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The one thing about CBB that everyone is overlooking

Started by snoot hoggy hog, September 18, 2017, 04:44:37 am

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snoot hoggy hog

is his recruitment of in state kids.

You gotta give it to him. He's giving kids from all over the state a chance to play for the hogs. Before it was rare to see kids from small towns like Hope, Smackover, Dumas, Star City, Charleston, and Hardy Arkansas playing for the Hogs. You look at the roster now and it truly represents the state of Arkansas.

jgphillips3

Rare?  Petrino's best teams and Nutt's best teams were filled with Arkansas kids.  If anything, Bielema slow plays Arkansas kids more than any other Arkansas coach.  Now, I think he treats those Arkansas kids great, other than failing to coach them worth a darn, but he's hardly setting any precedent.

 

gawntrail

Quote from: snoot hoggy hog on September 18, 2017, 04:44:37 am
is his recruitment of in state kids.

You gotta give it to him. He's giving kids from all over the state a chance to play for the hogs. Before it was rare to see kids from small towns like Hope, Smackover, Dumas, Star City, Charleston, and Hardy Arkansas playing for the Hogs. You look at the roster now and it truly represents the state of Arkansas.

#UNCOMMON

hogsanity

It is NOT a good thing when our roster is over half in state kids, because this state does not produce 40+ SEC LEVEL PLAYERS in a 4 year span.

Quote from: snoot hoggy hog on September 18, 2017, 04:44:37 am

You look at the roster now and it truly represents the state of Arkansas.


YEs, they play about like most high schools in the state, slow and small.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

DeltaBoy

Quote from: hogsanity on September 18, 2017, 08:33:23 am
It is NOT a good thing when our roster is over half in state kids, because this state does not produce 40+ SEC LEVEL PLAYERS in a 4 year span.

YEs, they play about like most high schools in the state, slow and small.

I proud of that part of his job here in ARK.
If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

hogsanity

Quote from: DeltaBoy on September 18, 2017, 09:01:43 am
I proud of that part of his job here in ARK.

Go right ahead, heck lets make a law that says all the players have to be from in state so johnny hometownhero gets to be a Hog even though he is a lb at 5'5" and runs a 7.5 40. But hey he'll want it more than the the 6'3" 240lb fb coming through the hole to block him.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

snoot hoggy hog

Quote from: jgphillips3 on September 18, 2017, 05:52:01 am
Rare?  Petrino's best teams and Nutt's best teams were filled with Arkansas kids.  If anything, Bielema slow plays Arkansas kids more than any other Arkansas coach.  Now, I think he treats those Arkansas kids great, other than failing to coach them worth a darn, but he's hardly setting any precedent.

Both Nutt and Petrino had Arkansas kids on their roster but not like CBB. Most of Nutts kids were from Little Rock and Petrino just so happened to come along and get the once in a lifetime group from Warren. Both concentrated on bigger town programs.

OneTuskOverTheLine™

Quote from: hogsanity on September 18, 2017, 10:28:59 am
Go right ahead, heck lets make a law that says all the players have to be from in state so johnny hometownhero gets to be a Hog even though he is a lb at 5'5" and runs a 7.5 40. But hey he'll want it more than the the 6'3" 240lb fb coming through the hole to block him.

41 683 posts, and i'd say a good 30k are toilet water just like this one... Name one 5'5' LB in the history of the UofA... Hell, Bua was 5'9" and balled out.! We also got him because someone in Louisiana felt the same way you do.
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quote from: golf2day on June 19, 2014....
I'm disgusted, but kinda excited. Now I'm disgusted that I'm excited.

Torqued pork

If we signed as many instate kids as some would like, the Hogs would be a lock for the very bottom of the SEC every year.

hogsanity

Quote from: OneTuskOverTheLine™ on September 18, 2017, 11:23:57 am
41 683 posts, and i'd say a good 30k are toilet water just like this one... Name one 5'5' LB in the history of the UofA... Hell, Bua was 5'9" and balled out.! We also got him because someone in Louisiana felt the same way you do.

Not my point, and you know it. IF our roster is half or more in state kids it is bad. That's too many kids for a state that produces, usually, 5-7 legit sec type players a year. Now, if several are walkon's, hey that's great, but if half or more of our scholarship players are from in state, that is a bad sign.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

solitons

Quote from: snoot hoggy hog on September 18, 2017, 04:44:37 am
is his recruitment of in state kids.

You gotta give it to him. He's giving kids from all over the state a chance to play for the hogs. Before it was rare to see kids from small towns like Hope, Smackover, Dumas, Star City, Charleston, and Hardy Arkansas playing for the Hogs. You look at the roster now and it truly represents the state of Arkansas.
ok, please just win the games should win, 9 or 10 wins each season to save his job

BoynamedWooPigSooie

Quote from: snoot hoggy hog on September 18, 2017, 04:44:37 am
is his recruitment of in state kids.

You gotta give it to him. He's giving kids from all over the state a chance to play for the hogs. Before it was rare to see kids from small towns like Hope, Smackover, Dumas, Star City, Charleston, and Hardy Arkansas playing for the Hogs. You look at the roster now and it truly represents the state of Arkansas.


ehhh Rick Fires had a column in yesterdays NWADG highlighting the kids from NW Arkansas playing D1 out of the state and Bielema whiffed on every single on them. (the kids at Mizzou were not included).

2 FS Northside kids playing in the secondary for Oklahoma and Minnesota, the fat boy from Har-Ber at Bama, Bennett Moehring kicking true for the Naval Academy, a kid from Siloam Springs that went to San Diego St. and is playing well.

and if you really think it's rare for small town kids to play at Arkansas then you've probably not been a fan for all that long. There's always been small town kids contributing to the program. Historically good athletes have come from the rural areas of the state and with the decline of LR, Pine Bluff, Ft. Smith and the Delta these small towns will continue to be mined.
Hogville's resident uniform designer.

snoot hoggy hog

Quote from: BoynamedWooPigSooie on September 18, 2017, 11:48:43 am

ehhh Rick Fires had a column in yesterdays NWADG highlighting the kids from NW Arkansas playing D1 out of the state and Bielema whiffed on every single on them. (the kids at Mizzou were not included).

2 FS Northside kids playing in the secondary for Oklahoma and Minnesota, the fat boy from Har-Ber at Bama, Bennett Moehring kicking true for the Naval Academy, a kid from Siloam Springs that went to San Diego St. and is playing well.

and if you really think it's rare for small town kids to play at Arkansas then you've probably not been a fan for all that long. There's always been small town kids contributing to the program. Historically good athletes have come from the rural areas of the state and with the decline of LR, Pine Bluff, Ft. Smith and the Delta these small towns will continue to be mined.

It's funny that you talk about all the areas that traditionally have been heavily recruited by Arkansas. I always felt that Arkansas always whiffed on southeast Arkansas talent. They would hit Pine Bluff, skip over to Eldorado and that would be about it. CBB has seventeen kids on the roster from small towns in Arkansas. The most you would see on other coaches rosters were about 5. Coupled with the fact that of those 5 most of their time was spent on scout team.

 

bphi11ips

Quote from: hogsanity on September 18, 2017, 11:41:55 am
Not my point, and you know it. IF our roster is half or more in state kids it is bad. That's too many kids for a state that produces, usually, 5-7 legit sec type players a year. Now, if several are walkon's, hey that's great, but if half or more of our scholarship players are from in state, that is a bad sign.

Because you tried to make a ridiculous point, which is your habit. 

No one here is suggesting that every player on the roster should be from Arkansas.  No one ever has.  The OP is just trying to acknowledge that Bielema is signing Arkansas kids. 

Since 2013, Alabama has signed 34 players from Alabama.  Arkansas has signed 33 from Arkansas.  Alabama's population is only about 160% of Arkansas's and it must compete with Auburn for in-state recruits.  Both Alabama and Arkansas must rely upon outside recruits to put a competitive team on the field. 
Life is too short for grudges and feuds.

hogsanity

Quote from: bphi11ips on September 18, 2017, 12:09:07 pm
Because you tried to make a ridiculous point, which is your habit. 

No one here is suggesting that every player on the roster should be from Arkansas.  No one ever has.  The OP is just trying to acknowledge that Bielema is signing Arkansas kids. 

Since 2013, Alabama has signed 34 players from Alabama.  Arkansas has signed 33 from Arkansas.  Alabama's population is only about 160% of Arkansas's and it must compete with Auburn for in-state recruits.  Both Alabama and Arkansas must rely upon outside recruits to put a competitive team on the field. 

You guys go on believing that it is good to load up with AR kids. But before you do, go look at how many P5 signees come from each state in the SEC.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

Uncle Remus

Quote from: BoynamedWooPigSooie on September 18, 2017, 11:48:43 am

ehhh Rick Fires had a column in yesterdays NWADG highlighting the kids from NW Arkansas playing D1 out of the state and Bielema whiffed on every single on them. (the kids at Mizzou were not included).

2 FS Northside kids playing in the secondary for Oklahoma and Minnesota, the fat boy from Har-Ber at Bama, Bennett Moehring kicking true for the Naval Academy, a kid from Siloam Springs that went to San Diego St. and is playing well.

and if you really think it's rare for small town kids to play at Arkansas then you've probably not been a fan for all that long. There's always been small town kids contributing to the program. Historically good athletes have come from the rural areas of the state and with the decline of LR, Pine Bluff, Ft. Smith and the Delta these small towns will continue to be mined.

I will say this as well...he has been roasted on here for not moving on some in state kids that committed elsewhere and given no credit when they flamed out or couldn't even get eligible to play.  He had legitimate reasons for not going after those kids that we were not privy to, but folks sure as heck criticized him for not going after them.  Also, we can cherry pick a kid here or there that went under the radar that turned out to be stars elsewhere...but that happens with all programs and all states.  Some kids just play for small schools or don't have someone helping get their name out there right. 

My bottom line is this, WINNING cures all ills.  If he rattles off several wins and gets an upset or two this season and turns things around, we will all think differently of him and once again realize the GOOD that he is doing within the program.  There are lots of positives that go against the L's.  Sure the losses are gut wrenching and we are sick of having a program not materialize on the field, but the personal attacks on the man and the willingness of so many to completely ignore some of the good things going on there are disheartening to some fans.  I want things turned around as much and as quickly as anyone, but it is obvious we are young, inexperienced, and trying to figure out who we are on Saturdays.  I truly think the coaching staff thinks during the week that they know what and who this team is...it is just not materializing on the field on Saturday.  Here is hoping it is figured out this week.  Can't wait to watch them suit up and be 1-0 in the SEC.  If they aren't, then we will see if any adjustments are made.  We have played two games folks...only lost one.  Can't put a wrecking ball to everything after one loss.  We definitely looked bad in the TCU loss, but it really fell apart at the end after we were unable to get any rhythm on offense.  I look for that to improve or wholesale changes will begin...just not with the HC with the buyout.  Anyone thinking he will be gone before the end of next season at a minimum is living in a fantasy world. 

codeHog

Bielema has done so many god things that it makes it harder to watch him show he is not a leader when it comes to wining games

bphi11ips

Quote from: hogsanity on September 18, 2017, 12:12:55 pm
You guys go on believing that it is good to load up with AR kids. But before you do, go look at how many P5 signees come from each state in the SEC.

Are you in such a hurry to argue and boost your post count that you don't bother to read what you reply to?
Life is too short for grudges and feuds.

hogsanity

Quote from: bphi11ips on September 18, 2017, 12:15:31 pm
Are you in such a hurry to argue and boost your post count that you don't bother to read what you reply to?

I read it. 34% Ar kids from a state that produces MAYBE 5 legit sec players a year is a lot different than 34% from a state that produces many times that many.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

Michael_E_Davis

September 18, 2017, 12:20:48 pm #19 Last Edit: September 18, 2017, 12:31:33 pm by Michael_E_Davis
I can't wait until we beat Texas AM Saturday.  Half of the posters here will be gone, and silent,  until the next time we lose;  then they will come out of the crawlspace.   Just curious,  if we win Saturday,  how many of you that have been bashing Bielema unrelentingly,  after our second game,  will come forward and give him his props? 

Sadly,  I assume most of you already have in your mind an excuse to use if we win Saturday:  Texas AM sucked,  we got lucky,  Sumlin didn't care.   You know, the usual stuff.
"I struggled through many problems in my life, most of which never happened." -Unknown

hogsanity

Quote from: Michael_E_Davis on September 18, 2017, 12:20:48 pm
I can't wait until we beat Texas AM Saturday.  Half of the posters here will be gone, and silent,  until the next time we lose;  then they will come out of the crawlspace.   Just curious,  if we win Saturday,  how many of you that have been bashing Bielema unrelentingly,  after our second game,  will come forward and give him his props? 

Sadly,  I assume most of you already have in your mind an excuse to use if we win Saturday.  Texas AM sucked,  we got lucky,  Sumlin didn't care.   You know, the usual stuff.

you have many here pegged to a T
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

snoot hoggy hog


Uncle Remus

I'm just curious...how many of you have ever spoken to an Arkansas High School coach and what they thought of BP and him recruiting their kids.  Do any of you remember any of the players telling recruits on visits that "you don't want to play for this guy"?  I have and do.  Just go ask a high school coach you know that had a kid recruited during the BP era of Hog Football.  It will not be a positive conversation!  Oh yeah...isn't that when the big controversy of central Arkansas coaches steering kids to other schools began?  Refresh my memory?

ErieHog

This has also been a historically bad run of HS talent in state, as well.

While they haven't missed, they haven't had a ton to miss on, really.   That said,  we really need something better out of AR HS Football than we've had the last 5 years.
No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

 

snoot hoggy hog

Quote from: Uncle Remus on September 18, 2017, 12:27:36 pm
I'm just curious...how many of you have ever spoken to an Arkansas High School coach and what they thought of BP and him recruiting their kids.  Do any of you remember any of the players telling recruits on visits that "you don't want to play for this guy"?  I have and do.  Just go ask a high school coach you know that had a kid recruited during the BP era of Hog Football.  It will not be a positive conversation!  Oh yeah...isn't that when the big controversy of central Arkansas coaches steering kids to other schools began?  Refresh my memory?

I remember this. I also remember when Bo Hembree was sending his players to Tenner during the days of Hootie Dale.

ErieHog

Quote from: Uncle Remus on September 18, 2017, 12:27:36 pm
I'm just curious...how many of you have ever spoken to an Arkansas High School coach and what they thought of BP and him recruiting their kids.  Do any of you remember any of the players telling recruits on visits that "you don't want to play for this guy"?  I have and do.  Just go ask a high school coach you know that had a kid recruited during the BP era of Hog Football.  It will not be a positive conversation!  Oh yeah...isn't that when the big controversy of central Arkansas coaches steering kids to other schools began?  Refresh my memory?


It wasn't when it began.  There have been rumblings about central Arkansas sending away players back to the days of Keef Jackson at Parkview.
No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

Kevin

there has not been a dmac or matt jones come along in a while
Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.<br />James 4:7
Reject Every Kind Of Evil 1 Thessalonians 5:22

snoot hoggy hog

Quote from: Kevin on September 18, 2017, 12:35:26 pm
there has not been a dmac or matt jones come along in a while

I was just watching their highlight reels the other day and thinking the same thing. Can you imagine a DMAC/Hillis I-formation under CBB? Nasty

ErieHog

Quote from: Kevin on September 18, 2017, 12:35:26 pm
there has not been a dmac or matt jones come along in a while

There hasn't even been a Cedric Cobbs.   TJ Hammonds and KJ Hill are probably the two best recruits offensively, in terms of raw talent, in the past half decade-- one went to OSU and got lost in the shuffle, and the other is an increasingly important part of the team, but not its workhorse.

There needs to be -something- provided by in state.  Of late, we've been fortunate on the DL in state-- the one area we seem to be getting better than state-usual talent.
No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

snoot hoggy hog

Quote from: ErieHog on September 18, 2017, 12:39:40 pm
There hasn't even been a Cedric Cobbs.   TJ Hammonds and KJ Hill are probably the two best recruits offensively, in terms of raw talent, in the past half decade-- one went to OSU and flamed out, and the other is an increasingly important part of the team, but not its workhorse.

There needs to be -something- provided by in state.  Of late, we've been fortunate on the DL in state-- the one area we seem to be getting better than state-usual talent.

Hill is doing ok at OSU. He lead them in receptions this past Saturday. He and Gragg both haven't lived up to the recruiting hype just yet. Remember all the offers they had coming out of high school?

ErieHog

Quote from: snoot hoggy hog on September 18, 2017, 12:43:50 pm
Hill is doing ok at OSU. He lead them in receptions this past Saturday. He and Gragg both haven't lived up to the recruiting hype just yet. Remember all the offers they had coming out of high school?

The point remains that normally Arkansas can produce a bit more offensively, particularly, than it has in the last 5 years.    While B has gotten most of his in state targets, moreso than previous coaches--  it isn't like there's enough talent in state right now to really make much of a difference at all.
No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

hogsanity

Quote from: ErieHog on September 18, 2017, 12:33:12 pm
This has also been a historically bad run of HS talent in state, as well.

While they haven't missed, they haven't had a ton to miss on, really.   That said,  we really need something better out of AR HS Football than we've had the last 5 years.

Carful, bph will be here in a minute to tell you how wrong you are.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

Redhogs

Quote from: Michael_E_Davis on September 18, 2017, 12:20:48 pm
I can't wait until we beat Texas AM Saturday.  Half of the posters here will be gone, and silent,  until the next time we lose;  then they will come out of the crawlspace.   Just curious,  if we win Saturday,  how many of you that have been bashing Bielema unrelentingly,  after our second game,  will come forward and give him his props? 

Sadly,  I assume most of you already have in your mind an excuse to use if we win Saturday:  Texas AM sucked,  we got lucky,  Sumlin didn't care.   You know, the usual stuff.
If we lose will you be gone or admit he's a failure?
Will I live long enough to see us win again? Will any of us?

Redhogs

Quote from: hogsanity on September 18, 2017, 12:16:33 pm
I read it. 34% Ar kids from a state that produces MAYBE 5 legit sec players a year is a lot different than 34% from a state that produces many times that many.
You are correct...no different than some wanting to hire a coach just because he is from the state. Makes no sense.
Will I live long enough to see us win again? Will any of us?

bphi11ips

Quote from: ErieHog on September 18, 2017, 12:39:40 pm
There hasn't even been a Cedric Cobbs.   TJ Hammonds and KJ Hill are probably the two best recruits offensively, in terms of raw talent, in the past half decade-- one went to OSU and got lost in the shuffle, and the other is an increasingly important part of the team, but not its workhorse.

There needs to be -something- provided by in state.  Of late, we've been fortunate on the DL in state-- the one area we seem to be getting better than state-usual talent.

Another leader of the Arkansas sucks crowd.

KJ Hill is RS Soph and is currently tied for the team lead in number of receptions at 15.  He was listed as alternate first team with junior Parris Campbell at H-B on the depth chart released prior to the Army game. 

T.J. Hammonds has yet to catch a pass and is third on the depth chart at one of two WR spots behind 1A and 1B Deon Stewart and Jordan Jones (two other players from Arkansas).  He has yet to catch a pass.

This is by no means an indictment of Hammonds or Bielema for not signing Hill.  It is an indictment of Eerie Hog for slamming Hill and Arkansas talent in such an easily researched, demonstrably false post.

P.S. - Damarea Crockett says hello.
Life is too short for grudges and feuds.

ErieHog

Quote from: bphi11ips on September 18, 2017, 01:08:55 pm
Another leader of the Arkansas sucks crowd.

KJ Hill is RS Soph and is currently tied for the team lead in number of receptions at 15.  He was listed as alternate first team with junior Parris Campbell at H-B on the depth chart released prior to the Army game. 

T.J. Hammonds has yet to catch a pass and is third on the depth chart at one of two WR spots behind 1A and 1B Deon Stewart and Jordan Jones (two other players from Arkansas).  He has yet to catch a pass.

This is by no means an indictment of Hammonds or Bielema for not signing Hill.  It is an indictment of Eerie Hog for slamming Hill and Arkansas talent in such an easily researched, demonstrably false post.

You cite 3rd year backups and pedestrian starters, as your evidence of impact players?

Jesus. I don't even have to make the argument.   This is the best Arkansas has put out, and that's a *huge* problem.    Not an impact player one, to be found. 
No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

bphi11ips

Quote from: hogsanity on September 18, 2017, 12:55:19 pm
Carful, bph will be here in a minute to tell you how wrong you are.

And I'll back it up with facts, unlike some of you who make stuff up as you go.
Life is too short for grudges and feuds.

ErieHog

Quote from: bphi11ips on September 18, 2017, 01:11:35 pm
And I'll back it up with facts, unlike some of you who make stuff up as you go.

The facts are stubborn things.   A shame they put paid to any claim that Arkansas is putting out much in the way of talent.
No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

bphi11ips

Quote from: ErieHog on September 18, 2017, 01:11:32 pm
You cite 3rd year backups and pedestrian starters, as your evidence of impact players?

Jesus. I don't even have to make the argument.   This is the best Arkansas has put out, and that's a *huge* problem.    Not an impact player one, to be found. 

Oh, now we're talking about "impact players"?  Must have missed that. 

Why don't you define "impact player" in your infinite wisdom.  Hill is currently catching 5 passes per game.  (Of course he only has about 40 games of eligibility left).  That's 65 to 75 for the year if that number holds up.  If TJ Hammonds catches 50 the rest of the year, will you consider him an impact player?

Do you think Missouri fans consider Crockett an impact player?

Do you have any idea how weak and desperate your reply looks?
Life is too short for grudges and feuds.

ErieHog

Quote from: bphi11ips on September 18, 2017, 01:17:40 pm
Oh, now we're talking about "impact players"?  Must have missed that. 

Why don't you define "impact player" in your infinite wisdom.  Hill is currently catching 5 passes per game.  (Of course he only has about 40 games of eligibilty left).  That's 65 to 75 for the year if that number holds up.  If TJ Hammonds catches 50 thecrest of the year, will you consider him an impact player?

Do you think Missouri fans consider Crockett an impact player?

Do you have any idea how weak and desperate your reply looks?

Crockett's probably the biggest recruiting miss in state, both in terms of evaluation and impact, in that same period-- mind, it probably will take a little more time to solidify that, but I'll even grant that.

An impact player isn't a pedestrian starter; they're also usually on offense, unless they produce turnovers or disruptive plays.  It is an actual workhorse, around who you can build a team.  We've back engineered our offenses around older quarterbacks the past few years-- which has been a bit of a nice luxury, to be sure, as well as older receivers, most from out of state.    Our backs have been Texas and Florida kids.    Our OL has been built around a kid from MN, and kids from Texas and Colorado before him;  the more Arkansas kids we have played on the OL, though, generally the worse it has performed.

This isn't to criticize B or the job that the offense has done; to the contrary, they've been pretty doggone skillful at working *around* this.

2017 is comparatively deep; there might be 20 people who play D1 football in Arkansas, with a bit more than half of them signing at P5 programs.

2016?  17 P5 players.

2015?  16 P5 players.

With about half of all recruits simply washing out or not panning out to the point of being barely worth mentioning,  it exacerbates the distinct lack of top end talent in state.

We need about 8 legitimate P5 starter types out of Arkansas, for it to be a good time in Arkansas HS football.   Right now, we're struggling to find 10 quality starters across all of CFB, in any given year with Arkansas roots.






No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

bphi11ips

Quote from: ErieHog on September 18, 2017, 01:35:36 pm
Crockett's probably the biggest recruiting miss in state, both in terms of evaluation and impact, in that same period-- mind, it probably will take a little more time to solidify that, but I'll even grant that.

An impact player isn't a pedestrian starter; they're also usually on offense, unless they produce turnovers or disruptive plays.  It is an actual workhorse, around who you can build a team.  We've back engineered our offenses around older quarterbacks the past few years-- which has been a bit of a nice luxury, to be sure, as well as older receivers, most from out of state.    Our backs have been Texas and Florida kids.    Our OL has been built around a kid from MN, and kids from Texas and Colorado before him;  the more Arkansas kids we have played on the OL, though, generally the worse it has performed.

This isn't to criticize B or the job that the offense has done; to the contrary, they've been pretty doggone skillful at working *around* this.

2017 is comparatively deep; there might be 20 people who play D1 football in Arkansas, with a bit more than half of them signing at P5 programs.

2016?  17 P5 players.

2015?  16 P5 players.

With about half of all recruits simply washing out or not panning out to the point of being barely worth mentioning,  it exacerbates the distinct lack of top end talent in state.

We need about 8 legitimate P5 starter types out of Arkansas, for it to be a good time in Arkansas HS football.   Right now, we're struggling to find 10 quality starters across all of CFB, in any given year with Arkansas roots.








That's better and what I expect from you. Kudos and sorry to give you a tough time. Hogsanity's method for dealing with having his head handed to him is to develop a case of lockjaw.

According to HS, Arkansas produces nowhere near 6 SEC caliber players per year. Do you agree with him?
Life is too short for grudges and feuds.

ErieHog

Quote from: bphi11ips on September 18, 2017, 01:47:32 pm
That's better and what I expect from you. Kudos and sorry to give you a tough time. Hogsanity's method for dealing with having his head handed to him is to develop a case of lockjaw.

According to HS, Arkansas produces nowhere near 6 SEC caliber players per year. Do you agree with him?

Guys that sign?   We probably do.  Guys that see major playing time at an SEC school?  Right now, probably not, but it can be 6 with specialists and contributors on STs.   Guys that will eventually start on an SEC offense or defense?   Maybe 4 a year.

At our best, we were producing about  15-20 P5 signees, with half of those panning out to see serious time at a P5 school.   When the HS talent produces at 80% of that, we don't have the 'fat' of other programs to take the hit.   
No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

bphi11ips

Quote from: ErieHog on September 18, 2017, 01:13:03 pm
The facts are stubborn things.   A shame they put paid to any claim that Arkansas is putting out much in the way of talent.

Here's a good article with some good facts:

https://www.arkansasfight.com/2017/8/24/16189826/how-well-is-bret-bielema-recruiting-in-state

I happen to agree with the author's conclusion - Bret Bielema is doing a pretty good job of keeping the best talent in-state.  For purposes of this discussion, it certainly looks like Arkansas has produced an average of at least 6 or 7 SEC caliber recruits over the last five years.  That's the average number of Arkansas high school players Arkansas has signed during that period, and the same number of Alabama high school players Alabama has signed.   
Life is too short for grudges and feuds.

bphi11ips

Quote from: hogsanity on September 18, 2017, 12:16:33 pm
I read it. 34% Ar kids from a state that produces MAYBE 5 legit sec players a year is a lot different than 34% from a state that produces many times that many.

Lol.

I thought you said you read my post.  I didn't say 34%, I said 34!
Life is too short for grudges and feuds.

MJ2

Quote from: snoot hoggy hog on September 18, 2017, 04:44:37 am
is his recruitment of in state kids.

You gotta give it to him. He's giving kids from all over the state a chance to play for the hogs. Before it was rare to see kids from small towns like Hope, Smackover, Dumas, Star City, Charleston, and Hardy Arkansas playing for the Hogs. You look at the roster now and it truly represents the state of Arkansas.

Why is Crockett at MO?   Frazier at AL?

31to6

Quote from: snoot hoggy hog on September 18, 2017, 04:44:37 am
is his recruitment of in state kids.

You gotta give it to him. He's giving kids from all over the state a chance to play for the hogs. Before it was rare to see kids from small towns like Hope, Smackover, Dumas, Star City, Charleston, and Hardy Arkansas playing for the Hogs. You look at the roster now and it truly represents the state of Arkansas.
He has improved recruiting. Not epically, but measurably.

Now in saying that, he has completely and totally dropped the ball in OL recruiting. If you take all the 4*'s and high 3*'s that have never managed to nail down a starting position then the classes don't look nearly as good.

porkrindjimmy

Quote from: snoot hoggy hog on September 18, 2017, 11:02:45 am
Both Nutt and Petrino had Arkansas kids on their roster but not like CBB. Most of Nutts kids were from Little Rock and Petrino just so happened to come along and get the once in a lifetime group from Warren. Both concentrated on bigger town programs.

Most of  Nutts kids were from Little Rock? Do you know where Little Rock is?

PRJ

Redhogs

Will I live long enough to see us win again? Will any of us?

spahoopsfan

Quote from: hogsanity on September 18, 2017, 12:22:13 pm
you have many here pegged to a T

You act like TCU was the first loss and the only reason people don't believe in Bielema.  His  record is one of the worst since before Broyles.  I have never believed in him, I thought his record at Wisconsin was misleading because how down Michigan, Ohio St and Penn St were during his so called good years.  He doesn't have a football mine, at all.  He is only a so so administrative type leader.  What he does well is sell himself.  Sometime by making other people look bad.  That is how he got the job.  He can only succeed if he put very good coaches around him that know football and can develop players.  Enos is a good coach but we don't have enough good coaches on this staff.  He is paid to win football games and make the players better, period.

hogsanity

Quote from: spahoopsfan on September 18, 2017, 04:26:28 pm
You act like TCU was the first loss and the only reason people don't believe in Bielema.  His  record is one of the worst since before Broyles.  I have never believed in him, I thought his record at Wisconsin was misleading because how down Michigan, Ohio St and Penn St were during his so called good years.  He doesn't have a football mine, at all.  He is only a so so administrative type leader.  What he does well is sell himself.  Sometime by making other people look bad.  That is how he got the job.  He can only succeed if he put very good coaches around him that know football and can develop players.  Enos is a good coach but we don't have enough good coaches on this staff.  He is paid to win football games and make the players better, period.

Do any of you read posts from people before you make assumptions? I have said I could not care less if he stays or goes. My point has been and will continue to be that without other changes, simply changing the coach IS NOT going to result in long term changes to the pattern we have seen since joining the SEC.

It is funny that in the last day I have been accused of wanting to give BB a life time contract and of wanting him fired.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE