What if

[Prestworthy]

The hogs finish with just (3) 4* LOI's in February?  How will you react?

[onebadrubi]

I'll be excited to see the hogs play in the upcoming season just as I would be after any signing class!

[Prestworthy]

I'll be excited to see the hogs play in the upcoming season just as I would be after any signing class!

All of us will still be excited....but back to my question -

[HardingHog]

It depends on how we finish. If we end up with 3 4 stars, but finish with: J'Marrick Woods, Thomas Johnston, Justin Thomas, and a couple other solid 3 stars then I'll be happy with the way the class turned out. I like what we have right now, but I'm interested to see the way we finish out this class

[Prestworthy]

It depends on how we finish. If we end up with 3 4 stars, but finish with: J'Marrick Woods, Thomas Johnston, Justin Thomas, and a couple other solid 3 stars then I'll be happy with the way the class turned out. I like what we have right now, but I'm interested to see the way we finish out this class

Thanks for answering the question.

[razorhog52]

We will say we don't recruit when we lose and say we develop when we when.

[southeasthog]

The hogs finish with just (3) 4* LOI's in February?  How will you react?

My reaction is that we beat Ole Miss so Prestworthy can't make snide sarcastic posts in MMQ so he comes to the recruiting forum to try and stir "stuff".

[Prestworthy]

My reaction is that we beat Ole Miss so Prestworthy can't make snide sarcastic posts in MMQ so he comes to the recruiting forum to try and stir "stuff".

I guess you don't have an answer either? Why did you post in here?

[Hawghiggs]

We will say we don't recruit when we lose and say we develop when we when.

When?

[presidenthog]

The hogs finish with just (3) 4* LOI's in February?  How will you react?

Will feel like we need to step up our recruiting game. Sorry I know very rarely you can find diamonds in the 3 star area who play well above that moniker but time has shown stars do matter and where your recruiting ranking is on signing day matters as well. Anyone who says I'm wrong is just trying to make themselves feel better. I do not believe stars are the end all be all, but I do know that they do matter A LOT.

[southeasthog]

I guess you don't have an answer either? Why did you post in here?

An answer to what? A stupid what if scenario to get posters to say we should fire Bielema because he can't recruit? Here's an answer:

247 final rankings.

Arkansas:
2013---#23
2014---#29
2015---#23
2016---#23

Ole Miss:
2013---#4
2014---#15
2015---#17
2016---#5


We are 3-1 against them in that time frame. But I know none of that matters to you and all your "realist" brothers.

All long as we are improving our record every year, the recruiting will get better.

[fullfan]

^^^^^^^^^^^^
Thread over!

[wildhogman]

An answer to what? A stupid what if scenario to get posters to say we should fire Bielema because he can't recruit? Here's an answer:

247 final rankings.

Arkansas:
2013---#23
2014---#29
2015---#23
2016---#23

Ole Miss:
2013---#4
2014---#15
2015---#17
2016---#5


We are 3-1 against them in that time frame. But I know none of that matters to you and all your "realist" brothers.

All long as we are improving our record every year, the recruiting will get better.

Well considering most experts say/claim that the big uglies usually don't garner much attention(stars) unless ofcourse their one of a handful who could play immediately.  This makes sense. It was obvious OM had WR's and a QB with swag. But their O-line suffered somewhat in the game. On the other side, our O-line seems to finally be coming together and the RB's and TE's and such are finally getting it that they too have to block or atleast chip away. So yeah, long as we keep improving I'll take our recruiting and intelligence in picking up a complicated pro system that is hard to defend when ran with great execution over Freeze's and malazhan's systems that high school kids can come in and learn the offense and start as freshmen

[onebadrubi]

All of us will still be excited....but back to my question -

I answered your stupid petty trolling question. That is how I will react. It's stupid to come in here and make the comments you and others make in the months of Feb, Mar, and Apr about kids that just signed and you know absolutely nothing about.  And now you want to take the stupid a next step further and predict the outcome to setup your petty trolljob of us now out recruiting bama? 

You are clamoring for attention in a bad way prestworthy. 

[trphog]

An answer to what? A stupid what if scenario to get posters to say we should fire Bielema because he can't recruit? Here's an answer:

247 final rankings.

Arkansas:
2013---#23
2014---#29
2015---#23
2016---#23

Ole Miss:
2013---#4
2014---#15
2015---#17
2016---#5


We are 3-1 against them in that time frame. But I know none of that matters to you and all your "realist" brothers.

All long as we are improving our record every year, the recruiting will get better.

Is the end game goal to beat Ole Miss or win championships? Why don't you show Texas A&M & Bama's recruiting rankings compared to ours?

[southeasthog]

Is the end game goal to beat Ole Miss or win championships? Why don't you show Texas A&M & Bama's recruiting rankings compared to ours?

The end goal is to get better every year and win Championships. So far we have gotten better every year. It remains to be seen about the other. Our recruiting is the same as it always has been. So Bama and A&M are higher than ours too. I posted Ole Miss because Prestworthy posts a bunch after losses but this was after a win so he started a stupid what if. But go ahead and get on the negative bandwagon with them if you want.

[trphog]

The end goal is to get better every year and win Championships. So far we have gotten better every year. It remains to be seen about the other. Our recruiting is the same as it always has been. So Bama and A&M are higher than ours too. I posted Ole Miss because Prestworthy posts a bunch after losses but this was after a win so he started a stupid what if. But go ahead and get on the negative bandwagon with them if you want.

I'm not being negative. I am being real. I don't bash coaches or recruits. The truth is no team has won a BCS championship without having at least one top 10 recruiting class.

[King Kong]

That's pretty much what I expect.

I think we need to recruit at a higher level regarding stars. But I also realize kids that commit super early sometimes are undervalued as they are not as attractive to recruiting sites.

[Prestworthy]

I'm not being negative. I am being real. I don't bash coaches or recruits. The truth is no team has won a BCS championship without having at least one top 10 recruiting class.

I'm with you.  If the hogs want to compete at a high level year in and year out, they have to recruit the 4/5* kids and sign them.  Depth will allow them to plug and play like the big boys.

[Prestworthy]

So what is the solution?  Gotta hire guys that are proven recruiters, AND change the philosophy around recruiting.  I think CBB prides himself on recruiting the little guy and coaching him up to play in the SEC, but they need guys that are good enough to come in as true freshmen and be difference-makers.

[Hawgar The Horrible]

I'm not being negative. I am being real. I don't bash coaches or recruits. The truth is no team has won a BCS championship without having at least one top 10 recruiting class.

Want to know how many times Arkansas has finished with a Top 10 recruiting class? ZERO. Zip, zilch, notta'.

Want to know how many times Arkansas had won an undisputed National Championship? ZERO. Zip, zilch, notta'.

There's some realism for you. So quit acting like those things should be commonplace at Arkansas. It would take Saban a lifetime to make it happen.

[Prestworthy]

Want to know how many times Arkansas has finished with a Top 10 recruiting class? ZERO. Zip, zilch, notta'.

Want to know how many times Arkansas had won an undisputed National Championship? ZERO. Zip, zilch, notta'.

There's some realism for you. So quit acting like those things should be commonplace at Arkansas. It would take Saban a lifetime to make it happen.

If Clemson can somehow become a great program and recruit well, so can Arkansas.  It just takes the right coaching staff and right strategy/philosophy.

Edit: Btw, Clemson doesn't have a ton of talent in SC, so they recruit FL, GA, and NC really well. 

[Hawgar The Horrible]

If Clemson can somehow become a great program and recruit well, so can Arkansas.  It just takes the right coaching staff and right strategy/philosophy.

WRONG. You can throw a rock from Clemson, SC and not miss hitting a Blue Chip in the head.

[East TN HAWG]

I'm not being negative. I am being real. I don't bash coaches or recruits. The truth is no team has won a BCS championship without having at least one top 10 recruiting class.

+1.  You are right.  When CBB took over, we had no where to go but up.  It was one of the low points in our rich history.  He is has rolled his selves up and is building a sustainable program.  However, with 20 something recruiting, there is a ceiling.  Unfortunately, that is probably somewhere on top of the second tier in the SEC which is an area we have not sustained in our time in the SEC. 

I think CBB is our best bet to get over the hump. 

[Prestworthy]

WRONG. You can throw a rock from Clemson, SC and not miss hitting a Blue Chip in the head.

You need to go back through their commit lists and see where they are getting their players...

[Hawgar The Horrible]

You need to go back through their commit lists and see where they are getting their players...

You need to learn some critical thinking. Take some math or something.

This is the class responsible for making them a household name. Count the number of players from SC alone. Much less NC and GA.

http://clemson.247sports.com/Season/2011-Football/Commits

[Prestworthy]

You need to learn some critical thinking. Take some math or something.

This is the class responsible for making them a household name. Count the number of players from SC alone. Much less NC and GA.

http://clemson.247sports.com/Season/2011-Football/Commits

LOL of the (9) 4* and 5* recruits they signed, only 2 were from SC.  All (3) 5* recruits were from out of state.

I can't wait to see your rebuttal to this.

[Hawgar The Horrible]

LOL of the (9) 4* and 5* recruits they signed, only 2 were from SC.  All (3) 5* recruits were from out of state.

Like I said. 23 players on that list within a rocks throw. And Florida is not a stretch from Clemson. More in-state D1 recruits that single year than Arkansas produces in 5.

LOL indeed.

[Prestworthy]

Like I said. 23 players on that list within a rocks throw. And Florida is not a stretch from Clemson. More in-state D1 recruits that single year than Arkansas produces in 5.

LOL indeed.

Nice reach...the best players they signed were not from SC.  And the FL players were 7+ hours away.

Not to mention the VA recruits, who were 4.5 hours away.

But that doesn't fit your narrative!  So ignore.

[Hawgar The Horrible]

Nice reach...the best players they signed were not from SC.  And the FL players were 7+ hours away.

Not to mention the VA recruits, who were 4.5 hours away.

But that doesn't fit your narrative!  So ignore.

How far is VA and FL from Fayetteville? For that matter, how many P5 prospects (forget about the 4 and 5 star studs you clamor for) are within 4.5 hours of Fayetteville any given year?

Math, buddy.

[Prestworthy]

How far is VA and FL from Fayetteville? For that matter, how many P5 prospects (forget about the 4 and 5 star studs you clamor for) are within 4.5 hours of Fayetteville any given year?

Math, buddy.

That's geography, not math.  And if recruits are willing to leave the state and go to a school 4.5+ hours away, the school's location relative to home isn't that big of a deal.  To further my point, Arkansas' current class has only 1 player from the state (4 hours away from UA) in its top 5, and the next 4 best players are from AZ, Memphis, AL, and IL.  Want me to continue?

[Hawgar The Horrible]

That's geography, not math.  And if recruits are willing to leave the state and go to a school 4.5+ hours away, the school's location relative to home isn't that big of a deal.  To further my point, Arkansas' current class has only 1 player from the state (4 hours away from UA), and the next 4 best players are from AZ, Memphis, AL, and IL.  Want me to continue?

You're obviously new to this recruiting thing because you don't know what in the HAIL you're talking about. Unless you mean to say Arkansas has to scratch and claw for recruits all over the place because there's not enough nearby talent. In which case you would be correct. Thanks for making my point.

[ricepig]

What if they changed the rating to all of our signees to 4*, would that make them any better players? I believe PIP says 8?? different commits rate a 4* on some service, would that matter?

[Prestworthy]

You're obviously new to this recruiting thing because you don't know what in the HAIL you're talking about. Unless you mean to say Arkansas has to scratch and claw for recruits all over the place because there's not enough nearby talent. In which case you would be correct. Thanks for making my point.

THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT CLEMSON DID IN 2011

[greenie]

A thread like this pops up about once a month, and we hear the same thing:  we need to improve our recruiting because you can't get the big wins without it.  I have a couple of comments:

Certainly, better recruiting helps.  No one really argues with that.

Can we win the SEC or NC without a top 10 recruiting class?  No one knows for sure.  History says it's unlikely, but history is re-written everyday.

It would be great if the proponents of "better recruiting" would share with us how we should do this, or what mistakes the current staff is making?  I know that there are a few insiders on this board that might be able to answer this question with veracity, but most are just repeating similar assertions: "we need to go after better recruits", "we need to do what Ole Miss is doing", "quite focusing on the boy scouts", ... all of which are empty comments.  I think the reason we don't hear *how* to improve recruiting is because it's very hard to answer, which makes for great message board Kung Fu fights.

JMHO...Happy Thursday to everyone and GO HOGS!

[Hawgar The Horrible]

THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT CLEMSON DID IN 2011

WRONG once again. You're on a roll.

What Clemson did was sign 14 players from within the State, 7 from bordering States, and picked up some dandy's not that far away.

[ricepig]

A thread like this pops up about once a month, and we hear the same thing:  we need to improve our recruiting because you can't get the big wins without it.  I have a couple of comments:

Certainly, better recruiting helps.  No one really argues with that.

Can we win the SEC or NC without a top 10 recruiting class?  No one knows for sure.  History says it's unlikely, but history is re-written everyday.

It would be great if the proponents of "better recruiting" would share with us how we should do this, or what mistakes the current staff is making?  I know that there are a few insiders on this board that might be able to answer this question with veracity, but most are just repeating similar assertions: "we need to go after better recruits", "we need to do what Ole Miss is doing", "quite focusing on the boy scouts", ... all of which are empty comments.  I think the reason we don't hear *how* to improve recruiting is because it's very hard to answer, which makes for great message board Kung Fu fights.

JMHO...Happy Thursday to everyone and GO HOGS!

Oh, they have no idea how to help, it's just hard to fire the coach after a win. So, you go after recruiting since it's an easy and subjective target.

[Hawgar The Horrible]

Oh, they have no idea how to help, it's just hard to fire the coach after a win. So, you go after recruiting since it's an easy and subjective target.

You're suggesting there are people coming in here with an agenda?  **gasp**

[Prestworthy]

WRONG once again. You're on a roll.

What Clemson did was sign 14 players from within the State, 7 from bordering States, and picked up some dandy's not that far away.

Aaaaannnnnddd only (2) of the SC players were 4* or 5*.  Yeah, West Palm Beach, St. Augustine, and Punta Gorda are just a "stone's throw" away....

By the way, they're doing it again this year.  Guess how many of their (11) 4*/5* players are from SC??

[SemperFi]

So what is the solution?  Gotta hire guys that are proven recruiters, AND change the philosophy around recruiting.  I think CBB prides himself on recruiting the little guy and coaching him up to play in the SEC, but they need guys that are good enough to come in as true freshmen and be difference-makers.

CBB's approach is building a program for the long term. If you want to see the short term approach then look at Ole Miss and as it's been pointed out the Hogs are 3-1 against them since he's been our Head Hog. Do we need better recruiting, absolutely. However, development of a player far out weighs what someone thinks of him as a HS Senior. No, we do not need a team full of kids that as true freshmen can start replacing the players that have been in the program for 2 and 3 years. That just means that you've failed miserably at the development of your current roster. Bama might be three deep with 5 star talent, but Coach B has gone toe to toe with Bama the last 3 years with his 3 star talent. Development of these kids is what will allow us to dethrone Bama.

[Hawgar The Horrible]

Aaaaannnnnddd only (2) of the SC players were 4* or 5*.  Yeah, West Palm Beach, St. Augustine, and Punta Gorda are just a "stone's throw" away....

By the way, they're doing it again this year.  Guess how many of their (11) 4*/5* players are from SC??

Just stop before you hurt yourself. Of course they're recruiting better and better each year. They're also winning now.

But screw all that, let's address your real motive for this thread. And that is...you want CBB gone.

Name a guy that will accept the position of Head Coach of the Arkansas Razorbacks after the previous guy showed steady improvement each year, ran a clean program, graduated his players and was beloved by the majority of fans. And don't forget to explain how THAT is going to improve recruiting while you're at it.

[Prestworthy]

Just stop before you hurt yourself. Of course they're recruiting better and better each year. They're also winning now.

But screw all that, let's address your real motive for this thread. And that is...you want CBB gone.

Name a guy that will accept the position of Head Coach of the Arkansas Razorbacks after the previous guy showed steady improvement each year, ran a clean program, graduated his players and was beloved by the majority of fans. And don't forget to explain how THAT is going to improve recruiting while you're at it.

There ya go - divert to putting words in my mouth that I've never said.  Ever.

Just be a man and admit you were incorrect in your argument, and we can move forward.

[Hawgar The Horrible]

There ya go - divert to putting words in my mouth that I've never said.  Ever.

Just be a man and admit you were incorrect in your argument, and we can move forward.

No, we're not moving forward because I've read your damn book more than once.

Stop the trolling and answer the question you originally posed. How are you going to react?

[justmakeit2thebcs]

The hogs finish with just (3) 4* LOI's in February?  How will you react?

I won't be disappointed if that is what you reaching for, stargazer. 

[Prestworthy]

No, we're not moving forward because I've read your damn book more than once.

Stop the trolling and answer the question you originally posed. How are you going to react?

Reported your language.

I think I've given plenty of reaction to the question.  Finishing with just (3) 4* recruits would probably put Arkansas at #12 in the SEC, thus limiting their potential to compete with Bama, aTm, LSU, and Auburn.  Recruiting approach, strategy, and philosophy all need to be changed, or the hogs will remain 3rd or 4th in the West.  CBB is a cool story (walk-on to All-Conference) but its the exception.  I wish CBB would address this and make recruiting a higher priority.  That may mean hiring guys who are proven recruiters.

[Hawgar The Horrible]

Reported your language.

I think I've given plenty of reaction to the question.  Finishing with just (3) 4* recruits would probably put Arkansas at #12 in the SEC, thus limiting their potential to compete with Bama, aTm, LSU, and Auburn.  Recruiting approach, strategy, and philosophy all need to be changed, or the hogs will remain 3rd or 4th in the West.  CBB is a cool story (walk-on to All-Conference) but its the exception.  I wish CBB would address this and make recruiting a higher priority.  That may mean hiring guys who are proven recruiters.

Iiiiiii see. Change something is your answer. You don't know what, but change something. Brilliant.

[Prestworthy]

Iiiiiii see. Change something is your answer. You don't know what, but change something. Brilliant.

That's like saying, "you can't question a coach unless you can coach better than him..."  Biggest change: hire proven recruiters.

[HotlantaHog]

Will be more interested in how the recruiting ranks overall ... If Hogs team recruiting ranking is say 40 nationally, everyone will totally freak out .... guaranteed. ... if it is in the 20-25 area, people will be generally ok with it.

[Hawgar The Horrible]

That's like saying, "you can't question a coach unless you can coach better than him..."  Biggest change: hire proven recruiters.

No, that's saying you don't have a clue what their approaches, strategies and philosophies are, but you think there's a better solution although no Razorback staff has performed better at recruiting.

[Prestworthy]

No, that's saying you don't have a clue what their approaches, strategies and philosophies are, but you think there's a better solution although no Razorback staff has performed better at recruiting.

Maybe not, but we all have seen what they are producing...which needs changing.  And I noticed you didn't speak to my main point....