Guns at Razorback Stadium

[grayhawg]

The police do not expect to be ready to issue permits until next year. Is there anything saying that they would not be allowed to issue permits even if they do get a course approved before then?

If not, then that is a true statement. Now, it is akin to having a story about Cole Kelley and saying he could lead the razorbacks to a championship this season. It is unlikely seeing as Austin is very much the starter and hasn't shown anything to suggest that he won't be this coming year. However, Kelley certain "can" win the starting job for the upcoming season. There is nothing making it impossible. Just not likely. 

What you say is true, but how likely is it that they can come up with the design for the class and train instructors and have permits before that. While it is possible it is not very likely, most CC permits take up to 120 days and some even longer after application is sent online. Sept first is around 150 days I would say very doubtful.

[bennyl08]

What you say is true, but how likely is it that they can come up with the design for the class and train instructors and have permits before that. While it is possible it is not very likely, most CC permits take up to 120 days and some even longer after application is sent online. Sept first is around 150 days I would say very doubtful.

And an article writing in depth and providing opinions would include that. Tell me, how long does would it take for the region of say the Otago region of New Zealand to implement something like that? Or the city of Heidelberg in Germany? Some municipality in the Congo? This is a UK article on something not happening in the US even, but a state, and one of the smaller ones, in the US.

What they have are the facts that are readily present and their opinion of those facts. The median and standard deviation of days it would take to implement such a course might be something that could be found as a fact, is probably a lot more involved than anybody not trying to win a pulitzer would be expected to even do. Further, it is speculation. To reuse the sports analogy, it would be like asking me about the starting lineup for India's cricket team. It would take several months to do a fine detail level of research on the article that my boss has probably given me a week to write along with the 10 other articles that I'm assigned as well.

Make a short story long, it's a foreign article talking about local politics that is grabbing headlines. Nuanced details that are not readily obvious such as how long it would take to have the course up and running should not be expected in such an article. Honestly, that they included you have to even take the class is better journalism than places like breitbart, fox news, and huff po are oft to do.

[Pig in the Pokey]

Have had a carry permit (TN doesn't differentiate between concealed vs. open carry) for years...went through several courses and learned the gravity of responsibility associated with having a gun on my person.  The only time I will not hesitate to pull the trigger is when my life, my wife's life or my daughters life are in jeopardy... and I will continue to pull the trigger until I no longer feel that threat exists or am out of bullets.  I will never shoot someone over stuff...but I really don't believe that clarity is present in some who are licensed to carry. 

Any situation where emotion runs high is a recipe for disaster when guns are present.  Some of the highest highs and lowest lows emotionally are felt at sporting events.  Passionate fans on both sides are crammed into a small space and when the clock strikes zero there is a winner and a loser, often under very contentious circumstances.  Can you imagine the hooligans of European soccer, who fight regularly at games, with weapons?  Whether it be a ref, an opposing fan (sober or drunk), or even a fan of the same team (see Hogville after just about any game), the emotional tinderbox of the post game roller-coaster is not a place where guns should ever be condoned.  People will do and say things in the heat of the moment that they would never do under normal circumstances. 

Didn't even touch on the other potential danger of some whack job with an agenda, which seems to be the majority of the public active shooter situations in the past several years.  Limited access/egress points that exist in every athletic event type gives them a forum where they could maximize damage.  Notwithstanding the emotional scars, the impact on the economic side of sports would be monumental.

if we could kill each other on here with our words so many of us would already have died at the hands of hogville. this is the dumbest idea ever. arkie senators are a joke, trying to act like cowboys and get teaparty street cred.

[PorkSoda]

I'm surprised they didn't call for open carry at airports while they were at it.

[(notOM)Rebel123]

I'm surprised they didn't call for open carry at airports while they were at it.

Shhhhh....don't give Charlie & Co. any ideas.

[PorkSoda]

Shhhhh....don't give Charlie & Co. any ideas.

lol, "shall not be infringed!"

never mind that if one goes off it could depressurize the cabin at 40,000 feet. 

[ricepig]

I'm surprised they didn't call for open carry at airports while they were at it.

You can, except in the federally restricted areas.

http://steelerslounge.com/2017/03/arkansas-governor-backs-gun-law-changes/3426304/

[Wayne Watson]

Look, I own a a lot of guns.  So many, I don't know how many and I carry.  I bought a shotgun recently.  Connie says, "Don't you have shotguns?"  I said, "Yes, but not one like this".

Having said that, we do NOT need people carrying firearms into the football stadium.  I'm not saying you can't carry but you shouldn't be allowed to carry inside ANY stadium.

[(notOM)Rebel123]

Look, I own a a lot of guns.  So many, I don't know how many and I carry.  I bought a shotgun recently.  Connie says, "Don't you have shotguns?"  I said, "Yes, but not one like this".

Having said that, we do NOT need people carrying firearms into the football stadium.  I'm not saying you can't carry but you shouldn't be allowed to carry inside ANY stadium.

You'd think our legislators could have recognized how insane this idea was to begin with. The fact that it has gotten this far makes one wonder just how competent they really are. Heaven help us.

[PorkRinds]

Common sense and gun legislation absolutely cannot be used together anymore.  Just because it is legal for my wife to wear her bikini to church on Sunday doesn't mean it would be appropriate or a good idea.  The posted speed limit is NOT always the best speed to drive.  Sometimes it makes sense to slow down considerably and use common sense so that everyone on the road remains safe.  Nobody is coming to take my guns from me without a fight and I will join the fight of others to protect the 2nd Amendment.  However, I be darned if I should, or I want anyone with a few hours of training to be able to carry pistols anywhere and everywhere they want in life.  Any moron can get a carry permit, but it doesn't mean they will have the God given ability to use good judgement when they need to if they lack that capacity.

Could you tell me what church you go to? Asking for a friend.

[(notOM)Rebel123]

Could you tell me what church you go to? Asking for a friend.

Lol! +1

[PonderinHog]

"nothing in our opinion should be taken to cast doubt on longstanding prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally ill, or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings, or laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms"

Quote from well known wacko liberal Antonin Scalia in District of Columbia vs. Heller.

Dude wore a dress to work - liberal.

[Sivad]

never mind that if one goes off it could depressurize the cabin at 40,000 feet. 

007 agrees:

[hawgwash]

Dude wore a dress to work - liberal.

Yeah, but which bathroom did he use?  That's the real question.

[(notOM)Rebel123]

Just curious how close the House vote really is?

[jacobp]

Just curious how close the House vote really is?

From legislators on both sides (R and D) on twitter, unless the NRA backs off it could be very close

[(notOM)Rebel123]

From legislators on both sides (R and D) on twitter, unless the NRA backs off it could be very close

Well, the NRA won't back off.

[tusksincolorado]

Sheep....

[PonderinHog]

Sheep....

With guns...

[ricepig]

Sheep....

Ewe.......

[bennyl08]

With guns...

With wool that dark, will probably be mistaken for a baaaaaaad guy with a gun.

[hawgwash]

From legislators on both sides (R and D) on twitter, unless the NRA backs off it could be very close

I am very impressed by strong statements of almost all the gun owners who have posted in this thread expressing their strong disagreement with this law.  You need to let your state representative and state senator know how you feel.  It is clear that the legislators supporting this law are motivated by the NRA and, presumably, how they believe their constituents feel about this.  If you let them know you support guns but not this law, it might have an impact.  Here's a link to a website where you can determine who your representative and senator are.  It also gives links to their email addresses.
https://openstates.org/find_your_legislator/

[The Kig]

I'm in Tennessee as well. In all my 20 years living here I've only seen one person open carry and that's been very recent.

I only see open carry in gun shops, ranges, etc...but funny that our instructor said legally in TN you can go wild west style with a gun on each hip, as long as it technically qualifies as a handgun and the business doesn't clearly state at all entrances that guns aren't allowed.  He didn't recommend it due to the likely attention you were likely to garner from local authorities... Castle law in TN is second only to TX in interpretation.

[PorkSoda]

I only see open carry in gun shops, ranges, etc...but funny that our instructor said legally in TN you can go wild west style with a gun on each hip, as long as it technically qualifies as a handgun and the business doesn't clearly state at all entrances that guns aren't allowed.  He didn't recommend it due to the likely attention you were likely to garner from local authorities... Castle law in TN is second only to TX in interpretation.

so does that mean you are welcome to open carry, but if someone shoots you, its your own fault for scaring people by open carrying?

[tusksincolorado]

With wool that dark, will probably be mistaken for a baaaaaaad guy with a gun.

You'all are welcome for the belt high slow- pitch softball.....


BBBBAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH!

[theFlyingHog]

007 agrees:

lol, "shall not be infringed!"

never mind that if one goes off it could depressurize the cabin at 40,000 feet.

Nah don't worry about one or two bullet holes in the fuse.

[bennyl08]

so does that mean you are welcome to open carry, but if someone shoots you, its your own fault for scaring people by open carrying?

Definitely. I know I just run up to people and tackle them if I see them wearing some football jersey. With clothes like that, they are just asking to be tackled. Well, unless they are wearing a defensive player's jersey. Then I go for a block at the knees.

[PonderinHog]

You'all are welcome for the belt high slow- pitch softball.....


BBBBAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH!

Maybe SNL will do a skit on us.  "Hey, Razorback Fans, show us your guns!"

[GoHogs1091]

I am pro-Second Amendment.  I support the NRA.  I have my CCP and I concealed carry regularly.  I am also a retired police officer, have carried a gun every day most of my adult life and have worked Razorback football games in the past.  I say all that to say this; allowing anyone other than law enforcement to carry guns at a sporting event is one of the worst ideas I have ever heard.  I have had alcohol poured on me while escorting the opponent off the field.  I have seen a liquor bottle come flying out of the stands aimed at the officials (at least I think that's who he was aiming at.)  We absolutely, positively do not need guns in a sports event.  There are plenty of cops around the stadium in the event of some kind of an attack.  I feel strongly enough about this that I have already emailed my representative.

Probably is a waste of time.

It should be remembered that many of the State Representatives/State Senators in Little Rock are an example of the Peter Principle.

The Peter Principle describes that people rise to and or are promoted to their level of incompetence.

[Karma]

As important as the guns in stadium issue is, they MUST fix the guns at UAMS provision or UAMS runs the risk of losing its accreditation.

[colbs]

I am very impressed by strong statements of almost all the gun owners who have posted in this thread expressing their strong disagreement with this law.  You need to let your state representative and state senator know how you feel.  It is clear that the legislators supporting this law are motivated by the NRA and, presumably, how they believe their constituents feel about this.  If you let them know you support guns but not this law, it might have an impact.  Here's a link to a website where you can determine who your representative and senator are.  It also gives links to their email addresses.
https://openstates.org/find_your_legislator/

I own several guns but I do not agree with guns in stadiums or arenas.  I just don't see any benefits to allowing them.  I just emailed my representative and I hope others will as well.  I've have heard or seen hardly in favor of this.  I have seen hundreds of people who were against with a lot of them being pro gun.  I hope these representatives realize they represent us and not the NRA at the end of the day.

[hawgwash]

I own several guns but I do not agree with guns in stadiums or arenas.  I just don't see any benefits to allowing them.  I just emailed my representative and I hope others will as well.  I've have heard or seen hardly in favor of this.  I have seen hundreds of people who were against with a lot of them being pro gun.  I hope these representatives realize they represent us and not the NRA at the end of the day.

I emailed both my representative and my senator about 9:00 tonight.  I am pleasantly surprised to report my senator, Jeremy Hutchinson, responded an hour and 15 minutes later to say he is doing his best to pass the clean up bill and allow universities to exclude guns at athletic events.

[jh0486]

Let's not get confused. This bill wasn't passed because our state government gives 2 shites about your right to carry. This was done for NRA campaign dollars. I wouldn't be calling anyone else sheep if you haven't realized that yet.

[Inhogswetrust]

I only see open carry in gun shops, ranges, etc...but funny that our instructor said legally in TN you can go wild west style with a gun on each hip, as long as it technically qualifies as a handgun and the business doesn't clearly state at all entrances that guns aren't allowed.  He didn't recommend it due to the likely attention you were likely to garner from local authorities... Castle law in TN is second only to TX in interpretation.

I forgot I have seen open carry in gun shops and ranges. I've only seen in once in any other place.

[Inhogswetrust]

so does that mean you are welcome to open carry, but if someone shoots you, its your own fault for scaring people by open carrying?

You know the answer. Scaring is not the same as threatening in a certain manner such as they have a reasonable fear for their life OR some one else's life. That does not in TN mean you have to back away thus the castle doctrine. The DA always reviews any shooting. At the place where I got my CCP examples of what is, is not and might or might not be reasons to shoot be open to interpretation, are a part of the class. As you also know sometimes it isn't so clear cut and people have been prosecuted.

[Inhogswetrust]

Probably is a waste of time.

It should be remembered that many of the State Representatives/State Senators in Little Rock are an example of the Peter Principle.

The Peter Principle describes that people rise to and or are promoted to their level of incompetence.

I wouldn't limit that to only those from Little Rock.

[Inhogswetrust]

Why any representative or senator would vote for a bill where emotionally charged nuts are in a stadium, arena or environment, and are allowed to have guns there are simply.....................nuts themselves.

[sw403]

People have guns.....  THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Inhogswetrust]

People have guns.....  THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Owning them is one thing............where you have them is another. I have quite a few and my CCP and do not carry 24/7 everywhere all the time. There are times and places for guns. Games isn't one of them.

[jkstock04]

Owning them is one thing............where you have them is another. I have quite a few and my CCP and do not carry 24/7 everywhere all the time. There are times and places for guns. Games isn't one of them.

Where is the time and place to conceal carry a handgun? I'm curious.

[ricepig]

I wouldn't limit that to only those from Little Rock.

He didn't, he said those in Little Rock, you know, where the state legislature meets.....

[jkstock04]

Common sense is your friend with this question.

Not in a stadium where over over 70,000 people are compressed and compact with emotions on a roller coaster.

Think about 70,000+ people compressed in Razorback Stadium. According to the 2010 census, there are only three cities with a population over 70,000. You'd find fewer places that allowing CCP would be worse.

This is the PR answer/dodge I was expecting. Common sense also tells me this doesn't come close to answering my question.

What's the point of a conceal carry license and more importantly where is the "right" place to do it? I don't have a CCL...but seems like many of those that do in this thread are vehemently against this notion. So my question...once again, why would you have a CCL to begin with? Where is the "correct" place to conceal carry a handgun?

[NaturalStateReb]

one would think the NRA would understand this.  they are as much lemmings in their blind opposition to common sense as any california liberal.

There's actually an excellent reason as to why they oppose carve-outs like sporting events, politically speaking.

The logic behind their argument is, "guns always make us safer."  If a societal consensus forms, especially one that includes responsible gun owners, that there are some places like sporting events where guns should not be allowed, that's tantamount to saying "there are places where guns do not make us safer."  If people start thinking that more guns don't make us safer in sporting events, then where else might more guns not make us safer?  It threatens the logical underpinnings of their entire project, so they must adamantly oppose any such measure.  Doing anything else would be an admission that firearms carry an element of danger and may not always make us safer.

Responsible firearm owners know firearms carry an element of danger; that's largely the reason they're responsible and not reckless.  There's nothing wrong with admitting that element of risk and understanding that that element of risk should be minimized.

[Pig in the Pokey]

I'm surprised they didn't call for open carry at airports while they were at it.

lol! right? they are pansies who let libtards take away their rights. THE MOST LIKELY place to encounter a problem is on a flight. Why no guns on planes, coward repugnants?

[hogcard1964]

Let's not get confused. This bill wasn't passed because our state government gives 2 shites about your right to carry. This was done for NRA campaign dollars. I wouldn't be calling anyone else sheep if you haven't realized that yet.

+1000

The NRA is powerful and does some awesome work!!!

[Pig in the Pokey]

This is the PR answer/dodge I was expecting. Common sense also tells me this doesn't come close to answering my question.

What's the point of a conceal carry license and more importantly where is the "right" place to do it? I don't have a CCL...but seems like many of those that do in this thread are vehemently against this notion. So my question...once again, why would you have a CCL to begin with? Where is the "correct" place to conceal carry a handgun?

answer is airports and airplanes. If you wont stand up for our right to protect ourselves on an airplane than what's the point!!!

[PorkSoda]

There's actually an excellent reason as to why they oppose carve-outs like sporting events, politically speaking.

The logic behind their argument is, "guns always make us safer."  If a societal consensus forms, especially one that includes responsible gun owners, that there are some places like sporting events where guns should not be allowed, that's tantamount to saying "there are places where guns do not make us safer."  If people start thinking that more guns don't make us safer in sporting events, then where else might more guns not make us safer?  It threatens the logical underpinnings of their entire project, so they must adamantly oppose any such measure.  Doing anything else would be an admission that firearms carry an element of danger and may not always make us safer.

Responsible firearm owners know firearms carry an element of danger; that's largely the reason they're responsible and not reckless.  There's nothing wrong with admitting that element of risk and understanding that that element of risk should be minimized.

I see what you are saying, maybe its my personal bias against dishonesty and them assuming their audience is too stupid to understand an honest stance.  that is a failing of our modern politics.  everything has to go all the way all the time or you might *gasp* be labeled a "moderate" you know one of those "fence sitters" that doesn't stand for anything

[hogcard1964]

I see what you are saying, maybe its my personal bias against dishonesty and them assuming their audience is too stupid to understand an honest stance.  that is a failing of our modern politics.  everything has to go all the way all the time or you might *gasp* be labeled a "moderate" you know one of those "fence sitters" that doesn't stand for anything

Which amp did you end up with?

[PorkSoda]

Which amp did you end up with?

nothing yet,  every time I think I have a little extra money to improve my listening experience, life gets in the way.

[hogcard1964]

nothing yet,  every time I think I have a little extra money to improve my listening experience, life gets in the way.

Exactly

I just had an old integrated amp repaired and it killed me.