Pressurized aircraft questions

[GusMcRae]

I copy and pasted a previous post of mine from Gotya's "182L My Bird" thread:
"However, there's a guy here that has a Cessna P210, a straight tail 182, and a Cherokee 140,,,, none of which get flown much at all.  I would guess <20 hours a year on any one of the 3, and maybe less than 10 hours on the P210.  I quizzed a guy that is closely associated (business partner some kind of way, but not a partner on the airplane) with the owner on what the chances were of a guy like me renting that 210 once or twice a year when I need more useful load than what my 182 offers.  He was drinking, but his answer was "you wouldn't have to rent it,,, just come get it".  So, I may test the water on that farily soon by asking them if my CFI and I can come get it to get my complex endorsement, and be ready to take it to South Texas in January. 

*Upon further research of this P210, sounds like it has its share of problems with the engine and the gear.  It's been sitting in a hangar for about 3 years without moving.  Plus, my CFI said that since it's pressurized, I couldn't get insurance on it unless I was Instrument rated, and it's almost like they want you to go through a school to fly the darn thing.  So scratch all that."

I actually saw this P210 yesterday and although it is just sitting in a hangar, it may be in a lot better shape than what I was told in regard to the engine and gear.  Damn shame it is just sitting there.  Beautiful bird, 6 plush leather seats, current owners had it painted, new 430 as well as the rest of the stack is no slouch, 3 blade prop.

That being said, besides getting my instrument rating and complex endorsement, what all would a guy have to go through to get certified to fly a P210? 

[Brownstreak]

I would find out what insurance expected you to do?  That's a fantastic airplane and what I've always wanted, but wouldn't ever be able to afford it.
Many years ago there was a 310 that sat in a hangar at Central and rotted.  Such a shame

[gotyacovered]

I copy and pasted a previous post of mine from Gotya's "182L My Bird" thread:
"However, there's a guy here that has a Cessna P210, a straight tail 182, and a Cherokee 140,,,, none of which get flown much at all.  I would guess <20 hours a year on any one of the 3, and maybe less than 10 hours on the P210.  I quizzed a guy that is closely associated (business partner some kind of way, but not a partner on the airplane) with the owner on what the chances were of a guy like me renting that 210 once or twice a year when I need more useful load than what my 182 offers.  He was drinking, but his answer was "you wouldn't have to rent it,,, just come get it".  So, I may test the water on that farily soon by asking them if my CFI and I can come get it to get my complex endorsement, and be ready to take it to South Texas in January. 

*Upon further research of this P210, sounds like it has its share of problems with the engine and the gear.  It's been sitting in a hangar for about 3 years without moving.  Plus, my CFI said that since it's pressurized, I couldn't get insurance on it unless I was Instrument rated, and it's almost like they want you to go through a school to fly the darn thing.  So scratch all that."

I actually saw this P210 yesterday and although it is just sitting in a hangar, it may be in a lot better shape than what I was told in regard to the engine and gear.  Damn shame it is just sitting there.  Beautiful bird, 6 plush leather seats, current owners had it painted, new 430 as well as the rest of the stack is no slouch, 3 blade prop.

That being said, besides getting my instrument rating and complex endorsement, what all would a guy have to go through to get certified to fly a P210? 

i LOVE 210's. my cousin has one... N761LG. not pressurized, but turbo..... aspen w/ synthetic vision, FIKI... there is a pic of it on flightaware. its a beaut.

all that to say his ops cost is about $350/hr at 70 hours per year.

add pressurization... man, not sure. i dont think your issue regarding insurance will be with pressurization its going to be purely the lack of instrument and no retract time (if that is the case). i know from experience that there is a dramatic increase at policy inception with transitioning from fixed to retract, but it is equally dramatic at the next renewal, assuming of course you build some time.

i think with a 210, the acquisition/insurance cost are not the concern, though. its the ops cost/mx cost that i cant get over. cousin's last two annual bills will send chills down your spine.

that being said, lets sell our 182's and buy it

[GusMcRae]

i LOVE 210's. my cousin has one... N761LG. not pressurized, but turbo..... aspen w/ synthetic vision, FIKI... there is a pic of it on flightaware. its a beaut.

all that to say his ops cost is about $350/hr at 70 hours per year.

add pressurization... man, not sure. i dont think your issue regarding insurance will be with pressurization its going to be purely the lack of instrument and no retract time (if that is the case). i know from experience that there is a dramatic increase at policy inception with transitioning from fixed to retract, but it is equally dramatic at the next renewal, assuming of course you build some time.

i think with a 210, the acquisition/insurance cost are not the concern, though. its the ops cost/mx cost that i cant get over. cousin's last two annual bills will send chills down your spine.

that being said, lets sell our 182's and buy it

Haha!  I fully realize that a P210 is waaaay out of my league to even be a partial owner of.  Don't think I even want any part of a normal 210.  Just that mx's comment the other day about 210s and cardinals is enough for me to stay away from owning either. 

However, I am curious as to what it would take to get certified to fly it (on my dime), and fly it for them, (on their dime). 
See where I'm going with this?

[gotyacovered]

Haha!  I fully realize that a P210 is waaaay out of my league to even be a partial owner of.  Don't think I even want any part of a normal 210.  Just that mx's comment the other day about 210s and cardinals is enough for me to stay away from owning either. 

However, I am curious as to what it would take to get certified to fly it (on my dime), and fly it for them, (on their dime). 
See where I'm going with this?

Oh ya... It's as easy as having them add you as a pilot/additional insured and you will want to make sure and get a waiver of subrogation on your favor. There will likely be a min requirement with CFI and before your carry pax (25-50 hours). If I wasn't completely covered up I would check on ot for more exact figures for us!

[GusMcRae]

Oh ya... It's as easy as having them add you as a pilot/additional insured and you will want to make sure and get a waiver of subrogation on your favor. There will likely be a min requirement with CFI and before your carry pax (25-50 hours). If I wasn't completely covered up I would check on ot for more exact figures for us!

No problem.  I'm a long way off from even being close to needing those kind of details. 

[Blue35]

Great airplane. Whatever you do, get instrument qualified and become proficient in instrument flying. Become especially proficient in being able to transitions from VFR to IMC flying in a split second. Don't ever get caught in a lowering ceiling condition and let the ceiling push you into the ground.

[gotyacovered]

Great airplane. Whatever you do, get instrument qualified and become proficient in instrument flying. Become especially proficient in being able to transitions from VFR to IMC flying in a split second. Don't ever get caught in a lowering ceiling condition and let the ceiling push you into the ground.

well, put. people are not inventing new ways to kill themselves in airplanes, its the same stuff over and over.... climb, communicate, confess, and comply. or file if properly certificated.

[Flying Razorback]

I love having that instrument cert.  I never really have to worry about anything besides convective weather.  Step 1)  Attempt to maintain VFR to the max extent possibly while flying VFR.  Step 2)  Climb to a known safe altitude while transitioning to instruments and contact the nearest RADAR facility ASAP for a clearance.

[GusMcRae]

i LOVE 210's. my cousin has one... N761LG. not pressurized, but turbo..... aspen w/ synthetic vision, FIKI... there is a pic of it on flightaware. its a beaut.

I pulled up that pic.  Very nice.  Just my color too.  Is he an Aggie?  LOL.

Thanks for the input Brownstreak, Blue35, FlyingRzrbkAF, and Gotya.  As soon as my prop gets back from the shop and bolted back on, I'll be back on the Instrument Rating trail.  I've got to get-r-done in the next 11 months or else I'll have to re-take my written. 

Things might be about to start moving on the revival of this P210.  Not sure if my inquiries have prompted it or if it is strictly coincidence.  Not sure that I will have the opportunity to have a damn thing to do with it if they successfully get it annualed. 
I've talked to the few around here that had anything to do with this plane when it was purchased and worked on (turns out that it was 5 years ago, Feb 2009).  Interesting to say the least.  I've made some notes on everything that turned up. 
First chance I get I'll take some pics and let y'all see why I'm salivating over this plane, and why it is haunting me that it is just sitting there in a hangar that I drive past twice a day.

[gotyacovered]

I pulled up that pic.  Very nice.  Just my color too.  Is he an Aggie?  LOL.

Thanks for the input Brownstreak, Blue35, FlyingRzrbkAF, and Gotya.  As soon as my prop gets back from the shop and bolted back on, I'll be back on the Instrument Rating trail.  I've got to get-r-done in the next 11 months or else I'll have to re-take my written. 

Things might be about to start moving on the revival of this P210.  Not sure if my inquiries have prompted it or if it is strictly coincidence.  Not sure that I will have the opportunity to have a damn thing to do with it if they successfully get it annualed. 
I've talked to the few around here that had anything to do with this plane when it was purchased and worked on (turns out that it was 5 years ago, Feb 2009).  Interesting to say the least.  I've made some notes on everything that turned up. 
First chance I get I'll take some pics and let y'all see why I'm salivating over this plane, and why it is haunting me that it is just sitting there in a hangar that I drive past twice a day.

brace yourself..... he is worse than an aggie. he is Michigan alum. played football there under Lloyd Carr and Brady Hoke. he was a red shirt freshman when the won a NC in 97. broke his leg after making the roster for two years on special teams/back up DB and never played again.

he had a 182RG that he flew back and forth from college and his hometown in Kansas. ***jealous*** i drove a 84 CJ7.

i with ya, i am not even starting my flight training until i have a new engine. hopeing maybe the break in period and that will coincide.

cant wait to see the pics.

[GusMcRae]

he had a 182RG that he flew back and forth from college and his hometown in Kansas. ***jealous*** i drove a 84 CJ7.

Wow,,, I've never even heard of anyone whose college vehicle was a 182RG, or any aircraft for that matter!

 

[gotyacovered]

Wow,,, I've never even heard of anybone whose college vehicle was a 182RG, or any aircraft for that matter!

Ya... His dad is the one who has the turbine evolution. They had several planes while he was in college. He solo'd at 16... He went to work for his dad after college and got to fly that 182RG 300hrs a year for work, then they sold and moved to Denver and started building the turbine evolutions and buying property. They sold the 182RG and bought the 210.

[GusMcRae]

Pics:

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[gotyacovered]

Pics:

oh man.

i got your doc by the way, great notes. i only made it 1/2 thru but will get back into them. very interesting situation. is it a "N"? looks like its been properly stowed away. one question re: N37MJstack.jpeg... next to the transponder and nav/comm is a green button/switch (to the left)... what is that?

that is pretty close to a dream family travel rig.

[GusMcRae]

oh man.

i got your doc by the way, great notes. i only made it 1/2 thru but will get back into them. very interesting situation. is it a "N"? looks like its been properly stowed away. one question re: N37MJstack.jpeg... next to the transponder and nav/comm is a green button/switch (to the left)... what is that?

that is pretty close to a dream family travel rig.

It shows to be a 1980, P210-N. 
I don't know what that green button/switch, or maybe a light is, but I'll find out.
I'm guessing that maybe it's a light to show the oxygen system on. 
It still smells new inside.

[attachment deleted by admin]

[GusMcRae]

Ya... His dad is the one who has the turbine evolution. They had several planes while he was in college. He solo'd at 16... He went to work for his dad after college and got to fly that 182RG 300hrs a year for work, then they sold and moved to Denver and started building the turbine evolutions and buying property. They sold the 182RG and bought the 210.

Are you talking Lancair Evolutions?  Building the kits to sell them already assembled?

[gotyacovered]

Are you talking Lancair Evolutions?  Building the kits to sell them already assembled?

yes. build. fly. sell. repeat. he improves each one... this is the one he is selling/sold--N750CG. it is awesome.

[gotyacovered]

here you go... i have to think with you NWAR folks someone has to have seen this airplane.

http://www.trade-a-plane.com/listing?id=1688427

[GusMcRae]

here you go... i have to think with you NWAR folks someone has to have seen this airplane.

http://www.trade-a-plane.com/listing?id=1688427

A little cream puff. 
Those are the ones people in the know say to run backwards from. 
But that is cheap!

[gotyacovered]

A little cream puff. 
Those are the ones people in the know say to run backwards from. 
But that is cheap!

run backwards, haha;D

i have repeatedly seen that if you stay on top of the mx on the 210's its no biggie. my question is how expensive it is to 'stay on top of'