I've said it before, but I'll repeat it again . . .

[WizardofhOgZ]

So he sounds "alpha."  Now if I told you that last season there was a team down on the road 24-9 mid-way through the first half and that then one of that team's guards went to work and scored 24 points to force overtime.  Then that team's other guard scored 16 points in the double overtime to win the game 80-77.  Wouldn't you say those guys sounded pretty "alpha?"  But no they played for us, Barford and Macon, so they were nothing much, I guess.  @Georgia, 23 January last year.

SMH . . . don't get lost in the weeds.  THIS year's team has no one like that - THAT's the point.

[The Hogfather]

So he sounds "alpha."  Now if I told you that last season there was a team down on the road 24-9 mid-way through the first half and that then one of that team's guards went to work and scored 24 points to force overtime.  Then that team's other guard scored 16 points in the double overtime to win the game 80-77.  Wouldn't you say those guys sounded pretty "alpha?"  But no they played for us, Barford and Macon, so they were nothing much, I guess.  @Georgia, 23 January last year.

No.  Did they score 53?  Did they score more than 50 twice in their careers?  Did they average 26 a game?

So far this year, he's had games of 53, 45, 45, 37, 27, 26, 26, 26, 21, 21.

[Fan701]

That doesn't make sense as a response to my post that you quoted.  I didn't say Whitt fit the criteria; in fact, I said he didn't.  And I've explained - in some detail - what (IMO) Macon and Barford were both very good players that I'd love to have on this year's team - but they fall short of what I'm talking about.

No "self hate" in those sentiments.

I was agreeing with you, disagreeing with the guy you were arguing with, and disagreeing, too, with the OP. 

[Fan701]

SMH . . . don't get lost in the weeds.  THIS year's team has no one like that - THAT's the point.

OP, i.e., you, says we've had no one like that for years.  That's your main point.

[Fan701]

No.  Did they score 53?  Did they score more than 50 twice in their careers?  Did they average 26 a game?

So far this year, he's had games of 53, 45, 45, 37, 27, 26, 26, 26, 21, 21.

If that's what it takes to be "alpha" then we've never had one.

[The Hogfather]

If that's what it takes to be "alpha" then we've never had one.

It doesn't necessarily take all of that, but he damm sure is what the OP was talking about.  We need someone like him.

[Fan701]

It doesn't necessarily take all of that, but he damm sure is what the OP was talking about.  We need someone like him.

Mason Jones did a pretty good imitation of it the other night, don't think he can do it consistently yet.  Given another year, he might.  Joe and Harris will win a lot of games for us too over the next few years.  Doubt they'll ever score 50 or average 26.

[The Hogfather]

Did you just copy and paste my post from yesterday?

Great post.  You are exactly right.  Jones may be turning into that guy.  He is about as close as we have right now (Joe just doesn't do much more than catch and shoot at this point).  Jones isn't quite there yet, but I think he will be next season and beyond.  Of course, we'll most likely not have Gafford and maybe Chaney (if we don't play him more).

[Fan701]

Did you just copy and paste my post from yesterday?

No, but great post!

[WizardofhOgZ]

Mason Jones did a pretty good imitation of it the other night, don't think he can do it consistently yet.  Given another year, he might.  Joe and Harris will win a lot of games for us too over the next few years.  Doubt they'll ever score 50 or average 26.

Jones is a nice player.  At this point, he's not what I'm talking about.  We'll see how he develops. I like him.  I "like" a lot of our players.  We just need "THE straw that stirs the drink".

Being "a dude" isn't only about scoring.  It's being the guy everyone on the floor defers to automatically when it's crunch time - on offense, defense, taking a charge, getting a key rebound, deflecting a ball at a critical moment, making the great assist, and - yes - hitting a buzzer beater every now and then.  Refusing to lose. 

Not sure you read my earlier post:

Having guys like that in the backcourt make good players look like "alphas"; well, maybe not alphas,but make them look better than they otherwise would.  Precisely what we need on THIS team.  We've got a lot of players who would be very effective if they were in the mix at, say, Duke or Kansas or N. Carolina, where there ARE alphas around.  They would look better than they do now.

I guess I'd call those two (Macon and Barford) "alpha lites" in this context. IMO, this team would definitely be better with either/both of them. But, I still wouldn't put them in the class of the group I mentioned. The primary difference is the "winner" gene. Some guys just won't accept losing, and it becomes contagious. And these types are also are stand-out defenders, so they have that going for them even when their shot may not be falling.

Honestly, as much as I liked both DM and JB, one thing that did disappoint me was their ineffectiveness in game-end situations. Yes - Macon had "ice water veins" at the FT line down the stretch (and that is something we could REALLY use). But I don't remember either being effective in scoring baskets late when we had to have one. In fact, much to my puzzlement and dismay, it was Beard who always seemed to want the "last shot" in those types of situations, and I don't remember him making many of them at all. Barford, to my recollection, would often attempt to drive at the end of games but usually would either miss or be called for a turnover. And I don't really remember Macon even attempting many end-game shots. He seemed to defer to Anton and Jalen in those situations (unless it was when we were up and he was going to be fouled to put him on the FT line).

Yes, their ability would be welcomed, and we might even be undefeated if they were still on the team. But I still yearn for "that guy" who you just feel good about regulating things on the court, and delivering at crunch time. I was spoiled for about 20 years there, and I guess that's the standard I will always use for comparison.