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With Moses coming back, let's check expectation levels...

Started by Deep Shoat, May 10, 2016, 12:43:46 pm

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With the return of Moses Kingsley, what does the BB team need to do in order for you to get back on the CMA bandwagon?

Nothing.  Mike Anderson is the coach for the Hogs no matter what.
18 (8.4%)
Any postseason bid is enough to show we are on the right track.
21 (9.8%)
NCAAT is a must.  Anything less and he should be done.
143 (66.8%)
Sweet 16 or bust.  2 Tourney appearances in 6 years won't cut it.
22 (10.3%)
I'm not sure a National Championship would convince me.  I've never thought he was the right man for the job.
10 (4.7%)

Total Members Voted: 213

Deep Shoat

Let's be real about what we really expect in year 6.  Anonymity means you can be completely honest.
All Gas, No Brakes!

cosmodrum

NCAAT. I figure we'll be a bubble team, trying to fight our way in.
Go away, batin'

 

GuvHog

I've said it before and I'll say it again:

If the Hogs don't at least make the NIT next season, Jeff Long should relieve Mike of his duties as head Hog. Just my opinion. The talent is definitely there for a solid NIT bid if not an NCAA Tournament bid.
Bleeding Razorback Red Since Birth!!!


jry04

Quote from: GuvHog on May 10, 2016, 12:57:28 pm
I've said it before and I'll say it again:

If the Hogs don't at least make the NIT next season, Jeff Long should relieve Mike of his duties as head Hog. Just my opinion. The talent is definitely there for a solid NIT bid if not an NCAA Tournament bid.
I know what JL has said, I think he will be gone without a NCAAT bid this next season.

yraciv

If the Juco's are as advertised, the talent is there for a 2nd round team. At the least, we should be dancing.  If we are not dancing, it's time to show Mike the door.

hogsanity

I said it months ago, sweet 16 or he should be gone. No NCAAT and he should have to pack up on selection Sunday if not sooner.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

Atlhogfan1

Need to see the schedule and what the SEC rosters will be.

Hard to believe our non conf will contain too many dangerous games.  Some quality opponents from the RPI manipulation standpoint.  But something tougher than a 10-3 non conf schedule based on the roster seems hard to imagine with this staff.  We've gotten the news about Minnesota and Texas in Houston(good job of scheduling).

This would lead to needing to go around 12-6 or so in the SEC before the SECT.  Again, need to see the schedules but outside of UK and maybe UF it is doubtful the SEC will have a really strong team. 

This seems like a bottom floor min just guessing at what the schedule might be.  It is actually time for the staff and team to do something extraordinary and truly accomplish something.  But they at least need to do well enough to get to the supposed help coming from some future and possible commits. 

For less than something near this seemingly would require Barford and/or Macon be busts/slow developers or a long term injury to Barford and/or Moses.  Or for a more difficult schedule (which the resulting stronger RPI would help compensate for).
Quote from: MaconBacon on March 22, 2018, 10:30:04 amWe had a good run in the 90's and one NC and now the whole state still laments that we are a top seed program and have kids standing in line to come to good ole Arkansas.  We're just a flash in the pan boys. 

Kevin

Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.<br />James 4:7
Reject Every Kind Of Evil 1 Thessalonians 5:22

Atlhogfan1

Quote from: Atlhogfan1 on May 10, 2016, 02:24:05 pm
It is actually time for the staff and team to do something extraordinary and truly accomplish something.  .
Quote from: Kevin on May 10, 2016, 02:25:52 pm
elite 8

I won't go specific E8.  But some level of accomplishment should be the expectation going forward.  Blah should be a thing of the past. 
Quote from: MaconBacon on March 22, 2018, 10:30:04 amWe had a good run in the 90's and one NC and now the whole state still laments that we are a top seed program and have kids standing in line to come to good ole Arkansas.  We're just a flash in the pan boys. 

jjdlc

This will be his overall most talented team since he's been here.  I would think we should be comfortably in the tournament, and win at least 1.  I really want to say sweet 16, but this team is going to have a ton of new faces.  If we miss the tourney again...

Deep Shoat

With very few votes in an unscientific poll, it appears most of us are on the same page.  NCAAT is a must. 

Barring significant injury issues, this team must perform well in order for the fan base to give CMA more time.
All Gas, No Brakes!

gmarv

I think its time we started to make some noise and I think we will.

 

hogsanity

Quote from: Atlhogfan1 on May 10, 2016, 02:24:05 pm
Need to see the schedule and what the SEC rosters will be.

Hard to believe our non conf will contain too many dangerous games.  Some quality opponents from the RPI manipulation standpoint.  But something tougher than a 10-3 non conf schedule based on the roster seems hard to imagine with this staff.  We've gotten the news about Minnesota and Texas in Houston(good job of scheduling).

This would lead to needing to go around 12-6 or so in the SEC before the SECT.  Again, need to see the schedules but outside of UK and maybe UF it is doubtful the SEC will have a really strong team. 

This seems like a bottom floor min just guessing at what the schedule might be.  It is actually time for the staff and team to do something extraordinary and truly accomplish something.  But they at least need to do well enough to get to the supposed help coming from some future and possible commits. 

For less than something near this seemingly would require Barford and/or Macon be busts/slow developers or a long term injury to Barford and/or Moses.  Or for a more difficult schedule (which the resulting stronger RPI would help compensate for).

They go to Minnesota, and play TX in Texas on a "neutral" site. Given their road woes for years now, both those are dangerous. Are we also in the big12/sec weekend again? If so our game there will be on the road too since we hosted last year.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

ShadowHawg

Quote from: hogsanity on May 10, 2016, 02:04:39 pm
I said it months ago, sweet 16 or he should be gone. No NCAAT and he should have to pack up on selection Sunday if not sooner.

LOL!!!

Sweet 16 or bust. Fire IZZO!!

hamARchy in the USA

So much talk about the postseason.  The program should be regularly competing for the SEC title.  The postseason would be a given most years.

porkinsons disease

This hiding behind he has a great recruiting classcoming in crap is just another excuse for this man. you could give this man M. Johnson and Larry Bird togather and he still would not win. he is a pitiful coach who can,t coach a lick.-fcj 1/22/2011

nwahogfan1

May 10, 2016, 09:03:39 pm #17 Last Edit: May 11, 2016, 06:52:25 am by nwahogfan1
We can not have it two ways.  We keep clamoring on here that with Moses returning next years team is going to be much better and that to me means at least a NCAAT team and should be a Sweet 16 team.  We have like 10 junior and seniors on this team.  We have like the best shooting guard and best 4/5 player in the SEC coming back.  Mike recruited 3 JUCOs for immediate help and so why not win now?   We should make a strong run in the NCAAT and at the SECC.   A sweet 16 appearance is probable.  Anything else is disappointing to me.

Dr. Starcs


TC3hogs

Should be the second best team in SEC. Sweet 16 or bust. This will be the most talent we have had in years.

HOGINTENNESSEE

Quote from: TC3hogs on May 10, 2016, 09:27:40 pm
Should be the second best team in SEC. Sweet 16 or bust. This will be the most talent we have had in years.

Agree with your first statement. Not the other 2 statements

bphi11ips

Hogs don't lose much from a team that was pretty good and add 3 of the top 5 Jucos in the country.  Offense travels better than defense in basketball, and this team will have enough scorers that one can have an off night on the road without killing the halfcourt offense.

Should be Anderson's best team at Arkansas. 
Life is too short for grudges and feuds.

yraciv

Quote from: TC3hogs on May 10, 2016, 09:27:40 pm
Should be the second best team in SEC. Sweet 16 or bust. This will be the most talent we have had in years.

IDK about that A&M has got a lot of guys back and UGA should be pretty good as well.  MS State has a huge class coming in as well, but they are young.

hogsanity

Quote from: bphi11ips on May 10, 2016, 09:56:52 pm


Should be Anderson's best team at Arkansas. 


They they should make AT LEAST the sweet 16.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

 

Razorbackers

If these JUCOs are as advertised, then they very well could start the season just outside the top 25. Lots of experience and returning talent.

azhog10

Quote from: hogsanity on May 11, 2016, 09:06:33 am
They they should make AT LEAST the sweet 16.
LOL, if anyone is going to have high expectations it's you. Not sure how anyone can believe this team is already better than the Portis and Qualls team of a two years ago. While I hope we make the sweet 16, we have so many new guys that I don't understand how someone can already expect the best outcome we've had in over 20 years.

The_Iceman

Quote from: hogsanity on May 11, 2016, 09:06:33 am
They they should make AT LEAST the sweet 16.

So you think Arkansas will be one of the best 16 teams in the country next year?

The_Iceman

Quote from: azhog10 on May 11, 2016, 09:11:52 am
LOL, if anyone is going to have high expectations it's you. Not sure how anyone can believe this team is already better than the Portis and Qualls team of a two years ago. While I hope we make the sweet 16, we have so many new guys that I don't understand how someone can already expect the best outcome we've had in over 20 years.

I actually think this team is better than that team. Barford and Hannahs are much better than Madden and Beard. Instead of Harris and Jacorey, we have Thomas, Cook, Hazen, and Bailey. We will be a much better shooting team and we will have more depth and length.

Next years team should be at least as good as Portis' team, although the SEC will be better than it was that year so it may not show in the record.

azhog10

Quote from: The_Iceman on May 11, 2016, 09:19:30 am
I actually think this team is better than that team. Barford and Hannahs are much better than Madden and Beard. Instead of Harris and Jacorey, we have Thomas, Cook, Hazen, and Bailey. We will be a much better shooting team and we will have more depth and length.

Next years team should be at least as good as Portis' team, although the SEC will be better than it was that year so it may not show in the record.
I think it's possible that they could be. But I don't see how anyone can say with certainty yet that they will be or should be. I would at least like to see how they perform in Spain and how all the pieces gel together first. I agree depth should be better, shooting as well. But I'm not sure we have that go to scorer that we had in Portis and that dynamic athlete teams have to look out for in Qualls. It's possible we do, I just haven't seen it yet.

We know what we have in Kingsley and Hannahs. But just how good will Barford, Macon, Cook, Bailey, and Thomas be? How much of an impact with Hazen have or CJ? Just a lot of question marks where when we had Qualls and Portis we knew what we had in those guys and Madden and Harris were seniors that had already been through SEC play before.

The_Iceman

Quote from: azhog10 on May 11, 2016, 09:24:22 am
I think it's possible that they could be. But I don't see how anyone can say with certainty yet that they will be or should be. I would at least like to see how they perform in Spain and how all the pieces gel together first. I agree depth should be better, shooting as well. But I'm not sure we have that go to scorer that we had in Portis and that dynamic athlete teams have to look out for in Qualls. It's possible we do, I just haven't seen it yet.

We know what we have in Kingsley and Hannahs. But just how good will Barford, Macon, Cook, Bailey, and Thomas be? How much of an impact with Hazen have or CJ? Just a lot of question marks where when we had Qualls and Portis we knew what we had in those guys and Madden and Harris were seniors that had already been through SEC play before.

Barford #0 White:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_sWzLAjw04

Watch the first 20 minutes and get back to me. Oh, and that was from his freshman year and he's gotten even better since.

King Kong

Quote from: hogsanity on May 11, 2016, 09:06:33 am
They they should make AT LEAST the sweet 16.

Won't be a preseason Top 25 team but they should at least go to the Sweet 16 in the biggest crap shoot in sports. Completely logicial

I mean Tom Izzo and Coach K each with First round NBA talent have been out in the first round by 15 seeds in the last 3 years.

What Anderson needs to do is start making the NCAAt every year

HoopS

It's fine to say whatever in terms of expectations but I can't take any of it seriously until we see our schedule and see them out on the floor. I will say that I definitely expect an NCAAT appearance and think we could be a sweet 16 team but need to see more before going on record. I know some are wanting to say we are absolutely a whatever level team but there's just too much to consider before going there. Other teams improve as well. The tournament schedule plays a huge part. A team who gets bounced out in the round of 32 could well be a top 10-15 team but got a crappy draw. Let's have a strong season and learn to win on the road like we did two seasons ago and see where we wind up.

Kevin

didn't somebody on bo's show yesterday say we will have 3 pro's on the floor next year?
Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.<br />James 4:7
Reject Every Kind Of Evil 1 Thessalonians 5:22

azhog10

Quote from: The_Iceman on May 11, 2016, 09:27:53 am
Barford #0 White:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_sWzLAjw04

Watch the first 20 minutes and get back to me. Oh, and that was from his freshman year and he's gotten even better since.
I've seen that video, and others as well. While I think he's going to be a good one, I still hold reservation till I see him with this team and against D1 speed and phsyicality. Like I said, Portis and crew had all seen it before so it wasn't new to them. For now we have Hannahs and Kingsley, of the main scorers that have been through this before. Barford, Macon, and Cook will all be new to it. That's why I am not as sold as some that this team is as good as that team that won 27 games. The potential is there, but I don't see how anyone is certain just yet.

jry04

Quote from: Kevin on May 11, 2016, 09:53:38 am
didn't somebody on bo's show yesterday say we will have 3 pro's on the floor next year?
Nick Mason, so I wouldn't necessarily put a lot of stock into what he says. However, he shares the same opinion that many others who have been on the radio as guests have said. Bill Ingram was on the show a few weeks ago saying he has talked to 4 or 5 different NBA scouts at various summer events that said they have seen Macon and that he has the skill set to be in the NBA now, but he needs to work on his upper body strength and add muscle. He said Barford and Macon will both fit in nicely at Arkansas, and the scouts think the question isn't "if" the two will make the NBA, but "when."

razoredge178

Quote from: King Kong on May 11, 2016, 09:29:22 am
Won't be a preseason Top 25 team but they should at least go to the Sweet 16 in the biggest crap shoot in sports. Completely logicial

I mean Tom Izzo and Coach K each with First round NBA talent have been out in the first round by 15 seeds in the last 3 years.

What Anderson needs to do is start making the NCAAt every year

Should be easy to do playing in the worst of the Power 5. Yet its not...

Atlhogfan1

I think we have a couple of different approaches going on with these "predictions".

Some are going to look at it in terms of just this team vs the schedule(when we get it) and how these players look when together based on reports or through early practices and scrimmages(Hoops' approach).

Others are going to come at this as it is season 6 for Anderson and it is time he starts accomplishing something and do so consistently.  No more "ifs" or qualifications or "wait till".  This is completely his team built with his chosen JC players and one of our program's better big men ever.  Fair to this current team?  Probably not. 

And stop with the Izzo and Coach K comments.  Izzo has been brought up at least twice in the last several hours.  If Coach A in his 21st season at Arkansas loses in the first NCAAT game after going to 7 F4's and winning a NC in his first 20, he will be in for a free pass and judged differently than if this current team ends up as a high seed and loses in the first game.  Yes, it happens to all programs.  But some of those coaches have actually accomplished something too.  Not promises, what if's, wait till next year or when these recruits arrive,...
Quote from: MaconBacon on March 22, 2018, 10:30:04 amWe had a good run in the 90's and one NC and now the whole state still laments that we are a top seed program and have kids standing in line to come to good ole Arkansas.  We're just a flash in the pan boys. 

King Kong

Quote from: razoredge178 on May 11, 2016, 10:35:39 am
Should be easy to do playing in the worst of the Power 5. Yet its not...

Actually it's harder to do in the worst Power 5 conference.

Because you have to play 18 conference games against those opponents that bring your RPI down even when you win.

azhog10

Quote from: Atlhogfan1 on May 11, 2016, 10:43:29 am
I think we have a couple of different approaches going on with these "predictions".

Some are going to look at it in terms of just this team vs the schedule(when we get it) and how these players look when together based on reports or through early practices and scrimmages(Hoops' approach).

Others are going to come at this as it is season 6 for Anderson and it is time he starts accomplishing something and do so consistently.  No more "ifs" or qualifications or "wait till".  This is completely his team built with his chosen JC players and one of our program's better big men ever.  Fair to this current team?  Probably not. 

And stop with the Izzo and Coach K comments.  Izzo has been brought up at least twice in the last several hours.  If Coach A in his 21st season at Arkansas loses in the first NCAAT game after going to 7 F4's and winning a NC in his first 20, he will be in for a free pass and judged differently than if this current team ends up as a high seed and loses in the first game.  Yes, it happens to all programs.  But some of those coaches have actually accomplished something too.  Not promises, what if's, wait till next year or when these recruits arrive,...
I didn't take the comment about Izzo and Coack K going out in the first round as them getting a "pass". It was more about how in the tourney stuff happens, and really good teams get beat out early. The final 16 aren't necessarily the best 16, but more about matchups and the magic of march biting you in the butt.

yraciv

Quote from: razoredge178 on May 11, 2016, 10:35:39 am
Should be easy to do playing in the worst of the Power 5. Yet its not...

It's going to get harder. Coaching was the  problem with the conference in early years.  The SEC should be getting substantially better with a lot of those new guys going into year 2.

azhog10

Quote from: King Kong on May 11, 2016, 10:50:37 am
Actually it's harder to do in the worst Power 5 conference.

Because you have to play 18 conference games against those opponents that bring your RPI down even when you win.
Also, it was the toughest conference to win a road game in, and has been for the last few years.

hogsanity

Quote from: The_Iceman on May 11, 2016, 09:16:14 am
So you think Arkansas will be one of the best 16 teams in the country next year?

I meant to say "THEN they should at least make the sweet 16" in reference to someone saying this is Mike most talented team he's had here. If that is true, they should do better than the BP MQ team that made the round of 32.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

Atlhogfan1

Quote from: azhog10 on May 11, 2016, 10:51:42 am
I didn't take the comment about Izzo and Coack K going out in the first round as them getting a "pass". It was more about how in the tourney stuff happens, and really good teams get beat out early. The final 16 aren't necessarily the best 16, but more about matchups and the magic of march biting you in the butt.

I know what it is.  Stuff does happen.  But they have accomplished something at their programs. 
Quote from: MaconBacon on March 22, 2018, 10:30:04 amWe had a good run in the 90's and one NC and now the whole state still laments that we are a top seed program and have kids standing in line to come to good ole Arkansas.  We're just a flash in the pan boys. 

The_Iceman

Quote from: hogsanity on May 11, 2016, 10:56:06 am
I meant to say "THEN they should at least make the sweet 16" in reference to someone saying this is Mike most talented team he's had here. If that is true, they should do better than the BP MQ team that made the round of 32.

If the Portis team would have gone against Maryland, Georgetown, or Louisville, I think we would have won. UNC was a bad matchup for us. As I said earlier, the NCAAT is all about matchups. We could be a #7 seed next year, but go further if the matchups go in our favor.

Atlhogfan1

Quote from: azhog10 on May 11, 2016, 10:52:35 am
Also, it was the toughest conference to win a road game in, and has been for the last few years.

That isn't because of the competition level or teams' abilities. 

2014-15 wasn't difficult comparatively for road teams. 
Quote from: MaconBacon on March 22, 2018, 10:30:04 amWe had a good run in the 90's and one NC and now the whole state still laments that we are a top seed program and have kids standing in line to come to good ole Arkansas.  We're just a flash in the pan boys. 

hogsanity

Quote from: The_Iceman on May 11, 2016, 11:02:30 am
If the Portis team would have gone against Maryland, Georgetown, or Louisville, I think we would have won. UNC was a bad matchup for us. As I said earlier, the NCAAT is all about matchups. We could be a #7 seed next year, but go further if the matchups go in our favor.

Agree that is much of the NCAAT, but much of it is having a better team than who you play as well.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

Atlhogfan1

Quote from: The_Iceman on May 11, 2016, 11:02:30 am
If the Portis team would have gone against Maryland, Georgetown, or Louisville, I think we would have won. UNC was a bad matchup for us. As I said earlier, the NCAAT is all about matchups. We could be a #7 seed next year, but go further if the matchups go in our favor.

Win one of those matchups.  Again, accomplish something even if unexpected or even improbable.  Perhaps it takes a team capable of playing his extended defenses which we may be starting to build finally. 
Quote from: MaconBacon on March 22, 2018, 10:30:04 amWe had a good run in the 90's and one NC and now the whole state still laments that we are a top seed program and have kids standing in line to come to good ole Arkansas.  We're just a flash in the pan boys. 

Kevin

Quote from: jry04 on May 11, 2016, 10:18:27 am
Nick Mason, so I wouldn't necessarily put a lot of stock into what he says. However, he shares the same opinion that many others who have been on the radio as guests have said. Bill Ingram was on the show a few weeks ago saying he has talked to 4 or 5 different NBA scouts at various summer events that said they have seen Macon and that he has the skill set to be in the NBA now, but he needs to work on his upper body strength and add muscle. He said Barford and Macon will both fit in nicely at Arkansas, and the scouts think the question isn't "if" the two will make the NBA, but "when."

then elite eight or bust
Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you.<br />James 4:7
Reject Every Kind Of Evil 1 Thessalonians 5:22

azhog10

Quote from: Atlhogfan1 on May 11, 2016, 11:05:08 am
That isn't because of the competition level or teams' abilities. 

2014-15 wasn't difficult comparatively for road teams.
Like I said the SEC, statistically has had one of the best home win percentages. I'm not arguing competition level or abilities. You can have your own opinion on that. ESPN and CBS in late January had the SEC as the #4 and #5 ranked conference. Obviously we didn't end up with as many teams in the big dance as others, but per the BPI and whatever CBS used at the time the SEC was not as bad as people project. Are the SEC Football dominant? No. But they were up until mid-february a top 5 conference. I'm shocked  as well but it's what they were up until the end of the season.

Atlhogfan1

Quote from: azhog10 on May 11, 2016, 11:12:24 am
Like I said the SEC, statistically has had one of the best home win percentages. I'm not arguing competition level or abilities. You can have your own opinion on that. ESPN and CBS in late January had the SEC as the #4 and #5 ranked conference. Obviously we didn't end up with as many teams in the big dance as others, but per the BPI and whatever CBS used at the time the SEC was not as bad as people project. Are the SEC Football dominant? No. But they were up until mid-february a top 5 conference. I'm shocked  as well but it's what they were up until the end of the season.

There are only 7 power conferences if you include the A10. 
Quote from: MaconBacon on March 22, 2018, 10:30:04 amWe had a good run in the 90's and one NC and now the whole state still laments that we are a top seed program and have kids standing in line to come to good ole Arkansas.  We're just a flash in the pan boys.