Is anyone else worried about Duwop transferring?

[HogMantheIntruder]

Sorry if this has already been discussed, but I haven't seen it if it has.  I think everyone agrees that DM is, at the very least, a superb athlete.  Moving out of the QB position is tough by itself, but to have that much ability and hardly ever see the field has got to be hard to swallow.  I just wonder about his future here.  I hope like hell he stays and they find a way to really utilize  him this year in the offense. 

[hogcam]

I hope he does great just like I do every razorback.. But why would we worry about losing someone who hasnt seen the field? It's like he's the next vin ascolese or Kane whitehurst.  He's an athlete just like every other skill player that signs with an SEC team.  Everyone on here has these opinions about him like he should be playing, but there's a reason he hasn't.. With all that said, I hope he stays here and does great. And It kind of sounds like I'm frustrated with your post, but I'm not. It's just weird to me seeing all the stuff on here about him.

[arsuperhog]

I think he could our answer at receiver. Though he hasn't shown to be as athletic as Joe Adams, I think he can be used in a similar way. He can line up at tailback or receiver. I think he can be a versatile weapon if used properly.

[Iwastherein1969]

I think he could our answer at receiver. Though he hasn't shown to be as athletic as Joe Adams, I think he can be used in a similar way. He can line up at tailback or receiver. I think he can be a versatile weapon if used properly.

this...most QB's make very good receivers because they understand the routes..see AJ Derby...it would be a shame to let a guy with the natural ability of Du Wop leave without really giving him a shot to prove himself...I don't like the fact that Damon hasnt played enough, but that's not my call.

[CattleCorn]

Honest question:  what are some of the primary reasons that good HS quarterbacks get scholarships and then never see the light of day?  In other words, what are they typically not able to do at the college level that is keeping them off the field?

[Hogfaniam]

Honest question:  what are some of the primary reasons that good HS quarterbacks get scholarships and then never see the light of day?  In other words, what are they typically not able to do at the college level that is keeping them off the field?

Can't adjust to the concentration of overall defensive speed at the next level.  It's a whole new world.

[scruf]

Nope. He's been all in since August of last year when he didn't transfer out after switching to WR in the spring of 2014. Put a fork in this topic.

[gawntrail]

Honest question:  what are some of the primary reasons that good HS quarterbacks get scholarships and then never see the light of day?  In other words, what are they typically not able to do at the college level that is keeping them off the field?

HS coach never taught them fundamentals of the QB position.  Just being an athlete got them wherever/whatever was needed.

Presnap reads
Understanding numbers on both sides of defense
Shift/motion alignment changes of defense
Initial coverage
Masked coverage
Blitz recognition
Check down
Route recognition
Hot routes
Choice routes
Hi/low reads
L/R reads
Back shoulder
Loft/touch on ball
Internal clock
Etc...

Most HS coaches have a system/playbook and conceptually understand it.  Less understand how to teach it.  Even less know how to identify what/why something isn't working in general, let alone specific to their stuff. 

One example...

Read option mesh.  There is one way right way to teach the read option mesh.  Yet, you can watch 10 different teams' cutups and it looks different each time.  Let alone watching one teams season cutups.  If the mesh is not taught and run correctly, then the read is not true.  If the read is not true, then the decision to give/pull based on the DE/EMOL is not measurable.  Its just guessing.  And guessing leads to the QB having to make an athletic move or 'make something happen' in order to achieve success on that given play.

I have a rule of thumb.  The more athletic the QB HAS TO BE the weaker the fundamentals of the basic workings of the scheme are. 

Using this example....

Urban Meyer's fundamental scheme is sound.  He can plug in any QB, that is practicing his sub scheme in his QB group, and it works. 

That is one example, but, if you look at a sampling of each fundamental skill and compare to a known successful model of what it should look like, understand why and how it is right, then you can teach it and coach it.

Anybody worthy of the title coach can identify talent and put them in positions and achieve something.  Good coaches understand scheme and really know how to best utilize talent.
Great coaches can 'force multiply' their talent by actually coaching a kid up in a manner that makes him better than his raw talent.

[cypert2]

We wouldn't miss him one bit.

[lefty08]

Why do people always assume when an athlete can't find the field it's due to not being given a fair shot?

[iseeredpeople]

We have to find 11 spots to be able to sign 25 next year. They have to come from somewhere.

[Inhogswetrust]

Why do people always assume when an athlete can't find the field it's due to not being given a fair shot?

It's the conspiracy theory.......................................there is a segment of society that thrives on it.

[rlreev01]

Are you really that worried that he stays or are you more worried that you can't pull for a guy named Du Wop? Just sayin?

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Sorry if this has already been discussed, but I haven't seen it if it has.  I think everyone agrees that DM is, at the very least, a superb athlete.  Moving out of the QB position is tough by itself, but to have that much ability and hardly ever see the field has got to be hard to swallow.  I just wonder about his future here.  I hope like hell he stays and they find a way to really utilize  him this year in the offense. 

From right now through sping practice will be a key time for him and everyone else to ramp up their performance and earn a position that offers playing time. I have always heard what a great and versatile athlete that he is, but something has to be missing in his overall performance or he would be getting playing time. What it is that is missing, I have no idea. But like everyone else, this is his golden opportunity.

[nchogg]

We wouldn't miss him one bit.

I think we would miss him. Many players have changed positions and done very well. You have no idea what the coaches have in store for him. Your comment is a cheap shot and I hope he has a very productive season.

[MultipleScoreGasms]

.....

[razorbacksnum1]

Why the infatuation with Duwop? If he leaves, he leaves. I don't want him to transfer but he needs to work hard for his playing time like all the other players. Nothing is going to be handed to him. If he's the best wide receiver then he needs to play if not then he needs to keep working hard or transfer.

[Lake City Hog]

People are expecting a kid that has never played receiver to come in a beat other kids that have played receiver their whole careers, why?
Probably for the same reason that certain people think that over half the newcomers from this class should take PT from established players.

[tophawg19]

it takes time to adapt to changing positions for younger players . Also the coaches  have to decide where he best fits and how to use him . whether it be at WR or RB . He could even wind up at D-back or safety before his time ends

[MuskogeeHogFan]

People are expecting a kid that has never played receiver to come in a beat other kids that have played receiver their whole careers, why?
Probably for the same reason that certain people think that over half the newcomers from this class should take PT from established players.

It isn't as if it hasn't happened before. QB's moving to WR should be a relatively easy transition especially since they should be familiar with the route trees, where receivers are supposed to be at a precise time and what benefits the QB in their system. Now who knows, maybe DuWop will emerge or find a way to be utilized under a new OC with a different perspective of both him and how he can be used in this system? We will see. 

[OneTuskOverTheLine™]

HS coach never taught them fundamentals of the QB position.  Just being an athlete got them wherever/whatever was needed.

Presnap reads
Understanding numbers on both sides of defense
Shift/motion alignment changes of defense
Initial coverage
Masked coverage
Blitz recognition
Check down
Route recognition
Hot routes
Choice routes
Hi/low reads
L/R reads
Back shoulder
Loft/touch on ball
Internal clock
Etc...

Most HS coaches have a system/playbook and conceptually understand it.  Less understand how to teach it.  Even less know how to identify what/why something isn't working in general, let alone specific to their stuff. 

One example...

Read option mesh.  There is one way right way to teach the read option mesh.  Yet, you can watch 10 different teams' cutups and it looks different each time.  Let alone watching one teams season cutups.  If the mesh is not taught and run correctly, then the read is not true.  If the read is not true, then the decision to give/pull based on the DE/EMOL is not measurable.  Its just guessing.  And guessing leads to the QB having to make an athletic move or 'make something happen' in order to achieve success on that given play.

I have a rule of thumb.  The more athletic the QB HAS TO BE the weaker the fundamentals of the basic workings of the scheme are. 

Using this example....

Urban Meyer's fundamental scheme is sound.  He can plug in any QB, that is practicing his sub scheme in his QB group, and it works. 

That is one example, but, if you look at a sampling of each fundamental skill and compare to a known successful model of what it should look like, understand why and how it is right, then you can teach it and coach it.

Anybody worthy of the title coach can identify talent and put them in positions and achieve something.  Good coaches understand scheme and really know how to best utilize talent.
Great coaches can 'force multiply' their talent by actually coaching a kid up in a manner that makes him better than his raw talent.

Dude I was convinced you had verbatim taken your post from a textbook or some other reading material. This is very detailed, and your observation on Meyer is very true. The only DC that I have seen have immediate success against him was Willy Robinson. Willy was lightyears ahead of anyone he coached against scheme wise. He made Gus look silly. He just didn't have the horses to get it done against a smash mouth team like Bama... Your post reminded me of a conversation I had with him. Except he got bored real quickly when he realized he was talking over my head.. LOL..! I believe we have another good one now as well...

[Hogarusa]

No

[Seebs]

He can start over at another place or start over here iwth a new OC that he can shine for during spring. If he gets the feeling that there is no room at the inn afte spring drills he transfers.

We 'should' be losing many more to get to that '11' to make 25 number.

[texas tush hog]

Nope. He's been all in since August of last year when he didn't transfer out after switching to WR in the spring of 2014. Put a fork in this topic.

Not the least bit worried about this, those are the coaches concerns, and I am sure they are analyzing every aspect of it, and will continue to do so. They will tell Duwop their plans and he will then examine his options. Duwop is a great kid and we should not worry about him making the right decision. I personally agree with Scruff, and think he sticks it out, and makes this discussion ridiculous.

[26.2Hog]

Not the least bit worried about this, those are the coaches concerns, and I am sure they are analyzing every aspect of it, and will continue to do so. They will tell Duwop their plans and he will then examine his options. Duwop is a great kid and we should not worry about him making the right decision. I personally agree with Scruff, and think he sticks it out, and makes this discussion ridiculous.

I think you nailed it.

[kaki]

I know there are exceptions to every rule, but in general would you not expect that it is more in Duwop's court whether he sees the field?  One would would think the AJ Derby example would show you that this staff is looking to get contributors on the field. 

[Hoggish1]

Nope. He's been all in since August of last year when he didn't transfer out after switching to WR in the spring of 2014. Put a fork in this topic.

Agreed.

Sometimes it takes a while for a player to come into his own...

[cypert2]

We wouldn't miss him one bit.

I think we would miss him. Many players have changed positions and done very well. You have no idea what the coaches have in store for him. Your comment is a cheap shot and I hope he has a very productive season.

Not a cheap shot at all. So far, he has done absolutely nothing. Hard to miss something you've never seen. Think if he had the ability to be a productive receiver we would of already seen it. Maybe he'll prove me wrong.

[Quickdraw]

Beliema's character has shown he gives opportunity to play well enough to be in the rotation. It's up to Duwop to be successful. And I hope he is.

[JIHawg]

No-I'm more worried about why he hasn't worked hard enough to get more playing time.

[code red]

Sounds like JoJo is turning a lot of heads on the hill.  It wouldn't surprise me.

[Shoat]

It's the conspiracy theory.......................................there is a segment of society that thrives on it.

Just like the group that always believe that certain people EARN everything they get...Allen Boys?

[Capt_Marvel]

We have to find 11 spots to be able to sign 25 next year. They have to come from somewhere.

"Limits?  What limits??"

[coolhog]

I think they will use him in some packages as qb
Running the option.

[CattleCorn]

HS coach never taught them fundamentals of the QB position.  Just being an athlete got them wherever/whatever was needed.

Presnap reads
Understanding numbers on both sides of defense
Shift/motion alignment changes of defense
Initial coverage
Masked coverage
Blitz recognition
Check down
Route recognition
Hot routes
Choice routes
Hi/low reads
L/R reads
Back shoulder
Loft/touch on ball
Internal clock
Etc...

Most HS coaches have a system/playbook and conceptually understand it.  Less understand how to teach it.  Even less know how to identify what/why something isn't working in general, let alone specific to their stuff. 

One example...

Read option mesh.  There is one way right way to teach the read option mesh.  Yet, you can watch 10 different teams' cutups and it looks different each time.  Let alone watching one teams season cutups.  If the mesh is not taught and run correctly, then the read is not true.  If the read is not true, then the decision to give/pull based on the DE/EMOL is not measurable.  Its just guessing.  And guessing leads to the QB having to make an athletic move or 'make something happen' in order to achieve success on that given play.

I have a rule of thumb.  The more athletic the QB HAS TO BE the weaker the fundamentals of the basic workings of the scheme are. 

Using this example....

Urban Meyer's fundamental scheme is sound.  He can plug in any QB, that is practicing his sub scheme in his QB group, and it works. 

That is one example, but, if you look at a sampling of each fundamental skill and compare to a known successful model of what it should look like, understand why and how it is right, then you can teach it and coach it.

Anybody worthy of the title coach can identify talent and put them in positions and achieve something.  Good coaches understand scheme and really know how to best utilize talent.
Great coaches can 'force multiply' their talent by actually coaching a kid up in a manner that makes him better than his raw talent.

Thank you sir, +rep.  As a followup, how is it that these guys get recruited in the first place?  Is it hard to identify that the QB doesn't have the ability to do all the things in your list?

[Polecat]

I hope he stays but I can see him going somewhere else for PT. Same for Peavey if Storey is as good as advertised

[gawntrail]

Dude I was convinced you had verbatim taken your post from a textbook or some other reading material. This is very detailed, and your observation on Meyer is very true. The only DC that I have seen have immediate success against him was Willy Robinson. Willy was lightyears ahead of anyone he coached against scheme wise. He made Gus look silly. He just didn't have the horses to get it done against a smash mouth team like Bama... Your post reminded me of a conversation I had with him. Except he got bored real quickly when he realized he was talking over my head.. LOL..! I believe we have another good one now as well...

Thank you for the positive remarks.  If I post something its original or its cited. 

[beantownhog]

HS coach never taught them fundamentals of the QB position.  Just being an athlete got them wherever/whatever was needed.

Presnap reads
Understanding numbers on both sides of defense
Shift/motion alignment changes of defense
Initial coverage
Masked coverage
Blitz recognition
Check down
Route recognition
Hot routes
Choice routes
Hi/low reads
L/R reads
Back shoulder
Loft/touch on ball
Internal clock
Etc...

Most HS coaches have a system/playbook and conceptually understand it.  Less understand how to teach it.  Even less know how to identify what/why something isn't working in general, let alone specific to their stuff. 

One example...

Read option mesh.  There is one way right way to teach the read option mesh.  Yet, you can watch 10 different teams' cutups and it looks different each time.  Let alone watching one teams season cutups.  If the mesh is not taught and run correctly, then the read is not true.  If the read is not true, then the decision to give/pull based on the DE/EMOL is not measurable.  Its just guessing.  And guessing leads to the QB having to make an athletic move or 'make something happen' in order to achieve success on that given play.

I have a rule of thumb.  The more athletic the QB HAS TO BE the weaker the fundamentals of the basic workings of the scheme are. 

Using this example....

Urban Meyer's fundamental scheme is sound.  He can plug in any QB, that is practicing his sub scheme in his QB group, and it works. 

That is one example, but, if you look at a sampling of each fundamental skill and compare to a known successful model of what it should look like, understand why and how it is right, then you can teach it and coach it.

Anybody worthy of the title coach can identify talent and put them in positions and achieve something.  Good coaches understand scheme and really know how to best utilize talent.
Great coaches can 'force multiply' their talent by actually coaching a kid up in a manner that makes him better than his raw talent.

Great read!  +1

[Brass Knob]

People are expecting a kid that has never played receiver to come in a beat other kids that have played receiver their whole careers, why?
Probably for the same reason that certain people think that over half the newcomers from this class should take PT from established players.

[gawntrail]

Thank you sir, +rep.  As a followup, how is it that these guys get recruited in the first place?  Is it hard to identify that the QB doesn't have the ability to do all the things in your list?

In my opinion, they get recruited based on raw talent.  Many athletic QBs have some of the fundamental skills and coaches think they can teach the rest.  Not that a kid can't learn what is being taught, but, the rub is putting it all in to action in real time.  If I were recruiting a QB, the first thing I would research is his QB coach. 

Its very easy to identify what a QB ISN'T doing.  It takes a better eye and much more experience than I have to determine what a QB CAN'T do.  Again, looking at an 18 yr old.... I want to know the book on who is coaching him.  If he's not been getting the fundamentals for what I want to run, then, to me he's another athlete.  Its easier to teach other position fundamentals to a gifted athlete. 

I think if you need a prototype QB, you're better off looking for a less gifted athlete that has very good QB fundamentals.  These kids are out there by the hundreds.  Usually from private schools and/or semi affluent families.  Youth QB camps are not cheap.

Now, if you're wanting to run a straight read option scheme with some simple hi/lo-L/R and first read routes, then that very athletic, low QB fundamentals kid fits perfectly.  We see this all over the country now.

[IBleedRazorbackRed]

Do I think he may transfer? yes.
Am I worried about it? Absolutely not.

[gawntrail]

Thank you sir, +rep.  As a followup, how is it that these guys get recruited in the first place?  Is it hard to identify that the QB doesn't have the ability to do all the things in your list?

And, for what CBB is doing here at UofA, we can actually be very choosy on who we recruit and offer at QB.  We don't need Michael Vick athleticism and we don't need Peyton Manning QB IQ.  I think we can find very solid 2.0-2.5* QBs all day long that fit what we need on AND off the field.

I know that's where I'd be looking every year.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

And, for what CBB is doing here at UofA, we can actually be very choosy on who we recruit and offer at QB.  We don't need Michael Vick athleticism and we don't need Peyton Manning QB IQ.  I think we can find very solid 2.0-2.5* QBs all day long that fit what we need on AND off the field.

I know that's where I'd be looking every year.

2-2.5 star QB's, really? You are kidding I guess.

[gawntrail]

2-2.5 star QB's, really? You are kidding I guess.

No.  Our RBs automatically make him better.  So does our D.  I look forward to the OL and WR getting much better, so those groups would make him better too.  We seem to be able to flip the field well when we punt, and will probably continue to, so 4th down isn't an issue. 

I'd handicap a fundamentally sound 2.0-2.5* kid +1-1.5* depending on what his exact skill set is in relation to our scheme and overall team.  That would make him a solid 3-4* on day 1.  He red shirts and a year in our program to learn and he gets another  .5-1*.  By the time he MAY see the field he's a solid 4*.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

No.  Our RBs automatically make him better.  So does our D.  I look forward to the OL and WR getting much better, so those groups would make him better too.  We seem to be able to flip the field well when we punt, and will probably continue to, so 4th down isn't an issue. 

I'd handicap a fundamentally sound 2.0-2.5* kid +1-1.5* depending on what his exact skill set is in relation to our scheme and overall team.  That would make him a solid 3-4* on day 1.  He red shirts and a year in our program to learn and he gets another  .5-1*.  By the time he MAY see the field he's a solid 4*.

Gonna need better QB's than that, period. RB's don't make calls at the LOS, don't go through check downs, don't go through progressions, don't execute good technique in throwing the ball or making the best decisions about what to do with the ball, and neither does the OL or WR's.

[carolinahogger]

Not worried in the least about Duwop transferring.

If he is good enough to play then he will play.  If he is not good enough to play then he won't play and it is no loss if he transfers.

[gawntrail]

Gonna need better QB's than that, period. RB's don't make calls at the LOS, don't go through check downs, don't go through progressions, don't execute good technique in throwing the ball or making the best decisions about what to do with the ball, and neither does the OL or WR's.

Neither do most 4-5* athletic QBs out of HS. 

At QB, I would rather develop a kid that is fundamentally sound, but, got hung with low * value, then high * value and missing the fundamentals.  Especially in the context of what we do.  Basically, I'm saying I'd recruit more brain than body.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Neither do most 4-5* athletic QBs out of HS. 

At QB, I would rather develop a kid that is fundamentally sound, but, got hung with low * value, then high * value and missing the fundamentals.  Especially in the context of what we do.  Basically, I'm saying I'd recruit more brain than body.

I'm not talking about "athletic, running QB's" either. But if you think a 2.0 to 2.5 star QB is going to cut it, even if coached up and developed, I think you are mistaken. You aren't going to see that kind of QB with that star rating at Arkansas. 3 star maybe, but more likely of the 4 star variety for all of the already developed skills that a QB needs when they land on campus in the SEC.

[Pork Twain]

I do not want to lose him, but I doubt we would feel the loss

[gawntrail]

I'm not talking about "athletic, running QB's" either. But if you think a 2.0 to 2.5 star QB is going to cut it, even if coached up and developed, I think you are mistaken. You aren't going to see that kind of QB with that star rating at Arkansas. 3 star maybe, but more likely of the 4 star variety for all of the already developed skills that a QB needs when they land on campus in the SEC.

In the context of what we do:

Why do we need a 4* QB out of HS?

Why would a 4* want to sign with us?

I believe we can recruit QBs from the deeper water and be very successful.