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To be successful at Arkansas...

Started by ambien_sky, December 13, 2017, 11:23:41 am

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Hopeful Hog

Quote from: hogsanity on December 13, 2017, 02:35:58 pm
Do you know how many fbs programs are within pretty easy drives of Dallas/Ft Worth? Do you know how many FBS programs are closer to DFW than Arkansas is?

Are any of them coached by a Dallas HS coaching legend? Do any of them have the DALLAS cowboys owner as a NC winning alumni? No? Hmm I don't know why I would think we would have a leg up.

RME

Quote from: Hopeful Hog on December 13, 2017, 02:38:38 pm
Are any of them coached by a Dallas HS coaching legend? Do any of them have the DALLAS cowboys owner as a NC winning alumni?

Dude what out of state 18-year old kid cares about a 75-year old man who did something in 1964?

 

Atlhogfan1

Alabama has NCs and the biggest brand in the south as far as football. This was true before Saban. 
Quote from: MaconBacon on March 22, 2018, 10:30:04 amWe had a good run in the 90's and one NC and now the whole state still laments that we are a top seed program and have kids standing in line to come to good ole Arkansas.  We're just a flash in the pan boys. 

Hopeful Hog

Quote from: RyanMallettsEgo on December 13, 2017, 02:42:36 pm
Dude what out of state 18-year old kid cares about a 75-year old man who did something in 1964?

Not one would care, heck I don't but they DO care that that 75 year old man owns their home NFL team.

HogHomer

Quote from: Hopeful Hog on December 13, 2017, 02:31:32 pm
You bring up a good point with the population differences between Arkansas and Bama but the Atlanta part doesn't hold water because Fayetteville is only about a 5 hour drive to Dallas. Bama has to compete with Georgia for those guys, the closest major program we have to compete with in Dallas is SMU. I know there are other major programs in Texas but not IN Dallas. I'm not saying we are gonna BE Bama but we're never gonna consistently compete with them on the field until we compete with them off the field.
UT
TAMU
Texas Tech
TCU
Ok St
OU
SMU

After 5 minutes of research i found all these schools have a shorter drive to Dallas than UA.

hogsanity

Quote from: Hopeful Hog on December 13, 2017, 02:38:38 pm
Are any of them coached by a Dallas HS coaching legend?

Do you think that matters to todays recruits? He has not coached HS ball since this years hs srs were in 5th or 6th grade.

And it still does not change the proximity to talent.

Norman, Ok to Dallas 190 mi
Stillwater, Ok to Dallas 297 mi
Austin, Tx to Dallas, TX 195 mi
Waco TX to Dallas TX 95 mi
Houston Tx to Dallas TX 239 mi
College station tx to dallas tx 181 mi
San Antonio, TX to Dalls TX 273 mi
Lubbock Tx to Dallas TX 345 mi

Fayetteville, Ar to Dallas TX 335mi
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

Hopeful Hog

Quote from: MyBoyCanaan on December 13, 2017, 02:45:19 pm
1. There is only 1 owner of the Cowboys so I am gonna go out on a limb and say no.

2. Also, most people are unaware that those 3 things combine to form the single greatest recruiting tool in the history of college football. I would guess its just a matter of a year or 2 until we are in the playoff.

1. Exactly!!
2. You think? Wow that's amazing to hear! What will the other 3 teams be? Wait a minute I wanna write this down.

hogsanity

Quote from: HogHomer on December 13, 2017, 02:47:11 pm
UT
TAMU
Texas Tech
TCU
Ok St
OU
SMU

After 5 minutes of research i found all these schools have a shorter drive to Dallas than UA.

Houston, Rice, UTSA, Baylor, all shorter and TT is only 10 more miles. Actually, if counting all fbs schools, La Tech is closer than the Hogs
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

HogHomer

Quote from: hogsanity on December 13, 2017, 02:54:09 pm
Houston, Rice, UTSA, Baylor, all shorter and TT is only 10 more miles. Actually, if counting all fbs schools, La Tech is closer than the Hogs
I got bored after the first 7

Hopeful Hog

Quote from: hogsanity on December 13, 2017, 02:47:51 pm
Do you think that matters to todays recruits? He has not coached HS ball since this years hs srs were in 5th or 6th grade.

And it still does not change the proximity to talent.

Norman, Ok to Dallas 190 mi
Stillwater, Ok to Dallas 297 mi
Austin, Tx to Dallas, TX 195 mi
Waco TX to Dallas TX 95 mi
Houston Tx to Dallas TX 239 mi
College station tx to dallas tx 181 mi
San Antonio, TX to Dalls TX 273 mi
Lubbock Tx to Dallas TX 345 mi

Fayetteville, Ar to Dallas TX 335mi

Dude that was only 10 years ago not a thousand, he could have coached their older brothers. Even if he didn't you mean to tell me they don't know who he is? Give me a break! As far as the recruiting goes, Norman, Austin, and College Station (maybe Stillwater but probably not) are the only ones Morris shouldn't be able to easily out recruit.

SoonerBaHog

Quote from: RyanMallettsEgo on December 13, 2017, 02:00:57 pm
If Arkansas had 15 10+ win seasons this century, I'd agree with you.

That is a defeatist attitude my friend.

hogsanity

Quote from: HogHomer on December 13, 2017, 02:57:08 pm
I got bored after the first 7

Even Texas State in San Marcos is closer, only 226 miles. So over a dozen FBS schools are closer to Dallas than the Hogs are.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

Hopeful Hog

Quote from: HogHomer on December 13, 2017, 02:57:08 pm
I got bored after the first 7

And not one of those should be even close to be able to win in a recruiting war against us.

 

HogHomer

Quote from: Hopeful Hog on December 13, 2017, 03:00:05 pm
Dude that was only 10 years ago not a thousand, he could have coached their older brothers. Even if he didn't you mean to tell me they don't know who he is? Give me a break! As far as the recruiting goes, Norman, Austin, and College Station (maybe Stillwater but probably not) are the only ones Morris shouldn't be able to easily out recruit.
You can say it's easy to recruit against the other teams but what do you tell a recruits parents that want to see their son play atleast 5-7 times a season in person. Sure some of the kids with parents who are able to afford the expenses will be easier to sway but what about the families that have multiple kids some of which they can't afford to send to college.

HogHomer

Quote from: Hopeful Hog on December 13, 2017, 03:03:03 pm
And not one of those should be even close to be able to win in a recruiting war against us.
What you believe should be and what is actually reality is different.

Hopeful Hog

Quote from: hogsanity on December 13, 2017, 03:02:00 pm
Even Texas State in San Marcos is closer, only 226 miles. So over a dozen FBS schools are closer to Dallas than the Hogs are.

And No one outside of OU, Texas, or A&M should be a problem.

HogHomer

Quote from: Hopeful Hog on December 13, 2017, 03:10:19 pm
And No one outside of OU, Texas, or A&M should be a problem.
You can say that until your hoarse but once again your personal opinion of what should be doesn't make it a reality.

hogsanity

Quote from: Hopeful Hog on December 13, 2017, 03:10:19 pm
And No one outside of OU, Texas, or A&M should be a problem.

For the 4 and 5 star talent, you maybe right, for the 3 stars, the "left overs" the Hogs usually get, they have multiple choices to play fbs ball. They may rather go be the big dog at SMU, or stay in state and go to a school 100 miles away or go to OSu and try to stick it to the Texas schools 4 times a year or a dozen other reasons before coming to a school that might play in Texas once a year.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

Hopeful Hog

Quote from: HogHomer on December 13, 2017, 03:08:58 pm
You can say it's easy to recruit against the other teams but what do you tell a recruits parents that want to see their son play atleast 5-7 times a season in person. Sure some of the kids with parents who are able to afford the expenses will be easier to sway but what about the families that have multiple kids some of which they can't afford to send to college.

It's 5 hours down the road not half way across the country. If they couldn't afford to drive over here then they couldn't afford to go to OU or Texas either.

hogsanity

Quote from: Hopeful Hog on December 13, 2017, 03:15:39 pm
It's 5 hours down the road not half way across the country. If they couldn't afford to drive over here then they couldn't afford to go to OU or Texas either.

Ok, that just makes it more likely they sign with someone closer to home, not further away though. So Ou does not get them, they end up at TCU or SMU or Baylor.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

HogHomer

Quote from: Hopeful Hog on December 13, 2017, 03:15:39 pm
It's 5 hours down the road not half way across the country. If they couldn't afford to drive over here then they couldn't afford to go to OU or Texas either.
6 hour trip vs a 10 hour trip one you can head back home another you are going to have to pay for a hotel room. Two days worth of food. Whatever the difference in gas. The amount of miles you put ova family vehicle.

hogsanity

Quote from: HogHomer on December 13, 2017, 03:19:29 pm
6 hour trip vs a 10 hour trip one you can head back home another you are going to have to pay for a hotel room. Two days worth of food. Whatever the difference in gas. The amount of miles you put ova family vehicle.

It continues to amaze me how people here want to discount everything bad about the Hogs location, act as if those things do not even factor in at all - WHEN IT COMES TO RECRUITING DALLAS - but they want to point out all the time how those things mean we should not even waste time in Fla or GA or even South La or South MS.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

Hopeful Hog

Quote from: hogsanity on December 13, 2017, 03:13:42 pm
For the 4 and 5 star talent, you maybe right, for the 3 stars, the "left overs" the Hogs usually get,

That's exactly my point! We shouldn't be competing for the leftovers at all.

HogHomer

Quote from: hogsanity on December 13, 2017, 03:21:48 pm
It continues to amaze me how people here want to discount everything bad about the Hogs location, act as if those things do not even factor in at all - WHEN IT COMES TO RECRUITING DALLAS - but they want to point out all the time how those things mean we should not even waste time in Fla or GA or even South La or South MS.
People just see names on papers and numbers next to the prospect. They dont realize these are families that have their own wants their own needs. And more often then not they are not going to line up with what Arkansas can provide.

 

wildturkey8

Have to recruit Arkansas a little better, love the fact that they staff was in Ashdown, Fordyce and Earle right out of the box.  Petrino always said he was looking for for a high three star.

hogsanity

Quote from: Hopeful Hog on December 13, 2017, 03:23:13 pm
That's exactly my point! We shouldn't be competing for the leftovers at all.

So lets say a kid lives in a town 30 miles south of Dallas. He is a 3 star, His parents do not have much money. He is being recruited by TCU, Baylor, SMu and the Hogs. Why is he going to choose Arkansas over one of those places where he can be home in an hour, or where mom and pops can drive an hour 4-6 times a year and see him play?
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

Hopeful Hog

Quote from: HogHomer on December 13, 2017, 03:19:29 pm
6 hour trip vs a 10 hour trip one you can head back home another you are going to have to pay for a hotel room. Two days worth of food. Whatever the difference in gas. The amount of miles you put ova family vehicle.

No you don't you just made that up. I have family in Houston and I can go down there and back without staying in a hotel room no problem. It's only maybe a two hour difference between the trips so everything you said is a bold faced lie to try and help your argument.

HogHomer

Quote from: Hopeful Hog on December 13, 2017, 03:29:05 pm
No you don't you just made that up. I have family in Houston and I can go down there and back without staying in a hotel room no problem. It's only maybe a two hour difference between the trips so everything you said is a bold faced lie to try and help your argument.
So are you saying your financial status is the same as all of the families in Texas?
Do you have a baby at home? What about a adolescent who you can't leave at home by themselves and it's too long of a drive to take them. You have to get a baby sitter. Add another expense.

HogHomer

What about the players GFs who are most likely going to a instate school? Have you ever tried to tell a teenager not to chase after a girl? Sure some are going to listen but most teens i know are okay with making a mistake later for some tail today.

Hopeful Hog

Quote from: hogsanity on December 13, 2017, 03:27:01 pm
So lets say a kid lives in a town 30 miles south of Dallas. He is a 3 star, His parents do not have much money. He is being recruited by TCU, Baylor, SMu and the Hogs. Why is he going to choose Arkansas over one of those places where he can be home in an hour, or where mom and pops can drive an hour 4-6 times a year and see him play?

You're not getting my point at all. You just described a kid that we could get anywhere including in our own state. My point is we shouldn't be fighting the likes of SMU or Baylor. Without trying to sound arrogant they are lesser programs. We have slide to their level but we are not that kind of school. We are a more prestigious institution than than even TCU. If a kid just really wants to stay close to home than so be it but I'm shooting for higher than some 3* with only low level offers.

Hopeful Hog

Quote from: HogHomer on December 13, 2017, 03:29:48 pm
So are you saying your financial status is the same as all of the families in Texas?
Do you have a baby at home? What about a adolescent who you can't leave at home by themselves and it's too long of a drive to take them. You have to get a baby sitter. Add another expense.

So you're saying the extra 2 or 3 hours you'd save is going to make the difference? Come on man that's a serious stretch. Besides a degree from the U of A is going to take you further than a degree from Baylor or SMU. They're going to get more pub being in SEC than buried in the American League. Are you saying those poor families would choose to take a better opportunity away from their child just to save a couple of hours?

Vantage 8 dude

Quote from: ambien_sky on December 13, 2017, 11:23:41 am
I think it's absolutely crucial that the coach be able develop 3 star players, to the level of 4-5 star athletes that are hungry to win. Petrino was excellent at that.  I believe that was a big problem with the style Bielema ran.  It required incredible talent, that we just couldn't get here on a regular basis.

It's a MUST that Chat Morris and staff are able to recruit players with lesser talent,  or at least not as highly ranked as the top recruits, and develop them into stars.  For those of you in the know,  that have done more research than me, can Chad Morris do this?  Does he have a pretty good history of developing players?  As I said,  in my opinion,  it's a must here at Arkansas if he expects to win.
While it's a total "no brainer" to say that we have to recruit better/higher rated high school players, in our situation being able to more effectively develop the kids we do have takes on an even greater importance. One of things that always dismayed me about CBB was the fact that far too often we saw little improvement in the play and skill levels of kids we DID get to the Hill. Seemed that so many of them were never able to improve their quality of play to effectively compete in the SEC.

IronHog

Quote from: hogsanity on December 13, 2017, 02:01:52 pm
Really? You cant figure out what that means? Ok, I'll bite. It means when you go play a team that has better players, players with more talent, you are going to lose more often than you win.  If the players i sign are not as talented as the players you sign, more often than not your team will win. My 3 star CB may be the best coached and have the most desire, but if he is 5'10" 170lbs and runs a 4.5 & he is trying to cover a wr that is 6'4" 220 and runs a 4.3, guess who is going to win that war by the end of the day. IF my ol is made up of guys that are 3stars and are a half step slower than your 4 & 5 star dl, guess who's Qb is going to be running for his life all day.

You are not going to win any titles in the sec trying to win with talent that is inferior to BAma, Aub, LSU you have go to find a way to get SEC talent into the program, and I ma not talking about 4 or 5 players a year, I am talking 12-15 legit sec calibre players every recruiting class, and some of them have to be lb's.


Only play 11 at a time


Arkansas can recruit enough high D1 players to match up better than they have the past 20 years....just gotta get and keep a real coach
Iron sharpens iron, So one man sharpens another.

IronHog

Quote from: Vantage 8 dude on December 13, 2017, 03:43:55 pm
While it's a total "no brainer" to say that we have to recruit better/higher rated high school players, in our situation being able to more effectively develop the kids we do have takes on an even greater importance. One of things that always dismayed me about CBB was the fact that far too often we saw little improvement in the play and skill levels of kids we DID get to the Hill. Seemed that so many of them were never able to improve their quality of play to effectively compete in the SEC.

His best athletes were often forced out, benched, or regressed


Crazy really
Iron sharpens iron, So one man sharpens another.

IronHog

Quote from: Hopeful Hog on December 13, 2017, 03:40:55 pm
So you're saying the extra 2 or 3 hours you'd save is going to make the difference? Come on man that's a serious stretch. Besides a degree from the U of A is going to take you further than a degree from Baylor or SMU. They're going to get more pub being in SEC than buried in the American League. Are you saying those poor families would choose to take a better opportunity away from their child just to save a couple of hours?

SMU is a good bit better school than UA

Iron sharpens iron, So one man sharpens another.

RME


hawginbigd1

Quote from: Hopeful Hog on December 13, 2017, 01:00:43 pm
I hate this mentality! This is what we've had beaten into our heads and I'm sick of it! How about let's not settle for the scraps no one wants, how about not fighting the American and MAC level programs for the " Diamonds in the Rough" type guys. Here's an original thought, why don't we take some of the best the country has to offer and Coach THEM up? There's no reason we have to cower before the likes of LSU, A&M, or even Bama. Are we gonna win most of those battles? No. Does that mean we should stop? Absolutely not!!!! The reason Bret Bielema failed here is because he did that exact thing, took a bunch of two and three stars and tried to coach them up into something. If you build your program like that you become super inconsistent and if any of your players go pro early or get hurt then you're screwed because their backups aren't ready to compete yet.

WE ARE NOT Memphis or SMU, WE ARE NOT Vanderbilt or Kentucky, WE ARE NOT Texas Tech or Washington State, WE ARE the freaking ARKANSAS RAZORBACKS start acting like it!
No nobody has beaten it in our heads it is a simple thing called geography, and lack of in-state talent. Recruits of any * category mostly stay close to home, we have to rely on the 3* diamond guys, because we don't live near enough to the 4 and 5 * guys it really is that simple at its core. Alabama's class from last year lives less than 350 miles from Tuscaloosa on average, and it includes a guy from Hawaii.

the 1 and only

Get backed recruiting heavy in the state of Texas but I for one don't think we're going to be able to get the elite players out of Texas playing in the SEC financially it would hurt but we need to move to the Big 12
molon Labe

Use your rights before you lose them

IronHog

Quote from: hawginbigd1 on December 13, 2017, 04:28:16 pm
No nobody has beaten it in our heads it is a simple thing called geography, and lack of in-state talent. Recruits of any * category mostly stay close to home, we have to rely on the 3* diamond guys, because we don't live near enough to the 4 and 5 * guys it really is that simple at its core. Alabama's class from last year lives less than 350 miles from Tuscaloosa on average, and it includes a guy from Hawaii.


It can be overcome but takes a great culture



But outrecruiting Bama is a pipe dream.....Georgia, UT, Fla, etc can't do it either
Iron sharpens iron, So one man sharpens another.

Paul

Quote from: the 1 and only on December 13, 2017, 04:34:14 pm
Get backed recruiting heavy in the state of Texas but I for one don't think we're going to be able to get the elite players out of Texas playing in the SEC financially it would hurt but we need to move to the Big 12
How do you think that would help get the elite players?

cram224

Quote from: HogHomer on December 13, 2017, 03:34:19 pm
What about the players GFs who are most likely going to a instate school? Have you ever tried to tell a teenager not to chase after a girl? Sure some are going to listen but most teens i know are okay with making a mistake later for some tail today.
Have you seen how many young women that are from Texas, go to UofA?
I bet a few of them have boyfriends that play football.

bphi11ips

Quote from: hogsanity on December 13, 2017, 02:26:59 pm
In many cases they either walked over to Tuscaloosa High, or they drove the hour or so to Birmingham or Montogomery or some other Bama HS. Or they took a day trip to ATL and visited about a dozen 5 star types.

Alabama's talent has been no more homegrown under Saban than it has ever been at Arkansas.  He averages about 6 Alabama recruits per class.

Someone made a good point about pre-Saban Alabama.  I just looked at it.  I use Rivals because the information is easily accessible back to 2002.  Saban took over at Alabama in 2007.  Alabama signed a total of 3 5-star recruits in the five years from 2002 to 2006.  In two of those years they were ranked behind Arkansas, once at 49 and once at 30. In contrast, Saban has signed 40 5-star players in 11 years.  Most of his classes have been ranked number 1.  He had 7 5-stars last year.

I noticed a strange thing when I researched those numbers.  Alabama has signed 7 more players than Arkansas the last four years, and Bret Bielema only had room for 15 this year.  I'm not sure how many CCM will have.  Hopefully more.  Part of that is no doubt due to walk-on scholarships.  The thing I had never thought about is that Saban is able sign more recruits every year than just about everyone else because so many Alabama players declare early.  That helps him in recruiting rankings and doesn't appear to hurt him on the field.

While it is true that teams in the deep south have geographic advantages, those advantages are overblown.  As the Alabama experience shows, recruiting can also be massively improved by a coach.  Frank Broyles did it at Arkansas, and he did it primarily with Texas recruits. 
Life is too short for grudges and feuds.

HogHomer

Quote from: cram224 on December 13, 2017, 05:00:21 pm
Have you seen how many young women that are from Texas, go to UofA?
I bet a few of them have boyfriends that play football.
Sigh. If you've read my other post you would see i am talking about the person behind the 247 profile page. I'm talking about the family. Their situations. The GF thing isn't my big point it's a piece of a much bigger picture.

HogHomer

Quote from: bphi11ips on December 13, 2017, 05:06:01 pm
Alabama's talent has been no more homegrown under Saban than it has ever been at Arkansas.  He averages about 6 Alabama recruits per class.

Someone made a good point about pre-Saban Alabama.  I just looked at it.  I use Rivals because the information is easily accessible back to 2002.  Saban took over at Alabama in 2007.  Alabama signed a total of 3 5-star recruits in the five years from 2002 to 2006.  In two of those years they were ranked behind Arkansas, once at 49 and once at 30. In contrast, Saban has signed 40 5-star players in 11 years.  Most of his classes have been ranked number 1.  He had 7 5-stars last year.

I noticed a strange thing when I researched those numbers.  Alabama has signed 7 more players than Arkansas the last four years, and Bret Bielema only had room for 15 this year.  I'm not sure how many CCM will have.  Hopefully more.  Part of that is no doubt due to walk-on scholarships.  The thing I had never thought about is that Saban is able sign more recruits every year than just about everyone else because so many Alabama players declare early.  That helps him in recruiting rankings and doesn't appear to hurt him on the field.

While it is true that teams in the deep south have geographic advantages, those advantages are overblown.  As the Alabama experience shows, recruiting can also be massively improved by a coach.  Frank Broyles did it at Arkansas, and he did it primarily with Texas recruits.
Alabama was put on probation in 2002. Might help to add that when you are analyzing their recruiting during that time period.

bphi11ips

Quote from: HogHomer on December 13, 2017, 05:11:02 pm
Alabama was put on probation in 2002. Might help to add that when you are analyzing their recruiting during that time period.

It wasn't the first time Alabama had been put on probation, either.  They received three years of probation in 1995, then 5 in 2002, including a two-year bowl ban, for paying players.

Your point is well taken, but does it account for 100% of the difference Saban has made at Alabama?

P.S. - Saban's last two classes at LSU were #1 and #2, respectively.
Life is too short for grudges and feuds.

the 1 and only

Quote from: Paul on December 13, 2017, 04:54:10 pm
How do you think that would help get the elite players?




By playing more games in texas.
Not just one
molon Labe

Use your rights before you lose them

HogHomer

Quote from: bphi11ips on December 13, 2017, 05:23:20 pm
It wasn't the first time Alabama had been put on probation, either.  They received three years of probation in 1995, then 5 in 2002, including a two-year bowl ban, for paying players.

Your point is well taken, but does it account for 100% of the difference Saban has made at Alabama?
If you are trying to make the comparison that Alabama pre Saban was in the same situation that Arkansas is now then I just do not agree. If Saban came here we would absolutely improve but we would not be what Alabama is now.

If that is not the point you were trying to make then I apologize.

bphi11ips

Quote from: HogHomer on December 13, 2017, 05:26:31 pm
If you are trying to make the comparison that Alabama pre Saban was in the same situation that Arkansas is now then I just do not agree. If Saban came here we would absolutely improve but we would not be what Alabama is now.

If that is not the point you were trying to make then I apologize.

I'm not trying to make that point.  The point is that a coach makes all the difference in the world in recruiting. 

I don't think anyone here thinks Arkansas should win division titles and championships on a regular basis.  On the other hand, there is now an entrenched belief that Arkansas can not compete with the deep south SEC teams, including A&M, because Arkansas is hopelessly stuck at the bottom of the conference because of inherent recruiting disadvantages.  That is simply not the case.  The world hasn't changed that much in 6 years.  Arkansas has had pitiful coaching following an embarrassing incident combined with a 180 degree change in philosophy.  That was at least as crippling a situation as Alabama's probation. 

Life is too short for grudges and feuds.

12247

Success often breeds success and we haven't had any success for years.  Most Seniors in High School cannot remember anything about Arkansas that would make them want to come here.

When Arkansas was popular with recruits, we had only a few Bowls and Arkansas usually cracked one of them, sometimes one of the big 4.  Back then, about 20 teams went Bowling and you better find a way to get on one of those teams if you wanted to go bowling. 

Now, just about any team can reach the Bowls Arkansas has reached recently, meaning you can go to Anywhere University and have just as good of a chance of gong bowling as you could at Arkansas.  We do not offer anything at Arkansas that a Kid can't get anywhere he goes.

What we haven't had is a scheme most Kids like, a coach they wish to go play for, a name brand school to brag about, Top that off with poor location and we got nothing.

We keep talking about a coach them up coach.  Hell, first we just need a coach that can coach them, period.  We need a coach that can evaluate players like women can evaluate clothes.  I need this Dude to return punts and kickoffs.  This player could take the handoff rolling right and throw it 30 yards downfield to an uncovered receiver.  They will only leave the WR uncovered once to close on the run.  Now I got one less person to block on the end sweep. and on and on and on.  We need our coach to not be so damn lazy he doesn't find time to recruit hard or so egotistical no Parents can stand him or so dumb its obvious to even the Parents that their Kid shouldn't go there.  Once we half assed take care of the things we can take care of, then we can worry about getting Mr. 5 star to come here.  Right now, Arkansas is no better than any of the top 60 to 80 schools out there.  HopefulHog is just that, hopeful.  The folks we want to come here has no idea what HopefulHog is talking about.  The worst thing we could do right now is try to sell this hundred dollar program for thousands of dollars. Most folks can see right through that LOS.

HogHomer

Quote from: bphi11ips on December 13, 2017, 05:34:34 pm
I'm not trying to make that point.  The point is that a coach makes all the difference in the world in recruiting. 

I don't think anyone here thinks Arkansas should win division titles and championships on a regular basis.  On the other hand, there is now an entrenched belief that Arkansas can not compete with the deep south SEC teams, including A&M, because Arkansas is hopelessly stuck at the bottom of the conference because of inherent recruiting disadvantages.  That is simply not the case.  The world hasn't changed that much in 6 years.  Arkansas has had pitiful coaching following an embarrassing incident combined with a 180 degree change in philosophy.  That was at least as crippling a situation as Alabama's probation.
What is competing for us? 3 SEC West titles in 20+ years. That is our reality. If you want to believe that Arkansas can be better then by all means do it but don't act like it's just a poor Lil Arkansas syndrome when people analyze our history in the SEC and then come to the conclusion that we do have disadvantages that certainly affects the program in a negative way.

And a great coach will help but he's not going to raise our population or move our campus closer to major metro areas.