Hogville

RB Sports Discussion => Monday Morning Quarterback => Topic started by: Boss Hog in the Arkansas on November 07, 2017, 08:17:55 am

Title: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Boss Hog in the Arkansas on November 07, 2017, 08:17:55 am
 I wanted an outside opinion on the job Bielema has done at Arkansas and I wanted to hear it from someone who has experienced Bielema as their head coach. Someone that knew what type of person he is. The obvious choice was a Wisconsin fan. The main thing I asked about was where they thought things went downhill and why the hire hasn't gone as fans hoped. They basically said his mistake was trying to remake Arkansas as another Wisconsin. He started out right away with his “run the ball big offensive line pro style offense” and maybe that just doesn’t work at Arkansas. He needed to get the lay of the land, figure out recruiting, what kind of players he has in-state, and build an identity from that. That was the 1st thing he should've done. It was a crucial step in building his foundation here and he didn't do it.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: jst01 on November 07, 2017, 08:19:14 am
I wanted an outside opinion on the job Bielema has done at Arkansas


Did you really need it?
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: The_Iceman on November 07, 2017, 08:27:46 am
This opinion is actually wrong. Bielemas problem is he didn't stick to developing the biggest and baddest offensive line. His lines got soft. Year 3 was our best roster, and his failure as a coach in preparing the team at the beginning of the year cost us. As we saw at the end, that team was talented enough to win 10 games.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: RyanMallettsEgo on November 07, 2017, 08:30:03 am
This opinion is actually wrong. Bielemas problem is he didn't stick to developing the biggest and baddest offensive line. His lines got soft. Year 3 was our best roster, and his failure as a coach in preparing the team at the beginning of the year cost us. As we saw at the end, that team was talented enough to win 10 games.

Welcome to Hogville, folks.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: hawgon on November 07, 2017, 08:30:38 am
I saw on another board that there are now 8 NFL STARTERS who played on that team.  The incompetence in underachieving the way Bert did with that team was staggering. 
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Hog Fan...DOH! on November 07, 2017, 08:43:10 am
This opinion is actually wrong. Bielemas problem is he didn't stick to developing the biggest and baddest offensive line. His lines got soft. Year 3 was our best roster, and his failure as a coach in preparing the team at the beginning of the year cost us. As we saw at the end, that team was talented enough to win 10 games.

CBB talked regularly about "not flinching".  What's he do? He changes philosophies on both sides of the ball.


Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Marshfieldhog on November 07, 2017, 08:45:43 am
I saw on another board that there are now 8 NFL STARTERS who played on that team.  The incompetence in underachieving the way Bert did with that team was staggering. 

And yet he failed to win at a high rate with 8 NFL guys.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Boss Hog in the Arkansas on November 07, 2017, 08:45:57 am
Welcome to Hogville, folks.
LMAO he probably doesn't even think he said anything wrong
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Boss Hog in the Arkansas on November 07, 2017, 08:48:50 am
I saw on another board that there are now 8 NFL STARTERS who played on that team.  The incompetence in underachieving the way Bert did with that team was staggering.
8 starters and 15 guys that at least made training camps. Doesn't sound like a big deal, but if you don't have talent (like so many on here say year after year) you wont even make it that far
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: twistitup on November 07, 2017, 08:50:17 am
I think CBB got desperate after losing nearly his entire staff...he made some bad hires and lost his identity- now he is just a puddle of pudding. He's got nothing....no redshirt program, no depth, no power- he lost his Wisky identity and now is just treading water trying not to drown.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: hawgon on November 07, 2017, 08:52:31 am
8 starters and 15 guys that at least made training camps. Doesn't sound like a big deal, but if you don't have talent (like so many on here say year after year) you wont even make it that far

I’ve been a fan for forty years and I can’t ever recall that much talent on one Arkansas team.  Can you imagine what Petrino in his seventh year as coach would have done with that team?
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: OneTuskOverTheLine™ on November 07, 2017, 08:54:02 am
This opinion is actually wrong. Bielemas problem is he didn't stick to developing the biggest and baddest offensive line. His lines got soft. Year 3 was our best roster, and his failure as a coach in preparing the team at the beginning of the year cost us. As we saw at the end, that team was talented enough to win 10 games.

 This. He Rann Oft a pretty good system building OC and OL coach. The length of time it took them to get UGA up and running shows some of the issues that they (UGA) had too. We would most assuredly have been better off with them.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: jm on November 07, 2017, 09:07:04 am
His problem is not alignment or formations or philosophy. His team is soft. His team is gutless. He went the wrong direction when he started making players change numbers because they played too rough.
I was excited when he was hired because I believed that a former walk on defensive lineman would bring the kind of toughness that would make people dread playing Arkansas win or lose, but obviously that has turned out to be exactly the opposite.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: tolerati on November 07, 2017, 09:07:24 am
I agree that BB lost his identity and under achieved.  He should have stuck with the big lines and dominant running game.  There is nothing wrong with balance if your built for balance.  Right now most people would be hard pressed to say what this team is built to do. Pass? Run? They do neither very well.  There should have been less worry about Alabama and more concern on establishing who Arkansas is.  Let the rest take care of itself.  First you have be competitive then you have a chance to win against Alabama.  Arkansas was competitive on occasions and at least twice could have beaten Alabama except for mistakes/missed opportunities by the Hogs.  Petrino had the Hogs on the cusp.  BB has never had Arkansas in top 25 except on rare occasions.  Arkansas could consistently be a top 25 program with the right coach and leadership.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: hoglady on November 07, 2017, 09:14:45 am
I’ve been a fan for forty years and I can’t ever recall that much talent on one Arkansas team.  Can you imagine what Petrino in his seventh year as coach would have done with that team?

But Petrino couldn't recruit or play defense - or so the mantra was at the time.
Petrino left us devoid of talent - or so the mantra goes.

We sure need some of those Petrino defensive players and offensive playmakers about now.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: PonderinHog on November 07, 2017, 09:17:25 am
He should have red shirted Kirkland and Skipper in year one, when there was no immediate pressure to win.  He blinked and now the chickens have come home to roost.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: BearsBisonsBoars on November 07, 2017, 09:17:59 am
Welcome to Hogville, folks.

I mean, he's right though.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: KennyForAD on November 07, 2017, 09:27:32 am
HEY This is the worst coach in HISTORY.   Everyone knows this now, even him.  What are y'all debating?   The guy made millions doing a job that he has NO IDEA how to do. 

That's all there is to it.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Grizzlyfan on November 07, 2017, 09:30:44 am
I wanted an outside opinion on the job Bielema has done at Arkansas and I wanted to hear it from someone who has experienced Bielema as their head coach. Someone that knew what type of person he is. The obvious choice was a Wisconsin fan. The main thing I asked about was where they thought things went downhill and why the hire hasn't gone as fans hoped. They basically said his mistake was trying to remake Arkansas as another Wisconsin. He started out right away with his “run the ball big offensive line pro style offense” and maybe that just doesn’t work at Arkansas. He needed to get the lay of the land, figure out recruiting, what kind of players he has in-state, and build an identity from that. That was the 1st thing he should've done. It was a crucial step in building his foundation here and he didn't do it.
This is pretty much what Alvarez said at the little rock td club.  At Wisconsin they could get all the 320 lb offensive linemen they wanted and they could grind out the game any way they wanted.  The complicating factor for Arkansas in the SEC, according to Alvarez, is speed.  Which Arkansas doesn't have and Wisconsin didn't need.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Piggfoot on November 07, 2017, 09:35:32 am
He should have red shirted Kirkland and Skipper in year one, when there was no immediate pressure to win.  He blinked and now the chickens have come home to roost.
Yes. But would fans have been patient enough when he went winless.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Deep Shoat on November 07, 2017, 09:37:14 am
But Petrino couldn't recruit or play defense - or so the mantra was at the time.
Petrino left us devoid of talent - or so the mantra goes.

We sure need some of those Petrino defensive players and offensive playmakers about now.
Why do you people always parrot bull?  That has never been what was actually said, except by the simplistic, 3 word sentence types.

Petrino left us devoid of DEPTH.  Over half of his players never saw the field at Arkansas.  They were reaches and misses and malcontents.  So they either flunked out, got arrested repeatedly, quit when they were expected to compete, or just plain sucked.  The other half were pretty good football players, and if you could avoid injury, they won games. 

As to defense, stop pretending we had some awesome D when Petrino was here.  Out of the great defenders on that 2014 team that you want to attribute to Petrino, you have Flowers and, sort of, Philon.  Petrino turned away Spaight.  He won Flowers, an Arkansas boy, and he lost the recruiting for Philon, but did know to grab him when he fell in his lap.

Petrino also had the good fortune of the best class Arkansas has produced in about 15-20 years and then fell off consistently after that.  The next coach will likely get something similar, because of the depth and talent of the '19 class.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: The_Iceman on November 07, 2017, 09:37:42 am

We sure need some of those Petrino defensive players and offensive playmakers about now.

Yes we do, and we would have been saying the same thing if Petrino remained as coach. He recruited well starting out, but his last couple classes were awful. You are seeing the same thing play out at Louisville.

Charlie Strong was 11-2 and 12-1 his last two seasons at Louisville. Petrino took over a strong program, has a Heisman winner, and his record at Louisville has been:

9-4
8-5
9-4
5-4.....Currently

Petrino struggles with sustaining a program because of his struggles with recruiting...and eventually his attitude wears thin on everyone,  including the coaches in his local recruiting base.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: KennyForAD on November 07, 2017, 09:39:11 am
This is pretty much what Alvarez said at the little rock td club.  At Wisconsin they could get all the 320 lb offensive linemen they wanted and they could grind out the game any way they wanted.  The complicating factor for Arkansas in the SEC, according to Alvarez, is speed.  Which Arkansas doesn't have and Wisconsin didn't need.

... which BB is FAR too stupid to ever understand.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Soooie21 on November 07, 2017, 09:40:14 am
I wanted an outside opinion on the job Bielema has done at Arkansas and I wanted to hear it from someone who has experienced Bielema as their head coach. Someone that knew what type of person he is. The obvious choice was a Wisconsin fan. The main thing I asked about was where they thought things went downhill and why the hire hasn't gone as fans hoped. They basically said his mistake was trying to remake Arkansas as another Wisconsin. He started out right away with his “run the ball big offensive line pro style offense” and maybe that just doesn’t work at Arkansas. He needed to get the lay of the land, figure out recruiting, what kind of players he has in-state, and build an identity from that. That was the 1st thing he should've done. It was a crucial step in building his foundation here and he didn't do it.

Couldn't agree more...He wants the big road grader linemen. and Enos likes a spread type offense..2 different styles...require 2 types of linemen....
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: PonderinHog on November 07, 2017, 09:40:52 am
Yes. But would fans have been patient enough when he went winless.
Yes, he would have survived year one if he had gone winless.  In fact, he did go winless in the SEC.  Remember?
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Boss Hog in the Arkansas on November 07, 2017, 09:42:05 am
Yes. But would fans have been patient enough when he went winless.
Yes, as long as he didn't go 3-9 again.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Grizzlyfan on November 07, 2017, 09:44:40 am
... which BB is FAR to stupid to ever understand.
He certainly hasn't adjusted to that reality, I will grant you that.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: swinemaster on November 07, 2017, 09:51:44 am
Wisconsin fans are great.  I've hung out with many of them in Vegas during March Madness.  They come out in force for their teams.  Great School and good folks.  They love beer and they can't stand "Fat Bret"(their words, not mine).  Even with all of the success they were having, it just seemed to them like Bret was Barry Alvarez's dumbass son in law running the business.  This is the prevailing theme from multiple groups of Wisky fans.  They were insulted that he would leave their program for a place like Arkansas.  But they didn't give a rat's ass that he was gone.  Their record since he has left proves their point.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: ballz2thewall on November 07, 2017, 09:57:25 am
This opinion is actually wrong. Bielemas problem is he didn't stick to developing the biggest and baddest offensive line. His lines got soft. Year 3 was our best roster, and his failure as a coach in preparing the team at the beginning of the year cost us. As we saw at the end, that team was talented enough to win 10 games.

agreed.

going back further i remember his first game here. i went and was underwhelmed. watching the OL was not what i expected. yeah; he was new, yada yada yada. but honestly, basically every game since has looked like that game from on OL perspective. nothing to write home about.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: RyanMallettsEgo on November 07, 2017, 10:20:15 am
I mean, he's right though.

Your opinion is wrong.

 ;)
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: AP85 on November 07, 2017, 10:21:59 am
Wisconsin fans are great.  I've hung out with many of them in Vegas during March Madness.  They come out in force for their teams.  Great School and good folks.  They love beer and they can't stand "Fat Bret"(their words, not mine).  Even with all of the success they were having, it just seemed to them like Bret was Barry Alvarez's dumbass son in law running the business.  This is the prevailing theme from multiple groups of Wisky fans.  They were insulted that he would leave their program for a place like Arkansas.  But they didn't give a rat's ass that he was gone.  Their record since he has left proves their point.

Whisky has a good brand of football and they are fun to watch. Overall prestige is about as equal to Arkansas only with more conference titles.

Would love to have a program like them these days....
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: DeltaBoy on November 07, 2017, 10:34:30 am
Whisky has a good brand of football and they are fun to watch. Overall prestige is about as equal to Arkansas only with more conference titles.

Would love to have a program like them these days....

I envy Whiskey the past 20 years.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Ironhawg on November 07, 2017, 10:41:52 am
This opinion is actually wrong. Bielemas problem is he didn't stick to developing the biggest and baddest offensive line. His lines got soft. Year 3 was our best roster, and his failure as a coach in preparing the team at the beginning of the year cost us. As we saw at the end, that team was talented enough to win 10 games.

I wonder if part of the reason he didn't stick to his original plan was first, he found out pretty quickly that he couldn't find the big road grader o-linemen in sufficient numbers and second, the speed of defenses in the SEC made it possible to run past those road graders?
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Pigstie on November 07, 2017, 10:45:38 am
Welcome to Hogville, folks.
Exactly ......   In a nutshell
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: wildturkey8 on November 07, 2017, 10:50:54 am
Why do you people always parrot bull?  That has never been what was actually said, except by the simplistic, 3 word sentence types.

Petrino left us devoid of DEPTH.  Over half of his players never saw the field at Arkansas.  They were reaches and misses and malcontents.  So they either flunked out, got arrested repeatedly, quit when they were expected to compete, or just plain sucked.  The other half were pretty good football players, and if you could avoid injury, they won games. 

As to defense, stop pretending we had some awesome D when Petrino was here.  Out of the great defenders on that 2014 team that you want to attribute to Petrino, you have Flowers and, sort of, Philon.  Petrino turned away Spaight.  He won Flowers, an Arkansas boy, and he lost the recruiting for Philon, but did know to grab him when he fell in his lap.

Petrino also had the good fortune of the best class Arkansas has produced in about 15-20 years and then fell off consistently after that.  The next coach will likely get something similar, because of the depth and talent of the '19 class.
I don't think Flowers is from Arkansas.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: hawg1221 on November 07, 2017, 11:00:22 am
I don't think Flowers is from Arkansas.

No. I think he's from Georgia and we got him to switch his commitment from Georgia Tech to Arkansas right before signing day.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Peter Porker on November 07, 2017, 11:04:25 am
This opinion is actually wrong. Bielemas problem is he didn't stick to developing the biggest and baddest offensive line. His lines got soft. Year 3 was our best roster, and his failure as a coach in preparing the team at the beginning of the year cost us. As we saw at the end, that team was talented enough to win 10 games.

Yep, and to the people that say "smashmouth offense don't work", we haven't been that since Enos was hired. How often do we use a fullback to block now? CBB's biggest mistake was changing the offense.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: ipigsooie on November 07, 2017, 11:08:48 am
What im hearing, like most of CBBs former assistants, Matt Canada does not care for Bret. Apparently CBB was always butting in and taking control of the play calling.  He also said to look for Canada to unleash a special kind of a whooping on our defense this weekend. Itll be like gus only itll be directed at one dude instead of our whole state.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: BearsBisonsBoars on November 07, 2017, 11:09:48 am
... which BB is FAR to stupid to ever understand.

*too
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: code red on November 07, 2017, 11:35:06 am
I wanted an outside opinion on the job Bielema has done at Arkansas and I wanted to hear it from someone who has experienced Bielema as their head coach. Someone that knew what type of person he is. The obvious choice was a Wisconsin fan. The main thing I asked about was where they thought things went downhill and why the hire hasn't gone as fans hoped. They basically said his mistake was trying to remake Arkansas as another Wisconsin. He started out right away with his “run the ball big offensive line pro style offense” and maybe that just doesn’t work at Arkansas. He needed to get the lay of the land, figure out recruiting, what kind of players he has in-state, and build an identity from that. That was the 1st thing he should've done. It was a crucial step in building his foundation here and he didn't do it.

I been screaming it for years.  "Your not going to out bama...Bama."  CBB fatal error was not going to the spread. 
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Ex-Trumpet on November 07, 2017, 11:37:21 am
I been screaming it for years.  "Your not going to out bama...Bama."  CBB fatal error was not going to the spread. 

Let's be honest, last weekend Hogs didn't even out-bama Coastal Carolina.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Peter Porker on November 07, 2017, 11:37:27 am
I been screaming it for years.  "Your not going to out bama...Bama."  CBB fatal error was not going to the spread.

The closest we ever got to beating Bama was when we tried to out-bama them. 14-13 .
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Ex-Trumpet on November 07, 2017, 11:38:40 am
... which BB is FAR to stupid to ever understand.
*too

I love moments like these!!  :)
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: The_Iceman on November 07, 2017, 11:45:08 am
I wonder if part of the reason he didn't stick to his original plan was first, he found out pretty quickly that he couldn't find the big road grader o-linemen in sufficient numbers and second, the speed of defenses in the SEC made it possible to run past those road graders?

Look at the sack numbers with those "road graders." They were out there, he just failed to recruit and develop enough of them. I believe his most recent class is a step in the right direction, but too little too late.

The inability to develop Wallace and Merrick killed us. If you are big and strong on the O-line and can establish the run, it puts you in a lot of 2nd and manageable and 3rd and shorts. It's harder to sack the QB in those instances.

Our offensive philosophy or alignment isn't the problem, it is the O-line. We were competitive against Bama in 2014 and 2015 with a big strong line. We lost that.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Hog Fan...DOH! on November 07, 2017, 12:00:42 pm
I been screaming it for years.  "Your not going to out bama...Bama."  CBB fatal error was not going to the spread. 

I've always really, really hated that phrase.   You need talent and execution to beat Saban.   I'm not sure it requires any other form of scientific rocketry. 
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: wildturkey8 on November 07, 2017, 12:07:27 pm
I've always really, really hated that phrase.   You need talent and execution to beat Saban.   I'm not sure it requires any other form of scientific rocketry. 
It is a terrible mentality.  Why not figure out who WE (Arkansas) are, what we do best and execute it.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Jim Harris on November 07, 2017, 12:19:45 pm
I think CBB got desperate after losing nearly his entire staff...he made some bad hires and lost his identity- now he is just a puddle of pudding. He's got nothing....no redshirt program, no depth, no power- he lost his Wisky identity and now is just treading water trying not to drown.

Arkansas by my count is redshirting at least 13 players from the current freshman class, so I wouldn't say he has no redshirt program. Four of the starting O linemen redshirted at one point (not that it apparently helped much). I agree with the rest of what you said though. They started out soft in 2015 after two years of smash mouth and it cost them at least two victories in the first half of the season, easily winnable games. That's an 11-win season in his third year, which is right on schedule and probably would have enhanced recruiting for the following signing day the next cycle immensely. Those losses to Toledo and Texas Tech were just crunchers on more than just the win-loss record, as it turned out. Hardly anyone outside of the fanbase noticed that Arkansas won six of its last seven and flat out WHIPPED LSU, I don't care if they "had a letdown after Bama" or not.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Jim Harris on November 07, 2017, 12:21:52 pm
No. I think he's from Georgia and we got him to switch his commitment from Georgia Tech to Arkansas right before signing day.

He's from Huntsville, Alabama.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: BearsBisonsBoars on November 07, 2017, 12:22:53 pm
I love moments like these!!  :)

I'm a man of simple pleasures. But among them, people making simple mistakes while calling others stupid is among the foremost.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Boss Hog in the Arkansas on November 07, 2017, 12:35:44 pm
Look at the sack numbers with those "road graders." They were out there, he just failed to recruit and develop enough of them. I believe his most recent class is a step in the right direction, but too little too late.

The inability to develop Wallace and Merrick killed us. If you are big and strong on the O-line and can establish the run, it puts you in a lot of 2nd and manageable and 3rd and shorts. It's harder to sack the QB in those instances.

Our offensive philosophy or alignment isn't the problem, it is the O-line. We were competitive against Bama in 2014 and 2015 with a big strong line. We lost that.
It all starts with philosophy and scheme. We have a situation where the offensive linemen we've recruited don't match what the OC wants to do. Pittman saw the writing on the wall and bolted. People wonder why chaney and pittman follow each other everywhere. Its because the linemen pitmen likes to recruit and the assignments he gives them fit perfectly into Jim Chaneys system. When you have coaches with philosophies/coaching styles that match up, you end up with great teams. See UGA.

Bielema did a poor job at hiring coordinators and position coaches. Spread coordinators and pro style position coaches was never going to work
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Mo_Better_Hogs on November 07, 2017, 12:40:37 pm
Wisconsin fans are great.  I've hung out with many of them in Vegas during March Madness.  They come out in force for their teams.  Great School and good folks.  They love beer and they can't stand "Fat Bret"(their words, not mine).  Even with all of the success they were having, it just seemed to them like Bret was Barry Alvarez's dumbass son in law running the business.  This is the prevailing theme from multiple groups of Wisky fans.  They were insulted that he would leave their program for a place like Arkansas.  But they didn't give a rat's ass that he was gone.  Their record since he has left proves their point.

Interesting thread topic. It comes up from time to time, but I wonder how many people just say "ohhh, Wisconsin is glad he's gone" just because they think so.

I'm interested in proof, in specifics (like above post). What didn't they like about Bielema when he was there? One thing I would think--bowl success. They made Rose Bowls but didn't win any (did they?) Big bowls are great, but you gotta win a few. You gotta end the season on a good note.

Clearly they're not missing him since he left.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Iwastherein1969 on November 07, 2017, 12:43:54 pm
I wanted an outside opinion on the job Bielema has done at Arkansas and I wanted to hear it from someone who has experienced Bielema as their head coach. Someone that knew what type of person he is. The obvious choice was a Wisconsin fan. The main thing I asked about was where they thought things went downhill and why the hire hasn't gone as fans hoped. They basically said his mistake was trying to remake Arkansas as another Wisconsin. He started out right away with his “run the ball big offensive line pro style offense” and maybe that just doesn’t work at Arkansas. He needed to get the lay of the land, figure out recruiting, what kind of players he has in-state, and build an identity from that. That was the 1st thing he should've done. It was a crucial step in building his foundation here and he didn't do it.
Nutt's 2006 team ran around, through, over, by, past Wisconsin in the Capitol One Bowl....if not for our kicker missing 3 chippies and their kicker hitting a 52 yarder to win the game 17-14, no way Wisky wins that game...take a look back in the archives at the stats for that game and we absolutely dominated Wisconsin...double the total yardage, especially rushing...the game was just one of those games that Hooten was going to lose even if he played Texas St...Wisky wasn't half the team we were but only two coaches in UA history could have lost that game, Hootie and "Smile"
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: CareBear on November 07, 2017, 12:44:03 pm
I didn't like the hire, but I bought in after CBB's introductory press conference.
 Fast forward to the first game of the Bielema era. When we came out in that ridiculous JUMBO Big Ten package in which  the lineman & TE are packed in tight (there may have been one WR split wide) I just had a gut feeling that this wasn't going to work. We all know the SEC has the best defensive lineman. The power, speed, & overall athleticism these D-lineman posess at their size... let's say 6'4 285lbs give or take a few...is world class. Once doesn't run into many humans that possess all those attributes in one body. I knew that if we relied on that philosophy which is unapologetically vanilla with some play action thrown in... We were f*cksville.
That Rutgers game in Jersey really scared me.  CBB mismanaged it for sure & the pattern would be repeated often. The handling of the QB situation has been the strangest thing I've ever seen. First of all Brandon Mitchell, who had been here for like 7 years, was not given his fair shot. I thought CBB was all about the Upperclassmen getting the benefit of the doubt and being rewarded for their hard work? Then he anointed Brandon Allen starter for life. Competition is good. Hells bells at the very least I feel like sometimes it is good for a QB to take a few series off to watch from the sideline. A good QB will learn from that.
We got hustled courtesy of Jeff Long's half-ass coaching search. Perhaps if JL would have done a more thorough job in researching all the variables & vetting CBB we wouldn't be here now. I wish CBB the best but it's been obvious for at least 3 years that he's not a good fit here despite what a few in the media have parroted (Y'all got hustled too) Constantly being told to be patient, "it was a dumpster fire", "It's coming",  "He's building it the right way" #uncommon... whilist seeing the subpar product on the field, has produced a phenomenon amongst the fans known as cognitive dissonance...which is a jedi mind f*ck for the layman. Think of an orange on the table. You know it's an orange. You have seen & tasted many in your life...but someone that you trusted is telling you, "no that's an apple, you're crazy for thinking that's an orange. How dare you". We have seen good football here folks. Sometimes great football. We have been known as a relatively classy program with fans who are known for being  passionate, patient, & generally welcoming in regards to the opposing team's fans. #WPS
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: longpig on November 07, 2017, 12:45:08 pm
No. I think he's from Georgia and we got him to switch his commitment from Georgia Tech to Arkansas right before signing day.

Huntsville, Alabama
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: twistitup on November 07, 2017, 12:47:22 pm
I drink beer w a guy that moved to Fville from Wisconsin- he couldn't believe we hired CBB...he thought we could do better (he said this 5 years ago)- CBB is just a lil Alvarez minion...

Now he just laughs at the situation
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: longpig on November 07, 2017, 12:48:12 pm
I wonder if part of the reason he didn't stick to his original plan was first, he found out pretty quickly that he couldn't find the big road grader o-linemen in sufficient numbers and second, the speed of defenses in the SEC made it possible to run past those road graders?

Best I could tell, he thought he could recruit the linemen to Arkansas that he was getting for Wisconsin.  Apparently it was the helmet they liked, not the coach. 
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Iwastherein1969 on November 07, 2017, 12:48:59 pm
I drink beer w a guy that moved to Fville from Wisconsin- he couldn't believe we hired CBB...he thought we could do better (he said this 5 years ago)- just a lil Alvarez minion

Now he just laughs at the situation
this is more like it
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: swinemaster on November 07, 2017, 12:53:24 pm
They all claimed bowl game incompetence and that last season of his which was a 7-5 team.  Funny how the program regressed after 5 years of Bret. ???

Barry had them used to winning bowl games.  Bret went 2-4 or 2-5 if you count the last team that he didn't coach in the Rose Bowl.  That team only went because Penn St. and Ohio St. were sanctioned.  They were 3rd in their division.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: swinemaster on November 07, 2017, 12:56:36 pm
Nutt's 2006 team ran around, through, over, by, past Wisconsin in the Capitol One Bowl....if not for our kicker missing 3 chippies and their kicker hitting a 52 yarder to win the game 17-14, no way Wisky wins that game...take a look back in the archives at the stats for that game and we absolutely dominated Wisconsin...double the total yardage, especially rushing...the game was just one of those games that Hooten was going to lose even if he played Texas St...Wisky wasn't half the team we were but only two coaches in UA history could have lost that game, Hootie and "Smile"

Very True.  And that was before the horse collar rule.  They just about killed DMAC tackling him from behind like that in that game.  Probably would have won going away if that rule was in effect back then.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Ironhawg on November 07, 2017, 01:14:55 pm
It all starts with philosophy and scheme. We have a situation where the offensive linemen we've recruited don't match what the OC wants to do. Pittman saw the writing on the wall and bolted. People wonder why chaney and pittman follow each other everywhere. Its because the linemen pitmen likes to recruit and the assignments he gives them fit perfectly into Jim Chaneys system. When you have coaches with philosophies/coaching styles that match up, you end up with great teams. See UGA.

Bielema did a poor job at hiring coordinators and position coaches. Spread coordinators and pro style position coaches was never going to work

How could a coach as experienced as Bielema not envision this disagreement between the different schemes?  Maybe if he had prepared the fanbase foe a transition there wouldn't be such an uproar right now. 
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Boss Hog in the Arkansas on November 07, 2017, 01:16:16 pm
Nutt's 2006 team ran around, through, over, by, past Wisconsin in the Capitol One Bowl....if not for our kicker missing 3 chippies and their kicker hitting a 52 yarder to win the game 17-14, no way Wisky wins that game...take a look back in the archives at the stats for that game and we absolutely dominated Wisconsin...double the total yardage, especially rushing...the game was just one of those games that Hooten was going to lose even if he played Texas St...Wisky wasn't half the team we were but only two coaches in UA history could have lost that game, Hootie and "Smile"
When you look back in history, no one looks at stats. They got the W, we didn't.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: KennyForAD on November 07, 2017, 01:16:32 pm
*too

Wow.  Thank you.   Call someone stupid, you might want to check for typos.  LMAO at myself.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Boss Hog in the Arkansas on November 07, 2017, 01:17:56 pm
Interesting thread topic. It comes up from time to time, but I wonder how many people just say "ohhh, Wisconsin is glad he's gone" just because they think so.

I'm interested in proof, in specifics (like above post). What didn't they like about Bielema when he was there? One thing I would think--bowl success. They made Rose Bowls but didn't win any (did they?) Big bowls are great, but you gotta win a few. You gotta end the season on a good note.

Clearly they're not missing him since he left.
Go over to buckyville or some of the badgers other fanboards. They don't bring it up as much these days, but when they talk about the guy they definitely don't hold back
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Razorbax on November 07, 2017, 01:18:21 pm
I am sure Louisville under Strong being in the American Athletic Conference (AAC) compared to CBP's Louisville teams being in the ACC had nothing to do with the win-loss records. 
Yes we do, and we would have been saying the same thing if Petrino remained as coach. He recruited well starting out, but his last couple classes were awful. You are seeing the same thing play out at Louisville.

Charlie Strong was 11-2 and 12-1 his last two seasons at Louisville. Petrino took over a strong program, has a Heisman winner, and his record at Louisville has been:

9-4
8-5
9-4
5-4.....Currently

Petrino struggles with sustaining a program because of his struggles with recruiting...and eventually his attitude wears thin on everyone,  including the coaches in his local recruiting base.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: The_Iceman on November 07, 2017, 01:38:20 pm
I am sure Louisville under Strong being in the American Athletic Conference (AAC) compared to CBP's Louisville teams being in the ACC had nothing to do with the win-loss records.

They were actually in the Big East during the 2012 year that he went 11-2. He beat #4 Florida to win the Sugar Bowl that season.

But it is funny how people want to belittle his record for winning in the AAC, then turn around and want Mike Norvell.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Boss Hog in the Arkansas on November 07, 2017, 01:49:26 pm
I didn't like the hire, but I bought in after CBB's introductory press conference.
 Fast forward to the first game of the Bielema era. When we came out in that ridiculous JUMBO Big Ten package in which  the lineman & TE are packed in tight (there may have been one WR split wide) I just had a gut feeling that this wasn't going to work. We all know the SEC has the best defensive lineman. The power, speed, & overall athleticism these D-lineman posess at their size... let's say 6'4 285lbs give or take a few...is world class. Once doesn't run into many humans that possess all those attributes in one body. I knew that if we relied on that philosophy which is unapologetically vanilla with some play action thrown in... We were f*cksville.
That Rutgers game in Jersey really scared me.  CBB mismanaged it for sure & the pattern would be repeated often. The handling of the QB situation has been the strangest thing I've ever seen. First of all Brandon Mitchell, who had been here for like 7 years, was not given his fair shot. I thought CBB was all about the Upperclassmen getting the benefit of the doubt and being rewarded for their hard work? Then he anointed Brandon Allen starter for life. Competition is good. Hells bells at the very least I feel like sometimes it is good for a QB to take a few series off to watch from the sideline. A good QB will learn from that.
We got hustled courtesy of Jeff Long's half-ass coaching search. Perhaps if JL would have done a more thorough job in researching all the variables & vetting CBB we wouldn't be here now. I wish CBB the best but it's been obvious for at least 3 years that he's not a good fit here despite what a few in the media have parroted (Y'all got hustled too) Constantly being told to be patient, "it was a dumpster fire", "It's coming",  "He's building it the right way" #uncommon... whilist seeing the subpar product on the field, has produced a phenomenon amongst the fans known as cognitive dissonance...which is a jedi mind f*ck for the layman. Think of an orange on the table. You know it's an orange. You have seen & tasted many in your life...but someone that you trusted is telling you, "no that's an apple, you're crazy for thinking that's an orange. How dare you". We have seen good football here folks. Sometimes great football. We have been known as a relatively classy program with fans who are known for being  passionate, patient, & generally welcoming in regards to the opposing team's fans. #WPS
That was well said. That blown lead in the Rutgers game and the mismanagement of Brandon Mitchell were just signs of things to come. I also feel like we were conned into believing that bielema was something he wasn't. He had his time in the spotlight and got his big check, but it will soon be time to pay the piper
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Razorbax on November 07, 2017, 02:03:02 pm
Why do you people always parrot bull?  That has never been what was actually said, except by the simplistic, 3 word sentence types.

Petrino left us devoid of DEPTH.  Over half of his players never saw the field at Arkansas.  They were reaches and misses and malcontents.  So they either flunked out, got arrested repeatedly, quit when they were expected to compete, or just plain sucked.  The other half were pretty good football players, and if you could avoid injury, they won games. So math is not your strong suit...With a hard 85 scholarship limit with redshirting You cannot average more than 16~18 a year in recruiting. Therefore, if you are signing 30 plus, losing close to half is required. Besides, why are yammering about depth? I saw zero problems with the depth the last 2 years under CBP. Numbers alone does not mean depth. Those numbers must include quality (Talent) for it to mean something....CBB does a better job retaining players. Do we have better quality depth? Hell, no.

As to defense, stop pretending we had some awesome D when Petrino was here.  Out of the great defenders on that 2014 team that you want to attribute to Petrino, you have Flowers and, sort of, Philon. So no Tevin Mitchel? Alonzo Highsmith? Rohan Gaines? Demarcus Hodges? Otha Peters? Taiwan Johnson? Deatrich Wise? JaMicharl Winston?  Petrino turned away Spaight. Everyone turned away Spaight out of High School....Including CBB at Wisconsin. That is why he ended up at Coffeyville. He won Flowers, an Arkansas boy, No he wasn't and he lost the recruiting for Philon, Imagine losing an Alabama boy to Alabama....... but did know to grab him when he fell in his lap. That was a negative?

Petrino also had the good fortune of the best class Arkansas has produced in about 15-20 years and then fell off consistently after that. Bull.....As CBP did say " You are making darn up" The next coach will likely get something similar, because of the depth and talent of the '19 class. You know this how?
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Razorbax on November 07, 2017, 02:06:01 pm
"The 2013 Louisville Cardinals football team represented the University of Louisville in the 2013 NCAA Division I FBS football season. The Cardinals were led by fourth-year head coach Charlie Strong. The Cardinals played their home games at Papa John's Cardinal Stadium in Louisville, Kentucky. They were in their last year as a member of the American Athletic Conference (formerly known as the Big East) until they moved to the Atlantic Coast Conference starting on July 1, 2014. They finished the season 12–1, 7–1 in American Athletic play to finish in second place. They were invited to the Russell Athletic Bowl where they defeated Miami" (FL).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Louisville_Cardinals_football_team

They were actually in the Big East during the 2012 year that he went 11-2. He beat #4 Florida to win the Sugar Bowl that season.

But it is funny how people want to belittle his record for winning in the AAC, then turn around and want Mike Norvell.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Razorbax on November 07, 2017, 02:10:28 pm
Last line makes zero sense. Pointing out the relative strength of a conference has zero congruency to the quality of coach at the respected conferences.
They were actually in the Big East during the 2012 year that he went 11-2. He beat #4 Florida to win the Sugar Bowl that season.

But it is funny how people want to belittle his record for winning in the AAC, then turn around and want Mike Norvell.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: The_Iceman on November 07, 2017, 02:24:22 pm
"The 2013 Louisville Cardinals football team represented the University of Louisville in the 2013 NCAA Division I FBS football season. The Cardinals were led by fourth-year head coach Charlie Strong. The Cardinals played their home games at Papa John's Cardinal Stadium in Louisville, Kentucky. They were in their last year as a member of the American Athletic Conference (formerly known as the Big East) until they moved to the Atlantic Coast Conference starting on July 1, 2014. They finished the season 12–1, 7–1 in American Athletic play to finish in second place. They were invited to the Russell Athletic Bowl where they defeated Miami" (FL).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Louisville_Cardinals_football_team

That's great. But if you read closer, my comment was about the 2012 team. I am fully aware the 2013 team that went 12-1 team was in the AAC.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: The_Iceman on November 07, 2017, 02:29:07 pm
Last line makes zero sense. Pointing out the relative strength of a conference has zero congruency to the quality of coach at the respected conferences.

The point is there are no guarantees. Before Mike Norvell and Chad Morris, there was Charlie Strong and Butch Jones. Sometime the hot popular name pans out. Sometimes they flame out. We don't know if Mike Norvell would succeed here. We also don't know that a coach like Gus or Sumlin who have underachieved where they are couldn't come here and pull off what Mark Richt is doing at Miami.

We just have to make the best hire we possibly can and hope it works out. But the #1 criteria we have to look at is FIT. A great coach at a bad fit will underachieve. A decent coach in a great fit can overachieve.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: 1highhog on November 07, 2017, 02:32:29 pm
Why do you people always parrot bull?  That has never been what was actually said, except by the simplistic, 3 word sentence types.

Petrino left us devoid of DEPTH.  Over half of his players never saw the field at Arkansas.  They were reaches and misses and malcontents.  So they either flunked out, got arrested repeatedly, quit when they were expected to compete, or just plain sucked.  The other half were pretty good football players, and if you could avoid injury, they won games. 

As to defense, stop pretending we had some awesome D when Petrino was here.  Out of the great defenders on that 2014 team that you want to attribute to Petrino, you have Flowers and, sort of, Philon.  Petrino turned away Spaight.  He won Flowers, an Arkansas boy, and he lost the recruiting for Philon, but did know to grab him when he fell in his lap.

Petrino also had the good fortune of the best class Arkansas has produced in about 15-20 years and then fell off consistently after that.  The next coach will likely get something similar, because of the depth and talent of the '19 class.

We sure need the "Right" Coach installed in here to get that next crop, the class of 2019 recruits that almost everyone thinks is going to be one of the best, on paper that is, that Arkansas has turned out in a long time.  Does anyone have a number on how many stud recruits we're talking about in that class that could make a difference?
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: 212hawg on November 07, 2017, 02:39:05 pm
A Wisky fan told me that we would see what we were getting when he first came here.  I always just chalked it up to sour grapes, which was easy to do at the time.  Now, I'm wondering if they were right.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: HognitiveDissonance on November 07, 2017, 02:39:31 pm
Wisconsin fans are great.  I've hung out with many of them in Vegas during March Madness.  They come out in force for their teams.  Great School and good folks.  They love beer and they can't stand "Fat Bret"(their words, not mine).  Even with all of the success they were having, it just seemed to them like Bret was Barry Alvarez's dumbass son in law running the business.  This is the prevailing theme from multiple groups of Wisky fans.  They were insulted that he would leave their program for a place like Arkansas.  But they didn't give a rat's ass that he was gone.  Their record since he has left proves their point.
Barry Alvarez = Archie Bunker
Bret Bielema = Meathead
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: majp51 on November 07, 2017, 02:44:17 pm
I been screaming it for years.  "Your not going to out bama...Bama."  CBB fatal error was not going to the spread. 

The spread isn't the solution, any more than going to the wishbone. The real solution is to focus on building a program that will consistently beat, or scare, everyone else except BAMA , and maybe Georgia. If you do that then Every once in a while you will beat BAMA too. A scholl like Arkansa aiming to build a program that can "beat Bama" is a recipe for not only not beating BAMA, but also losing to the MSU's of the world as well.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Razorbax on November 07, 2017, 02:52:48 pm
Besides for UCF and Memphis, the same conference. Again to my point, ACC is a much stronger conference. Therefore, you are not comparing apples to apples.
That's great. But if you read closer, my comment was about the 2012 team. I am fully aware the 2013 team that went 12-1 team was in the AAC.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: HognitiveDissonance on November 07, 2017, 02:52:54 pm
There are things being revealed about Bret Bielema, yes. It’s unfortunate for him because now people are doing a complete re-evaluation of him as a coach. They’re thinking, ‘we thought we knew this guy’, but are we completely wrong? But things are being revealed about Wisconsin as well.

Revelations:
1)Bielema had little to do with whatever success Wisconsin was having while he was there. The proof is that every coach after him has done as well, or better, including this year. You can credit Alvarez, or the schedule, etc. But it wasn’t really Bret.

2)Wisconsin is being revealed as a place where you can win…but are you really that good? Every coach seems to do well there. They’re always ranked very high. Yet their coaches go elsewhere and fall flat. It seems the relative ease of their division and conference is padding Wisc’s reputation. Good program? No doubt. Overrated a little? Yes.
Last weekend may be a microcosm of this point. Headline reads ‘#9 Wisconsin beats Indiana’. Yes, Indiana. Woo Hoo.


I have no doubt the main reason Bielema came here is he’s a confident guy, always full of swagger and talking a good game, and wanted to escape Alvarez’s shadow and be his own man. That was never going to happen at Wisconsin. But he apparently has run into the Peter Principle. If he loses his job, how embarrassing that must be. And also his wife for tweeting ‘Karma’ at Wisc fans. Karma, yes indeed, it’s turning again now.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: East Clintwood on November 07, 2017, 02:56:55 pm
I'm a man of simple pleasures. But among them, people making simple mistakes while calling others stupid is among the foremost.


Learned that from your days riding the short bus, huh?
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: East Clintwood on November 07, 2017, 03:09:06 pm
A Wisky fan told me that we would see what we were getting when he first came here.  I always just chalked it up to sour grapes, which was easy to do at the time.  Now, I'm wondering if they were right.


You're still wondering??
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Vantage 8 dude on November 07, 2017, 03:40:36 pm
The point is there are no guarantees. Before Mike Norvell and Chad Morris, there was Charlie Strong and Butch Jones. Sometime the hot popular name pans out. Sometimes they flame out. We don't know if Mike Norvell would succeed here. We also don't know that a coach like Gus or Sumlin who have underachieved where they are couldn't come here and pull off what Mark Richt is doing at Miami.

We just have to make the best hire we possibly can and hope it works out. But the #1 criteria we have to look at is FIT. A great coach at a bad fit will underachieve. A decent coach in a great fit can overachieve.
Very well said! Yep, very few guarantees in the coaching field. However, much of the potential success lies with finding the right fit for the particular school culture and then building on it.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: RedRock on November 07, 2017, 04:56:50 pm
Just another overpaid coach that failed. He made 20 million and here we are. Shame on us.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Ex-Trumpet on November 07, 2017, 06:03:16 pm
No, not shame on us.  When are you people going to understand it’s the market price for a P5 HC!

You people?!?!

(http://ic.pics.livejournal.com/kensmind/1278588/550369/550369_600.jpg)
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Rayzback on November 07, 2017, 06:09:05 pm
they are couldn't come here and pull off what Mark Richt is doing at Miami.

Hopefully knocking off ND and making this year interesting.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Porkchop#1 on November 07, 2017, 06:16:29 pm
HEY This is the worst coach in HISTORY.   Everyone knows this now, even him.  What are y'all debating?   The guy made millions doing a job that he has NO IDEA how to do. 

That's all there is to it.
And sadly, that pretty much sums it up.  The rudderless, good ship Bielema just drifting along and taking on water.

It has been a complete joke.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: PygmalionEffect2 on November 07, 2017, 06:29:38 pm
Although very few of us on here would have realized it at the time,

looking back over CBB's tenure here, I'm starting to think the Cheney situation (either failing to keep him or being run off by Bielema), that to me is possibly the biggest mistake he made.

This is assuming Cheney's dismissal is connected to Pitman's departure a year later to join him at Georgia.


Makes me want to be extra careful in placing blame on assistant coaches when it's difficult sometimes really knowing who is at fault, other than ultimately the buck always stops with the HC.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: sickboy on November 07, 2017, 06:31:35 pm
I think CBB got desperate after losing nearly his entire staff...he made some bad hires and lost his identity- now he is just a puddle of pudding. He's got nothing....no redshirt program, no depth, no power- he lost his Wisky identity and now is just treading water trying not to drown.

I agree with this.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: nwahogfan1 on November 07, 2017, 06:33:00 pm
This opinion is actually wrong. Bielemas problem is he didn't stick to developing the biggest and baddest offensive line. His lines got soft. Year 3 was our best roster, and his failure as a coach in preparing the team at the beginning of the year cost us. As we saw at the end, that team was talented enough to win 10 games.

I agree.  But was it because he made too many recruiting mistakes or he just could not attract the OLM he needed?    Maybe little of both but your right the OL and DL recruiting blunders did hurt.  But also he never signed pure athletes in the secondary or LBers.  He never could sustain a SEC quality defense.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: JOKERHOG on November 07, 2017, 08:33:26 pm
I didn't like the hire, but I bought in after CBB's introductory press conference.
 Fast forward to the first game of the Bielema era. When we came out in that ridiculous JUMBO Big Ten package in which  the lineman & TE are packed in tight (there may have been one WR split wide) I just had a gut feeling that this wasn't going to work. We all know the SEC has the best defensive lineman. The power, speed, & overall athleticism these D-lineman posess at their size... let's say 6'4 285lbs give or take a few...is world class. Once doesn't run into many humans that possess all those attributes in one body. I knew that if we relied on that philosophy which is unapologetically vanilla with some play action thrown in... We were f*cksville.
That Rutgers game in Jersey really scared me.  CBB mismanaged it for sure & the pattern would be repeated often. The handling of the QB situation has been the strangest thing I've ever seen. First of all Brandon Mitchell, who had been here for like 7 years, was not given his fair shot. I thought CBB was all about the Upperclassmen getting the benefit of the doubt and being rewarded for their hard work? Then he anointed Brandon Allen starter for life. Competition is good. Hells bells at the very least I feel like sometimes it is good for a QB to take a few series off to watch from the sideline. A good QB will learn from that.
We got hustled courtesy of Jeff Long's half-ass coaching search. Perhaps if JL would have done a more thorough job in researching all the variables & vetting CBB we wouldn't be here now. I wish CBB the best but it's been obvious for at least 3 years that he's not a good fit here despite what a few in the media have parroted (Y'all got hustled too) Constantly being told to be patient, "it was a dumpster fire", "It's coming",  "He's building it the right way" #uncommon... whilist seeing the subpar product on the field, has produced a phenomenon amongst the fans known as cognitive dissonance...which is a jedi mind f*ck for the layman. Think of an orange on the table. You know it's an orange. You have seen & tasted many in your life...but someone that you trusted is telling you, "no that's an apple, you're crazy for thinking that's an orange. How dare you". We have seen good football here folks. Sometimes great football. We have been known as a relatively classy program with fans who are known for being  passionate, patient, & generally welcoming in regards to the opposing team's fans. #WPS

I was pissed when he was hired and knew he was an "orange".  This has been allow to go on WAY TOO LOOONG!
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: East Clintwood on November 07, 2017, 08:35:58 pm
No, not shame on us.  When are you people going to understand it’s the market price for a P5 HC!


No, it's the market price for a top 15 P5 HC.


What we have is a Bottom 15 HC.  He's extremely overpaid.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: HognitiveDissonance on November 09, 2017, 11:48:42 am
Although very few of us on here would have realized it at the time,

looking back over CBB's tenure here, I'm starting to think the Cheney situation (either failing to keep him or being run off by Bielema), that to me is possibly the biggest mistake he made.

This is assuming Cheney's dismissal is connected to Pitman's departure a year later to join him at Georgia.


Makes me want to be extra careful in placing blame on assistant coaches when it's difficult sometimes really knowing who is at fault, other than ultimately the buck always stops with the HC.
I agree that the failure of the O-line in 2016 and 2017 has been the biggest issue.
The O-line in 2015 was fantastic. Great run game, and only allowed 8 sacks all year.

So if you trace the steps back as you say, Pittman left in 2015, and it's been in shambles ever since.
And Pittman's departure was tied to him being miffed that his friend Chaney was let go.
I think Enos was a slight upgrade over Chaney, but that's how the cookie crumbled.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: carolinahogger on November 09, 2017, 12:15:06 pm
His problem is not alignment or formations or philosophy. His team is soft. His team is gutless. He went the wrong direction when he started making players change numbers because they played too rough.

Agreed.  Bielema lacks attention to detail and tries to be buddies with his players.  Ask any new Marine Corps second lieutenant how that will work out.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: BallHog1 on November 09, 2017, 03:49:17 pm
The closest we ever got to beating Bama was when we tried to out-bama them. 14-13 .
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: HognitiveDissonance on November 09, 2017, 11:21:15 pm

One game doesn't prove anything.

We also had them beat in 2010, with a different style.

It's one year. one game. It's not a pattern.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: hogginbama on November 10, 2017, 08:15:28 am
How could a coach as experienced as Bielema not envision this disagreement between the different schemes?  Maybe if he had prepared the fanbase foe a transition there wouldn't be such an uproar right now. 

If you look at the younger linemen, they have the ability to block for the scheme that Enos likes to run. I think the transition to Enos after Chaney/Pittman left was because BB realized he couldn't recruit well enough to go man on man with Alabama. Realized he needed a different offensive scheme, chose Enos and has to recruit offensive players to fit that scheme.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: hogginbama on November 10, 2017, 08:25:27 am
I envy Whiskey the past 20 years.

In the past 20 years they have had ten 10+ win seasons, with 6 coming since 2006. In 16 seasons Alvarez had 4 ten win seasons, but most hovered between 7-9 wins. It took Alvarez 16 yrs to put a system in place, get the type of players coming in and developed that has made them successful at their level. As the AD, he was smart enough to hire coaches who would continue the system that was in place, while adding just a few of their own wrinkles. The type of player and overall scheme is the same that Alvarez started and it has worked for them.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Boss Hog in the Arkansas on November 10, 2017, 09:44:17 am
I agree that the failure of the O-line in 2016 and 2017 has been the biggest issue.
The O-line in 2015 was fantastic. Great run game, and only allowed 8 sacks all year.

So if you trace the steps back as you say, Pittman left in 2015, and it's been in shambles ever since.
And Pittman's departure was tied to him being miffed that his friend Chaney was let go.
I think Enos was a slight upgrade over Chaney, but that's how the cookie crumbled.
Enos was an upgrade if you're going to more of a spread offense. A spread OC and a pro style OL Coach was never going to work. We complained about Jim Chaneys play calling and some of the dumb trick plays he would dial up at the worst possible time....but Chaney has been gone for a while and we're still doing thoe same trick plays.....and chaneys team is #1 in the country....apparently we let go of the wrong guy
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: HognitiveDissonance on November 12, 2017, 09:50:35 pm
Georgia is not #1 (got drilled by Auburn yesterday) BECAUSE of Jim Chaney. That's faulty logic.
Is he a good coach? I think so.
Is he contributing to UGA's season? Yes.
The sum of the parts at Georgia, who nearly always has had more overall talent 1 thru 85 than Arkansas, is greater than the sum of the parts at Arkansas. That's why they got to #1. Not because of one player, one coach, or one anything.
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: Boss Hog in the Arkansas on November 12, 2017, 10:30:04 pm
Georgia is not #1 (got drilled by Auburn yesterday) BECAUSE of Jim Chaney. That's faulty logic.
Is he a good coach? I think so.
Is he contributing to UGA's season? Yes.
The sum of the parts at Georgia, who nearly always has had more overall talent 1 thru 85 than Arkansas, is greater than the sum of the parts at Arkansas. That's why they got to #1. Not because of one player, one coach, or one anything.
Youve been waiting for Georgia to lose so you could come post this havent you? No one here said UGA was #1 BECAUSE of chaney. You also said they got to #1 because of the sum of all parts and not just 1 person, so isnt the opposite also true? Jim Chaney may have had some fault in the loss, but to say he is THE reason they lost is a bit asinine
Title: Re: I Talked To A Wisconsin Fan
Post by: HognitiveDissonance on November 13, 2017, 11:49:46 pm
Youve been waiting for Georgia to lose so you could come post this havent you? No one here said UGA was #1 BECAUSE of chaney. You also said they got to #1 because of the sum of all parts and not just 1 person, so isnt the opposite also true? Jim Chaney may have had some fault in the loss, but to say he is THE reason they lost is a bit asinine
Waiting for UGA to lose? Hardly. I don't keep up with them.

The comment earlier was that since UGA was #1 and they had Chaney, and Arkansas was nowhere near #1 and they had Enos, that Arkansas made the wrong choice in letting Chaney go and hiring Enos. That's exactly what was said. That is strained logic, and I stand by that statement. There are too many other things that go into that.

No one said Chaney was the reason they lost Saturday.