If Stan is fired, and Nutt stays, does that mean there

[007 License To Squeal]

is a double standard?

[Bvilleboar]

YES!

[H&D]

YES  :razorback:

[hogfan064]

Would you like me to dig up Barbaro so you can beat him?

[dmac_iz_kin]

no

I don't understand why this question is constantly circulating. Nutt has fan interest at a very high level. yes thats partly b/c of Dmac, Matt Jones,  players any ark coach would of had.  HDN is not a good coach, but he's still filling his arena, SH is not. its not about double standards, wins ,losses, offense defense, schemes, philosophies, its about A$$'s in the seats.

[007 License To Squeal]

but he's still filling his arena,

I disagree.  What filled the FB stadiums last year was the anticipation of MM and GM....IMO.

[hoghearted]

Nutt gets too much credit, IMO. Fans got excited at the prospect of finally having a balanced offense. Now that that possibility has been diminished, there will still be some interest related to DMac and Felix, but I don't think it will rise to the level of last season.

And yes, the double standard is quite apparent, even to the most cursory of examinations.

[hogfan064]

but he's still filling his arena,

I disagree.  What filled the FB stadiums last year was the anticipation of MM and GM....IMO.

That might have filled it for the Utah State game, but a top 10 football team is what filled the stands for the other games. 

[Steef]

no

I don't understand why this question is constantly circulating. Nutt has fan interest at a very high level. yes thats partly b/c of Dmac, Matt Jones,  players any ark coach would of had.  HDN is not a good coach, but he's still filling his arena, SH is not. its not about double standards, wins ,losses, offense defense, schemes, philosophies, its about A$$'s in the seats.

Serious question...I'm not trying to be smart, I just don't know, because I live out of state.

Did the football stadium get filled in 04 & 05? During the 'down' cycle?

IMO, HDN really isn't the architect of full-to-the-brim football stadiums. The fact that 'football is king' is filling those seats. Basketball doesn't enjoy that luxury, so how the team plays (in wins and style) CAN affect attendance.

I'm not a basketball afficionado, so I really have no opinion about Stan pro or con. But his accomplishments this year look (to me) to be exactly what HDN's accomplishments are:

1. He got to the SEC final...and failed.
2. He got to a 'bowl' game...and failed.
3. He lost to LSU, Florida and USC.

The only difference I can see, is the 'honor' factor.

[hogfan064]

Nutt 7-2 in SEC games, top 20 finish

Heath 10-10 in SEC games, nowhere near the top 25.   

Nutt coaching against 12 football schools

Heath coaching against 1 basketball school

Nutt has the harder job and did better this year.  Heath is a better man, but who would you rather have as a coach a jerk like Spurrier or a good man like Billy Graham?

[Bvilleboar]

no

I don't understand why this question is constantly circulating. Nutt has fan interest at a very high level. yes thats partly b/c of Dmac, Matt Jones,  players any ark coach would of had.  HDN is not a good coach, but he's still filling his arena, SH is not. its not about double standards, wins ,losses, offense defense, schemes, philosophies, its about A$$'s in the seats.

You can not compare attendance from a sport that has 5 home games a year to a sport that has 20.  Hell yeah the football stadium is going to be packed.  I have wanted Nutt gone for 5 years now yet I have not missed a single home game during that span of time.  I go to many of the Basketball games, but their are far too many to make all of them.

[mword]

No, not all. It just means that the Good Ole Boys system is still in affect.

[hogfan064]

no

I don't understand why this question is constantly circulating. Nutt has fan interest at a very high level. yes thats partly b/c of Dmac, Matt Jones,  players any ark coach would of had.  HDN is not a good coach, but he's still filling his arena, SH is not. its not about double standards, wins ,losses, offense defense, schemes, philosophies, its about A$$'s in the seats.

Serious question...I'm not trying to be smart, I just don't know, because I live out of state.

Did the football stadium get filled in 04 & 05? During the 'down' cycle?

IMO, HDN really isn't the architect of full-to-the-brim football stadiums. The fact that 'football is king' is filling those seats. Basketball doesn't enjoy that luxury, so how the team plays (in wins and style) CAN affect attendance.

I'm not a basketball afficionado, so I really have no opinion about Stan pro or con. But his accomplishments this year look (to me) to be exactly what HDN's accomplishments are:

1. He got to the SEC final...and failed.
2. He got to a 'bowl' game...and failed.
3. He lost to LSU, Florida and USC.

The only difference I can see, is the 'honor' factor.

Nowhere near the same.  Heath finished 10-10 .500 in conference games.  Nutt was 7-2.   Nutt's 4 losses were to 4 top 5 teams.  Heath had bad losses to Ole Miss, Auburn, South Carolina, Mizzou, Georgia, and MSU.

[Bvilleboar]

Nutt 7-2 in SEC games, top 20 finish

Heath 10-10 in SEC games, nowhere near the top 25.   

Nutt coaching against 12 football schools

Heath coaching against 1 basketball school

Nutt has the harder job and did better this year.  Heath is a better man, but who would you rather have as a coach a jerk like Spurrier or a good man like Billy Graham?

Sure take the stats from the 1 and ONLY 1 season that HDN had the best record in the West.  That is a good gauge for his success as a HC over 9 years!

[Tusks]

YES

[hogfan064]

Nutt 7-2 in SEC games, top 20 finish

Heath 10-10 in SEC games, nowhere near the top 25.   

Nutt coaching against 12 football schools

Heath coaching against 1 basketball school

Nutt has the harder job and did better this year.  Heath is a better man, but who would you rather have as a coach a jerk like Spurrier or a good man like Billy Graham?

Sure take the stats from the 1 and ONLY 1 season that HDN had the best record in the West.  That is a good gauge for his success as a HC over 9 years!

When speaking of who did a better job this past year then what stats do you think I would bring up?   At least after 5 years Nutt had a top 25 finish, Heath hasn't come close to that yet.  After 5 years Nutt had 0 losing season.  Heath has 2.   

I'm not defending Nutt b/c he's not the right coach for us, but he has done a much better job than Heath.  He also has a much tougher job than Heath because he has to compete against 11 football rabid schools.  Heath is competing against 1 school(and now maybe Florida) that really cares about basketball.

[pigmania]

A definite, YES!

[Cornhogio]

If we averaged 103% attendance in football this year, that tells me that if we were winning, we could easily fill an 80k+ stadium.  But, if we go back to the 4-7/5-7 years, we wouldn't be able to fill a 50k stadium.  The AD should be focused on what could be rather than what is.

[Bvilleboar]

A Pinto and a Pacer?  Both cars suck!  Does it really matter if one sucks a little less than the other? In both cases it is time to get a new car.

[Rockhawg]

IMO. Yes

[PorcineSublime]

Yes there is a double standard. Anyone who says differently is not looking at it realistically. I am not saying it is a race issue, I am just saying the FB coach will always be able to draw better and if he finishes .500 or better he gets postseason action. BB takes .667 or better just to get a sniff. You can say what you want about the SEC BB strength this year, but Tennesse and Vandy showed yesterday that this league is still tough.

Maybe it is time for Stan to go. Nice guys don't always finish first. But to say that HDN did not deserve firing after the back to back losing seasons is silly. I will not throw a fit if SH is let go, but be ready for the national media to have a field day, and it will be ugly. We are already the laughing stock of college sports for the BAC antics, might as well take the hit and hope for better days.

[mykidsdad]

but he's still filling his arena,

I disagree.  What filled the FB stadiums last year was the anticipation of MM and GM....IMO.

That might have filled it for the Utah State game, but a top 10 football team is what filled the stands for the other games. 

If you didn't notice we didn't and don't have a top 10 football team.

[coachp]

Yes, white haired devil still racist.  That is how it will look to recruits, trust me.

[hogfan064]

Yes there is a double standard. Anyone who says differently is not looking at it realistically. I am not saying it is a race issue, I am just saying the FB coach will always be able to draw better and if he finishes .500 or better he gets postseason action. BB takes .667 or better just to get a sniff. You can say what you want about the SEC BB strength this year, but Tennesse and Vandy showed yesterday that this league is still tough.

Maybe it is time for Stan to go. Nice guys don't always finish first. But to say that HDN did not deserve firing after the back to back losing seasons is silly. I will not throw a fit if SH is let go, but be ready for the national media to have a field day, and it will be ugly. We are already the laughing stock of college sports for the BAC antics, might as well take the hit and hope for better days.

The national media won't make this ugly.  Why would they.  What's the story for them to go on?  The national media has defended Nutt 90% of the time.  What the national media will see is that Arkansas, who is a tradition rich program, fired a guy with 0 NCAA tourney wins over 5 years.  This will be treated no different than when Mike Davis(who went to a final 4) was fired at Indiana.

[Steef]

no

I don't understand why this question is constantly circulating. Nutt has fan interest at a very high level. yes thats partly b/c of Dmac, Matt Jones,  players any ark coach would of had.  HDN is not a good coach, but he's still filling his arena, SH is not. its not about double standards, wins ,losses, offense defense, schemes, philosophies, its about A$$'s in the seats.

Serious question...I'm not trying to be smart, I just don't know, because I live out of state.

Did the football stadium get filled in 04 & 05? During the 'down' cycle?

IMO, HDN really isn't the architect of full-to-the-brim football stadiums. The fact that 'football is king' is filling those seats. Basketball doesn't enjoy that luxury, so how the team plays (in wins and style) CAN affect attendance.

I'm not a basketball afficionado, so I really have no opinion about Stan pro or con. But his accomplishments this year look (to me) to be exactly what HDN's accomplishments are:

1. He got to the SEC final...and failed.
2. He got to a 'bowl' game...and failed.
3. He lost to LSU, Florida and USC.

The only difference I can see, is the 'honor' factor.

Nowhere near the same.  Heath finished 10-10 .500 in conference games.  Nutt was 7-2.   Nutt's 4 losses were to 4 top 5 teams.  Heath had bad losses to Ole Miss, Auburn, South Carolina, Mizzou, Georgia, and MSU.

That's fair. That's fair. I said I didn't know much about basketball.

But...

Do you know the story in the bible of the 'manna from heaven'? That's when Moses and his people wandered in the desert for 40 years. God fed them by literally dropping food from heaven. Wafers called 'Manna'. They didn't earn. It just fell into their lap, literally.

For HDN in 06.......that manna was...DMAC.

HDN didn't earn DMAC, and without him, that SEC record would have looked just like Stan's.
You could even make a case for 'little manna'...if Bama had just thought to bring a kicker...for just one snap...just one.
Then 06 would have been 7-5, at best.

Again, I don't know BB, so did Stan have a DMAC on this team? Just askin'....'cause we're all trying to compare apples to apples. Right?

[hogfan064]

but he's still filling his arena,

I disagree.  What filled the FB stadiums last year was the anticipation of MM and GM....IMO.

That might have filled it for the Utah State game, but a top 10 football team is what filled the stands for the other games. 

If you didn't notice we didn't and don't have a top 10 football team.

Due to 2 postseason losses we didn't.  We had a top 10 team before the postseason started and there were no home games in the postseason.  The Gameday crowd we had as there to see a top 10 Hog team that hadn't lost in 2 months, not to see Gus and Mitch.

[WilsonHog]

Double standard? Of course there is, but not like most people think.

Allow me to relate an Al McGuire story to illustrate. At one point McGuire's son, Allie McGuire, played for him. Allie was getting some quality playing time, and another player came to Coach McGuire to complain. "Coach, I'm as good as Allie is." McGuire's response? "Allie is my son. You have to be better than him to play."

Think of it this way. Suppose Heath is fired/resign/takes another job. There will STILL be a double standard that favors Nutt over our new basketball coach, regardless of whether that coach is black, white, or green. Why? Because Nutt is (1) from Arkansas and (2) has the political connections.

That's reality.

[Steef]

Double standard? Of course there is, but not like most people think.

Allow me to relate an Al McGuire story to illustrate. At one point McGuire's son, Allie McGuire, played for him. Allie was getting some quality playing time, and another player came to Coach McGuire to complain. "Coach, I'm as good as Allie is." McGuire's response? "Allie is my son. You have to be better than him to play."

Think of it this way. Suppose Heath is fired/resign/takes another job. There will STILL be a double standard that favors Nutt over our new basketball coach, regardless of whether that coach is black, white, or green. Why? Because Nutt is (1) from Arkansas and (2) has the political connections.

That's reality.

Wilson!

We actually agree on something!  +1 !

Now, is there any part of that, that we as Hog fans should be happy or proud about?

[hogfan064]

no

I don't understand why this question is constantly circulating. Nutt has fan interest at a very high level. yes thats partly b/c of Dmac, Matt Jones,  players any ark coach would of had.  HDN is not a good coach, but he's still filling his arena, SH is not. its not about double standards, wins ,losses, offense defense, schemes, philosophies, its about A$$'s in the seats.

Serious question...I'm not trying to be smart, I just don't know, because I live out of state.

Did the football stadium get filled in 04 & 05? During the 'down' cycle?

IMO, HDN really isn't the architect of full-to-the-brim football stadiums. The fact that 'football is king' is filling those seats. Basketball doesn't enjoy that luxury, so how the team plays (in wins and style) CAN affect attendance.

I'm not a basketball afficionado, so I really have no opinion about Stan pro or con. But his accomplishments this year look (to me) to be exactly what HDN's accomplishments are:

1. He got to the SEC final...and failed.
2. He got to a 'bowl' game...and failed.
3. He lost to LSU, Florida and USC.

The only difference I can see, is the 'honor' factor.

Nowhere near the same.  Heath finished 10-10 .500 in conference games.  Nutt was 7-2.   Nutt's 4 losses were to 4 top 5 teams.  Heath had bad losses to Ole Miss, Auburn, South Carolina, Mizzou, Georgia, and MSU.

That's fair. That's fair. I said I didn't know much about basketball.

But...

Do you know the story in the bible of the 'manna from heaven'? That's when Moses and his people wandered in the desert for 40 years. God fed them by literally dropping food from heaven. Wafers called 'Manna'. They didn't earn. It just fell into their lap, literally.

For HDN in 06.......that manna was...DMAC.

HDN didn't earn DMAC, and without him, that SEC record would have looked just like Stan's.
You could even make a case for 'little manna'...if Bama had just thought to bring a kicker...for just one snap...just one.
Then 06 would have been 7-5, at best.

Again, I don't know BB, so did Stan have a DMAC on this team? Just askin'....'cause we're all trying to compare apples to apples. Right?

If Vandy scores on its final attempt in Atlanta then Heath would've been gone a week ago.  If South Carolina doesn't have 3 FGs blocked against Florida then the Gators aren't National Champs in CFB right now.

[hog.goblin]

You can not compare attendance from a sport that has 5 home games a year to a sport that has 20.  Hell yeah the football stadium is going to be packed.  I have wanted Nutt gone for 5 years now yet I have not missed a single home game during that span of time.  I go to many of the Basketball games, but their are far too many to make all of them.

ditto

[LilRounDevil]

Nutt should go too, but each deserves to go for their own reasons.  It's not a double standard, the needs of the two programs are different, the coaches are different, fan support is different, team makeup and depth is different.  Stan isn't cutting it at all.  Nutt has had some success, just not enough.

[LilRounDevil]

no

I don't understand why this question is constantly circulating. Nutt has fan interest at a very high level. yes thats partly b/c of Dmac, Matt Jones,  players any ark coach would of had.  HDN is not a good coach, but he's still filling his arena, SH is not. its not about double standards, wins ,losses, offense defense, schemes, philosophies, its about A$$'s in the seats.

Serious question...I'm not trying to be smart, I just don't know, because I live out of state.

Did the football stadium get filled in 04 & 05? During the 'down' cycle?

IMO, HDN really isn't the architect of full-to-the-brim football stadiums. The fact that 'football is king' is filling those seats. Basketball doesn't enjoy that luxury, so how the team plays (in wins and style) CAN affect attendance.

I'm not a basketball afficionado, so I really have no opinion about Stan pro or con. But his accomplishments this year look (to me) to be exactly what HDN's accomplishments are:

1. He got to the SEC final...and failed.
2. He got to a 'bowl' game...and failed.
3. He lost to LSU, Florida and USC.

The only difference I can see, is the 'honor' factor.

Nowhere near the same.  Heath finished 10-10 .500 in conference games.  Nutt was 7-2.   Nutt's 4 losses were to 4 top 5 teams.  Heath had bad losses to Ole Miss, Auburn, South Carolina, Mizzou, Georgia, and MSU.

That's fair. That's fair. I said I didn't know much about basketball.

But...

Do you know the story in the bible of the 'manna from heaven'? That's when Moses and his people wandered in the desert for 40 years. God fed them by literally dropping food from heaven. Wafers called 'Manna'. They didn't earn. It just fell into their lap, literally.

For HDN in 06.......that manna was...DMAC.

HDN didn't earn DMAC, and without him, that SEC record would have looked just like Stan's.
You could even make a case for 'little manna'...if Bama had just thought to bring a kicker...for just one snap...just one.
Then 06 would have been 7-5, at best.

Again, I don't know BB, so did Stan have a DMAC on this team? Just askin'....'cause we're all trying to compare apples to apples. Right?

If Vandy scores on its final attempt in Atlanta then Heath would've been gone a week ago.  If South Carolina doesn't have 3 FGs blocked against Florida then the Gators aren't National Champs in CFB right now.

Isn't if a great word.

[budcampbellfan]

Nutt should have been gone immediately after the 4-7 season at the very latest.  BS that he said we would have 2 "down" years.  "Down" year = 6-5+small bowl, not 5-6 or 4-7.

Now Broyles has screwed us out of yet another year of football.

[hogfan064]

Double standard? Of course there is, but not like most people think.

Allow me to relate an Al McGuire story to illustrate. At one point McGuire's son, Allie McGuire, played for him. Allie was getting some quality playing time, and another player came to Coach McGuire to complain. "Coach, I'm as good as Allie is." McGuire's response? "Allie is my son. You have to be better than him to play."

Think of it this way. Suppose Heath is fired/resign/takes another job. There will STILL be a double standard that favors Nutt over our new basketball coach, regardless of whether that coach is black, white, or green. Why? Because Nutt is (1) from Arkansas and (2) has the political connections.

That's reality.

I don't think it is even that complicated.  The double standard that exists is the idea that Arkanas football has a tougher time winning in the SEC than Arkansas basketball.   History says that our football program will continue to at best hover around 8-10 wins in the SEC and get a Cotton Bowl bid or a lesser bowl.  This will make most fans happy regardless of who is coach. 

In Basketball we have proven that we are a better program than everyone in the league besides Kentucky and thus fans hold the basketball program to a higher level. 

Our National Championship run in basketball is still fresh in all big $$$ donors minds.  It wasn't that long ago.  OUr glory days of football are remembered only by older folks who have come to accept that Arkansas football will never reach the days of the past. 

There's your double standard.

[Bvilleboar]

no

I don't understand why this question is constantly circulating. Nutt has fan interest at a very high level. yes thats partly b/c of Dmac, Matt Jones,  players any ark coach would of had.  HDN is not a good coach, but he's still filling his arena, SH is not. its not about double standards, wins ,losses, offense defense, schemes, philosophies, its about A$$'s in the seats.

Serious question...I'm not trying to be smart, I just don't know, because I live out of state.

Did the football stadium get filled in 04 & 05? During the 'down' cycle?

IMO, HDN really isn't the architect of full-to-the-brim football stadiums. The fact that 'football is king' is filling those seats. Basketball doesn't enjoy that luxury, so how the team plays (in wins and style) CAN affect attendance.

I'm not a basketball afficionado, so I really have no opinion about Stan pro or con. But his accomplishments this year look (to me) to be exactly what HDN's accomplishments are:

1. He got to the SEC final...and failed.
2. He got to a 'bowl' game...and failed.
3. He lost to LSU, Florida and USC.

The only difference I can see, is the 'honor' factor.

Nowhere near the same.  Heath finished 10-10 .500 in conference games.  Nutt was 7-2.   Nutt's 4 losses were to 4 top 5 teams.  Heath had bad losses to Ole Miss, Auburn, South Carolina, Mizzou, Georgia, and MSU.

That's fair. That's fair. I said I didn't know much about basketball.

But...

Do you know the story in the bible of the 'manna from heaven'? That's when Moses and his people wandered in the desert for 40 years. God fed them by literally dropping food from heaven. Wafers called 'Manna'. They didn't earn. It just fell into their lap, literally.

For HDN in 06.......that manna was...DMAC.

HDN didn't earn DMAC, and without him, that SEC record would have looked just like Stan's.
You could even make a case for 'little manna'...if Bama had just thought to bring a kicker...for just one snap...just one.
Then 06 would have been 7-5, at best.

Again, I don't know BB, so did Stan have a DMAC on this team? Just askin'....'cause we're all trying to compare apples to apples. Right?

If Vandy scores on its final attempt in Atlanta then Heath would've been gone a week ago.  If South Carolina doesn't have 3 FGs blocked against Florida then the Gators aren't National Champs in CFB right now.

If Bama doesn't miss three field goals and the sudden gust of wind doesn't stop Vandy's game winning field goal then HDN is gone already.

[Steef]

no

I don't understand why this question is constantly circulating. Nutt has fan interest at a very high level. yes thats partly b/c of Dmac, Matt Jones,  players any ark coach would of had.  HDN is not a good coach, but he's still filling his arena, SH is not. its not about double standards, wins ,losses, offense defense, schemes, philosophies, its about A$$'s in the seats.

Serious question...I'm not trying to be smart, I just don't know, because I live out of state.

Did the football stadium get filled in 04 & 05? During the 'down' cycle?

IMO, HDN really isn't the architect of full-to-the-brim football stadiums. The fact that 'football is king' is filling those seats. Basketball doesn't enjoy that luxury, so how the team plays (in wins and style) CAN affect attendance.

I'm not a basketball afficionado, so I really have no opinion about Stan pro or con. But his accomplishments this year look (to me) to be exactly what HDN's accomplishments are:

1. He got to the SEC final...and failed.
2. He got to a 'bowl' game...and failed.
3. He lost to LSU, Florida and USC.

The only difference I can see, is the 'honor' factor.

Nowhere near the same.  Heath finished 10-10 .500 in conference games.  Nutt was 7-2.   Nutt's 4 losses were to 4 top 5 teams.  Heath had bad losses to Ole Miss, Auburn, South Carolina, Mizzou, Georgia, and MSU.

That's fair. That's fair. I said I didn't know much about basketball.

But...

Do you know the story in the bible of the 'manna from heaven'? That's when Moses and his people wandered in the desert for 40 years. God fed them by literally dropping food from heaven. Wafers called 'Manna'. They didn't earn. It just fell into their lap, literally.

For HDN in 06.......that manna was...DMAC.

HDN didn't earn DMAC, and without him, that SEC record would have looked just like Stan's.
You could even make a case for 'little manna'...if Bama had just thought to bring a kicker...for just one snap...just one.
Then 06 would have been 7-5, at best.

Again, I don't know BB, so did Stan have a DMAC on this team? Just askin'....'cause we're all trying to compare apples to apples. Right?

If Vandy scores on its final attempt in Atlanta then Heath would've been gone a week ago.  If South Carolina doesn't have 3 FGs blocked against Florida then the Gators aren't National Champs in CFB right now.

With respect, I can't figure out if you are now agreeing or disagreeing with me. I take it that you're making a point about the 'luck' factor that influenced the outcome of the SEC in general, and Razorbacks in particular. We had our own share of luck this past season, and I've already mentioned two. Here's a couple more.

Tuberville must have been brain-dead to not adjust to DMAC at halftime. Worst coaching he did all year.
Tenn's all-star QB was injured and their two best DB's were out on suspension.
Spurrier found himself a QB...after we ran up a lead he couldn't catch.
In that same game, someone bludgeoned Herring over the head with 5 min. left, to get him into a zone that saved the game.

Just sayin'

[hogfan064]

no

I don't understand why this question is constantly circulating. Nutt has fan interest at a very high level. yes thats partly b/c of Dmac, Matt Jones,  players any ark coach would of had.  HDN is not a good coach, but he's still filling his arena, SH is not. its not about double standards, wins ,losses, offense defense, schemes, philosophies, its about A$$'s in the seats.

Serious question...I'm not trying to be smart, I just don't know, because I live out of state.

Did the football stadium get filled in 04 & 05? During the 'down' cycle?

IMO, HDN really isn't the architect of full-to-the-brim football stadiums. The fact that 'football is king' is filling those seats. Basketball doesn't enjoy that luxury, so how the team plays (in wins and style) CAN affect attendance.

I'm not a basketball afficionado, so I really have no opinion about Stan pro or con. But his accomplishments this year look (to me) to be exactly what HDN's accomplishments are:

1. He got to the SEC final...and failed.
2. He got to a 'bowl' game...and failed.
3. He lost to LSU, Florida and USC.

The only difference I can see, is the 'honor' factor.

Nowhere near the same.  Heath finished 10-10 .500 in conference games.  Nutt was 7-2.   Nutt's 4 losses were to 4 top 5 teams.  Heath had bad losses to Ole Miss, Auburn, South Carolina, Mizzou, Georgia, and MSU.

That's fair. That's fair. I said I didn't know much about basketball.

But...

Do you know the story in the bible of the 'manna from heaven'? That's when Moses and his people wandered in the desert for 40 years. God fed them by literally dropping food from heaven. Wafers called 'Manna'. They didn't earn. It just fell into their lap, literally.

For HDN in 06.......that manna was...DMAC.

HDN didn't earn DMAC, and without him, that SEC record would have looked just like Stan's.
You could even make a case for 'little manna'...if Bama had just thought to bring a kicker...for just one snap...just one.
Then 06 would have been 7-5, at best.

Again, I don't know BB, so did Stan have a DMAC on this team? Just askin'....'cause we're all trying to compare apples to apples. Right?

If Vandy scores on its final attempt in Atlanta then Heath would've been gone a week ago.  If South Carolina doesn't have 3 FGs blocked against Florida then the Gators aren't National Champs in CFB right now.

If Bama doesn't miss three field goals and the sudden gust of wind doesn't stop Vandy's game winning field goal then HDN is gone already.

If Stoerner doesn't fumble then Nutt might have won a NC.  If Jones doesn't fumble late against Texas then Nutt is 3-0 against Texas.  If not for a bad whistle against South Carolina in 04, then Nutt goes bowling and has only 1 losing season. 

If Atwater holds onto that INT against Miami in 88 the Hogs finish 11-0 in the regular season and who knows what happens then. 

We could "if" outcomes all day.  We got to deal with the facts.

[Steef]

Man, did you have to bring up the Atwater thing? That play still haunts me!

Bottom line, Nutt had some luck this year in order to look as good as he did. I'm not supporting Stan. I don't know about him and will gladly accede to others.

But Nutt's gotta go.

[hogfan064]

no

I don't understand why this question is constantly circulating. Nutt has fan interest at a very high level. yes thats partly b/c of Dmac, Matt Jones,  players any ark coach would of had.  HDN is not a good coach, but he's still filling his arena, SH is not. its not about double standards, wins ,losses, offense defense, schemes, philosophies, its about A$$'s in the seats.

Serious question...I'm not trying to be smart, I just don't know, because I live out of state.

Did the football stadium get filled in 04 & 05? During the 'down' cycle?

IMO, HDN really isn't the architect of full-to-the-brim football stadiums. The fact that 'football is king' is filling those seats. Basketball doesn't enjoy that luxury, so how the team plays (in wins and style) CAN affect attendance.

I'm not a basketball afficionado, so I really have no opinion about Stan pro or con. But his accomplishments this year look (to me) to be exactly what HDN's accomplishments are:

1. He got to the SEC final...and failed.
2. He got to a 'bowl' game...and failed.
3. He lost to LSU, Florida and USC.

The only difference I can see, is the 'honor' factor.

Nowhere near the same.  Heath finished 10-10 .500 in conference games.  Nutt was 7-2.   Nutt's 4 losses were to 4 top 5 teams.  Heath had bad losses to Ole Miss, Auburn, South Carolina, Mizzou, Georgia, and MSU.

That's fair. That's fair. I said I didn't know much about basketball.

But...

Do you know the story in the bible of the 'manna from heaven'? That's when Moses and his people wandered in the desert for 40 years. God fed them by literally dropping food from heaven. Wafers called 'Manna'. They didn't earn. It just fell into their lap, literally.

For HDN in 06.......that manna was...DMAC.

HDN didn't earn DMAC, and without him, that SEC record would have looked just like Stan's.
You could even make a case for 'little manna'...if Bama had just thought to bring a kicker...for just one snap...just one.
Then 06 would have been 7-5, at best.

Again, I don't know BB, so did Stan have a DMAC on this team? Just askin'....'cause we're all trying to compare apples to apples. Right?

If Vandy scores on its final attempt in Atlanta then Heath would've been gone a week ago.  If South Carolina doesn't have 3 FGs blocked against Florida then the Gators aren't National Champs in CFB right now.

With respect, I can't figure out if you are now agreeing or disagreeing with me. I take it that you're making a point about the 'luck' factor that influenced the outcome of the SEC in general, and Razorbacks in particular. We had our own share of luck this past season, and I've already mentioned two. Here's a couple more.

Tuberville must have been brain-dead to not adjust to DMAC at halftime. Worst coaching he did all year.
Tenn's all-star QB was injured and their two best DB's were out on suspension.
Spurrier found himself a QB...after we ran up a lead he couldn't catch.
In that same game, someone bludgeoned Herring over the head with 5 min. left, to get him into a zone that saved the game.

Just sayin'

If you take anything out of anything I say let it be this

The SEC is a football conference.   Year round all SEC cities talk nothing but football.  Talk shows are devoted to recruiting 24/7.  Message board conversation is 80% football.  Kids are named Bear, Steve, Jordan, Vince, and Vaught.   Fans schedule vacations around bowl games and football road trips.   People miss wedding and funerals for college football in the SEC.  Schools spend millions in constant arm races to build bigger stadiums and better facilities.  The competetion in SEC football is high every where. Every SEC school besides MSU, Vandy, UK, and USC have a national championship and even South Carolina came close in 84 and now has possibly the SEC's best coach in the last quarter century.

When December roles around only UK and Arkansas will pack a SEC basketball arena.  Watch an Ole Miss, UGA, USC, or Auburn SEC basketball game and you might see 5,000 in attendance.  I live near Columbia, SC and the Gamecock fans care more about college baseball than basketball(LSU, MSU and Ole Miss are likely the same).   Several SEC schools have outdated facilities and noone is going to donate millions to change that.  Kids aren't named after Pistol Pete, Shaq, Charles Barkley, Alex English, or Dominique Wilkins.  Frank Mcguire's funeral didn't have truckers pulling over to the side of the road like Bear's did.  Entire towns don't shut down to watch a Georgia-Auburn basketball game.  Only UK and Arkansas have success in SEC basketball.  Florida is now on the map, but is still a new kid at the game. 


Point is to win at Arkansas in basketball is much easier than in football.  That's a fact.  Noone in the SEC(besides UK) comes close to our facilities, fans, and tradition in basketball.  In football we're matched and beaten in those catagories by 9 teams. 

Your double standard is that Nutt has a much tougher job than Heath.

[RazorRaider]

no

I don't understand why this question is constantly circulating. Nutt has fan interest at a very high level. yes thats partly b/c of Dmac, Matt Jones,  players any ark coach would of had.  HDN is not a good coach, but he's still filling his arena, SH is not. its not about double standards, wins ,losses, offense defense, schemes, philosophies, its about A$$'s in the seats.

Serious question...I'm not trying to be smart, I just don't know, because I live out of state.

Did the football stadium get filled in 04 & 05? During the 'down' cycle?

IMO, HDN really isn't the architect of full-to-the-brim football stadiums. The fact that 'football is king' is filling those seats. Basketball doesn't enjoy that luxury, so how the team plays (in wins and style) CAN affect attendance.

I'm not a basketball afficionado, so I really have no opinion about Stan pro or con. But his accomplishments this year look (to me) to be exactly what HDN's accomplishments are:

1. He got to the SEC final...and failed.
2. He got to a 'bowl' game...and failed.
3. He lost to LSU, Florida and USC.

The only difference I can see, is the 'honor' factor.

Nowhere near the same.  Heath finished 10-10 .500 in conference games.  Nutt was 7-2.   Nutt's 4 losses were to 4 top 5 teams.  Heath had bad losses to Ole Miss, Auburn, South Carolina, Mizzou, Georgia, and MSU.

That's fair. That's fair. I said I didn't know much about basketball.

But...

Do you know the story in the bible of the 'manna from heaven'? That's when Moses and his people wandered in the desert for 40 years. God fed them by literally dropping food from heaven. Wafers called 'Manna'. They didn't earn. It just fell into their lap, literally.

For HDN in 06.......that manna was...DMAC.

HDN didn't earn DMAC, and without him, that SEC record would have looked just like Stan's.
You could even make a case for 'little manna'...if Bama had just thought to bring a kicker...for just one snap...just one.
Then 06 would have been 7-5, at best.

Again, I don't know BB, so did Stan have a DMAC on this team? Just askin'....'cause we're all trying to compare apples to apples. Right?

If Vandy scores on its final attempt in Atlanta then Heath would've been gone a week ago.  If South Carolina doesn't have 3 FGs blocked against Florida then the Gators aren't National Champs in CFB right now.

With respect, I can't figure out if you are now agreeing or disagreeing with me. I take it that you're making a point about the 'luck' factor that influenced the outcome of the SEC in general, and Razorbacks in particular. We had our own share of luck this past season, and I've already mentioned two. Here's a couple more.

Tuberville must have been brain-dead to not adjust to DMAC at halftime. Worst coaching he did all year.
Tenn's all-star QB was injured and their two best DB's were out on suspension.
Spurrier found himself a QB...after we ran up a lead he couldn't catch.
In that same game, someone bludgeoned Herring over the head with 5 min. left, to get him into a zone that saved the game.

Just sayin'

If you take anything out of anything I say let it be this

The SEC is a football conference.   Year round all SEC cities talk nothing but football.  Talk shows are devoted to recruiting 24/7.  Message board conversation is 80% football.  Kids are named Bear, Steve, Jordan, Vince, and Vaught.   Fans schedule vacations around bowl games and football road trips.   People miss wedding and funerals for college football in the SEC.  Schools spend millions in constant arm races to build bigger stadiums and better facilities.  The competetion in SEC football is high every where. Every SEC school besides MSU, Vandy, UK, and USC have a national championship and even South Carolina came close in 84 and now has possibly the SEC's best coach in the last quarter century.

When December roles around only UK and Arkansas will pack a SEC basketball arena.  Watch an Ole Miss, UGA, USC, or Auburn SEC basketball game and you might see 5,000 in attendance.  I live near Columbia, SC and the Gamecock fans care more about college baseball than basketball(LSU, MSU and Ole Miss are likely the same).   Several SEC schools have outdated facilities and noone is going to donate millions to change that.  Kids aren't named after Pistol Pete, Shaq, Charles Barkley, Alex English, or Dominique Wilkins.  Frank Mcguire's funeral didn't have truckers pulling over to the side of the road like Bear's did.  Entire towns don't shut down to watch a Georgia-Auburn basketball game.  Only UK and Arkansas have success in SEC basketball.  Florida is now on the map, but is still a new kid at the game. 


Point is to win at Arkansas in basketball is much easier than in football.  That's a fact.  Noone in the SEC(besides UK) comes close to our facilities, fans, and tradition in basketball.  In football we're matched and beaten in those catagories by 9 teams. 

Your double standard is that Nutt has a much tougher job than Heath.

The real double standard is that Nutt has had twice as long to get the job done as Heath has.

But since both have been around long enough to have gotten thigns done I say fire them both.

[Bvilleboar]

no

I don't understand why this question is constantly circulating. Nutt has fan interest at a very high level. yes thats partly b/c of Dmac, Matt Jones,  players any ark coach would of had.  HDN is not a good coach, but he's still filling his arena, SH is not. its not about double standards, wins ,losses, offense defense, schemes, philosophies, its about A$$'s in the seats.

Serious question...I'm not trying to be smart, I just don't know, because I live out of state.

Did the football stadium get filled in 04 & 05? During the 'down' cycle?

IMO, HDN really isn't the architect of full-to-the-brim football stadiums. The fact that 'football is king' is filling those seats. Basketball doesn't enjoy that luxury, so how the team plays (in wins and style) CAN affect attendance.

I'm not a basketball afficionado, so I really have no opinion about Stan pro or con. But his accomplishments this year look (to me) to be exactly what HDN's accomplishments are:

1. He got to the SEC final...and failed.
2. He got to a 'bowl' game...and failed.
3. He lost to LSU, Florida and USC.

The only difference I can see, is the 'honor' factor.

Nowhere near the same.  Heath finished 10-10 .500 in conference games.  Nutt was 7-2.   Nutt's 4 losses were to 4 top 5 teams.  Heath had bad losses to Ole Miss, Auburn, South Carolina, Mizzou, Georgia, and MSU.

That's fair. That's fair. I said I didn't know much about basketball.

But...

Do you know the story in the bible of the 'manna from heaven'? That's when Moses and his people wandered in the desert for 40 years. God fed them by literally dropping food from heaven. Wafers called 'Manna'. They didn't earn. It just fell into their lap, literally.

For HDN in 06.......that manna was...DMAC.

HDN didn't earn DMAC, and without him, that SEC record would have looked just like Stan's.
You could even make a case for 'little manna'...if Bama had just thought to bring a kicker...for just one snap...just one.
Then 06 would have been 7-5, at best.

Again, I don't know BB, so did Stan have a DMAC on this team? Just askin'....'cause we're all trying to compare apples to apples. Right?

If Vandy scores on its final attempt in Atlanta then Heath would've been gone a week ago.  If South Carolina doesn't have 3 FGs blocked against Florida then the Gators aren't National Champs in CFB right now.

With respect, I can't figure out if you are now agreeing or disagreeing with me. I take it that you're making a point about the 'luck' factor that influenced the outcome of the SEC in general, and Razorbacks in particular. We had our own share of luck this past season, and I've already mentioned two. Here's a couple more.

Tuberville must have been brain-dead to not adjust to DMAC at halftime. Worst coaching he did all year.
Tenn's all-star QB was injured and their two best DB's were out on suspension.
Spurrier found himself a QB...after we ran up a lead he couldn't catch.
In that same game, someone bludgeoned Herring over the head with 5 min. left, to get him into a zone that saved the game.

Just sayin'

If you take anything out of anything I say let it be this

The SEC is a football conference.   Year round all SEC cities talk nothing but football.  Talk shows are devoted to recruiting 24/7.  Message board conversation is 80% football.  Kids are named Bear, Steve, Jordan, Vince, and Vaught.   Fans schedule vacations around bowl games and football road trips.   People miss wedding and funerals for college football in the SEC.  Schools spend millions in constant arm races to build bigger stadiums and better facilities.  The competetion in SEC football is high every where. Every SEC school besides MSU, Vandy, UK, and USC have a national championship and even South Carolina came close in 84 and now has possibly the SEC's best coach in the last quarter century.

When December roles around only UK and Arkansas will pack a SEC basketball arena.  Watch an Ole Miss, UGA, USC, or Auburn SEC basketball game and you might see 5,000 in attendance.  I live near Columbia, SC and the Gamecock fans care more about college baseball than basketball(LSU, MSU and Ole Miss are likely the same).   Several SEC schools have outdated facilities and noone is going to donate millions to change that.  Kids aren't named after Pistol Pete, Shaq, Charles Barkley, Alex English, or Dominique Wilkins.  Frank Mcguire's funeral didn't have truckers pulling over to the side of the road like Bear's did.  Entire towns don't shut down to watch a Georgia-Auburn basketball game.  Only UK and Arkansas have success in SEC basketball.  Florida is now on the map, but is still a new kid at the game. 


Point is to win at Arkansas in basketball is much easier than in football.  That's a fact.  Noone in the SEC(besides UK) comes close to our facilities, fans, and tradition in basketball.  In football we're matched and beaten in those catagories by 9 teams. 

Your double standard is that Nutt has a much tougher job than Heath.

The real double standard is that Nutt has had twice as long to get the job done as Heath has.

But since both have been around long enough to have gotten thigns done I say fire them both.

+1 Raider.  Simple and true.  Well said.

[Karma]

but he's still filling his arena,

I disagree.  What filled the FB stadiums last year was the anticipation of MM and GM....IMO.

It was filled 2 years ago too. And 3 years ago . . .

[Steef]

Double standard?  Hell, I'm not aware of any standards up there.

Okay. Now, THAT's funny! +1

Or is it just sad?

[slopinhogs]

YES

[WestMemphisHogFan]

Would you like me to dig up Barbaro so you can beat him?

Now that is funny. I needed something to brighten up my dreary Saturday morning!! Thanks!

[hogfan064]

Would you like me to dig up Barbaro so you can beat him?

Now that is funny. I needed something to brighten up my dreary Saturday morning!! Thanks!

Finally someone appreciates my humor

[IBreal]

Double standards.  Whatever would make a person think of such a thing.  the Good Ol Boys system doesn't calculate to double standards.