Sincere Question Re: O-line

[razorbackfaninar]

Saw a stat on Twitter that Arkansas has the highest percentage of QB pressures in the SEC, 28/59 drop-backs.  I tried to attach it here, not sure how to add an image. My question is what does this stat mean in reality.  I know my gut says that the o-line doesn't look up to par. However people whose opinion I respect tell me the o-line looks good and getting better, and that they aren't the problem with this team.  Is this stat a function of the way we play meaning our system or does it mean as it appears to me that our o-line in 2017 is not what it should be.  This is especially troubling, to me anyway, because we have only faced FAMU and TCU and haven't gotten to the heart of SEC play yet. Here is a link to he article that SDS did on the info which was compiled by CFB filmroom;  https://www.saturdaydownsouth.com/sec-football/sec-qbs-facing-pressure-2017/

[HogHomer]

We haven't been playing well on the line but I wonder what percentage of our drop backs were play action. We probably run more play action than any of those teams. Also we can't really see how much of an impact other positions have on that stat. WRs not getting open and causing Austin to hold it longer will end up in more pressure. Austin holding the ball too long in general has probably inflated that stat.

If we had a stat that gave us the average time QBs are given in the pocket we might be able to tell if it's more of an oline problem or another position. Or multiple positions.

I'm not saying the oline has been great or even above average but their is too many variables to just place the blame on oline.

[jm]

There are many reasons. Part of it is poor line play, inability of receivers to get open quickly, and slow reads by the QB;  but it also reflects the number of slow developing deep drop plays called by the coach. You either have to block well or get rid of the ball quickly. We have failed on both counts to some degree.

[woodrow hog call]

We haven't been playing well on the line but I wonder what percentage of our drop backs were play action. We probably run more play action than any of those teams. Also we can't really see how much of an impact other positions have on that stat. WRs not getting open and causing Austin to hold it longer will end up in more pressure. Austin holding the ball too long in general has probably inflated that stat.

If we had a stat that gave us the average time QBs are given in the pocket we might be able to tell if it's more of an oline problem or another position. Or multiple positions.

I'm not saying the oline has been great or even above average but their is too many variables to just place the blame on oline.

I think you hit right on the head here, it's not enough information by itself to to tell the whole story.

[GuvHog]

I've said it once and I'll say it again: the Oline is NOT the problem.

The problem is the receivers are not getting open and AA is holding the ball TOO LONG.

[PorkRinds]

I've said it once and I'll say it again: the Oline is NOT the problem.

The problem is the receivers are not getting open and AA is holding the ball TOO LONG.

OL is indeed part of the problem.

[lakecityhog]

So I guess that on every other team the receivers all get open quickly and the QB gets rid of the ball just as quickly??
Guys, AA is not much different than any other QB. Sometimes he holds the ball a little too long and sometimes he misses a read. Sometimes he makes a bad throw, I know that other QB's never do any of those things!

Yeah, a big part of our problems are O'Line related. Be it player, scheme, coaching or some combination of all 3 we do have O'Line issues and to ignore that is simply putting your head in the sand.

[HogHomer]

So I guess that on every other team the receivers all get open quickly and the QB gets rid of the ball just as quickly??
Guys, AA is not much different than any other QB. Sometimes he holds the ball a little too long and sometimes he misses a read. Sometimes he makes a bad throw, I know that other QB's never do any of those things!

Yeah, a big part of our problems are O'Line related. Be it player, scheme, coaching or some combination of all 3 we do have O'Line issues and to ignore that is simply putting your head in the sand.

Yes we do have oline issues but I believe they have improved problem is the positions around them haven't improved or even regressed. If you can't see that AA is holding on to the ball longer than the average QB on many of our drop backs then idk what to tell you. WRs don't have to get open quick but they have to get open and they couldn't against TCU. You can only block for so long. Isn't the mental clock for a QB supposed to be 3-4 seconds. I saw plenty of plays where the line held for 3 seconds and either a receiver didn't get open or AA held it for more than he should have.

Online is a problem but it's not our only problem and certainly not the biggest

[MuskogeeHogFan]

We haven't been playing well on the line but I wonder what percentage of our drop backs were play action. We probably run more play action than any of those teams. Also we can't really see how much of an impact other positions have on that stat. WRs not getting open and causing Austin to hold it longer will end up in more pressure. Austin holding the ball too long in general has probably inflated that stat.

If we had a stat that gave us the average time QBs are given in the pocket we might be able to tell if it's more of an oline problem or another position. Or multiple positions.

I'm not saying the oline has been great or even above average but their is too many variables to just place the blame on oline.

Well, get your stop watch out and dust it off and time AA from the snap to the release and record the results. Have to keep several separate categories for better results though.

One for straight drop back when under Center, one for drop back off of play action, one if he lines up in shotgun and another if he has to scramble or has a designed roll out. Those four should yield accurate results in terms of how long he holds the ball. Another important stat is how many times within each category that someone even lays a hand on him, even after the release.

I think it would also be interesting to see how many of those passes within those categories are completed and how many are dropped.

Personally I don't have that patience as a stat keeper, but the results of that should be interesting.

[Scott7703]

OL is indeed part of the problem.

Absolutely. We consistently get beat on the edges and have little to no push in our power run game. How anyone can watch the games and not see that as a problem is beyond me.

[woodrow hog call]

The O line is definitely PART of the problem, the problem is the offense can't sustain drives and or convert on critical 3rd downs, at anywhere near the level it needs to.

Some of it is scheme related, and some of it is execution related, some times we don't understand where the pressure is coming from so we don't get the correct protection called.

I saw one play last game where defender got a free path to AA, because Ty and Frank were double teaming the same man, and nobody picked up the LB. The thing I don't know is whose responsibility it was, because I don't know what protection they had called there.

Did they let him come free thinking a back would pick him up, or was Ty supposed to let Frank go solo, and pick him up?

It's not as easy to assign blame as most people think, because we don't know what each player is supposed to be doing on each and every play. We can see a guy get beat off the edge, or when a guy gets bull rushed and knocked into the backfield, but gap assignments and blitz pickups are harder to tell about.

Most people teach the backs to look from inside to out, for pass rushers to pick up, so now a smart DC will have an extra guy coming off the edge at the snap, which draws the attention of the back to go get him but then have a LB coming up the middle on a delay and he has a shorter distance to the QB with a free run now that the back is occupied.

[mckinneyhog5]

we're blocking well enough on pass plays...just don't think AA and the receivers have the timing worked out yet. Receivers need to learn that separation begins at the LOS and how to run precise routes and we'll be ok.

[HogHomer]

Well, get your stop watch out and dust it off and time AA from the snap to the release and record the results. Have to keep several separate categories for better results though.

One for straight drop back when under Center, one for drop back off of play action, one if he lines up in shotgun and another if he has to scramble or has a designed roll out. Those four should yield accurate results in terms of how long he holds the ball. Another important stat is how many times within each category that someone even lays a hand on him, even after the release.

I think it would also be interesting to see how many of those passes within those categories are completed and how many are dropped.

Personally I don't have that patience as a stat keeper, but the results of that should be interesting.

If we got enough people interested and have them donate $5 I bet we could find someone to do that research for us. I don't have the patience as well.

I would also like to see the percentage of PA passes we run versus other "Pro Style" teams. But once again I don't have the patience or desire to do such research.

[woodrow hog call]

we're blocking well enough on pass plays...just don't think AA and the receivers have the timing worked out yet. Receivers need to learn that separation begins at the LOS and how to run precise routes and we'll be ok.

JJ Meadors was on the radio talking about that one day, extremely educational listening to him describe all that goes into that part of the game.

[mckinneyhog5]

JJ Meadors was on the radio talking about that one day, extremely educational listening to him describe all that goes into that part of the game.

yep, if you're waiting for your receivers to get open before throwing, you've already lost.

[Iwastherein1969]

it has to be the o line's fault...every facet of our offense revolves around being able to get runs of 4 to 8 yards on first down. Obviously if we are dominating the line of scrimmage in the run game the play action pass will be exponentially more effective. If the OL doesn't improve dramatically, our passing game can only get marginally better. It' not Austin Allen's fault (I've never been a huge fan of his) because if AA cannot step up into a solid and clean pocket he doesn't have the arm strength of a Ryan Mallet to throw off of his back foot. On offense it all begins and ends with the OL creating just enough of a crease to get 4 to 6 yds on first down.

On offense our O line has looked like the rattlesnake and the opposing defense like the roadrunner in this clip   

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FS2TLGO7Ghk

[lakecityhog]

Yeah, this same kid threw for well over 3,000 yards and ?26? touchdowns, but he is the problem.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Yeah, this same kid threw for well over 3,000 yards and ?26? touchdowns, but he is the problem.

There is a lot of overwhelming self-imposed pressure on a lot of these kids to produce at an extremely high level due to the way we finished last season. In golf terms, they seem to be trying to choke the club to death from the pressure. Everyone needs to relax, enjoy playing and just execute.

[12247]

Remember some coach said, when questioned by a media person about the execution, the coach said he was for it. 

I am about to that point

[HogHomer]

Yeah, this same kid threw for well over 3,000 yards and ?26? touchdowns, but he is the problem.

He isn't the only problem but yes as he is playing right now he is a problem. He has all the tools to be the best in the SEC but whether it be receivers not getting open, the line struggling at times or he himself holding on to the ball too long he is not the QB I saw in the first half of last season.

[Josh Goforth]

We haven't been playing well on the line but I wonder what percentage of our drop backs were play action. We probably run more play action than any of those teams. Also we can't really see how much of an impact other positions have on that stat. WRs not getting open and causing Austin to hold it longer will end up in more pressure. Austin holding the ball too long in general has probably inflated that stat.

If we had a stat that gave us the average time QBs are given in the pocket we might be able to tell if it's more of an oline problem or another position. Or multiple positions.

I'm not saying the oline has been great or even above average but their is too many variables to just place the blame on oline.

FLA has a carbon copy of the ARK offense, switch jerseys and they would look a lot alike, lot of playaction.

[Swestwill66]

Saw a stat on Twitter that Arkansas has the highest percentage of QB pressures in the SEC, 28/59 drop-backs.  I tried to attach it here, not sure how to add an image. My question is what does this stat mean in reality.  I know my gut says that the o-line doesn't look up to par. However people whose opinion I respect tell me the o-line looks good and getting better, and that they aren't the problem with this team.  Is this stat a function of the way we play meaning our system or does it mean as it appears to me that our o-line in 2017 is not what it should be.  This is especially troubling, to me anyway, because we have only faced FAMU and TCU and haven't gotten to the heart of SEC play yet. Here is a link to he article that SDS did on the info which was compiled by CFB filmroom;  https://www.saturdaydownsouth.com/sec-football/sec-qbs-facing-pressure-2017/

The stat means Cole Kelly starting soon.AA gonna get K.O.'d

[Josh Goforth]

If we got enough people interested and have them donate $5 I bet we could find someone to do that research for us. I don't have the patience as well.

I would also like to see the percentage of PA passes we run versus other "Pro Style" teams. But once again I don't have the patience or desire to do such research.

I have most of that charted, alreqdy and will share on here after adding in the A&M game.

[Jzilla]

Many times the defensive ends blow right by our tackles without even being touched!!

[HogHomer]

I have most of that charted, alreqdy and will share on here after adding in the A&M game.

You sir are a gentleman and a scholar.

[HognotinMemphis]

Saw a stat on Twitter that Arkansas has the highest percentage of QB pressures in the SEC, 28/59 drop-backs.  I tried to attach it here, not sure how to add an image. My question is what does this stat mean in reality.  I know my gut says that the o-line doesn't look up to par. However people whose opinion I respect tell me the o-line looks good and getting better, and that they aren't the problem with this team.  Is this stat a function of the way we play meaning our system or does it mean as it appears to me that our o-line in 2017 is not what it should be.  This is especially troubling, to me anyway, because we have only faced FAMU and TCU and haven't gotten to the heart of SEC play yet. Here is a link to he article that SDS did on the info which was compiled by CFB filmroom;  https://www.saturdaydownsouth.com/sec-football/sec-qbs-facing-pressure-2017/

The O line last year gave up the most sacks in the SEC. 35 of them. This year's O line is measurably worse than last year's. The people whose opinions you respect are out of the sphere of competence if they are telling you that the O line is not a problem for this team. Find smarter friends who understand football better.