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POLL: Hoop Hogs are 7-1, #7 RPI...what will fairweather fans complain about now?

Started by fourthcrusade, December 06, 2006, 07:40:43 am

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With the Hogs 7-1, & the #7 RPI, what will the always-negative fairweather hoop fans complain about now?

"I miss Nolan ball" (except when we didn't made the sweet 16 - see 1997-2002; and except when we lost to American-PuertoRico, N'Western Louisiana, & Oral Roberts at home)
11 (12.4%)
"Heath's style of play is "BIG TEN" boring" (even though we average a higher # of blocks, rebounds, FT%, and 3P% than Nolan's years)
16 (18%)
today's fad insult = "Attendance is too low!" (even though yesterday was a bitterly cold TUESDAY weeknight, with the game on TV)
5 (5.6%)
"We should have hired Mike Anderson, his teams are exciting" (UAB never scored 100, scored over 90 once, and scored 37 last year; we have 100+ once, and 90+ three times)
27 (30.3%)
"I realized what a negative jerk I am being so I will be proud of the hoop hogs and take out my wrath on Nutt" (the only sane thing to whine about)
30 (33.7%)

Total Members Voted: 84

hogfan064

Quote from: Juicemeister on December 06, 2006, 09:30:10 am
Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 08:49:34 am
I didn't know "fans" ridiculed those that attended games, assumed UA lies about figures
You are thick. Just because we complain about attendance means that we're ridiculing fans? I drive from Fort Smith for 2 out of every 3 games. That's 120 to 240 miles a week just to see the BB hogs play. What I'm sick of is not seeing a quality team. There are so many students who live on campus and so many Hog fans in NWA who are apathetic because our team is nothing to write home about. Where are all the fans? They're at home because our team is average at best. Why doesn't the media cover the basketball Hogs like they used to? Because our team is average at best. Heath has had 5 years to build up a team, and they're showing somewhat of a glimpse of hope, but people are getting sick of the sluggish pace on which we improve.

Just because I complain about the attendance of a game being 3,000 (and laughing at the UA's padded "estimate" of 8,000) doesn't mean I'm ridiculing fans. I'm one of the 3,000. Where are the other 17,000?

I'd be there every game, but I live 950 miles away

hogtheball

Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 07:40:43 am
Whine, whine, whine - all you people do is complain!

Keep it up!  The more you complain, the better we do!  At this rate, we will win 30 games and go to the final four.



(courtesy espn.com, AP Photo/April L. Brown)

I am very optimistic about this years team - and have been very positive about Heath this year. However, your post was almost enough to send me running and screaming to the dark side. 

We had a good early year tournament and after the tourny would have been a good time to say some positive things about the team.  We got thrashed by Mizzou last week - which is fresh in everyone's memory - so now is probably not the most intelligent time to call everyone out on how great Heath is and how stupid Anderson fans are. 

Also, while RPIs are certainly important at the end of the season, they are nothing to get all worked up about at this point.  Games this early in the season barely give anyone an inidcation of what a team is going to be like.  A lot of the teams that look great right now will fold later on.  Some of the teams who look weak right now will be in the Sweet 16.  The good teams are the ones who are trying to learn, improve their chemistry, and patiently improve.  I hold my fingers crossed that we are one of those teams.

I am patiently supporting Heath and hoping that we do indeed start to look more and more like the Big Ten powerhouse that produced him.  If I were you, however, I wouldn't start ranting and raving like we just won the SEC championship right now. 
Did you hear about the dyslexic agnostic with insomnia? He laid awake all night wondering if there really was a dog.

 

iCalledThatHogBrotha!

How about #5:

We have scheduled absolutely NOBODY, except for Missouri, who handed our asses to us on a platter.

Do you seriously not remember two years ago when we started off 12-1, then hit conference play and ended up 18-22???  Regardless of the media propaganda, this team is NOT better without Brewer & Modica!

Fatty McGee

Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 07:45:14 am
"We should have hired Mike Anderson, his teams are exciting" (UAB never scored 100, scored over 90 once, and scored 37 last year; we have 100+ once, and 90+ three times)

You keep bringing this point up, but forget to leave out that Anderson beat Heath by 20.

When your RPI is 7th after 8 games its not that big of a deal.  What matters is how you do in the postseason and Heath has done nothing at Arkansas in the postseason.   Stan beat a 4-4 CMU team last night and beat a UMKC team by 10 points on Saturday.  Are these things to be proud of?  Not exactly, Heath has to win these games.   When he quits losing on the road to teams like MSU and Ole Miss then I'll be happy.  When he wins 1 postseason game I'll be happy, but he hasn't done that yet.  He hasn't proved anything at this point other than he's a decent recruiter.

Bill Self lost to ORU.  Want to fire him?
Bandit: Hey wait a minute, wait a minute. Why do you want that beer so bad?
Little Enos: Cause he's thirsty, dummy!

Fatty McGee

Quote from: HogBaptist on December 06, 2006, 09:13:06 am
He seems to be a good recruiter.  He has a hard time getting his team fired up.  He also has a hard time getting the team to listen to him.  The example to be used here is the Missou game.  He kept calling time outs and EVERY player kept doing the exact same thing.  They were not doing anything different.  They would continuously hurry the ball and try to run with Mizz.  He also would not get on the refs.  They are playing a high tempo game, which should cause everyone to get riled up.  Stan didn't.  He just sat there.  Get off your freaking butt.  That might not be his style, but every coach does it. 

This teams progression.  Every player on this team is exactly the same as when they came.  Thomas, Townes, Hill, McCurdy, Hunter.  None of them have progressed.  That is Stans weakness.  He is having a hard time getting these guys do what he wants them to do.  That is the key to basketball.  The players must be sold out...these guys aren't. 

If you watched one game all year, Mizzou, you would be correct.  But you're not.

Bandit: Hey wait a minute, wait a minute. Why do you want that beer so bad?
Little Enos: Cause he's thirsty, dummy!

Ouachihog

Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 09:23:39 am
Quote from: Ouachihog on December 06, 2006, 09:20:27 am
Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 07:58:29 am
Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 07:51:48 am
NEWS FLASH ANDERSON KILLED HEATH LAST THURSDAY(I can use caps too)

I watched all of last night's game and  yeah we dominated 90% of the game.  Big deal it was Central Michigan.  Do you want me to get excited with a win over a team with a RPI in the 200s? 

No, I want you to support a team, a coach, and a program worth supporting.  And the rpi in the 200s is light years better than last year, when playing texas pan american and another 300rpi'er KILLED us, i mean KILLED us in rankings.... the 'six game streak' wouldn't have been necessary last year if we hadnt played pan-am. 

Will you whine if we are 12-1, or 13-2 near the beginning of sec play?  will you stop whining then?


I do admire your enthusiasm, and I wish I had some of it.  Let's go down the schedule.  The "big 3 in december" are T Tech, texas, and ORU.  I'll give the benefit of the doubt and say we win 2 of the 3, which may or may not happen.  I'll even give you three wins over Oakland, La tech, and Tulsa.  That would put us 12-2 going into SEC play.  This would be a good record and would put us in position to make an ncaa run.  If we finish 8-8 in SEC play we would be 20-10 needing to win 1 in the SEC tourney most likely.  RPI would still be top 25 more than likely.  

With that said, I don't think it will happen b/c of how tough the SEC is.  Three of our first 5 SEC games are against top 10 teams (Bama, at Florida, and LSU).  The other 2 games in that stretch are AT Ole Miss and UGA at home.  We lost at Ole Miss last year and they had possibly the worst team in the league.  I see us being 1-4 after 5 SEC games.  But the schedule only gets better from here....we then play AT south carolina and AT Bama.  Looking like 1-6 SEC play, maybe 2-5 after 7 games.  The good news after that, we play 2 straight home games, the bad news...one of them is kentucky.  We could get back into the race by beating UK and Auburn here, or we could seal our fate with another loss.  

Bottom line, the SEC is too good this year, we have a lot of rookies who may light it up one night, but then go 0-6 with 4 turnovers the next night.  Our point guard assist to turnover average will be 1-1 in SEC play if we are LUCKY.  Right now, I anticipate a 6-10 to 7-9 SEC season and another NIT play or no play decision.  Hope to goodness I'm wrong.  

If your prediction comes true and infact we miss the NCAA tourney then Heath has to go.  4 misses in 5 years and no postseason wins is a firing at any elite program.

Completely agree.  But then we wil be hit with..."he is a great recruiter" and "he has improved in wins every year except this year."  The problem with those arguments is #1 the proof is in the pudding for recruiting.  If we go 6-10 SEC this year, is he really that great?  While he has done a decent job of bringing the program back from the 9 win season, 1 ncaat bid doesn't cut it.  
"If I lived back in the wild west days, instead of carrying a six-gun in my holster, I'd carry a soldering iron. That way, if some smart-aleck cowboy said something like "Hey, look. He's carrying a soldering iron!" and started laughing, and everybody else started laughing, I could just say, "That's right, it's a soldering iron. The soldering iron of justice." Then everybody would get real quiet and ashamed, because they had made fun of the soldering iron of justice, and I could probably hit them up for a free drink."

"I hope if dogs ever take over the world, and they chose a king, they don't just go by size, because I bet there are some Chihuahuas with some good ideas."

hogfan064

Quote from: Fatty McGee on December 06, 2006, 09:40:10 am
Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 07:45:14 am
"We should have hired Mike Anderson, his teams are exciting" (UAB never scored 100, scored over 90 once, and scored 37 last year; we have 100+ once, and 90+ three times)

You keep bringing this point up, but forget to leave out that Anderson beat Heath by 20.

When your RPI is 7th after 8 games its not that big of a deal.  What matters is how you do in the postseason and Heath has done nothing at Arkansas in the postseason.   Stan beat a 4-4 CMU team last night and beat a UMKC team by 10 points on Saturday.  Are these things to be proud of?  Not exactly, Heath has to win these games.   When he quits losing on the road to teams like MSU and Ole Miss then I'll be happy.  When he wins 1 postseason game I'll be happy, but he hasn't done that yet.  He hasn't proved anything at this point other than he's a decent recruiter.

Bill Self lost to ORU.  Want to fire him?

Bill Self is not my coach, so I will leave that decision up to his school.  Stan Heath is my coach and if he isn't in the NCAA tourney this year he must be fired.

fourthcrusade

Quote from: abostian on December 06, 2006, 09:36:47 am
How about #5:

We have scheduled absolutely NOBODY, except for Missouri, who handed our asses to us on a platter.

Do you seriously not remember two years ago when we started off 12-1, then hit conference play and ended up 18-22???  Regardless of the media propaganda, this team is NOT better without Brewer & Modica!

Exactly my point, we started off 12-1 because we played NOONE.

We are playing S. Illinois (i know you are a 'new' fan by S.Illinois has been to multiple sweet 16s), W. Virginia (elite 8, nba picks), Texas (elite 8, recent final four), Texas Tech (bobby knight)..  Tulsa (NCAA), ORU (NCAA), Marist (likely NCAA)

That's  7  -- count it -- SEVEN Nonconference games against NCAA teams.

The 12-1 start you refer to saw us lose to Illinois but beat NO ONE that made the tourney (maybe mighty winthrop, i can't remember).

if we go 12-1, yes, beating 7 NCAA teams is better than the paper tiger we were in '04-'05.

Losing brewer and modica were THE best thing to team chemistry, sorry, but the two of them were a cancer in the locker room... hello, where have you been??

TRUHOG718

Quote from: hogtheball on December 06, 2006, 09:34:56 am
Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 07:40:43 am
Whine, whine, whine - all you people do is complain!

Keep it up!  The more you complain, the better we do!  At this rate, we will win 30 games and go to the final four.



(courtesy espn.com, AP Photo/April L. Brown)

I am very optimistic about this years team - and have been very positive about Heath this year. However, your post was almost enough to send me running and screaming to the dark side. 

We had a good early year tournament and after the tourny would have been a good time to say some positive things about the team.  We got thrashed by Mizzou last week - which is fresh in everyone's memory - so now is probably not the most intelligent time to call everyone out on how great Heath is and how stupid Anderson fans are. 

Also, while RPIs are certainly important at the end of the season, they are nothing to get all worked up about at this point.  Games this early in the season barely give anyone an inidcation of what a team is going to be like.  A lot of the teams that look great right now will fold later on.  Some of the teams who look weak right now will be in the Sweet 16.  The good teams are the ones who are trying to learn, improve their chemistry, and patiently improve.  I hold my fingers crossed that we are one of those teams.

I am patiently supporting Heath and hoping that we do indeed start to look more and more like the Big Ten powerhouse that produced him.  If I were you, however, I wouldn't start ranting and raving like we just won the SEC championship right now. 

Take notes...This is how you intelligently dispute another post. Opinion based on facts and respect for the other poster. +1 hogtheball
http://www.sicollection.com/assets/images/nolan_richardson_300.jpg

One Day. We Will Be Back. I Promise You This.

Pork Twain

Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 08:49:34 am
Quote from: BeoPig on December 06, 2006, 08:47:07 am
Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 08:42:33 am
Quote from: LA HAWG on December 06, 2006, 08:40:25 am
What in the HECK has Heath done to deserve any praise or support?  You Heath Huggers are just as bad as Nutt Huggers.

I'm not a "Hugger", i just don't want to have heath learn as a coach, get his 'training' here, improve EACH YEAR, then go somewhere else and have great success.  Do you?  IF we sit through 02 & 03, why don't we want to reap the benefits in 07 08 09?  

But never fear, as long as nutt has a job here, HEATH has a job.
Dear Stan,
You are right you are not a Hugger.  That term is reserved for HDN and I have never heard a hugger cry as much as you or be as rude to his fellow fans.

I didn't know "fans" ridiculed those that attended games, assumed UA lies about figures, calls out the players for not playing hard enough, calls out the players for not being "enthusiastic", calls out players for poor play (i'm sorry, isn't ther elike a  'don't insult casey dick rule' around here -- are bball players immune from that protection?), if THAT is a "FAN", then forget it, I'll root for UALR.

Get over it, we are going to be better than last year, and you will still whine about something... maybe the fact we are peaking too fast LOL
FYI mr spazzing out all the time -- I have not complained or insulted any of our players but you are coming across like a damn cry baby.  I don't have to like SH's offense to like him or the players.  You and your preaching for SH threads are a joke.  You go crazy anytime anyone disagrees with you and resort to calling names like that is going to help you make your point
"It is better to be an optimist and proven wrong, than a pessimist and proven right." ~Pork Twain

https://www.facebook.com/groups/sweetmemes/

fu-man-soo

Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 07:40:43 am
Whine, whine, whine - all you people do is complain!

Keep it up!  The more you complain, the better we do!  At this rate, we will win 30 games and go to the final four.



(courtesy espn.com, AP Photo/April L. Brown)

and this is not a compaint?

Fatty McGee

Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 09:47:40 am
Quote from: Fatty McGee on December 06, 2006, 09:40:10 am
Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 07:45:14 am
"We should have hired Mike Anderson, his teams are exciting" (UAB never scored 100, scored over 90 once, and scored 37 last year; we have 100+ once, and 90+ three times)

You keep bringing this point up, but forget to leave out that Anderson beat Heath by 20.

When your RPI is 7th after 8 games its not that big of a deal.  What matters is how you do in the postseason and Heath has done nothing at Arkansas in the postseason.   Stan beat a 4-4 CMU team last night and beat a UMKC team by 10 points on Saturday.  Are these things to be proud of?  Not exactly, Heath has to win these games.   When he quits losing on the road to teams like MSU and Ole Miss then I'll be happy.  When he wins 1 postseason game I'll be happy, but he hasn't done that yet.  He hasn't proved anything at this point other than he's a decent recruiter.

Bill Self lost to ORU.  Want to fire him?

Bill Self is not my coach, so I will leave that decision up to his school.  Stan Heath is my coach and if he isn't in the NCAA tourney this year he must be fired.

I agree.  But simply losing to Missouri doesn't mean much.
Bandit: Hey wait a minute, wait a minute. Why do you want that beer so bad?
Little Enos: Cause he's thirsty, dummy!

hogfan064

Quote from: Fatty McGee on December 06, 2006, 10:05:20 am
Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 09:47:40 am
Quote from: Fatty McGee on December 06, 2006, 09:40:10 am
Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 07:45:14 am
"We should have hired Mike Anderson, his teams are exciting" (UAB never scored 100, scored over 90 once, and scored 37 last year; we have 100+ once, and 90+ three times)

You keep bringing this point up, but forget to leave out that Anderson beat Heath by 20.

When your RPI is 7th after 8 games its not that big of a deal.  What matters is how you do in the postseason and Heath has done nothing at Arkansas in the postseason.   Stan beat a 4-4 CMU team last night and beat a UMKC team by 10 points on Saturday.  Are these things to be proud of?  Not exactly, Heath has to win these games.   When he quits losing on the road to teams like MSU and Ole Miss then I'll be happy.  When he wins 1 postseason game I'll be happy, but he hasn't done that yet.  He hasn't proved anything at this point other than he's a decent recruiter.

Bill Self lost to ORU.  Want to fire him?

Bill Self is not my coach, so I will leave that decision up to his school.  Stan Heath is my coach and if he isn't in the NCAA tourney this year he must be fired.

I agree.  But simply losing to Missouri doesn't mean much.

Its not losing to Mizzou that angers the fanbase. Its losing to Ole Miss, MSU, and other teams we should've beaten the last 4 years that angers folks.  Missouri is brought up because Anderson made Heath look like a fool.

 

fourthcrusade

Oh well. 
The more we win, the more media coverage we get, and of course, when SEC play starts, the place will be filled up.    

chillinhoggie


HawgAdvocate

Screw it guys...nothin will change the minds of these bitter, ol' bloodthrity wolves except in mid-Januray when the bandwagon comes back around and they start jumpin on and off, game by game.

To many of these folks couldn't see progress if it slapped them across their face. Lord knows fourthcrusade has it in his signitature, bolded no less, but what good does that do if they don't know squat about the past 20 years of Razorback basketball, in the first place?

I'm still waiting for folks to step up and tell me, due to the exodus of common sense after the Missouri debacle, how Florida is gonna have a worse year than Florida St. due to single upset loss on the road.

Funny how none of the haters want to touch that one.
"The supreme benevolent force of Hogville, who is impervious to pervasive form of confirmation bias, which is inherent to ALL human beings" - intelligence 4/4/16
***
I used to argue with HA about how Pel ran the basketball team.  I've since learned to like and respect him.  In fact, I'd go as far to say that HA is well connected or extremely perceptive. - Porkatarian, 11/7/12

TRUHOG718

Quote from: HawgAdvocate on December 06, 2006, 10:52:30 am
Screw it guys...nothin will change the minds of these bitter, ol' bloodthrity wolves except in mid-Januray when the bandwagon comes back around and they start jumpin on and off, game by game.

To many of these folks couldn't see progress if it slapped them across their face. Lord knows fourthcrusade has it in his signitature, bolded no less, but what good does that do if they don't know squat about the past 20 years of Razorback basketball, in the first place?

I'm still waiting for folks to step up and tell me how, due to the exodus of common sense after the Missouri debacle, Florida is gonna have a worse year than Florida St. due to single upset loss on the road.

Funny how none of the haters want to touch that one.

What he said!
http://www.sicollection.com/assets/images/nolan_richardson_300.jpg

One Day. We Will Be Back. I Promise You This.

fourthcrusade

Quote from: HawgAdvocate on December 06, 2006, 10:52:30 am
I'm still waiting for folks to step up and tell me, due to the exodus of common sense after the Missouri debacle, how Florida is gonna have a worse year than Florida St. due to single upset loss on the road.
Funny how none of the haters want to touch that one.

Exactly.  Nobody wins every game, and yet somehow the "1" in the "7-1" is grounds for firing and starting back at square one.

We lost to Mizzou after winning 7 times in a row, including winning AT mizzou a few years ago!  Under stan! GET OVER IT!

hogfan064

Quote from: HawgAdvocate on December 06, 2006, 10:52:30 am
Screw it guys...nothin will change the minds of these bitter, ol' bloodthrity wolves except in mid-Januray when the bandwagon comes back around and they start jumpin on and off, game by game.

To many of these folks couldn't see progress if it slapped them across their face. Lord knows fourthcrusade has it in his signitature, bolded no less, but what good does that do if they don't know squat about the past 20 years of Razorback basketball, in the first place?

I'm still waiting for folks to step up and tell me, due to the exodus of common sense after the Missouri debacle, how Florida is gonna have a worse year than Florida St. due to single upset loss on the road.

Funny how none of the haters want to touch that one.

I haven't touched it because I was working, but now that I got a little free time here ya go.  The Missouri loss isn't the only reason people are fired up on Heath.  Its a history of Heath losing to teams he shouldn't and a lack of a single NCAA tourney win entering year 5.  The Mizzou loss frustrates people b/c the man who beat Heath runs a style that won us a NC. 

Comparing Arkansas to Florida right now is laughable.  We all realize that every College basketball team loses games, but Heath continues to lose games he shouldn't.  Billy Donovan has been a winner since day 1 at Florida. 

Until Heath wins a NCAA game expect me and others to be upset.

fourthcrusade

Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 12:07:08 pm
Quote from: HawgAdvocate on December 06, 2006, 10:52:30 am
Screw it guys...nothin will change the minds of these bitter, ol' bloodthrity wolves except in mid-Januray when the bandwagon comes back around and they start jumpin on and off, game by game.

To many of these folks couldn't see progress if it slapped them across their face. Lord knows fourthcrusade has it in his signitature, bolded no less, but what good does that do if they don't know squat about the past 20 years of Razorback basketball, in the first place?

I'm still waiting for folks to step up and tell me, due to the exodus of common sense after the Missouri debacle, how Florida is gonna have a worse year than Florida St. due to single upset loss on the road.

Funny how none of the haters want to touch that one.

I haven't touched it because I was working, but now that I got a little free time here ya go.  The Missouri loss isn't the only reason people are fired up on Heath.  Its a history of Heath losing to teams he shouldn't and a lack of a single NCAA tourney win entering year 5.  The Mizzou loss frustrates people b/c the man who beat Heath runs a style that won us a NC. 

Comparing Arkansas to Florida right now is laughable.  We all realize that every College basketball team loses games, but Heath continues to lose games he shouldn't.  Billy Donovan has been a winner since day 1 at Florida. 

Until Heath wins a NCAA game expect me and others to be upset.

Heath went to an elite  8.  he has won 3 ncaa games

DCHawg

Quote from: hogdave on December 06, 2006, 09:06:24 am
Big Ten style basketball = boring.

That is why attendance is down, nobody wants to drive 3 hours (which my father and I did for just about every game from 1994 - 2002) and watch boring basketball.

This is my problem.  I love the game of basketball, but the way we play it  (slow and sloppy) is not fun to watch.  Seeing Hawgball being played by Mizzou conjured tears of awesome to well up in my eyes.  Either play up-tempo and run the ball or take care of it.  Doing neither is like fingernails on a chalkboard.

HawgLover08

We looked good in Orlando, but I have never seen a team play worse than we did against Mizzou.  We are going to have to be much more consistent and get good play out of everyone to make a run for the SEC.

fourthcrusade

Quote from: HawgLover08 on December 06, 2006, 12:29:35 pm
We looked good in Orlando, but I have never seen a team play worse than we did against Mizzou.

No offense, but if you really think that, then i take it that you must have only seen 1 basketball game in your life...

Pork Twain

Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 12:16:34 pm
Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 12:07:08 pm
Quote from: HawgAdvocate on December 06, 2006, 10:52:30 am
Screw it guys...nothin will change the minds of these bitter, ol' bloodthrity wolves except in mid-Januray when the bandwagon comes back around and they start jumpin on and off, game by game.

To many of these folks couldn't see progress if it slapped them across their face. Lord knows fourthcrusade has it in his signitature, bolded no less, but what good does that do if they don't know squat about the past 20 years of Razorback basketball, in the first place?

I'm still waiting for folks to step up and tell me, due to the exodus of common sense after the Missouri debacle, how Florida is gonna have a worse year than Florida St. due to single upset loss on the road.

Funny how none of the haters want to touch that one.

I haven't touched it because I was working, but now that I got a little free time here ya go.  The Missouri loss isn't the only reason people are fired up on Heath.  Its a history of Heath losing to teams he shouldn't and a lack of a single NCAA tourney win entering year 5.  The Mizzou loss frustrates people b/c the man who beat Heath runs a style that won us a NC. 

Comparing Arkansas to Florida right now is laughable.  We all realize that every College basketball team loses games, but Heath continues to lose games he shouldn't.  Billy Donovan has been a winner since day 1 at Florida. 

Until Heath wins a NCAA game expect me and others to be upset.

Heath went to an elite  8.  he has won 3 ncaa games
Nobody here really cares what SH did at another college with someone else's players in one year.  Ford won a NC at Clemson and he worked out great for us.  I agree that SH has improved every year, but it still bothers me that his teams have no identity.  What kind of team are we???  I wish he could coach half as good as he recruits.
"It is better to be an optimist and proven wrong, than a pessimist and proven right." ~Pork Twain

https://www.facebook.com/groups/sweetmemes/

 

fourthcrusade

Quote from: BeoPig on December 06, 2006, 12:35:44 pm
Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 12:16:34 pm
Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 12:07:08 pm
Quote from: HawgAdvocate on December 06, 2006, 10:52:30 am
Screw it guys...nothin will change the minds of these bitter, ol' bloodthrity wolves except in mid-Januray when the bandwagon comes back around and they start jumpin on and off, game by game.

To many of these folks couldn't see progress if it slapped them across their face. Lord knows fourthcrusade has it in his signitature, bolded no less, but what good does that do if they don't know squat about the past 20 years of Razorback basketball, in the first place?

I'm still waiting for folks to step up and tell me, due to the exodus of common sense after the Missouri debacle, how Florida is gonna have a worse year than Florida St. due to single upset loss on the road.

Funny how none of the haters want to touch that one.

I haven't touched it because I was working, but now that I got a little free time here ya go.  The Missouri loss isn't the only reason people are fired up on Heath.  Its a history of Heath losing to teams he shouldn't and a lack of a single NCAA tourney win entering year 5.  The Mizzou loss frustrates people b/c the man who beat Heath runs a style that won us a NC. 

Comparing Arkansas to Florida right now is laughable.  We all realize that every College basketball team loses games, but Heath continues to lose games he shouldn't.  Billy Donovan has been a winner since day 1 at Florida. 

Until Heath wins a NCAA game expect me and others to be upset.

Heath went to an elite  8.  he has won 3 ncaa games
Nobody here really cares what SH did at another college with someone else's players in one year.  Ford won a NC at Clemson and he worked out great for us.  I agree that SH has improved every year, but it still bothers me that his teams have no identity.  What kind of team are we???  I wish he could coach half as good as he recruits.

Already said.  Our identity is DEFENSE>

On offense, we look to pound it inside first.  We go to the big towers, or we use a guard to slash and score.  High % shots close to the bucket, crash the boards after.

DEFENSE is the key.  outside of mizzou (who hit a few last minute 3's to get their score out of the 70s), our 7 wins we have kept the opponent in the FIFTIES and SIXTIES of scoring... that's pretty good.

Steven Hill leads the Nation in BLock Percentage at 21%.

Think about that.  When STeven hill is on the floor, he blocks 1 of every 5 shots by the other team.   He is the (Statistically) most DOMINANT blocker out there.  21%.  Dang.  that's good.
 

(townes, too, with Rebounds and blocks as well, is playing at the level he needs to be playing)

*If we wouldnt turn it over like pee wee basketball we would consistently be winning 80something to 50 something, but alas, turnovers take away some of our points, soi thinkn our average ponts now is closer to like 70. 

DEFENSE DEFENSE DEFENSE is the identiy - with "look inside first" as the offensive strategy -- provided we don't turn it over in the backcourt :)

dana caldwell

i have to say that i got too giddy at 5-0 or whatever the record was after wins over SIU, marist and west virginia.

i have noticed regression since, especially the butt-whipping at mizzou.

my jury's back out.

hogfan064

Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 12:16:34 pm
Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 12:07:08 pm
Quote from: HawgAdvocate on December 06, 2006, 10:52:30 am
Screw it guys...nothin will change the minds of these bitter, ol' bloodthrity wolves except in mid-Januray when the bandwagon comes back around and they start jumpin on and off, game by game.

To many of these folks couldn't see progress if it slapped them across their face. Lord knows fourthcrusade has it in his signitature, bolded no less, but what good does that do if they don't know squat about the past 20 years of Razorback basketball, in the first place?

I'm still waiting for folks to step up and tell me, due to the exodus of common sense after the Missouri debacle, how Florida is gonna have a worse year than Florida St. due to single upset loss on the road.

Funny how none of the haters want to touch that one.

I haven't touched it because I was working, but now that I got a little free time here ya go.  The Missouri loss isn't the only reason people are fired up on Heath.  Its a history of Heath losing to teams he shouldn't and a lack of a single NCAA tourney win entering year 5.  The Mizzou loss frustrates people b/c the man who beat Heath runs a style that won us a NC. 

Comparing Arkansas to Florida right now is laughable.  We all realize that every College basketball team loses games, but Heath continues to lose games he shouldn't.  Billy Donovan has been a winner since day 1 at Florida. 

Until Heath wins a NCAA game expect me and others to be upset.

Heath went to an elite  8.  he has won 3 ncaa games

How many times do I have to state that I don't care what he did at Kent, all I care about is what he has done in 5 years at Arkansas.  Howard Snellenberger(sp?) won a NC at Miami, but did that help him win a NC at Oklahoma or Louisville?   Dave Odom won a couple ACC championships at Wake Forest and produced one of the best big men of alltime, but do you think South Carolina fans are happy with 1 NCAA appearance in 6 years?

Filthy_McSwine

Quote from: Razorzac on December 06, 2006, 09:03:45 am
I will whine that Heath is a terrible coach. Get him to start teaching fundamentals to the team and I will stop calling for his head.

You are wasting your time responding to this idiot.  He apparently thinks his opinion should be shared by everyone; anyone who disagrees is wrong.  He also does not understand that one can love the Hogs, but not be happy with the coaching, or lack of.




HawgAdvocate

Quote
I haven't touched it because I was working, but now that I got a little free time here ya go.  The Missouri loss isn't the only reason people are fired up on Heath.  Its a history of Heath losing to teams he shouldn't and a lack of a single NCAA tourney win entering year 5.  The Mizzou loss frustrates people b/c the man who beat Heath runs a style that won us a NC. 

Comparing Arkansas to Florida right now is laughable.  We all realize that every College basketball team loses games, but Heath continues to lose games he shouldn't.  Billy Donovan has been a winner since day 1 at Florida. 

Until Heath wins a NCAA game expect me and others to be upset.

No, it's not laughable. People are throwing in the towell, declaring "FIRE HEATH" after one road loss, despite being one of the golden children of college basketball for the week following the Old Spice Tourney. We had sports writers all over the country hyping us for SEC play.

If we can lose one game, and people claim we're "HORRIBLE," then why not say the same about Florida, who we BEAT last year? They lost one game to a lesser team, but i don't see mass hysteria there.

"history of Heath losing to teams he shouldn't"

Every team gets upset, just like every team beats others who they weren't supposed to. Arkansas isn't immune. We've beaten quite a few teams we weren't supposed to beat. You ever heard of the phrase "any given Sunday" when it comes to football? It means the same in all sports.

On top of that, look at all the close games we lost last year due to horrid FT shooting. Well, Heath has worked to help the team improve in that area, so hey, whaddya know...wouldn't that deserve some praise and/or hope for a possible upswing in results? Heaven forbid you look at the positives.

That "style" you're talking about is NOT what got us the NC. A fantastic mix of half-cout offense and full court defense got us the NC. You think Corey Beck played the same style as Kareem Reid or Squeaky Johnson from UAB? Nolan couldn't/wouldn't recruit the low post presences after 1996 that are so important to a half-court offense. So what did we do? We ran street ball, and we either won big, or lost big. We had a pathetic half court offense that couldn't score in clutch to save our lives. We had athletes who weren't basketball players. The majority of our guys were so one-dimensional that they couldn't hit 40% FG shooting if they were within 10 feet from the hoop.

You should be happy we took a bunch of Sunbelt players (Satchell, Lane, Baker, Gomez) and turned the ship around in 4 years to actually make the tournament last year. Honestly, if we had beat Bucknell by 2, and lost by 10 to Memphis last year, I guarantee you that this silly nonsense would live on.
"The supreme benevolent force of Hogville, who is impervious to pervasive form of confirmation bias, which is inherent to ALL human beings" - intelligence 4/4/16
***
I used to argue with HA about how Pel ran the basketball team.  I've since learned to like and respect him.  In fact, I'd go as far to say that HA is well connected or extremely perceptive. - Porkatarian, 11/7/12

HawgAdvocate

Quote
How many times do I have to state that I don't care what he did at Kent, all I care about is what he has done in 5 years at Arkansas.  Howard Snellenberger(sp?) won a NC at Miami, but did that help him win a NC at Oklahoma or Louisville?   Dave Odom won a couple ACC championships at Wake Forest and produced one of the best big men of alltime, but do you think South Carolina fans are happy with 1 NCAA appearance in 6 years?

But you all seem to care about what Mike Anderson has done at other schools. Hypocrisy.
"The supreme benevolent force of Hogville, who is impervious to pervasive form of confirmation bias, which is inherent to ALL human beings" - intelligence 4/4/16
***
I used to argue with HA about how Pel ran the basketball team.  I've since learned to like and respect him.  In fact, I'd go as far to say that HA is well connected or extremely perceptive. - Porkatarian, 11/7/12

HogPsych

They're terrible.  Poorly coached, undiscilplined on the court, no half court offense, often don't play hard, and horrible to watch.  I just gave up my season tickets.  How about that?

HawgWyld

Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 07:40:43 am
At this rate, we will win 30 games and go to the final four.

Hope you're right. Hell, nothing would please me more than to see Stan Heath pull off a great year. He's a classy guy and I'd love to see him turn this team into a contender.

fourthcrusade

Quote from: HogPsych on December 06, 2006, 01:01:46 pm
They're terrible.  Poorly coached, undiscilplined on the court, no half court offense, often don't play hard, and horrible to watch.  I just gave up my season tickets.  How about that?

You said 7 things.  The only thing i agree with is the last one.

P.S. i am talking about the part where you said you gave up your tickets....

HawgWyld

Quote from: TRUHOG718 on December 06, 2006, 09:08:56 am
Before we lost in football saturday most basketball posts were positive. I guess the darksiders remembered we actually have a B-Ball team now so the hate has migrated over....   
:puke: welcome glad to have ya.

Hey, not all of us. It's hard to dislike Stan Heath, so I'm more than willing to cut him some slack.

Now, that jerky Houston, on the other hand...

hogfan064

Quote from: HawgAdvocate on December 06, 2006, 12:59:00 pm
Quote
How many times do I have to state that I don't care what he did at Kent, all I care about is what he has done in 5 years at Arkansas.  Howard Snellenberger(sp?) won a NC at Miami, but did that help him win a NC at Oklahoma or Louisville?   Dave Odom won a couple ACC championships at Wake Forest and produced one of the best big men of alltime, but do you think South Carolina fans are happy with 1 NCAA appearance in 6 years?

But you all seem to care about what Mike Anderson has done at other schools. Hypocrisy.

I only bring Mike Anderson up to state he outcoached Heath last week.  The only reason I even bring that up is because the author of this thread brought up Anderson.  I only care about Arkansas and I want us to win another NC just like you do, but I honestly can't see Stan Heath ever winning a NC or even a SEC CHampionship for us. If you do then that's your opinion and you have a right to it, but some of you Heath Huggers don't want others to give an opinion that isn't the same as yours.   

And as I have said on numerous occasions, I want Heath to do well b/c he seems like a good guy, but I just don't think he's going to do it.  I hope I'm wrong, but I doubt I am.

Pork Twain

Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 12:42:29 pm
Quote from: BeoPig on December 06, 2006, 12:35:44 pm
Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 12:16:34 pm
Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 12:07:08 pm
Quote from: HawgAdvocate on December 06, 2006, 10:52:30 am
Screw it guys...nothin will change the minds of these bitter, ol' bloodthrity wolves except in mid-Januray when the bandwagon comes back around and they start jumpin on and off, game by game.

To many of these folks couldn't see progress if it slapped them across their face. Lord knows fourthcrusade has it in his signitature, bolded no less, but what good does that do if they don't know squat about the past 20 years of Razorback basketball, in the first place?

I'm still waiting for folks to step up and tell me, due to the exodus of common sense after the Missouri debacle, how Florida is gonna have a worse year than Florida St. due to single upset loss on the road.

Funny how none of the haters want to touch that one.

I haven't touched it because I was working, but now that I got a little free time here ya go.  The Missouri loss isn't the only reason people are fired up on Heath.  Its a history of Heath losing to teams he shouldn't and a lack of a single NCAA tourney win entering year 5.  The Mizzou loss frustrates people b/c the man who beat Heath runs a style that won us a NC. 

Comparing Arkansas to Florida right now is laughable.  We all realize that every College basketball team loses games, but Heath continues to lose games he shouldn't.  Billy Donovan has been a winner since day 1 at Florida. 

Until Heath wins a NCAA game expect me and others to be upset.

Heath went to an elite  8.  he has won 3 ncaa games
Nobody here really cares what SH did at another college with someone else's players in one year.  Ford won a NC at Clemson and he worked out great for us.  I agree that SH has improved every year, but it still bothers me that his teams have no identity.  What kind of team are we???  I wish he could coach half as good as he recruits.

Already said.  Our identity is DEFENSE>

On offense, we look to pound it inside first.  We go to the big towers, or we use a guard to slash and score.  High % shots close to the bucket, crash the boards after.

DEFENSE is the key.  outside of mizzou (who hit a few last minute 3's to get their score out of the 70s), our 7 wins we have kept the opponent in the FIFTIES and SIXTIES of scoring... that's pretty good.

Steven Hill leads the Nation in BLock Percentage at 21%.

Think about that.  When STeven hill is on the floor, he blocks 1 of every 5 shots by the other team.   He is the (Statistically) most DOMINANT blocker out there.  21%.  Dang.  that's good.
 

(townes, too, with Rebounds and blocks as well, is playing at the level he needs to be playing)

*If we wouldnt turn it over like pee wee basketball we would consistently be winning 80something to 50 something, but alas, turnovers take away some of our points, soi thinkn our average ponts now is closer to like 70. 

DEFENSE DEFENSE DEFENSE is the identiy - with "look inside first" as the offensive strategy -- provided we don't turn it over in the backcourt :)
I would love to know how you calculated blocking %.

Since Central Michigan attempted 53 shots that would mean that SH had like 11 blocks???  I think you need to take that one back to the drawing board and he is 3rd in the SEC in blocked shots.  I love what he does for us but try not to blow it out of proportion.  That costs you credibility with everyone on here.

My point was that with Nolan we all knew what kind team we have and there was no doubt.  With Stan is seems to be fluid and we have no real identity.  So we play good defense and work the ball inside slow and methodical.  If that is the case we cannot afford careless mistakes.
"It is better to be an optimist and proven wrong, than a pessimist and proven right." ~Pork Twain

https://www.facebook.com/groups/sweetmemes/

hogfan064

Quote from: BeoPig on December 06, 2006, 01:09:22 pm
Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 12:42:29 pm
Quote from: BeoPig on December 06, 2006, 12:35:44 pm
Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 12:16:34 pm
Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 12:07:08 pm
Quote from: HawgAdvocate on December 06, 2006, 10:52:30 am
Screw it guys...nothin will change the minds of these bitter, ol' bloodthrity wolves except in mid-Januray when the bandwagon comes back around and they start jumpin on and off, game by game.

To many of these folks couldn't see progress if it slapped them across their face. Lord knows fourthcrusade has it in his signitature, bolded no less, but what good does that do if they don't know squat about the past 20 years of Razorback basketball, in the first place?

I'm still waiting for folks to step up and tell me, due to the exodus of common sense after the Missouri debacle, how Florida is gonna have a worse year than Florida St. due to single upset loss on the road.

Funny how none of the haters want to touch that one.

I haven't touched it because I was working, but now that I got a little free time here ya go.  The Missouri loss isn't the only reason people are fired up on Heath.  Its a history of Heath losing to teams he shouldn't and a lack of a single NCAA tourney win entering year 5.  The Mizzou loss frustrates people b/c the man who beat Heath runs a style that won us a NC. 

Comparing Arkansas to Florida right now is laughable.  We all realize that every College basketball team loses games, but Heath continues to lose games he shouldn't.  Billy Donovan has been a winner since day 1 at Florida. 

Until Heath wins a NCAA game expect me and others to be upset.

Heath went to an elite  8.  he has won 3 ncaa games
Nobody here really cares what SH did at another college with someone else's players in one year.  Ford won a NC at Clemson and he worked out great for us.  I agree that SH has improved every year, but it still bothers me that his teams have no identity.  What kind of team are we???  I wish he could coach half as good as he recruits.

Already said.  Our identity is DEFENSE>

On offense, we look to pound it inside first.  We go to the big towers, or we use a guard to slash and score.  High % shots close to the bucket, crash the boards after.

DEFENSE is the key.  outside of mizzou (who hit a few last minute 3's to get their score out of the 70s), our 7 wins we have kept the opponent in the FIFTIES and SIXTIES of scoring... that's pretty good.

Steven Hill leads the Nation in BLock Percentage at 21%.

Think about that.  When STeven hill is on the floor, he blocks 1 of every 5 shots by the other team.   He is the (Statistically) most DOMINANT blocker out there.  21%.  Dang.  that's good.
 

(townes, too, with Rebounds and blocks as well, is playing at the level he needs to be playing)

*If we wouldnt turn it over like pee wee basketball we would consistently be winning 80something to 50 something, but alas, turnovers take away some of our points, soi thinkn our average ponts now is closer to like 70. 

DEFENSE DEFENSE DEFENSE is the identiy - with "look inside first" as the offensive strategy -- provided we don't turn it over in the backcourt :)
I would love to know how you calculated blocking %.

Since Central Michigan attempted 53 shots that would mean that SH had like 11 blocks???

My point was that with Nolan we all knew what kind team we have and there was no doubt.  With Stan is seems to be fluid and we have no real identity.  So we play good defense and work the ball inside slow and methodical.  If that is the case we cannot afford careless mistakes.

Hill wasn't on the floor for all of those shots though.  For example if CMU attempted 20 shots while Hill was on the floor and Hill blocked 5 of them then Hill blocked 25% of those shots.

fourthcrusade

Quote from: BeoPig on December 06, 2006, 01:09:22 pm
I would love to know how you calculated blocking %.

Since Central Michigan attempted 53 shots that would mean that SH had like 11 blocks???

My point was that with Nolan we all knew what kind team we have and there was no doubt.  With Stan is seems to be fluid and we have no real identity.  So we play good defense and work the ball inside slow and methodical.  If that is the case we cannot afford careless mistakes.

"WHEN STEVEN HILL IS ON THE FLOOR"

http://kenpom.com/leaders.php?c=PctBlocks

HawgAdvocate

Quote
I only bring Mike Anderson up to state he outcoached Heath last week.  The only reason I even bring that up is because the author of this thread brought up Anderson.  I only care about Arkansas and I want us to win another NC just like you do, but I honestly can't see Stan Heath ever winning a NC or even a SEC CHampionship for us. If you do then that's your opinion and you have a right to it, but some of you Heath Huggers don't want others to give an opinion that isn't the same as yours.  


No, no, don't get it twisted. I don't mind people doubting Heath won't win an NC or SEC title. But I won't agree for one second when people scream "FIRE HEATH" or "we're HORRIBLE" when every statistiic says otherwise.

A lot of folks are trying to say we dont have fundamentals, we suck after 4+ years, Mike Anderson would have done better with our old style, yada yada yada... it's unintelligent nonsense that has brought out the realists on here who are gracious enough to remind you that progress IS INDEED being made.
"The supreme benevolent force of Hogville, who is impervious to pervasive form of confirmation bias, which is inherent to ALL human beings" - intelligence 4/4/16
***
I used to argue with HA about how Pel ran the basketball team.  I've since learned to like and respect him.  In fact, I'd go as far to say that HA is well connected or extremely perceptive. - Porkatarian, 11/7/12

hogfan064

Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 01:11:11 pm
Quote from: BeoPig on December 06, 2006, 01:09:22 pm
I would love to know how you calculated blocking %.

Since Central Michigan attempted 53 shots that would mean that SH had like 11 blocks???

My point was that with Nolan we all knew what kind team we have and there was no doubt.  With Stan is seems to be fluid and we have no real identity.  So we play good defense and work the ball inside slow and methodical.  If that is the case we cannot afford careless mistakes.

"WHEN STEVEN HILL IS ON THE FLOOR", dear

http://kenpom.com/leaders.php?c=PctBlocks

dear?   

StanNutt

Stan's an average coach with an average team.  Brewer made them above average.  I'm sure some SEC athletic teams watched our point guard play against Mizzou.  Sign of things to come.

hogfan064

Quote from: HawgAdvocate on December 06, 2006, 01:12:33 pm
Quote
I only bring Mike Anderson up to state he outcoached Heath last week.  The only reason I even bring that up is because the author of this thread brought up Anderson.  I only care about Arkansas and I want us to win another NC just like you do, but I honestly can't see Stan Heath ever winning a NC or even a SEC CHampionship for us. If you do then that's your opinion and you have a right to it, but some of you Heath Huggers don't want others to give an opinion that isn't the same as yours.  


No, no, don't get it twisted. I don't mind people doubting Heath won't win an NC or SEC title. But I won't agree for one second when people scream "FIRE HEATH" or "we're HORRIBLE" when every statistiic says otherwise.

A lot of folks are trying to say we dont have fundamentals, we suck after 4+ years, Mike Anderson would have done better with our old style, yada yada yada... it's unintelligent nonsense that has brought out the realists on here who are gracious enough to remind you that progress IS INDEED being made.


IMO Mike Anderson is a better coach than Heath and in one head to head meeting he proved it.  You can compare all the records and stats between the 2 that you want, but with at best equal talent Anderson beat Heath.   Never have I said our team is horrible or anything like that.  I just feel our program is very stale right now and is becoming nothing more than another South Carolina, that is a competetive team that plays good defense, but never accomplishes anything major.

fourthcrusade

Quote from: StanNutt on December 06, 2006, 01:14:17 pm
Stan's an average coach with an average team.  Brewer made them above average.  I'm sure some SEC athletic teams watched our point guard play against Mizzou.  Sign of things to come.


Brewer was great, but his general refusal to play point (stan's request), wanting to play wingman (daddy's request) to show range for NBA was a cancer, and caused the Dontell Jefferson Project.

Pork Twain

Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 01:10:52 pm
Quote from: BeoPig on December 06, 2006, 01:09:22 pm
Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 12:42:29 pm
Quote from: BeoPig on December 06, 2006, 12:35:44 pm
Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 12:16:34 pm
Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 12:07:08 pm
Quote from: HawgAdvocate on December 06, 2006, 10:52:30 am
Screw it guys...nothin will change the minds of these bitter, ol' bloodthrity wolves except in mid-Januray when the bandwagon comes back around and they start jumpin on and off, game by game.

To many of these folks couldn't see progress if it slapped them across their face. Lord knows fourthcrusade has it in his signitature, bolded no less, but what good does that do if they don't know squat about the past 20 years of Razorback basketball, in the first place?

I'm still waiting for folks to step up and tell me, due to the exodus of common sense after the Missouri debacle, how Florida is gonna have a worse year than Florida St. due to single upset loss on the road.

Funny how none of the haters want to touch that one.

I haven't touched it because I was working, but now that I got a little free time here ya go.  The Missouri loss isn't the only reason people are fired up on Heath.  Its a history of Heath losing to teams he shouldn't and a lack of a single NCAA tourney win entering year 5.  The Mizzou loss frustrates people b/c the man who beat Heath runs a style that won us a NC. 

Comparing Arkansas to Florida right now is laughable.  We all realize that every College basketball team loses games, but Heath continues to lose games he shouldn't.  Billy Donovan has been a winner since day 1 at Florida. 

Until Heath wins a NCAA game expect me and others to be upset.

Heath went to an elite  8.  he has won 3 ncaa games
Nobody here really cares what SH did at another college with someone else's players in one year.  Ford won a NC at Clemson and he worked out great for us.  I agree that SH has improved every year, but it still bothers me that his teams have no identity.  What kind of team are we???  I wish he could coach half as good as he recruits.

Already said.  Our identity is DEFENSE>

On offense, we look to pound it inside first.  We go to the big towers, or we use a guard to slash and score.  High % shots close to the bucket, crash the boards after.

DEFENSE is the key.  outside of mizzou (who hit a few last minute 3's to get their score out of the 70s), our 7 wins we have kept the opponent in the FIFTIES and SIXTIES of scoring... that's pretty good.

Steven Hill leads the Nation in BLock Percentage at 21%.

Think about that.  When STeven hill is on the floor, he blocks 1 of every 5 shots by the other team.   He is the (Statistically) most DOMINANT blocker out there.  21%.  Dang.  that's good.
 

(townes, too, with Rebounds and blocks as well, is playing at the level he needs to be playing)

*If we wouldnt turn it over like pee wee basketball we would consistently be winning 80something to 50 something, but alas, turnovers take away some of our points, soi thinkn our average ponts now is closer to like 70. 

DEFENSE DEFENSE DEFENSE is the identiy - with "look inside first" as the offensive strategy -- provided we don't turn it over in the backcourt :)
I would love to know how you calculated blocking %.

Since Central Michigan attempted 53 shots that would mean that SH had like 11 blocks???

My point was that with Nolan we all knew what kind team we have and there was no doubt.  With Stan is seems to be fluid and we have no real identity.  So we play good defense and work the ball inside slow and methodical.  If that is the case we cannot afford careless mistakes.

Hill wasn't on the floor for all of those shots though.  For example if CMU attempted 20 shots while Hill was on the floor and Hill blocked 5 of them then Hill blocked 25% of those shots.
Got it now thanks
"It is better to be an optimist and proven wrong, than a pessimist and proven right." ~Pork Twain

https://www.facebook.com/groups/sweetmemes/

HawgAdvocate

Quote
IMO Mike Anderson is a better coach than Heath and in one head to head meeting he proved it.  You can compare all the records and stats between the 2 that you want, but with at best equal talent Anderson beat Heath.   Never have I said our team is horrible or anything like that.  I just feel our program is very stale right now and is becoming nothing more than another South Carolina, that is a competetive team that plays good defense, but never accomplishes anything major.

I guess you have your standards and I have mine. But had that game been in Fayetteville, I think it would have a very different game.
"The supreme benevolent force of Hogville, who is impervious to pervasive form of confirmation bias, which is inherent to ALL human beings" - intelligence 4/4/16
***
I used to argue with HA about how Pel ran the basketball team.  I've since learned to like and respect him.  In fact, I'd go as far to say that HA is well connected or extremely perceptive. - Porkatarian, 11/7/12

StanNutt

Quote from: fourthcrusade on December 06, 2006, 01:16:02 pm
Quote from: StanNutt on December 06, 2006, 01:14:17 pm
Stan's an average coach with an average team.  Brewer made them above average.  I'm sure some SEC athletic teams watched our point guard play against Mizzou.  Sign of things to come.


Nice post


Brewer was great, but his general refusal to play point (stan's request), wanting to play wingman (daddy's request) to show range for NBA was a cancer, and caused the Dontell Jefferson Project.

hogfan064

Quote from: HawgAdvocate on December 06, 2006, 01:18:55 pm
Quote
IMO Mike Anderson is a better coach than Heath and in one head to head meeting he proved it.  You can compare all the records and stats between the 2 that you want, but with at best equal talent Anderson beat Heath.   Never have I said our team is horrible or anything like that.  I just feel our program is very stale right now and is becoming nothing more than another South Carolina, that is a competetive team that plays good defense, but never accomplishes anything major.

I guess you have your standards and I have mine. But had that game been in Fayetteville, I think it would have a very different game.

I'll agree with that, but Fayetteville has always been a huge homefield advantage.  If you read all my posts about Heath my biggest concern is his road record against average to great competition.  If he wins in Mississippi last year we go 12-4 in SEC play and are likely a 5 seed or higher in the tourney.  Those 2 losses killed us.   Those kind of losses can't continue to happen.  If they do then Heath will be gone. 

fourthcrusade

Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 01:22:56 pm
Quote from: HawgAdvocate on December 06, 2006, 01:18:55 pm
Quote
IMO Mike Anderson is a better coach than Heath and in one head to head meeting he proved it.  You can compare all the records and stats between the 2 that you want, but with at best equal talent Anderson beat Heath.   Never have I said our team is horrible or anything like that.  I just feel our program is very stale right now and is becoming nothing more than another South Carolina, that is a competetive team that plays good defense, but never accomplishes anything major.

I guess you have your standards and I have mine. But had that game been in Fayetteville, I think it would have a very different game.

I'll agree with that, but Fayetteville has always been a huge homefield advantage.  If you read all my posts about Heath my biggest concern is his road record against average to great competition.  If he wins in Mississippi last year we go 12-4 in SEC play and are likely a 5 seed or higher in the tourney.  Those 2 losses killed us.   Those kind of losses can't continue to happen.  If they do then Heath will be gone. 

I agree 1000% with that statement about the seedings, the Ole miss loss KILLED US, though i think he's still here at 10-6, because 10-6 gets us in the NCAAt

But i say 11-5 - 13-3 is the range, losing @bama and @lsu for sure

hoghug

Quote from: hogfan064 on December 06, 2006, 01:15:14 pm
Quote from: HawgAdvocate on December 06, 2006, 01:12:33 pm
Quote
I only bring Mike Anderson up to state he outcoached Heath last week.  The only reason I even bring that up is because the author of this thread brought up Anderson.  I only care about Arkansas and I want us to win another NC just like you do, but I honestly can't see Stan Heath ever winning a NC or even a SEC CHampionship for us. If you do then that's your opinion and you have a right to it, but some of you Heath Huggers don't want others to give an opinion that isn't the same as yours.  


No, no, don't get it twisted. I don't mind people doubting Heath won't win an NC or SEC title. But I won't agree for one second when people scream "FIRE HEATH" or "we're HORRIBLE" when every statistiic says otherwise.

A lot of folks are trying to say we dont have fundamentals, we suck after 4+ years, Mike Anderson would have done better with our old style, yada yada yada... it's unintelligent nonsense that has brought out the realists on here who are gracious enough to remind you that progress IS INDEED being made.


IMO Mike Anderson is a better coach than Heath and in one head to head meeting he proved it.  You can compare all the records and stats between the 2 that you want, but with at best equal talent Anderson beat Heath.   Never have I said our team is horrible or anything like that.  I just feel our program is very stale right now and is becoming nothing more than another South Carolina, that is a competetive team that plays good defense, but never accomplishes anything major.

So one head to head meeting PROVEd that Anderson is better than heath?  Well, I guess since Sylvester Croom is 1-1 against Urban Meyer that he is an equal coach?  THat makes no sense.

Alot of the dislike for Heath goes back to a question I posed this morning, is winning or excitement more important to fans?  If Heath had the exact same record, but played the " 40 minutes of hell" style I think most people would be supporting him.

fourthcrusade

Quote from: hoghug on December 06, 2006, 01:26:56 pm
So one head to head meeting PROVEd that Anderson is better than heath?  Well, I guess since Sylvester Croom is 1-1 against Urban Meyer that he is an equal coach?  THat makes no sense.

Alot of the dislike for Heath goes back to a question I posed this morning, is winning or excitement more important to fans?  If Heath had the exact same record, but played the " 40 minutes of hell" style I think most people would be supporting him.

If heath had the same record, but threw chairs/towels/pets onto the court while screaming "F#$%" every 30 seconds and ripping his shirt off, then the posters on this thread would love him beyond belief.  Too bad high school players' parents wouldn't. :(