OMG.....

[rude1]

you want to know why I am so critical of Fortson? Just looked at the stats. 9-26 from the field. He put up 26 freaking field goal attempts, while Powell goes 10-16.  We have a point guard who doesn't understand who has the hot hand and where the ball should be going. I said it last game and I will say it again. He led the team in field goal attempts last season, and was one of the weakest shooters, he has picked right back up where he left off last season. I see no change.

Also, as I warned after the TX. game. When he gets in SEC play they will not bail him out with the whistle when he goes barreling into the lane out of control, they will let the play continue and he will either turn it over, have his shot blocked, or throw up a crazy shot. He had 0 free throw attempts in this game.

[Breems]

you want to know why I am so critical of Fortson? Just looked at the stats. 9-26 from the field. He put up 26 freaking field goal attempts, while Powell goes 10-16.  We have a point guard who doesn't understand who has the hot hand and where the ball should be going. I said it last game and I will say it again. He led the team in field goal attempts last season, and was one of the weakest shooters, he has picked right back up where he left off last season. I see no change.

Whether you like him or not, he's our best option at the point. 

[rude1]

Whether you like him or not, he's our best option at the point. 

Pelphrey needs to get a grip on him. I know he is the best we have, but it is Pelphrey's JOB, to get a handle on this kid and let him know what is expected of him as the point guard on this team. That going out and throwing up 26 shots is not winning basketball for this team.

[yraciv]

and only 6 of them were blocked by Varnado! haha
Yes Fortson is a terrible decision maker, but we're much better with him then without.  A lot of games he'll get those bailout fouls on those shots, just not against MS State.  Got to remember he is just getting his legs under him, so still rusty.  Don't know if he'll ever get the decision making down.

[rude1]

and only 6 of them were blocked by Varnado! haha
Yes Fortson is a terrible decision maker, but we're much better with him then without.  A lot of games he'll get those bailout fouls on those shots, just not against MS State.  Got to remember he is just getting his legs under him, so still rusty.  Don't know if he'll ever get the decision making down.

My major concern with him is, two games back, two games being the leader in shot attempts. This time 10 shots more than his leading competitor. That is not winning basketball for your point guard, especially when you had an option down low in Powell who was having his way with those guys.

[nextlevel]

Pel's offense is a marvel, it puts the old Knight motion offense to shame, so it really is hard to believe Fortson is jacking up 26 shots instead of being patient and allowing all that movement to present a better shot.

[Hot_Town_Hog]

I will take Fortson anyday as our point guard....he makes things happen, including driving to the basket...many of his shots are also put back in from an offensive board. Tonight was tough with Vinardo. The guy is a crazy good shot blocker.

[rude1]

I will take Fortson anyday as our point guard....he makes things happen, including driving to the basket...many of his shots are also put back in from an offensive board. Tonight was tough with Vinardo. The guy is a crazy good shot blocker.

I think Fortson is getting too much credit. They were in the game despite Fortson, not because of. 9-26 from the field. 5Assists/3Turns, those are hardly numbers from your point guard that I look at and say he made us so much better.

[chiefsfan]

I think Fortson is getting too much credit. They were in the game despite Fortson, not because of. 9-26 from the field. 5Assists/3Turns, those are hardly numbers from your point guard that I look at and say he made us so much better.

I wouldnt say that   Nobles was overmatched today when he was out there.  I dont think we would have done much better

Fortson had 16 at half

[jry04]

Keep in mind this is only Fortson's 2nd game in months. He missed 4 or 5 easy layups due to Varnardo being such a presence He was also fouled on 3 or 4 of those shot attempts. Him and Powell were our only options tonight. Fortson would have had quite a few more assists had Clarke hit the threes he usually hits, or Washington could make a layup instead of throwing up garbage.

[rude1]

I wouldnt say that   Nobles was overmatched today when he was out there.  I dont think we would have done much better

Fortson had 16 at half

My complaint with Fortson is he is shooting way too much for a point guard, at such a low percentage. 31% for the first game, 35% for this game, yet he continues to throw up shots without a conscious. It is Pelphrey's job to get this guy under control, or we will pay for it as the season unfolds.

[la20688]

If Fortson didn't  play tonight, we lose by 20.  Plain and simple!  Did he drive me crazy at the end of the game a few times?.........Yes!  But if he's not on the floor, I'm not watching at the end of the game.

[rude1]

If Fortson didn't  play tonight, we lose by 20.  Plain and simple!  Did he drive me crazy at the end of the game a few times?.........Yes!  But if he's not on the floor, I'm not watching at the end of the game.

The stats don't bear out what you are saying. The stats clearly show he hurt this team tonight with his selfish play. What game have we won thus far with him this season? 0-2 with him in the lineup. Before you say how much better we have played. Didn't we see that in the UAB game before he got back? We are playing better IMO because of the emergence of Powell.

[GuvHog]

The stats don't bear out what you are saying. The stats clearly show he hurt this team tonight with his selfish play. What game have we won thus far with him this season? 0-2 with him in the lineup. Before you say how much better we have played. Didn't we see that in the UAB game before he got back? We are playing better IMO because of the emergence of Powell.

The stats don't bear out what he's saying?? Fortson scored 20 points tonight and is once again
the #2 scorer on the team. You're wrong on this one.

[lr52879]

IMO, that stat tends to be misleading for a player like Fortson.  Often times a missed shot from him when he goes inside allows for an easy follow up from someone else.  Sure, he didn't get the basket, but we got the points.  That said, he still shot way too much tonight.

[GuvHog]

IMO, that stat tends to be misleading for a player like Fortson.  Often times a missed shot from him when he goes inside allows for an easy follow up from someone else.  Sure, he didn't get the basket, but we got the points.  That said, he still shot way too much tonight.

That's because no one else got open and Vardano wasn't being called for many fouls underneath.

[rude1]

The stats don't bear out what he's saying?? Fortson scored 20 points tonight and is once again
the #2 scorer on the team. You're wrong on this one.

Jeez he scored 20 points on 26 shots, most opponents will take that every day of the week and twice on Sundays. Does field goal percentage not play a part in you guys thinking? All you guys do is look at the final score, see it was close, see that Fortson played and scored double figures, and think he must be making a good positive impact. Look at the numbers, he isn't helping this team as of yet.

[thirtythree]

If I heard it right we still outscored them in the paint. That's better than I thought.

[rude1]

If I heard it right we still outscored them in the paint. That's better than I thought.

If Fortson would have shot less and looked for Powell more, there was an opportunity to win that game. Those guys were unable to even slow him down, he was having his way, when he got the ball.

[GuvHog]

Jeez he scored 20 points on 26 shots, most opponents will take that every day of the week and twice on Sundays. Does field goal percentage not play a part in you guys thinking? All you guys do is look at the final score, see it was close, see that Fortson played and scored double figures, and think he must be making a good positive impact. Look at the numbers, he isn't helping this team as of yet.

When your best shooter goes 2 -7 from 3 point range which is LESS than 15%, somebody else
has to shoot. Thank goodness for CF's 20 points.

[Danny J]

Fortson is the best option we have at the point and he makes this team more aggresive which is what we lacked before he came back but rude1 is absolutely right when he says pelphrey needs to coach fortson on who has the hot hand and how to distribute the ball to that person. Pelphrey needs to work with fortson in the film room. Actually, alot of our players need time in the film room especially when it comes to defense.

[la20688]

Stats are nice.........but sometimes you just have to watch the game.  It's called "intangibles".  He's also a pretty pesky defensive player.  If you don't think were a better team w/ him on the floor, I don't know what to tell you...................other than your crazy!

[rude1]

When your best shooter goes 2 -7 from 3 point range which is LESS than 15%, somebody else
has to shoot. Thank goodness for CF's 20 points.

If CF looks for the hot man Powell, Powell might put up 40 and we WIN the game. But I know thats not important around here anymore. As long as its close, lousy play should be commended.

[GuvHog]

If CF looks for the hot man Powell, Powell might put up 40 and we WIN the game. But I know thats not important around here anymore. As long as its close, lousy play should be commended.

Just who do you think fed Powell the ball for most of his points tonight?? Answer: CF.

[DiscombobulatoryHOG]

If you cannot see that this team is exponentially better with Fortson on the floor than you really have no clue..... Of course, you rarely do.

[thirtythree]

If you cannot see that this team is exponentially better with Fortson on the floor than you really have no clue..... Of course, you rarely do.

+1

[WhenPigsFly]

We just have no semblance of team offense.  It took 8 minutes for Clarke to get a shot.  That's absurd!

Evidently, the players have the freedom to go one on one whenever they want.  I've never seen a college team do this like we do, one guy driving and four guys watching.  This explains how CF gets 26 shots; he has the ball in his hands more, so he gets to shoot more!  It's almost like watching a pickup game.

I'd rather watch an Eddie Sutton team score 46 points passing the ball for good shots than this mess we see every game.

[rude1]

Just who do you think fed Powell the ball for most of his points tonight?? Answer: CF.

See here is the difference in perception and reality. CF had only 5 assists in the game to 3 turns. He was not looking for anyone but himself and his 26 field goal attempts. Powell made his own way in this game, when he could get the ball, which wasn't nearly enough considering how well he was operating.

[rude1]

If you cannot see that this team is exponentially better with Fortson on the floor than you really have no clue..... Of course, you rarely do.

You are basing your observations on what? 0-2 with Fortson in the lineup. So I guess it is you without the clue. You guys need to understand the difference in your perception as opposed to reality.

[SunshinePumper]

you want to know why I am so critical of Fortson? Just looked at the stats. 9-26 from the field. He put up 26 freaking field goal attempts, while Powell goes 10-16.  We have a point guard who doesn't understand who has the hot hand and where the ball should be going. I said it last game and I will say it again. He led the team in field goal attempts last season, and was one of the weakest shooters, he has picked right back up where he left off last season. I see no change.

Also, as I warned after the TX. game. When he gets in SEC play they will not bail him out with the whistle when he goes barreling into the lane out of control, they will let the play continue and he will either turn it over, have his shot blocked, or throw up a crazy shot. He had 0 free throw attempts in this game.

BUT, BUT, BUT, Fortson is the savior for this team!  With Fortson back, this team is sooooooooo much better.  With Fortson back, we're going to go 10-6 in the SEC and get an NCAA tourney bid!  With Fortson back, we've looked good on the court!  We look like a real team!  Fortson is the answer!  He's still rusty from sitting out all season, he'll get better in time!

[Niels Boar]

Fortson's biggest problem is that he tries to impact the game too often by making spectacular plays.  You win by creating more easy plays.  We would be better off if Fortson scored fewer points and had fewer assists as he cut way down on high risk attempts.  He pulls it off just enough to encourage him to keep trying to do something like shoot over Varnado 10 times.  He schools Varnado once but then gets blocked 4 times.  He seems to have the short-term memory of a corner back, which isn't such a good thing for a PG.  Our O would have scored more points if he had just walked down and handed Powell the ball more often.  In his defense fatigue may have affected his play in the second half.

[UltimateHog]

Fortson is the only one that can get off a halfway decent shot by creating his own shot and seperation.

Let him shoot it all he wants.

No one else can get open, forget Clarke ever getting open again, Welsh is our other guard and do you really want him to shoot more? Farmer starts for whatever reason and looks like a lost, 2 star true freshman out there.

Fortson is the only option, it's either him shoot, or pray for an open pass down low.

Critical of him or not, it's just how it is, we have NO other guards whatsoever when Clarke can't get open, and they figured out how to shut down Clarke LAST YEAR.

[SunshinePumper]

Our O would have scored more points if he had just walked down and handed Powell the ball more often. 

Bingo.  Someone gets it.  Like I said in my own thread, Fortson being back equals better looking LOSING basketball team.

Nothing more.

[SunshinePumper]

Fortson is the only one that can get off a halfway decent shot by creating his own shot and seperation.

Let him shoot it all he wants.

No one else can get open, forget Clarke ever getting open again, Welsh is our other guard and do you really want him to shoot more? Farmer starts for whatever reason and looks like a lost, 2 star true freshman out there.

Fortson is the only option, it's either him shoot, or pray for an open pass down low.

Critical of him or not, it's just how it is, we have NO other guards whatsoever when Clarke can't get open, and they figured out how to shut down Clarke LAST YEAR.

So we have no talent that can replace Fortson or get their own shot.  I guess by hugger reasoning, that means it's Heath's fault right?

[rude1]

Fortson's biggest problem is that he tries to impact the game too often by making spectacular plays.  You win by creating more easy plays.  We would be better off if Fortson scored fewer points and had fewer assists as he cut way down on high risk attempts.  He pulls it off just enough to encourage him to keep trying to do something like shoot over Varnado 10 times.  He schools Varnado once but then gets blocked 4 times.  He seems to have the short-term memory of a corner back, which isn't such a good thing for a PG.  Our O would have scored more points if he had just walked down and handed Powell the ball more often.  In his defense fatigue may have affected his play in the second half.

Yeah I am sure he has wrist iced right now after firing up that many shots.

[Danny J]

Fortson's biggest problem is that he tries to impact the game too often by making spectacular plays.  You win by creating more easy plays.  We would be better off if Fortson scored fewer points and had fewer assists as he cut way down on high risk attempts.  He pulls it off just enough to encourage him to keep trying to do something like shoot over Varnado 10 times.  He schools Varnado once but then gets blocked 4 times.  He seems to have the short-term memory of a corner back, which isn't such a good thing for a PG.  Our O would have scored more points if he had just walked down and handed Powell the ball more often.  In his defense fatigue may have affected his play in the second half.

Totally agree. Pelphrey needs to find the fine line between fortson being aggressive and taking good shots and making good passes and fortson taking circus shots and making terrible passes. It is a fine line but this team to have any chance to win games in the sec needs for courtney to be aggressive but SMART.

[rude1]

Fortson is the only one that can get off a halfway decent shot by creating his own shot and seperation.

Let him shoot it all he wants.

No one else can get open, forget Clarke ever getting open again, Welsh is our other guard and do you really want him to shoot more? Farmer starts for whatever reason and looks like a lost, 2 star true freshman out there.

Fortson is the only option, it's either him shoot, or pray for an open pass down low.

Critical of him or not, it's just how it is, we have NO other guards whatsoever when Clarke can't get open, and they figured out how to shut down Clarke LAST YEAR.

What game did you watch? Powell was 10-16 from the field. He was getting to the basket whenever he could get the ball. Yet you Fortson guys think it is better to have Fortson go 9-26 from the field. How you guys are even trying to justify this is beyond belief.

[Iwastherein1969]

anyone who thinks Julysses Nobles is the answer hasn't a clue about basketball....the guy does not look to set up the offense as its a major goal of his just to get the ball across mid-court without a ten second violation or a turnover...and if he does get it over midcourt, he looks to get rid of the ball ASAP and does NOT run our offense....so basically, he's as worthless as teats on a boar hog at the #1 position

[rude1]

anyone who thinks Julysses Nobles is the answer hasn't a clue about basketball....the guy does not look to set up the offense as its a major goal of his just to get the ball across mid-court without a ten second violation or a turnover...and if he does get it over midcourt, he looks to get rid of the ball ASAP and does NOT run our offense....so basically, he's as worthless as teats on a boar hog at the #1 position

Agreed. But I make people angry when I point out that his own 2 home state D1 schools didn't want him. My point is that the way Fortson is playing, we wouldn't be any worse off with Welsh back at the point. Pelphrey needs to get Fortson under control NOW or he has no shot to win in this conference. He can't have another season of his point guard playing shooting guard too, and leading the team in shot attempts at a 30 percent made stat.

[UltimateHog]

So we have no talent that can replace Fortson or get their own shot.  I guess by hugger reasoning, that means it's Heath's fault right?

Hugger reasoning?

How pathetic are you?

Do you realize how unintelligent and immature that makes you sound?

Grow up, emo kid.

[Brass Knob]

We will be lucky to win more than 3 or 4 more games (as would any team), so long we have a point guard shooting the ball at such a low percent...Plus a turnover ratio of almost 1 to 1. 

I like how Sunshine Pumper puts it... We will have better looking losses.

That is about it.

[UltimateHog]

We will be lucky to win more than 3 or 4 more games (as would any team), so long we have a point guard shooting the ball at such a low percent...Plus a turnover ratio of almost 1 to 1. 

I like how Sunshine Pumper puts it... We will have better looking losses.

That is about it.

There are always going to be those people like you, that find ways to cut players that perform as well as Fortson does nightly.

2 games...20ppg 6apg, against #1 team in the country, and #1 team in the SEC west on the road.

Yeah hey, let's cut that player, why not?

Frickin give me a break, just shut up.

Joke of a fan base I swear.

[donkey]

You are basing your observations on what? 0-2 with Fortson in the lineup. So I guess it is you without the clue. You guys need to understand the difference in your perception as opposed to reality.

You need to see past his hair and your preconcieved notions and watch the game. 

Louisville beat us by 30, Baylor by 30, Oklahoma by 20, and 3 mid-majors by 10 a piece at home.  All that happened with Welsh at point. 

Mississippi State went unconcious in the first half and had us down 20 before halftime.  But, I'm guessing that you think we would have gotten right back in that game without Fortson. I think you said that we would be no worse with Welsh, correct? 

He absolutely took too many shots.  But Pel was able to calm him down some after his really bad stretch at around the 10 minute mark.  That's a big chunk of why Powell got his shots.  Fortson calmed down and started running the offense for him.

You look at a stat line that shows 20 points, 6 rebounds, 5 assists, 2 steals, and a blocked shot and all you see is 9-26 from the floor.  You don't bother to mention the times when he dropped an assist in Washington's lap only to watch him throw the layup off the side of the backboard.  Or the fact that Powell was scared early and Clarke never got going.  Somebody has to score and Fortson tried to take over. 

He forced alot last night, but I'm pretty sure you're the only person in america who would actually try to make the asinine argument that the team would be just as good with Welsh. 

[HogInThaGrove]

BUT, BUT, BUT, Fortson is the savior for this team!  With Fortson back, this team is sooooooooo much better.  With Fortson back, we're going to go 10-6 in the SEC and get an NCAA tourney bid!  With Fortson back, we've looked good on the court!  We look like a real team!  Fortson is the answer!  He's still rusty from sitting out all season, he'll get better in time!

How many posts are you going to start with the words:

But, But, But.....

I can hear you saying it as you type, I bet you think it's witty and you probably chuckle to yourself, like "Take that".  Oh yeah, you're halarious.

And how many of your posts are going to include the words:

Hugger
Pel-Lover
Apologist
Mrs. Pelphrey
Pel's Family
Employee of the BAC
?

Cause those are all witty too.  Good for you.  At least you're funny in your own mind.

[pfrg999]

Keep in mind this is only Fortson's 2nd game in months. He missed 4 or 5 easy layups due to Varnardo being such a presence He was also fouled on 3 or 4 of those shot attempts. Him and Powell were our only options tonight. Fortson would have had quite a few more assists had Clarke hit the threes he usually hits, or Washington could make a layup instead of throwing up garbage.

it his fault he was gone... Dont care if he is rusty... That is his own doing

[Biggus Piggus]

Want to know how many points MSU scored off Fortson missed shots?

One.  One point.

Arkansas scored 8 points after rebounding Fortson's misses.

He gets things rolling one way or another.  Sure we need to run a more constructive offense in halfcourt.  But when Clarke isn't getting open, and Varnado is lurking inside, we don't have a lot of options.

If we had one guy on the wing who could score with midrange shots, it would be a tremendous improvement.  Farmer was supposed to be that.  He's a turnip right now.  And Welsh can't.

[HogInThaGrove]

Want to know how many points MSU scored off Fortson missed shots?

One.  One point.

Arkansas scored 8 points after rebounding Fortson's misses.

He gets things rolling one way or another.  Sure we need to run a more constructive offense in halfcourt.  But when Clarke isn't getting open, and Varnado is lurking inside, we don't have a lot of options.

If we had one guy on the wing who could score with midrange shots, it would be a tremendous improvement.  Farmer was supposed to be that.  He's a turnip right now.  And Welsh can't.

Ahhhh, stats.  Hard to argue with those.  Fortson will probably play in the NBA, and we have people wanting him benched. 

[Knot2brite]

I see what rude1 is trying to say and to be honest, it isn't wrong from a coaching standpoint. He does need to improve his decision making at times. But having said that, there are times when he has to take to ball to the hole because if not, no one else is going to do it. He is pushing his game because he is making up for lost time and trying to provide a spark to ignite the team. We are a much worse team without him but there is no reason he can't make the drives and kick to a teammate more. Now if they arent getting themselves into position and are scared...that means he is going to have to take more shots and try to do more himself.

[Temprees]

I see what rude1 is trying to say and to be honest, it isn't wrong from a coaching standpoint. He does need to improve his decision making at times. But having said that, there are times when he has to take to ball to the hole because if not, no one else is going to do it. He is pushing his game because he is making up for lost time and trying to provide a spark to ignite the team. We are a much worse team without him but there is no reason he can't make the drives and kick to a teammate more. Now if they arent getting themselves into position and are scared...that means he is going to have to take more shots and try to do more himself.

And as he does more, his team mates will do less.  The team mates will be standing around watching him.  It is not really Fortson's fault, because (1) there is no structure to our offense, and (2) Pelphrey permits him to do it.  It is not a good thing for your point guard to have a shoot first mentality (for the entire game). 

[HogInThaGrove]

And as he does more, his team mates will do less.  The team mates will be standing around watching him.  It is not really Fortson's fault, because (1) there is no structure to our offense, and (2) Pelphrey permits him to do it.  It is not a good thing for your point guard to have a shoot first mentality (for the entire game). 

Georgetown was pretty good with Allen Iverson.  Memphis with Derek Rose.  Shoot first point guards can be an asset....if their shot selection is on point.  If not, they can be detrimental.  Fortson has good days and bad days.  He is just a sophomore though, we can't expect him to play like  a senior every night.  And he's 2 games off suspension and hadn't played in a real game, much less against Texas and MSU in almost a year.  Let's see how he does the rest of the year.