Arkansas 34 Ole Miss + Curls 30

[Kevin]

I would like for the rules to tighten up on all the movement the offensive lineman are aloud pre snap

I think it should be once you take a stance whether hand on the ground our not, you should not be able to move.

[bpoecell]

I would like for the rules to tighten up on all the movement the offensive lineman are aloud pre snap

I think it should be once you take a stance whether hand on the ground our not, you should not be able to move.

Definitely. With the spread you have linemen setting, then standing up to look at the sideline every play, then gesturing and pointing the rest of the time. Either crack down on the constant movement, or do away with the false start altogether.

[SemperFi]

Mark Curles and his crews are horrible. The Sprinkle PI call was bad, but the facemask take down of Austin Allen was such a flagrant foul with the only intention to cause serious injury that #9 for Ole Piss should have been tossed out of the game. There were too many bad calls and missed late hit calls by Ole Piss with the Ref's in close proximity to call it anything else, but gross negligence. Best football conference in all of college football with the absolute worst officiating. What a joke!

[Kevin]

ole miss is a dirty team.

the hit on Cantrell out of bounds

skipper hit in the back after the play

the two hits they put on Austin after his knee hit the ground.

[PonderinHog]

He who laughs last either doesn't get the joke, or laughs best!   :razorback:

[onebadrubi]

The fact remains, Wise didn't make contact, so what he did was legal.

Not exactly, if wise moves into the neutral zone causing the Olineman to move then it is still on the defense. 

[ABM]

It was the correct call.  Sorry if you all have moved on but watch the right tackle, he moves.  The guards movement is him tapping the center to let him know to snap the ball.

[onebadrubi]

I would like for the rules to tighten up on all the movement the offensive lineman are aloud pre snap

I think it should be once you take a stance whether hand on the ground our not, you should not be able to move.

I would just settle for them calling damn O lineman down field.

[Kevin]

I would just settle for them calling damn O lineman down field.

that is another one

[factchecker]

you've got still shots that don't show the correct play or the correct moment on the play. I've got the game DVRd and they show the exact moment that Dean was lined up on top of the ESPN black line indicating the line of scrimmage.

Not my still shots.  It was on twitter so I thought I would share.

I have no doubt that Dean was off-sides but the tweet demonstrates that Ole Miss was offsides all night w/o penalty.

[GolfnHog]

Not my still shots.  It was on twitter so I thought I would share.

I have no doubt that Dean was off-sides but the tweet demonstrates that Ole Miss was offsides all night w/o penalty.

I was screaming all night about the OM DL lining up in the NZ and being there at the snap so the still shots confirm what I was seeing. That infraction continued even after they called DJD for it.

I realize mistakes are going to be made but the historical data on Curles and his crew validates a lot of the bitching and moaning on the lack of consistency and objectivity.

[upperdeck_hawg]

It was the correct call.  Sorry if you all have moved on but watch the right tackle, he moves.  The guards movement is him tapping the center to let him know to snap the ball.

It wasn't the correct call. They called a false start on 67. 67 is the tackle that jumped in reaction to Wise moving into the neutral zone. We caught a break. The refs were not out to get us. They just suck.

[YtownHog]

I dont think the bad calls were intentional. The offsides on Dean was a good call. They gave us one at the end there when Wise clearly caused their lineman to move. That 5 yards made the difference in Kelley needing 16 yards instead of 11 yards.

This is false I watched the replay again and the lineman clearly flinched before Wise jumped.  It was the correct call.  The flinch is verily slight but it did happen.

[Dominicanhog]

We have won every game in the last two years in which Curles was the head official.

Just goes to show.. had he not been suspended before, we'd probably have lost all of those games..

[upperdeck_hawg]

This is false I watched the replay again and the lineman clearly flinched before Wise jumped.  It was the correct call.  The flinch is verily slight but it did happen.

still doesn't explain the conspiracy theorists that say the refs were out to get us. if they were, they would have ignored it or called it on wise. why march another 5 yards against the team you're trying to help win?

[hogsanity]

still doesn't explain the conspiracy theorists that say the refs were out to get us. if they were, they would have ignored it or called it on wise. why march another 5 yards against the team you're trying to help win?

there are some who do not think the Hogs have ever lost a game without being cheated. They think every call made against the Hogs is motivated by some desire at the sec office for the hogs to lose every game and that the league protects every team except the Hogs. IT is the red headed step child attitude that permeates this state in every area, from sports to business to academics.

[PonderinHog]

still doesn't explain the conspiracy theorists that say the refs were out to get us. if they were, they would have ignored it or called it on wise. why march another 5 yards against the team you're trying to help win?

They screwed up and got one right?

[hogpc]

This is false I watched the replay again and the lineman clearly flinched before Wise jumped.  It was the correct call.  The flinch is verily slight but it did happen.

I watched the replay multiple times in slow motion on a 72 inch HD screen - the guard did not flinch and cause our guy to move.  The guard pointed to his left with his arm, which is allowed, but certainly did not flinch or jump at all.  What the guard did is done on practically every play by offensive lineman. 

Once our lineman jumped into the neutral zone their tackle jumped back, but it was caused by our guy.  The penalty clearly should have been on Arkansas.  Instead of 4th and 16 they should have had 4th and 6.  We caught a serious break! The refs were bad - several bad calls and several missed calls, including this one.  They clearly missed the call, but it went in our favor.

[rljjr]

It wasn't the correct call. They called a false start on 67. 67 is the tackle that jumped in reaction to Wise moving into the neutral zone. We caught a break. The refs were not out to get us. They just suck.

Go look again. He flinched first and that caused us to jump. The correct call was made.

[southarkhog06]

Go look again. He flinched first and that caused us to jump. The correct call was made.

what I think is confusing people is that they are looking for a "flinch" what the tackle did was more of a "lurch" he kinda shifts his weight onto his right heel, its not easy to see but it does happen.

[Hoggish1]

When fans complain about the officials it's usually after a loss

Wrong, wrong, wrong...  I have watch a lot of Hog vs SEC and they are always giving us the shaft.

[hogmolar]

Not sure if mentioned but how about the defensive offsides call when Ellis got the interception.  Who was offside? No number was announced and no flag could be seen on the field.  Plus the call came really late. 

[PonderinHog]

Not sure if mentioned but how about the defensive offsides call when Ellis got the interception.  Who was offside? No number was announced and no flag could be seen on the field.  Plus the call came really late.

One of our DB's was lined up in the neutral zone.

[hawgfan4life]

hmmmmm, name calling? That will surely make you look smart and mature.

Makes him look like a Preident candidate this year.

[Sir Oinksalot]

...there were so many bad calls against us and so many no calls which should have been penalties in the oM game it's clearly ref. bias......this game was one of the worse screw jobs I've ever seen.  Sure they have to even it up a little. But OM didn't get way ahead as hoped so it made their job more difficult ...

The coaches must be telling them to not give up to the crooked refs.

[ABM]

what I think is confusing people is that they are looking for a "flinch" what the tackle did was more of a "lurch" he kinda shifts his weight onto his right heel, its not easy to see but it does happen.

Maybe this will help.  The right tackle moves first.  It is ever so slight but it is there.

https://j.gifs.com/1jY42q.gif

[hogpc]

Maybe this will help.  The right tackle moves first.  It is ever so slight but it is there.

https://j.gifs.com/1jY42q.gif

Not sure where you got you're video, but, it does not match what's on my DVR...

[ABM]

Not sure where you got you're video, but, it does not match what's on my DVR...

Youtube, SEC Nation page.  The whole game is there.  I just broke out the play in question to a gif.

So do you agree that the tackle moved?

[hogsanity]

Youtube, SEC Nation page.  The whole game is there.  I just broke out the play in question to a gif.

So do you agree that the tackle moved?

looks to me like the tackle rocks back and the guard moves forward and slightly to the left.

[hogpc]

Youtube, SEC Nation page.  The whole game is there.  I just broke out the play in question to a gif.

So do you agree that the tackle moved?

No, I don't agree that the tackle moved. The video you post has been altered from the original, no question about that. Look at the movement of the players, it is much faster than live action.

[ABM]

No, I don't agree that the tackle moved. The video you post has been altered from the original, no question about that. Look at the movement of the players, it is much faster than live action.

This will be my last effort.

The right tackle flexes his right leg before Wise moves.

It is not a video it is a gif.  And of course I altered it.  I cut out about Two hours 34 mins and 48 seconds of video so you could see the play in question.  That is the only alteration I made.  I did not speed anyone up or speed up only the right tackle.

If you want to watch the whole thing I linked it above.  I also added some time to the gif below so it doesn't look quite as jumpy.

[hogpc]

This will be my last effort.

The right tackle flexes his right leg before Wise moves.

It is not a video it is a gif.  And of course I altered it.  I cut out about Two hours 34 mins and 48 seconds of video so you could see the play in question.  That is the only alteration I made.  I did not speed anyone up or speed up only the right tackle.

If you want to watch the whole thing I linked it above.  I also added some time to the gif below so it doesn't look quite as jumpy.

Glad it's your last attempt - what you posted is moving much faster than the actual game.  Look at the hand movements of the QB, the head movement of the center and the hand signal by the right guard. Compare those to the actual game and you see a significant difference. Whether intentional or not, the increased speed in what you posted changes the appearance of what the tackle did.  When you look at it in real time HD on a big screen, not what you posted, it is evident the tackle didn't move.

[Hawgar The Horrible]

No, I don't agree that the tackle moved. The video you post has been altered from the original, no question about that. Look at the movement of the players, it is much faster than live action.

Quit looking for Waldo and pay attention to the tackle leaning back in his stance.

[hogpc]

Quit looking for Waldo and pay attention to the tackle leaning back in his stance.

I'm relying on my big screen HD TV, not the gif he posted, which isn't the same. I only pointed out the hand signals etc to make my point that the gif is not the same as the actual game.

[Großer Kriegschwein]

I'm relying on my big screen HD TV, not the gif he posted, which isn't the same. I only pointed out the hand signals etc to make my point that the gif is not the same as the actual game.

The tackle reacted to the corner, the defensive end reacted to the tackle.

False start.

[southarkhog06]

has it really come down to posters that are hog fans being so obsessed with being intellectually superior that they are now accusing other fans of doctoring game footage?

SMDH.

[hawgfan4life]

Need a new HD tv because yours is not working very good.  I thought it was a gift until my DVR and replay demonstrated the OL moved. 

[fishes2000]

How about the kickoff return for touchdown that got overturned. If every touchdown wasn't reviewed it would have stood. there was a referee in front and behind the runner and neither one ruled him out of bounds. The facemask on Hatcher on the third down play in fourth qtr. spun his head around no call. I hope we don't get the same crew this weekend and especially for the florida  game.

[hogpc]

has it really come down to posters that are hog fans being so obsessed with being intellectually superior that they are now accusing other fans of doctoring game footage?

SMDH.

I never said he doctored the footage, only that the gif is in a different speed then the actual game. IMO, that speed difference casts a different light on what actually happened.

[hogginbama]

I never said he doctored the footage, only that the gif is in a different speed then the actual game. IMO, that speed difference casts a different light on what actually happened.

How can it cast a different light on what happened? Movement of any type by the OL, regardless of how slight, is a false start. The gif only enhances that ever so slight bit of movement. It is okay to be wrong every now and then.

[hogsanity]

How about the kickoff return for touchdown that got overturned. If every touchdown wasn't reviewed it would have stood. there was a referee in front and behind the runner and neither one ruled him out of bounds. The facemask on Hatcher on the third down play in fourth qtr. spun his head around no call. I hope we don't get the same crew this weekend and especially for the florida  game.

I hope we get the same crew because reading all the conspiracy theories is so much fun.

BTW, you say neither official ruled the runner out of bounds, you do know only one of them is watching the feet, and there is a lot of traffic on a sideline run like that so it is very possible the official watching the feet could not see it. Also, they are taught to let it play out unless they are positive the runner is out of bounds.

[BearsBisonsBoars]

Who is going to replace them? There are not enough d1 officials to go around now, let alone if several crews quit being used. The umpire in the Bama game was a fill in on that crew, and his highest level of work before this season was far below the sec.

Money can fix this problem, and the SEC has plenty of it.

[hogsanity]

Money can fix this problem, and the SEC has plenty of it.

again, the sec can afford the money, but what about the mt west, the mac, all the fcs leagues, d2, d3, naia, juco? And it is not just money. You have to be able to convince guys to make that their job, which means that for 9 months a year you are not calling games.

[BearsBisonsBoars]

again, the sec can afford the money, but what about the mt west, the mac, all the fcs leagues, d2, d3, naia, juco? And it is not just money. You have to be able to convince guys to make that their job, which means that for 9 months a year you are not calling games.

You'd pay them all year and make reffing a full time job. Their duties in the off season would be to hone their craft. This would be akin to how schools handle teachers, if you need a comparison. (Just paid more, but that's a conversation for /Politics) Pay them enough, and have standards to match, and talent will come.

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make by bringing up G5 and lower conferences. Let them keep their current PT model if that's what fits their budgets/needs. This discussion is about how the SEC handles its refs.

[hogsanity]

You'd pay them all year and make reffing a full time job. Their duties in the off season would be to hone their craft. This would be akin to how schools handle teachers, if you need a comparison. (Just paid more, but that's a conversation for /Politics) Pay them enough, and have standards to match, and talent will come.

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make by bringing up G5 and lower conferences. Let them keep their current PT model if that's what fits their budgets/needs. This discussion is about how the SEC handles its refs.

Hone their craft for 9 months of the off season? While teachers have to go to continuing ed, it is not 9 months worth. How much do you think officials can learn from clinics and film study? Nothing is going to come close to simulating game conditions.

It is also not like baseball or basketball, where there are games year around. Football is pretty much dead, at least on field, from Jan-August.

As for bringing up other leagues, it is a domino effect. If the sec hires 10 crews total, that's 80 guys, supposedly at the top of the chain, that now might call in other leagues that no longer are available.

[BearsBisonsBoars]

Hone their craft for 9 months of the off season? While teachers have to go to continuing ed, it is not 9 months worth. How much do you think officials can learn from clinics and film study? Nothing is going to come close to simulating game conditions.

It is also not like baseball or basketball, where there are games year around. Football is pretty much dead, at least on field, from Jan-August.

As for bringing up other leagues, it is a domino effect. If the sec hires 10 crews total, that's 80 guys, supposedly at the top of the chain, that now might call in other leagues that no longer are available.

I think you're stuck in the freelance ref crew paradigm. I'm talking about hiring 90-100 people who are now employees of the conference. They are put though an extensive training process during the offseason even if they have experience and are rotated through each school's spring and fall camps to get hands-on experience. Then they ref the season.

Term the ones who did a bad job during the year, hire their replacements, rinse and repeat. Sure, there will be a lot of down time, but who cares? We're paying them to ref the season, not for whatever they're doing in May. As long as they show up ready to go, let them have that time.

[hogsanity]

I think you're stuck in the freelance ref crew paradigm. I'm talking about hiring 90-100 people who are now employees of the conference. They are put though an extensive training process during the offseason even if they have experience and are rotated through each school's spring and fall camps to get hands-on experience. Then they ref the season.

Term the ones who did a bad job during the year, hire their replacements, rinse and repeat. Sure, there will be a lot of down time, but who cares? We're paying them to ref the season, not for whatever they're doing in May. As long as they show up ready to go, let them have that time.

It will take 10 years, minimum, to get the 1st crew in this program on a sec field. 10 years to hire 25 years olds ( because they are the only ones who will give up their days jobs/benefits to sign on for this ) train them, and have them sec ready. Which means 10 years of paying someone with no return on your investment.

[BearsBisonsBoars]

It will take 10 years, minimum, to get the 1st crew in this program on a sec field. 10 years to hire 25 years olds ( because they are the only ones who will give up their days jobs/benefits to sign on for this ) train them, and have them sec ready. Which means 10 years of paying someone with no return on your investment.

Where are you getting your 10 year figure?

[hogsanity]

Where are you getting your 10 year figure?

How long do you think the average official is a official before he starts working college games, much less sec games? Do you think they are going to go to a few clinics, work a few practices/scrimmages and be sec ready? There is a reason the average age of p5 officials is 50 or so, it takes a long time to get the game experience needed to work at that level.

[BearsBisonsBoars]

How long do you think the average official is a official before he starts working college games, much less sec games? Do you think they are going to go to a few clinics, work a few practices/scrimmages and be sec ready? There is a reason the average age of p5 officials is 50 or so, it takes a long time to get the game experience needed to work at that level.

But are they learning the craft 40-50 hours a week, five days a week during that time?

You can get prepared for the CCNA with a two week intensive boot camp. I have to believe that a seven month intensive program could get someone at least close to ready to ref in the SEC.

I'm not saying that the first year or two wouldn't be shaky, but I think it would help solve a long term problem.

edit: heck, you could even graduate the pay scale. So newbies with no experience get very little pay as they're going through camp, then they get entry level pay during and after their first year, sloping up to very nice pay as they get experience.