Kingsley Not Even In 2016 Mock Draft

[MountieDawg]

KINGSLEY is projected as the 45th pick in the 2017 Draft.

[HiggiePiggy]

He can always play in Europe if he wanted to go pro at the end of this year.  I hope he stays because I am wanting to see us in the NCAA tournament next year. 

[Hawg Red]

KINGSLEY is projected as the 45th pick in the 2017 Draft.

Posted 13 posts before you.

[hobhog]

I still think if Hogs were to get on a roll and even win the SecT somehow that he'd get a lot of late interest by some NBA teams and be encouraged to go enter early. Hope I'm wrong as he will be dominant next year.

[MountieDawg]

Posted 13 posts before you.

Sorry, I don't read every line in every post but I found yours valuable and insightful.  Thanks for keeping score.

[jry04]

I still think if Hogs were to get on a roll and even win the SecT somehow that he'd get a lot of late interest by some NBA teams and be encouraged to go enter early. Hope I'm wrong as he will be dominant next year.

You won't have to worry about that.

[TomBigBeeHog]

Probably should stay in school if not, this could be him next year.

http://www.courier-journal.com/story/sports/college/kentucky/2016/02/25/uk-misses-him-but-no-regrets-dakari-johnson-kentucky-basketball-nba-development-league/80922732/

[Captain Morgan]

Probably should stay in school if not, this could be him next year.

http://www.courier-journal.com/story/sports/college/kentucky/2016/02/25/uk-misses-him-but-no-regrets-dakari-johnson-kentucky-basketball-nba-development-league/80922732/

He could always go play in Europe and make 8 figure £££ and €€€

[HOGINTENNESSEE]

Probably should stay in school if not, this could be him next year.

http://www.courier-journal.com/story/sports/college/kentucky/2016/02/25/uk-misses-him-but-no-regrets-dakari-johnson-kentucky-basketball-nba-development-league/80922732/

He wouldn't be drafted that high right now. Europe is probably his best bet overall.

If he is even thinking about going MA should promise him half his salary after next season as No Moses is a very bad think for our tourney hopes next year. (Tongue and check comment)

[SooiecidetillNuttgone]

This right here is the main reason I don't enjoy college b-ball half as much as I used to.

The product is a watered down shadow of itself,  and if you get lucky enough to get a good player, you sweat bullets as to whether he'll bolt or not.  And all of this happens under the media aided dominance to the Kentuckys and Dukes of the landscape.

I wish the scholarships came with a minimum three year obligation.   Considering the man hours used in recruiting,  visitations,  room, board, professional staff to hone your skills, tutors, and connections made in the professional world,  it should be worth at least that.

[Hawg Red]

This right here is the main reason I don't enjoy college b-ball half as much as I used to.

The product is a watered down shadow of itself,  and if you get lucky enough to get a good player, you sweat bullets as to whether he'll bolt or not.  And all of this happens under the media aided dominance to the Kentuckys and Dukes of the landscape.

I wish the scholarships came with a minimum three year obligation.  Considering the man hours used in recruiting,  visitations,  room, board, professional staff to hone your skills, tutors, and connections made in the professional world,  it should be worth at least that.

Players would just pay back the difference after they go pro, or the full amount, or just never go to college. The NCAA can't make players stay in school. It has to be a rule change made by the NBA that says a player has to be 3 years removed from their HS graduating class or it will be meaningless.

[SooiecidetillNuttgone]

Players would just pay back the difference after they go pro, or the full amount, or just never go to college. The NCAA can't make players stay in school. It has to be a rule change made by the NBA that says a player has to be 3 years removed from their HS graduating class or it will be meaningless.

Probably true to a degree.   
I don't get why the NBA Players Association hasn't screamed about this.  When a one and done goes pro, a veteran loses a spot on the team with no guarantee the rookie will ever be as good as the displaced veteran.

I would think the union would want a better system to prevent  a one year wonder hitting it big and washing out at the next level.

[Hawg Red]

Probably true to a degree.   
I don't get why the NBA Players Association hasn't screamed about this.  When a one and done goes pro, a veteran loses a spot on the team with no guarantee the rookie will ever be as good as the displaced veteran.

I would think the union would want a better system to prevent  a one year wonder hitting it big and washing out at the next level.

I agree. You would think it would benefit everyone already in the NBA to keep top talent out as long as they can.

[SooiecidetillNuttgone]

I agree. You would think it would benefit everyone already in the NBA to keep top talent out as long as they can.

It doesn't make sense for the owners either.
You'd think they would be happy about colleges weeding out the pretenders from contenders while developing them for free.

Yes.  Yes.  I realize the giddy greed to land the next Kobe or whatever,  but those type players don't roll around very often.   You'd have to realize you're probably getting the next Korleone Young rather than the next KG.

[Hawg Red]

It doesn't make sense for the owners either.
You'd think they would be happy about colleges weeding out the pretenders from contenders while developing them for free.

Yes.  Yes.  I realize the giddy greed to land the next Kobe or whatever,  but those type players don't roll around very often.   You'd have to realize you're probably getting the next Korleone Young rather than the next KG.

The FOs just have to get over this fixation on developing players the way they want from as early an age as possible.

[ErieHog]

Probably true to a degree.   
I don't get why the NBA Players Association hasn't screamed about this.  When a one and done goes pro, a veteran loses a spot on the team with no guarantee the rookie will ever be as good as the displaced veteran.

I would think the union would want a better system to prevent  a one year wonder hitting it big and washing out at the next level.

Washouts are rare;  over 80% of one and done players make a second contract-- which, depending on year, means 4 or 5 seasons in  the league.

Oh-- and the union has virtually no interest in discouraging one and done;  the people being forced off of rosters by the youngest talent, are the most marginal, and it drives up the overall quality of play.

[Captain Morgan]

Washouts are rare;  over 80% of one and done players make a second contract-- which, depending on year, means 4 or 5 seasons in  the league.

Oh-- and the union has virtually no interest in discouraging one and done;  the people being forced off of rosters by the youngest talent, are the most marginal, and it drives up the overall quality of play.

I think it will eventually go to a 2 and done system. Which I think should happen because American/Canadian players are not mentally mature enough like 18 year old European guys. It should be like baseball where the non American/Canadian players have to wait longer than the International players. I think the union would be all for a 2 and done system for American/Canadian born players and Europeans and other internationals come out at 18 or 19. Union wants to keep the Mike Miller's and Richard Jefferson's of the world on nba rosters and not have their spots taken by a 19 year old kid that doesn't know how to handle millions of dollars(Jahlil Okafor and his immature incidents). The system should be completely different for international players because they are far more mature at ages 18 and 19 than are American and Canadian players. 

[PonderinHog]

Unless he develops a jump shot from 15-18 feet, he won't be drafted in the first round.

Dang, did y'all notice that mid-range jump shot last night

I'm glad he's paying attention to my constructive criticism.   

[Hawg Red]

Dang, did y'all notice that mid-range jump shot last night

I'm glad he's paying attention to my constructive criticism.   

We'd have been dead-in-the-water if they didn't let him take all of those jumpers. He hit at least 5.

[ErieHog]

I think it will eventually go to a 2 and done system. Which I think should happen because American/Canadian players are not mentally mature enough like 18 year old European guys. It should be like baseball where the non American/Canadian players have to wait longer than the International players. I think the union would be all for a 2 and done system for American/Canadian born players and Europeans and other internationals come out at 18 or 19. Union wants to keep the Mike Miller's and Richard Jefferson's of the world on nba rosters and not have their spots taken by a 19 year old kid that doesn't know how to handle millions of dollars(Jahlil Okafor and his immature incidents). The system should be completely different for international players because they are far more mature at ages 18 and 19 than are American and Canadian players. 

One and done is already stretching the limit of avoiding a lawsuit coming to fruition before the year is up--  two and done would lead to litigation that would end the restriction system.

[Captain Morgan]

One and done is already stretching the limit of avoiding a lawsuit coming to fruition before the year is up--  two and done would lead to litigation that would end the restriction system.

I don't see how a 18 or 19 year old kid can tell a billion dollar industry that he is allowed to play on a corporation that has business rights to restrict age limit for employment. I believe the NBA as a business very much has this right. 

[SooiecidetillNuttgone]

I don't see how a 18 or 19 year old kid can tell a billion dollar industry that he is allowed to play on a corporation that has business rights to restrict age limit for employment. I believe the NBA as a business very much has this right. 

Not often.....But I agree.

If a business and/or government can discriminate on the grounds of not having a degree, not having Spanish speaking abilities (even when not involved with a Spanish speaking public), or not having one or two years of ON THE JOB EXPERIENCE, then let them bring it.

This stinking farce has gone on too long as it is.

[ErieHog]

I don't see how a 18 or 19 year old kid can tell a billion dollar industry that he is allowed to play on a corporation that has business rights to restrict age limit for employment. I believe the NBA as a business very much has this right. 

The restriction doesn't do anything for the NBA, except keep talent out of its league- and proving real damage from restrictive labor rules that have no bearing on ability, is not a tough sell, even if the NBA wanted to harm itself by putting up  multiyear restriction on labor.

[Captain Morgan]

Not often.....But I agree.

If a business and/or government can discriminate on the grounds of not having a degree, not having Spanish speaking abilities (even when not involved with a Spanish speaking public), or not having one or two years of ON THE JOB EXPERIENCE, then let them bring it.

This stinking farce has gone on too long as it is.

I'm with you completely. Any other American looking for employment has to look at the issues you stressed. Why do athletes that are not mature enough to make that kind of coin deserve more rights than the common American citizen looking for employment?

The restriction doesn't do anything for the NBA, except keep talent out of its league- and proving real damage from restrictive labor rules that have no bearing on ability, is not a tough sell, even if the NBA wanted to harm itself by putting up  multiyear restriction on labor.

I understand what your saying but even if 18 or 19 year olds are denied employment, the NBA financially is not being hurt by it. Richard Jefferson playing instead of Brandon Ingram is not hurting Adam Silver and his billion dollar industry.

[ErieHog]

I'm with you completely. Any other American looking for employment has to look at the issues you stressed. Why do athletes that are not mature enough to make that kind of coin deserve more rights than the common American citizen looking for employment?

I understand what your saying but even if 18 or 19 year olds are denied employment, the NBA financially is not being hurt by it. Richard Jefferson playing instead of Brandon Ingram is not hurting Adam Silver and his billion dollar industry.

It does hurt the individual bottom lines, *and* it decreases the quality of play.     Geeze.

[SooiecidetillNuttgone]

It does hurt the individual bottom lines, *and* it decreases the quality of play.     Geeze.

With this logic, why stop at 18/19 year olds?
Start drafting them at 16.  If the two or three years really make that much difference as you're suggesting, then delaying from 16 to 18/19 is even more criminal.

[ErieHog]

With this logic, why stop at 18/19 year olds?
Start drafting them at 16.  If the two or three years really make that much difference as you're suggesting, then delaying from 16 to 18/19 is even more criminal.

If they have the capacity, all the better.

The question is, are there players who, at a 18 and 19 can compete reasonably with the best in the world, while still on the upswing athletically?   The last 20 years shows  that this answer is unquestionably yes.

[Captain Morgan]

If they have the capacity, all the better.

The question is, are there players who, at a 18 and 19 can compete reasonably with the best in the world, while still on the upswing athletically?   The last 20 years shows  that this answer is unquestionably yes.

This sounds like a soccer fan aspect.

[SooiecidetillNuttgone]

If they have the capacity, all the better.

The question is, are there players who, at a 18 and 19 can compete reasonably with the best in the world, while still on the upswing athletically?   The last 20 years shows  that this answer is unquestionably yes.

Without looking at the NBA rosters and deciphering meaningful minutes,  I'd say you're wrong.   It seems  to me that most 20 and less players need a couple years to mature into the game.

Someone posted a link to a Kentucky player in the D league.  He was supposed to be a star.
His Kentucky teammate was on the same team and was sent down because his game regressed from riding the bench cause he wasn't ready for the NBA either.

Patrick Beverly left early and had to go overseas cause his game wasn't ready.

I don't follow the NBA very well, so maybe I'm wrong, but it seems to me that a bona fide, day one starter that's only had one year of college is more an exception.

[ErieHog]

Without looking at the NBA rosters and deciphering meaningful minutes,  I'd say you're wrong.   It seems  to me that most 20 and less players need a couple years to mature into the game.

Someone posted a link to a Kentucky player in the D league.  He was supposed to be a star.
His Kentucky teammate was on the same team and was sent down because his game regressed from riding the bench cause he wasn't ready for the NBA either.

Patrick Beverly left early and had to go overseas cause his game wasn't ready.

I don't follow the NBA very well, so maybe I'm wrong, but it seems to me that a bona fide, day one starter that's only had one year of college is more an exception.

Day 1 starters are few and far between in any draft, but in terms of productive NBA players, that reach a second contract?  One and dones are as close to a sure thing as there is-- and they're overwhelmingly likely to be drafted, as well--- so it isn't like even 25% of them go unpicked, and thereby pre-winnow the field to only the best, before evaluating how they perform as pros.

[ShadowHawg]

Washouts are rare;  over 80% of one and done players make a second contract-- which, depending on year, means 4 or 5 seasons in  the league.

Oh-- and the union has virtually no interest in discouraging one and done;  the people being forced off of rosters by the youngest talent, are the most marginal, and it drives up the overall quality of play.

They are only getting a second contract because their teams look at them as long term investments. Same thing happens in baseball. The guys that get drafted high and sign for huge bonuses get way more time to develop than a 20th rounder ever would. It hardly makes them more successful though.

The quality of NBA play sucks right now. It gets harder to watch each year. Thank goodness for Curry or their wouldn't be much exciting ball at all in the NBA right now.

[ErieHog]

They are only getting a second contract because their teams look at them as long term investments. Same thing happens in baseball. The guys that get drafted high and sign for huge bonuses get way more time to develop than a 20th rounder ever would. It hardly makes them more successful though.

The quality of NBA play sucks right now. It gets harder to watch each year. Thank goodness for Curry or their wouldn't be much exciting ball at all in the NBA right now.

The quality of the NBA is at an unprecedented high.     And no, sunk costs are not reasons for second contracts-- especially in an environment where the value of those deals is significantly higher than starting over.

[BRHogfan]

They are only getting a second contract because their teams look at them as long term investments. Same thing happens in baseball. The guys that get drafted high and sign for huge bonuses get way more time to develop than a 20th rounder ever would. It hardly makes them more successful though.

The quality of NBA play sucks right now. It gets harder to watch each year. Thank goodness for Curry or their wouldn't be much exciting ball at all in the NBA right now.

Can you give me some details on why you think quality of NBA play is bad right now?  Do you not like watching the Thunder, Spurs, Clippers, Cavs, or Raptors?

We are in and era with so many complete point guards with Curry, Rose, Chris Paul, Kyrie Irving, Damian Lillard, Kyle Lowery,  Mike Conley, Tony Parker, and Russel Westbrook.

Some amazing players are still in the league like Harden, James, Anthony Davis, Marc Gasol (when uninjured), Tim Duncan is still playing at 39, Durant, Kawhi Leonard, Lamarcus Aldridge, Pau Gasol, and Blake Griffen.

Teams have gotten more analytical and are running more advance offense and defense than ever.  The coaching is so important to the game. 

If you think NBA play sucks, you just aren't watching.

[Cinco de Hogo]

I'm liking the idea of having Kingsley, Thompson and Cook next year. 

[SooiecidetillNuttgone]

Can you give me some details on why you think quality of NBA play is bad right now?  Do you not like watching the Thunder, Spurs, Clippers, Cavs, or Raptors?

We are in and era with so many complete point guards with Curry, Rose, Chris Paul, Kyrie Irving, Damian Lillard, Kyle Lowery,  Mike Conley, Tony Parker, and Russel Westbrook.

Some amazing players are still in the league like Harden, James, Anthony Davis, Marc Gasol (when uninjured), Tim Duncan is still playing at 39, Durant, Kawhi Leonard, Lamarcus Aldridge, Pau Gasol, and Blake Griffen.

Teams have gotten more analytical and are running more advance offense and defense than ever.  The coaching is so important to the game. 

If you think NBA play sucks, you just aren't watching.

Duncan needs to retire.

There's a 16 year old somewhere that needs to be drafted that can come off the bench and contribute 3 minutes, 0.2 points,  0.4 rebounds and no hope to the Spurs.

[BRHogfan]

Duncan needs to retire.

There's a 16 year old somewhere that needs to be drafted that can come off the bench and contribute 3 minutes, 0.2 points,  0.4 rebounds and no hope to the Spurs.

With the way the Spurs handle things, they would probably dump Duncan and somehow discover the next Wilt Chamberlain

[SooiecidetillNuttgone]

With the way the Spurs handle things, they would probably dump Duncan and somehow discover the next Wilt Chamberlain

LOL.  Probably.
This however was more a shot at Erie and his defense of a broken NBA model.

[ErieHog]

LOL.  Probably.
This however was more a shot at Erie and his defense of a broken NBA model.

The problem is the model isn't broken.  It works -remarkably- well for the NBA.

And you'll note that Duncan has moved down the salary scale, to the point where it has bothered the union, to avoid being phased out as quickly and to keep his teams competitive.

The critics of the modern NBA mostly have one thing in common- they don't watch it.

[SooiecidetillNuttgone]

The problem is the model isn't broken.  It works -remarkably- well for the NBA.

And you'll note that Duncan has moved down the salary scale, to the point where it has bothered the union, to avoid being phased out as quickly and to keep his teams competitive.

The critics of the modern NBA mostly have one thing in common- they don't watch it.

Just saw Brian Widhorst interviewed on Dan Lebatard show.
When asked about Golden State, he stated that the team is smart.  They don't beat themselves.  They don't get surprised.  Over the last several years, they drafted guys that had at least three years of college.  These players are better prepared for the NBA and life. There's less guessing what you're getting when you draft them vs one and dones.  It's a smart model and they're capitalizing.

As a professional writer whose job is to specifically cover the NBA, I'd expect him to have an educated opinion.

[TomBigBeeHog]

He can always play in Europe if he wanted to go pro at the end of this year.  I hope he stays because I am wanting to see us in the NCAA tournament next year.

I think he's coming back. Could knock us out of the tournament if he leaves.

[gmarv]

I think he's coming back. Could knock us out of the tournament if he leaves.

I sure hope so we could be good to very good with him.

[jbcarol]

https://twitter.com/JerryTipton/status/706876196626243584

[zuko]

The thing about the NBA is they draft more on potential than anything. Sometimes staying an extra year just reveals more holes in your game.

However, if Portis and Qualls had stayed one more year and taken this team to the Elite 8, then that exposure could have gotten Portis in the Top 10 or Top 5, and Qualls into the Top 25.

You just never know. Portis should have gone much higher than he did last year.

This is the first year, only year, that Kingsley has showed anything. He has not shown enough to be considered for the draft at all. Late bloomer.  Portis, being the better than Kingsley prevented Kingsley from getting the time that he needed which is the fault of the coach as far as development is concerned. Portis seems to be doing quite well in the Pro environment.

[-Blu]

Kingsley is now on nbadraft.net 2016 big board.  Coming in at the #52 best prospect, jumping up 49 spots.

They also wrote a scouting report on him.  Seems very accurate.

http://www.nbadraft.net/ranking/bigboard

http://www.nbadraft.net/players/moses-kingsley