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Anybody notice any wild quail anymore?

Started by LSUFan, April 15, 2015, 08:47:14 pm

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LSUFan

Used to have tons of them behind my house in Bryant, didn't a hear a quail call since 2005.

Don't hear any in South La either (Fire ants eat their eggs and coyotes, raccoons, possums)

How long before they are endangered?

Fun little buggers to hunt, and nice table fare.

Just wondering if it's just me. I'd like to take my boys on a hunt before I die.
I ain't saying you babysitting, but my kids are all over your couch.

Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on August 17, 2015, 02:46:52 pm
Sometimes, I think you're a wine-o who found a laptop in a dumpster.

covert

I see a few in my area crossing the road this time of year. It has been years since i bumped a covey in the fields walking duing hunting season.

 

DOGALUM

Used to hunt them across the street from my dad's house in Springdale.  (The field is a subdivision now)

Don't hear em anymore....haven't for years.   Yotes, and cats have wiped them out.
A man who wouldn't cheat for a poke, don't want one bad enough!

grayhawg

Quote from: DOGALUM on April 15, 2015, 09:12:59 pm
Used to hunt them across the street from my dad's house in Springdale.  (The field is a subdivision now)

Don't hear em anymore....haven't for years.   Yotes, and cats have wiped them out.
You would be surprised how many eggs terrapins eat.

jrulz83

The great mystery of the disappearing bob white quail. Everybody wants to boil it down to one of the following: drought, predation, habitat destruction, etc. I've even heard global warming. I'm not so sure it can be boiled down to a singular cause but if I had to boil it down, I'd go for habitat loss and here's why:

I rule out drought as quail have survived droughts for centuries, why would a modern one effect them worse than the many they have endured as a species for generations?

Same thing for predation, the coyotes, bobcats, fire ants, etc. have been here most of the time the quail has, why would they have a detrimental impact now?

Habitat destruction gets the nod as the primary problem from me. Modern farming practices which utilize a far greater percentage of land that used to grow in brambles being the culprit makes sense to me. Urban sprawl also obviously has been a cause of lost habitat as well. Habitat destruction brings about an increase in predation. Without the proper cover the quail cannot escape from his predators, simple cause and effect.

Just my theory.
Lenin is cautiously optimistic.

DOGALUM

Quote from: jrulz83 on April 15, 2015, 09:45:50 pm
The great mystery of the disappearing bob white quail. Everybody wants to boil it down to one of the following: drought, predation, habitat destruction, etc. I've even heard global warming. I'm not so sure it can be boiled down to a singular cause but if I had to boil it down, I'd go for habitat loss and here's why:

I rule out drought as quail have survived droughts for centuries, why would a modern one effect them worse than the many they have endured as a species for generations?

Same thing for predation, the coyotes, bobcats, fire ants, etc. have been here most of the time the quail has, why would they have a detrimental impact now?

Habitat destruction gets the nod as the primary problem from me. Modern farming practices which utilize a far greater percentage of land that used to grow in brambles being the culprit makes sense to me. Urban sprawl also obviously has been a cause of lost habitat as well. Habitat destruction brings about an increase in predation. Without the proper cover the quail cannot escape from his predators, simple cause and effect.

Just my theory.
I have no doubt that habitat loss has had a huge effect.  That said, the number of coyotes around our land has increased dramatically over the last 10-20 years.   So have the number of cats that have been turned out.  I do my best to keep both of those populations in check.....but I'm only one man.  The number of people has not increased and the non forest land is more grown up with more cover than it's been since I've been alive. 

I agree with you about all of the reasons.  It's a shame too.  Wonderful birds.
A man who wouldn't cheat for a poke, don't want one bad enough!

jrulz83

Quote from: DOGALUM on April 15, 2015, 10:28:00 pm
I have no doubt that habitat loss has had a huge effect.  That said, the number of coyotes around our land has increased dramatically over the last 10-20 years.   So have the number of cats that have been turned out.  I do my best to keep both of those populations in check.....but I'm only one man.  The number of people has not increased and the non forest land is more grown up with more cover than it's been since I've been alive. 

I agree with you about all of the reasons.  It's a shame too.  Wonderful birds.

I don't doubt that you have seen an increase in predators and I can see that being an issue. I've also heard people point to feral hogs as a problem, I find little reason to doubt that being a problem either.

I've heard smarter people than me theorize that the problem is the un-forested land isn't growing up with the native/clump grasses that were some of the primary food and cover that quail used to have in abundance. I'm not sure as I wasn't around for the hey day of quail hunting, but it seems plausible.

The quail population is like the US economy. It's too complex to be boiled down to a single factor and thereby obtain the magic bullet to re-establishing quail. I think you have to go with a holistic approach; re-establish habitat, cut down as many predators as possible, and stock quail.

I think the AGFC is exploring plans to bring the quail back. I know something is being done at Pea Ridge in regard to quail. I hope that they can bring about some kind of statewide plan to reestablish quail, but it's going to take landowners getting on board. Quail hunting is part of Southern and Arkansas heritage and unfortunately it's been lost upon my generation. I for one hope to see it return.
Lenin is cautiously optimistic.

Rzbakfromwaybak


I can't remember exactly when the last time I saw.....or heard a quail, but it's been years.  When I was growing up, they were everywhere I hunted....& all around our house in SW LR.  I could hear quail regularly from my bedroom window, in the spring & summer.
Arkansas born, Arkansas bred, when I die I'll be a Razorback dead.

Albert Einswine

Growing up in eastern Craighead seeing and hearing quail was a daily thing. Granddad would sit on the front porch and whistle 'em out of the cotton field to the edge of the yard. You'd see cocks sparring over a hen in the cotton middles driving down the gravel roads. That was back when most 80's had a good grown up fence row around them and the ditch dumps were grown up and tree lined. We could go shoot a limit about any time we took the notion. All that habitat has been gone for decades now.
"Funny thing, I become a hell of a good fisherman when the trout decide to commit suicide." ~ John D. Voelker

ARoutdoorsman

Seen two the other day mowing at the house in the fence row. Haven't jumped a covey in probably 10 years hunting. Use to raise and dump a ton of those things out when I was a teen working at the J. Perry Mikles WDA for bird trial during the summer.

LSUFan

Last covey I saw was in 1996

Haven't heard many since.
I ain't saying you babysitting, but my kids are all over your couch.

Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on August 17, 2015, 02:46:52 pm
Sometimes, I think you're a wine-o who found a laptop in a dumpster.

DeltaBoy

I still hear them down on the Farm in Monroe County Arkansas when I am home But Dad says there just not as many Big coveys around unless you hunt the Electrical Companies Right of Ways they cut through the bottoms.
If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

Wayne Watson

Quote from: jrulz83 on April 15, 2015, 10:56:37 pm
I don't doubt that you have seen an increase in predators and I can see that being an issue. I've also heard people point to feral hogs as a problem, I find little reason to doubt that being a problem either.

I've heard smarter people than me theorize that the problem is the un-forested land isn't growing up with the native/clump grasses that were some of the primary food and cover that quail used to have in abundance. I'm not sure as I wasn't around for the hey day of quail hunting, but it seems plausible.

The quail population is like the US economy. It's too complex to be boiled down to a single factor and thereby obtain the magic bullet to re-establishing quail. I think you have to go with a holistic approach; re-establish habitat, cut down as many predators as possible, and stock quail.

I think the AGFC is exploring plans to bring the quail back. I know something is being done at Pea Ridge in regard to quail. I hope that they can bring about some kind of statewide plan to reestablish quail, but it's going to take landowners getting on board. Quail hunting is part of Southern and Arkansas heritage and unfortunately it's been lost upon my generation. I for one hope to see it return.

Yes, AGFC has a program called Arkansas Acres for Wildlife Program.  Also, keep in mind that the Red Tail Hawk has been protected for years to the point I think they are overpopulated now...and they could prey on quail very easily.

I don't remember the last time I heard or saw a quail.

http://www.agfc.com/species/Pages/SpeciesConservationProgramsAAW.aspx
Take a look at http://gridironhistory.com/
IF YOU DON'T TAILGATE WITH HOGVILLE...YOU HAVEN'T BEEN TO A TAILGATE!
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We don't rent pigs

 

jrulz83

Quote from: Wayne Watson on April 16, 2015, 04:38:40 pm
Yes, AGFC has a program called Arkansas Acres for Wildlife Program.  Also, keep in mind that the Red Tail Hawk has been protected for years to the point I think they are overpopulated now...and they could prey on quail very easily.

I don't remember the last time I heard or saw a quail.

http://www.agfc.com/species/Pages/SpeciesConservationProgramsAAW.aspx

I thought they did have a program, but I didn't have the wherewithal to search for it. Thanks WW.
Lenin is cautiously optimistic.

DeltaBoy

Drought and Habitat loss is what they are promoting down here with the Texas Parks and Wildlife Service.  We got at similar program.
If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

Wayne Watson

Quote from: jrulz83 on April 16, 2015, 07:15:53 pm
I thought they did have a program, but I didn't have the wherewithal to search for it. Thanks WW.

No problem.  As a BOD for the Arkansas Trappers Association, I have a few contacts with the AGFC.  Most are wildlife biologists but have always helped any time a question arose.
Take a look at http://gridironhistory.com/
IF YOU DON'T TAILGATE WITH HOGVILLE...YOU HAVEN'T BEEN TO A TAILGATE!
Check out www.fearlessfriday.com
We don't rent pigs

HawgWild

I haven't flushed a covey since the early 1990's.

HogBreath

Boy they used to be the stuff, saw quail all the time back in the 70's, think I have seen maybe one covey in the last 15 or so years.  Kinda like every one else has said, they are, or were, a wonderful bird.
I said...LSU has often been an overrated team.

That ignoramus Draconian Sanctions said..if we're overrated, why are we ranked higher than you are?

Albert Einswine

Quote from: HogBreath on April 17, 2015, 06:45:00 pm
Boy they used to be the stuff, saw quail all the time back in the 70's, think I have seen maybe one covey in the last 15 or so years.  Kinda like every one else has said, they are, or were, a wonderful bird.


Like smaller Cornish hens. Tasty.
"Funny thing, I become a hell of a good fisherman when the trout decide to commit suicide." ~ John D. Voelker

pigture perfect

Bobwhites are pretty common south of the border. I do know where a nice covey is located, but they are too scarce elsewhere for me to shoot. That, and the fact the crazy landowner is a PTSD suffering highly armed Vietnam vet.
The 2 biggest fools in the world: He who has an answer for everything and he who argues with him.  - original.<br /> <br />The first thing I'm going to ask a lawyer (when I might need one) is, "You don't post on Hogville do you?"

rickm1976

I used to like quail hunting with our bird dogs better than any other kind of hunting (even deer).  When we moved back home to Arkansas in 2004, I couldn't wait to start up again, but found out there weren't many quail anymore.  I once asked a game warden what happened to them, and he told me the number one cause was loss of habitat.

DeltaBoy

The best place I have found them the past 20 years is where you can get to AP&L or rural Coop Power line right of ways that border Farm land 
If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

Filthy_McSwine

Quote from: pigture perfect on April 17, 2015, 11:02:53 pm
Bobwhites are pretty common south of the border. I do know where a nice covey is located, but they are too scarce elsewhere for me to shoot. That, and the fact the crazy landowner is a PTSD suffering highly armed Vietnam vet.

Don't say nothing about his birthmark.

Flying Razorback

I actually came across two today on Highway 60 west of Perryville.  You're right though, they are much sparser than they were in the 90s.  I used to listen to Bob White calls all summer long in Saline County growing up. 

There were a lot of quails going strong in Oklahoma.  But I rarely see them here in Arkansas anymore.
Satchel Paige said, "Don't look back, something might be gaining on you..."

 

DeltaBoy

I glad to hear them down here in TX and when I back on the Farm in Monroe County !
If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

Flying Razorback

Quote from: DeltaBoy on May 01, 2015, 11:09:41 am
I glad to hear them down here in TX and when I back on the Farm in Monroe County !

It's definitely a sound that brings you back.  You don't realize you've missed it until you hear it again.
Satchel Paige said, "Don't look back, something might be gaining on you..."

DeltaBoy

Quote from: Flying Razorback on May 01, 2015, 06:00:10 pm
It's definitely a sound that brings you back.  You don't realize you've missed it until you hear it again.

Dad had a pair that set and raised some around the Old Chicken house this past year.  They set on the back fence post behind the house and sing till near dark.
If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

bolo

R.I.P OTR
R.I.P PRJ
2023 March Maddest Champion with a little help from my friends

LAHogfan123

Quote from: DOGALUM on April 15, 2015, 10:28:00 pm
I have no doubt that habitat loss has had a huge effect.  That said, the number of coyotes around our land has increased dramatically over the last 10-20 years.   So have the number of cats that have been turned out.  I do my best to keep both of those populations in check.....but I'm only one man.  The number of people has not increased and the non forest land is more grown up with more cover than it's been since I've been alive. 

I agree with you about all of the reasons.  It's a shame too.  Wonderful birds.

Was walking on my son-n-laws land in Mena this past weekend and scared up a covey them, I no longer hunt quail just because they are getting to be few in number.  I also have them on my property as well and see them often around here in Prattsville, all the guys around here I know don't hunt them as well.  I agree with you about the population of yotes and wild cats having and affect on them and all birdlife itself, you're not just one man, I to keep the cats in check as well as the yotes.  My Boxer hunts the wildcats with a passion, but I have a cat now myself that I keep on my property that I acclimated her to, I just got her as a 7 week old kitten, raised her in the house and house trained her, and now keep her down in my shop and barn area, she's a great mouser.  My Boxer gets along with her great, but will hunt other cats with extreme prejudice. 

Getting back on topic, my son-in-law and I have virtually killed off every coyote from his land, he has around 200 acres surrounded by the National Forest on 3 sides, but we still have to keep watch on them and wild hogs alike.  We'll think that we've killed every hog on the place but they're right back on it since they have free rein coming in off the NF.

LSUFan

My dad owned a chow that would hunt down rabbits, then would snuggle up with the pet rabbit at home and sleep with it.
I ain't saying you babysitting, but my kids are all over your couch.

Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on August 17, 2015, 02:46:52 pm
Sometimes, I think you're a wine-o who found a laptop in a dumpster.

DeltaBoy

When I am home to visit it is open season on and non barn cats at the Farm.  And those Yotes got where we have to use a 7 mm mag to reach them, cause they will not come with in 22-22-250 range any more.
If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

Albert Einswine

Quote from: bolo on May 10, 2015, 09:53:15 am
round bales did them in.


I'm interested in the round bale hypothesis, please expound on it.
"Funny thing, I become a hell of a good fisherman when the trout decide to commit suicide." ~ John D. Voelker

pigture perfect

I helped with a disability summer camp in Oklahoma last week. We had trouble with the horses because they kept walking up on quail and spooking. We had to move our riding area.
The 2 biggest fools in the world: He who has an answer for everything and he who argues with him.  - original.<br /> <br />The first thing I'm going to ask a lawyer (when I might need one) is, "You don't post on Hogville do you?"

LSUFan

I ain't saying you babysitting, but my kids are all over your couch.

Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on August 17, 2015, 02:46:52 pm
Sometimes, I think you're a wine-o who found a laptop in a dumpster.

DeltaBoy

Round bales  Cats and Yotes is my 2 cents on what wrong with Quail but number one is loss of habitat.
If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

bolo

Quote from: Albert Einswine on May 22, 2015, 03:42:59 pm

I'm interested in the round bale hypothesis, please expound on it.
they are east to store and feed so farmers got more cows, dozed all the orchards.
R.I.P OTR
R.I.P PRJ
2023 March Maddest Champion with a little help from my friends

bolo

R.I.P OTR
R.I.P PRJ
2023 March Maddest Champion with a little help from my friends

DeltaBoy

Dad said he jumped up 3 coveys out scouting for Black berry bushes last week. 
If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

vandybuff

When I was a kids in the sixties, there were ample quail hunting in north AR ... Super bonding time with my dad on hunts sometimes within 400 yards of our house.  But also then farmers worked sixty, eighty, one hundred acres fields -- most all with treelines, fence rows, ditch banks and a spot of trees.  Now it is 1600 acres precision leveled with nothing but crop.  I have long felt the loss of habitat ended wild (Bob White) quail hunting in north Arkansas.   Thank you for letting me relive a great memory!!!!
What a wonderful time to rediscover the hobby for a lifetime - a great book!!!

A happy life is doing something "that matters".  So start today!!!!!

wildturkey8

The Arkansas Game and Fish Commission and National Bobwhite Initiative have started a restoration program of wild birds around Pea Ridge National Battlefield and the surrounding area. 

wildturkey8

Quote from: DeltaBoy on May 26, 2015, 11:31:26 am
Round bales  Cats and Yotes is my 2 cents on what wrong with Quail but number one is loss of habitat.
Don't forget fescue.

LSUFan

Quote from: vandybuff on May 27, 2015, 11:19:52 pm
When I was a kids in the sixties, there were ample quail hunting in north AR ... Super bonding time with my dad on hunts sometimes within 400 yards of our house.  But also then farmers worked sixty, eighty, one hundred acres fields -- most all with treelines, fence rows, ditch banks and a spot of trees.  Now it is 1600 acres precision leveled with nothing but crop.  I have long felt the loss of habitat ended wild (Bob White) quail hunting in north Arkansas.   Thank you for letting me relive a great memory!!!!
Nothin gets your blood pumpin like a good bird dog that goes on point!
I ain't saying you babysitting, but my kids are all over your couch.

Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on August 17, 2015, 02:46:52 pm
Sometimes, I think you're a wine-o who found a laptop in a dumpster.

bolo

coon hides used to be worth alot more back then
R.I.P OTR
R.I.P PRJ
2023 March Maddest Champion with a little help from my friends

vandybuff

Quote from: LSUFan on May 28, 2015, 04:22:49 pm
Nothin gets your blood pumpin like a good bird dog that goes on point!
Absolutely ... and my father correctly said that you can't have a great dog if you don't have adequate birds.  Again, thanks for some great memories of my best friend!  Bless you!
What a wonderful time to rediscover the hobby for a lifetime - a great book!!!

A happy life is doing something "that matters".  So start today!!!!!

LSUFan

Quote from: vandybuff on May 29, 2015, 06:47:44 am
Absolutely ... and my father correctly said that you can't have a great dog if you don't have adequate birds.  Again, thanks for some great memories of my best friend!  Bless you!
As an aside, hunted with a guy whose dog would jump every armadillo within 3 miles. I put some bird shot in the dog's butt, broke him of that quick-like  :)
I ain't saying you babysitting, but my kids are all over your couch.

Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on August 17, 2015, 02:46:52 pm
Sometimes, I think you're a wine-o who found a laptop in a dumpster.

Großer Kriegschwein

Quote from: LSUFan on May 29, 2015, 03:36:30 pm
As an aside, hunted with a guy whose dog would jump every armadillo within 3 miles. I put some bird shot in the dog's butt, broke him of that quick-like  :)

Shock collar turned up to 7 will do the same thing, minus the topical ointment needed. Thats how I trained mine to stop having anything to do with snakes. She just ignores them now.
This is my non-signature signature.

Pudgepork

my area in eastern Arkansas used to have great numbers of quail.  Local hunters wouldn't give them a chance. There were a group of 6 hunters or so that everyone liked, so they had access to everybodies land.   They had really good dogs and would hunt the coveys every week.   20+ bird coveys were abundant at the start of season but they would whittle them down to 4-6 birds by the end of season.  At that point they would complain that the coveys would flush long before the dogs reached them. I've heard them brag about bagging 500+ birds in a season.   One guy in the group was great at providing food plots and habitat all over for the birds but I believe by whittling the covey numbers down very low, they really hurt the population.   

Those guys got old and gave up bird hunting.  I'd say for at least 10 yrs it was  a rare treat to see a quail.   Over the last 5 yrs they are making a strong comeback.  It isn't rare to flush a covey because they aren't being hunted.   

As a guy guilty of baling those dreaded round bales, I plead not guilty in diminishing the quail numbers.  A couple of years back I flushed 8 pair of quail from the same trip through the field with a mower.   They all flew to the property north of me, which is abandoned ground and returning to nature.   Much of the property in this area has been abandoned(taken out of crops) or even planted with trees through the govt CRP programs so the habitat is making a strong move in the right direction.

bolo,  the reason those orchards left was mama nature wouldn't let the growers make a crop.   Way too many late frosts and late deep freezes put the orchard guys out of bidness.   Other than the usual problem with old folks die and the kids have left the farm/orchard.   

bolo

Quote from: Pudgepork on June 02, 2015, 06:27:48 pm
my area in eastern Arkansas used to have great numbers of quail.  Local hunters wouldn't give them a chance. There were a group of 6 hunters or so that everyone liked, so they had access to everybodies land.   They had really good dogs and would hunt the coveys every week.   20+ bird coveys were abundant at the start of season but they would whittle them down to 4-6 birds by the end of season.  At that point they would complain that the coveys would flush long before the dogs reached them. I've heard them brag about bagging 500+ birds in a season.   One guy in the group was great at providing food plots and habitat all over for the birds but I believe by whittling the covey numbers down very low, they really hurt the population.   

Those guys got old and gave up bird hunting.  I'd say for at least 10 yrs it was  a rare treat to see a quail.   Over the last 5 yrs they are making a strong comeback.  It isn't rare to flush a covey because they aren't being hunted.   

As a guy guilty of baling those dreaded round bales, I plead not guilty in diminishing the quail numbers.  A couple of years back I flushed 8 pair of quail from the same trip through the field with a mower.   They all flew to the property north of me, which is abandoned ground and returning to nature.   Much of the property in this area has been abandoned(taken out of crops) or even planted with trees through the govt CRP programs so the habitat is making a strong move in the right direction.

bolo,  the reason those orchards left was mama nature wouldn't let the growers make a crop.   Way too many late frosts and late deep freezes put the orchard guys out of bidness.   Other than the usual problem with old folks die and the kids have left the farm/orchard.   
more money in cattle than apples i figure, hell i don't know.
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2023 March Maddest Champion with a little help from my friends

Pudgepork

Quote from: bolo on June 03, 2015, 05:32:00 pm
more money in cattle than apples i figure, hell i don't know.

money really wasn't as much of an influence in the changeover as it would appear.  When the orchards left, cows were cheap.  Livestock was a sloooooooow return on investment in those days but the owners had to do something.  Most of the owners were old so putting a herd of cows out to eat the grass that grew naturally made sense.  It wouldn't make as much sense for a younger guy to do the same, at the time.  Younger guys need a return on their money much quicker  usually than older financially secure people.

Weather had so much to do with it.  Apples get blistered by the upper 90's days that Arkansas experience well into October many years.   A cool night in August will turn a red apple red.  Then day after day of 90+ temps will fade that pretty red into a sick looking orange color.   The apple still isn't really ripe until late October/early Nov most years.   In 1996, a late freeze wiped out both the peach crops and apple crops in Arkansas.  Most years the late freezes and frosts would only get the peach crop but that year it got both.  It also put most of the growers still in business moving quickly to get out. 

The govt took a big interest and made demands on labor situations.   The govt pretty much took most of the chemicals that worked off of the market.  People in the orchard business were simply beating their head against a brick wall tryin to stay in business.

Buff

My backyard just north of Piedmont, OK is a hiding place for quail.  I wake up to them every morning.