I blame Frank Broyles for state of Hogs BB program

[Piggie Smalls]

Because that's where the blame belongs, IMO. Going way back to when he fired Nolan (not that I totally disagree with that decision, it may have been a Jerry Jones/Jimmy Johnson situation where the two simply just could no longer co-exist together), he had a chance to keep the ball rolling and keep Mike Anderson as the head coach. Despite the struggles the Hogs were going thru at the time, the program was not in need of a total reboot, which is essentially what Broyles did. Disassociating himself with everything Nolan related absolutely destroyed the program. Mike Anderson never should've had to leave Arkansas. When he came back in 2011, Razorback basketball was basically 9 years behind where it should've been (going back to 2002 when Nolan was fired). Granted, it's unlikely that Anderson would still be the coach if he had been originally retained- we're talking 15 years, after all- but if Broyles would've just swallowed his pride and done what was best for the program by keeping Anderson, I truly believe the Hogs would be a perennial top 25 program. The Hogs didn't need a new direction in 2002, it just needed new blood. But the old man killed the program, only he's not around to shoulder the blame.

[Farmer Hogget]

The state of Razorbacks basketball is not because of Frank Broyles.  It's because of Nolan Richardson and the law suit he filed against the University of Arkansas after he was fired.  Period. No one wants to hear it but that is the truth.  Because of the law suit, Arkansas HAD to hire Stan Heath but even that didn't help.  The damage was done.

[Atlhogfan1]

Because that's where the blame belongs, IMO. Going way back to when he fired Nolan (not that I totally disagree with that decision, it may have been a Jerry Jones/Jimmy Johnson situation where the two simply just could no longer co-exist together), he had a chance to keep the ball rolling and keep Mike Anderson as the head coach. Despite the struggles the Hogs were going thru at the time, the program was not in need of a total reboot, which is essentially what Broyles did. Disassociating himself with everything Nolan related absolutely destroyed the program. Mike Anderson never should've had to leave Arkansas. When he came back in 2011, Razorback basketball was basically 9 years behind where it should've been (going back to 2002 when Nolan was fired). Granted, it's unlikely that Anderson would still be the coach if he had been originally retained- we're talking 15 years, after all- but if Broyles would've just swallowed his pride and done what was best for the program by keeping Anderson, I truly believe the Hogs would be a perennial top 25 program. The Hogs didn't need a new direction in 2002, it just needed new blood. But the old man killed the program, only he's not around to shoulder the blame.

The same thing hindering Mike now vs when he was at UAB and Mizzou would have hindered him then.   The recruiting slid when White put restrictions on Nolan and staff.  No longer could they take the academic risks or JC players they would have in the past.  Demario Eddins type players. 

Broyles didn't solely kill the program.  Nolan, White, the NCAA all share in it. 

[Athog]

Because that's where the blame belongs, IMO. Going way back to when he fired Nolan (not that I totally disagree with that decision, it may have been a Jerry Jones/Jimmy Johnson situation where the two simply just could no longer co-exist together), he had a chance to keep the ball rolling and keep Mike Anderson as the head coach. Despite the struggles the Hogs were going thru at the time, the program was not in need of a total reboot, which is essentially what Broyles did. Disassociating himself with everything Nolan related absolutely destroyed the program. Mike Anderson never should've had to leave Arkansas. When he came back in 2011, Razorback basketball was basically 9 years behind where it should've been (going back to 2002 when Nolan was fired). Granted, it's unlikely that Anderson would still be the coach if he had been originally retained- we're talking 15 years, after all- but if Broyles would've just swallowed his pride and done what was best for the program by keeping Anderson, I truly believe the Hogs would be a perennial top 25 program. The Hogs didn't need a new direction in 2002, it just needed new blood. But the old man killed the program, only he's not around to shoulder the blame.

Give it a rest! The Nolan love affair has been what killed the program. Oh not that he needs defending, "that old man" made the program.

[sowmonella]

Because that's where the blame belongs, IMO. Going way back to when he fired Nolan (not that I totally disagree with that decision, it may have been a Jerry Jones/Jimmy Johnson situation where the two simply just could no longer co-exist together), he had a chance to keep the ball rolling and keep Mike Anderson as the head coach. Despite the struggles the Hogs were going thru at the time, the program was not in need of a total reboot, which is essentially what Broyles did. Disassociating himself with everything Nolan related absolutely destroyed the program. Mike Anderson never should've had to leave Arkansas. When he came back in 2011, Razorback basketball was basically 9 years behind where it should've been (going back to 2002 when Nolan was fired). Granted, it's unlikely that Anderson would still be the coach if he had been originally retained- we're talking 15 years, after all- but if Broyles would've just swallowed his pride and done what was best for the program by keeping Anderson, I truly believe the Hogs would be a perennial top 25 program. The Hogs didn't need a new direction in 2002, it just needed new blood. But the old man killed the program, only he's not around to shoulder the blame.

It's been almost 20 years. Get over it.

[Sivad]

The state of Razorbacks basketball is not because of Frank Broyles.  It's because of Nolan Richardson.

No doubt about it. Nolan did everything he possibly could to destroy the UofA athletic programs, especially basketball.

[RedBird5]

True. Bill Self was allegedly interested as well.  Same can be said about the football program dating back to the late '80 in regards to Coach Broyles.  Great for our program and college athletics in general but held on too long

[lynbug]

It's beginning to feel like some type of curse.  Some day a book may be written about it.  A mystery book about how fans tried to exorcise the curse for......how many years?  Hope that it's not much more than 25-30 years or I won't be around to read the book.  I'm being silly (a bit) but sometimes that's the only way I can describe it so that I don't have to figure out who's to blame and who started it all.

[HognitiveDissonance]

Frank ran the AD pretty much on his own from 1974-1997. That changed when John White arrived in 1997; he had his hand in every major decision after that.

Nolan was a victim of his own success. Everyone knew the glory years of 1985-1996 weren't being re-created, so finally in 2002 after his infamous outburst he was fired.

As others have stated, his lawsuit vs the UA played a huge part in creating the mess that followed; as it had an influence on who was hired. Yes, Bill Self wanted the job, but the UA hired the Stan Heath instead.

Mike Anderson had no head coaching experience in 2002. After striking out on his own for 10 years and building a resume, he became a more attractive candidate than he was in 2002.

[hawkhawg]

Frank should have treated Nolan like the basketball god he was.

[Wild Bill Hog]

No doubt about it. Nolan did everything he possibly could to destroy the UofA athletic programs, especially basketball.

Outstanding summary of the facts.

[Boarsnest]

No doubt about it. Nolan did everything he possibly could to destroy the UofA athletic programs, especially basketball.

This! but he also destroyed his chances of landing a top level coaching job in doing so!

This mess was 20 years ago, if Mike is fired I don't think you will see a huge backlash. Some news outlets may dig it up but in the end Nolan is not in the spot light at a major university now and was never in a top position after Arkansas due to his rant. I just don't think that anyone on a national level really cares now, plus Mike has not even got the program close to the level of success that Nolan had. We older fans still see the program through our red glasses from the Sutton and Nolan years but in reality we are not significant on a national level now.

I feel like with the right coach we can could make a come back. The Nolan days are in the past and a lot of younger athletes don't remember any of this mess or even care. We are the only ones still dwelling in the past.

[BigHog396]

Because that's where the blame belongs, IMO. Going way back to when he fired Nolan (not that I totally disagree with that decision, it may have been a Jerry Jones/Jimmy Johnson situation where the two simply just could no longer co-exist together), he had a chance to keep the ball rolling and keep Mike Anderson as the head coach. Despite the struggles the Hogs were going thru at the time, the program was not in need of a total reboot, which is essentially what Broyles did. Disassociating himself with everything Nolan related absolutely destroyed the program. Mike Anderson never should've had to leave Arkansas. When he came back in 2011, Razorback basketball was basically 9 years behind where it should've been (going back to 2002 when Nolan was fired). Granted, it's unlikely that Anderson would still be the coach if he had been originally retained- we're talking 15 years, after all- but if Broyles would've just swallowed his pride and done what was best for the program by keeping Anderson, I truly believe the Hogs would be a perennial top 25 program. The Hogs didn't need a new direction in 2002, it just needed new blood. But the old man killed the program, only he's not around to shoulder the blame.

Mike absolutely should not have been given the job when Nolan was fired.  The man had ZERO head coaching experience at that time, and has since proven he has the same problems when it comes to coaching fundamentals that Nolan showed over his last eight seasons.

And by the way... The program was absolutely in need of a total reboot at that time, and we would have had that had John White not told Bill Self that he had to come to campus for an interview.  The blame for where we are now rests solely on that single decision, and on the shoulders of John White.

Nolan's game worked like magic when he had better players, and when he "got him some men."  After we played football on the basketball court for about 10 years, the NCAA made it a point to start calling the fouls we had been getting away with for all of those years.  When Nolan was no longer allowed to wear a team down by leaning on them for 40 minutes, his game was finished.  That, and the fact that he had quit recruiting after the NCAA garbage in '96.

Go back and look at things with rose-colored glasses if you want, but Nolan's style had been ended at that point.  The one thing that kept Nolan's later teams half-way successful was how intimidating Nolan was.  The difference between Nolan and Mike is the fact that Nolan scared his players.  Nolan was a beast, and his team's respected/feared him.  They knew if they screwed up on the court, they were going to pay for it running the hills around BWA.  Mike does not command that kind of respect at all from what I have seen of the demeanor of his teams, and that's simply a function of the difference in their personalities and stature.  To me it looks like Nolan ran a boot camp, and Mike runs a band camp.

[Danimal]

The same thing hindering Mike now vs when he was at UAB and Mizzou would have hindered him then.   The recruiting slid when White put restrictions on Nolan and staff.  No longer could they take the academic risks or JC players they would have in the past.  Demario Eddins type players. 

Broyles didn't solely kill the program.  Nolan, White, the NCAA all share in it.

Summed up perfectly.

[tasteslikechicken]

I blame the 96 NCAA investigation bulldarn as the start of it.

[LZH]

Mike absolutely should not have been given the job when Nolan was fired.  The man had ZERO head coaching experience at that time, and has since proven he has the same problems when it comes to coaching fundamentals that Nolan showed over his last eight seasons.

And by the way... The program was absolutely in need of a total reboot at that time, and we would have had that had John White not told Bill Self that he had to come to campus for an interview.  The blame for where we are now rests solely on that single decision, and on the shoulders of John White.

Nolan's game worked like magic when he had better players, and when he "got him some men."  After we played football on the basketball court for about 10 years, the NCAA made it a point to start calling the fouls we had been getting away with for all of those years.  When Nolan was no longer allowed to wear a team down by leaning on them for 40 minutes, his game was finished.  That, and the fact that he had quit recruiting after the NCAA garbage in '96.

Go back and look at things with rose-colored glasses if you want, but Nolan's style had been ended at that point.  The one thing that kept Nolan's later teams half-way successful was how intimidating Nolan was.  The difference between Nolan and Mike is the fact that Nolan scared his players.  Nolan was a beast, and his team's respected/feared him.  They knew if they screwed up on the court, they were going to pay for it running the hills around BWA.  Mike does not command that kind of respect at all from what I have seen of the demeanor of his teams, and that's simply a function of the difference in their personalities and stature.  To me it looks like Nolan ran a boot camp, and Mike runs a band camp.

+1

[HawgAdvocate]

I'd argue the blame lies with Stan Heath and John White, for allowing the further degradation of the program off the floor, that occurred during Heath's tenure. Broyles was AD, but mostly in title only. Broyles was lead fundraiser, story teller, and football fan/czar far more than steward over athlete academics, marketing, compliance, etc. No one could make him retire, so he kept his role far longer than he should have. White knew this very well.

While everyone looked the other way when it came to keeping up with the academic side and maintaining institutional control, Heath was slowly losing control over his program. There was little supervision. Student athletes bucked authority. At times, open rebellion ensued. Short cuts were taken to keep the players eligible. It was so toxic that when the job came open again, it was a 5+ year APR fiasco waiting to happen and there was very little maturity or Razorback pride left within the locker room. Recall all the reported team chemistry issues that existed toward the end. Recall the reported 'airing of grievance' sessions at airports, hotels, and locker rooms. I've shared this story before, but Heath only had two of his players show up for his 'going away' party. Where's the respect?

Nolan and Mike certainly let the program dip in Nolan's latter years, and Nolan was never known for enforcing academic standards, but it was at the end of Heath's tenure that those on the inside realized that hitting rock-bottom, by Razorback standards, was ensured and practically unavoidable.

IMO.

[Athog]

Frank should have treated Nolan like the basketball god he was.

Right....sarcasm off!!

[GuvHog]

Because that's where the blame belongs, IMO. Going way back to when he fired Nolan (not that I totally disagree with that decision, it may have been a Jerry Jones/Jimmy Johnson situation where the two simply just could no longer co-exist together), he had a chance to keep the ball rolling and keep Mike Anderson as the head coach. Despite the struggles the Hogs were going thru at the time, the program was not in need of a total reboot, which is essentially what Broyles did. Disassociating himself with everything Nolan related absolutely destroyed the program. Mike Anderson never should've had to leave Arkansas. When he came back in 2011, Razorback basketball was basically 9 years behind where it should've been (going back to 2002 when Nolan was fired). Granted, it's unlikely that Anderson would still be the coach if he had been originally retained- we're talking 15 years, after all- but if Broyles would've just swallowed his pride and done what was best for the program by keeping Anderson, I truly believe the Hogs would be a perennial top 25 program. The Hogs didn't need a new direction in 2002, it just needed new blood. But the old man killed the program, only he's not around to shoulder the blame.

Terminating Nolan wasn't Frank Broyles decision. John White took control of the men's basketball program away from Frank several years earlier. It was John White's decision to terminate Nolan.

[John Snow]

Frank Broyels missed a  great Opportunity to have our fans and former players come together in a 10 year celebration by having former players come up for a weekend game during the 2003-04 season. But instead Broyels acted like all of Nolans former great players from 1994 did not exist and had to wait until he retired and Jeff Long brought them together in 2009 and again 2014 with Frank Broyels part of the ceremony  even though it felt awkward with him there.

[GuvHog]

Frank Broyels missed a  great Opportunity to have our fans and former players come together in a 10 year celebration by having former players come up for a weekend game during the 2003-04 season. But instead Broyels acted like all of Nolans former great players from 1994 did not exist and had to wait until he retired and Jeff Long brought them together in 2009 and again 2014 with Frank Broyels part of the ceremony  even though it felt awkward with him there.

It wasn't awkward at all because Nolan and Frank had settled their differences and buried the hatchet, so to speak, several years earlier.

[Big Boi]

I'd argue the blame lies with Stan Heath and John White, for allowing the further degradation of the program off the floor, that occurred during Heath's tenure. Broyles was AD, but mostly in title only. Broyles was lead fundraiser, story teller, and football fan/czar far more than steward over athlete academics, marketing, compliance, etc. No one could make him retire, so he kept his role far longer than he should have. White knew this very well.

While everyone looked the other way, when it came to keeping up with the academic side and maintaining institutional control, Heath was losing slowly control over his program. There was little supervision. Student athletes bucked authority. At times, open rebellion ensued. Short cuts were taken to keep the players eligible. It was so toxic that when the job came open again, it was a 5+ year APR fiasco waiting to happen and there was very little maturity or Razorback pride left within the locker room. Recall all the reported team chemistry issues that existed toward the end. Recall the reported 'airing of grievance' sessions at airports, hotels, and locker rooms. I've shared this story before, but Heath only had two of his players show up for his 'going away' party. Where's the respect?

Nolan and Mike certainly let the program dip in Nolan's latter years, and Nolan was never known for enforcing academic standards, but it was at the end of Heath's tenure that those on the inside realized that hitting rock-bottom, by Razorback standards, was ensured and practically unavoidable.

IMO.

Frank put himself in a situation to where a PR hire was necessary. Heath was the the youngest most appealing candidate. Got the Kent St job because he landed Zac Randolph at Mich st. Caught fire in year 1 with a deep run in tourney. Heath had no clue about running a program. Frank did a lot of good coaching and raising money. His vision to join the SEC is still paying dividends. However as far as coaching hires in my lifetime he struggled. Getting played by BCG, and the Altman debacle, went ahead and killed Bball. We are know staring at 4 NCAA appearances in the last 15yrs. White hurt a lot of sports. At least that's the way its always been reported

[PonderinHog]

Terminating Nolan wasn't Frank Broyles decision. John White took control of the men's basketball program away from Frank several years earlier. It was John White's decision to terminate Nolan.

And that's where we get the term "White haired devil!"

[Kevin]

The problem is hiring Altman then flying off to Augusta without making sure that the new head coach was going to be taken care of

[Inhogswetrust]

The state of Hog basketball rests ONLY on the shoulders of Mike Anderson.

[Hoggish1]

Frank should have treated Nolan like the basketball god he was.

And there lies the curse we're all watching...

[Hook 'em Hogs]

We are so close though. I'm not saying that because of Mike though. We can afford a big name coach (Anderson is one, I believe, but there are others that can do better than Anderson). We have great facilities and Arkansas as a state has great athletes year in and year out. The right guy (not necessarily saying it isn't Anderson) could have us back on track next year. The last 6 years may not have progressed us much in tournament appearances, but imo, we are healthier.

[Inhogswetrust]

Frank should have treated Nolan like the basketball god he was.

A coach winning one NC at a major level is not a God in their sport by wing one. some coaches that win one are close but not quite there. A coach winning multiple one's like coach K and Wooden are.

[Razorback_2007]

A coach winning one NC at a major level is not a God in their sport. A coach winning multiple one's like coach K and Wooden are.

So Dean Smith who won 'only' two isn't regarded as a basketball God? Spurrier won 1 NC, goodness knows he's revered as a God. A couple examples off the top of my head, just sayin.

[Inhogswetrust]

So Dean Smith who won 'only' two isn't regarded as a basketball God? Spurrier won 1 NC, goodness knows he's revered as a God. A couple examples off the top of my head, just sayin.

Dean maybe but not Spurrier. Dean won TWO NC's but made the Final Four ELEVEN times. IF Nolan had won that second one, and I wish he would have, and made the finals that many times while playing in what is thought to be the best conference in college basketball, then yes he would earn that title from me.

[Razorback_2007]

Phog Allen the "Father of Basketball Coaching", one NC?

[Westcoasthog]

After the firing of Nolan Richardson - Frank Broyles was going to hire Bill Self,
he was ready to accept the head Basketball Coach at Arkansas.  The Meddelor
John White intervened - told Frank Broyles after the firing of Nolan Richardson you have to hire a black coach.  This statement is the hard core truth.

[Boarcephus]

Nolan's game worked like magic when he had better players, and when he "got him some men."  After we played football on the basketball court for about 10 years, the NCAA made it a point to start calling the fouls we had been getting away with for all of those years.  When Nolan was no longer allowed to wear a team down by leaning on them for 40 minutes, his game was finished.  That, and the fact that he had quit recruiting after the NCAA garbage in '96.

Go back and look at things with rose-colored glasses if you want, but Nolan's style had been ended at that point.  The one thing that kept Nolan's later teams half-way successful was how intimidating Nolan was.  The difference between Nolan and Mike is the fact that Nolan scared his players.  Nolan was a beast, and his team's respected/feared him.  They knew if they screwed up on the court, they were going to pay for it running the hills around BWA.  Mike does not command that kind of respect at all from what I have seen of the demeanor of his teams, and that's simply a function of the difference in their personalities and stature.  To me it looks like Nolan ran a boot camp, and Mike runs a band camp.

This is probably the answer right here.  We mugged teams back then.   Physically wore them out.  Corey and Clint ate their guards up!  The fear factor of Nolan is dead on.  I got to know Cannon Whitby through the food shows years ago and he confirmed that.  Nolan would literally get up in a players face and threaten to whip their butts if they did whatever it was again and they had not doubt he'd follow through the threat. 

Personally, I think Mikes style of game has made its run and is over.  The game has evolved into a "me" first game and the players you need to be successful will not be content with 20-25 minutes a game.  The question to me is can he adapt and so far the answer, here anyway, is no. 

[Inhogswetrust]

Phog Allen the "Father of Basketball Coaching", one NC?

He also won four conference championships while coaching football! The fact you said he is the "father" of college basketball coaching says a lot. Would Nolan's Resume' supplant him in that role as the "father" of college basketball coaching? I don't think so but it is wrong that he would have never been given that chance in the same years that Phog was coaching. If he had Nolan might just have been given that moniker.

[GuvHog]

The problem is hiring Altman then flying off to Augusta without making sure that the new head coach was going to be taken care of

Frank couldn't have stopped John White from making the move that caused Altman to change his mind and go back to Creighton.

[Justifiable Hogicide]

Frank should have treated Nolan like the basketball god he was.

The trouble was Nolan believed that to be true.

[hawkhawg]

The trouble was Nolan believed that to be true.

There is no trouble in that. He was a great coach and knew it.

[redleg]

Because that's where the blame belongs, IMO. Going way back to when he fired Nolan (not that I totally disagree with that decision, it may have been a Jerry Jones/Jimmy Johnson situation where the two simply just could no longer co-exist together), he had a chance to keep the ball rolling and keep Mike Anderson as the head coach. Despite the struggles the Hogs were going thru at the time, the program was not in need of a total reboot, which is essentially what Broyles did. Disassociating himself with everything Nolan related absolutely destroyed the program. Mike Anderson never should've had to leave Arkansas. When he came back in 2011, Razorback basketball was basically 9 years behind where it should've been (going back to 2002 when Nolan was fired). Granted, it's unlikely that Anderson would still be the coach if he had been originally retained- we're talking 15 years, after all- but if Broyles would've just swallowed his pride and done what was best for the program by keeping Anderson, I truly believe the Hogs would be a perennial top 25 program. The Hogs didn't need a new direction in 2002, it just needed new blood. But the old man killed the program, only he's not around to shoulder the blame.

I blame Frank too.....but I also blame Nolan just as much.
:razorback:

[HF#1]

Had Frank's last hire stuck around, we wouldn't be in this position. Frank hit a homerun with Dana Altman, but Altman wanted no part of the dumpster fire once he saw how it really was.

[roothawg]

Frank should of been gone a long time ago.He stayed about 25yrs to long.

[rude1]

The state of Razorbacks basketball is not because of Frank Broyles.  It's because of Nolan Richardson and the law suit he filed against the University of Arkansas after he was fired.  Period. No one wants to hear it but that is the truth.  Because of the law suit, Arkansas HAD to hire Stan Heath but even that didn't help.  The damage was done.

Not true. I was ready for a change too, I felt Nolan had lost his passion and drive. But as I said at the time, you don't fire a hall of fame coach who has taken your program to heights never seen before. If you are ready for the change, you work out a way to part amicably, even if that means you have to pay more to make it happen. Had Frank even attempted to do this I believe there would have been an amicable parting of the ways, instead of the embarrassing public firing that happened and the predictable lawsuit that followed.

[Jackrabbit Hog]

The blame is equally shared by JFB and CNR.  It was time for Nolan to move on but his pride wouldn't let him do it because of his hatred of Broyles.  And Broyles could have handled it much, much better but he saw an opening and took it, public relations be darned.  I don't think either man wanted to see the other feel he had the upper hand, but I also think both are saddened at the damage they did to the program.

[Sivad]

Not true. I was ready for a change too, I felt Nolan had lost his passion and drive. But as I said at the time, you don't fire a hall of fame coach who has taken your program to heights never seen before. If you are ready for the change, you work out a way to part amicably, even if that means you have to pay more to make it happen. Had Frank even attempted to do this I believe there would have been an amicable parting of the ways, instead of the embarrassing public firing that happened and the predictable lawsuit that followed.

Nolan fired himself.

[hamARchy in the USA]

Nolan fired himself.

Straight up.

[ballz2thewall]

the conclusion "we should have elevated mike"

is quite possibly the worst suggestion in sports management i've ever heard given the contextual circumstances at the time.

everyone else has already stated the reasons.