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when holtz got fired

Started by dfwalumdad, November 20, 2017, 07:47:33 am

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dfwalumdad

paul eells the night before holtz was fired at the end of his 6pm broadcast delivered an editorial calling for holtz's dismissal or resignation. it was unprecedented, it was analogous to cronkite's saying the veitnam war was unwinnable.

at the time katv and razorback football were essentially one and the same thing that's no longer the case.

anyway steve sullivan yesterday weighed in on bert.

It no longer seems to be a matter of "if" for Bret Bielema. Friday, Saturday or Sunday, the three most logical guesses on when Arkansas will pull the plug on the Bret Bielema era.

In most situations, he was blue-collar Bret, a great fit for this state.

He just didn't win enough.

http://katv.com/sports/sully-says/sully-says-one-more-game-for-coach-b

this is as official as it's going to get until it's official.

   

SchrodingersHog

I'm digressing from the OP, but the title of the post got me thinking about something else.

The instability in our football program can be traced back to the firing of Holtz and the whatever you want to call it happened with Hatfield.  After that we got Crow, interim, Ford, Nutt (and his drama), interim, Petrino (and more drama), smiley, and now Bret. 

If our next coach is as good as Holtz or Hatfield, I hope we have the good sense to leave him alone and not fire him or run him off for trivial crap.

 

SamBuckhart

Hoping to end 2017 season with a victory Friday. GO HOGS!
BE TRUE TO YOUR SCHOOL. THE UNIVERSITY OF ARKANSAS!!!  WOOO PIG!!!

Razorback Pastor

Quote from: SchrodingersHog on November 20, 2017, 08:10:33 am
I'm digressing from the OP, but the title of the post got me thinking about something else.

The instability in our football program can be traced back to the firing of Holtz and the whatever you want to call it happened with Hatfield.  After that we got Crow, interim, Ford, Nutt (and his drama), interim, Petrino (and more drama), smiley, and now Bret. 

If our next coach is as good as Holtz or Hatfield, I hope we have the good sense to leave him alone and not fire him or run him off for trivial crap.

I second EVERY BIT of this!

sowmonella

Quote from: SamBuckhart on November 20, 2017, 08:17:22 am
Hoping to end 2017 season with a victory Friday. GO HOGS!

Me too. Go Hogs. Send the seniors out with a win.
Not trying to brag or make anyone jealous but I can still fit into the same pair of socks I wore in high school.
Proud member since August 2003

Vantage 8 dude

November 20, 2017, 10:16:59 am #5 Last Edit: November 20, 2017, 04:49:04 pm by Vantage 8 dude
Quote from: SchrodingersHog on November 20, 2017, 08:10:33 am
I'm digressing from the OP, but the title of the post got me thinking about something else.

The instability in our football program can be traced back to the firing of Holtz and the whatever you want to call it happened with Hatfield.  After that we got Crow, interim, Ford, Nutt (and his drama), interim, Petrino (and more drama), smiley, and now Bret. 

If our next coach is as good as Holtz or Hatfield, I hope we have the good sense to leave him alone and not fire him or run him off for trivial crap.
I was around way back when. And yes, while Lou had done some incredible things with our program, like the '77 Orange Bowl upset of OU and the '81 whipping of #1 Texas, over time he also lost focus.

First of all, he apparently alienated many of the instate coaches here in Arkansas. At least that was the word back then.

Secondly, he apparently began thinking of himself as quite a bit larger than the state. I remember his endorsement of Jessie Helms back in North Carolina that ran afoul of some on the Hill. However, the biggest gaff was his appearance on Johnny Carson's The Tonight Show shortly before he was booted. I remember it as if it were yesterday. During the show, after performing some of his famous magic tricks, he was being interviewed by Johnny. At that point Lou said something like: "Well, I live in Arkansas. And while it may not be the end of the world, you CAN see it from there". After which there was great laughter from both Carson and the audience. I remember thinking "Uhh....Lou, whether you meant to or not, you just said the wrong thing. You may have just 'cooked your own goose'" with that little remark". Therefore, I wasn't particularly shocked when a several months later he "resigned because he was tired of coaching".

Funny how he immediately popped back up on by taking the Minnesota job. I suppose he got rejuvenated real quickly.  ;)

SchrodingersHog

Quote from: Vantage 8 dude on November 20, 2017, 10:16:59 am
I was around way back when. And yes, while Lou had done some incredible things with our program, like the '78 Orange Bowl upset of OU and the '81 whipping of #1 Texas, over time he also lost focus.

First of all, he apparently alienated many of the instate coaches here in Arkansas. At least that was the word back then.

Secondly, he apparently began thinking of himself as quite a bit larger than the state. I remember his endorsement of Jessie Helms back in North Carolina that ran afoul of some on the Hill. However, the biggest gaff was his appearance on Johnny Carson's The Tonight Show shortly before he was booted. I remember it as if it were yesterday. During the show, after performing some of his famous magic tricks, he was being interviewed by Johnny. At that point Lou said something like: "Well, I live in Arkansas. And while it may not be the end of the world, you CAN see it from there". After which there was great laughter from both Carson and the audience. I remember thinking "Uhh....Lou, whether you meant to or not, you just said the wrong thing. You may have just 'cooked your own goose'" with that little remark". Therefore, I wasn't particularly shocked when a several months later he "resigned because he was tired of coaching".

Funny how he immediately popped back up on by taking the Minnesota job. I suppose he got rejuvenated real quickly.  ;)

Yep, that's the kind of trivial stuff I'm talking about.  Politics and a joke that offended some thin skinned folks.  Didn't suck up to instate HS coaches.  I don't think that was worth starting us down the road we find ourselves on now.  The same goes for the minor imperfections of Hatfield. 

As I said, I hope we've got better sense if we ever get another good coach.

Torqued pork

The talent level from the time Holtz got here to the time he left had dropped dramatically.  Lou did not like recruiting and it was showing. IIRC we had to settle for a tie against Rice at home in his last year.

Of course decades later all many remember is the Orange Bowl and beating Texas in Fayetteville.

hogsanity

Quote from: SchrodingersHog on November 20, 2017, 10:44:28 am
Yep, that's the kind of trivial stuff I'm talking about.  Politics and a joke that offended some thin skinned folks.  Didn't suck up to instate HS coaches.  I don't think that was worth starting us down the road we find ourselves on now.  The same goes for the minor imperfections of Hatfield. 

As I said, I hope we've got better sense if we ever get another good coach.

Yep. Arkansans are very thin skinned and always looking for ways to claim someone is out to get them or keep them down. When, the reality is, it is our own backwards thinking that keeps us down.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

jdlew

I thought the appearace on Johnny Carson was just after the Orange Bowl win ...That was his first year here...Jessie Helms and recruiting is what got him in trouble with Frank..

Vantage 8 dude

November 20, 2017, 03:42:48 pm #10 Last Edit: November 20, 2017, 04:51:56 pm by Vantage 8 dude
Quote from: jdlew on November 20, 2017, 01:30:00 pm
I thought the appearace on Johnny Carson was just after the Orange Bowl win ...That was his first year here...Jessie Helms and recruiting is what got him in trouble with Frank..
If I'm not mistaken he had a least two appearances on the Tonight Show; one was most certainly on 12/13/78 when he was one just before we played UCLA that year in the Fiesta Bowl (but this was definitely not the one that got him in trouble) What I DO KNOW is that his joke about the state was made not long before his leaving. Not saying it contributed to his departure; he was definitely already in hot water over the Helms support. It was also pretty widely known that whether or not he actually liked recruiting, his efforts had fallen off in that area.

IronHog

Quote from: SchrodingersHog on November 20, 2017, 08:10:33 am
I'm digressing from the OP, but the title of the post got me thinking about something else.

The instability in our football program can be traced back to the firing of Holtz and the whatever you want to call it happened with Hatfield.  After that we got Crow, interim, Ford, Nutt (and his drama), interim, Petrino (and more drama), smiley, and now Bret. 

If our next coach is as good as Holtz or Hatfield, I hope we have the good sense to leave him alone and not fire him or run him off for trivial crap.


JFB was a lame duck after ruining off two highly respected coaches


In Longs defense he was smarter than that
Iron sharpens iron, So one man sharpens another.

moses_007

Quote from: Torqued pork on November 20, 2017, 12:02:23 pm
The talent level from the time Holtz got here to the time he left had dropped dramatically.  Lou did not like recruiting and it was showing. IIRC we had to settle for a tie against Rice at home in his last year.

Of course decades later all many remember is the Orange Bowl and beating Texas in Fayetteville.
Holtz never had a bad record here.  He was fired because he went over to South Carolina and did a campaign commercial for a politician without asking Broyles if it was okay.  But Broyles never told him that when he fired him.  I heard Holtz say in the last few years that JFB didn't give him any kind of reason other than he was making a change.

 

buldozer

Quote from: SchrodingersHog on November 20, 2017, 08:10:33 am


If our next coach is as good as Holtz or Hatfield, I hope we have the good sense to leave him alone and not fire him or run him off for trivial crap.

^^^This^^^ and add petrino to this list, not saying he was fired for trivial BS but him, Holtz and Hatfield are probably the best coaches we have had in modern times..... and all run off before they could achieve a championship here

S&W

Quote from: SchrodingersHog on November 20, 2017, 08:10:33 am
I'm digressing from the OP, but the title of the post got me thinking about something else.

The instability in our football program can be traced back to the firing of Holtz and the whatever you want to call it happened with Hatfield.  After that we got Crow, interim, Ford, Nutt (and his drama), interim, Petrino (and more drama), smiley, and now Bret. 

If our next coach is as good as Holtz or Hatfield, I hope we have the good sense to leave him alone and not fire him or run him off for trivial crap.


I agree with this mostly. The program hasn't been the same since Hatfield for several reasons. We entered the SEC behind in facilities, with subpar players and coaches.  Add to that the schedule was immediately tougher. Truthfully we've been trying to play catch up ever since.

I have a lot of what ifs that go back a long time. What if Frank retires in 73 and hires Switzer? What if Frank Hires Jimmy in 76? Hell what if he hires Jimmy in 83? Would we have been in trouble for cheating? Most certainly. By and large the teams that were cheating back then are still at the top of the mountain today. 

I'm not taking a stance on cheating one way or another, simply saying the program has had plenty of chances over the last 40 years to not be in the position it's in now. Plenty of egos have played a part in it too.

Hollywood870

Eels did one for Hatfield leaving too. I was a sad little boy. I still love the triple option to this day. When working it is beautiful to watch.

redeye

Quote from: Vantage 8 dude on November 20, 2017, 03:42:48 pm
If I'm not mistaken he had a least two appearances on the Tonight Show; one was most certainly on 12/13/78 when he was one just before we played UCLA that year in the Fiesta Bowl (but this was definitely not the one that got him in trouble) What I DO KNOW is that his joke about the state was made not long before his leaving. Not saying it contributed to his departure; he was definitely already in hot water over the Helms support. It was also pretty widely known that whether or not he actually liked recruiting, his efforts had fallen off in that area.

I watched him say that and just thought it was a funny joke.  Many seemed offended, but I think he'd have said the same about West Virginia and some other places.  That was just Holtz being Holtz, which is why he was on the Tonight Show.  It was positive coverage for Arkansas, despite the backhanded slap by Holtz, and he knew that or I doubt he'd have said it.

I didn't agree with him on Jesse Helms, but I'm not sure that should have gotten him fired, either.  I was still fairly young at the time, so my perspective may not be great, but I never thought he should have been fired.  Recruiting probably did suffer some under Holtz, but we still had decent teams, including a shot at the national title 2 year prior.  Hatfield was a good coach himself, but it was obvious, early, that Arkansas football was falling to a lower level under Hatfield.

I'm not a Holtz fan and I greatly admire Hatfield, but this is still my opinion.  I agree with the OP and actually think that we've been sabotaging ourselves for a long time now.

redeye

Quote from: S&W on November 20, 2017, 10:15:47 pm

I agree with this mostly. The program hasn't been the same since Hatfield for several reasons. We entered the SEC behind in facilities, with subpar players and coaches.  Add to that the schedule was immediately tougher. Truthfully we've been trying to play catch up ever since.

The SWC was behind in facilities, so I don't think you can blame that on Hatfield, but I agree with the rest.

Quote from: S&W on November 20, 2017, 10:15:47 pm

I have a lot of what ifs that go back a long time. What if Frank retires in 73 and hires Switzer? What if Frank Hires Jimmy in 76? Hell what if he hires Jimmy in 83? Would we have been in trouble for cheating? Most certainly. By and large the teams that were cheating back then are still at the top of the mountain today. 


This is why I'm so anti-cheating and hate how it's become more accepted.  SMU is an exception here, because they've still not fully recovered from the death penalty.  Many use that as an excuse for not using the death penalty, but shouldn't fear of it be the point?  I think SMU got what it deserved and these other schools have gotten off easy.  It's great that the SEC is strong, but I think Arkansas would be much stronger, if cheating were penalized heavier, as it should be.  I'm not saying that we're angels, but we're a classic case of nice guys finishing last.


S&W

Quote from: redeye on November 20, 2017, 11:06:47 pm
The SWC was behind in facilities, so I don't think you can blame that on Hatfield, but I agree with the rest.

This is why I'm so anti-cheating and hate how it's become more accepted.  SMU is an exception here, because they've still not fully recovered from the death penalty.  Many use that as an excuse for not using the death penalty, but shouldn't fear of it be the point?  I think SMU got what it deserved and these other schools have gotten off easy.  It's great that the SEC is strong, but I think Arkansas would be much stronger, if cheating were penalized heavier, as it should be.  I'm not saying that we're angels, but we're a classic case of nice guys finishing last.



I'm not blaming Hatfield. I'm just saying we were behind when we entered the conference.  If anything I'm blaming Paw Paw. He had the foresight to get us in the SEC but didn't have us prepared.

Yeah we aren't angels but we've never bought a trans am for a player or a double wide for a players mother. And that's another reason we are/were behind. Not saying I want us to cheat, but like you said, nice guys finish last.

NuttinItUp

Quote from: buldozer on November 20, 2017, 04:13:31 pm
^^^This^^^ and add petrino to this list, not saying he was fired for trivial BS but him, Holtz and Hatfield are probably the best coaches we have had in modern times..... and all run off before they could achieve a championship here

Don't know if I would classify Holtz as "modern times" since it was so long ago, but I agree with the sentiment. Frank should not have gotten rid of him.

prattville pig

Making re-election commercials for Strom Thurman in South Carolina is what got him fired, he was told to not do it but he did.
Life's too short to last long.

SooieGeneris

Quote from: SchrodingersHog on November 20, 2017, 10:44:28 am
Yep, that's the kind of trivial stuff I'm talking about.  Politics and a joke that offended some thin skinned folks.  Didn't suck up to instate HS coaches.  I don't think that was worth starting us down the road we find ourselves on now.  The same goes for the minor imperfections of Hatfield. 

As I said, I hope we've got better sense if we ever get another good coach.

It was not a matter of just "not sucking up", Lil' Lou treated them as non-persons is what I always heard, like he was above even talking to them more than he just had to.

Also, Broyles-Holtz was a little like the Jones-Johnson split in Dallas. Clash of the Titan Egos. There were Holtz Tee shirts, Holtz' "do-right" rule, the Lou Holtz doll, I think it all got to be a bit too much for Frank.

After the Orange Bowl win, Holtz' high water mark, things slipped ever so slightly as we lost a game to Texass that should have been a win and settled for a tie in the Fiesta Bowl vs UCLA.

The '79 team was rebuilding after the loss of most of the stars and somehow got to the Sugar Bowl at 10-1 with a very young team and lost to 'Bama, maybe Bear's last hurrah as I recall.

The '80 team flopped and barely made a Bowl, the '81 team was up and down, kind of like Nutt in 2003, underachieving with one of our more talented teams after trouncing #1 Texass with several high NFL draft picks over the next 2 drafts.

Everything was set for a big year in '82 and the team started 7-0 and at #5 in the nation, lost to an unranked Baylor team. After beating A&M to get to 8-1 there was a showdown between two Top 10 teams vs SMU. There was a TERRIBLE PI call that caused the game to end in a 17-17 tie, the team unraveled finishing 9-2-1.

Also, Broyles had been doing color commentary for ABC with Keith Jackson for the first few years of the Holtz era. That kept Broyles from meddling as much. When that gig ended after the '82 season, Broyles began micro-managing Holtz.

Lil' Lou was getting restless and his name had been popping up for other jobs every year. The 83 season was a downer with 3 losses in the last 4 games, the Jesse Helms deal was bubbling beneath the surface, some instate recruits had gone elsewhere, Keith Jackson Sr. couldn't stand Holtz and was headed to OU and Big Frank had had enough.

Jimmy Johnson was expected to be the next coach and had been promised the job by Broyles the next time it opened when he was passed over for Holtz due to no head coach experience.

Broyles was said to have backed out due to JJ's recruiting practices at OSU. For example, Dexter Manley had been one of Johnson's stars there. Years later after he retired after starring in the NFL for DC, it was revealed that Manley was illiterate.

There were many stories like that coming out of Stillwater, most involving $$$ changing hands.

Broyles went with the squeaky clean Hatfield instead. Hatfield was (and is) a good man, but as a coach his 3 pass a game wishbone offense (after initially being more balanced, sound familiar?) wore on fans.

There was a 1987 game in LR vs Texass in which the Hogs did not throw a pass in the last 3 quarters, sitting on a slim lead almost all day. The Whorns scored on the last play of the game on 4th and 17 or something like that to win 17-14.

I was there and a fan above the tunnel leading to the Hogs locker room at WMS was loudly berating Hatfield, who made the mistake of arguing with the man.

From 50 yards or so away, that scene was more entertaining than the action on the field, even though I don't endorse the man's actions.

Earlier that season, lo and behold, one Jimmy Johnson, by then at Miami, brought his undefeated team into LR for a nonconference game.

It was 38-0 Miami, I believe it was at the half, and ended 51-7 with Johnson unleashing his fury on the AD who had gone back on a promise, or at least that was Johnson's take.

Even though Hatfield stayed another 2 seasons after those '87 debacles, things were never the same between Hatfield and Broyles.

Before that final, fateful play vs Texass, the Whorns had no TOs and we called time to set the defense. It was 4th and between 15-20 yards or 4th and goal from the 15-20 yard line.

The play seemed like it was unfolding in slow motion as a WR who had dropped several easy passes broke open on a post pattern if I remember correctly.

The QB threw the ball and it seemed like it took forever before the ball arrived. I watched in horror as the WR was rocked by two defenders, one on each side and held onto the ball.

WMS went deadly silent. There were not a lot of Texass fans in the stands and you could hear the few celebrating and literally hear the players from where I was sitting as they jumped for joy and it sounded as if one was speaking in tongues...

It was surreal and to this day, there has been only one other time in a game I attended that time seemed to stand still in the middle of a play. That was Matt Jones' long throw to Richard Smith into about a 15 MPH wind toward the south end zone.

That was the "Miracle On Markham" game vs LSU 15 years later in 2002. I couldn't believe my eyes when I saw Smith break open from the North end zone, I just wondered if Jones could get the ball 50 yards or more into that wind.

That one went our way, but that play in 1987 along with the Miami fiasco, sealed Hatfield's fate with the fans.

There were reports that as the coaches were reviewing the film on Sunday, Frank Broyles burst into the room and exclaimed: "Kenny, where were your line-backuhs?"

Broyles went full blown meddler from that point, especially on assistant coaches. Broyles wanted some of Ken's staff fired and "suggested" replacements is the way I heard it.

Jack Crowe, yes, THAT Jack Crowe, was brought in from Clemson to switch the offense to the Power I. I don't think Hatfield was ever fully on board with it, but went along.

So, there were MUCH more to all that than simple disagreements or politics going on in those coaching changes..

KJ Jefferson, one of only 2 QBs in UA history to go 2-0 in Bowl Games..

Mac attack: McAdoo & McGlothern co-winners of the Thorpe Award 2023?

Jimbob111

Quote from: SchrodingersHog on November 20, 2017, 10:44:28 am
Yep, that's the kind of trivial stuff I'm talking about.  Politics and a joke that offended some thin skinned folks.  Didn't suck up to instate HS coaches.  I don't think that was worth starting us down the road we find ourselves on now.  The same goes for the minor imperfections of Hatfield. 

As I said, I hope we've got better sense if we ever get another good coach.

Are you seriously tracing the current coaching issues back to the early eighties? I don't think it's that deep. Coaches win games or coaches get fired. Sometimes, they do both.
"DO NOT POST IN THE GAME THREAD ANYMORE TODAY OR YOU WILL RECIEVE A 30 BAN!"--

Multiple play-by-play posters followed by "Good job, D" and "Way to go, Offense" is so interesting to read over and over as the team gets blown out and the coaches flounder. I can't figure out why game threads don't have 60 to 80 pages now.

Am I the only one that misses the old, interesting game threads?

HogBreath

Quote from: hogsanity on November 20, 2017, 12:08:02 pm
Yep. Arkansans are very thin skinned and always looking for ways to claim someone is out to get them or keep them down. When, the reality is, it is our own backwards thinking that keeps us down.
Thankfully us dumb ole Arkiesawers has got you to keep us pointed in the right direction. 
I said...LSU has often been an overrated team.

That ignoramus Draconian Sanctions said..if we're overrated, why are we ranked higher than you are?

 

go hogues

Quote from: Vantage 8 dude on November 20, 2017, 10:16:59 am
I was around way back when. And yes, while Lou had done some incredible things with our program, like the '77 Orange Bowl upset of OU and the '81 whipping of #1 Texas, over time he also lost focus.

First of all, he apparently alienated many of the instate coaches here in Arkansas. At least that was the word back then.

Secondly, he apparently began thinking of himself as quite a bit larger than the state. I remember his endorsement of Jessie Helms back in North Carolina that ran afoul of some on the Hill. However, the biggest gaff was his appearance on Johnny Carson's The Tonight Show shortly before he was booted. I remember it as if it were yesterday. During the show, after performing some of his famous magic tricks, he was being interviewed by Johnny. At that point Lou said something like: "Well, I live in Arkansas. And while it may not be the end of the world, you CAN see it from there". After which there was great laughter from both Carson and the audience. I remember thinking "Uhh....Lou, whether you meant to or not, you just said the wrong thing. You may have just 'cooked your own goose'" with that little remark". Therefore, I wasn't particularly shocked when a several months later he "resigned because he was tired of coaching".

Funny how he immediately popped back up on by taking the Minnesota job. I suppose he got rejuvenated real quickly.  ;)
Ive watched the Carson episode on YouTube and haven't seen that? Was he on the show more than once?
Quote from: Leadbelly on September 24, 2019, 09:05:22 pm<br />Dude, our back has been against the wall so long, we are now on the other side of the wall!<br />

Rocket23

It wasn't Richard Smith that caught the "Miracle on Markham," it was Decori Birmingham.

Rudy Baylor

Quote from: Vantage 8 dude on November 20, 2017, 10:16:59 am
I was around way back when. And yes, while Lou had done some incredible things with our program, like the '77 Orange Bowl upset of OU and the '81 whipping of #1 Texas, over time he also lost focus.

First of all, he apparently alienated many of the instate coaches here in Arkansas. At least that was the word back then.

Secondly, he apparently began thinking of himself as quite a bit larger than the state. I remember his endorsement of Jessie Helms back in North Carolina that ran afoul of some on the Hill. However, the biggest gaff was his appearance on Johnny Carson's The Tonight Show shortly before he was booted. I remember it as if it were yesterday. During the show, after performing some of his famous magic tricks, he was being interviewed by Johnny. At that point Lou said something like: "Well, I live in Arkansas. And while it may not be the end of the world, you CAN see it from there". After which there was great laughter from both Carson and the audience. I remember thinking "Uhh....Lou, whether you meant to or not, you just said the wrong thing. You may have just 'cooked your own goose'" with that little remark". Therefore, I wasn't particularly shocked when a several months later he "resigned because he was tired of coaching".

Funny how he immediately popped back up on by taking the Minnesota job. I suppose he got rejuvenated real quickly.  ;)

I think there was some dislike between Holtz and John Outlaw

good read on Outlaw

http://www.sportinglifearkansas.com/remembering-legendary-coach-john-outlaw/

PORKULATOR

Quote from: dfwalumdad on November 20, 2017, 07:47:33 am
paul eells the night before holtz was fired at the end of his 6pm broadcast delivered an editorial calling for holtz's dismissal or resignation. it was unprecedented, it was analogous to cronkite's saying the veitnam war was unwinnable.

at the time katv and razorback football were essentially one and the same thing that's no longer the case.

anyway steve sullivan yesterday weighed in on bert.

It no longer seems to be a matter of "if" for Bret Bielema. Friday, Saturday or Sunday, the three most logical guesses on when Arkansas will pull the plug on the Bret Bielema era.

In most situations, he was blue-collar Bret, a great fit for this state.

He just didn't win enough.

http://katv.com/sports/sully-says/sully-says-one-more-game-for-coach-b

this is as official as it's going to get until it's official.

   
from now on, your name is dfphallicdad.
From now on. 100 total posts and they all have the name Bert in them. Enjoy
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Inhogswetrust

Quote from: Vantage 8 dude on November 20, 2017, 10:16:59 am
I was around way back when. And yes, while Lou had done some incredible things with our program, like the '77 Orange Bowl upset of OU and the '81 whipping of #1 Texas, over time he also lost focus.

First of all, he apparently alienated many of the instate coaches here in Arkansas. At least that was the word back then.

Secondly, he apparently began thinking of himself as quite a bit larger than the state. I remember his endorsement of Jessie Helms back in North Carolina that ran afoul of some on the Hill. However, the biggest gaff was his appearance on Johnny Carson's The Tonight Show shortly before he was booted. I remember it as if it were yesterday. During the show, after performing some of his famous magic tricks, he was being interviewed by Johnny. At that point Lou said something like: "Well, I live in Arkansas. And while it may not be the end of the world, you CAN see it from there". After which there was great laughter from both Carson and the audience. I remember thinking "Uhh....Lou, whether you meant to or not, you just said the wrong thing. You may have just 'cooked your own goose'" with that little remark". Therefore, I wasn't particularly shocked when a several months later he "resigned because he was tired of coaching".

Funny how he immediately popped back up on by taking the Minnesota job. I suppose he got rejuvenated real quickly.  ;)

Ironic since Minnesota is closer to the end of the world than Fayetteville!
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

Soooie21

Quote from: Hollywood870 on November 20, 2017, 10:20:10 pm
Eels did one for Hatfield leaving too. I was a sad little boy. I still love the triple option to this day. When working it is beautiful to watch.
Flexbone..

dfwalumdad

Quote from: S&W on November 20, 2017, 10:15:47 pm

I agree with this mostly. The program hasn't been the same since Hatfield for several reasons. We entered the SEC behind in facilities, with subpar players and coaches.  Add to that the schedule was immediately tougher. Truthfully we've been trying to play catch up ever since.

we had one of the first indoor facilities in the country in walker pavilion the broyles complex when built was state of the art. let's not forget danny ford won the division in his third year. nutt won the division twice. petrino took us to a bcs bowl.

our problem right now is a coach that after he ran out of petrino players collapsed, this sums up bret better than anything it's that Dietrich Wise was a rotational player for us his senior year, and he starts for the patriots in his rookie year.

the decisions he makes on depth cart and playing time don't seem to be based on a players ability. when it's obvious the best players aren't playing you lose the team.

we started a walk on freshman over a four star scholarship athlete who been in our program for three years.

that doesn't say much about our program now does it. 

S&W

Quote from: dfwalumdad on November 21, 2017, 08:23:08 am
we had one of the first indoor facilities in the country in walker pavilion the broyles complex when built was state of the art. let's not forget danny ford won the division in his third year. nutt won the division twice. petrino took us to a bcs bowl.

our problem right now is a coach that after he ran out of petrino players collapsed, this sums up bret better than anything it's that Dietrich Wise was a rotational player for us his senior year, and he starts for the patriots in his rookie year.

the decisions he makes on depth cart and playing time don't seem to be based on a players ability. when it's obvious the best players aren't playing you lose the team.

we started a walk on freshman over a four star scholarship athlete who been in our program for three years.

that doesn't say much about our program now does it. 

Walker Pavilion wasn't built until 98. Yeah Ford won the West with an 8-5/6-3 record. Yay!

The rest of your post is babble.

dfwalumdad

Quote from: S&W on November 21, 2017, 12:29:51 pm
Walker Pavilion wasn't built until 98. Yeah Ford won the West with an 8-5/6-3 record. Yay!

The rest of your post is babble.

well we've certainly done better than 11 sec wins in five years. if that's good enough for you then bert's your guy!

S&W

Quote from: dfwalumdad on November 21, 2017, 12:59:03 pm
well we've certainly done better than 11 sec wins in five years. if that's good enough for you then bert's your guy!

More derp.  Bluto has never been my guy.

Albert Einswine

Quote from: Hollywood870 on November 20, 2017, 10:20:10 pm
Eels did one for Hatfield leaving too. I was a sad little boy. I still love the triple option to this day. When working it is beautiful to watch.


When not working you get 21 rushing yards and 21 passing yards in a Cotton Bowl loss to UCLA. That was embarrassing. Hatfield's record at Arkansas was embellished by playing in a rapidly deteriorating SWC. Clemson didn't put up with him very long.
"Funny thing, I become a hell of a good fisherman when the trout decide to commit suicide." ~ John D. Voelker

hawgdavis

Quote from: Rocket23 on November 21, 2017, 07:01:45 am
It wasn't Richard Smith that caught the "Miracle on Markham," it was Decori Birmingham.

Nope your both wrong it was Boo Williams

Hogwaller

Quote from: Jimbob111 on November 21, 2017, 02:27:09 am
Are you seriously tracing the current coaching issues back to the early eighties? I don't think it's that deep. Coaches win games or coaches get fired. Sometimes, they do both.

Why not? It's been one fiasco after another ever since.

S&W

Quote from: Hogwaller on November 21, 2017, 06:05:41 pm
Why not? It's been one fiasco after another ever since.

Every step we took brought us to where we are now.

PorkSoda

Quote from: IronHog on November 20, 2017, 04:04:08 pm

JFB was a lame duck after ruining off two highly respected coaches


In Longs defense he was smarter than that
yeah, he only ran off one highly respected coach.
"I became insane, with long intervals of horrible sanity." ― Edgar Allan Poe
"If quantum mechanics hasn't profoundly shocked you, you haven't understood it yet. Everything we call real is made of things that cannot be regarded as real." – Niels Bohr
"A mind stretched to a new idea, never returns to its original dimensions" ~ Oliver Wendell Holmes
Quote from: PonderinHog on August 07, 2023, 06:37:15 pmYeah, we're all here, but we ain't all there.

Leadbelly

"I do mind, the Dude minds. This will not stand, ya know, this aggression will not stand, man."

Hogsolo

It's some serious re-writing of history to make Hatfield a successful coach at Arkansas.  Yes he won a lot of games against a very weak SWC.

Nationally we were not competitive, embarrassingly so.

The fans were not happy with our constant run offense to the point Hatfield would sarcastically point out every 5 forward passes on his coaches show.  Holtz was the end of national prominence until 1998.

Go ahead and roast me now, but I was right there in the middle of it during the eighties.   We were not a good team out of conference.  We were very boring too living in three and outs.

Just had to get that off my chest.

Sweet Feet

Quote from: SchrodingersHog on November 20, 2017, 08:10:33 am
If our next coach is as good as Holtz or Hatfield, I hope we have the good sense to leave him alone and not fire him or run him off for trivial crap.

Well the main one responsible for those things is gone now, so new beginnings