Raising Arkansas

[Fan1958]

If he can get the Little Rock schools reinvigorated, that alone would produce another 2-5 high level D1 talents per year which presumably we could be a first choice for in recruiting.

You are correct but unfortunately not likely to happen in the next 20 years. The total enrollment in the five high schools in the LRSD is 6,950. Assuming 45% are males, that leaves roughly 3100 candidates to play football.  The last I checked, the total football participation for the 5 schools was approximately 300.  That's less than 10% of the male enrollment.  JA Fair's (home of Cedric Cobbs) numbers dropped so low a couple years ago they had to forfeit several games.  That's a school with a total enrollment of 1,170.  They couldn't get 20 kids to play football.

The public school in Pulaski County producing the most athletes (for UA anyway) is Pulaski Robinson, which is a Pulaski County district school. The others in the LR area are from the private schools.

The coach at the UA has no influence over what happens in the LRSD.  The LRSD made a conscious decision to kill athletics (FB anyway) in the mid 80s and it has shown.  When was the last time the University of Arkansas signed a kid from LR Central?  They missed on one or two (Charles Clay comes to mind) several years back but there are NO FB players being produced for the high D1 level in the LRSD.

[#1 STUNNA]

Yeah, Stuttgart use to send a few up every few years, but haven't had one in forever that I can remember. Has there been anyone since Bo Busby from Monticello??

In 09 monticello sent one to ole miss. New coach should help monticello athletes a ton.

[ricepig]

In 09 monticello sent one to ole miss. New coach should help monticello athletes a ton.

Yeah, but he wasn't a can't miss type of guy.

[12247]

Hogo, fine thread, great job.

Muskogee, One way the Broyles era and even moreso the Holtz era assisted the Arkansas schools was scheduling several talks, speaches in the schools throughout the school year.  I remember Holtz came to our school and the speech wasn't all about football as much as encouraging all school Kids in leadership.  Of course, football was the real reason but even someone who didn't live football would have gotten a good message.  Parents and Area Leaders were welcome and the thought process that he would take the time to come to us, shake hands, break bread, offer a funny and yet serious speech was priceless.  ONE OF HOLTZ FUNNIES:  I guarantee you we will move the ball at Arkansas, and I pray to God, its forward.  And yes, he was mumbly back then too.

One of the problems facing Kids today is Parents who really just don't care. And if they care, they may encourage their child to avoid football due to the injury scare.  Meeting a person like Holtz just might be the tiny difference in a blue-chip basketball or baseball player getting into football.  I am sure that the schools and local coaches enjoy someone from THE UNIVERSITY giving of themselves to come to their school and give a speech.  Though the Coach might of had nothing to do with bringing the Arkansas HC there, most of the locals will just believe he did, thus raising his stature within the hood.  It is human nature for us humans to want to be a part of something and families love finding mentors who might really have the Kids in mind.  And yeah, there is likely 50 parents wanting Coach to see the video of their Kid running a 6 second flat 40 time to go with that one Kid who covers that space in 4.3 and has superior hand/eye coordination, plays center field from foul line to foul line, bats .650, hits towering homeruns, cannot be thrown out when base stealing and is dying to play football and nwt that Mom has met Chad, her Kid is going to get to go out for football.  This really happens but it starts with staff really caring and being willing to give of their time, not only for a possible blue-chip but to give a darn about the Kid who can't run but is inspired by the speech and goes on to get an education and become the best Mayor the town has ever had.

[hogsanity]

Hogo, fine thread, great job.

Muskogee, One way the Broyles era and even moreso the Holtz era assisted the Arkansas schools was scheduling several talks, speaches in the schools throughout the school year.  I remember Holtz came to our school and the speech wasn't all about football as much as encouraging all school Kids in leadership.  Of course, football was the real reason but even someone who didn't live football would have gotten a good message.  Parents and Area Leaders were welcome and the thought process that he would take the time to come to us, shake hands, break bread, offer a funny and yet serious speech was priceless.  ONE OF HOLTZ FUNNIES:  I guarantee you we will move the ball at Arkansas, and I pray to God, its forward.  And yes, he was mumbly back then too.

One of the problems facing Kids today is Parents who really just don't care. And if they care, they may encourage their child to avoid football due to the injury scare.  Meeting a person like Holtz just might be the tiny difference in a blue-chip basketball or baseball player getting into football.  I am sure that the schools and local coaches enjoy someone from THE UNIVERSITY giving of themselves to come to their school and give a speech.  Though the Coach might of had nothing to do with bringing the Arkansas HC there, most of the locals will just believe he did, thus raising his stature within the hood.  It is human nature for us humans to want to be a part of something and families love finding mentors who might really have the Kids in mind.  And yeah, there is likely 50 parents wanting Coach to see the video of their Kid running a 6 second flat 40 time to go with that one Kid who covers that space in 4.3 and has superior hand/eye coordination, plays center field from foul line to foul line, bats .650, hits towering homeruns, cannot be thrown out when base stealing and is dying to play football and nwt that Mom has met Chad, her Kid is going to get to go out for football.  This really happens but it starts with staff really caring and being willing to give of their time, not only for a possible blue-chip but to give a darn about the Kid who can't run but is inspired by the speech and goes on to get an education and become the best Mayor the town has ever had.

Yet one of the knocks on Holtz was not recruiting in state.

And the kid in your description, with all that baseball talent, but he should risk that to go play football? That's crazy. That kid should go in the draft right out of HS and cash a 7 figure signing bonus check.

I do agree with your statement about parents not caring. I am not sure I would use caring actually, but they do not want to make the time commitment it takes for a child to compete in sports. Practices take time, games take time. I have been involved in youth baseball leagues for 15 years and I have seen t get worse and worse every year. All the time we hear stuff like " We would play but we dont want to play on Saturdays cause we like to go ( insert place here )". "We can't make practices" " We have cross fit 4 nights a week " " And a dozen other things the PARENTS do not want to give up so their kid can play baseball. But the one that frightens me the most " We just don't think competitive sports is good for kids " I had a lady tell me that a couple years ago and I literally spit what I was drinking I was so taken aback by it.

[Cinco de Hogo]

People dance around this all the time, but yea, demographics has a lot to do with it. Our AA population is about 450k. Bama has 1.25 mil. Louisiana 1.5mil. Ga has as many AA's as Arkansas has total population. Fla 2.9mil. Tn 1mil. Mizzu 700k. SC 1.3mil.

There have been studies of the # of d1 football players and where they come from, and there is no doubt, the higher the AA population the higher the rate of d1 players.

Goodness Hogsanity we ain't trying to supply half the world with players, most on this thread would be ecstatic if we could just up our in state haul by 3-5 players per year.

Is that impossible?

[#1 STUNNA]

Yeah, but he wasn't a can't miss type of guy.

Nope. Not sure if he even was offered by the hogs. Just stating he was the last SEC level player from them.

[Cinco de Hogo]

In the last ten years Greenwood with a population of about 10,000 has sent 2 QB's, a WR, a Kicker, and a LBer to Arkansas and they haven't been run of the mill players, they have either started or have good potential to start.

Fort Smith, just 10 miles away with a population of 80,000 plus has provided nothing.   It's not genes it the community, but most of all it's the coach the community hires.  Who you hire or CAN hire based on commitment is very important.

[DeltaBoy]

The Bottom is  Coaching

[#1 STUNNA]

In the last ten years Greenwood with a population of about 10,000 has sent 2 QB's, a WR, a Kicker, and a LBer to Arkansas and they haven't been run of the mill players, they have either started or have good potential to start.

Fort Smith, just 10 miles away with a population of 80,000 plus has provided nothing.   It's not genes it the community, but most of all it's the coach the community hires.  Who you hire or CAN hire based on commitment is very important.

Bingo!!! Look at Warren now... Look at Warren before Hembree... same can be said about quite a few schools.

[ricepig]

In the last ten years Greenwood with a population of about 10,000 has sent 2 QB's, a WR, a Kicker, and a LBer to Arkansas and they haven't been run of the mill players, they have either started or have good potential to start.

Fort Smith, just 10 miles away with a population of 80,000 plus has provided nothing.   It's not genes it the community, but most of all it's the coach the community hires.  Who you hire or CAN hire based on commitment is very important.

And finding a "good" high school coach is few and far between. As to GW, part of their school district is inside the FS city limits.

[12247]

I realize times have changed from those long ago years.  But the small school I attended, there was a half dozen Kids that didn't play sports that would have been as good or better than those of us who did.  Usually it was no leadership at home.  No encouragement.  Seeing a coach from the lead instate University could be a difference maker back then.  I promise you there are more players in Arkansas than we are seeing but I would offer that is true in every state. Broyles used instate players because every Kid back then bled Razorback red.  Your dream school was THE UNIVERSITY.  You might be the #1 QB in Arkansas but you would just love to come play Safety for the Hogs.

[Cinco de Hogo]

And finding a "good" high school coach is few and far between. As to GW, part of their school district is inside the FS city limits.

Yea but wouldn't the "good genes" according to Hogsanity be on the other side of town?  I don't think Greenwood benifits enough to logically overcome 8-1.

[Cinco de Hogo]

I realize times have changed from those long ago years.  But the small school I attended, there was a half dozen Kids that didn't play sports that would have been as good or better than those of us who did.  Usually it was no leadership at home.  No encouragement.  Seeing a coach from the lead instate University could be a difference maker back then.  I promise you there are more players in Arkansas than we are seeing but I would offer that is true in every state. Broyles used instate players because every Kid back then bled Razorback red.  Your dream school was THE UNIVERSITY.  You might be the #1 QB in Arkansas but you would just love to come play Safety for the Hogs.

One thing has changed for sure, those farm tough kids are getting fewer and fewer.  Nowadays it's all training in a lab like setting.  We are producing test tube athletes!

[ricepig]

Yea but wouldn't the "good genes" according to Hogsanity be on the other side of town?  I don't think Greenwood benifits enough to logically overcome 8-1.

Probably been some walkons from FS, too.

[bphi11ips]

And finding a "good" high school coach is few and far between. As to GW, part of their school district is inside the FS city limits.

It's not just the high school coach. It's the system feeding the high school with players who have been playing football for years already and the community emphasizing and supporting games and the sport itself. All of those factors were at work in Little Rock in the 70s when it produced a ton of D1 talent.

Well organized youth football can't be overemphasized. It starts in middle Tennessee and all over the South at 5.  I personally think 7 is about right. That's when it started in Little Rock in the 70s. Kids here have often played five years or more before they hit middle school. Not all daddies are great coaches, but a lot are. The kids who could block, tackle, run, catch, throw, and kick when they were 10 are the same kids who star for high school teams in middle Tennessee. One of those is Jackson Hannah, who was in Fayetteville for Junior Day this past weekend. He's the kid in a photo posted in another thread with John Chavis where they're pointing at each other. The first time I saw Jack he was probably no more than 8. He was already a football player.

A friend of mine from Little Rock told me about 8 or 10 years ago that Little Rock did not have organized youth football. I couldn't believe it. He was looking into starting an 8-man league.

The reason Texas produces so much talent is because football starts early for kids and ends with Friday Night Lights being something they've pointed to since they were very young. Same thing in Florida. I spoke with Max Thurman last December just before UCA hired him as defensive coordinator. I was telling him how well organized youth football is here. Communities play other communities. Cheerleaders, PA announcers, concessions, etc., are all part of it. Hundreds of people are at the parks watching on Saturday mornings. Max said that his son played in Florida, where it's the same way, but teams are organized by feeder schools to middle and high school, so the same kids stay together from when they start until they play their last Friday night game. Rivalries start at an early age. Coaching systems are introduced early. High school coaches hold clinics to educate the volunteers below on everything from fundamentals to their own systems.

It's not genes. Arkansas's demographics aren't the problem. We don't share our population with a P5 competitor. What we don't do as well as we could is create an environment where kids become passionate about the game early and develop sound fundamentals and skills. When we do that, the players will be there. It doesn't take as much money as it does a community of volunteers who care.

[LZH]

Yeah, Stuttgart use to send a few up every few years, but haven't had one in forever that I can remember. Has there been anyone since Bo Busby from Monticello??

Tough to get the best athletes out of Monticello....UAM is recruiting like a mofo.

[ricepig]

Well, more and more organizations are talking about delaying "tackle" football for older kids, some say even 7th/8th grades. I don't know what the correct age is for them to play, I've got no problem with 4th graders playing tackle football. As to the community supporting it, you've answered your own question concerning LR, there isn't enough interest. Now, every dad thinks he has the next LeBron and has an AAU basketball team, while the others start an USSSA baseball team.

[bphi11ips]

Well, more and more organizations are talking about delaying "tackle" football for older kids, some say even 7th/8th grades. I don't know what the correct age is for them to play, I've got no problem with 4th graders playing tackle football. As to the community supporting it, you've answered your own question concerning LR, there isn't enough interest. Now, every dad thinks he has the next LeBron and has an AAU basketball team, while the others start an USSSA baseball team.

Maybe there is more interest in Little Rock than you think. It used to be there. People change, but not much.

[ricepig]

Maybe there is more interest in Little Rock than you think. It used to be there. People change, but not much.

I guess I'll go by the past trend. I don't think they have 7th/8th grade football?? I'm sure someone will correct me, but I remember hearing from some high school coaches complaining about a lack of a feeder system to their schools.

[#1 STUNNA]

It's not just the high school coach. It's the system feeding the high school with players who have been playing football for years already and the community emphasizing and supporting games and the sport itself. All of those factors were at work in Little Rock in the 70s when it produced a ton of D1 talent.

Well organized youth football can't be overemphasized. It starts in middle Tennessee and all over the South at 5.  I personally think 7 is about right. That's when it started in Little Rock in the 70s. Kids here have often played five years or more before they hit middle school. Not all daddies are great coaches, but a lot are. The kids who could block, tackle, run, catch, throw, and kick when they were 10 are the same kids who star for high school teams in middle Tennessee. One of those is Jackson Hannah, who was in Fayetteville for Junior Day this past weekend. He's the kid in a photo posted in another thread with John Chavis where they're pointing at each other. The first time I saw Jack he was probably no more than 8. He was already a football player.

A friend of mine from Little Rock told me about 8 or 10 years ago that Little Rock did not have organized youth football. I couldn't believe it. He was looking into starting an 8-man league.

The reason Texas produces so much talent is because football starts early for kids and ends with Friday Night Lights being something they've pointed to since they were very young. Same thing in Florida. I spoke with Max Thurman last December just before UCA hired him as defensive coordinator. I was telling him how well organized youth football is here. Communities play other communities. Cheerleaders, PA announcers, concessions, etc., are all part of it. Hundreds of people are at the parks watching on Saturday mornings. Max said that his son played in Florida, where it's the same way, but teams are organized by feeder schools to middle and high school, so the same kids stay together from when they start until they play their last Friday night game. Rivalries start at an early age. Coaching systems are introduced early. High school coaches hold clinics to educate the volunteers below on everything from fundamentals to their own systems.

It's not genes. Arkansas's demographics aren't the problem. We don't share our population with a P5 competitor. What we don't do as well as we could is create an environment where kids become passionate about the game early and develop sound fundamentals and skills. When we do that, the players will be there. It doesn't take as much money as it does a community of volunteers who care.

some schools in Arkansas have this... just not enough.

[Hogs-n-Roses]

It’s not just the high school coach. It’s the system feeding the high school with players who have been playing football for years already and the community emphasizing and supporting games and the sport itself. All of those factors were at work in Little Rock in the 70s when it produced a ton of D1 talent.

Well organized youth football can’t be overemphasized. It starts in middle Tennessee and all over the South at 5.  I personally think 7 is about right. That’s when it started in Little Rock in the 70s. Kids here have often played five years or more before they hit middle school. Not all daddies are great coaches, but a lot are. The kids who could block, tackle, run, catch, throw, and kick when they were 10 are the same kids who star for high school teams in middle Tennessee. One of those is Jackson Hannah, who was in Fayetteville for Junior Day this past weekend. He’s the kid in a photo posted in another thread with John Chavis where they’re pointing at each other. The first time I saw Jack he was probably no more than 8. He was already a football player.

A friend of mine from Little Rock told me about 8 or 10 years ago that Little Rock did not have organized youth football. I couldn’t believe it. He was looking into starting an 8-man league.

The reason Texas produces so much talent is because football starts early for kids and ends with Friday Night Lights being something they’ve pointed to since they were very young. Same thing in Florida. I spoke with Max Thurman last December just before UCA hired him as defensive coordinator. I was telling him how well organized youth football is here. Communities play other communities. Cheerleaders, PA announcers, concessions, etc., are all part of it. Hundreds of people are at the parks watching on Saturday mornings. Max said that his son played in Florida, where it’s the same way, but teams are organized by feeder schools to middle and high school, so the same kids stay together from when they start until they play their last Friday night game. Rivalries start at an early age. Coaching systems are introduced early. High school coaches hold clinics to educate the volunteers below on everything from fundamentals to their own systems.

It’s not genes. Arkansas’s demographics aren’t the problem. We don’t share our population with a P5 competitor. What we don’t do as well as we could is create an environment where kids become passionate about the game early and develop sound fundamentals and skills. When we do that, the players will be there. It doesn’t take as much money as it does a community of volunteers who care.

You sir, get it. nice post.

[chenalhog]

If he can get the Little Rock schools reinvigorated, that alone would produce another 2-5 high level D1 talents per year which presumably we could be a first choice for in recruiting.

good luck with that

[bphi11ips]

I guess I'll go by the past trend. I don't think they have 7th/8th grade football?? I'm sure someone will correct me, but I remember hearing from some high school coaches complaining about a lack of a feeder system to their schools.

Really?  Not even middle school football?  That's nuts.  No wonder football in the LRSD is in such sad shape. 

The losers are the kids whose lives could be changed by football.  Case in point - I played at Hall with George Hall, Jr.  I have no idea what he is doing now, but he was a great football player and a really nice guy. His dad, George, Sr., was the long-time cook in the pool grill at Little Rock Country Club.  Everyone loved George, Sr., but to put it bluntly, he was a victim of discrimination and segregation.   George, Jr. went to Arkansas on a football scholarship, where I believe he was an All-SWC nose tackle on Lou Holtz teams.  Other players from Hall who went to college on scholarship at that time were Gary Woods and Leslie O'Neal.  I think Gary went to Arkansas first and transferred to Tulsa.  Everyone knows Leslie went to Oklahoma State and was an All-Pro with the San Diego Chargers. 

College football scholarships have changed minority lives all over the United States for generations.  Other than the Civil Rights Act of 1964, I believe athletic scholarships have had a greater positive impact on equality for African Americans in this country than perhaps any other factor.  Not only have scholarships provided college educations for many like George Hall, Jr., who probably wouldn't have been able to afford Fayetteville on his own, college athletics have provided the training grounds for thousands of African Americans who now occupy executive positions all over the country.  Cities like Atlanta and Jacksonville, Florida have thriving middle and upper-middle class African American communities that have developed in large part through college educations originally provided by athletic scholarships.  Those communities are now perpetuating education in newer generations.  Athletics is no longer necessary to pull children out of poverty and provide college educations.

I may be up on a soap box a bit here, but quality athletic programs in public schools is an important issue, and that's not limited to football.   

[ricepig]

Really?  Not even middle school football?  That's nuts.  No wonder football in the LRSD is in such sad shape. 

The losers are the kids whose lives could be changed by football.  Case in point - I played at Hall with George Hall, Jr.  I have no idea what he is doing now, but he was a great football player and a really nice guy. His dad, George, Sr., was the long-time cook in the pool grill at Little Rock Country Club.  Everyone loved George, Sr., but to put it bluntly, he was a victim of discrimination and segregation.   George, Jr. went to Arkansas on a football scholarship, where I believe he was an All-SWC nose tackle on Lou Holtz teams.  Other players from Hall who went to college on scholarship at that time were Gary Woods and Leslie O'Neal.  I think Gary went to Arkansas first and transferred to Tulsa.  Everyone knows Leslie went to Oklahoma State and was an All-Pro with the San Diego Chargers. 

College football scholarships have changed minority lives all over the United States for generations.  Other than the Civil Rights Act of 1964, I believe athletic scholarships have had a greater positive impact on equality for African Americans in this country than perhaps any other factor.  Not only have scholarships provided college educations for many like George Hall, Jr., who probably wouldn't have been able to afford Fayetteville on his own, college athletics have provided the training grounds for thousands of African Americans who now occupy executive positions all over the country.  Cities like Atlanta and Jacksonville, Florida have thriving middle and upper-middle class African American communities that have developed in large part through college educations originally provided by athletic scholarships.  Those communities are now perpetuating education in newer generations.  Athletics is no longer necessary to pull children out of poverty and provide college educations.

I may be up on a soap box a bit here, but quality athletic programs in public schools is an important issue, and that's not limited to football.   

Well, I did a little searching and it appears they do have middle school football, so I stand corrected. I do remember some coaches talking about not having direct feeder schools to the high schools. I know that's important to installing your system the Jr. Highs here in town run the same offense and defense as the Sr high does. I remember when my oldest was a 9th grader, during the spring and summer they worked on a spread offense as the coach was going to it at the high school. Anyway, something happened during the late summer and we went back to the wishbone which he had run for years. Needless to say, after another 3 win seasons he was replaced.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

It's not just the high school coach. It's the system feeding the high school with players who have been playing football for years already and the community emphasizing and supporting games and the sport itself. All of those factors were at work in Little Rock in the 70s when it produced a ton of D1 talent.

Well organized youth football can't be overemphasized. It starts in middle Tennessee and all over the South at 5.  I personally think 7 is about right. That's when it started in Little Rock in the 70s. Kids here have often played five years or more before they hit middle school. Not all daddies are great coaches, but a lot are. The kids who could block, tackle, run, catch, throw, and kick when they were 10 are the same kids who star for high school teams in middle Tennessee. One of those is Jackson Hannah, who was in Fayetteville for Junior Day this past weekend. He's the kid in a photo posted in another thread with John Chavis where they're pointing at each other. The first time I saw Jack he was probably no more than 8. He was already a football player.

A friend of mine from Little Rock told me about 8 or 10 years ago that Little Rock did not have organized youth football. I couldn't believe it. He was looking into starting an 8-man league.

The reason Texas produces so much talent is because football starts early for kids and ends with Friday Night Lights being something they've pointed to since they were very young. Same thing in Florida. I spoke with Max Thurman last December just before UCA hired him as defensive coordinator. I was telling him how well organized youth football is here. Communities play other communities. Cheerleaders, PA announcers, concessions, etc., are all part of it. Hundreds of people are at the parks watching on Saturday mornings. Max said that his son played in Florida, where it's the same way, but teams are organized by feeder schools to middle and high school, so the same kids stay together from when they start until they play their last Friday night game. Rivalries start at an early age. Coaching systems are introduced early. High school coaches hold clinics to educate the volunteers below on everything from fundamentals to their own systems.

It's not genes. Arkansas's demographics aren't the problem. We don't share our population with a P5 competitor. What we don't do as well as we could is create an environment where kids become passionate about the game early and develop sound fundamentals and skills. When we do that, the players will be there. It doesn't take as much money as it does a community of volunteers who care.

There is a lot of truth in this post.

When I started playing ball in Muskogee, OK as a kid, you weren't supposed to be able to start playing organized tackle football until the 4th grade. Because of my size at the time, I started with a waiver in the 3rd grade, so did a lot of other kids. Many of us played four years through the 6th grade and then they did away with 7th grade football in (what was then) Jr. High, so we played another year on our "club teams". There was one club team for each Jr. High in town at the time so we had 3 teams with 30-40 kids on each team.

My eternal thanks to all those volunteer coaches who dedicated their free time after work and on Saturday mornings to coach and still other time to raise funds to help support our programs so we had equipment and uniforms. Parents paid some, but the community businesses paid the lion's share to help provide the funds we needed to be able to exist. As much as I hate to use any phrase that Hillary Clinton has ever used, it did indeed, "take a village".

As a result we were not only able to play each other, but to play out of town teams as well and most of the time, Tulsa area teams. They had even more kids on their teams and a lot more talent as I recall. But we held our own and performed well, which built a ready pipeline of talent to feed the 8th and 9th grade Jr. High teams and then the High School teams.

Had it not been for the faithful dedication of many a private citizen, parents and community business owners, we might not have had the opportunity to develop into the players that we became in HS. After my Senior year of HS we had 10 players sign scholarship offers. I truly believe that none of that would have happened if not for the efforts of a great many people who provided us with the opportunity to play and develop at much younger ages.

And yes, the HS coaching staff was present pretty often, helping the coaches, teaching, training them, making sure we were learning the same schemes that were being taught at the HS level.

We never saw a college coach. They were busy and when in town they were visiting the HS's, looking for talent. Did they help the HS coaches? Probably some, but mostly looking for talent, and it was the community that helped develop that talent through their funding of our programs.

[bphi11ips]

There is a lot of truth in this post.

When I started playing ball in Muskogee, OK as a kid, you weren't supposed to be able to start playing organized tackle football until the 4th grade. Because of my size at the time, I started with a waiver in the 3rd grade, so did a lot of other kids. Many of us played four years through the 6th grade and then they did away with 7th grade football in (what was then) Jr. High, so we played another year on our "club teams". There was one club team for each Jr. High in town at the time so we had 3 teams with 30-40 kids on each team.

My eternal thanks to all those volunteer coaches who dedicated their free time after work and on Saturday mornings to coach and still other time to raise funds to help support our programs so we had equipment and uniforms. Parents paid some, but the community businesses paid the lion's share to help provide the funds we needed to be able to exist. As much as I hate to use any phrase that Hillary Clinton has ever used, it did indeed, "take a village".

As a result we were not only able to play each other, but to play out of town teams as well and most of the time, Tulsa area teams. They had even more kids on their teams and a lot more talent as I recall. But we held our own and performed well, which built a ready pipeline of talent to feed the 8th and 9th grade Jr. High teams and then the High School teams.

Had it not been for the faithful dedication of many a private citizen, parents and community business owners, we might not have had the opportunity to develop into the players that we became in HS. After my Senior year of HS we had 10 players sign scholarship offers. I truly believe that none of that would have happened if not for the efforts of a great many people who provided us with the opportunity to play and develop at much younger ages.

And yes, the HS coaching staff was present pretty often, helping the coaches, teaching, training them, making sure we were learning the same schemes that were being taught at the HS level.

We never saw a college coach. They were busy and when in town they were visiting the HS's, looking for talent. Did they help the HS coaches? Probably some, but mostly looking for talent, and it was the community that helped develop that talent through their funding of our programs.

Thanks for adding your experience, Muskogee. I truly believe the key to returning great football to communities all over Arkansas starts at the grass roots level. Will football itself survive the current assault on it at all levels? I hope so, because I truly believe it does far more good than harm.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Thanks for adding your experience, Muskogee. I truly believe the key to returning great football to communities all over Arkansas starts at the grass roots level. Will football itself survive the current assault on it at all levels? I hope so, because I truly believe it does far more good than harm.

I agree. It doesn't start at the University level, it begins with the commitment within the communities themselves. If they don't want it, it will never work anyway because they are the ones who have to sustain the programs even if given a hand up to begin with.

[The Kig]

I refuse to disparage Bret Bielema.  He needed to go, and he's gone.  The 5-year Bret Bielema Era is behind us.  The Chad Morris Era has begun.  I have high hopes for a substantial upswing in Razorback football fortunes under the leadership of Coach Morris, and my focus is on the here and now.  I truly believe that our overall football fortunes will substantially improve under Coach Morris; - - not instantaneously, in all likelihood, - - - -  but hopefully in a steadily-progressing success ratio.

I believe wholeheartedly that Coach Morris & Staff are deserving of my full, unconditional support in the kickoff of this new era; - - -and they have it without reservation.


                                                      Woo

                                                       Pig

                                                       SOOIE!!!!!!!

I hope Morris wins every game and he is the guy that can raise the program where I honestly believe it can be under the right leadership.  Very few Hog coaches have worked with HS coaches to develop a talent pipeline.  Petrino, who some here still idolize, got lucky with some exceptional talent, but otherwise ignored Arkansas HS.

One thing the Bielema era taught me though  was to cautiously sip my kool-aid.  I was drinking it by the gallon at times... predicting 9, 10 and more win seasons. 

So I reserve all the "amazing" talk about a coach who has yet to win a single game.  Bielema did some amazing things that didn't translate to the only area that truly mattered...Wins/Losses.  I saw many of those now bashing Bielema at the same kool-aid fountain. 

Morris is doing all the right things now.  None of that will matter one iota if we don't win... and soon, not in 5 years.

[#1 STUNNA]

Winning in my opinion solves everything. If you win... they will come. Would be interested to see how schools were before they got their top notch coaches, and how they are after they get their guy.

[hogsanity]

I agree. It doesn't start at the University level, it begins with the commitment within the communities themselves. If they don't want it, it will never work anyway because they are the ones who have to sustain the programs even if given a hand up to begin with.

But the same things that hinder AR HS teams because of small school size hinders this community development too. There is good youth football in many cities and towns, but, just like Hs, it seems to be focused in areas like NWA. I call in a youth league in my area that covers parts of 3 counties. And it is no coincidence that the communities involved tend to go on to be the ones that win their HS conferences or at least challenge, year after year. But there are also some smaller towns that field teams and it is just sad to see how they are being coached and how they are unorganized. One team did not even have a tee for kickoffs.

[bphi11ips]

I want to add a bit to what I said above about youth football in middle Tennessee.  As of this morning, Richard Davenport has reported on five players from the area who visited for Junior Day.  All are from areas where the Tennessee Youth Football Alliance is a big part of local communities.  Joseph Anderson, Adonis Otey and Trey Knox are from Murfreesboro.  Murfreesboro produces some of the best youth football teams in the mid-state region year after year.  Jackson Hannah is from Brentwood and was a star in the Brentwood Blaze program.  I'm not sure where Lance Wilhoite is from, but he plays for Franklin Road Academy, which is just north of Brentwood in Nashville.  I didn't watch all of these players grow up the way I did Jack Hannah, but I'd be surprised if every one of them didn't start TYFA at an early age. 

I'd also be surprised if almost all of those athletes weren't a part of National Playmakers Academy.  NPA is an organization started by former Tennessee DB Buck Fitzgerald.  It is a great organization that trains local high school athletes with college potential and shepherds them through the camp and recruiting process.  In many respects, organizations like NPA have become as important as high school coaches in attracting interest from college teams.  They are especially influential in elite camps and recruiting ratings.  For example, Cole Mabry credits NPA as having been key in his offer from Notre Dame.  My son Matthew was involved as a DB, but not as a kicker.  He could have played at the D1 level somewhere as a DB or slot receiver, and NPA would have been a key had he wanted to pursue that route.

This really is an important subject for Arkansas football players in areas without strong youth football.  If central Arkansas doesn't have something as well developed as TYFA and NPA, they need it.  Below are links to each organization.  I have relationships with leaders in both.  If anyone here has an interest in finding out how you can learn more and in starting something in your own community, pm me.  I am not only happy to help but am willing to spend some time to get things started.  Arkansas is long overdue for this.

http://leagues.bluesombrero.com/tnyfl/home

https://nationalplaymakersacademy.com/

[hogsanity]

I want to add a bit to what I said above about youth football in middle Tennessee.  As of this morning, Richard Davenport has reported on five players from the area who visited for Junior Day.  All are from areas where the Tennessee Youth Football Alliance is a big part of local communities.  Joseph Anderson, Adonis Otey and Trey Knox are from Murfreesboro.  Murfreesboro produces some of the best youth football teams in the mid-state region year after year.  Jackson Hannah is from Brentwood and was a star in the Brentwood Blaze program.  I'm not sure where Lance Wilhoite is from, but he plays for Franklin Road Academy, which is just north of Brentwood in Nashville.  I didn't watch all of these players grow up the way I did Jack Hannah, but I'd be surprised if every one of them didn't start TYFA at an early age. 

I'd also be surprised if almost all of those athletes weren't a part of National Playmakers Academy.  NPA is an organization started by former Tennessee DB Buck Fitzgerald.  It is a great organization that trains local high school athletes with college potential and shepherds them through the camp and recruiting process.  In many respects, organizations like NPA have become as important as high school coaches in attracting interest from college teams.  They are especially influential in elite camps and recruiting ratings.  For example, Cole Mabry credits NPA as having been key in his offer from Notre Dame.  My son Matthew was involved as a DB, but not as a kicker.  He could have played at the D1 level somewhere as a DB or slot receiver, and NPA would have been a key had he wanted to pursue that route.

This really is an important subject for Arkansas football players in areas without strong youth football.  If central Arkansas doesn't have something as well developed as TYFA and NPA, they need it.  Below are links to each organization.  I have relationships with leaders in both.  If anyone here has an interest in finding out how you can learn more and in starting something in your own community, pm me.  I am not only happy to help but am willing to spend some time to get things started.  Arkansas is long overdue for this.

http://leagues.bluesombrero.com/tnyfl/home

https://nationalplaymakersacademy.com/

So much of the youth football in AR is ran through local boys clubs ( nothing wrong with that ) and relies on volunteer "coaches" many of which are just dads or guys who want to be around the game. They are not coaches, at least not in the sens of a jshs or hs coach. Many fancy themselves as the next Saban, they try to run spread hunh offenses, or they simply find the fastest kid and give him the ball 100 times a game. I'm not saying they are bad guys, but I know the jrhs coaches in our area spend all of 7th grade breaking bad habits of the kids coming out of the boys clus programs. Now, a place like GW, where the HS coaches have had a hand in forming the youth program, those kids get to 7th grade WAY ahead of the curve.

[bphi11ips]

So much of the youth football in AR is ran through local boys clubs ( nothing wrong with that ) and relies on volunteer "coaches" many of which are just dads or guys who want to be around the game. They are not coaches, at least not in the sens of a jshs or hs coach. Many fancy themselves as the next Saban, they try to run spread hunh offenses, or they simply find the fastest kid and give him the ball 100 times a game. I'm not saying they are bad guys, but I know the jrhs coaches in our area spend all of 7th grade breaking bad habits of the kids coming out of the boys clus programs. Now, a place like GW, where the HS coaches have had a hand in forming the youth program, those kids get to 7th grade WAY ahead of the curve.

My experience has been just the opposite. 

TYFA is organized by community.  It is not uncommon for 140 players to participate in any particular age group of the Brentwood Blaze.  That's around 500-600 kids per year in a community with a population of 50,000.  Brentwood teams play teams from Franklin, Murfreesboro, Goodlettesville, Hendersonville, Antioch, Bordeaux, Hermitage, Bellevue and other communities within an hour or so drive from Nashville.   

TYFA is an association that manages mid-state youth football.  Each community program has its own autonomous board of directors, primarily comprised of player parents.  The board appoints a president and other administrative officers.  All are volunteers.  The board vetts each coach.  Each coach must attend instructional classes conducted by high school coaches and be certified through a test administered on-line.  I have seen coaches removed or turned down based upon conduct or for simply demonstrating that he didn't know what he was doing.  Most coaches have at least high school experience and many have college and even NFL experience.

Middle school can be an entirely different story.  In TYFA, a team can have up to six coaches for 25-30 players.  In middle school, there may be 80 boys dressed out supervised by 3 coaches, many of whom are science teachers first and coaches second.  Like youth volunteers, there are good and not so good middle school coaches.  At the high school level, most coaches I know played in college or have been coaching many years. 

High school coaches here value the Brentwood Blaze program and other local programs and are very supportive of them.  Almost every player on their roster spent at least a few years in one.  Those schools include Brentwood, Ravenwood, Franklin, and the schools who sent five players to Arkansas's Junior Day recently, Franklin Road Academy,  Montgomery Bell Academy, Blackman, and Siegel.   Some of the best players spent 8 years in youth football.  Brentwood High's QB in 2017 was Region 6 Offensive MVP two years in a row and was a Mr. Football finalist.  He started playing football when he was 5.  I recall hearing Jalen Merrick saying that he spent 11 years in Florida playing football by the time he got to Fayetteville. 

The point is that great youth football programs promote love for the game at a young age.  The YMCA program I grew up with in Little Rock was populated by very good coaches whose players fed into Central, Hall, Mills, Parkview and Catholic High.  Billy Gray taught me to execute a belly fake when I was 8.  Terry Moore was as good a coach as I ever had and set a fine example for his players as well.  Little Rock, especially, needs a quality youth football program if it doesn't have one already.  I was told it didn't a few years ago.  The vast majority of kids who play youth football are much better players for it by the time they reach high school.             

[Cinco de Hogo]

The level of knowledge in this thread has passed me waaay up but I would like to say thinks to all who participated.

[SooieGeneris]

What has CCM done to make players in state be better? Is he recruiting out of state players to come play high school in Arkansas? Is he fundraising to improve the hardware that high school programs have available to them? Is he lobbying in state congress to increase funding for state schools?

Or is he just allowing HS coaches to visit our campus and watch our practices and such? Because all of the previous coaching staffs did that and doing so isn't going to impact the quality of player development in high school sports any more than it did during past coaching staffs.

And to be honest, if he is doing the above, that could easily be his downfall. He needs to spend his time coaching the razorbacks. Not trying to be a HS coach again. Every minute he's trying to be a HS coach again, he isn't watching game film of our opponents, watching practice film, coming up with new schemes for our players, watching film on potential recruits. If he wants to hire somebody to be a full time improver of arkansas HS football, by all means. However, he doesn't have time to be doing that himself.

You're surely aware that coaches have limited contact with the players during most of the off season, right? 20 hours in the fall, including the game.This thing of having relationships with HS coaches and visiting schools is not just playing Mr. Rogers. It's about recruiting, recruiting and more recruiting.

How is that "trying to be a HS coach again?" I have no idea if his purpose is to improve AR HS football or when it might pay dividends in the future. I do know that the UA head football coach has what Teddy Roosevelt called a "Bully Pulpit."

Using that visibility and platform in which his every utterance becomes news, anything he says or does that might improve HS football in the state certainly cannot hurt.

If only one player in the state who has been walking the halls or playing in the band turned into a Darren McFadden, wouldn't it be worth a little jawboning? Don't say that can't happen either.

Daniel Gafford was playing in the band instead of on a court not that long ago. Now, he will be a millionaire pro athlete in a year (hopefully) or a few months from now.

Steve Spurrier didn't watch film 24/7 and do all the things you say Morris should be doing and he had a bit of success. Of course, I'm not saying Morris can do here what SS did at UF, slightly different recruiting base, but he can with a little effort possibly raise the level of HS play without taking away from his other duties.

It in no way makes him a slacker as a coach to promote the game of football in this state! If it doesn't work, we hit TX and OK harder. By your definition of his duties as a coach, wouldn't he be better off poring over film endlessly instead of speaking at Razorback Club meetings?

How would that put butts in the seats? If he locked himself in his office studying film, how would that unify the fan base in any way? That would not go over well if he doesn't win, would it? At least if he's promoting this moribund program he is building support for it. That sort of thing may not make a huge difference but it sure can't hurt.

[SooieGeneris]

People dance around this all the time, but yea, demographics has a lot to do with it. Our AA population is about 450k. Bama has 1.25 mil. Louisiana 1.5mil. Ga has as many AA's as Arkansas has total population. Fla 2.9mil. Tn 1mil. Mizzu 700k. SC 1.3mil.

There have been studies of the # of d1 football players and where they come from, and there is no doubt, the higher the AA population the higher the rate of d1 players.

So by that statistic, shouldn't AR produce over 1/3 as many D1 players as Alabama and almost 1/3 as many as LA?

Look up the numbers. When was the last year that the state of LA only produced 15 D1 players? AR has likely had years with 5 or less in the recent past or not many more than that, but those states produce well over 3 times as many as AR probably every year..