SB Nation: THE SPREAD OFFENSE HAS CHANGED FOOTBALL FOREVER

[bphi11ips]

I'm not sure that it is any safer than any other style of offense.

I think the misconception is this - the spread is a passing offense.  Passing offenses are safer than run-based offenses.  Therefore the spread is a safer offense.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

I think the misconception is this - the spread is a passing offense.  Passing offenses are safer than run-based offenses.  Therefore the spread is a safer offense.

And that is a misconception because there are varying forms of the Spread that definitely involve the run game. As an example, Auburn presents a fairly balanced approach between run (236) and pass (231) in Gus's version of the Spread. Mike Leach on the other hand, 375 passing to 80 rushing p/gm on average.

[bphi11ips]

And that is a misconception because there are varying forms of the Spread that definitely involve the run game. As an example, Auburn presents a fairly balanced approach between run (236) and pass (231) in Gus's version of the Spread. Mike Leach on the other hand, 375 passing to 80 rushing p/gm on average.

I don't know where those numbers come from.  Maybe Auburn is throwing more with Stidham.  Auburn has run the ball between 65% and 71% of the time every year since Malzahn has been there.  He ran the ball 64% of the time the year he was at Arkansas. 

There is a significant group of players and players reps at the high school level who would like to see the game become a Mike Leach style game - and beyond.  Think basketball on grass.  Every group that would benefit from an erosion of American football's dominance of  U.S. interest smells blood.  Meanwhile, the style of football in the NFL looks much like it always has looked - and ratings are falling off the charts.  Not for political reasons or because mothers and sensitive men don't like seeing helmet-to-helmet hits.  Fans want to see offense.  Offense = scoring to the average fan. 

I've noticed a big change in the way pass interference is being called recently.  It has become the equivalent of walking in the NBA.  The battles in the future will not be in the trenches, except maybe in pass pro. They will be between receivers and defensive backs in one-on-one acrobatics where hands are legal as long as no blatant grabbing or pushing off is involved. 

NFL owners know that football itself is in jeopardy if it loses the physicality that separates it from basketball, baseball and soccer.  On the other hand, it is a business driven by fan interest.  The game appears to be in a state of transition and changes are being driven from the bottom up.  The old guard will resist because that's what the old guard does.  In the end the old guard dies and the new guard makes the decisions.  And uniforms take on the color of highlighters.

[rtr]

I would point out that Kevin Sumlin's version of the spread is air raid based. 

[MuskogeeHogFan]

I don't know where those numbers come from.  Maybe Auburn is throwing more with Stidham.  Auburn has run the ball between 65% and 71% of the time every year since Malzahn has been there.  He ran the ball 64% of the time the year he was at Arkansas. 

There is a significant group of players and players reps at the high school level who would like to see the game become a Mike Leach style game - and beyond.  Think basketball on grass.  Every group that would benefit from an erosion of American football's dominance of  U.S. interest smells blood.  Meanwhile, the style of football in the NFL looks much like it always has looked - and ratings are falling off the charts.  Not for political reasons or because mothers and sensitive men don't like seeing helmet-to-helmet hits.  Fans want to see offense.  Offense = scoring to the average fan. 

I've noticed a big change in the way pass interference is being called recently.  It has become the equivalent of walking in the NBA.  The battles in the future will not be in the trenches, except maybe in pass pro. They will be between receivers and defensive backs in one-on-one acrobatics where hands are legal as long as no blatant grabbing or pushing off is involved. 

NFL owners know that football itself is in jeopardy if it loses the physicality that separates it from basketball, baseball and soccer.  On the other hand, it is a business driven by fan interest.  The game appears to be in a state of transition and changes are being driven from the bottom up.  The old guard will resist because that's what the old guard does.  In the end the old guard dies and the new guard makes the decisions.  And uniforms take on the color of highlighters.

270 rush attempts, 254 passing attempts. More balance this year.

[Pig in the Pokey]

"To us, it's truly making the defense defend the entire field. In college, the spread offense is an equalizer. If your team can't recruit elite linemen, a wide-open offense might be the way to mitigate the talent gap."

Been saying it for years, Arkansas, since it entered the SEC has never been able to level the field recruiting.

So. . . .you have to do something to, otherwise, level the playing field.

Answer is a good to great coach and the spread.

Maybe, the OP is right; this time we go after someone that can teach and coach the spread offense of his choice.

Two I loved was the Leach spread and Briles spread.  Similar, but Briles loved running the ball probably a little more.

leach. dilly dilly

[Pa-Paw]

I think that one can trace the B12 type spread offences  all the way back to 1989 when the Houston Cougars used what was then called the "Run and Shoot" offense. Their QB Andrew Ware won a Heisman Trophy due to the offense as no one in the SW Conference or anywhere else for that matter could defend against it. Fast forward to 2000 when Mike Leach came off of the Oklahoma staff and instituted the Spread offense at Texas Tech which, like the old Run and Shoot, was very potent against the standard defenses. Both of these offenses very worked well using lesser athletes as long as the athletes were "fast" and elusive. The thing is that if you can't out-recruit the "big boys" then a gimmick offense might just level the playing field. 

[hoghiker]

Or competent defense and a great running game to limit possessions. 

What my concern is we go B12 and try it to play it in the SEC.  A&M under Sumlin with less talent. 

This is me. It's not as simple as go to spread.

[Josh Goforth]

Personally, I hate the spread. Call plays from the sideline by holding up pictures, it's like a high school offense to me.
But I am old fashioned. I guess we can't recruit the big road graders for the offensive line consistently.
How about the veer or the wing T ?
But we'll need a QB that can also run.
And that doesn't even get to the defense. IMO we need LB's, Safeties badly.
And I mean big and fast guys with a on the field attitude.

Veer and wing T, you just described the Auburn and Alabama offenses. Only difference is they do it out of the gun instead of under center

[bphi11ips]

What do you think Gus does?  It is a form of the option and relies on oline play.  The difference with Gus is he goes hurry up.  But his offense is about oline play and deception off the run game. 

And this out Alabama thing, who does beat Bama?  They haven't lost a regular season SEC game in how long? 

Mississippi State was Alabama's 31st straight regular season win. 

Atlhogfan is right.  You have to run and be able to stop the run to win the SEC.  Orgeron said this last week.  Case in point - Auburn had 237 rushing yards Saturday to Georgia's 46.

Arkansas has one chance to compete in the SEC, and one chance only, the way Broyles did it.  Play fundamentally sound football in all three phases of the game.  That doesn't mean trying to out-Alabama Alabama. 

[hogsanity]

I think the misconception is this - the spread is a passing offense.  Passing offenses are safer than run-based offenses.  Therefore the spread is a safer offense.

Recent NFL study shows 41% of concussion occurred on passing plays. 20+% occurred on kick/punt returns.

[Lady Razorback]

"To us, it's truly making the defense defend the entire field. In college, the spread offense is an equalizer. If your team can't recruit elite linemen, a wide-open offense might be the way to mitigate the talent gap."

Been saying it for years, Arkansas, since it entered the SEC has never been able to level the field recruiting.

So. . . .you have to do something to, otherwise, level the playing field.

Answer is a good to great coach and the spread.

Maybe, the OP is right; this time we go after someone that can teach and coach the spread offense of his choice.

Two I loved was the Leach spread and Briles spread.  Similar, but Briles loved running the ball probably a little more.

I have long thought this.  We can recruit quality players but usually not a sufficient number for quality depth.  Petrino's success on field here in AR was predicated on this theory.  That's why i never believed that we could out Alabama 'Bama and out LSU  LSU. 

[DeltaBoy]

What do you think Gus does?  It is a form of the option and relies on oline play.  The difference with Gus is he goes hurry up.  But his offense is about oline play and deception off the run game. 

And this out Alabama thing, who does beat Bama?  They haven't lost a regular season SEC game in how long? 

They Lost 2 times to Ole Miss.

[ipigsooie]

Offense wins GAMES.  Defense wins CHAMPIONSHIPS!

Ha! Since when? The past 5 national championships had a total of, 66,85, 62, 65, and 56 points. That means each team averages 34 points a game. Not a lot of defenses winning championships. 

[Atlhogfan1]

The spread works because over the past 15 to 20 years the rules of the game have changed to empower the passing game.  You can barley touch the QB without getting a flag, you can hardly touch the receivers, you can't hit the receivers without getting a targeting call on you and getting thrown out of the game.  An offense today has so many advantages over the defense that it makes sense to spread it out, isolate a defender and play pitch and catch.  Football 'was' the ultimate team sport, to play the pro style offense or heavy run focused you need every player on the same page.. with the spread it doesn't matter, you could have half the team taking a coffee break out there and still do well.

Yes.  And some of it has been rules not enforced like oline downfield.  The hurry up prevents officials from being on top of things.  Rules on when ball is made ready for play hasn't been streamlined and adjusted correctly when no sub is made. 

[hogsanity]

I have long thought this.  We can recruit quality players but usually not a sufficient number for quality depth.  Petrino's success on field here in AR was predicated on this theory.  That's why i never believed that we could out Alabama 'Bama and out LSU  LSU. 

Petrino had NFl draftees at the skill positions on is best 2 teams.

BB had NFl backs and Olinemen, and 4 wrs' that made nfl teams on his best 2 teams ( and a nfl draft pick at qb on one of those ).

It takes talent to win games. This current group of receivers and olinemen would do not better in the spread. As it is now, our wrs, usually laying against man coverage since the defense stacks the box with 7 or 8, still cant get separation most of the time.

As far as the spread, people here cant' even agree on what the spread is. To some, the spread is throwing the ball alot like Leach does. To others it is what Auburn does. Is it a offensive set, I mean the Hogs use 3 wide a lot of times, and sometimes 4. Is it the type of plays run? 

[hogsanity]

Yes.  And some of it has been rules not enforced like oline downfield.  The hurry up prevents officials from being on top of things.  Rules on when ball is made ready for play hasn't been streamlined and adjusted correctly when no sub is made. 

The oline down field rule drives me crazy as an official. I know we are instructed not to call it unless the lineman is downfield more than 5 yards. I saw several games Sat where linemen were that far or farther downfield. Another one the drives me crazy is that they can block downfield as long as the pass is thrown behind the LOS.

[Atlhogfan1]

They Lost 2 times to Ole Miss.

Bama has won 31 straight regular season games. 

[12247]

Every sport competition is based on advantages.  Where and how can you gain an advantage.  Who has the best coach, advantage, who recruits the best, advantage, often who has the most to spend, advantage, who gets the most favorable schedule, advantage.  Every formation of offensive football was designed to take advantage of a defense.  When you are short on talent, you MUST get the few talented you have in a location to have a chance to produce.  Spreading the field is the most likely method of getting your 3 or 4 better players the ball in space.  Until Arkansas can recruit linemen on both sides of the ball with top 10 talent, we must spread the offense and hope to gain an advantage through dilution. 

Only when defenses are forced to actually defend the entire field can a middle of the road team like Arkansas hope to have winning season after winning season and sometimes play for a championship.  This starts with a coach that looks for every mismatch he might take advantage of instead of just running it into the same basic hole in the same basic line and face the same basic result.  In plain English, we must start with a coach that is talented enough to actually evaluate the competition and take advantage of their weaknesses.  Every team has some and most teams have many.  Our coach must find and take advantage of those weaknesses. 

I know this is a SPREAD thread and I am totally behind some form of it in the future.  When you cannot out talent someone, you must spread them out and out coach them to have a chance.  Petrino would most often out coach you on offense.  He would have his team ready for Saturday, no excuses.  He would set you up, he would run plays that most would call gimmicks but our Guys had practiced them to perfection.  People howl on here about how Petrino fell into a great recruiting class, his first year here.  So he rounded up a nice bunch of 3 star players and taught them the game of passing the football.  He did get Mallet and pulled a player bound for USCw back to us, plus gained the big RB that had gone to USCw and wanted to come home.  But Petrino still had to teach them and use them to our advantage and mostly he did.

ARKANSAS WILL NEVER BE SUCCESSFUL RUNNING MOSTLY POWER FOOTBALL, WE JUST CANNOT GET THE LINEMEN AND YOU ALSO NEED GREAT D-LINEMEN TO RUN POWER AS YOU USUALLY DO NOT SCORE FAST ENOUGH TO OVERCOME GETTING BEHIND.

I like Gus because he considers Defense to be very important.  Many spread coaches forget about the defense.

[bphi11ips]

Recent NFL study shows 41% of concussion occurred on passing plays. 20+% occurred on kick/punt returns.

http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/wireStory/apnewsbreak-reported-concussions-occur-pass-plays-51039663

[OneTuskOverTheLine™]

I think we may have isolated the problem..."spread" could very well mean peanut butter, jelly, or some condiments to those so inclined.

Or a photo shoot in a publication...

[Atlhogfan1]

The oline down field rule drives me crazy as an official. I know we are instructed not to call it unless the lineman is downfield more than 5 yards. I saw several games Sat where linemen were that far or farther downfield. Another one the drives me crazy is that they can block downfield as long as the pass is thrown behind the LOS.

Supposed to be 3 in college with a point of emphasis.  NFL rule is one yard downfield.  Watch the Eagles and Wentz.  They will have a lineman blocking on a LB on the second level 3-4 yards downfield like it is a run and he will throw beyond the line of scrimmage and NFL officials miss it. 

The behind the line of scrimmage thing too is so annoying.  The spirit of the rule was to allow screens to RBs.  of course the spread weasels take it and now have wr who go beyond the line of scrimmage like they are running a route and then barely hop back behind the line just as the ball is getting there while others are already blocking downfield.  Chicken darn way of playing football. 

[Lady Razorback]

Every sport competition is based on advantages.  Where and how can you gain an advantage.  Who has the best coach, advantage, who recruits the best, advantage, often who has the most to spend, advantage, who gets the most favorable schedule, advantage.  Every formation of offensive football was designed to take advantage of a defense.  When you are short on talent, you MUST get the few talented you have in a location to have a chance to produce.  Spreading the field is the most likely method of getting your 3 or 4 better players the ball in space.  Until Arkansas can recruit linemen on both sides of the ball with top 10 talent, we must spread the offense and hope to gain an advantage through dilution. 

Only when defenses are forced to actually defend the entire field can a middle of the road team like Arkansas hope to have winning season after winning season and sometimes play for a championship.  This starts with a coach that looks for every mismatch he might take advantage of instead of just running it into the same basic hole in the same basic line and face the same basic result.  In plain English, we must start with a coach that is talented enough to actually evaluate the competition and take advantage of their weaknesses.  Every team has some and most teams have many.  Our coach must find and take advantage of those weaknesses. 

I know this is a SPREAD thread and I am totally behind some form of it in the future.  When you cannot out talent someone, you must spread them out and out coach them to have a chance.  Petrino would most often out coach you on offense.  He would have his team ready for Saturday, no excuses.  He would set you up, he would run plays that most would call gimmicks but our Guys had practiced them to perfection.  People howl on here about how Petrino fell into a great recruiting class, his first year here.  So he rounded up a nice bunch of 3 star players and taught them the game of passing the football.  He did get Mallet and pulled a player bound for USCw back to us, plus gained the big RB that had gone to USCw and wanted to come home.  But Petrino still had to teach them and use them to our advantage and mostly he did.

ARKANSAS WILL NEVER BE SUCCESSFUL RUNNING MOSTLY POWER FOOTBALL, WE JUST CANNOT GET THE LINEMEN AND YOU ALSO NEED GREAT D-LINEMEN TO RUN POWER AS YOU USUALLY DO NOT SCORE FAST ENOUGH TO OVERCOME GETTING BEHIND.

I like Gus because he considers Defense to be very important.  Many spread coaches forget about the defense.

Good post.  This was what I was thinking, but you verbalized it so much better. 

[hogsanity]

Supposed to be 3 in college with a point of emphasis.  NFL rule is one yard downfield.  Watch the Eagles and Wentz.  They will have a lineman blocking on a LB on the second level 3-4 yards downfield like it is a run and he will throw beyond the line of scrimmage and NFL officials miss it. 

The behind the line of scrimmage thing too is so annoying.  The spirit of the rule was to allow screens to RBs.  of course the spread weasels take it and now have wr who go beyond the line of scrimmage like they are running a route and then barely hop back behind the line just as the ball is getting there while others are already blocking downfield.  Chicken darn way of playing football. 

Do they miss it because they do not see it, or do they miss it because they are told to miss it? I called a game this year, not with my normal crew., and I was told before the game not to call ineligible downfield unless it was at least 6 yards or the ineligible caught the ball.  I saw why after about 3 plays, one of the teams had ineligible downfield just about every play. 

[Atlhogfan1]

He would have his team ready for Saturday, no excuses.   

I like Gus because he considers Defense to be very important.  Many spread coaches forget about the defense.

Not true too many times.  Way too many slow starts and first half deficits and penalty-laden games.  Romanticizing the legend of Bobby.  What he did do was adjust well and his offense could come from behind.

I don't believe Gus considers defense to any more important than most any other coach.  He is at a program who can build great defenses.  If he were are Ok St or Texas Tech or Baylor or Syracuse or most any of the lesser programs who have tried the spread, his defense of course wouldn't be what it is.

[hogsanity]

Not true too many times.  Way too many slow starts and first half deficits and penalty-laden games.  Romanticizing the legend of Bobby.  What he did do was adjust well and his offense could come from behind.

I don't believe Gus considers defense to any more important than most any other coach.  He is at a program who can build great defenses.  If he were are Ok St or Texas Tech or Baylor or Syracuse or most any of the lesser programs who have tried the spread, his defense of course wouldn't be what it is.

Proximity to great defensive players. Aub lists 12 players as "starters" on their 2 deep on defense. 6 are from Alabama, 3 from Fl and 3 from GA. I did not look at distances, but I bet all are from within 300 miles. Offense was a little different. 4 from Bama, 3 Fla, 2 Ga 1 KS and 1 TX. Total of those listed as starters 10 from Bama, 6 from Fl, 5 from GA, 1 ks, 1 tx.

[Atlhogfan1]

Do they miss it because they do not see it, or do they miss it because they are told to miss it? I called a game this year, not with my normal crew., and I was told before the game not to call ineligible downfield unless it was at least 6 yards or the ineligible caught the ball.  I saw why after about 3 plays, one of the teams had ineligible downfield just about every play.

I would hope NFL officials aren't told to ignore it.  They are so absurdly technical on so much.  I'm guessing with all they have to watch they miss it.  May be time to get an extra official on the field in college and NFL for these types of offenses or re-position. 

[hogsanity]

I would hope NFL officials aren't told to ignore it.  They are so absurdly technical on so much.  I'm guessing with all they have to watch they miss it.  May be time to get an extra official on the field in college and NFL for these types of offenses or re-position. 

I have a hard time buying that they miss it so often. They know the eligible number, they know where the eligibles are at the snap, they have 4 or 5 officials that are watching the play beyond the los. It should not be hard to see #77 is 4 yards downfield.

[Atlhogfan1]

I have a hard time buying that they miss it so often. They know the eligible number, they know where the eligibles are at the snap, they have 4 or 5 officials that are watching the play beyond the los. It should not be hard to see #77 is 4 yards downfield.

Good article from a couple of years ago:
https://www.si.com/college-football/2015/02/22/rule-proposal-linemen-downfield-punt-pass-pork

4 or 5 officials though aren't in position to judge if a lineman is past the limit or when ball is thrown. 

[hogsanity]

Good article from a couple of years ago:
https://www.si.com/college-football/2015/02/22/rule-proposal-linemen-downfield-punt-pass-pork

4 or 5 officials though aren't in position to judge if a lineman is past the limit or when ball is thrown. 

Sure they are. Both line judges, both side judges and the back judge. Even the umpire could be depending on where the pass is thrown. Matter of fact, only ineligible downfield I saw called all weekend was the umpire because the lineman in question ran right infront of him.

[Shorttimer]

The spread hasn't changed football forever . . . the blocking rules have.  You guys who have pointed this out are right. 

You may not like a rule that could work to your advantage.  You might think it's a stupid rule.  Like me, you might even think it changes the fundamental underpinnings of the game.  But you'd be an idiot not to use it.

[RD]

At the end of the day it's still coaching

Any Coach/Coordinator can have a QB stand 4 steps behind the center a RB offset and 2 WRs to the wide side 2 WRs to the short side and still suck.


Coaching and Execution.

On paper Greenwood High School shouldn't compete with Texarkana, Pine Bluff, West Memphis, El Dorado, Benton, etc...

It's coaching and execution.

[hogtheball]

Personally, I hate the spread. Call plays from the sideline by holding up pictures, it's like a high school offense to me.
But I am old fashioned. I guess we can't recruit the big road graders for the offensive line consistently.
How about the veer or the wing T ?
But we'll need a QB that can also run.
And that doesn't even get to the defense. IMO we need LB's, Safeties badly.
And I mean big and fast guys with a on the field attitude.

pretty funny post - you hate the "spread" but would like an offense like a veer or Wing T and a QB who can run!   You know you accidentally described the most popular variation of the "spread," right?  Or were you being sarcastic and I'm missing my sarcasm detector again?

[SwineOnUCrazyDiamond]

OK, but.... Is Gus coming back to Arkansas?

[SwinedMelon]

OK, but.... Is Gus coming back to Arkansas?

Great question.

[Malvin]

7 on 7 National Champs..

This is kind of what football is today.  I hate the spread but the rules of the game dictate that you need to run it or you will not win.  The old saying defense wins championships worked back in the day, but today's football the defense doesn't really matter. 

The rules of the game are so sensitive now that defensive players have a hard time making any kind of impact on the game.  Wide receivers can basically run free all over the field, they don't really worry anymore about getting hit after the catch because.. well the defensive player will get thrown out of the game.  Back in the day you didn't run a route across the middle because you would get killed.  Back in the day the pass rush was much more intense, the QB didn't have all day to throw the ball.  These days if you get to the QB you can't really hit them, you can't hit them high, you can't hit them low.  You can't swat at the ball because you run the risk of touching their helmet which will get you thrown out of the game.

This imbalance in the game is why recruiting is so offensive focused and coaches are putting their best athletes on the offensive side of the ball... it's a waste to put them on defense.  Basically, the game has turned into execution of the passing game.. whichever team can pitch and catch more efficiently will win the game.  Seriously, watch some of the games in the Big 12 and other conferences, basically each team scores a touchdown on nearly every play.. that's entertainment?

[hogfan10]

For the most part offense has never been our problem, but stopping the other teams offense has.