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I don't understand the Stan animosity

Started by PAHog, February 21, 2006, 04:42:09 pm

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PAHog

The program under Heath has progressively gotten better in the only stat that counts, wins.

2002-03  9-19
2003-04  12-16
2004-05  18-12
2005-06  17-8 (4 reg. season games remaining and SEC Tournament)

Why fire a guy that is improving?  Patients pays off most of the time (e.g. Bill Cowher and the Pittsburgh Steelers).  What really irks me is that there are more Nutt apologists than Heath defenders.  I will take a coach (any sport) that wins more games than he did the previous year every day of the week.

Or am I totally off-base and the people who want Heath gone also want Nutt gone?  Who I'm interested to hear from are those that want Nutt to stay and Heath out.  Please defend your position.
Darksider Since October 2003...We are victorious!

LA HAWG


 

100+GM HAWG

Houston: 6 Bowls. Doing more with less..

Stan: Nothing. Doing less with more.


hoggystyle78

I have no animosity toward Stan, I simply want my BB program back among it's rightful place. I think that Stan is a good man but that in no way qualifies him to be a Div.1 HC. And if the rumors of Stan and Ramona being unhappy here are true, he will just leave at the first Big 10 job that offers him. If Stan can turn it around great, if not, then let's get someone in here who can. As far as wanting nutt gone all i can say is that I hate nutt with every fiber of my being, he's an a$$hole with an attitude toward the fans who won't accept mediocrity. I will not care if the Hogs win a NC in football, it will be in spite of the used car salesman and his BS, not because of him.    FIRE nUTT NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

TuckFexas

Quote from: hoggystyle78 on February 21, 2006, 04:48:01 pm
I have no animosity toward Stan, I simply want my BB program back among it's rightful place. I think that Stan is a good man but that in no way qualifies him to be a Div.1 HC. And if the rumors of Stan and Ramona being unhappy here are true, he will just leave at the first Big 10 job that offers him. If Stan can turn it around great, if not, then let's get someone in here who can. As far as wanting nutt gone all i can say is that I hate nutt with every fiber of my being, he's an a$$hole with an attitude toward the fans who won't accept mediocrity. I will not care if the Hogs win a NC in football, it will be in spite of the used car salesman and his BS, not because of him.    FIRE nUTT NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

At least your whining and bi*ching about Nutt are consistent. I can respect that.
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PintailKiller

Granted Stan has improved and for that I'm glad, but I think a lot of the collapses are the result of poor coaching, ie not calling a TO to stop a run or a poor substitution pattern.  From my observations, Stan does not have enough game control over his players and that is a bug problem with me.  They stand around way to much and in general, aren't aggressive.  In my playing experiences, the team's emotions mirror that of their coach.
I also want HDN gone.  Once again, I am grateful for a few good years and bringing back winning ways.  I don't feel that he can take us to a consistent top 25 level - see previous 8 years.  We all rant and rave over this years recruiting class, but according to the experts, we finished from 8-10 in the SEC.  Any real wonder why we finish there on the field?
My 2 cents.
"Just take the ball and throw it where you want to. Throw strikes. Home plate don't move."

PAHog

If Heath has 20+ wins and an NCAA bid, do you still want to see him gone after this year?
Darksider Since October 2003...We are victorious!

HawgWyld

Quote from: PAHog on February 21, 2006, 04:42:09 pm
The program under Heath has progressively gotten better in the only stat that counts, wins.

2002-03  9-19
2003-04  12-16
2004-05  18-12
2005-06  17-8 (4 reg. season games remaining and SEC Tournament)

Why fire a guy that is improving?  Patients pays off most of the time (e.g. Bill Cowher and the Pittsburgh Steelers).  What really irks me is that there are more Nutt apologists than Heath defenders.  I will take a coach (any sport) that wins more games than he did the previous year every day of the week.

Or am I totally off-base and the people who want Heath gone also want Nutt gone?  Who I'm interested to hear from are those that want Nutt to stay and Heath out.  Please defend your position.

You've got a point. However, fans are generally unhappy when the Hogs stink like they do in basketball right now. It's no wonder they're calling for Heath's head. Frankly, I'd love to see him turn things around and do believe most fans should hope for the same -- we're stuck with him as long as that underachieving Nutt is "given just one more chance" every single year.

I don't get the Nutt apologists, either. The man's got about enough business being a head coach in the SEC as does that kid down the street who plays a kick ass game of Madden 2006 on his PS2.

100+GM HAWG

Yes, because I don't think he has the ability to get us to the championship level. Going to the tourney and winning 20 games should not be the goal of Arkansas Basketball.

Rings should be the goal.  I don't think Stan can get us there.

Richard_white

Quote from: PAHog on February 21, 2006, 04:42:09 pm
The program under Heath has progressively gotten better in the only stat that counts, wins.

2002-03  9-19
2003-04  12-16
2004-05  18-12
2005-06  17-8 (4 reg. season games remaining and SEC Tournament)

Why fire a guy that is improving?  Patients pays off most of the time (e.g. Bill Cowher and the Pittsburgh Steelers).  What really irks me is that there are more Nutt apologists than Heath defenders.  I will take a coach (any sport) that wins more games than he did the previous year every day of the week.

Or am I totally off-base and the people who want Heath gone also want Nutt gone?  Who I'm interested to hear from are those that want Nutt to stay and Heath out.  Please defend your position.


How many times have Arkansas been in the top 25 under Heath? How many quality wins have Heath won except for Kansas and Florida this year? How many NCAA tournaments have Stan took the razorbacks in his tenure? One more, how many SEC tournaments games have Stan won? If you want to go by wins for Stan improving than by all means but I rather see the Razorbacks win more quality teams, win against top 25 teams, win a SEC tournament game and go into the NCAA tournament.

WPS

100+GM HAWG

They are still bowls. Postseason play. Stan hasn't done it.

PintailKiller

Quote from: PAHog on February 21, 2006, 04:53:01 pm
If Heath has 20+ wins and an NCAA bid, do you still want to see him gone after this year?

Yes!
"Just take the ball and throw it where you want to. Throw strikes. Home plate don't move."

HawgWyld

Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 04:55:22 pm
Yes, because I don't think he has the ability to get us to the championship level. Going to the tourney and winning 20 games should not be the goal of Arkansas Basketball.

Rings should be the goal.  I don't think Stan can get us there.

That's a bit surprising coming from you, considering your constant defense of that underachieving Houston Nutt. Why do you hold Stan Heath to such a high standard?

 

100+GM HAWG

I have different expectations of the two programs. I want football to win and win big. But just get your media guides out and look at the last 30 yrs in football and basketball.

Tell me which sport has won and won big more often. Of course it's basketball.

I want to go to a bowl every year and have a legitimate chance to win the SEC championship every third year. (we play in the toughest football conference next to the NFC East). I have not been happy with the last two yrs in football. But we were told they were coming, and we have had the best recruiting class in years. And the football team layed it all on the line the last game of the year against LSU with virtually nothing to play for. I'm happy with where we are headed in Football.

Basketball, we have been to several final fours, won a title and have won many league titles. Sec in basketball is not the same as SEC in football. It's good, but not football good. Stan can recruit, but he can't inspire. Where our football team plays hard every game, our basketball team plays only when they feel like it. They fear no reprucussion from there coach..


It's apples and oranges, and the fans that don't want to see that are just fooling themselves.

silvertip

Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 04:47:31 pm
Houston: 6 Bowls. Doing more with less..

Stan: Nothing. Doing less with more.



That "6 bowls" is about the lamest of the hugger excuses.
Check this out:

FOOTBALL: 56/117 = 48% of Div-1 FB schools get a Bowl.

BASKETBALL: 65/325= 20% of BB teams get NCAAT invite.

SO, it's over twice as hard to get to the NCAAT as it is to get to a bowl game.

Furthermore, Nutt has been going downhill with HIS players after starting great with Ford's players. While Heath has been steadily on the rise while doing better as Nolan's boys wash out of the program.

Both coaches have to recruit. SO, tell us why you think Nutt has "less" while Heath has "more"?

100+GM HAWG

The football program has won more SEC road games the last three years than the basketball team.

I mean, are you guys kidding me?

Sanctified Swine

Stan had to start from scratch. It has taken time, but we are getting better!!!! It is not for us to judge if the coach "should" be getting more out of what he has. The bottom line is wins and losses (specifically SEC), and with that as the bottom line we are getting better every single year.

The bottom line is not how we have done in the past (that would be completely unfair HE HAD TO START OVER), the bottom line is not our feelings about how well we should be doing with the players we have (remember Heath got them here to start with), the bottom line is much simpler than that , it is progress. Are we getting better? The answer is yes. period. NO ONE CAN ARGUE THAT!

100+GM HAWG

You can rebuild a basketball program in two to three years.

Sanctified Swine


Ugly Uncle

Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 05:12:08 pm
You can rebuild a basketball program in two to three years.

But it takes eight years to tear down a football team?
Retired Radio Host

jkstock04

Quote from: PAHog on February 21, 2006, 04:42:09 pm
The program under Heath has progressively gotten better in the only stat that counts, wins.

2002-03  9-19
2003-04  12-16
2004-05  18-12
2005-06  17-8 (4 reg. season games remaining and SEC Tournament)


It does look like slowly but surely progress on paper, and I would say the same thing...but, people on here that know a lot more than me about stats and strength of schedules say that the schedule has got considerably easier each year that stan has been here...
Thanks for the F Shack. 

Love,

Dirty Mike and the Boys

Richard_white

Quote from: Sanctified Swine on February 21, 2006, 05:10:31 pm
Stan had to start from scratch. It has taken time, but we are getting better!!!! It is not for us to judge if the coach "should" be getting more out of what he has. The bottom line is wins and losses (specifically SEC), and with that as the bottom line we are getting better every single year.

The bottom line is not how we have done in the past (that would be completely unfair HE HAD TO START OVER), the bottom line is not our feelings about how well we should be doing with the players we have (remember Heath got them here to start with), the bottom line is much simpler than that , it is progress. Are we getting better? The answer is yes. period. NO ONE CAN ARGUE THAT!
Quote from: Sanctified Swine on February 21, 2006, 05:10:31 pm
Stan had to start from scratch. It has taken time, but we are getting better!!!! It is not for us to judge if the coach "should" be getting more out of what he has. The bottom line is wins and losses (specifically SEC), and with that as the bottom line we are getting better every single year.

The bottom line is not how we have done in the past (that would be completely unfair HE HAD TO START OVER), the bottom line is not our feelings about how well we should be doing with the players we have (remember Heath got them here to start with), the bottom line is much simpler than that , it is progress. Are we getting better? The answer is yes. period. NO ONE CAN ARGUE THAT!

Patience is a virtue. That is what I been told. I wonder if U of A would tell Stan be patient getting his check. You huggers remember Stan Heath said, "Tourney or Bust". When do we start making him good on his word?

WPS

Ugly Uncle

Heath's 5-6 record this year, combined with 6-10 last year, amounts to a miserable .407 (11-16) SEC winning percentage the last two years.  But it's better than Nutt's .313 (5-11) percentage over the same time period. 

Heath needs to be replaced...right after Nutt is shown the door.- EASTEXHAWG

Thanks Eastexhawg for those stats.
Retired Radio Host

hogblade

Bill Cowher isn't a good example on patience since he went to the post-season the first 6 years of his career and a super bowl in his 5th season. If Stan had been legitmatly better and better every year so far, people wouldn't be so hard on him

 

HawgWyld

Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 05:06:43 pm
I have not been happy with the last two yrs in football. But we were told they were coming, and we have had the best recruiting class in years. And the football team layed it all on the line the last game of the year against LSU with virtually nothing to play for. I'm happy with where we are headed in Football.

And, what I'm honestly curious about is how -- as the original poster mentioned -- people show up and defend Nutt like this every single year. We've heard this all before. After a rotten season, for example, we'll hear, "Well, we've got a dynamite recruiting class coming in! They'll set the world on fire! You just wait!" When that class fails to achieve much of anything, the Nutt defenders are back with the familiar refrain of, "Hey, the team's young. Give them a year or two, and then just wait!" Meanwhile, the Hogs have gotten steadily worse since a pretty good 1998 season, yet the defenders are still there claiming success is just around the corner and etc.

Plus, the whole thing about how we knew the Razorbacks would stink for two years is baffling. Nutt mentioned that after accepting his rather generous raise and announcing he'd stay in Arkansas. That's not exactly the type of thing you want to hear from a coach that costs as much as Nutt does. Still, several fans accepted it and threw the "two-year pass" thing out as an excuse for why the Hogs lost to the likes of Vanderbilt.

I have absolutely no doubt that, should the Hogs still stink next year, people will be back to blaming assistants, claiming the team is young, talking about rough schedules, claiming Razorbacks fans shouldn't expect too much because this is just li'l ol' Arkansas and etc. -- anything but suggesting that Nutt might not be a very good coach.

Again, what is it with that guy that inspires such devotion? Nutt's teams have gotten worse and there are fans out there that think he's the greatest thing since sliced bread, even after losses in the Las Vegas Bowl, Music City Bowl, the horrible 2003 season, the miserable 2000 season when an intramural, flag football QB could move the team more effectively than players on scholarship and etc., etc. Heath, while not exactly successful, has at least shown some improvement, but he doesn't seem to have the leeway that Nutt does.

That's puzzling.

100+GM HAWG

Football is Apples

Basketball is Oranges

I know alot of you don't want to view it that way, but its a fact.

Heres another fact,

Houston is going to coach in '06.

Sanctified Swine

Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 05:12:08 pm
You can rebuild a basketball program in two to three years.

first off - I agree, you can rebuild a program in two to three years in certain situations. But each situation is different, you can't draw that up as a hard fast rule. What you can conclude is that it takes time, but not how much time. Its hard to evaluate how much work and how much time it will take to get something turned around. There are way too many variables. The only given I see in rebuilding anything is consistant improvement and progress.

So the question is ....have we had consistant improvement and progress? Of course the answer to that is yes. And as long as that is the answer every year then I say we are on the right track. Do I wish it were faster? Of course. But I am ok with slow and steady as long as it is forward. Its like a snowball - we are picking up speed and power every year. We started as nothing, but now nobody takes us lightly anymore (our biggest loss is by 5 points!) and very soon we will be the avalanche that has swallowed up the SEC and has the nation talking.

dotnet

Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 05:06:43 pm
I have different expectations of the two programs. I want football to win and win big. But just get your media guides out and look at the last 30 yrs in football and basketball.

Tell me which sport has won and won big more often. Of course it's basketball.

I want to go to a bowl every year and have a legitimate chance to win the SEC championship every third year. (we play in the toughest football conference next to the NFC East). I have not been happy with the last two yrs in football. But we were told they were coming, and we have had the best recruiting class in years. And the football team layed it all on the line the last game of the year against LSU with virtually nothing to play for. I'm happy with where we are headed in Football.

Basketball, we have been to several final fours, won a title and have won many league titles. Sec in basketball is not the same as SEC in football. It's good, but not football good. Stan can recruit, but he can't inspire. Where our football team plays hard every game, our basketball team plays only when they feel like it. They fear no reprucussion from there coach..


It's apples and oranges, and the fans that don't want to see that are just fooling themselves.

You have to be joking.  Here are the teams and their records for the NFC east:

NY Giants  11-5
Washington  10-6
Dallas  9-7
Eagles  6-10

And now the AFC West:
Denver 13-3
Kansas City  10-6
Chargers  9-7
Raiders 4-12

It looks kind of close if you just look at the records.  When you take into account which conference both of these teams played in, its obvious that the west is tougher.  This doesn't even account for the fact that the NFC East is not a conference but a division and that the AFC is the toughest conference in football.

I understand what you're saying about the respective teams recent history, but there are some major differences.  No matter what had happened seven (or so) years earlier, the team that Stan was left with was terrible.  No coaching was going to make a difference.  Every year since then, he has battled back and continued to improve. 

The more Nutt has relied on the players that he has brought in and the program that he has built, the team has declined.  The more Stan has relied on his players that he has brought in and the program that he is building, we have continued to improve. 

I don't necessarily hate Nutt and I'm okay with him sticking around a couple of more years (though I'll be honest, I'd rather have ole Butch), but I don't think there is anyway that you can be satisfied with Nutt and complain about Stan.

Ugly Uncle

Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 05:23:23 pm
Football is Apples

Basketball is Oranges

I know alot of you don't want to view it that way, but its a fact.

Heres another fact,

Houston is going to coach in '06.

Actually, he is not.  He will watch others coach and try to meld personalities on the staff.

If he tries to coach, he will be fired.  Deny that if you want to, but that is a fact.
Retired Radio Host

dotnet

Quote from: uglyuncle on February 21, 2006, 05:26:38 pm
Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 05:23:23 pm
Football is Apples

Basketball is Oranges

I know alot of you don't want to view it that way, but its a fact.

Heres another fact,

Houston is going to coach in '06.

Actually, he is not.  He will watch others coach and try to meld personalities on the staff.

If he tries to coach, he will be fired.  Deny that if you want to, but that is a fact.

So is Pete Carroll not going to coach in 06 either?  Neither is Bob Stoops?  I think we're finally going to see Nutt be a real head coach instead of offensive coordinator who far to often forgets that he is also head coach.

HawgWyld

Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 05:23:23 pm
Football is Apples

Basketball is Oranges

That gets back to the original point -- you seem to be going out of your way to bash one underperforming coach while defending another. Why is that? What, precisely, has Nutt done that lets him off the hook while (in your view) Heath deserves to be fired? Granted, whipping Texas in the Cotton Bowl was outstanding and the 1998 season was dandy, but what has Nutt done outside of that that causes people to defend him so adamantly?

100+GM HAWG

Well, I guess since Bill Belichick has two coordinators that he is not coaching either.

Your logic is silly.

100+GM HAWG

Look, all the arguments have been layed out over and over as why to support Nutt and why to hate Nutt. I'm not going to change anyones opinion, and don't really care to try.

I just simply call it like I see it. I've played and been around high school athletics all my life. I have my opinions. I have backed them up. Some feel differently and I understand.

The last two years in Football have sucked. So I know why people feel the way they do.

All those that hate nutt will continue to rail against him.

100+GM HAWG


dj shanon "Notshavin" smeya

Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 04:47:31 pm
Houston: 6 Bowls. Doing more with less..

Does more with less what?  Talent?  Money?  Free passes?  New Hires to protect him?

Say The Nutt does more with (HIS OWN) less intelligence, less competence and with his total Shite for brains, and you might have a point.
published songwriter(ASCAP)/audio production/radio jingles/producer<br /><br />Audio Production/Music

R.I.P. notshavintilnuttgo 12/11/07

dotnet

I'm not against you supporting Nutt.  I guess I just think its crazy to support Nutt and to bash Stan all at the same time.

BigHog396

Quote from: silvertip on February 21, 2006, 05:08:15 pm
Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 04:47:31 pm
Houston: 6 Bowls. Doing more with less..

Stan: Nothing. Doing less with more.



That "6 bowls" is about the lamest of the hugger excuses.
Check this out:

FOOTBALL: 56/117 = 48% of Div-1 FB schools get a Bowl.

BASKETBALL: 65/325= 20% of BB teams get NCAAT invite.

SO, it's over twice as hard to get to the NCAAT as it is to get to a bowl game.

Furthermore, Nutt has been going downhill with HIS players after starting great with Ford's players. While Heath has been steadily on the rise while doing better as Nolan's boys wash out of the program.

Both coaches have to recruit. SO, tell us why you think Nutt has "less" while Heath has "more"?
You are kidding... right?  When you are a mid-level SEC team, you are basically guaranteed a spot in both bowl games for football, and in the NCAA tournament in basketball year-in and year-out.  The SEC has 7 or 8 guaranteed bowls if we have that many +.500 teams.  In a typical year, the top 6-8 SEC basketball teams make the NCAA tournament.  Your "statistics" are completely skewed, and show just how easy it is to make "statistics" support any point of view you may want to take.

For South-East-North-West Louisiana it's twice as hard, but to say that it is for an SEC school is a total joke.  Our basketball team has basically the same chance the football team does to make post-season play EVERY year.

Whether WE like it or not, Nutt WAS told he had a two-year pass.  He now has everything in place to succeed.  If he doesn't, he will be shown the door and Malzahn will probably end-up taking his place.  Heath's firing was setup last year with the "direction of the program" memorandum he was required to write-up for JFB.  If he doesn't make the dance this year, he should be shown the door.  The improvement has been there, but it has NOT shown on the road.  Heath's recruiting has left much to be desired, and it all comes down to wins and losses.  Look at North Carolina and Tennessee just to name two, to see what a difference coaching WILL make.  Heck, look at what Mike Anderson has done at UAB... did anyone know anything about UAB basketball prior to Anderson showing up?

Richard_white

It's basketball season why not bash on Heath, wait until football season I will have alot to say about Houston Nutt..lol

idochog

Quote from: opineonswine on February 21, 2006, 04:54:54 pm
Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 04:47:31 pm
Houston: 6 Bowls. Doing more with less..

Stan: Nothing. Doing less with more.



Oh, pa-leeeeze.  You must be kidding.  half the bowls were like the NIT AND he's lost all but 2 of those.  I could go on for days.  Neither program has done diddly in 5 years.  Please don't use HDN as the standard we want to measure by.



A-freakin-men.  "you made a good call, brotha"
I love Jesus!

dj shanon "Notshavin" smeya

Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 05:23:23 pm

Heres another fact,

Houston is going to coach in '06.

No he's not, he is viewed as a puppet only and will either:

1.  Sit back and chew his fingernails, hoping the real coaches and players can win just enough to keep him his job. 

or

2.  His arrogance will get the best of him and he will start to meddle...At which point he will be fired on the spot.

So keep supporting your arrogant puppet.
:puke:
published songwriter(ASCAP)/audio production/radio jingles/producer<br /><br />Audio Production/Music

R.I.P. notshavintilnuttgo 12/11/07

Niels Boar

February 21, 2006, 06:21:41 pm #40 Last Edit: February 21, 2006, 06:26:01 pm by Niels Boar
Quote from: PAHog on February 21, 2006, 04:42:09 pm
The program under Heath has progressively gotten better in the only stat that counts, wins.

2002-03  9-19
2003-04  12-16
2004-05  18-12
2005-06  17-8 (4 reg. season games remaining and SEC Tournament)

Why fire a guy that is improving?  Patients pays off most of the time (e.g. Bill Cowher and the Pittsburgh Steelers).  What really irks me is that there are more Nutt apologists than Heath defenders.  I will take a coach (any sport) that wins more games than he did the previous year every day of the week.

Or am I totally off-base and the people who want Heath gone also want Nutt gone?  Who I'm interested to hear from are those that want Nutt to stay and Heath out.  Please defend your position.

This point gets made and shot down about twice a week.  Here's the stock reply.

Increasing wins are almost entirely attributable to decreasing schedule strength.  Here is a look at our schedules according to RPI from the previous two seasons.  The number in parentheses is the end-of-year RPI rating of the opponent.  Cutoffs are at 25, 50, and 100.  You can see we played as many games against the top 50 in 03-04 as the top 100 in 04-05.  The 02-03 schedule was tougher than 03-04.  The schedule Nolan played his last season was tougher still.

Here are the schedules of the last two years in order of descending RPI:

2003-2004                                    2004-2005
Kentucky (1, L)                              Illinois(4, L)
MSU(4, L)                                      Kentucky(11, L)
MSU(4, L)                                      Bama(13, L)
OSU(6, L)                                      Bama(13, L)
UF(13, L)                                       LSU(24, L)
Illinois(23, L)                                 LSU(24, W)
Bama(26, L)                                   UF(28, L)
Bama(26, L)                                   MSU(30, L)
Vandy(27, W)                                MSU(30, L)
LSU(39, L)                                     Vandy(64, L)
LSU(39, L)                                     Winthrop(71, W)
USC(45, W)                                   Missouri(88, W)
UGA(47, L)                                     USC(94, L)
UT(78, L)                                      UT(131, W)
Auburn(79, L)                                Gardner Webb (142, W)
Auburn(79, W)                               Tennessee St. (143, W)
Ole Miss(96, L)                                Auburn(152, L)
Ole Miss (96, W)                              Auburn(152, W)
Oral Roberts(157, W)                      Ole Miss(154, W)
Louisiana Tech(158, W)                   Ole Miss(154, W)
Tulsa(197, W)                                Lipscomb(211, W)
Western Carolina(236, L)                 Troy(213, W)
North Texas(240, W)                      UGA(228, W)
Jacksonville(251, W)                        Eastern Michigan(257, W)
SEMSt(267, W)                              Tulsa(263, W)
Grambling(296, W)                          Hartford(300, W)
Nicholl's St(325, W)                         Jacksonville St. (311, W)
                                                    Louisiana-Monroe(315, W)



Top 5 RPI wins:
2004: 27, 45, 79, 96, 157
2005: 24, 71, 88, 131, 142

winning percentage against top 100:
2004: 22%
2005: 23%

Games against 100+:
2004: 9
2005: 15

Easiest conference game:
2004: Ole Miss(96)
2005: UGA(228)*

*5 conference games in 2004-2005 were against teams that were worse than any in 2003-2004

Projected wins of 2004 team against 2005 schedule:
multiply winning percentage in respective category (1-25, 26-50, 50-100, 100+) times number of games in category: 17

Projected conference record of 2005 team against 2004 SEC: 4-12

Considering the downward trend in SOS and the upward trend in roster and experience, Heath has shown little in coaching chops to this point.

PintailKiller

"Just take the ball and throw it where you want to. Throw strikes. Home plate don't move."

waphill

UA                                   UAB
2001-02  14-15                 13-17
*2002-03  9-19                *21-13     
2003-04  12-16                 22-10
2004-05  18-12                 22-11
2005-06  17-8                   22-5

*new coaches' first year

I think MA did a better job rebuilding UAB. I realize he doesn't play in the SEC, but he doesn't have the UA facilities to recruit to, either.

HawgWyld

Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 05:35:55 pm
All those that hate nutt will continue to rail against him.

And, the same is true of Heath. Hell, none of this has much to do with logic, does it? Fans are, by and large, driven by emotion, so it's only natural some will love the heck out of one coach and hate another like mad. Even if the two coaches in question really aren't that great.

Sanctified Swine

Quote from: Niels Boar on February 21, 2006, 06:21:41 pm
Quote from: PAHog on February 21, 2006, 04:42:09 pm
The program under Heath has progressively gotten better in the only stat that counts, wins.

2002-03  9-19
2003-04  12-16
2004-05  18-12
2005-06  17-8 (4 reg. season games remaining and SEC Tournament)

Why fire a guy that is improving?  Patients pays off most of the time (e.g. Bill Cowher and the Pittsburgh Steelers).  What really irks me is that there are more Nutt apologists than Heath defenders.  I will take a coach (any sport) that wins more games than he did the previous year every day of the week.

Or am I totally off-base and the people who want Heath gone also want Nutt gone?  Who I'm interested to hear from are those that want Nutt to stay and Heath out.  Please defend your position.

This point gets made and shot down about twice a week.  Here's the stock reply.

Increasing wins are almost entirely attributable to decreasing schedule strength.  Here is a look at our schedules according to RPI from the previous two seasons.  The number in parentheses is the end-of-year RPI rating of the opponent.  Cutoffs are at 25, 50, and 100.  You can see we played as many games against the top 50 in 03-04 as the top 100 in 04-05.  The 02-03 schedule was tougher than 03-04.  The schedule Nolan played his last season was tougher still.

Here are the schedules of the last two years in order of descending RPI:

2003-2004                                    2004-2005
Kentucky (1, L)                              Illinois(4, L)
MSU(4, L)                                      Kentucky(11, L)
MSU(4, L)                                      Bama(13, L)
OSU(6, L)                                      Bama(13, L)
UF(13, L)                                       LSU(24, L)
Illinois(23, L)                                 LSU(24, W)
Bama(26, L)                                   UF(28, L)
Bama(26, L)                                   MSU(30, L)
Vandy(27, W)                                MSU(30, L)
LSU(39, L)                                     Vandy(64, L)
LSU(39, L)                                     Winthrop(71, W)
USC(45, W)                                   Missouri(88, W)
UGA(47, L)                                     USC(94, L)
UT(78, L)                                      UT(131, W)
Auburn(79, L)                                Gardner Webb (142, W)
Auburn(79, W)                               Tennessee St. (143, W)
Ole Miss(96, L)                                Auburn(152, L)
Ole Miss (96, W)                              Auburn(152, W)
Oral Roberts(157, W)                      Ole Miss(154, W)
Louisiana Tech(158, W)                   Ole Miss(154, W)
Tulsa(197, W)                                Lipscomb(211, W)
Western Carolina(236, L)                 Troy(213, W)
North Texas(240, W)                      UGA(228, W)
Jacksonville(251, W)                        Eastern Michigan(257, W)
SEMSt(267, W)                              Tulsa(263, W)
Grambling(296, W)                          Hartford(300, W)
Nicholl's St(325, W)                         Jacksonville St. (311, W)
                                                    Louisiana-Monroe(315, W)



Top 5 RPI wins:
2004: 27, 45, 79, 96, 157
2005: 24, 71, 88, 131, 142

winning percentage against top 100:
2004: 22%
2005: 23%

Games against 100+:
2004: 9
2005: 15

Easiest conference game:
2004: Ole Miss(96)
2005: UGA(228)*

*5 conference games in 2004-2005 were against teams that were worse than any in 2003-2004

Projected wins of 2004 team against 2005 schedule:
multiply winning percentage in respective category (1-25, 26-50, 50-100, 100+) times number of games in category: 17

Projected conference record of 2005 team against 2004 SEC: 4-12

Considering the downward trend in SOS and the upward trend in roster and experience, Heath has shown little in coaching chops to this point.

Quote from: PintailKiller on February 21, 2006, 06:29:16 pm
Excellent Niels.

HIS RECORD AGAINST THE SEC HAS IMPROVED EVERY YEAR!!! We are also moving higher up in the standings EVERY YEAR!!

Man some people just don't get it!!

dmhog v2.0

Quote from: PAHog on February 21, 2006, 04:42:09 pm
The program under Heath has progressively gotten better in the only stat that counts, wins.

2002-03  9-19
2003-04  12-16
2004-05  18-12
2005-06  17-8 (4 reg. season games remaining and SEC Tournament)

Why fire a guy that is improving?  Patients pays off most of the time (e.g. Bill Cowher and the Pittsburgh Steelers).  What really irks me is that there are more Nutt apologists than Heath defenders.  I will take a coach (any sport) that wins more games than he did the previous year every day of the week.

Or am I totally off-base and the people who want Heath gone also want Nutt gone?  Who I'm interested to hear from are those that want Nutt to stay and Heath out.  Please defend your position.

These people love Nutt and hate Heath when Nutt's teams are getting worse and Heath's improve.

Racists, I tell you. The whole lot of them.

HamHands

Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 04:47:31 pm
Houston: 6 Bowls. Doing more with less..

Stan: Nothing. Doing less with more.





Nutt is saved by the fact that there are a gazillion bowls and only one NCAAT. How many BCS bowls has Nutt taken us too? Stan is doing better, but the jury is still out.
One day at a time.

BigHog396

Quote from: HoginHeat on February 21, 2006, 11:10:36 pm
Quote from: 100+GM HAWG on February 21, 2006, 04:47:31 pm
Houston: 6 Bowls. Doing more with less..

Stan: Nothing. Doing less with more.





Nutt is saved by the fact that there are a gazillion bowls and only one NCAAT. How many BCS bowls has Nutt taken us too? Stan is doing better, but the jury is still out.
Again... 6-8 SEC football teams make it to bowl games, and 6-8 SEC basketball teams make it to the NCAA Tournament, just about every year.  That means the two teams have basically the same chance, in relation to the rest of the teams in the SEC, to make post season play.  Where is the big disparity that makes it so much more impressive for the basketball team to make "The Dance"?

dmhog v2.0

Quote from: BigHog396 on February 21, 2006, 11:15:55 pm
]
Again... 6-8 SEC football teams make it to bowl games, and 6-8 SEC basketball teams make it to the NCAA Tournament, just about every year.  That means the two teams have basically the same chance, in relation to the rest of the teams in the SEC, to make post season play.  Where is the big disparity that makes it so much more impressive for the basketball team to make "The Dance"?

Wow. I did not know that our football teams play 14 conference games. And last time I checked there was a rule in place that a team was not bowl eligible with a losing record.

This may have been the dumbest post in the history of the internet.

hawgopolis

OMGOSH, WE LOSE, WE GRIPE, WE WIN, WE GRIPE.  LET'S ENJOY IT UNTIL SATURDAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!THEN KICK THE VOLS AND SLAP PHATPHIL UPSIDE HIS GOURD WHIILE WE ARE THERE.

GOHOGSGO!!!
Football! It's what's for Dinner, and Supper, and Breffass!!!

If at first you should fail...... Skydiving is probably not for you!!