Felix " The Scat Cat" Jones

[blueshog2001]

With Arkansas signing McFadden at runningback. I fear Felix Jones has been forgotten.  The kid was being pretty heavily recruited by the likes of Tenn Vols, Nebraska, Texas A&M, and OU showed a little interest.  My Question is could Arkansas possibly see the return of the three-headed monster ground attack; we had with Cobbs, Talley, and Holmes?  With McFAdden, Jones, Hillis (FB or TB), or even Howard and Poole stepping up would be enough to scare me as a Defensive Coordinator.  And when (not if) our passing game comes around how can you stop us?

[Boared]

I don't think anyone has forgotten about Felix Jones, or Michael Smith, for that matter. They're just both out-of-state guys that most people here didn't get a chance to see very much, unlike McFadden.

[blueshog2001]

Does anyone know how to describe his running style?  Power-back, an ankle-breaker,or speed back?

[Hogstradamus]

We have a lot of young talent in the backfield.  That's one area I'm not too worried about.  With his speed, Felix should be right in the mix of things.

[TulsaHawg]

If I'm not mistaken, he played some D Back too. Wasn't that what TN was recruiting him for?

[Amityvillehogger]

You can have all the talent in the world, but if they dont play as a team and gel together, it really doesnt matter.  And who can stop us isnt the question.  Its can we keep things going.  Can we perform.  Can we move the ball up the field.  Thats the question.  We will have talent.  We just have to translate it to the field.

[hoggerdinger]

I agree amityville, I think our backs are solid.  We need the O line to make some holes for these guys. It takes a team.

[hogwildinhouston]

I agree amityville, I think our backs are solid. We need the O line to make some holes for these guys. It takes a team.

I really believe the entire offense is solid, provided one of the 3 QBs steps up.  The only question I have is QB.  If one of them can be at least solid, not spectacular, just solid (ala a healthy Robby Hampton), then this offense could be good enough to win some games.  This also hinges on HDN not freaking out if the QBs make the slightest mistake, and revert back to his 3rd and 10 smoke draw routine.

[The_Bionic_Pig]

I think he will surprise the hell outta you guys when fall practice rolls around!!! 

[pioneerhog]

I think he will surprise the hell outta you guys when fall practice rolls around!!!

From what I have heard about him that is how I feel. I won't be suprised if it isn't him and Mcfad as the top two backs and I'm not real sure which one of them will be starting.

[Since 1894]

Starting?  First they have to get some seasoning and fast.  HDN will start his upper classmen for the first half of the season just because.  He may put the pups in after a series and they will see plenty of PT, when they have "gotten off the tit" and shown that they can survive the SEC.

[Hacker]

With Arkansas signing McFadden at runningback. I fear Felix Jones has been forgotten. The kid was being pretty heavily recruited by the likes of Tenn Vols, Nebraska, Texas A&M, and OU showed a little interest. My Question is could Arkansas possibly see the return of the three-headed monster ground attack; we had with Cobbs, Talley, and Holmes? With McFAdden, Jones, Hillis (FB or TB), or even Howard and Poole stepping up would be enough to scare me as a Defensive Coordinator. And when (not if) our passing game comes around how can you stop us?

Yet another reason why I could QB this team to 5 wins.

I'll echo again, the offense is loaded moreso than it has been in some time.  A rolodex of runningbacks and receivers, the best fullback in the country, a seasoned offensive line, and 3 deep at TE.  The only weaknesses are QB and depth at O-line.  This will not be a replay of Robbie Hampton and the 2000 offense.  It will be more like the 2001 offense when we were at or near the top of the SEC in rushing.

[Biggus Piggus]

I expect it will have to be like 2001, when we ran the ball 2/3 of the time.  If the offensive line is not good this year, then this will be the second time one could criticize Markuson for his coaching performance (the first time being the 2000 season, when his players were out of shape and the most talented guy was not really into it). 

Three deep at tight end is an overstatement.  You'd say we were three deep at tight end every year by those standards.  Yes, we will have at least three players practicing at tight end.  We will not have three SEC-caliber tight ends.  We will have four or five players who are unidimensional, most of them painfully slow.

Calling Hillis the best fullback in the country also is shooting way far afield.  The top fullbacks this season all go 260 pounds or bigger.  Hillis didn't even play much fullback last season.  How much will he play this year?  He is an interesting player, an intriguing player, and my main question is just how many touches for him will be optimal.  Is he an A back or a supporting cast kind of guy?  In high school Hillis steamrolled people, but he can't do that in college without getting badly beaten, and he is not elusive.  He has good hands as a receiver, and if our QB will quit setting him up for getting destroyed, Hillis should help a lot in the passing game.  I'm looking forward to seeing how HDN features Hillis at alternate positions as he did in spring, such as H back.

It's a serious question, what kind of production the Hogs get at fullback.  Hillis, Brandon Kennedy and the others are not ideal blockers.  The running game needs an ideal blocker at fullback.  It won't have an ideal blocker at tight end.  If you do not recruit talent at a position, you will not have it.

[CorningHog]

I have heard he is a little bull with great cutting ability and vision, ala Barry Sanders type.

He looks the part and was getting serious recruiting attention.  I think we were fortunate that Petersen was at OU and Miles was leaving OSU and with Gundy heading up OSU it could turn into a passing style there.

Anyhow, I expect that the running game will be much improved since we had little last year.  Not enough speed to threaten the corners as well as no bruiser except for Hillis in the middle.  It will definitely take the whole team to improve the running game.  They did not seem as cohesive at times last year but there were glimpses.  Part of that seemed to be the type of style and playclalling with Matt Jones.  We had like 5 main themes to our offenses that we ran with MJ.  The rollout type stuff where he could look for receivers and run if needed, we had the "I" that was little used, speed option plays, and some pure pass type stuff with 3 & 4 receiver sets, and of course the dreaded draw play which was DeCori's specialty setup off the play action.  Most everything looked like play action and was predicated off of it but most defenses kept the linebackers in tight to keep MJ in check.  Without the threat of a real power running game and speed off the edges except for MJ, the Hogs were handicapped against the faster defenses.  If they had had a better passing game we could have forced defenses to play us more honest which may have helped the running game some.  Matt had one of his better games and the offense produced bigger against Alabama, which had a great defense.  If I remember correctly, Monk & Hillis had good games and the play calling kept Alabama off kilter a lot.

I can see our offense being much more diversified this fall as well as more talent at RB.  Poole, Howard and the FB's that have been here like Kennedy, as well as the Frosh and Hillis, should allow us to be focused on the running game more.  We will need it to keep defenses from blitzing the whole team on us.  We should be fine in the passing game and the playcalling is always great if HDN has the true weapons and ability to call them if our guys can execute the play.

I am looking forward to this season simply because the media, ESPN, the SEC and others are all predicting gloom.  This is usually the first ingredient for success at Arkansas.  Add in Herring's influence and mainly that a losing record last year has everyone on the team and all the coaches working harder than ever.  Hard work always spells success. 

8-3 baby!!!!!! maybe more if the ball bounces our way in turnovers!

GO HOGS!

[tulsahog36]

Felix Jones: 46 touchdowns as a senior in Tulsa.  One thing not mentioned here is alot of his touchdowns came on passes.  YEP!!  I live in Tulsa and the local media here played his highlights every Friday night.  The kid has excellent hands, not good, EXCELLENT!   He is just as dangerous, maybe more so, catching passes out of the backfield.  With his speed, once he makes the catch he can outrun everyone to the endzone.  His 4.3 speed IS FAST enough to outrun any secondary in the nation.   The potential of this group of Tailbacks is mindboggling.  Mcfadden, Jones and Smith will go down in History as the best group of Tailbacks in Razorback history.

[tulsahog36]

"Anyhow, I expect that the running game will be much improved since we had little last year.  Not enough speed to threaten the corners as well as no bruiser except for Hillis in the middle."
Quote by Corninghog

ARE YOU NUTS!!!  Mcfadden, Jones and Smith all run sub 4.4 40s.  Washington, Logan, Monk and Baker are all fast to.  Monk might be one of the best wideouts in the country if Arkansas has a QB that can get him the ball.  No Bruiser except for Hillis?  Did you forget about Howard?  And I didn't mention Poole, he is just as fast the incoming freshman at tailback.  Not enough speed to threaten the corners???  How much speed do you want?  The true question IS: Does Arkansas have a QUATERBACK that can threaten the corners.  Speed?  Arkansas has never had this much speed.

[Buck Ocean]

The fact that you are refering to him as "Scat Cat" deserves 1st team on the depth chart alone.

[Biggus Piggus]

That is such vague conjecture, BP.  What does it really mean?

It is not vague conjecture.  It is a summary.  The detail: SEC-caliber tight ends can run like pro tight ends.  We have one who can run like a pro tight end.  The rest run like pro offensive linemen.  Hicks gets beaten up because he has never been strong enough.  SEC-caliber tight ends are strong enough.  Not every SEC team has SEC-caliber tight ends.  I'm talking about what it takes to compete for championships in the SEC.  We have a young tight end who isn't very strong, a veteran tight end who has been battered to the point of being injury prone, and some roster fill.  Pretty simple.

[Biggus Piggus]

I look for ways the Hogs can improve.  Get the tight end and fullback positions up another level in talent, and that would enable a more robust playbook (fall not spring).  I see way too much attention rationing in the recruiting effort.  Too much time spent focused on pet areas at the expense of getting any talent for the less supported positions such as FB, TE, K, P and that Husky thingy they used last season.

[Hacker]

We will not have three SEC-caliber tight ends.

That is such vague conjecture, BP.  What does it really mean?  We have three players who all have the dimensions comparable to other tight ends within the SEC - comparable size, speed and strength.  At the same time, when utilized, our tight ends have been equally effective.  But, to say SEC caliber about this position is extremely relative. 

Ole Miss set in a two tight end formation last season and used their tight ends in a reinforce offensive line and an emphasized running game.  Conversely, Georgia and Auburn used their tight end as more of an an extra offensive weapon in their passing games.  But, Georiga and Auburn utilized their tight ends in very different ways...as receivers.  My point being, what exactly is SEC caliber as you compare tight ends to tight ends?

We have tight ends who's physical stats match up pretty closely with many other tight ends in the league (Jared Hicks - 6-6/280 (8 receptions); Mason Templeton - 6-7, 263 (6 receptions); Marc Winston - 6-6, 262 and add Payne Hall - 6-4, 236 as an emergency TE since he has had a growth spurt and was moved to this position from wide receiver last season. 

UGA's Leonard Pope is 6-7/250 (25 receptions) and Martrez Milner 6-4/250 (4 receptions)
Tennessee's Justin Reed is 6-7/289 (1 reception) and backup Chris Brown 6-3/239 (6 receptions)
Florida's Darrell Carpenter 6-3/222
Bama's Trent Davidson 6-5/270 and Nick Walker 6-5/245
Auburn's Cooper Wallace 6-4/265 (18 receptions) - 2004 All SEC 2nd team & Cole Bennett (1 reception)
Ole Miss' - Jimmy Brooks 6-4/270 (2 receptions), Lawrence Lilly 6-4/275 (5 receptions) & Robert Hough 6-4/220
LSU's David Jones 6-4/260 (8 receptions), Keith Zinger 6-4/247 (2 receptions), Kory Herbert 6-4/229 and Mit Cole 6-4/260

Does SEC caliber relate to ability?  Hicks has graded out as well as many other tight ends on blocking assignments.  Is it pedigree?  Over half of the tight ends in the SEC are walk ons to their teams (like Darell Carpenter for Florida).  Hicks and Winston both were courted by other SEC schools (as we all remember Florida's pursuit of Winston).

If you are arguing the fact that Arkansas could stand to have more talented players filling the role of tight end, well that is an opinion call.  Bottom line, last season Templeton and Hicks (when healthy) both did a pretty good job of handling their assignments as tight end (we all remember the clutch reception on 4th down to the tight end in the Georgia game which gave us a first down and kept our last offensive drive alive - until Matt Jones fumbled a few plays later). 

When Hicks' shoulder is healthy, he is a better go to guy than Jason Peters ever was...Hicks can catch the ball.  The Hogs also saw the strong upside of taking a chance on Templeton, a player who only played one year of high school football for a smaller high school in Texas.  He continues to grow in both size and skills and has more than earned his stripes on the field. 

Our friend and OCCASSIONAL Hogville contributor, Trey Biddy wrote a great article for HawgSports about our tight end options heading into 2005.  Note - this article was written prior to Hicks problems up on the Hill, which moved him to the bottom of the tight end depth chart.

karma for you.  great post, HoopHog!

[Oklahawg]

Hicks has bruiser, blocking TE size and speed, and finesse, passing game TE skills. Not a good combo, but serviceable.

Templeton? He would be in the rotation at other SEC schools, but not at schools with significantly better prognostications for 2005 than UA.

Winston has to be able to block a little bit or his appearance in the huddle will be as predictable as when both Jones and Sorahan were in the huddle in 2003.

You forgot Tate Casey of Florida, a very solid TE who we went after hard and heavy. He would be starting ahead of Hicks if he were at UA.

Jones, McFadden and Smith all have something that Howard doesn't have--hands. All three could catch passes if needed and Howard can't. Of course, getting the ball lobbed in your direction so that some monosyllabic linebacker can rearrange your short-term memory at the point of reception has a way of reducing your pass-catching skills.

We really wasted Hillis last year. I don't know that he was integral in any victory, and he was hurt for too much of the year to have wasted his redshirt year. I wonder if that redshirt year could have taught him (a) how to block or (b) how to be a big-time TE. He has the raw skill for both, but the lack of blocking means he is merely pedestrian in the big picture. If he shows he can block consistently he will have a long career on Sunday...after an abbreviated career on Saturday.

[Hoggysoprano]

I look for ways the Hogs can improve. Get the tight end and fullback positions up another level in talent, and that would enable a more robust playbook (fall not spring). I see way too much attention rationing in the recruiting effort. Too much time spent focused on pet areas at the expense of getting any talent for the less supported positions such as FB, TE, K, P and that Husky thingy they used last season.

I totally understand, BP.  I feel the same way about tight end AND defensive end.  I am holding a bit of guarded optimism for both positions this season.  I haven't thought about our personnel at fullback.  Obviously, like you say, we do need dependable depth here as well (and at defensive tackle).  If all of our starters stay healthy then 'fine', but when was the last season were we experienced that!

That is also why I chuckled at all these people who went absolutely ballistic when Arkansas stopped recruiting Slick Shelly. We had all these wide receivers AND defensive backs on our roster, while lacking in so many other areas. If we had stayed with him, we would not have had as many scholarships alloted toward the end of recruiting and it would have cost us Felix Jones (our last scholarship committment last season). I think the Hogs will find more uses for Jones than they would have had with Shelly.

...I defintely understand your point regarding tight ends and every other position where depth of that position can really cost Arkansas from truly being consistent on the playing field.

Sorry Hoop, but to me when you offer a 5'4" 140lb reciever and not an all-american Arkansas boy like Slick Shelly I don't see much humor.

[Rocky&Boarwinkle]

Scat: an animal fecal dropping

Scat-cat.  Funny stuff.

[rricha]

I am with you hoggy i am still puzzled about that one.  On D-1 school recruits midgers anymore.  They may be dreaming of the amigos that use to play for redskins.

[Hoggysoprano]

I look for ways the Hogs can improve. Get the tight end and fullback positions up another level in talent, and that would enable a more robust playbook (fall not spring). I see way too much attention rationing in the recruiting effort. Too much time spent focused on pet areas at the expense of getting any talent for the less supported positions such as FB, TE, K, P and that Husky thingy they used last season.

I totally understand, BP. I feel the same way about tight end AND defensive end. I am holding a bit of guarded optimism for both positions this season. I haven't thought about our personnel at fullback. Obviously, like you say, we do need dependable depth here as well (and at defensive tackle). If all of our starters stay healthy then 'fine', but when was the last season were we experienced that!

That is also why I chuckled at all these people who went absolutely ballistic when Arkansas stopped recruiting Slick Shelly. We had all these wide receivers AND defensive backs on our roster, while lacking in so many other areas. If we had stayed with him, we would not have had as many scholarships alloted toward the end of recruiting and it would have cost us Felix Jones (our last scholarship committment last season). I think the Hogs will find more uses for Jones than they would have had with Shelly.

...I defintely understand your point regarding tight ends and every other position where depth of that position can really cost Arkansas from truly being consistent on the playing field.

Sorry Hoop, but to me when you offer a 5'4" 140lb reciever and not an all-american Arkansas boy like Slick Shelly I don't see much humor.

We didn't offer a 5'4" 140 pound receiver. We offered a 5'4'" burner (who is really 5'6") for punt returns. A kid who finished at the top (I repeat...at the top) of the combine shuttle at the College Station Nike Camp with a 3.78 shuttle speed. His shuttle speed was one of the best throughout all of the Nike Camps. He was 12th in the 40 times with a 4.47 -- by the way, this camp was held in thunderstorm conditions and was eventually cancelled due to the weather.

At the same time, Slick Shelley (who has not yet academically qualified, btw) is a wide receiver who runs a 4.6 - 40. We need a specialized punt returner, not another wide receiver (remember all those times you bitch about special teams? Do they do something about it or not?).

In addition, Fish is academically qualified and Slick has not yet scored above a 16 on his ACT. If Fish was academically ineligible...or if we had signed Shelley and he ended up not being eligible, you would be the first to rag the system about this. Well, now you can rag Phil Fulmer, cause as of right now, Shelley has a 2.8 and a 16 ACT. Even though you can't see the forrest for the trees Skip...we did not need another wide receiver.

Slick is 6'6" 4.65 and rivals says that midget ran a 4.52 not rain aided.  What was the deal with the "rain" did it make those other 11 guys faster?

[Hoggysoprano]

I am with you hoggy i am still puzzled about that one. On D-1 school recruits midgers anymore. They may be dreaming of the amigos that use to play for redskins.

I agree, doesn't make much sense to me.  Maybe they are going to start a midget football team. 

[VoR]

Sorry to say, but in a way the point is moot, until we use the TE as a legitimate offensive weapon, all that matters is that they can carry out blocking assignments, and what talent can you bring to Arkansas when you can read the history books for the last 10 years and see if you have a great year you'll get 10 touches.

[HogFansReunited]

Sorry to say, but in a way the point is moot, until we use the TE as a legitimate offensive weapon, all that matters is that they can carry out blocking assignments, and what talent can you bring to Arkansas when you can read the history books for the last 10 years and see if you have a great year you'll get 10 touches.

Thats all going to change this year.  If Nutt has half a brain he will use the TE position to his advantage.

[Hoggysoprano]

I look for ways the Hogs can improve. Get the tight end and fullback positions up another level in talent, and that would enable a more robust playbook (fall not spring). I see way too much attention rationing in the recruiting effort. Too much time spent focused on pet areas at the expense of getting any talent for the less supported positions such as FB, TE, K, P and that Husky thingy they used last season.

I totally understand, BP. I feel the same way about tight end AND defensive end. I am holding a bit of guarded optimism for both positions this season. I haven't thought about our personnel at fullback. Obviously, like you say, we do need dependable depth here as well (and at defensive tackle). If all of our starters stay healthy then 'fine', but when was the last season were we experienced that!

That is also why I chuckled at all these people who went absolutely ballistic when Arkansas stopped recruiting Slick Shelly. We had all these wide receivers AND defensive backs on our roster, while lacking in so many other areas. If we had stayed with him, we would not have had as many scholarships alloted toward the end of recruiting and it would have cost us Felix Jones (our last scholarship committment last season). I think the Hogs will find more uses for Jones than they would have had with Shelly.

...I defintely understand your point regarding tight ends and every other position where depth of that position can really cost Arkansas from truly being consistent on the playing field.

Sorry Hoop, but to me when you offer a 5'4" 140lb reciever and not an all-american Arkansas boy like Slick Shelly I don't see much humor.

We didn't offer a 5'4" 140 pound receiver. We offered a 5'4'" burner (who is really 5'6") for punt returns. A kid who finished at the top (I repeat...at the top) of the combine shuttle at the College Station Nike Camp with a 3.78 shuttle speed. His shuttle speed was one of the best throughout all of the Nike Camps. He was 12th in the 40 times with a 4.47 -- by the way, this camp was held in thunderstorm conditions and was eventually cancelled due to the weather.

At the same time, Slick Shelley (who has not yet academically qualified, btw) is a wide receiver who runs a 4.6 - 40. We need a specialized punt returner, not another wide receiver (remember all those times you bitch about special teams? Do they do something about it or not?).

In addition, Fish is academically qualified and Slick has not yet scored above a 16 on his ACT. If Fish was academically ineligible...or if we had signed Shelley and he ended up not being eligible, you would be the first to rag the system about this. Well, now you can rag Phil Fulmer, cause as of right now, Shelley has a 2.8 and a 16 ACT. Even though you can't see the forrest for the trees Skip...we did not need another wide receiver.

Slick is 6'6" 4.65 and rivals says that midget ran a 4.52 not rain aided. What was the deal with the "rain" did it make those other 11 guys faster?

I look for ways the Hogs can improve. Get the tight end and fullback positions up another level in talent, and that would enable a more robust playbook (fall not spring). I see way too much attention rationing in the recruiting effort. Too much time spent focused on pet areas at the expense of getting any talent for the less supported positions such as FB, TE, K, P and that Husky thingy they used last season.

I totally understand, BP. I feel the same way about tight end AND defensive end. I am holding a bit of guarded optimism for both positions this season. I haven't thought about our personnel at fullback. Obviously, like you say, we do need dependable depth here as well (and at defensive tackle). If all of our starters stay healthy then 'fine', but when was the last season were we experienced that!

That is also why I chuckled at all these people who went absolutely ballistic when Arkansas stopped recruiting Slick Shelly. We had all these wide receivers AND defensive backs on our roster, while lacking in so many other areas. If we had stayed with him, we would not have had as many scholarships alloted toward the end of recruiting and it would have cost us Felix Jones (our last scholarship committment last season). I think the Hogs will find more uses for Jones than they would have had with Shelly.

...I defintely understand your point regarding tight ends and every other position where depth of that position can really cost Arkansas from truly being consistent on the playing field.

Sorry Hoop, but to me when you offer a 5'4" 140lb reciever and not an all-american Arkansas boy like Slick Shelly I don't see much humor.

We didn't offer a 5'4" 140 pound receiver. We offered a 5'4'" burner (who is really 5'6") for punt returns. A kid who finished at the top (I repeat...at the top) of the combine shuttle at the College Station Nike Camp with a 3.78 shuttle speed. His shuttle speed was one of the best throughout all of the Nike Camps. He was 12th in the 40 times with a 4.47 -- by the way, this camp was held in thunderstorm conditions and was eventually cancelled due to the weather.

At the same time, Slick Shelley (who has not yet academically qualified, btw) is a wide receiver who runs a 4.6 - 40. We need a specialized punt returner, not another wide receiver (remember all those times you bitch about special teams? Do they do something about it or not?).

In addition, Fish is academically qualified and Slick has not yet scored above a 16 on his ACT. If Fish was academically ineligible...or if we had signed Shelley and he ended up not being eligible, you would be the first to rag the system about this. Well, now you can rag Phil Fulmer, cause as of right now, Shelley has a 2.8 and a 16 ACT. Even though you can't see the forrest for the trees Skip...we did not need another wide receiver.

Slick is 6'6" 4.65 and rivals says that midget ran a 4.52 not rain aided. What was the deal with the "rain" did it make those other 11 guys faster?

Okay, don't be an idiot, Skip.  My point is that he ran an agility shuttle on a wet field...and you need to look at Rivals again.  You misread.  It never said 4.52 anywhere on his profile page - and never has.  It is one thing to disagree, it is another to just make up stuff, Hoggy.  After you revisit the profile and see that I am right, click on the link to the College Station Nike Training Camp and you will see the times for the Camp and you will see I am right again.

By the way, I love how you competely ignore the academic issue surrounding Shelley.  When you blatantly ignore something that means you are intentionally sidestepping it.  I guess that means you realize I am right about this one and you have no REAL response.  If we had extended an offer to SS, we would not have had a scholarship to offer Felix Jones, SS would end up JUCO because of his grades and the Hogs would not have signed the Oklahoma Player of the Year - whom we can use in a big way.

http://scout.scout.com/a.z?s=10&p=8&c=1&nid=1232866

You better look again.

If Nutt had not offered his friends kids we would of had a schollie for Shelly and Jones.  By the way if Shelly is not eligible then we wouldn't be using a schollie anyway on him.  Now Hoop the real question, who would help the program more? Shelly or Fish? That is the real question.  The answer is obvious.

[Hoggysoprano]

I look for ways the Hogs can improve. Get the tight end and fullback positions up another level in talent, and that would enable a more robust playbook (fall not spring). I see way too much attention rationing in the recruiting effort. Too much time spent focused on pet areas at the expense of getting any talent for the less supported positions such as FB, TE, K, P and that Husky thingy they used last season.

I totally understand, BP. I feel the same way about tight end AND defensive end. I am holding a bit of guarded optimism for both positions this season. I haven't thought about our personnel at fullback. Obviously, like you say, we do need dependable depth here as well (and at defensive tackle). If all of our starters stay healthy then 'fine', but when was the last season were we experienced that!

That is also why I chuckled at all these people who went absolutely ballistic when Arkansas stopped recruiting Slick Shelly. We had all these wide receivers AND defensive backs on our roster, while lacking in so many other areas. If we had stayed with him, we would not have had as many scholarships alloted toward the end of recruiting and it would have cost us Felix Jones (our last scholarship committment last season). I think the Hogs will find more uses for Jones than they would have had with Shelly.

...I defintely understand your point regarding tight ends and every other position where depth of that position can really cost Arkansas from truly being consistent on the playing field.

Sorry Hoop, but to me when you offer a 5'4" 140lb reciever and not an all-american Arkansas boy like Slick Shelly I don't see much humor.

We didn't offer a 5'4" 140 pound receiver. We offered a 5'4'" burner (who is really 5'6") for punt returns. A kid who finished at the top (I repeat...at the top) of the combine shuttle at the College Station Nike Camp with a 3.78 shuttle speed. His shuttle speed was one of the best throughout all of the Nike Camps. He was 12th in the 40 times with a 4.47 -- by the way, this camp was held in thunderstorm conditions and was eventually cancelled due to the weather.

At the same time, Slick Shelley (who has not yet academically qualified, btw) is a wide receiver who runs a 4.6 - 40. We need a specialized punt returner, not another wide receiver (remember all those times you bitch about special teams? Do they do something about it or not?).

In addition, Fish is academically qualified and Slick has not yet scored above a 16 on his ACT. If Fish was academically ineligible...or if we had signed Shelley and he ended up not being eligible, you would be the first to rag the system about this. Well, now you can rag Phil Fulmer, cause as of right now, Shelley has a 2.8 and a 16 ACT. Even though you can't see the forrest for the trees Skip...we did not need another wide receiver.

Slick is 6'6" 4.65 and rivals says that midget ran a 4.52 not rain aided. What was the deal with the "rain" did it make those other 11 guys faster?

I look for ways the Hogs can improve. Get the tight end and fullback positions up another level in talent, and that would enable a more robust playbook (fall not spring). I see way too much attention rationing in the recruiting effort. Too much time spent focused on pet areas at the expense of getting any talent for the less supported positions such as FB, TE, K, P and that Husky thingy they used last season.

I totally understand, BP. I feel the same way about tight end AND defensive end. I am holding a bit of guarded optimism for both positions this season. I haven't thought about our personnel at fullback. Obviously, like you say, we do need dependable depth here as well (and at defensive tackle). If all of our starters stay healthy then 'fine', but when was the last season were we experienced that!

That is also why I chuckled at all these people who went absolutely ballistic when Arkansas stopped recruiting Slick Shelly. We had all these wide receivers AND defensive backs on our roster, while lacking in so many other areas. If we had stayed with him, we would not have had as many scholarships alloted toward the end of recruiting and it would have cost us Felix Jones (our last scholarship committment last season). I think the Hogs will find more uses for Jones than they would have had with Shelly.

...I defintely understand your point regarding tight ends and every other position where depth of that position can really cost Arkansas from truly being consistent on the playing field.

Sorry Hoop, but to me when you offer a 5'4" 140lb reciever and not an all-american Arkansas boy like Slick Shelly I don't see much humor.

We didn't offer a 5'4" 140 pound receiver. We offered a 5'4'" burner (who is really 5'6") for punt returns. A kid who finished at the top (I repeat...at the top) of the combine shuttle at the College Station Nike Camp with a 3.78 shuttle speed. His shuttle speed was one of the best throughout all of the Nike Camps. He was 12th in the 40 times with a 4.47 -- by the way, this camp was held in thunderstorm conditions and was eventually cancelled due to the weather.

At the same time, Slick Shelley (who has not yet academically qualified, btw) is a wide receiver who runs a 4.6 - 40. We need a specialized punt returner, not another wide receiver (remember all those times you bitch about special teams? Do they do something about it or not?).

In addition, Fish is academically qualified and Slick has not yet scored above a 16 on his ACT. If Fish was academically ineligible...or if we had signed Shelley and he ended up not being eligible, you would be the first to rag the system about this. Well, now you can rag Phil Fulmer, cause as of right now, Shelley has a 2.8 and a 16 ACT. Even though you can't see the forrest for the trees Skip...we did not need another wide receiver.

Slick is 6'6" 4.65 and rivals says that midget ran a 4.52 not rain aided. What was the deal with the "rain" did it make those other 11 guys faster?

Okay, don't be an idiot, Skip. My point is that he ran an agility shuttle on a wet field...and you need to look at Rivals again. You misread. It never said 4.52 anywhere on his profile page - and never has. It is one thing to disagree, it is another to just make up stuff, Hoggy. After you revisit the profile and see that I am right, click on the link to the College Station Nike Training Camp and you will see the times for the Camp and you will see I am right again.

By the way, I love how you competely ignore the academic issue surrounding Shelley. When you blatantly ignore something that means you are intentionally sidestepping it. I guess that means you realize I am right about this one and you have no REAL response. If we had extended an offer to SS, we would not have had a scholarship to offer Felix Jones, SS would end up JUCO because of his grades and the Hogs would not have signed the Oklahoma Player of the Year - whom we can use in a big way.

http://scout.scout.com/a.z?s=10&p=8&c=1&nid=1232866

You better look again.

If Nutt had not offered his friends kids we would of had a schollie for Shelly and Jones. By the way if Shelly is not eligible then we wouldn't be using a schollie anyway on him. Now Hoop the real question, who would help the program more? Shelly or Fish? That is the real question. The answer is obvious.

WOW...Scout is not Rivals, which is who you refered to in your first post. Like I said, check out the recorded time from the College Station Nike Camp (which one of those Scout articles references, and see that the recorded time on the Scout profile is wrong).

Two, you are deft at making vague references. In this case, I have not a clue who you are refering when you talk about Nutt's friends. But that's your style...bounce around rather than staying on the argument.

Three, are you smoking dope? You miss the entire scholarship point...but of course. If Shelley had become a Hog and ended up being academically ineligible, that would have freed up that schollie...for NEXT YEAR, doofus. So, we would have been without Shelley and it would have been Felix Jones who would have signed with Tennessee because we would not have had a scholarship to OFFER HIM prior to Shelley getting this last nugget and then [CENSORED] up by being academically ineligible. I know you don't understand this, but I make a pitch anyway.

Who would help the progrtam more? Fish...cause he has his grades and is ready to suit up! You are right the answer IS obvious, you are just araid to see it.

Oh so the guys at Scout are wrong and you seem to be the only person in the world who is right?  And Fish would help the program more?  You have lost all credibility Hoop, you need to stick to basketball you obviously don't know squat about football.
As far as the schollie being for next year, well your boy Fish is not going to see the field anyway so I don't see where it would make a difference.  It's one thing for Nutt to throw away a schollie because of a old friendship, it's quite another to actually put that on the field, especially when Nutt's job is on the line this year. 

[Theolesnort]

Hoggy, I know the scholie to Fish doesn't seem rational especially in the SEC where you can flat out get killed but once in a while when the planets line up, a little guy with a attitude can come along and over achieve just to show people like us that we are just so wrong about them. Maybe someone saw that in him and he is here for a reason. Anyway let's give him a chance now that he is already here. As far as Slick, don't give it another thought. He had no intention of going to Ark unless it was his only option. In his mind he was better than Ark and that is my sincere take on things when I was able to talk to him a couple of times.

[Hoggysoprano]

Hoggy, I know the scholie to Fish doesn't seem rational especially in the SEC where you can flat out get killed but once in a while when the planets line up, a little guy with a attitude can come along and over achieve just to show people like us that we are just so wrong about them. Maybe someone saw that in him and he is here for a reason. Anyway let's give him a chance now that he is already here. As far as Slick, don't give it another thought. He had no intention of going to Ark unless it was his only option. In his mind he was better than Ark and that is my sincere take on things when I was able to talk to him a couple of times.

I know you're right, and I really hope Fish does well. This is not about Fish to me, it's about Nutt.  I just don't udnerstand the guys reasoning.

[Hoggysoprano]

ROFLMAO Hoggy, you dare talk to anyone about credibility? 

Yes, the guys at Scout are wrong because if you looked for yourself, you would see where even they mention Fish's 40 time at the Nike Camp at College Station (and (again) the fastest shuttle speed at camp). The 4.47 listed in print on both Rivals AND Scout is a different time that the one on Fish's Scout profile.  Typos do happen.  But of course, you aren't going to look this up to see that I am right because you hate it when the truth bites you in the ass - which is every day. 

You still haven't clarrified what the hell you are talking about as you vaguely refer to HDN's friend's son getting a scholarship. Are you mentioniing Fish? Good God, be specific man!  Emotionally charged statements and no substance...that's the Hoggy way!  I'll put money down, here on Hogville in front of God, Lanny and everyone else that Fish will see the field next season. Hey Hoggy, got balls -- or just a mouth?

I know you don't keep up with current events that well, but Nutt coached with Fish's dad. That is why he offered Fish.  You say seeing the field next season, do you mean the 05 or 06 season? 

Now let me bring you back around to the question once again.  Oh and yes you have no credibility, you can make all the little remarks you want fact is you don't know what you're talking about.

IF Nutt had not offered his friend's son, that is Fish I am trying go slow so you can follow, then he would of had a schollie for both Shelly and Jones.  Since we only have 12 to give this next year even if Shelly was ineligible I sure we could find a better player than Fish to give one to in 06.

[Hoggysoprano]

Hoggy, I know the scholie to Fish doesn't seem rational especially in the SEC where you can flat out get killed but once in a while when the planets line up, a little guy with a attitude can come along and over achieve just to show people like us that we are just so wrong about them. Maybe someone saw that in him and he is here for a reason. Anyway let's give him a chance now that he is already here. As far as Slick, don't give it another thought. He had no intention of going to Ark unless it was his only option. In his mind he was better than Ark and that is my sincere take on things when I was able to talk to him a couple of times.

I know you're right, and I really hope Fish does well. This is not about Fish to me, it's about Nutt. I just don't understand the guys reasoning.

Give everyone a break...you could care less about trying to understand his reasoning. You aren't that charitable, Skip.

I know Fish's dad played at O-State with Nutt, I was just trying to get you to say what you were talking about. It is oftern hard to tell what you are stammering about, so getting you to clarify helps.

The fact remains that we already had Fish committed when Arkansas decided to no longer extend a schollie to SS. Of course, part of their retraction was exactly what Theolesnort mentioned. At the same time a new player came onto our radar screen...so, without you or I being in the war room knowing the real truth, it has been strongly assumed that the retraction of a schollie offer to SS was done just in time to extend an offer to Felix Jones (a player who will probably help the program out far more than SS ever would). Again, the one part of this discussion that you haven't touched with a ten foot poll is the fact that our program is over flowing with wide receivers. It was not a need for the program.

I could go into detail about the little spat between the UofA and SS regarding summer camp but why go into it. I know far more about this than you probably do, Skip. I actually listen to some very knowledgeable people rather than just make it up as I go along.

Don't kid yourself, the offer to Slick was taken back right AFTER he decided to go to Tennessee.  As far as the little spat about Nutts camp, who gives a crap?  Nutt is the coach, if things like that bother him he needs to grow up or leave, not ever in state player comes to Nutts camps and falls on his knees to worship the Hog God.  If don't make anything up Hoop, I talk to a lot of people who know and those are not your buddies down in Little Rock, they are people who are close to the Hogs who are in NW Arkansas.  People who actually do know something in other words. Now I don't want to discuss this anymore, I don't want to get into a name calling match or a match of who knows more about the Hogs. I have stated my opinion and is all I have to say.  Go ahead have the last word.

[Hoggysoprano]

Yes, and I guess my having the UofA as a client and working with Dean Weber and Dave England means nothing or having one of your berst high school friends as legal counsel to the U of A - to name a few people I can talk to, if ever needed. Quit blowing smoke up people's asses, Skip. You? With Sources? Perhaps. But, you still have to listen to them rather than make up the story as you go along.

For the recond, the offer to Slick was off the table about a month and a half before he committed. It was a topic of discussion even on this board that the schollie had been retracted.

Now I was going to let you go and you showed you don't know what your talking about again.  The offer to Shelly was taken off the table two days after he played great in the Rivals All-Star game. Which was also the same day he committed to Tennessee.  That is a fact.  While I'm sure you think your legal counsel is a good lawyer I doubt he knows squat about the U of A.  Yeah Hoop I talk to people, and they know a little more than the ones you listed.  Who are they?  That's my buisness, you have no need to know.

Oh and Hoop, you need to quit trying to blow smoke up my ass, it's a known fact on here you talk out of yours.

[Hoggysoprano]

Yes, and I guess my having the UofA as a client and working with Dean Weber and Dave England means nothing or having one of your berst high school friends as legal counsel to the U of A - to name a few people I can talk to, if ever needed. Quit blowing smoke up people's asses, Skip. You? With Sources? Perhaps. But, you still have to listen to them rather than make up the story as you go along.

For the recond, the offer to Slick was off the table about a month and a half before he committed. It was a topic of discussion even on this board that the schollie had been retracted.

Now I was going to let you go and you showed you don't know what your talking about again. The offer to Shelly was taken off the table two days after he played great in the Rivals All-Star game. Which was also the same day he committed to Tennessee. That is a fact. While I'm sure you think your legal counsel is a good lawyer I doubt he knows squat about the U of A. Yeah Hoop I talk to people, and they know a little more than the ones you listed. Who are they? That's my buisness, you have no need to know.

WRONG. Once again, making stuff up, huh, Skip. Just as long as it helps your story.

Yes, I'm sure Dean Weber, who has been on the Hill longer than you have been an occassional fan of the program, knows nothing about what is going on with the program. I'll be sure to tell him you said so...he'll get a good chuckle.

Oh I see. We decided not that we "No-longer were interested in Shelly" on Jan 30, 2005 and he committed to Tennessee on Jan 31 2005. Those are facts and they are not wrong, you are wrong again.  Quit making stuff up Hoop, it makes you look like an idiot.

[Hoggysoprano]

In the meantime...

Taking focus off of a wide receiver we did not need, we had one scholarship left and were able to land a player just as accomplished as SS in several positions and predominantly, running back.

http://rivals100.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=386729

You need a password Hoop. 

This from the SW times Record Jan 27 of this year:

"Southside coach Barry Lunney received word from Arkansas coach Houston Nutt about the Razorbacks' decision not to pursue Shelley. In addition to Arkansas, South Carolina has also told Shelley to look elsewhere."

Sounds like your full of beans Hoop>  again.

[sage_dragoon]

I'm sure Fish being the Offensive MVP of the US Army Combine as a Jr. and having the fastest shuttle ever at the combine had nothing to do with UA offering him. BTW, I think Shavers was the Defensive MVP of the same combine, guess Nutt played ball w/his dad as well.

[Hoggysoprano]

I will ask Trey Biddy if I can cut and paste both of these articles since they are old. Rivals is justifiably very protective about their material. If I can get an okay from him, I will post them to this thread.

The SW Times Record?  If I am full of beans, then my sources (only one of the leading recruiting resources in the country) stated here for everyone to read, is full of beans as well.

I also find it interesting that you have made several refernces to Rivals in this thread yet you do not have a password. Hmmmm...interesting.  CASE CLOSED!

Oh I'm sure you know more than all the reporters at the SW times record with all of your connections like your attorney.

Yeah, you need to go eat some more beans. 

[Hoggysoprano]

I will ask Trey Biddy if I can cut and paste both of these articles since they are old. Rivals is justifiably very protective about their material. If I can get an okay from him, I will post them to this thread.

The SW Times Record?  If I am full of beans, then my sources (only one of the leading recruiting resources in the country) stated here for everyone to read, is full of beans as well.

I also find it interesting that you have made several refernces to Rivals in this thread yet you do not have a password. Hmmmm...interesting.  CASE CLOSED!

Oh I'm sure you know more than all the reporters at the SW times record with all of your connections like your attorney.

Yeah, you need to go eat some more beans.

Yes, and the scoop writers at the S.W. Times know more than thjeir colleagues at Rivals.com?  Let's see, a national recruiting site vesus a small town newspaper. Hmmmmmm priceless.

You can kiss the feet of that atorney.  You would think you would know who in the hell I am talking about since he represented the UofA in the Richardson case.  Yee of very little light.

Imhogginit, he will find some way to welsh on that bet when it comes to fruition.

I know who you are talking but that has nothing to do with this matter.  Barry Lunney was Slicks coach, he told the SW times reporter who reported the story. Since they are right there I guess they would know a little more than the chalk eaters at rivals. Oh and Hoop, I don't want to discuss this anymore. I don't want to hurt any friend ships over such a trival discussion.

Skip,

1) Slick is only 6'3" I stood next to him last Winter so I should know.

2) When Fish scores that touchdown sometime in his career ,instead of you giving me $100, you and I can be photographed
with you serving me a Coors Light and a plate of ribs. If Fish never scores I'll still owe you $100. Deal ?

Tell you what between friends if I lose I will let you have  a picture, if you lose you don't owe me anything.  In fact I wouldn't take your money on either bet. I just don't see it happening but I wouldn't want to make money on my teams misfortunes.

[Rhyno_Hawg]

Hicks has bruiser, blocking TE size and speed, and finesse, passing game TE skills. Not a good combo, but serviceable.

Templeton? He would be in the rotation at other SEC schools, but not at schools with significantly better prognostications for 2005 than UA.

Winston has to be able to block a little bit or his appearance in the huddle will be as predictable as when both Jones and Sorahan were in the huddle in 2003.

You forgot Tate Casey of Florida, a very solid TE who we went after hard and heavy. He would be starting ahead of Hicks if he were at UA.

Jones, McFadden and Smith all have something that Howard doesn't have--hands. All three could catch passes if needed and Howard can't. Of course, getting the ball lobbed in your direction so that some monosyllabic linebacker can rearrange your short-term memory at the point of reception has a way of reducing your pass-catching skills.

We really wasted Hillis last year. I don't know that he was integral in any victory, and he was hurt for too much of the year to have wasted his redshirt year. I wonder if that redshirt year could have taught him (a) how to block or (b) how to be a big-time TE. He has the raw skill for both, but the lack of blocking means he is merely pedestrian in the big picture. If he shows he can block consistently he will have a long career on Sunday...after an abbreviated career on Saturday.

Disagree on Tate Casey. He goes about 225 and was almost never used for Blockking. He played out of the Shot Gun last season, and was very effective as a pass catching TE. HDN's offense has never used a TE for receiving puroposes only.

[sooie dog]

You have lost all credibility Hoop.

He lost that long ago.

[Rhyno_Hawg]

I don't want to get in the middle of this or anything, but I thought we pulled Slicks offer a week or two  before he committed to Tenn. If I remember right, he tried to act all interested in us after that and said it was like a slap in the face. Maybe I'm wrong.

As far as Fish goes, I was very puzzled at why we gave a scholie to him. Besides the obvious facts (his size and 40 time) he didn't have any other offers from major programs.

Since then I've learned about his shuttle time, and seen some game tape of him. He is quick. I'll give him that. If he can give us anything close to what a healthy Marvin Jackson did, then I will be happy. Guess we'll wait and see.

I know it looks like it, but I have a hard time believing HDN only gave Fish a scholie as a favor to a friend. We have too many needs, and that would be a tremendous disservice to the team and fans. Besides he has never (that I know of) done anything like that in the past. I'm sure he has heard from friends that have a son that needed a scholie and would love a favor. I know he has allowed them to walk-on, but has he ever wasted a scholarship like that?

I also think Micheal Smith or Cedric Logan could fill the need at PR/KR easily, so HDN must have seen something that set Fish apart from anything we have now, or have coming in.   

[sooie dog]

You have lost all credibility Hoop.

He lost that long ago.

As you sit quitetly in the wings challenging your credibility everyday.  Way to have balls, Sooie...you pathetic lurker.

I might disagree with my friend Hoggy Soprano, but at least he has the balls to step out and take a challenge. What's your MO, Texas fan?

I like getting stupid drunk and doing the worm on the sidewalk outside War Memorial.

[sooie dog]

You have lost all credibility Hoop.

He lost that long ago.

As you sit quitetly in the wings challenging your credibility everyday. Way to have balls, Sooie...you pathetic lurker.

I might disagree with my friend Hoggy Soprano, but at least he has the balls to step out and take a challenge. What's your MO, Texas fan?

I like getting stupid drunk and doing the worm on the sidewalk outside War Memorial.

Sounds like you are a natural for those spineless convulsions.

By the way where is that wonderful blue and gold ND.  We all miss that dearly.

[Oklahawg]

Casey would give us the diversity at TE that we need. Hopefully, its what we want, also. He wasn't asked to block much. He played a lot bigger than the 225 he was listed with as a recruit. A year at Florida and I bet he's closer to 250 now. Bottom line, he's agile and has awesome hands. Able to play in that complex system as a true frosh. Even Winston wasn't able to play at UA. Hmm...