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ASU is getting a reputation...

Started by Ugly Uncle, December 11, 2013, 10:29:18 pm

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Ugly Uncle

Arkansas State is getting to be known as a proving ground for rising coaching stars. That shows a big shift in growth in the program. People don't look at it as a dead end job, but one where you can be successful. What this means is that there will be a young rising coaching star that will stay and will build a very good program there. ASU is now an attractive job. I expect them to get another good young coach and eventually they will find their Chris Peterson.
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pigbacon

Any coach that stays there very long falls into two catergories IMO:

1. He views it as a destination job to retire, raise a family, etc.
2. He is unsuccessful or mediocre. Even State may not deal as long as they have in the past with a coach in this catergory since they have seen recent success.

 

nextlevel

Congrats to stAte on becoming a stepping stone school?
Quote from: GUVHOG on March 07, 2011, 11:26:42 am
I'll make a prediction: If BCG were to get the Tennessee job, Calipari will be fired from UK within 2 years because from the 2013-2014 season on, Tennessee will own the SEC East until BCG moves on or retires.

ell oh ell

reddogjcss

State becoming the Boise of the south! Well that is a big step up. Young coach with ambition can go to state and if he does good he's off to the big bucks.
One other thing the AD there is doing a great job on coaching talent he's hiring.
It want be long someone will be offering him a nice high paying job,

FelixJonesorDMAC?

Quote from: pigbacon on December 11, 2013, 10:34:13 pm
Any coach that stays there very long falls into two catergories IMO:

1. He views it as a destination job to retire, raise a family, etc.
2. He is unsuccessful or mediocre. Even State may not deal as long as they have in the past with a coach in this catergory since they have seen recent success.

1. Retire in Jonesboro? 

Cartoon Man


Sivad

I agree they're "getting a reputation"...as the school every coach leaves as soon as he gets the chance.
Paraphrasing Dean Wormer: 5 coaches in 5 years is no way to go through school son.

pigbacon

Quote from: FelixJonesorDMAC? on December 11, 2013, 11:21:29 pm
1. Retire in Jonesboro? 

Yeah, I know that sounds terrible. But someone not looking for the next best thing, maybe trying to cap their career there with some stability. John Thompson's name was thrown out there on the radio today. Someone like that.


JIHawg


secneahog

Remix MMA.  Alan "the talent" Belcher - Born_Imboden Arkansas- Next 185 UFC Champ!

GoHogs1091

Quote from: minister on December 11, 2013, 11:25:17 pm
Look for Rhett Lashlee to be hired.

Eddie Gran (who they chose Bryan Harsin over) would be a better hire for ASU than Lashlee just because of Gran's recruiting ability.  There are several current players on Florida State's Team who were recruited and landed by Gran.  Gran has very extensive recruiting connections, particularly in South Florida, but he also has recruiting connections in the entire South (he also previously coached at Ole Miss and Auburn).

If I am not mistaken, a T.V. Commentator during Cincinnati's game last Thursday night stated that Gran has relatives in Arkansas.

Here to me is ASU's best possibilities.

1.  Eddie Gran- Very good recruiter
2.  Frank Wilson-  Very good recruiter, currently at LSU
3.  Geoff Collins-  Mississippi State's current Defensive Coordinator   

ADavisTheGOAT

Razorbacks | Redskins | Pelicans | LA Tech

1highhog

Quote from: Ched "UglyUncle" Carpenter on December 11, 2013, 10:29:18 pm
Arkansas State is getting to be known as a proving ground for rising coaching stars. That shows a big shift in growth in the program. People don't look at it as a dead end job, but one where you can be successful. What this means is that there will be a young rising coaching star that will stay and will build a very good program there. ASU is now an attractive job. I expect them to get another good young coach and eventually they will find their Chris Peterson.

I don't know about that UU, you might have something there, but IMO they'll just keep on getting the one and done type Coaches or get stuck with a coach who just has moderate success there, like before this last 5 Coach ride.  Look at Tulsa in basketball years back, they produced the likes of Nolan, Tuberville, Self, granted, they were there longer than a year but they went to their next job and won National Titles.  So Tulsa started getting the reputation as a proving ground for Coaches coming up and winning big there and then moving on soon after.  But Tulsa hasn't become anything else since, and these will all be hall of fame Coaches.  Tulsa has just settled back to having one guy there that's Coached there and had just moderate success.

 

Hogfaniam

I can just see the end of the season evaluation with the AD next year. 

"Coach, you had a good season this year, but no school wants to hire you, so we've got to let you go.  Good luck"
"My dog Sam eats purple flowers"

Seminole Indian

Quote from: Hogfaniam on December 12, 2013, 04:38:43 am
I can just see the end of the season evaluation with the AD next year. 

"Coach, you had a good season this year, but no school wants to hire you, so we've got to let you go.  Good luck"
The biggest problem ASU has is talent, they have more than the other SBC teams, so winning,even with all the disruption, is likely to continue. In todays world with many teams higher up the food chain  desperately looking to win now, ASU may have a hard time keeping a coach for long time.
"In truth, knowledge is a great and very useful quality; those who despise it give evidence enough of their stupidity. Yet I do not set its value at that extreme measure that some attribute to it." - Michel de Montaigne

twistitup

How you gonna win when you ain't right within?

Here I am again mixing misery and gin....

Seminole Indian

Another problem is that unlike most G5 schools, a change at ASU now attracts attention and that attracts the coaches. Hard for ASU to say no to a coach who they know will win, because there is a bigger upside to winning,than there is to hanging onto a coach
"In truth, knowledge is a great and very useful quality; those who despise it give evidence enough of their stupidity. Yet I do not set its value at that extreme measure that some attribute to it." - Michel de Montaigne

Inhogswetrust

Quote from: Ched "UglyUncle" Carpenter on December 11, 2013, 10:29:18 pm
Arkansas State is getting to be known as a proving ground for rising coaching stars. That shows a big shift in growth in the program. People don't look at it as a dead end job, but one where you can be successful. What this means is that there will be a young rising coaching star that will stay and will build a very good program there. ASU is now an attractive job. I expect them to get another good young coach and eventually they will find their Chris Peterson.

Wrong UU. A young rising star may not stay long because bigger programs with bigger budgets will come calling with millions in hand and they will jump ship in a split second usually. Chris Peterson"s situation was a little unique and rare. I know some coaches don't want the demands that go with a big time program but to say they WILL find someone like that is just a guess. They could just as easily keep getting short-termers and at some point get a dud. Then the job becomes harder to get a rising star. Boise had already established a fairly consistent winning program before Chris was named head coach and those coaches moved on fairly quickly. Ironically the exception to winning there was a nutt (the only coach there to have a losing record since 1969) yet he had an out. ASU is not the worst job in football, it is a good one, but it isn't a specially attractive one either. It is similar to about 100 other one's in college.
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

Seminole Indian

Quote from: Inhogswetrust on December 12, 2013, 06:15:43 am
Wrong UU. A young rising star may not stay long because bigger programs with bigger budgets will come calling with millions in hand and they will jump ship in a split second usually. Chris Peterson"s situation was a little unique and rare. I know some coaches don't want the demands that go with a big time program but to say they WILL find someone like that is just a guess. They could just as easily keep getting short-termers and at some point get a dud. Then the job becomes harder to get a rising star. Boise had already established a fairly consistent winning program before Chris was named head coach and those coaches moved on fairly quickly. Ironically the exception to winning there was a nutt (the only coach there to have a losing record since 1969) yet he had an out. ASU is not the worst job in football, it is a good one, but it isn't a specially attractive one either. It is similar to about 100 other one's in college.
I disagree ASU is now one of the top G5 gigs. ASU has won at every level and now has established itself at the G5 level, and because talent is the key to winning, they are going to do well for quite some time. All these hotshot coaches have no problem attracting talent by offering their recruits immediate playing time. ASU, as a result has the best young talent in the SBC,as evidenced by the all league selections yesterday.
"In truth, knowledge is a great and very useful quality; those who despise it give evidence enough of their stupidity. Yet I do not set its value at that extreme measure that some attribute to it." - Michel de Montaigne

Inhogswetrust

Quote from: Seminole Indian on December 12, 2013, 05:54:39 am
The biggest problem ASU has is talent, they have more than the other SBC teams, so winning,even with all the disruption, is likely to continue. In todays world with many teams higher up the food chain  desperately looking to win now, ASU may have a hard time keeping a coach for long time.

And thus they may not have as talented a team going forward after the current talent leaves. Especially if there is any more drop off.
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

Inhogswetrust

Quote from: twistitup on December 12, 2013, 06:01:33 am
Carl Pelini is ready for the job

Is he out of prison or rehab yet........................................
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

twistitup

Quote from: Inhogswetrust on December 12, 2013, 06:37:03 am
Is he out of prison or rehab yet........................................

No better place for a coach to get his career and life back on track than ASU.

Isn't that what we are talking about here? It might be the water in Jonesboro that is creating winners out of these guys, who know?

All I know is that Carl needs some of that water
How you gonna win when you ain't right within?

Here I am again mixing misery and gin....

GolfNut57

Quote from: Hogfaniam on December 12, 2013, 04:38:43 am
I can just see the end of the season evaluation with the AD next year. 

"Coach, you had a good season this year, but no school wants to hire you, so we've got to let you go.  Good luck"

OK, that was pretty funny.  :D
"Golf is deceptively simple and endlessly complicated; it satisfies the soul and frustrates the intellect. It is at the same time rewarding and maddening – and it is without a doubt the greatest game mankind has ever invented." Arnold Palmer.

Inhogswetrust

Quote from: pigbacon on December 11, 2013, 11:31:07 pm
Yeah, I know that sounds terrible. But someone not looking for the next best thing, maybe trying to cap their career there with some stability. John Thompson's name was thrown out there on the radio today. Someone like that.

Thompson is from east Arkansas. If he wanted to retire there I could understand that. A coach (or almost everyone else) from somewhere else probably wouldn't have that desire. Sorry but Jonesboro is not know as a retirement mecca.
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

 

Hog N Bama

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jbcarol

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Tim Harris

Quote from: reddogjcss on December 11, 2013, 11:03:44 pm
State becoming the Boise of the south! Well that is a big step up. Young coach with ambition can go to state and if he does good he's off to the big bucks.
One other thing the AD there is doing a great job on coaching talent he's hiring.
It want be long someone will be offering him a nice high paying job,

The current AD has only been there a little over a year.  Harsin was his only hire.

Tim Harris

Quote from: GoHogs1091 on December 11, 2013, 11:49:01 pm
Eddie Gran (who they chose Bryan Harsin over) would be a better hire for ASU than Lashlee just because of Gran's recruiting ability.  There are several current players on Florida State's Team who were recruited and landed by Gran.  Gran has very extensive recruiting connections, particularly in South Florida, but he also has recruiting connections in the entire South (he also previously coached at Ole Miss and Auburn).

If I am not mistaken, a T.V. Commentator during Cincinnati's game last Thursday night stated that Gran has relatives in Arkansas.

Here to me is ASU's best possibilities.

1.  Eddie Gran- Very good recruiter
2.  Frank Wilson-  Very good recruiter, currently at LSU
3.  Geoff Collins-  Mississippi State's current Defensive Coordinator   

What about Venables?  Would he be a good fit?

Sir Oinksalot


...wish we had their AD, guy seems to be able to recognize talent...

Be ye therefore like the grasses and yield
to the inevitable forces of Nature,
and in so yielding survive...

DeltaBoy

Good for ASU and they are getting more respect all the time.
If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

SwineSalesman

Don't be surprised to hear Ed Orgeron's name come out... ASU wants to hire a name to continue the donations for football upgrades

MuskogeeHogFan

Quote from: Ched "UglyUncle" Carpenter on December 11, 2013, 10:29:18 pm
Arkansas State is getting to be known as a proving ground for rising coaching stars. That shows a big shift in growth in the program. People don't look at it as a dead end job, but one where you can be successful. What this means is that there will be a young rising coaching star that will stay and will build a very good program there. ASU is now an attractive job. I expect them to get another good young coach and eventually they will find their Chris Peterson.

A stepping stone to bigger jobs, just like Tulsa has been for years.
Go Hogs Go!

KCRazorbackfan

Just in - Malzahn back to state!  ;) 

Seriously, the same person that coached them in their bowl game last year, Thompson I believe his name is, should get consideration.  He'll probably be so grateful he won't be a one and done after 2014.
Life took me to Central Florida, but I'll always be a Razorback.

Tim Harris

Quote from: SwineSalesman on December 12, 2013, 08:45:20 am
Don't be surprised to hear Ed Orgeron's name come out... ASU wants to hire a name to continue the donations for football upgrades

It will most likely be a young offensive minded HC.

impact

Quote from: 1highhog on December 12, 2013, 04:30:29 am
I don't know about that UU, you might have something there, but IMO they'll just keep on getting the one and done type Coaches or get stuck with a coach who just has moderate success there, like before this last 5 Coach ride.  Look at Tulsa in basketball years back, they produced the likes of Nolan, Tuberville, Self, granted, they were there longer than a year but they went to their next job and won National Titles.  So Tulsa started getting the reputation as a proving ground for Coaches coming up and winning big there and then moving on soon after.  But Tulsa hasn't become anything else since, and these will all be hall of fame Coaches.  Tulsa has just settled back to having one guy there that's Coached there and had just moderate success.

I believe that would be Tubby Smith instead of Tuberville but I agree 100% with your post.
Arkansas Razorback Football - Reigning champion and annual winner of the Integrity Bowl!

SwineSalesman

Quote from: Tim Harris on December 12, 2013, 09:09:27 am
It will most likely be a young offensive minded HC.
Rhett, Ed, Frank Wilson, and Neal Brown ( kind of surprised) is who my boss ( supposedly an ASU booster no clue if he really is) said they are going to try to interview.

ricepig

Quote from: Inhogswetrust on December 12, 2013, 07:10:59 am
Thompson is from east Arkansas. If he wanted to retire there I could understand that. A coach (or almost everyone else) from somewhere else probably wouldn't have that desire. Sorry but Jonesboro is not know as a retirement mecca.

Layoff dude, I really think there is more to your "anti-Jonesboro" stand than you let on. It depends what you wish for retirement, some think Lakeland is a nice place??

ricepig

Quote from: Tim Harris on December 12, 2013, 09:09:27 am
It will most likely be a young offensive minded HC.

Yep, that's been the formula for the last three hires, I'd say they stick with it.

arkjay19

Quote from: MuskogeeHogFan on December 12, 2013, 09:04:04 amA stepping stone to bigger jobs, just like Tulsa has been for years.

And it hasn't done all that much for Tulsa, who went 3-9 this year.

They had them a nice little run.  They had several 10+ win seasons in the last few years, but if you're not making noise in the BCS and in the rankings consistently, it doesn't have much lasting effect.

Their stability and consistency is what made Boise State different.  Arkansas State is not the Boise State of the South and they're not even close.

I'll give it to Arkansas State, they have an eye for coaching talent right now, but the nature of college football doesn't allow for schools outside of the Power 5 to hold on to top coaches for very long.  And IMO, coaches have a bigger impact in college football than anywhere else.

Inhogswetrust

Quote from: Sir Oinksalot on December 12, 2013, 08:33:51 am
...wish we had their AD, guy seems to be able to recognize talent...



He has only been there one year. Thus I believe he's only hired ONE head football coach. The other more recent successful one's were hired by the guy that ironically was forced out if reports are to be believed.
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

nextlevel

Quote from: Inhogswetrust on December 12, 2013, 09:52:13 am
He has only been there one year. Thus I believe he's only hired ONE head football coach. The other more recent successful one's were hired by the guy that ironically was forced out if reports are to be believed.

He wasn't perfect, he hired John Brady...
Quote from: GUVHOG on March 07, 2011, 11:26:42 am
I'll make a prediction: If BCG were to get the Tennessee job, Calipari will be fired from UK within 2 years because from the 2013-2014 season on, Tennessee will own the SEC East until BCG moves on or retires.

ell oh ell

Inhogswetrust

December 12, 2013, 10:05:51 am #41 Last Edit: December 12, 2013, 10:25:10 am by Inhogswetrust
Quote from: ricepig on December 12, 2013, 09:45:02 am
Layoff dude, I really think there is more to your "anti-Jonesboro" stand than you let on. It depends what you wish for retirement, some think Lakeland is a nice place??

I tell you what. I'll lay off Jonesboro and the Red Wolves when their fans and minions quit coming to a Hog based message board and keep spouting off at the mouth and stirring up feces.

Until then, NO I never had an opinion of Jonesboro until I had experience there and NEVER started a thread about it. I only respond with my opinion of it when other start talking about it as this great utopia or how nice it is. Here's a shocker for you. I have gone on the record on here as saying Jonesboro has some really nice people in it in the past. That doesn't mean I have to like where they live! Lakeland. WOW! That is the mecca of retirement communities huh? I always thought Retirement communities are areas usually people move to in somewhat large numbers to retire. I guess that describes Lakeland in your mind then. Oh well come see me in Hot Springs or Bella Vista or Cherokee Village or somewhere like those places when I retire.


Conversely how do think the majority of Red Wolf and ASU fans would react IF I went to a message board that is Red wolf or ASU based and started talking smack, or how much greater and nicer it is in Fayetteville and all things Hogs and such? I'd be attacked unmercifully. I'd be lucky if they didn't kick me off their board!
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

Inhogswetrust

Quote from: nextlevel on December 12, 2013, 10:01:51 am
He wasn't perfect, he hired John Brady...

True that! But in his defense have you seen Brady's wife.......................
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

Hawgon

Whatever they're doing, it is working relatively speaking.  Even going through the coaches like they have been, they've had more success in the last five years than they had in the previous twenty-five.  If I were them, I would stick with the formula and hire a up and coming future star with a dynamic spread type offense.  Being a stepping stone job is a lot better than being a dead end job.

Inhogswetrust

Quote from: Hawgon on December 12, 2013, 10:07:05 am
Whatever they're doing, it is working relatively speaking.  Being a stepping stone job is a lot better than being a dead end job.

Agree with that.
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

arkjay19

Quote from: Hawgon on December 12, 2013, 10:07:05 amWhatever they're doing, it is working relatively speaking.  Even going through the coaches like they have been, they've had more success in the last five years than they had in the previous twenty-five.  If I were them, I would stick with the formula and hire a up and coming future star with a dynamic spread type offense.  Being a stepping stone job is a lot better than being a dead end job.

Agreed.  Winning Sun Belt titles is better than not.

ricepig

Quote from: Inhogswetrust on December 12, 2013, 10:05:51 am
I tell you what. I'll lay off Jonesboro and the Red Wolves when their fans and minions quit coming to a Hog based message board and keep spouting off at the mouth and stirring up feces.

Until then, NO I never had an opinion of Jonesboro until I had experience there and NEVER started a thread about it. I only respond with my opinion of it when other start talking about it as this great utopia or how nice it is. Here's a shocker for you. I have gone on the record on here as saying Jonesboro has some really nice people in it in the past. That doesn't mean I have to like where they live! Lakeland. WOW! That is the mecca of retirement communities huh? I always thought Retirement communities are areas usually people move to in somewhat large numbers to retire. I guess that describes Lakeland in your mind then. Oh well come see me in Hot Springs or Bella Vista or Cherokee Village or somewhere like those places when I retire.



So, you take out you anger on Jonesboro because ASU fans come on this board, says a lot. f I had my wish, they wouldn't be here, but it's Lanny's board. If you woud notice, the vast majority of people not bashing Jonesboro, are Razorback fans and alums such as myself, who live in Jonesboro.

SwineSalesman

Quote from: Inhogswetrust on December 12, 2013, 10:05:51 am
I tell you what. I'll lay off Jonesboro and the Red Wolves when their fans and minions quit coming to a Hog based message board and keep spouting off at the mouth and stirring up feces.

Until then, NO I never had an opinion of Jonesboro until I had experience there and NEVER started a thread about it. I only respond with my opinion of it when other start talking about it as this great utopia or how nice it is. Here's a shocker for you. I have gone on the record on here as saying Jonesboro has some really nice people in it in the past. That doesn't mean I have to like where they live! Lakeland. WOW! That is the mecca of retirement communities huh? I always thought Retirement communities are areas usually people move to in somewhat large numbers to retire. I guess that describes Lakeland in your mind then. Oh well come see me in Hot Springs or Bella Vista or Cherokee Village or somewhere like those places when I retire.


Conversely how do think the majority of Red Wolf and ASU fans would react IF I went to a message board that is Red wolf or ASU based and started talking smack, or how much greater and nicer it is in Fayetteville and all things Hogs and such? I'd be attacked unmercifully. I'd be lucky if they didn't kick me off their board!
Man your really going to live it up when you retire lol

Hawg Red

Appears to be an attractive stepping stone job for rising coaches, but the last 3 coaches left for jobs at schools they had previous ties to. I think that was the main factor in the whole "one and done" thing. It was mainly circumstance.

MuskogeeHogFan

Quote from: arkjay19 on December 12, 2013, 09:47:13 am
And it hasn't done all that much for Tulsa, who went 3-9 this year.

They had them a nice little run.  They had several 10+ win seasons in the last few years, but if you're not making noise in the BCS and in the rankings consistently, it doesn't have much lasting effect.

Their stability and consistency is what made Boise State different.  Arkansas State is not the Boise State of the South and they're not even close.

I'll give it to Arkansas State, they have an eye for coaching talent right now, but the nature of college football doesn't allow for schools outside of the Power 5 to hold on to top coaches for very long.  And IMO, coaches have a bigger impact in college football than anywhere else.

The last 10 seasons, 2002-2012 Tulsa went 85-58 (.594). Over the same period of time, ASU has gone 65-69 (.485) and Tulsa has played in the far more difficult conference, so whatever. And even further back than that, Tulsa has been the proving ground of a lot of future big conference Div I coaches (HC's and Assistant's), over the years and currently, one who is playing for a NC in January, and the same can be said of ASU, though he was only there for one year.

Point is, ASU is a lot like Tulsa in this regard.
Go Hogs Go!