ball enough around here to know a good ground game. CBB has made us soft. We can do SOOOOOOO much better than this yíall. Weíve seen it. Itís that fighting Hog spirit that has been missing. Bert & Jen & Jeffy Boy have hijacked our program...Hoganese, Throwing The A, #uncommon, etc. Itís been a sh*t show from the day that man got here. All I want for Christmas is for CBB & Jen to be away from the program. I wish them the best with their new baby , but hands off our football program. They did a helluva lot of damage in 5 yrs. Ridiculous! 

I buried a dear friend yesterday in Springdale. Rabid Hog fan. Murdered in Tulsa last week. Arkansas memorabilia in the casket with him. We cannot let complete apathy set in. This is serious business folks
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Smalltownhog95 on November 09, 2017, 09:13:29 pm
BOT spent four hours this morning trying to find our identity. One guy said "It's in Memphis!" and everyone else yelled "Dilly Dilly!" and they decided to fire BB and JL and bring Coke back to Fayetteville and close Bud Walton and move basketball back to Barnhill and also moved the LSU home game back to WMS, but only after approving $1.2B to upgrade it
Your ideas signify you're a true friend to the Razorback crown Dilly Dilly! Now someone show Jeff Long to the pit of Misery.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: hogginbama on November 09, 2017, 09:15:01 pm
Yes indeed Arkansas has been known throughout my 42 yrs on earth as a physical football team. Nuttís teams were the ones that Marcus Spears faced. Marcus Spears was a force to be reckoned with on the D-line. Itís guys like him that wreck a vanilla system like Bert wanted to run. Hatfield had the wishbone & a mobile QB, Nutt had plenty of great backs & was more wide open than CBB. Petrinoís teams were much, much tougher than ANY team BErt has fielded & Bobby could call them plays son!. Bert has problems identifying talent, finding an ideal position for said talent, playing favorites, & is dead set on running that gross BIG Ten Jumbo package that was never gonna work. I love running the football as much as the next guy, but one has to be creative in the way you draw up the running plays. Why handcuff yourself to a sh*tty formation just to prove a point. Bert did not bring physicality to the Arkansas Razorbacks & we have run the ball enough around here to know a good ground game. CBB has made us soft. We can do SOOOOOOO much better than this yíall. Weíve seen it. Itís that fighting Hog spirit that has been missing. Bert & Jen & Jeffy Boy have hijacked our program...Hoganese, Throwing The A, #uncommon, etc. Itís been a sh*t show from the day that man got here. All I want for Christmas is for CBB & Jen to be away from the program. I wish them the best with their new baby , but hands off our football program. They did a helluva lot of damage in 5 yrs. Ridiculous! 

I buried a dear friend yesterday in Springdale. Rabid Hog fan. Murdered in Tulsa last week. Arkansas memorabilia in the casket with him. We cannot let complete apathy set in. This is serious business folks

So Spears said we lost our identity of being tough and running the ball and all the other posters say we started our slide when we started passing more. You say Nutt, who everyone hated for not passing more, was more wide open than CBB and also that we need more creative play calling instead of just running the ball. Damn I am so confused here, either we lost our identity and got away from running, or we need to be more creative with a more wide open offense. Which is it, it can't possibly be both.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: bphi11ips on November 09, 2017, 09:16:19 pm

BB is in his 5th year

The few tough guys he recruited are already gone.....

I'm not talking about BB or any particular class.  I know Spears comment was about BA passing the ball 50 times. 

I'm talking about Arkansas's identity as a PROGRAM, the identity that made it a TOP 20 PROGRAM.  Crowe screwed the fundamentally sound part of it up in less than two years.  Broyles hired Ford to fix it.  He did at least to the extent he put together a roster of hardnosed football players who could run and stop the run.  What did Orgeron just say about why LSU is playing well?  "We've learned to run and stop the run." 

Nutt showed up with a wide open offense by Ford and Broyles standards and did well with Stoerner, Lucas and Davenport because he could run and play defense.  Broyles reined him in on passing but made sure he kept the defense and special teams.

Petrino came in and turned Arkansas's mindset into Louisville, Thursday-night style football.  Fans bought into it and now they're clamoring for Oregon and Baylor, 

Spears is right.  Arkansas has no identity.  Worse, its fans don't even know what he's talking about.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: hawgmasta on November 09, 2017, 09:23:33 pm
Exactly...

Spears also said- "Ark was one of my favorite teams because they played tough football the way it was meant to be played." He mentioned our big Olines and talented Dlines and the teams being tough for 4 qtrs every year

That s$&t hurts to hear.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: bphi11ips on November 09, 2017, 09:32:33 pm
Exactly...

Spears also said- "Ark was one of my favorite teams because they played tough football the way it was meant to be played." He mentioned our big Olines and talented Dlines and the teams being tough for 4 qtrs every year

Does this sound to you like Spears was referring to CBB's teams before BA threw the ball 50 times in a game?  Or was he referring to the teams he grew up with and played against?
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: From Tusk Till Dawn on November 09, 2017, 09:52:56 pm
If he was talking about our identity from when he played against us then he is just wrong.  That identity was first changed when CBP was hired, changed again when CBB was hired and again when we switched OCís.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: bphi11ips on November 09, 2017, 09:58:17 pm
If he was talking about our identity from when he played against us then he is just wrong.  That identity was first changed when CBP was hired, changed again when CBB was hired and again when we switched OCís.

I think he was referring to both.  I'm not convinced CBB knew anything about Arkansas when he got here.  But Marcus Spears did and thought CBB was taking us back to the style of football we played for 50 years.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: ChicoHog on November 09, 2017, 10:01:36 pm
I'm not talking about BB or any particular class.  I know Spears comment was about BA passing the ball 50 times. 

I'm talking about Arkansas's identity as a PROGRAM, the identity that made it a TOP 20 PROGRAM.  Crowe screwed the fundamentally sound part of it up in less than two years.  Broyles hired Ford to fix it.  He did at least to the extent he put together a roster of hardnosed football players who could run and stop the run.  What did Orgeron just say about why LSU is playing well?  "We've learned to run and stop the run." 

Nutt showed up with a wide open offense by Ford and Broyles standards and did well with Stoerner, Lucas and Davenport because he could run and play defense.  Broyles reined him in on passing but made sure he kept the defense and special teams.

Petrino came in and turned Arkansas's mindset into Louisville, Thursday-night style football.  Fans bought into it and now they're clamoring for Oregon and Baylor, 

Spears is right.  Arkansas has no identity.  Worse, its fans don't even know what he's talking about.
Well said.  You win in the trenches.  Ask UGA, Bama, Notre Dame and Clemson.  the top 4 teams right now have good lines on both sides of the ball. 
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: ShadowHawg on November 09, 2017, 10:02:37 pm
If he was talking about our identity from when he played against us then he is just wrong.  That identity was first changed when CBP was hired, changed again when CBB was hired and again when we switched OCís.

No. He specifically referenced the Toledo game as his aha moment.

He was saying CBB abandoned his own identity once that started.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: ShadowTheHedgehog on November 09, 2017, 10:02:58 pm
From interview on Bo....

"When I saw B Allen throw the ball 50 times in one game- I knew they lost their identity. Ark has always been a tough out- but they don't have the players- never in a million years did I think I would ever say Ark is not a physical football team."

Marcus Spears nailed it....we simply lost out identity under CBB

(https://abancommercials.com/uploadComercial/22122.jpg)
Coach, I'm delicate.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: rude1 on November 09, 2017, 10:06:34 pm
You have no clue what youíre talking about.


Basic math my friend try it 10> 6 or 7, hey and on a rebuild year it was still 8.......Just saying.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: SooieGeneris on November 09, 2017, 10:12:54 pm
Nutt had plenty of great backs & was more wide open than CBB.

You've got to be kidding! His last 5 years, all we ran were the same 4-5 plays over and over, no passes to the TE, no passes over the middle, no passes more than 5 yards past the LOS, PLEASE!

I want Bert gone as much as the next guy, but his offenses are not nearly as stodgy as Hooty's. If anything, the offense has become too finesse, not too conservative.

People have selective memories. I was concerned about Bert from the start, feeling that with most offenses being at least a version of the spread with the rules favoring that, that we would be on the wrong side of history.

I gave him a chance unlike some and it just hasn't worked out. If we are going to run a finesse offense, we need to commit to it all the way and recruit more speed.

Since Pittman left, we seem to be trying to run a mishmash of what the Tennessee Titans call "exotic smashmouth."

The problem with that is we don't have a running threat at QB, and please don't try to tell me that Cole Kelley with his 4.9 forty time puts the same pressure on a defense running as say, a DeShaun Watson, or even most of the QBs we play against.

We lack an identity just as the basketball team did under Failphrey. You can't be an uptempo team one game and play Eddie ball the next and switch back and forth at random with no rhyme or reason.

You have to recruit to a system or tweak your system to the players at hand until you get your players. You have to have something to hang your hat on that you can do week in and week out against anyone to win much in the SEC.

I see none of that from us. I think we have more speed than most think, we just don't use it properly (see TJ Hammonds) and we slow recruits down after they get here with the old B1G bulk 'em up mentality.

But, I guarantee you that Ohio State and some other members of the Big 10 are faster than us. Suburban Cryer changed that league and we are trying to play to the script Wisconsin won with several years ago before Meyer brought that program back.

When the stinkin' Badgers won those titles PSU and OSU were on probation, also. We are trying to play a little Big 10 style, a little MAC, a little this and that and it's not working.

DJ Williams said the other night that we are loosey-goosey in practice, unlike BP, and basically said BB is too easy on the players in practice with no on field discipline.

We need a coach who can adapt to the personnel on hand in the short term, recruit well to his system, give the fanbase hope, get the players to buy in and sell his program aggressively.

And have an identity and stick to it without being too stubborn or inflexible. Not what we have in Bert, at least the post-Pittman Bert who can't seem to decide what he wants this team to be...
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: From Tusk Till Dawn on November 09, 2017, 10:17:46 pm
No. He specifically referenced the Toledo game as his aha moment.

He was saying CBB abandoned his own identity once that started.
I understand that, was responding based on some previous questions about what he was referring to.  Either way, his aha moment was wrong.  That was our most successful year, I get the Toledo game was a let down (they won 10 games that year) but BA was lights out and Collins was a 1600 yard back.  So I call BS.  Our progression was trending positively unti Mizzou last year, thats when the train got off the track.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: rude1 on November 09, 2017, 10:17:51 pm
I would take this with a grain of salt also, remember Spears played when that was how the game was played and won, the game and rules have changed to favor the offense and thus the reason everyone who is anyone is using the spread offense. Sorry for you ole skool guys who can't let it go, but the 3 yards and a cloud of dust days are gone......................
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: wildhogman on November 09, 2017, 10:37:23 pm
Basic math my friend try it 10> 6 or 7, hey and on a rebuild year it was still 8.......Just saying.
I am soooooo sick of the microwave generation pimping Booby the boob man petrino. His offenses were pretty. His defense offensive and the poster who mentioned is right. of that 10 win season which I loved, he was lucky to win a few of those games.  He is 5-4 this year with a returning QB who won the Heisman last year and that's the best he could do. Watch Louisville the next few years.
As for identity, Spears is right. The hogs have always been known as one of the hardest hitting teams in the game. Players like Atwater, Dan Hampton, dirt Winston. Many many more all made sure of this. 
Now we are a mashmellow team.  We might as well do what so many of you want and convert fully to the spread and have track meets every weekend. That is except when you play the cream of the SEC.  Anyone watch Bama this year and think a high octane offense scared them?  You better have a defense that will bring the pain. Because their D is going to every down of every game.
I just hope Arkansas can get back to that mentality before My time is over.  I miss a tough hard nosed football team with a never die attitude. 
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: ShadowHawg on November 09, 2017, 10:52:55 pm
I understand that, was responding based on some previous questions about what he was referring to.  Either way, his aha moment was wrong.  That was our most successful year, I get the Toledo game was a let down (they won 10 games that year) but BA was lights out and Collins was a 1600 yard back.  So I call BS.  Our progression was trending positively unti Mizzou last year, thats when the train got off the track.

Disagree. Nearly everyone will tell you that may have been a high water mark for wins, but that team also underachieved big time.

He was saying the softness began that season and that what you see before you is what it looks like in its third year now. He wasnít saying that we were suddenly soft because Enos came on board.

He is saying he identified what was happening as a problem for the future of a team built around being physical. Looks like he was correct.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: ucafreaky on November 09, 2017, 11:03:01 pm
I have said this for years. Our identity has been lost. We cannot decide from game to game who and what we want to be. I am personally in favor of a smashmouth, defensive orientated, ground and pound style. But at this point I am willing to accept any style so long as it is consistent. The best I can tell, the style we try to play now is read and react????? Maybe??? Lol. Which isn't working. We are too slow against speed teams, and too small for the big boy teams. The problem I have right now is that these players can win, they are just being held back by the style. These players need to attack. Offense and defense. If you are running the ball, settle for 3 yards and if you break one great, but at least you got 3. Instead we are passing off blocks (Which don't get picked up) and stuttering at the line looking for a hole that is never there. Lower your head, put your body on someone and push for 1 step. When we pass, we look for option routes and try to confuse the D, which is faster than is, instead of setting up designed routes with timing, running those and throwing it away if it's not there. On D, we play so far off the line, AT EVERY POSITION, and try to react to what the offence does. Even when we read it right, and tackle it right they are 4 or 5 yards downfield.  We need to attack them. Make them adjust to us. Stack the box and blitz from various angles every play. Yes, we might give up the big play every once in awhile, but we have a better chance than giving them 5 yards every play. That's what this team needs to do to win at least. 

And to the guy who said 3 yards is done. That's crap. Unless you have ELITE talent at every position, slowing the game down, grinding out every possession is the only way to beat an Alabama, and the best way to beat all the other spread teams. They can't score if they don't have the ball, and if you are grinding out possessions you are wearing the other D down until they start to make mistakes.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Jimbob111 on November 09, 2017, 11:03:44 pm
Yeah better to be thought of a physical football team and win 6 or 7 games, than use that CUSA mentality and win 10 back to back...............

BPs teams were tough enough to do what they needed to. Arkansas losing its identity is an easy talking point but doesn't mean much.  Did Alabama lose their identity when Kiffin was calling plays? Maybe they did a little but they used it to form a new identity and embraced the future of a dual threat QB and a more spread offense.

Trying to stick to that "identity" of run it down their throats cost Arkansas some games they could have one. Teams don't have an identity except for what those on the team are good at. To try to force a running identity onto a team better suited for passing is ridiculous but also part of why Bielema is such a miserable failure at Arkansas.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: bphi11ips on November 09, 2017, 11:04:30 pm
I would take this with a grain of salt also, remember Spears played when that was how the game was played and won, the game and rules have changed to favor the offense and thus the reason everyone who is anyone is using the spread offense. Sorry for you ole skool guys who can't let it go, but the 3 yards and a cloud of dust days are gone......................

Don't watch much football, do you?  Not a damn thing has changed in the 50 years I've been watching it.  The team with the biggest, strongest, fastest, best football players win.  Three yards and a cloud of dust is just a lazy excuse for being unable to articulate what you really mean which is that you don't understand what makes a championship college football team.  If you can't run and stop the run don't even think about it.  The spread offense started as a run-based offense and still is at the championship level.  Rich Rodriguez's spread at West Virginia wasn't even close to a passing offense. It was based on read options.  So was Chip Kelly's at Oregon.  Same as Bear Bryant and Barry Switzer's wishbones.  3 yards and a cloud of dust?  Try 6 or 7 yards a carry and 40 plus points a game.  What did Bryant and Switzer have that Rodriguez and Kelly didn't?  Nine national champioships?  Why?  Because they had the defenses and special teams to go with unstoppable offenses.

Yep.  Arkansas has work to do on offense. A spread would be nice, but we don't have the QB to run it.  Know why Clemson's worked?  DeShaun Watson.  He had 73 yards rushing against Alabama and that was including 4 sacks.  Unless you want Kliff Kigsbury's offense, you better have a QB who can run if you want to run the spread.  And you better have some backs and an oline.  And you better have a defense and special teams to go with it.

Three yards and a cloud of dust my ass. 
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: rude1 on November 09, 2017, 11:06:28 pm
I am soooooo sick of the microwave generation pimping Booby the boob man petrino. His offenses were pretty. His defense offensive and the poster who mentioned is right. of that 10 win season which I loved, he was lucky to win a few of those games.  He is 5-4 this year with a returning QB who won the Heisman last year and that's the best he could do. Watch Louisville the next few years.
As for identity, Spears is right. The hogs have always been known as one of the hardest hitting teams in the game. Players like Atwater, Dan Hampton, dirt Winston. Many many more all made sure of this. 
Now we are a mashmellow team.  We might as well do what so many of you want and convert fully to the spread and have track meets every weekend. That is except when you play the cream of the SEC.  Anyone watch Bama this year and think a high octane offense scared them?  You better have a defense that will bring the pain. Because their D is going to every down of every game.
I just hope Arkansas can get back to that mentality before My time is over.  I miss a tough hard nosed football team with a never die attitude. 
Lol, just go back and read the names you gave to illustrate this alleged "tough man" system that use to be Arkansas football, and put a time line on when they all played. Thanks for proving my point. It's good you would like to get back to winning 6 or 7 games and being billed as a "tough team". I would rather win 10 personally, even if everyone said we were finesse.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: From Tusk Till Dawn on November 09, 2017, 11:22:08 pm
Disagree. Nearly everyone will tell you that may have been a high water mark for wins, but that team also underachieved big time.

He was saying the softness began that season and that what you see before you is what it looks like in its third year now. He wasnít saying that we were suddenly soft because Enos came on board.

He is saying he identified what was happening as a problem for the future of a team built around being physical. Looks like he was correct.
I agree on under achieving we should have legitimately been 10-11 wins.  Yet an errant end zone throw and a blocked kick are bigger qualifiers for under achieving vs. starting to get soft.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: The Kig on November 10, 2017, 12:09:43 am
From interview on Bo....

"When I saw B Allen throw the ball 50 times in one game- I knew they lost their identity. Ark has always been a tough out- but they don't have the players- never in a million years did I think I would ever say Ark is not a physical football team."

Marcus Spears nailed it....we simply lost out identity under CBB

I thought BA played on Offense... Go figure.  So a QB who hasn't been on the field in the last two years is responsible for our Defense no longer playing with toughness?
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: CareBear on November 10, 2017, 12:11:03 am
So Spears said we lost our identity of being tough and running the ball and all the other posters say we started our slide when we started passing more. You say Nutt, who everyone hated for not passing more, was more wide open than CBB and also that we need more creative play calling instead of just running the ball. Damn I am so confused here, either we lost our identity and got away from running, or we need to be more creative with a more wide open offense. Which is it, it can't possibly be both.
Nutt didít run the GD Big Ten Jumbo sets unless we were on the goal line. I said that we have always, prior to BERT getting here, been known as a physical, tough, chip on thy shoulder type of team. In regards to the running game...Nutt ran the ball in different ways than bert does. Nutt was a better coach on every level of the game. Period. I liked Nutt...didnít mind that he left though, but Bobby was on another level. Two things can be true at the same time my friend. You can have a legit passing game & run the ball with physicality. Those things arenít exclusive brother. There is no universal law of physics that makes doing two things well in football impossible.
What you ABSOLUTELY cannot do is have a blowhard coach who hustled his way into a job by bamboozling a weasel ass AD who had already sh*t the bed with his attempts to hire Grobe & Bowden before Petrino fell into his lap. Then he fired Bobby over a personal matter so as to make himself out to be a hero. Mr Integrity. Mr College Football Playoff Committee. Sure hasnít done our program one bit of good. Some of the sheep in the media were trying to have us believe that Jeffy being on the committee would give us great exposure & recruits would take notice. We were told that these recruits and their parents would never want their innocent little high school football stars to play for Bobby after his affair. Ridiculous. That was more propaganda by Jeffy. CBB is the absolute worst football coach weíve had since I have been alive in regards to EVERY aspect of coaching, conditioning, preparation, etc. It is comical folks.
I was born in 1975, just for reference to my timeline of fandom/coaches...& no heís not better than Jack Crowe. Not by a longshot even though Long sure as hell thought he was a sureshot ;)
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: twistitup on November 10, 2017, 04:48:34 am
Does this sound to you like Spears was referring to CBB's teams before BA threw the ball 50 times in a game?  Or was he referring to the teams he grew up with and played against?

Teams he played against and watched when he was young - pre CBB
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: twistitup on November 10, 2017, 04:49:45 am
I thought BA played on Offense... Go figure.  So a QB who hasn't been on the field in the last two years is responsible for our Defense no longer playing with toughness?

The mentality and toughness of the TEAM is gone
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: twistitup on November 10, 2017, 04:53:18 am
Lol, just go back and read the names you gave to illustrate this alleged "tough man" system that use to be Arkansas football, and put a time line on when they all played. Thanks for proving my point. It's good you would like to get back to winning 6 or 7 games and being billed as a "tough team". I would rather win 10 personally, even if everyone said we were finesse.

Either way...let's just do it and stick w it. At the moment we have nothing.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: code red on November 10, 2017, 05:20:13 am
yeah, we may not have been a good team, but I remember teams commenting that we were the most physical team they played all year.

we were not an easy out for anyone.

somewhere along they way, we lost that.
We have no studs.....I repeat we do NOT  have SEC talent.  It's glaring yet most think CBB has recruied well.  In a microwave world is his famous analogy. Yet he recruits jucos that's lazy recruiting.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: MuskogeeHogFan on November 10, 2017, 05:56:02 am
I would take this with a grain of salt also, remember Spears played when that was how the game was played and won, the game and rules have changed to favor the offense and thus the reason everyone who is anyone is using the spread offense. Sorry for you ole skool guys who can't let it go, but the 3 yards and a cloud of dust days are gone......................

Teams are running the Spread for the same reason that a lot of teams used to run the Wishbone, it stresses the Defense. With perhaps the majority of high schools going to this offense, there are a lot more players familiar with that offense to recruit which also helps them when they reach the college level to not have to re-learn another Offensive scheme, but just how it is tweaked at the school that they attend.

Part of the way that these Offenses stress a defense is the threat of the run. That threat (and it still has to be a viable threat) is what helps make the passing game go. If all you have is passing it makes it far easier to scheme for you from a defensive perspective. See Texas Tech (4-5) who is #5 in the nation in passing, but just #79 in rushing. On the other hand look at Oklahoma (5.5 p/rush) and Oklahoma State (4.96 p/rush) who are both among the top passing teams in the nation but who also hover around the 200-215 yard mark (on average) in rushing. Auburn has better balance between the two phases of offense averaging 229 passing and 237 rushing (5.0 p/rush) each game. Rushing has to be a part of the equation and that will never change.

Now that doesn't mean that a traditional Pro Style of Offense can't be successful, it can. But it is more difficult to recruit and you have to have more talent across the board at all positions to make it work. Plus, the re-training of HS athletes at the college level may take longer because the individual responsibilities and the techniques involved to execute that style of Offense are just different than what kids have been taught to run in HS. Additionally, because it is more of a power style of Offense, you better be able to recruit top athletes. The Spread style gives more teams a better chance because you don't have to have as many superior athletes at every Offensive position.

A good rushing threat will always be a necessary part of the game if you want to be successful. Otherwise, you are Texas Tech.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: FANONTHEHILL on November 10, 2017, 06:04:53 am
The worst thing that has happened to the Football Program in the last five years has nothing to do with Jeff Long or Bret Bielema.  Itís when Sam Pittman left for Georgia.  The heart and soul of the physical football team was the Oline Pittman built and it has not been replicated since he left. 

They have a spread roster trying to play Power ďIĒ football. 
Square pegs in round holes.

The defense isnít addressed here, but itís pretty simple.  The fear of the big play has taken away aggressiveness.   
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Inhogswetrust on November 10, 2017, 06:20:00 am
I would take this with a grain of salt also, remember Spears played when that was how the game was played and won, the game and rules have changed to favor the offense and thus the reason everyone who is anyone is using the spread offense. Sorry for you ole skool guys who can't let it go, but the 3 yards and a cloud of dust days are gone......................

Playing physical has nothing to do with three yards and a cloud of dust. A team can be physical and play within the current rules setup.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: nwahogfan1 on November 10, 2017, 07:23:45 am
From interview on Bo....

"When I saw B Allen throw the ball 50 times in one game- I knew they lost their identity. Ark has always been a tough out- but they don't have the players- never in a million years did I think I would ever say Ark is not a physical football team."

Marcus Spears nailed it....we simply lost out identity under CBB

Cbb came in with an attitude of big physical OL and DL and that isn't happening. Bad recruiting and bad coaching.  Spears is right. We are throwing out if desperation because we do not have a physical run game.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: bphi11ips on November 10, 2017, 07:31:13 am
Teams he played against and watched when he was young - pre CBB

I agree. A former Auburn player from Spears' era told me Arkansas was one of the most physical teams they played along with Alabama, LSU and Georgia.  That's the reputation they entered the league with. 

A former Tennessee player told me last week that the most he ever wanted to get off the field in a game in his life was at Arkansas in 2006. 

Don't tell Ken Hamlin his defenses weren't physical.  Or Steve Atwater or Henry Ford or Carlos Hall or Kenoy Kennedy or Jamaal Anderson or Tony Bua or Chris Houson...

One problem today with physical play, in secondaries in particular, is 7 on 7 offenses.  There are a lot of players getting three star and higher ratings who have never learned to tackle.  They don't even try to break down and wrap up.  They dive and lunge and push.  They never tackle to the ground in practice.  They look like Adonis and have mastered the cone drills and one-on-one in shorts, though.  Fans are so wrapped up in recruiting rankings that coaches have to decide whether to take players who have proven on film that they can tackle and play football in general or a more highly rated combine winner they hope they can teach to play football.  Some of these guys don't want to hit at all.  That's the world we live in.  Alabama doesn't need to take players who haven't proven it on film.  Neither does LSU or Auburn or A&M.  Does Arkansas?  I don't know.  What I do know is that we have a lot of guys in the secondary who would rather watch an opponent run by them than deliver a blow.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: MuskogeeHogFan on November 10, 2017, 07:35:02 am
Cbb came in with an attitude of big physical OL and DL and that isn't happening. Bad recruiting and bad coaching.  Spears is right. We are throwing out if desperation because we do not have a physical run game.

I would suggest that what happened was that after Chaney left and Enos came in, the scheme changed slightly and Enos' playbook included things that our O-Linemen weren't mobile enough to execute, like screens. That's when we started restructuring the O-Line and going lighter to accommodate the changes and lost some of the lead in our britches that helped enable the power run game. Now it seems like we have always had trouble pounding it into the RZ with the run game at times, so there is that to debate, but the shift in physical size and mobility of the O-Line came from the arrival of Enos and his offense.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: DLUXHOG on November 10, 2017, 07:49:38 am
From interview on Bo....

"When I saw B Allen throw the ball 50 times in one game- I knew they lost their identity. Ark has always been a tough out- but they don't have the players- never in a million years did I think I would ever say Ark is not a physical football team."

Marcus Spears nailed it....we simply lost out identity under CBB

uhhh.... I think it started before Brandon & CBB....  try thinking about CBP & Mallett.... years before...
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: The Kig on November 10, 2017, 07:51:44 am
I would suggest that what happened was that after Chaney left and Enos came in, the scheme changed slightly and Enos' playbook included things that our O-Linemen weren't mobile enough to execute, like screens. That's when we started restructuring the O-Line and going lighter to accommodate the changes and lost some of the lead in our britches that helped enable the power run game. Now it seems like we have always had trouble pounding it into the RZ with the run game at times, so there is that to debate, but the shift in physical size and mobility of the O-Line came from the arrival of Enos and his offense.

Maybe in philosophy, but these guys can't pass pro either... so if you're not physical enough to road grade your way and not fast enough (both on your feet and in assignment)  then you get what we have on our OL...a completely inept offense. 
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: hawgmasta on November 10, 2017, 08:07:41 am
The worst thing that has happened to the Football Program in the last five years has nothing to do with Jeff Long or Bret Bielema.  Itís when Sam Pittman left for Georgia.  The heart and soul of the physical football team was the Oline Pittman built and it has not been replicated since he left. 

They have a spread roster trying to play Power ďIĒ football. 
Square pegs in round holes.

The defense isnít addressed here, but itís pretty simple.  The fear of the big play has taken away aggressiveness.

I think you are right. A lot on here wanted to say Pittman wasn't as good as advertised and recruited poorly after he left but that was ex girlfriend syndrome. Look at Georgia number one team in the country and we were on an upward projectory it seems until after Pittman left. I'm sure there are other factors at play but that one is glaring now.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: BigE_23 on November 10, 2017, 08:13:54 am
uhhh.... I think it started before Brandon & CBB....  try thinking about CBP & Mallett.... years before...

You mean the 2010 team that had Knile Davis who lead the SEC in rushing among RB's? That team? The team that held the ball for almost 9 minutes in the 4th quarter to ice the game against LSU in the Rock? That non-physical football team??

Just because we could throw the ball all over the field doesn't mean we weren't physical. Those teams under CBP could do whatever the hell they wanted...except against LSU and Alabama in 2011. And we didn't give up 500 yards rushing either.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: FANONTHEHILL on November 10, 2017, 08:20:09 am
I think you are right. A lot on here wanted to say Pittman wasn't as good as advertised and recruited poorly after he left but that was ex girlfriend syndrome. Look at Georgia number one team in the country and we were on an upward projectory it seems until after Pittman left. I'm sure there are other factors at play but that one is glaring now.

Heís the best coach my son has ever had.  Iíll say that without hesitation.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: wildhogman on November 10, 2017, 08:29:54 am
Lol, just go back and read the names you gave to illustrate this alleged "tough man" system that use to be Arkansas football, and put a time line on when they all played. Thanks for proving my point. It's good you would like to get back to winning 6 or 7 games and being billed as a "tough team". I would rather win 10 personally, even if everyone said we were finesse.
You insinuate that a team playing tough cant win more then 6 games. But how do you explain Ga and Bama?  Oh wait, I forgot, They are marshmellows right?  Now don't you go moving the goal post on me now
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Little Lady Back on November 10, 2017, 08:33:23 am
The worst thing that has happened to the Football Program in the last five years has nothing to do with Jeff Long or Bret Bielema.  Itís when Sam Pittman left for Georgia.  The heart and soul of the physical football team was the Oline Pittman built and it has not been replicated since he left. 

They have a spread roster trying to play Power ďIĒ football. 
Square pegs in round holes.

The defense isnít addressed here, but itís pretty simple.  The fear of the big play has taken away aggressiveness.

Thanks Fan for your input. I always felt that Pittman leaving hurt the program way more than many hogville posters wanted to admit at the time. 
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: bkjbearcat on November 10, 2017, 08:45:10 am
You insinuate that a team playing tough cant win more then 6 games. But how do you explain Ga and Bama? Oh wait, I forgot, They are marshmellows right?  Now don't you go moving the goal post on me now

A lot of 5* players might explain it.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: DeltaBoy on November 10, 2017, 08:50:15 am
From interview on Bo....

"When I saw B Allen throw the ball 50 times in one game- I knew they lost their identity. Ark has always been a tough out- but they don't have the players- never in a million years did I think I would ever say Ark is not a physical football team."

Marcus Spears nailed it....we simply lost out identity under CBB

No crap sherlock
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: twistitup on November 10, 2017, 08:50:24 am
uhhh.... I think it started before Brandon & CBB....  try thinking about CBP & Mallett.... years before...

This isn't coming from me - it's Spears saying this. I really don't care one way or the other on how we go with our offense....I just ask that we do it consistently and for a long period of time. We need to recruit players that fit a certain style - recruit those same type of players for multiple years. We have a mixture of players on the roster now in an attempt to marry the philosophies of Enos AND CBB - IT'S NOT WORKING AND NEVER WORKS. Know who you are and go with it.

Go with one philosophy and stick with it.....the last 6 years have been nothing but a cluster f----

What happened to the don't flinch attitude CBB came in with - I think it got beat out of him, now he does whatever out of pure desperation. Heck, he won't even admit to a starting qb he's so desperate to gain some sort of slight advantage.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: wildhogman on November 10, 2017, 08:57:34 am
A lot of 5* players might explain it.
Now that's moving goal post. According to Rude1 you cannot win with smash mouth 3 yards in a cloud of dust football. 
however Bama's D is the reason they are winning games by such lopsided margins. Not their O
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: hobhog on November 10, 2017, 08:57:59 am
I felt it started last year and then we went complete finesse this year. Against Coastal I thnk we threw the ball 7 of first 10 plays?  Insanity.

Enos has to be blamed, then coach B for allowing it. Maybe the imergence of Hamminds will help but it's to late.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: hoghearted on November 10, 2017, 09:32:28 am
Playing physical has nothing to do with three yards and a cloud of dust. A team can be physical and play within the current rules setup.

This is true. It also shouldnít matter whether itís a spread offense or primarily a running offense. This team doesnít play physical
You mean the 2010 team that had Knile Davis who lead the SEC in rushing among RB's? That team? The team that held the ball for almost 9 minutes in the 4th quarter to ice the game against LSU in the Rock? That non-physical football team??

Just because we could throw the ball all over the field doesn't mean we weren't physical. Those teams under CBP could do whatever the hell they wanted...except against LSU and Alabama in 2011. And we didn't give up 500 yards rushing either.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: HoginMemphis on November 10, 2017, 09:36:55 am
If you donít understand Arkansas football and what made it what it is I canít help you much. I explained it here while Petrino was recruiting 18 receivers in every class and changing uniforms every other game. When he was lucking into wins over Vanderbilt, Ole Miss and A&M. And when he was getting plowed under by Alabama and LSU.

I get pretty sick of hearing about nostalgia here. Either you understand fundamentally sound, physical football or you donít. Why do you think Arkansas is still 19 in greatest college football programs of all time?  Because it played physical offense, defense and special teams. For decades. Look at the other teams in that top 20. Almost all of them did.

For all his personal faults, Houston Nuttís teams played physical football. Do you think physical football is limited to the o-line?  No. And that is not what Marcus Spears is talking about. Marcus Spears played against Nutt coached teams. Even when they were mediocre they would hit you in the mouth. So would Fordís teams. Nuttís 2006 team would have beaten the snot out of BPís teams. 2010 was as close as BP got to a complete football team.

Hogville is full of people who donít understand college football.
This is all 100% accurate. Totally agree. Don't like giving Nutt credit for anything but his teams did play hard. Defense was tough under Nutt and they swarmed to the ball. Have not done that many games during Bielema's time here.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: hog.goblin on November 10, 2017, 09:37:10 am
Does Marcus not know that B Allen has been gone a couple years?

BA threw 52 times against Toledo and we lost.  We improved that year, but it was the beginning of the end
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: COACHINTEXAS on November 10, 2017, 10:18:25 am
We loss our identity as soon as Bielema was named coach. Iím certain that I will get negative feedback from this, but you show me a nice guy who become friends with his players and I will show you a loser coach!! Heís too laid back and that rubs off onto the players. I never liked the hire; never understood it! Why do we hire a coach from the Big 10 when the Big 10 wins 1 out of 3 games against SEC. I want a coach that eats, sh#% and sleep football!!!!!
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Hogblog on November 10, 2017, 11:54:57 am
We loss our identity as soon as Bielema was named coach. Iím certain that I will get negative feedback from this, but you show me a nice guy who become friends with his players and I will show you a loser coach!! Heís too laid back and that rubs off onto the players. I never liked the hire; never understood it! Why do we hire a coach from the Big 10 when the Big 10 wins 1 out of 3 games against SEC. I want a coach that eats, sh#% and sleep football!!!!!
_____________________________________________________________________________________

^^^^^^^^^^ THIS ^^^^^^^^^^^
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Atlhogfan1 on November 10, 2017, 12:32:02 pm
Spears and bphillips speak a lot of truth. 

Now I won't blame Petrino.  He tried to keep physical football on both sides especially in the running game.  He did abandon the run or forget about it sometimes (Bama 2010).  And his oline did spend a lot of time backing up instead of firing off. 

Bielema didn't do as he stated he was going to in building the oline.  Had he and had they focused on that first and foremost in creating a power running game, the team and program would be better.  His Arkansas teams have passed more and run less than his teams did at Wisconsin.  Balance is a great thing.  But we needed more oline signees earlier from the high school ranks to build a pipeline in the roster.  Wasn't done.  As bphillips describes, Bielema should have been a fit based on our history. 

I've always questioned in college football if you have the practice time to develop olinemen who can be versatile enough to run block one play and play backing up the next.  Questioned it with BP and question it now. 
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: OneTuskOverTheLineô on November 10, 2017, 12:34:15 pm
yeah, we may not have been a good team, but I remember teams commenting that we were the most physical team they played all year.

we were not an easy out for anyone.

somewhere along they way, we lost that.

 If I had to guess I would say it happened because JFB was not upstairs to make certain his coach knew what Arkansas football was all about.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: IronHog on November 10, 2017, 12:57:06 pm
Teams he played against and watched when he was young - pre CBB


Could be taking about BBs team that were tough.....Spaight etc.


Regardless those days are over.  High IQ, speed based football is the model now at Ark.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: IronHog on November 10, 2017, 12:57:56 pm
If I had to guess I would say it happened because JFB was not upstairs to make certain his coach knew what Arkansas football was all about.


Iíd say itís becase JFB stayed too long.


Arkansas should be a premier passing school
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: MuskogeeHogFan on November 10, 2017, 05:57:37 pm
Maybe in philosophy, but these guys can't pass pro either... so if you're not physical enough to road grade your way and not fast enough (both on your feet and in assignment)  then you get what we have on our OL...a completely inept offense. 

It's the style of offense and the standing, holding the ball and waiting for the receivers to get open, so yes, to some degree it is the difference in philosophy. All American O-Linemen can't consistently produce effective pass protection when you are having to block the speed and strength in the SEC for 4-5 seconds waiting for someone to finally get open. The spread, along with the RPO's, keeps the ball moving and you don't have a figure just standing in the pocket for that long.   
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Hogindasticks on November 10, 2017, 06:05:29 pm
From interview on Bo....

"When I saw B Allen throw the ball 50 times in one game- I knew they lost their identity. Ark has always been a tough out- but they don't have the players- never in a million years did I think I would ever say Ark is not a physical football team."

Marcus Spears nailed it....we simply lost out identity under CBB

Correction.....ENOS...
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Hogindasticks on November 10, 2017, 06:07:19 pm

Iíd say itís becase JFB stayed too long.


Arkansas should be a premier passing school

Might as well be, running the ball every 1st down isn't working is it.....smh    I just don't understand why they don't spread it out so we CAN run!   
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: jgphillips3 on November 10, 2017, 06:11:19 pm
Contrary to those who insist otherwise, Arkansasís identity has always been physical football. BP didnít get that. He had a CUSA mentality and that is what started this. I can say that now because I said it when he was winning here.

Thatís odd.  I remember those teams being physical enough, delivering some huge hits at times and all of our toughness suddenly being gone after all of Petrinoís conference USA recruits had expended their eligibility.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: ChicoHog on November 10, 2017, 06:16:13 pm

Could be taking about BBs team that were tough.....Spaight etc.


Regardless those days are over.  High IQ, speed based football is the model now at Ark.
Spread is not high IQ. that's why so many QBs from spread systems struggle in the pros.  they can't read defenses.  It makes decision making easier and the players always look to the sidelines instead of QB calling the audible. 
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: twistitup on November 10, 2017, 06:21:11 pm
Correction.....ENOS...

ENOS? He's the coordinator, it's not his job to create an offensive identity - that job falls on CBB and Enos then adjusts. This is the big problem...CBB had a style very different from Enos and they tried to somehow blend those two.

It has failed and look where we are now. A good coach must believe in himself...go with what you know or it becomes an enormous Cluster F
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Hogindasticks on November 10, 2017, 06:26:24 pm
We loss our identity as soon as Bielema was named coach. Iím certain that I will get negative feedback from this, but you show me a nice guy who become friends with his players and I will show you a loser coach!! Heís too laid back and that rubs off onto the players. I never liked the hire; never understood it! Why do we hire a coach from the Big 10 when the Big 10 wins 1 out of 3 games against SEC. I want a coach that eats, sh#% and sleep football!!!!!

Your name is Texas, you don't count.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Hogindasticks on November 10, 2017, 06:28:21 pm
ENOS? He's the coordinator, it's not his job to create an offensive identity - that job falls on CBB and Enos then adjusts. This is the big problem...CBB had a style very different from Enos and they tried to somehow blend those two.

It has failed and look where we are now. A good coach must believe in himself...go with what you know or it becomes an enormous Cluster F

Enos is calling the plays....a 3 play offense isn't going to work no matter who you play.  No room for adjustment anywhere on the offensive playbook.  The cluster you speak of is like when Jerry Jones extends his fingers into the program to try to coach from the sidelines...doesn't work.  I think CBB has that same problem with JL
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: twistitup on November 10, 2017, 06:31:42 pm
Enos is calling the plays....a 3 play offense isn't going to work no matter who you play.  No room for adjustment anywhere on the offensive playbook.

Look at CBB if you need to blame somebody for the O, he hired ENOS - this is CBB's team, he can take over playcalling
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Hogindasticks on November 10, 2017, 06:35:39 pm
Look at CBB if you need to blame somebody for the O, he hired ENOS - this is CBB's team, he can take over playcalling

I know...I agree.....but I wish he would....things would be different.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: twistitup on November 10, 2017, 06:41:52 pm
I know...I agree.....but I wish he would....things would be different.

Enos was a bad fit, maybe CBB should do the playcalling - who knows
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Hogwild on November 10, 2017, 06:43:56 pm

I get pretty sick of hearing about nostalgia here. Either you understand fundamentally sound, physical football or you donít. Why do you think Arkansas is still 19 in greatest college football programs of all time?  Because it played physical offense, defense and special teams. For decades. Look at the other teams in that top 20. Almost all of them did.


Curious about where you got the 19th all time ranking?  I know that are ranked 20th in weeks in the AP poll. but Clemson is going to pass us before the seasons over.  We are tied with Florida in all time wins.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: IronHog on November 10, 2017, 07:44:16 pm
Spread is not high IQ. that's why so many QBs from spread systems struggle in the pros.  they can't read defenses.  It makes decision making easier and the players always look to the sidelines instead of QB calling the audible. 

Spread can be basic to NFL complex.

Most NFL teams are spread to throw now.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: MuskogeeHogFan on November 10, 2017, 10:46:59 pm
Enos was a bad fit, maybe CBB should do the playcalling - who knows

The bad fit was Enos combined with the O-Line Coach. Doesn't seem that there was ever a complete mesh of philosophies that were a good fit for each other. That doesn't mean that Enos is a bad OC.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: twistitup on November 11, 2017, 03:56:27 am
The bad fit was Enos combined with the O-Line Coach. Doesn't seem that there was ever a complete mesh of philosophies that were a good fit for each other. That doesn't mean that Enos is a bad OC.
...wish I could say I was impressed w Enos- I'm not
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: MuskogeeHogFan on November 11, 2017, 05:37:25 am
...wish I could say I was impressed w Enos- I'm not

I don't like all of his calls but I realize that we are all coming from a fan's perspective and we don't have all of the information that he has access to in terms of our opponents down and distance tendencies in certain alignments. Some of the reason that plays don't seem to work is a matter of execution on the field and the coaches can't go out on the field and get that done.

If there is one thing that is easily fixed and that really grinds my gears, it is not getting the doggone plays in fast enough. That is one thing that I will say for Bobby Petrino, he was usually thinking 3-4-5 plays ahead about what he wanted to run to set the defense up for a particular big play and really, any good OC is usually thinking at least 3 plays ahead. I don't think Enos does a very good job of this.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Steef on November 11, 2017, 05:55:15 am
I don't like all of his calls but I realize that we are all coming from a fan's perspective and we don't have all of the information that he has access to in terms of our opponents down and distance tendencies in certain alignments. Some of the reason that plays don't seem to work is a matter of execution on the field and the coaches can't go out on the field and get that done.

If there is one thing that is easily fixed and that really grinds my gears, it is not getting the doggone plays in fast enough. That is one thing that I will say for Bobby Petrino, he was usually thinking 3-4-5 plays ahead about what he wanted to run to set the defense up for a particular big play and really, any good OC is usually thinking at least 3 plays ahead. I don't think Enos does a very good job of this.

Ive been perplexed by playcalling for a while. I originally assumed like you, he was forced to call the plays they could run.

Its been three years. At some point, hes supposed to teach them how to run other plays.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Youngsta71701 on November 11, 2017, 05:58:04 am
So we established ourselves as a tough outing in CBBís first 3 years because of physical oline play.  Yet in that 3rd year B Allen was most successful (everyone was pissed because he wasnt all sec), we probably had arguably our strongest backfield, and we had our best record.  But thats when the slide started, uh huh...
Ladies and Gentlemen, it's not hard to figure out what he's saying. We went from a physical smash mouth football team to a soft throw the ball around the yard 50 times a game football team. And on defense we went from a physical aggressive football team to a soft as a hushpuppy sit back and let the opposing offense do whatever they wanna do football team. And that transformation happened sometime during the Bret Bielema era. Actually I think it happened when BA was the QB. Even when we had Ryan Mallett, Tyler Wilson and all those great receivers we still were a physical run the ball before we pass it football team. And we still ran it more than we passed it.

FYI: Aggressive doesn't mean blitz on every play.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: MuskogeeHogFan on November 11, 2017, 08:43:06 am
Ladies and Gentlemen, it's not hard to figure out what he's saying. We went from a physical smash mouth football team to a soft throw the ball around the yard 50 times a game football team. And on defense we went from a physical aggressive football team to a soft as a hushpuppy sit back and let the opposing offense do whatever they wanna do football team. And that transformation happened sometime during the Bret Bielema era. Actually I think it happened when BA was that QB. Even when we had Ryan Mallett, Tyler Wilson and all those great receivers we still were a physical run the ball before we pass it football team. And we still ran it more than we passed it.

FYI: Aggressive doesn't mean blitz on every play.

Game Averages by Season and through 9 games in 2017. One season we have averaged over 30 pass attempts p/gm, but our rushing effectiveness has certainly decreased.

                        2013          2014        2015        2016         2017
Total Yards         357.2         406.0       465.5       428.4        388.5
Total Plays           64.6           70.5        68.2         71.0         69.1
Yards/Play            5.5             5.8          6.8           6.0          5.6
Pass Att              25.1           27.6        28.8         31.2         28.8
Pass Cmpl            12.5           15.3        18.9         19.0         16.7
Cmpl %                49.8           55.4        65.8         60.8         57.9
Pass Yards          148.5          188.0      268.2       264.2        205.8
Yds/Attempt          5.9             6.8         9.3           8.5          7.2
Yds/Compl            11.9           12.3        14.2         13.9         12.3
Rush Attempts      39.5            42.8       39.4         39.8         40.3
Rush Yards          208.7          218.0      197.3       164.2        182.7
Yds/Rush Att         5.3             5.1         5.0           4.1           4.5 
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Youngsta71701 on November 11, 2017, 09:14:17 am
Game Averages by Season and through 9 games in 2017. One season we have averaged over 30 pass attempts p/gm, but our rushing effectiveness has certainly decreased.

                        2013          2014        2015        2016         2017
Total Yards         357.2         406.0       465.5       428.4        388.5
Total Plays           64.6           70.5        68.2         71.0         69.1
Yards/Play            5.5             5.8          6.8           6.0          5.6
Pass Att              25.1           27.6        28.8         31.2         28.8
Pass Cmpl            12.5           15.3        18.9         19.0         16.7
Cmpl %                49.8           55.4        65.8         60.8         57.9
Pass Yards          148.5          188.0      268.2       264.2        205.8
Yds/Attempt          5.9             6.8         9.3           8.5          7.2
Yds/Compl            11.9           12.3        14.2         13.9         12.3
Rush Attempts      39.5            42.8       39.4         39.8         40.3
Rush Yards          208.7          218.0      197.3       164.2        182.7
Yds/Rush Att         5.3             5.1         5.0           4.1           4.5
Don't forget that QB sacks go as rushing attempts these days. Which I think is stupid. But it is what it is.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: MuskogeeHogFan on November 11, 2017, 09:19:24 am
Don't forget that QB sacks go as rushing attempts these days. Which I think is stupid. But it is what it is.

I'm not forgetting that, but the sack yards count against rushing yards, they don't count as rushing attempts. I agree that it would be more applicable to count them against passing numbers. Those numbers nonetheless speak directly to some of the points that you wanted to make.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Youngsta71701 on November 11, 2017, 09:23:45 am
I'm not forgetting that, but the sack yards count against rushing yards, they don't count as rushing attempts. I agree that it would be more applicable to count them against passing numbers. Those numbers nonetheless speak directly to some of the points that you wanted to make.
No doubt. Even when we get the running game going we don't stay committed to it long enough if you ask me. Now don't get me wrong I'm not one of those guys that thinks you should run the ball on every play but I do believe you run it until they prove they can stop you. And on the same token if they can't stop your passing game then you keep doing that until they prove they can stop you. Whatever is working if it ain't broke don't fix it. And if both is working then well, take your pick. Make it situational.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: MuskogeeHogFan on November 11, 2017, 09:26:16 am
No doubt. Even when we get the running game going we don't stay committed to it long enough if you ask me. Now don't get me wrong I'm not one of those guys that thinks you should run the ball on every play but I do believe you run it until they prove they can stop you. And on the same token if they can't stop your passing game then you keep doing that until they prove they can stop you. Whatever is working if it ain't broke don't fix it.

You run it until they adjust, giving you a better opportunity to throw. JMO
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Youngsta71701 on November 11, 2017, 09:26:45 am
You run it until they adjust, giving you a better opportunity to throw. JMO
Yep, that too. Put it like this. I don't believe in throwing the ball just because. You ever notice how if we run the ball on 1st down and pick up maybe 2 or 3 yards then it's almost an automatic pass or play-action pass on 2nd down which results in a lot of the sacks we give up? To me that is way to predictable. You have to mix it up and keep the defense guessing and off balance.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Youngsta71701 on November 11, 2017, 09:57:37 am
I love our pro-style offensive scheme but I can't stand our bend & break (supposed to be bend but don't break) defensive scheme. I love a dominating 3 & out or turnover creating defense.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: twistitup on November 11, 2017, 10:31:23 am
Do we establish a run game first today?
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: MuskogeeHogFan on November 11, 2017, 10:41:32 am
Do we establish a run game first today?

LSU averages allowing 4.2 YPC and we average 4.5 p/carry. LSU is #11 in the country in pass efficiency defense allowing just 157 yards passing/gm and a 53% completion percentage. They are #8 in Team Sacks with an average of 3.33 p/gm while we average giving up 3.1 p/gm. What do you think? Are we going to try to fool them by going "pass first"?
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Youngsta71701 on November 11, 2017, 10:41:46 am
Do we establish a run game first today?
Against a defense like LSU I might come out with a little play action pass just to keep them honest. But against a defense like Coastal Carolina I would have run the ball down their throats the whole game until they couldn't take it anymore.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: The Hawg Marshal on November 11, 2017, 10:42:14 am
LSU averages allowing 4.2 YPC and we average 4.5 p/carry. LSU is #11 in the country in pass efficiency defense allowing just 157 yards passing/gm and a 53% completion percentage. That are #8 in Team Sacks with an average of 3.33 p/gm while we average giving up 3.1 p/gm. What do you think? Are we going to try to fool them by going "pass first"?
Probably.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Youngsta71701 on November 11, 2017, 10:44:11 am
I can almost guaran damn tee you one thing, whatever it is that we should do we will probably do the opposite. Because we're backwards like that.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: twistitup on November 11, 2017, 10:47:27 am
I can almost guaran damn tee you one thing, whatever it is that we should do we will probably do the opposite. Because we're backwards like that.

You think we establish the run or pass first? Make a prediction....c'mon
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Deep Shoat on November 11, 2017, 10:48:42 am
I'm not talking about BB or any particular class.  I know Spears comment was about BA passing the ball 50 times. 

I'm talking about Arkansas's identity as a PROGRAM, the identity that made it a TOP 20 PROGRAM.  Crowe screwed the fundamentally sound part of it up in less than two years.  Broyles hired Ford to fix it.  He did at least to the extent he put together a roster of hardnosed football players who could run and stop the run.  What did Orgeron just say about why LSU is playing well?  "We've learned to run and stop the run." 

Nutt showed up with a wide open offense by Ford and Broyles standards and did well with Stoerner, Lucas and Davenport because he could run and play defense.  Broyles reined him in on passing but made sure he kept the defense and special teams.

Petrino came in and turned Arkansas's mindset into Louisville, Thursday-night style football.  Fans bought into it and now they're clamoring for Oregon and Baylor, 

Spears is right.  Arkansas has no identity.  Worse, its fans don't even know what he's talking about.
HERE HERE!
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: HoginMemphis on November 11, 2017, 10:49:28 am
Game Averages by Season and through 9 games in 2017. One season we have averaged over 30 pass attempts p/gm, but our rushing effectiveness has certainly decreased.

                        2013          2014        2015        2016         2017
Total Yards         357.2         406.0       465.5       428.4        388.5
Total Plays           64.6           70.5        68.2         71.0         69.1
Yards/Play            5.5             5.8          6.8           6.0          5.6
Pass Att              25.1           27.6        28.8         31.2         28.8
Pass Cmpl            12.5           15.3        18.9         19.0         16.7
Cmpl %                49.8           55.4        65.8         60.8         57.9
Pass Yards          148.5          188.0      268.2       264.2        205.8
Yds/Attempt          5.9             6.8         9.3           8.5          7.2
Yds/Compl            11.9           12.3        14.2         13.9         12.3
Rush Attempts      39.5            42.8       39.4         39.8         40.3
Rush Yards          208.7          218.0      197.3       164.2        182.7
Yds/Rush Att         5.3             5.1         5.0           4.1           4.5
The team's biggest issue during Bielema's time is the defense, not the offense.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: thebignasty on November 11, 2017, 10:52:17 am
Spread can be basic to NFL complex.

Most NFL teams are spread to throw now.
yep

Spread is really just describing the basic formation ideology.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: MuskogeeHogFan on November 11, 2017, 10:53:29 am
The team's biggest issue during Bielema's time is the defense, not the offense.

I have those numbers as well. They aren't pretty.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Inhogswetrust on November 11, 2017, 10:54:42 am

Iíd say itís becase JFB stayed too long.


Arkansas should be a premier passing school

I bet you're glad to be out of the rubber room..............or maybe you aren't out.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Dominicanhog on November 11, 2017, 11:00:13 am
The worst thing that has happened to the Football Program in the last five years has nothing to do with Jeff Long or Bret Bielema.  Itís when Sam Pittman left for Georgia.  The heart and soul of the physical football team was the Oline Pittman built and it has not been replicated since he left. 

They have a spread roster trying to play Power ďIĒ football. 
Square pegs in round holes.

The defense isnít addressed here, but itís pretty simple.  The fear of the big play has taken away aggressiveness.

This is the problem.. Enos vs, Chaney... 350 pounder's looking for 3 yards and a cloud of dust.. one of the first things Enos mentioned, more nimble guards..able to pull and screen... which is great but they don't have the road-graders to control the clock... stack the box against an over matched line.. wala
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Dominicanhog on November 11, 2017, 11:02:11 am
The team's biggest issue during Bielema's time is the defense, not the offense.

what about special teams?.. I think your selling him short...
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: HoginMemphis on November 11, 2017, 11:09:08 am
what about special teams?.. I think your selling him short...
Sure, they have been awful too. But it begins and ends with defense for every team and defense has been a boil on Bielema's fat arse since he's been at Ark. And he's gained 100 lbs since he came to Ark so that is a huge arse.
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: IronHog on November 11, 2017, 12:10:39 pm
I bet you're glad to be out of the rubber room..............or maybe you aren't out.


Run it up the gut play not to lose BS donít work anymore


Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: Youngsta71701 on November 11, 2017, 12:36:38 pm
You think we establish the run or pass first? Make a prediction....c'mon
C. None of the Above

Lol...
Title: Re: Spears: Ark lost it's identity
Post by: twistitup on November 11, 2017, 02:21:49 pm
C. None of the Above

Lol...

Haha....we were flat