Manny Watkins

[-Blu]

I haven't heard anybody talk about Manny yet, but looks like he's played himself into the rotation.  At first when I seen him starting to get playing time, I was hoping it wasn't one of those situations, where's CMA was being nice because Coach Watkins is on staff.  But that's clearly not that case, the kid can play. 

I made sure to watch him today, and he was very impressive.  He's probably our best on ball defender as a guard right now, brings a ton of energy, he can attack the rim, and he doesn't make bad decisions with the ball.  From observing the past couple of games, looks like he'll be the second guard off the bench behind Durham.  I'm curious to see how he's going to do against tougher opponents, but so far I'm impressed and surprised by his performances.

[Swinesong1]

I haven't heard anybody talk about Manny yet, but looks like he's played himself into the rotation.  At first when I seen him starting to get playing time, I was hoping it wasn't one of those situations, where's CMA was being nice because Coach Watkins is on staff.  But that's clearly not that case, the kid can play. 

I made sure to watch him today, and he was very impressive.  He's probably our best on ball defender as a guard right now, brings a ton of energy, he can attack the rim, and he doesn't make bad decisions with the ball.  From observing the past couple of games, looks like he'll be the second guard off the bench behind Durham.  I'm curious to see how he's going to do against tougher opponents, but so far I'm impressed and surprised by his performances.

So he's ahead of Beard?

[-Blu]

So he's ahead of Beard?

From what I've seen.  Now, this is just going off of the second half of first exhibition, and the exhibition game today.

Starters...

Madden
Bell
Qualls
Harris
Portis


Durham is first guard off bench, he comes in for either Madden or Bell.
Williams comes in for Harris.
Kingsley comes in for Portis.
Watkins comes in for Qualls.
Beard comes in for either Madden or Bell after Durham is already in.
Miles comes in for either Kingsley or Williams.

Babb and Thompson have been playing, but usually after everyone else has played.  I think they'll be the odd men out of the rotation.

[Atlhogfan1]

Maybe Watkins can provide some of the same steady play Gulley did last season just in much less than the 18 mpg Gulley had to play.

That seems like a small second unit Blu especially Miles for Williams or Kingsley if Mike substitutes "platoon" style leaving all starters out.
Beard, Durham, Watkins - 6-0, 6-1, 6-3 

[opineonswine]

He definitely played good defense last night.

[-Blu]

Maybe Watkins can provide some of the same steady play Gulley did last season just in much less than the 18 mpg Gulley had to play.

That seems like a small second unit Blu especially Miles for Williams or Kingsley if Mike substitutes "platoon" style leaving all starters out.
Beard, Durham, Watkins - 6-0, 6-1, 6-3

Yea that second unit looks like it's running 3 guards.  But, Kingsley and Williams are good rebounders and rim protectors, they'll be alright.  But, you know with CMA nothing is ever that simple, I'm sure we'll see some big lineups as well, where he may have Williams at the 3 then Portis and Kingsley in together.  Then you may see Miles at the 3 some as well. 

But, from what I seen it's pretty clear right now who's where in the rotation.  I'm surprised to see Keaton Miles as the 11th man.  But, you really can't argue it, because Williams is just playing amazing right now, and Manny Watkins is a better ball handler, distributor, shooter, and can get in the lane better being a 6'3 guard.  Miles really doesn't have the ball handling or shooting to play full time at the 3 position.  But, he's such an great athlete and defender they'll find a way to get him on the floor.

[jry04]

I may be wrong, but i was under the impression that we will redshirt him this year.

[mhuff]

I am glad to see Manny play well. I would love to see some stats from last night's game. You have to remember that it was an exhibition game that everyone was getting to play. Plus MA wanted to look at different combinations.

You mentioned Williams is playing well. I want to look at the percentages. I remember him missing 2 or 3 in a row. I just want to make sure he didn't shoot a bad percentage. I am proud of his metamorphosis ,but players that shoot 30 times and make 8 or 9 are not on my favorites list. It excites me that his game is coming on. Last year near the end of the season MA and he had words ,and I thought he might sulk and be gone. He has hitched up his pants and is showing great promise. Keep it up Jacorey...you only get to play once.

[GuvHog]

From what I've seen.  Now, this is just going off of the second half of first exhibition, and the exhibition game today.

Starters...

Madden
Bell
Qualls
Harris
Portis


Durham is first guard off bench, he comes in for either Madden or Bell.
Williams comes in for Harris.
Kingsley comes in for Portis.
Watkins comes in for Qualls.
Beard comes in for either Madden or Bell after Durham is already in.
Miles comes in for either Kingsley or Williams.

Babb and Thompson have been playing, but usually after everyone else has played.  I think they'll be the odd men out of the rotation.

After the way Moses played in the second half last night, I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him starting with Portis Sunday afternoon, he really dominated in the lane on both ends of the floor.

[onebadrubi]

My observation on Watkins is he is GREAT mike Anderson depth in this guard rotation.  He carries himself very well on te bench, almost leader like (too young and unearned to label him a leader yet).  I was at the red/white and was shocked by his play, but chaulks it up as playing against common opponents (scrimmages).  Glad to hear he's still impressing. 

I'm not real sure what position you rotate him in with though?  Am I wrong thinking his game just doesn't fit any position great but almost anywhere between a 1-3?

[PonderinHog]

I am glad to see Manny play well. I would love to see some stats from last night's game. You have to remember that it was an exhibition game that everyone was getting to play. Plus MA wanted to look at different combinations.

You mentioned Williams is playing well. I want to look at the percentages. I remember him missing 2 or 3 in a row. I just want to make sure he didn't shoot a bad percentage. I am proud of his metamorphosis ,but players that shoot 30 times and make 8 or 9 are not on my favorites list. It excites me that his game is coming on. Last year near the end of the season MA and he had words ,and I thought he might sulk and be gone. He has hitched up his pants and is showing great promise. Keep it up Jacorey...you only get to play once.

Jacorey was 6/9, 13 points in 16 minutes. not bad

http://www.arkansasrazorbacks.com/game-center/54135ab1e4b0086459ee3fbe/#/

[labb]

So that makes Williams 13 out of 18 in these two games. That puts him at 72.2%. Pretty good for a guy that can't shoot.

[HawgAdvocate]

After the way Moses played in the second half last night, I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him starting with Portis Sunday afternoon, he really dominated in the lane on both ends of the floor.

That would require putting Portis out on the perimeter to start our half-court offense. Not likely to happen.

[mhuff]

Jacorey was 6/9, 13 points in 16 minutes. not bad

http://www.arkansasrazorbacks.com/game-center/54135ab1e4b0086459ee3fbe/#/

Thanks Ponderin, you are always so pensive and sagacious. Where are you getting the stats big guy.... I looked around and found nothing. Those stats are great on Williams. The 2 or 3 misses by him that I heard were about it......
I really want to see who missed all the FT's.

[PonderinHog]

Thanks Ponderin, you are always so pensive and sagacious. Where are you getting the stats big guy.... I looked around and found nothing. Those stats are great on Williams. The 2 or 3 misses by him that I heard were about it......
I really want to see who missed all the FT's.

Does the link that I provided not work, mhuff?

[mhuff]

So that makes Williams 13 out of 18 in these two games. That puts him at 72.2%. Pretty good for a guy that can't shoot.

Stats are naturally skewed at this point. I bet he does not average that for the season..... no one would. But I give him credit again as this is a definite improvement from the .398 of  last year. Hey wouldn't you settle for 45 or 46% shooting % for the season and 70% FT %? I would, especially if his TO's go down.

Exhibition stats aren't part of season stats are they?

[mhuff]

Does the link that I provided not work, mhuff?

Asleep at the wheel. Sorry ..... thanks

[-Blu]

My observation on Watkins is he is GREAT mike Anderson depth in this guard rotation.  He carries himself very well on te bench, almost leader like (too young and unearned to label him a leader yet).  I was at the red/white and was shocked by his play, but chaulks it up as playing against common opponents (scrimmages).  Glad to hear he's still impressing. 

I'm not real sure what position you rotate him in with though?  Am I wrong thinking his game just doesn't fit any position great but almost anywhere between a 1-3?

Yea he can play the 1-3 position.  I've seen him handle the ball a lot in the exhibitions and red/white, so I think staff is comfortable with him playing some 1 as well.  Kinda like how Kikko was last year.  And don't get me wrong I don't think Watkins is a 15 MPG player, but I think he'll play Kikko Haydar type minutes to bring energy off the bench.

[onebadrubi]

That would require putting Portis out on the perimeter to start our half-court offense. Not likely to happen.

Gosh I hate sounding like I'm on Guv's side, but I'm not picking up what your laying down.  Why couldn't Portis take the 4 and Kingsley the 5?  Because Harris is a locked starter is your reason, in guessing?  What about duraham, madden, Qualls?  Don't like that lineup?

[HawgAdvocate]

Gosh I hate sounding like I'm on Guv's side, but I'm not picking up what your laying down.  Why couldn't Portis take the 4 and Kingsley the 5?  Because Harris is a locked starter is your reason, in guessing?  What about duraham, madden, Qualls?  Don't like that lineup?

In the half court, we primarily run a 4-out 1-in motion. Last season, you recall Clarke taking a lot of perimeter jumpers, correct? That's not where we want Portis to be taking shots from. We prefer a less crowded interior.

[RazorAg]

In the half court, we primarily run a 4-out 1-in motion. Last season, you recall Clarke taking a lot of perimeter jumpers, correct? That's not where we want Portis to be taking shots from. We prefer a less crowded interior.

The motion offense is liberal enough to where we can adjust pretty easily to a more traditional motion instead of the 4 out 1 in.  As we all know, Portis is comfortable as a stretch forward on the perimeter.  I'm a believer that it would be a good move.

I think Mike is more worried about post depth, and that's why he plays Moses and Portis separately a lot.

[HawgAdvocate]

The motion offense is liberal enough to where we can adjust pretty easily to a more traditional motion instead of the 4 out 1 in.  As we all know, Portis is comfortable as a stretch forward on the perimeter.  I'm a believer that it would be a good move.

I think Mike is more worried about post depth, and that's why he plays Moses and Portis separately a lot.

You are right about the flexibility of the motion, and our interior depth is certainly questionable at this stage. Perhaps MA will eventually change it up later on in the year. BP/MK should certainly be more effective in conference play than AH/BP should be.

[mhuff]

The motion offense is liberal enough to where we can adjust pretty easily to a more traditional motion instead of the 4 out 1 in.  As we all know, Portis is comfortable as a stretch forward on the perimeter.  I'm a believer that it would be a good move.

I think Mike is more worried about post depth, and that's why he plays Moses and Portis separately a lot.

I thought that MA was afraid of post depth as well. However, with all the losses on the road, why have a weaker lineup when you could have a stronger one? We all know how last year turned out ,and poor player management was only a part of the problem. You need to put your best foot forward whether you are winning or not. I always liked winning and sometimes you gotta gamble. I mean we would like to go to the NCAA's before the turn of the century. Why not take a shot ?  We have Thompson now. There is no excuse.

[nextlevel]

I thought that MA was afraid of post depth as well. However, with all the losses on the road, why have a weaker lineup when you could have a stronger one? We all know how last year turned out ,and poor player management was only a part of the problem. You need to put your best foot forward whether you are winning or not. I always liked winning and sometimes you gotta gamble. I mean we would like to go to the NCAA's before the turn of the century. Why not take a shot ?  We have Thompson now. There is no excuse.

What factual data do you have that shows Portis/Kingsley  followed by Harris/Williams rotation is better than Portis/Harris followed by Kingsley/Williams.

Its it the huge drop off in size that makes you think it will work out best over all?

Is it having two in the game at the same time who had trouble with always hustling back to defend the rim after a made basket on the court at the same time?

Or is it But they tall?

[mhuff]

What factual data do you have that shows Portis/Kingsley  followed by Harris/Williams rotation is better than Portis/Harris followed by Kingsley/Williams.
Its it the huge drop off in size that makes you think it will work out best over all?

Is it having two in the game at the same time who had trouble with always hustling back to defend the rim after a made basket on the court at the same time?

Or is it But they tall?

Nextlevel, it is the stats that tell the tale. It is the announcers who know the game of BB that keep suggesting them together. It is my humble opinion that has seen both play for 4 or more years. It is their having won a national championship while playing on the Wings. It is Sports Illustrated touting Kingsley and his ability. Last year they both got down the court well. That's definitely one of the reasons they are both highly respected.... their ability to run. When they are in the lineup together, it would be like Mae West, " Why don't you come down and see me some time?" The announcers talk about Kingsley and his effect on the other team of making them change their whole way of doing things. Portis by himself is not enough.... we need a center. Isn't last year enough to convince anyone that in order to win.... things have to be different...... or do we want to squander our advantage...... again. I am betting on MA to seize the advantage.... if not, I have bet on the wrong man.... This is his year to show us something.

Naturally there are not stats available as MA has not been playing them together. When he wants to win, he will.

Hey, if Williams continues to play well, he could play with either. Kingsley and Portis can't play together the whole game.  Williams is a juxtaposition from last year. His stats were not really good ,and he turned the ball over too often at critical times. He has been applauded by many on here the last few days.

[nextlevel]

So nothing but the opinions of others that resembles yours.

As I thought.

No response to the overall effect on the line up and rotation, as I imagined.

There is no "5" in his offense, only guards and forwards.

[mhuff]

So nothing but the opinions of others that resembles yours.

As I thought.

No response to the overall effect on the line up and rotation, as I imagined.

There is no "5" in his offense, only guards and forwards.

The effect on the lineup gig was unmerited. I am not dodging anything. We saw those lineups before last year and we saw the results. You have to bring men to the game if you want to win. You see Kingsley's and Portis' stats last year and so far this year..... You think playing midgets and shooting 38% is gonna get us there.

Yes, duh..... you asked me why I believed what I said and I told you. I am supposed to give you a response backing up the opposite to what I believe..... C'mon...... Certainly , you can enlighten me with some facts to back up your opinion..... I would enjoy that.... I want to know others opinion.

[nextlevel]

The effect on the lineup gig was unmerited. I am not dodging anything. We saw those lineups before last year and we saw the results. You have to bring men to the game if you want to win. You see Kingsley's and Portis' stats last year and so far this year..... You think playing midgets and shooting 38% is gonna get us there.

Unmerited?

You have yet to answer how Prolonged minutes with Williams/Harris/Miles is better than having one of each out there with Portis/Kingsley.

Its a chess/checkers discussion.

The reality is it is better to have a rotation that sees combinations of the forwards on the court with Ports or Kingsley with minimal minutes without either of those two on the court while strategic planning of both being on the court for prolong minutes, mainly at the end of each half.

To say "derp Portis and Kingsley not being on the court all the time together is why we weren't so good last year" is misguided at best, the offense doesn't run through the block and Clarke was the better defender of the group.

Mike's "system" "philosophy" whatever you want to call it is a very guard oriented one and will see more wins/success as the guard play improves. It isn't about a "PG" or lack there of, its about all 2-3 guards on the court at any given time and the entire guard rotation.

This year's team has the best group of guards that CMA has had during his time here, it is filled with guys who can do more than one thing on the court at an above average capacity.

[mhuff]

Unmerited?

You have yet to answer how Prolonged minutes with Williams/Harris/Miles is better than having one of each out there with Portis/Kingsley.

Its a chess/checkers discussion.

The reality is it is better to have a rotation that sees combinations of the forwards on the court with Ports or Kingsley with minimal minutes without either of those two on the court while strategic planning of both being on the court for prolong minutes, mainly at the end of each half.

To say "derp Portis and Kingsley not being on the court all the time together is why we weren't so good last year" is misguided at best, the offense doesn't run through the block and Clarke was the better defender of the group.

Mike's "system" "philosophy" whatever you want to call it is a very guard oriented one and will see more wins/success as the guard play improves. It isn't about a "PG" or lack there of, its about all 2-3 guards on the court at any given time and the entire guard rotation.

This year's team has the best group of guards that CMA has had during his time here, it is filled with guys who can do more than one thing on the court at an above average capacity.

MA has never recruited players with Kingley's and Portis' ability while he's been here. We have always gotten our brains beaten out because we didn't have inside people who could stand up against the other teams bigs. We got our brains beaten out last year against California because he didn't play a lineup that matched up well with them. That plus we shot like 2-30 from 3p range. That approach was not what was needed.

Certainly as I have already mentioned there will be different combinations of bigs playing together. But, the best combination will be Kingsley and Portis backed up by their stats. Harris shot 46% from 2p land.. I think that was good. However, Harris can't play and has not played defense against the bigs with any success. Plus, Kingsley outrebounds him and outscores him per minute played. Kingsley causes havoc on defense to the other team. Harris does not hold his own. Williams shot .398 last year which I don't consider to be good. Maybe he will play better this year.

Put whoever you want out there with Kingsley and Portis. That is another discussion. I think Miles could play with the aforementioned duo, but Harris nor Williams handle the ball well enough to play the 3. I would like to see more assists from Williams. Kingsley and Portis could and have played the high - low game together..... Definitely a strength.

Off topic ,but I am concerned by Durham's fouls in the last game. Like some said.... refs could have been told to call fouls closely.

[lookawayquick]

Manny played a solid game today against AL State. He is steady with the ball, makes good decisions and is a solid on ball defender. No real sense of his shooting ability just yet but I believe he will be a contributor this year.

[ra2ford]

Rebounding Still a HUGE Issue.

Got to find a way to to get Kingsley more minutes.

[onebadrubi]

In the half court, we primarily run a 4-out 1-in motion. Last season, you recall Clarke taking a lot of perimeter jumpers, correct? That's not where we want Portis to be taking shots from. We prefer a less crowded interior.

Oh I agree there.  I'm saying though last year there were many times we need to run a set with a 4 and 5 with te likes of Portis and Kingsley.  It's just a change that didn't have last year.

By the way, I loved Clarke.  If we had Clarke this year id be preaching sweet 16.  The guy was key and was money when the game was on the line

[WarPig88]

Oh I agree there.  I'm saying though last year there were many times we need to run a set with a 4 and 5 with te likes of Portis and Kingsley.  It's just a change that didn't have last year.

By the way, I loved Clarke.  If we had Clarke this year id be preaching sweet 16.  The guy was key and was money when the game was on the line

Kingsley and Portis played a lot together at LSU last year. It was one of our worst outings of the year.

This topic is like the back up qb stuff. The most popular guy on the team is the guy that really shouldn't see the field if you want to win.

MA isn't changing his system any time soon to accommodate a whole lot of big man ball. You will see some of it, but never a lot of it.

[TomBigBeeHog]

Kingsley and Portis played a lot together at LSU last year. It was one of our worst outings of the year.

This topic is like the back up qb stuff. The most popular guy on the team is the guy that really shouldn't see the field if you want to win.

MA isn't changing his system any time soon to accommodate a whole lot of big man ball. You will see some of it, but never a lot of it.

Good observation. You put my thoughts into words very well.

[opineonswine]

Kingsley and Portis played a lot together at LSU last year. It was one of our worst outings of the year.

This topic is like the back up qb stuff. The most popular guy on the team is the guy that really shouldn't see the field if you want to win.

MA isn't changing his system any time soon to accommodate a whole lot of big man ball. You will see some of it, but never a lot of it.

I agree.  I don't like our lack of rhythm when the two of them are in the game at the same time.  Giving one rest while the other one battles is much more effective. 

Miles was very impressive in the Red/White game but has kind of disappeared since.  I believe he has talent and will re-emerge at some point.

Jacori has been looking like the most improved player but didn't have a good game yesterday.  Madden is in a mini-slump but will get it figured out.

Watkins is a very pleasant surprise.  He may be the best on-ball defender we've had in quite a while.  He plays under control.  I really like him.

Harris can do some things most players can't.  Then he'll take an ill-advised shot.  Still, as I said in another post, he's big and tough.  He contributes.

Portis played with passion yesterday.  Best he's looked so far in early games.

The two new PG's are both keepers.  I think in the end, Beard may be the better one.  He does not play like a true freshman.

Bell is a much better player now than last two years.  He's confident in his game and it shows.  AND maybe the best part is his defense is better and he's not just a 3 point bomber anymore. 

Alabama State is pretty good, especially when number 3 can't miss from 3.  But he wasn't their only threat.  They have a well-rounded team that can score. 

Yesterday's game may be a precursor for lots of games.  Can't pull away until we wear them out.  But with the depth we have, wearing them out is a dang good strategy.  We still need a/some scorers.  I worry about zone defenses against us still.

[Biggus Piggus]

The player rotations were weird yesterday because of Madden having been out of practice, which screwed up the first half. They were more normal in the second half, and that went fine with much better defense. This already is an improved version vs. last year's team. MA's going to try to develop the guards as fast as he can.

[mbgrulz]

Kingsley and Portis played a lot together at LSU last year. It was one of our worst outings of the year.

This topic is like the back up qb stuff. The most popular guy on the team is the guy that really shouldn't see the field if you want to win.

MA isn't changing his system any time soon to accommodate a whole lot of big man ball. You will see some of it, but never a lot of it.

Agree 100%...

We just need to accept that we are going to play Harris and Williams a lot at the 4 spot, and that is not a bad thing at all.