THE MAIN problem with Ar basketball

[hogsanity]

When Nolan took over, he made his teams out of ATHLETES who could play his style, but were not prototypical basketball players.  They were so athletic they just overwhelmed most teams with their style of play.  Look when his teams always got into trouble, it was when the other team controlled the tempo and forced Nolan's guys to play fundamental basketball.

In the late 90's, other teams, especially the elite teams, started to get more players who were both bb players and exceptional athletes, while Nolan just kept getting athletes. 

I still do not see basketball players filling our roster, I see athletic types who can play some ball, for the most part.  Now, it is too early to tell on this particular group.  I hope to see more bb talent, but I will not hold my breath.

[razorhead94]

Very good point..I think nobles could serve as a good example.  He wasn't the super savy recruit coming out of high school bc he wasn't 6'5" and didn't have a 40" vertical but he seems to be very sound in running the point guard position.  There were many times in the game against lousiville where nobles could penetrate pretty easily and make a good pass to the post.  But like you said time will tell with this group.

[The Hogfather]

When Nolan took over, he made his teams out of ATHLETES who could play his style, but were not prototypical basketball players.  They were so athletic they just overwhelmed most teams with their style of play.  Look when his teams always got into trouble, it was when the other team controlled the tempo and forced Nolan's guys to play fundamental basketball.

In the late 90's, other teams, especially the elite teams, started to get more players who were both bb players and exceptional athletes, while Nolan just kept getting athletes. 

I still do not see basketball players filling our roster, I see athletic types who can play some ball, for the most part.  Now, it is too early to tell on this particular group.  I hope to see more bb talent, but I will not hold my breath.

Hmmmm....interesting take.....I disagree completely.

[razorhead94]

Nolans best team were guys that were athletic and sound bball players.  See corey beck, scotty thurman, and corliss williamson

[jst01]

IMO Rot, Powell, Nobles, Farmer, Bryant all look to be 'basketball players', they also happen to be athletic.

[donewithdale]

When Nolan took over, he made his teams out of ATHLETES who could play his style, but were not prototypical basketball players.  They were so athletic they just overwhelmed most teams with their style of play.  Look when his teams always got into trouble, it was when the other team controlled the tempo and forced Nolan's guys to play fundamental basketball.

In the late 90's, other teams, especially the elite teams, started to get more players who were both bb players and exceptional athletes, while Nolan just kept getting athletes. 

I still do not see basketball players filling our roster, I see athletic types who can play some ball, for the most part.  Now, it is too early to tell on this particular group.  I hope to see more bb talent, but I will not hold my breath.

You are badly underrating and misrepresenting our players from about 88 - 97.  Those players were very skilled basketball players.  Guys like Oliver Miller who had exceptional hands and touch and basketball IQ.  Players we rarely talk about like Butch Morris who was a skilled forward.  I shouldn't even have to mention Lee who was our most complete PG probably ever and his skills or Todd.  True Nolan had some athletes but I wouldn't consider Scotty an athlete or Dwight Stewart.  If Scotty were athletic, he would have played in the NBA.  Beck wasn't a great athlete as far as fast or someone with exceptional leaping ability.  Brandon Dean was much much more athletic than Corey. 

I would have to say your post really misses and is insulting to Nolan's coaching ability and many of the players of that era.  For instance, its incredible the difference in the shooting ability of the players from 88 through the good seasons to the "athletes" Nolan had towards the end.

The other teams benifitted from a number of things including the rules changes and the extra timeouts that came in to college basketball.

[donewithdale]

Nolans best team were guys that were athletic and sound bball players.  See corey beck, scotty thurman, and corliss williamson

Our NC group may have been one of the least athletic until Nolan's last group he left behind.  Clint McDaniel was a speedster and athlete and Corliss could move well for a man his size.  The other starters weren't athletes in the same sense as a Sunday Adebayo or Brandon Dean was an athlete.  Not even in that class of athlete. 

[thirtythree]

IMO Rot, Powell, Nobles, Farmer, Bryant all look to be 'basketball players', they also happen to be athletic.

This^^^^^^

[PorkRyan]

When Nolan took over, he made his teams out of ATHLETES who could play his style, but were not prototypical basketball players.  They were so athletic they just overwhelmed most teams with their style of play.  Look when his teams always got into trouble, it was when the other team controlled the tempo and forced Nolan's guys to play fundamental basketball.

In the late 90's, other teams, especially the elite teams, started to get more players who were both bb players and exceptional athletes, while Nolan just kept getting athletes. 

I still do not see basketball players filling our roster, I see athletic types who can play some ball, for the most part.  Now, it is too early to tell on this particular group.  I hope to see more bb talent, but I will not hold my breath.

You are pretty much completely wrong.  Alabama is the school that had the athletes that could jump out of the gym, and we had very few of those players.  Day, Hood, McDaniel, and Brandon Dean are the guys that stand out as tremendous athletes.  Mayberry, Hawkins, Miller, Linn, Rimac, Lee Wilson, Thurman, Corliss, Darnell, Beck, Stewart, those guys weren't superb athletes.  When we won a national title we didn't even press very much.  We ran a 4 out 1 in offense around Corliss and dominated.  Nolan was the master of finding players that fit his system and getting them to play as hard as they could.  Nolan's demise started when he started signing guys like Gilbert, Jennings, etc.

[hogsanity]

Our NC group may have been one of the least athletic until Nolan's last group he left behind.  Clint McDaniel was a speedster and athlete and Corliss could move well for a man his size.  The other starters weren't athletes in the same sense as a Sunday Adebayo or Brandon Dean was an athlete.  Not even in that class of athlete. 

Yes, the least athletic team was the one that won the NC.  Kind of proves what I am saying.  I did not say we had no bb skills or bb players, but, by and large we had athletes who could play ball, not ball players who were athletes. 

[Brass Knob]

When Nolan took over, he made his teams out of ATHLETES who could play his style, but were not prototypical basketball players.  They were so athletic they just overwhelmed most teams with their style of play.  Look when his teams always got into trouble, it was when the other team controlled the tempo and forced Nolan's guys to play fundamental basketball.

In the late 90's, other teams, especially the elite teams, started to get more players who were both bb players and exceptional athletes, while Nolan just kept getting athletes. 

I still do not see basketball players filling our roster, I see athletic types who can play some ball, for the most part.  Now, it is too early to tell on this particular group.  I hope to see more bb talent, but I will not hold my breath.

I am a little confused... Are you still trying to blame Nolan for the current state of this program?

[dddollars]

When Nolan took over, he made his teams out of ATHLETES who could play his style, but were not prototypical basketball players.  They were so athletic they just overwhelmed most teams with their style of play.  Look when his teams always got into trouble, it was when the other team controlled the tempo and forced Nolan's guys to play fundamental basketball.

In the late 90's, other teams, especially the elite teams, started to get more players who were both bb players and exceptional athletes, while Nolan just kept getting athletes. 

I still do not see basketball players filling our roster, I see athletic types who can play some ball, for the most part.  Now, it is too early to tell on this particular group.  I hope to see more bb talent, but I will not hold my breath.

I agree with this completely

[1highhog]

Nolan's demise came about when Nolan quit recruiting, matter of fact, the last three years he was here he quit Coaching as well.  Anyone that watched those games during those years new that Mike Anderson was the Coach, Nolan was collecting a paycheck.

[The Boar War]

Nolan's demise came about when Nolan quit recruiting, matter of fact, the last three years he was here he quit Coaching as well.  Anyone that watched those games during those years new that Mike Anderson was the Coach, Nolan was collecting a paycheck.

  I think he had reached a level where he believed that the elite recruits would crawl to play at Arkansas.  The only problem is that all the coaches at all the elite programs have to pamper every single top recruit they get.  In addition the 40 minutes of hell is not particularly fun for the players. 

Mike Anderson may have had the reigns at that time.  If he did it's important to understand that it was (gee) almost 10 years ago.  A lot of people will hold that against Anderson.  Imagine if you go to your boss for an annual review and he judges you not on the performance you've given after you learned your job but reviews you solely on the production from your very first day. 

[hogsanity]

I am a little confused... Are you still trying to blame Nolan for the current state of this program?

NO, not at all, and I thoroughly enjoyed watching his teams play, except for the last 2 seasons.  What I am saying, much of the success most of us remember was built on a recruiting philosophy and style that will not work anymore.  We have to find a way to get basketball players who are athletic, not athletes who can play a little ball.  I want a PG who will be a PG, his job is to get the ball to OTHERS.  I want guys who realize on defense you can not leave a 3pt shooter open.  I want post players who can freaking block out.

[Lando Calrissian]

IMO Rot, Powell, Nobles, Farmer, Bryant all look to be 'basketball players', they also happen to be athletic.

I agree.

So what does that say about Pelphery???

[Brass Knob]

NO, not at all, and I thoroughly enjoyed watching his teams play, except for the last 2 seasons.  What I am saying, much of the success most of us remember was built on a recruiting philosophy and style that will not work anymore.  We have to find a way to get basketball players who are athletic, not athletes who can play a little ball.  I want a PG who will be a PG, his job is to get the ball to OTHERS.  I want guys who realize on defense you can not leave a 3pt shooter open.  I want post players who can freaking block out.

Gotcha and I definitely agree with that.