Eddie Sutton found unconscious in his car

[Pork Twain]

You make your bed and you get to sleep in it.  When using the term disease with alcohol it is just an excuse.  It is not a disease, it is a bad choice.  I wish I could say every bad choice I ever made in my life was a disease.  Alcoholics are pathetic, weak people just like drug addicts

I'm sorry that you grew up in such a difficult situation, however, don't try to stereotype all alcoholics into that category.  There have been several people who have overcome their addiction and have served their communities very well......

Except "W".......

I am proud of THOSE people that were stronger than their addiction.  I don't wish anyone ill but I reserve my sympathy for those that deserve it.

Sorry I let emtional Jimmy post here and I will not post on this anymore.  If you would like to discuss or debate feel free to Im or email me.

[oldfart]

yes and they were not all related to alcohol.  I knew Eddie sort of peripherally in those days (our kids were in school together and saw him off and on at school functions when BB season was over) and I sincerely hope that whatever this is he can overcome it. 

and they were wider than just alcohol.

You can say that again. 

You know what I mean.  If you were around Fayetteville the last 2-3 years he coached there......Eddie had a lot of issues.

[wacohog]

15% of the population carries the gene for Chem dependancy(alcohol, drugs, etc.) The problem lies in the so-called ''pleasure pathway'' of the brain. Affected individuals have a brain chemistry response that is different than the rest of the population than others. If I have a drink--no big deal. If an alcoholic drinks, he gets a flood of neurotransmittors in the ''pleasure'' part of his brain. The cravings set in quickly, as does the need to restimulate this area. I heard one expert state that the feeling of well-beeing that an alcoholic gets from using is several hundre times more than one obtains post-orgasm. So. you can see that this is a very powerful force in these people.

Now, these FACTS don't obviate the need and responsibility for sobriety. But, they do put in perspective how difficult the journey to sobriety can be for some people.

Thos of you that don't understand that this is a disease are wrong...you are uninformed and wrong. I suggest you do some reading, talk to a Doctor that treats these poor souls before you judge.

We sometimes unfairly judge that which we do not understand. It is no sin to be wrong. It is a sin to judge.

FWIW, I do not have it, but I have family that do. I am also a physician, and I can assure you I know much more about this than you.

[flhog1]

15% of the population carries the gene for Chem dependancy(alcohol, drugs, etc.) The problem lies in the so-called ''pleasure pathway'' of the brain. Affected individuals have a brain chemistry response that is different than the rest of the population than others. If I have a drink--no big deal. If an alcoholic drinks, he gets a flood of neurotransmittors in the ''pleasure'' part of his brain. The cravings set in quickly, as does the need to restimulate this area. I heard one expert state that the feeling of well-beeing that an alcoholic gets from using is several hundre times more than one obtains post-orgasm. So. you can see that this is a very powerful force in these people.

Now, these FACTS don't obviate the need and responsibility for sobriety. But, they do put in perspective how difficult the journey to sobriety can be for some people.

Thos of you that don't understand that this is a disease are wrong...you are uninformed and wrong. I suggest you do some reading, talk to a Doctor that treats these poor souls before you judge.

We sometimes unfairly judge that which we do not understand. It is no sin to be wrong. It is a sin to judge.

FWIW, I do not have it, but I have family that do. I am also a physician, and I can assure you I know much more about this than you.

Well said Waco.......

[Pork Twain]

15% of the population carries the gene for Chem dependancy(alcohol, drugs, etc.) The problem lies in the so-called ''pleasure pathway'' of the brain. Affected individuals have a brain chemistry response that is different than the rest of the population than others. If I have a drink--no big deal. If an alcoholic drinks, he gets a flood of neurotransmittors in the ''pleasure'' part of his brain. The cravings set in quickly, as does the need to restimulate this area. I heard one expert state that the feeling of well-beeing that an alcoholic gets from using is several hundre times more than one obtains post-orgasm. So. you can see that this is a very powerful force in these people.

Now, these FACTS don't obviate the need and responsibility for sobriety. But, they do put in perspective how difficult the journey to sobriety can be for some people.

Thos of you that don't understand that this is a disease are wrong...you are uninformed and wrong. I suggest you do some reading, talk to a Doctor that treats these poor souls before you judge.

We sometimes unfairly judge that which we do not understand. It is no sin to be wrong. It is a sin to judge.

FWIW, I do not have it, but I have family that do. I am also a physician, and I can assure you I know much more about this than you.

Your specialty is alcoholism???   There are a lot of different fields in medicine and there are a lot of different theories on alcohoism.

If judging is a sin then this board is full of it.  I know I am guilty...

[PigPusher]

Once a DRUNK always a DRUNK   What a shame such a great Basketball Coach laid low by the Bottle.  :razorback:

I happen to know one who hasn't had a drink in 17 years.

If you ask the Tempatation is still there; as strong as The three Sirens Pisinoe, Aglaope and Thelxiepi were to Odysseus.

Cripes!  Are we into Western classical lit again. Very impressive.

[flhog1]

BP.....you are digging yourself deeper......take your own advice from earlier and let it go.....don't insult the physician.....I have 30 years experience in healthcare and have met hundreds of physicians that didn't "specialize" in alcoholism, but have studied and observed enough to have a true understanding of the beast.  

[roothogornotatall]

15% of the population carries the gene for Chem dependancy(alcohol, drugs, etc.) The problem lies in the so-called ''pleasure pathway'' of the brain. Affected individuals have a brain chemistry response that is different than the rest of the population than others. If I have a drink--no big deal. If an alcoholic drinks, he gets a flood of neurotransmittors in the ''pleasure'' part of his brain. The cravings set in quickly, as does the need to restimulate this area. I heard one expert state that the feeling of well-beeing that an alcoholic gets from using is several hundre times more than one obtains post-orgasm. So. you can see that this is a very powerful force in these people.

Now, these FACTS don't obviate the need and responsibility for sobriety. But, they do put in perspective how difficult the journey to sobriety can be for some people.

Thos of you that don't understand that this is a disease are wrong...you are uninformed and wrong. I suggest you do some reading, talk to a Doctor that treats these poor souls before you judge.

We sometimes unfairly judge that which we do not understand. It is no sin to be wrong. It is a sin to judge.

FWIW, I do not have it, but I have family that do. I am also a physician, and I can assure you I know much more about this than you.

Your specialty is alcoholism???   There are a lot of different fields in medicine and there are a lot of different theories on alcohoism.

If judging is a sin then this board is full of it.  I know I am guilty...

well maybe there are a lot of theories but his is the best i've heard so far.  i couldn't have said it any better myself and i do have an alcohol problem.  i can say that here because i'm just a name on a message board.  like he said, he, and most others can have a drink and be cool.  others, like me cant.  i always call it an "itch".  and i have to scratch it.  i'm on leave from work as we spaek to deal with this problem.  am i dealing with it very well?  not so far.  the fact that i'm not supposed to drink always keeps it on my mind so its more tempting to drink.  plus, i tend to be more sneaky about it, meaning hittong the vodka bottle more than drinking a lot of beer.  i went and checked in to place today in little rock, it will be outpatient, though.  do i think it will help?  not really, because i'm not as serious about it as i should be.  i shouldnt even say that.  but then again, i've never been to classes, maybe my whole moind-set will change.

having for some odd reason just admitted all that- dont view me as a drunken bafoon on the boards.

but yeah beopig, the man knows what he's talking about, obviously.

late.

[WILL CLINTON]

Eddie is Hog. Once a Hog always a Hogs. My thoughts and prayers go to him and his family.

Yep, he helped build the Arkansas basketball team from nothing to something special.  He deserves everyone's thoughts and prayers, not their ridicule!

So he deserves this because of what he did on a basketball court, or because he is an alcoholic??  Because if it is what he did on the basketball court, then we should have a statue of Nolan in front of Bud Walton, or rename it, the house that Nolan built.  If it is because of him being an alcoholic, you have to say the same thing about every crackhead or methhead around.  If alcoholism is a disease, then so is someone who is addicted to crack, meth, cocaine, or any other drug. 

I am just of the opinion that no drug addiction is a disease, it is a choice.  And before you try to crucify me, I have had alcoholics, and people die from it, and drug addiction, and people die from it, in my family, and very close friends.  And I told them the same thing I will say now.  They are weak, and use drugs/alcohol as crutches. 

You ought to be embarrassed for posting this...God bless you!

I am not embarrassed by it at all.  Alcoholics should be embarrassed that they have gotten over on everybody, when crack addicts, meth addicts, and other drug abusers still carry the stigma of being an addict, and not suffering from a disease. 

How in the hell you can even call alcoholism a disease is beyond me.  And to the person who relates it to cancer, are you serious??  Have you really been brainwashed, or are you so weak to to believe that??  I can't sit around, never take a drink and suffer and die from alcoholism.  I can from cancer.  Alcoholism doesn't have a hold on you, or affect you if you never take a drink, plain and simple. 

Oh, and thanks for the blessings, God blesses me everyday and has since I became a Christian at the age of 13.  God bless you also. 

[roothogornotatall]

and damn, i toally regret every word of that.

[Pork Twain]

http://www.peele.net/lib/atlcgene.html

Most theories concerning alcoholism state that the child is more likely to drink when they come from a family of alcoholism than a child that does not come from a family of alcoholism.  They want to say that there is a gene and that it is hereditary.  I say it is learned behavior.  There is a higher prevalence of children that turn into abusive adults when they come from abusive families.  Does that make domestic violence a disease?  Is alcoholism a disease because it is legal while coke, crack, meth are all just addictions because they are illegal.  Who gets to make those distinctions???

Maybe there is a disease involved called depression and that triggers the person to turn to alcohol.  I can drink and I feel sorry for those that HAVE to drink.  That is a sad life to live.

[roothogornotatall]

Eddie is Hog. Once a Hog always a Hogs. My thoughts and prayers go to him and his family.

Yep, he helped build the Arkansas basketball team from nothing to something special.  He deserves everyone's thoughts and prayers, not their ridicule!

So he deserves this because of what he did on a basketball court, or because he is an alcoholic??  Because if it is what he did on the basketball court, then we should have a statue of Nolan in front of Bud Walton, or rename it, the house that Nolan built.  If it is because of him being an alcoholic, you have to say the same thing about every crackhead or methhead around.  If alcoholism is a disease, then so is someone who is addicted to crack, meth, cocaine, or any other drug. 

I am just of the opinion that no drug addiction is a disease, it is a choice.  And before you try to crucify me, I have had alcoholics, and people die from it, and drug addiction, and people die from it, in my family, and very close friends.  And I told them the same thing I will say now.  They are weak, and use drugs/alcohol as crutches. 

You ought to be embarrassed for posting this...God bless you!

I am not embarrassed by it at all.  Alcoholics should be embarrassed that they have gotten over on everybody, when crack addicts, meth addicts, and other drug abusers still carry the stigma of being an addict, and not suffering from a disease. 

How in the hell you can even call alcoholism a disease is beyond me.  And to the person who relates it to cancer, are you serious??  Have you really been brainwashed, or are you so weak to to believe that??  I can't sit around, never take a drink and suffer and die from alcoholism.  I can from cancer.  Alcoholism doesn't have a hold on you, or affect you if you never take a drink, plain and simple. 

Oh, and thanks for the blessings, God blesses me everyday and has since I became a Christian at the age of 13.  God bless you also. 

dubyacee, spoken like a true christian.  its "chrisitans" like you who turn people totally away from religion. 

[WILL CLINTON]

Eddie is Hog. Once a Hog always a Hogs. My thoughts and prayers go to him and his family.

Yep, he helped build the Arkansas basketball team from nothing to something special.  He deserves everyone's thoughts and prayers, not their ridicule!

So he deserves this because of what he did on a basketball court, or because he is an alcoholic??  Because if it is what he did on the basketball court, then we should have a statue of Nolan in front of Bud Walton, or rename it, the house that Nolan built.  If it is because of him being an alcoholic, you have to say the same thing about every crackhead or methhead around.  If alcoholism is a disease, then so is someone who is addicted to crack, meth, cocaine, or any other drug. 

I am just of the opinion that no drug addiction is a disease, it is a choice.  And before you try to crucify me, I have had alcoholics, and people die from it, and drug addiction, and people die from it, in my family, and very close friends.  And I told them the same thing I will say now.  They are weak, and use drugs/alcohol as crutches. 

You ought to be embarrassed for posting this...God bless you!

I am not embarrassed by it at all.  Alcoholics should be embarrassed that they have gotten over on everybody, when crack addicts, meth addicts, and other drug abusers still carry the stigma of being an addict, and not suffering from a disease. 

How in the hell you can even call alcoholism a disease is beyond me.  And to the person who relates it to cancer, are you serious??  Have you really been brainwashed, or are you so weak to to believe that??  I can't sit around, never take a drink and suffer and die from alcoholism.  I can from cancer.  Alcoholism doesn't have a hold on you, or affect you if you never take a drink, plain and simple. 

Oh, and thanks for the blessings, God blesses me everyday and has since I became a Christian at the age of 13.  God bless you also. 

dubyacee, spoken like a true christian.  its "chrisitans" like you who turn people totally away from religion. 

Oh, please elaborate on this statement. 

[WILL CLINTON]

http://www.peele.net/lib/atlcgene.html

Most theories concerning alcoholism state that the child is more likely to drink when they come from a family of alcoholism than a child that does not come from a family of alcoholism.  They want to say that there is a gene and that it is hereditary.  I say it is learned behavior.  There is a higher prevalence of children that turn into abusive adults when they come from abusive families.  Does that make domestic violence a disease?  Is alcoholism a disease because it is legal while coke, crack, meth are all just addictions because they are illegal.  Who gets to make those distinctions???

Maybe there is a disease involved called depression and that triggers the person to turn to alcohol.  I can drink and I feel sorry for those that HAVE to drink.  That is a sad life to live.

I don't think I could have said it any better.  You have to make a choice to go out and do crack, meth, heroin, etc. just like you have to go out and make a choice to buy a bottle. 

[Pork Twain]

I don't have anything against alcoholics but they are no different than any other addict.  My dad and grandpa and an aunt and couple of uncles (uncles married into the family) were all addicts.  I loved them but I saw them for what they were and did not try to make excuses for them.  They were to weak to quit and they let alcohol be more important to them then the families they destroyed.  That was their generation.  In my generation of our family there is not a single case of alcoholism.  There should be at least one...  I think me, my brothers and sisters and all of our cousins saw what they did to our family and made a CHOICE not to do the same.

America wants to make excuses because that is what we do.

[Hawgon]

I know some real honest to goodness Christians who are alcoholics.  Whether it is a disease, an addiction, a demon inspired sin, or a combination of all three, it is a tough nut to crack.  It has a powerful hold on people and once it gets them, they can be powerless to get away from it by themselves.  I believe it is a sin and most people would be better off if they never took a drink.  But being a sin, it is no different than so many other sins that hold sway over us.  It is just more visible.  You can't mistake an alcoholic who is in the grip of his sin, but someone who battles the sin of pride can get by a little easier on the outside world.

I wish Eddy the best.  I hope he gets better and I hope he takes my advice and hires someone to drive him around before he hurts someone.

[HogHeathen]

Eddie is Hog. Once a Hog always a Hogs. My thoughts and prayers go to him and his family.

Yep, he helped build the Arkansas basketball team from nothing to something special.  He deserves everyone's thoughts and prayers, not their ridicule!

So he deserves this because of what he did on a basketball court, or because he is an alcoholic??  Because if it is what he did on the basketball court, then we should have a statue of Nolan in front of Bud Walton, or rename it, the house that Nolan built.  If it is because of him being an alcoholic, you have to say the same thing about every crackhead or methhead around.  If alcoholism is a disease, then so is someone who is addicted to crack, meth, cocaine, or any other drug. 

I am just of the opinion that no drug addiction is a disease, it is a choice.  And before you try to crucify me, I have had alcoholics, and people die from it, and drug addiction, and people die from it, in my family, and very close friends.  And I told them the same thing I will say now.  They are weak, and use drugs/alcohol as crutches. 

No, I believe you are the weak minded one especially since medical studies has proven that there is such a thing as alcoholism....geez...the self-rightous people on this board amaze me...

[HogHeathen]

I know some real honest to goodness Christians who are alcoholics.  Whether it is a disease, an addiction, a demon inspired sin, or a combination of all three, it is a tough nut to crack.  It has a powerful hold on people and once it gets them, they can be powerless to get away from it by themselves.  I believe it is a sin and most people would be better off if they never took a drink.  But being a sin, it is no different than so many other sins that hold sway over us.  It is just more visible.  You can't mistake an alcoholic who is in the grip of his sin, but someone who battles the sin of pride can get by a little easier on the outside world.

I wish Eddy the best.  I hope he gets better and I hope he takes my advice and hires someone to drive him around before he hurts someone.

How bout that wine the Jesus drank and those catholics sip on Sundays?

[roothogornotatall]

looking down your nose at others when you really dont even know what you're talking about.  would jesus say "How in the hell you can even call alcoholism a disease is beyond me."  i doubt it.  he wouldnt say any of what you just said.  your not righteous, you seem SELF-righteous. stick to you area of expertise. just because theres a post doesn't mean that you always have to go out and get some of it. 

[werehog]

Wowser!This is an incredible response and a totally stupid leap to conclusions before the entire story is known by many on this board. It sounds to me that he has had a bad reaction to his meds. When my father was sufferingg from heart disease he was taken to the hospital by paramedics in an unresponsive condition that I and some of the paramedics believe was a stroke. It turned out that it was a reaction to some of the prescription drugs he was taking. Please, those of you who are so quick to condem hold your your tongues until you know what you are talking about.

[WindyCityHog]

I don't have anything against alcoholics but they are no different than any other addict.  America wants to make excuses because that is what we do.

Au contraire.

Alcoholism is a disease.  It's been documented over and over and over....

You come across as a holier-than-thou prick.

I drink....am a child of alcoholic parents....but understand the difference.  Don't be so prudish....unless you can provide more proof than merely your opinion.

[Hawgon]

How bout that wine the Jesus drank and those catholics sip on Sundays?

We're talking about Christians, not Catholics.

[WILL CLINTON]

Eddie is Hog. Once a Hog always a Hogs. My thoughts and prayers go to him and his family.

Yep, he helped build the Arkansas basketball team from nothing to something special.  He deserves everyone's thoughts and prayers, not their ridicule!

So he deserves this because of what he did on a basketball court, or because he is an alcoholic??  Because if it is what he did on the basketball court, then we should have a statue of Nolan in front of Bud Walton, or rename it, the house that Nolan built.  If it is because of him being an alcoholic, you have to say the same thing about every crackhead or methhead around.  If alcoholism is a disease, then so is someone who is addicted to crack, meth, cocaine, or any other drug. 

I am just of the opinion that no drug addiction is a disease, it is a choice.  And before you try to crucify me, I have had alcoholics, and people die from it, and drug addiction, and people die from it, in my family, and very close friends.  And I told them the same thing I will say now.  They are weak, and use drugs/alcohol as crutches. 

No, I believe you are the weak minded one especially since medical studies has proven that there is such a thing as alcoholism....geez...the self-rightous people on this board amaze me...

No one is disputing whether there is such a thing as alcoholism (A disorder characterized by the excessive consumption of and dependence on alcoholic beverages, leading to physical and psychological harm and impaired social and vocational functioning.) what I am disputing is it being a disease vs. an addiction.  I'm not self righteous, I was what could be considered an alcoholic after my divorce earlier this year.  I drank every day, excessively.  But I never used an excuse like I have a disease, I simply stated I was an addict.  There is a difference in addiction and disease. 

[roothogornotatall]

I know some real honest to goodness Christians who are alcoholics.  Whether it is a disease, an addiction, a demon inspired sin, or a combination of all three, it is a tough nut to crack.  It has a powerful hold on people and once it gets them, they can be powerless to get away from it by themselves.  I believe it is a sin and most people would be better off if they never took a drink.  But being a sin, it is no different than so many other sins that hold sway over us.  It is just more visible.  You can't mistake an alcoholic who is in the grip of his sin, but someone who battles the sin of pride can get by a little easier on the outside world.

I wish Eddy the best.  I hope he gets better and I hope he takes my advice and hires someone to drive him around before he hurts someone.

How bout that wine the Jesus drank and those catholics sip on Sundays?

i dont think it was fermented, honestly.  you really think that jesus would do/take anything to alter his mind??? but it is a good excuse for catholics and other religions to drink.  but its not mine, and neither is the whole "disease" thing.  i DO have a choice- i for some season choose to stop at the liquor store instead of driving past it.  i cant shake it.  i dont blame my grae grea great great grandfather.  i dont blame anybody- its my problem and i own up to it.  so really, you still dont know what you're talking about.  its the dr.'s who try to come up with the reason that people drink excessively, not the drinkers. 

[WILL CLINTON]

looking down your nose at others when you really dont even know what you're talking about.  would jesus say "How in the hell you can even call alcoholism a disease is beyond me."  i doubt it.  he wouldnt say any of what you just said.  your not righteous, you seem SELF-righteous. stick to you area of expertise. just because theres a post doesn't mean that you always have to go out and get some of it. 

Who are you to tell me what I do and don't know about??  I don't look down my nose at someone who has a problem with alcohol, I've been there, done that.  I just don't like someone saying I have a disease when it is clearly an addiction.  I think the alcoholics are the ones looking down their nose at others who have addictions, simply because their problem has been classified as a disease.  You choose to drink, smoke crack, snort/smoke meth, shoot up with heroin.  With cancer, and most other true diseases, you can do nothing wrong and simply get cancer.  You don't just get alcoholism

[jammerhog]

I have a cold beer in my truck and can,t wait to get off work and consume it ,after i drive home of course. is this a disease ? or am i addicted to cold beer? life is full of questions good luck to eddie

[flhog1]

Oh, and thanks for the blessings, God blesses me everyday and has since I became a Christian at the age of 13.  God bless you also.  

I'm not self righteous, I was what could be considered an alcoholic after my divorce earlier this year.  I drank every day, excessively.  But I never used an excuse like I have a disease, I simply stated I was an addict.  There is a difference in addiction and disease.  

[/quote]


Oh my gosh.....now I'm confused.....Christians that drink AND get divorced?   just kidding.....bless you and may you have a wonderful life....

[Pork Twain]

I don't have anything against alcoholics but they are no different than any other addict.  America wants to make excuses because that is what we do.

Au contraire.

Alcoholism is a disease.  It's been documented over and over and over....

You come across as a holier-than-thou prick.

I drink....am a child of alcoholic parents....but understand the difference.  Don't be so prudish....unless you can provide more proof than merely your opinion.

Au contraire

I am not holier than thou.  I have a drink every now and then.  I used to smoke.  I cheated on my first wife and destroyed my marriage and I found myself following my father's footsteps.  He started drinking when he was 24 and after he cheated on my mom the first time.  I am not better than anyone else.  I am just making better choices at this point in my life.  There is just as much out there that says alcoholism is learned like domestic violence as there are things out there that say it is a gene.

I am very happy this is not another alcohol related incident for Eddie.  I just hate excuse makers.  What I did in my life I did because I was weak and I decided to.  Did you know there is a sex addicts anonymous???  How sad is that?

[wacohog]

This particular disease is Genetic, and has a 50% chance of being passed down to the children.

My speciality is not ''Alcoholism,'' but there is a Board Specialty in Addiction Medicine. If you educate yourself you will see I am correct.  I am extremely well-informed and you are not.

I don't want to start a flame war with any of you so I will not write again on this subject. Suffice it to say that I am secure in my position in this regard. And some of you have the reasoning skills of a child--just because you ardently believe something to be true doesn't mean that it is.

[WILL CLINTON]

I know some real honest to goodness Christians who are alcoholics.  Whether it is a disease, an addiction, a demon inspired sin, or a combination of all three, it is a tough nut to crack.  It has a powerful hold on people and once it gets them, they can be powerless to get away from it by themselves.  I believe it is a sin and most people would be better off if they never took a drink.  But being a sin, it is no different than so many other sins that hold sway over us.  It is just more visible.  You can't mistake an alcoholic who is in the grip of his sin, but someone who battles the sin of pride can get by a little easier on the outside world.

I wish Eddy the best.  I hope he gets better and I hope he takes my advice and hires someone to drive him around before he hurts someone.

How bout that wine the Jesus drank and those catholics sip on Sundays?

i dont think it was fermented, honestly.  you really think that jesus would do/take anything to alter his mind??? but it is a good excuse for catholics and other religions to drink.  but its not mine, and neither is the whole "disease" thing.  i DO have a choice- i for some season choose to stop at the liquor store instead of driving past it.  i cant shake it.  i dont blame my grae grea great great grandfather.  i dont blame anybody- its my problem and i own up to it.  so really, you still dont know what you're talking about.  its the dr.'s who try to come up with the reason that people drink excessively, not the drinkers. 

Actually, it is not the drinking of alcohol that is a "sin", it is the excessive consumption to become drunk that makes it sinful.  I don't understand why you choose to argue with me, when you are saying the same thing I am, that it is a choice. 

[roothogornotatall]

I know some real honest to goodness Christians who are alcoholics.  Whether it is a disease, an addiction, a demon inspired sin, or a combination of all three, it is a tough nut to crack.  It has a powerful hold on people and once it gets them, they can be powerless to get away from it by themselves.  I believe it is a sin and most people would be better off if they never took a drink.  But being a sin, it is no different than so many other sins that hold sway over us.  It is just more visible.  You can't mistake an alcoholic who is in the grip of his sin, but someone who battles the sin of pride can get by a little easier on the outside world.

I wish Eddy the best.  I hope he gets better and I hope he takes my advice and hires someone to drive him around before he hurts someone.

How bout that wine the Jesus drank and those catholics sip on Sundays?

i dont think it was fermented, honestly.  you really think that jesus would do/take anything to alter his mind??? but it is a good excuse for catholics and other religions to drink.  but its not mine, and neither is the whole "disease" thing.  i DO have a choice- i for some season choose to stop at the liquor store instead of driving past it.  i cant shake it.  i dont blame my grae grea great great grandfather.  i dont blame anybody- its my problem and i own up to it.  so really, you still dont know what you're talking about.  its the dr.'s who try to come up with the reason that people drink excessively, not the drinkers. 

Actually, it is not the drinking of alcohol that is a "sin", it is the excessive consumption to become drunk that makes it sinful.  I don't understand why you choose to argue with me, when you are saying the same thing I am, that it is a choice. 

ok, sorry i argued, i DO agree with what you're saying. it was your approach that got to me. and i DO think it's the drinking of alcohol that is a sin.  i dont think it was the excessiveness. 

[WindyCityHog]

Liquor shouldn't be equated with evil....

It's the choices that can be debated.

There are those that can't understand the difference.....whether it be drugs or alcohol.

It IS a disease....a mental disease.  I don't understand the argument here....Addiction is a mental disease.  I deal with drunks on a daily basis...along with drug addicts....They ARE one and the same....ALL=disease.

You can say they CHOOSE their path......I tend to think the same.

Some need help, whether they choose to do it is another thing entirely.

[Pork Twain]

This particular disease is Genetic, and has a 50% chance of being passed down to the children.

My speciality is not ''Alcoholism,'' but there is a Board Specialty in Addiction Medicine. If you educate yourself you will see I am correct.  I am extremely well-informed and you are not.

I don't want to start a flame war with any of you so I will not write again on this subject. Suffice it to say that I am secure in my position in this regard. And some of you have the reasoning skills of a child--just because you ardently believe something to be true doesn't mean that it is.

Good for you because the theory of the alcoholism gene is relatively new in medical terms and it has not been conclusively proven as you would like people to think.  There are many theories out there and this is just the one you choose to support.

[flhog1]

And with some, their religion is an addiction.....or is it a disease?

[jammerhog]

What justifies drunk in the "sin" sense?They did not have breathalyzers in biblical times or did they follw D.O.T. rules.

[Pork Twain]

Liquor shouldn't be equated with evil....

It's the choices that can be debated.

There are those that can't understand the difference.....whether it be drugs or alcohol.

It IS a disease....a mental disease.  I don't understand the argument here....Addiction is a mental disease.  I deal with drunks on a daily basis...along with drug addicts....They ARE one and the same....ALL=disease.

You can say they CHOOSE their path......I tend to think the same.

Some need help, whether they choose to do it is another thing entirely.

I totally agree with everything you just said if you will substitute addiction for disease.  I don't think alcohol or drugs are evil.  I think the way some use them are evil.

Depression is the disease. 

Drugs and alcohol are the medicine.

I think that to do ANYTHING in excess is a sin.  I have been and am guilty of that.  Just not drugs or alcohol.

[WindyCityHog]

Good for you Beopig.

Please give me your expertise.....not your opinion.

I'm not a genetic biochemist......but the prevalence of alcoholism....definite trend....and there is lots of "scientific" evidence to back it up, recent or not.

[WILL CLINTON]

I know some real honest to goodness Christians who are alcoholics.  Whether it is a disease, an addiction, a demon inspired sin, or a combination of all three, it is a tough nut to crack.  It has a powerful hold on people and once it gets them, they can be powerless to get away from it by themselves.  I believe it is a sin and most people would be better off if they never took a drink.  But being a sin, it is no different than so many other sins that hold sway over us.  It is just more visible.  You can't mistake an alcoholic who is in the grip of his sin, but someone who battles the sin of pride can get by a little easier on the outside world.

I wish Eddy the best.  I hope he gets better and I hope he takes my advice and hires someone to drive him around before he hurts someone.

How bout that wine the Jesus drank and those catholics sip on Sundays?

i dont think it was fermented, honestly.  you really think that jesus would do/take anything to alter his mind??? but it is a good excuse for catholics and other religions to drink.  but its not mine, and neither is the whole "disease" thing.  i DO have a choice- i for some season choose to stop at the liquor store instead of driving past it.  i cant shake it.  i dont blame my grae grea great great grandfather.  i dont blame anybody- its my problem and i own up to it.  so really, you still dont know what you're talking about.  its the dr.'s who try to come up with the reason that people drink excessively, not the drinkers. 

Actually, it is not the drinking of alcohol that is a "sin", it is the excessive consumption to become drunk that makes it sinful.  I don't understand why you choose to argue with me, when you are saying the same thing I am, that it is a choice. 

ok, sorry i argued, i DO agree with what you're saying. it was your approach that got to me. and i DO think it's the drinking of alcohol that is a sin.  i dont think it was the excessiveness. 

I'll admit that maybe I got a little overzealous in my posts.  I just have a very strong belief in what I'm saying because of the fact that I have gone through it, from both sides.  From being what most would call an alcoholic, to watching a life being destroyed because of it.  Watching someone's life get destroyed, and ultimately taken by drug addiction.  I just got hardened by it/ 

[roothogornotatall]

the last i'll say about it...  i don't think it's necessarily an "alcohol gene", but there can be things aboout one personality that make them feel more comfortable when they catch a buzz.  catch a buzz enough times you're going to cross the line and drink more and more until you are, or think you are, dependent.  i think many times it's a self-esteem thing with people.  that can come from many things. 

[WILL CLINTON]

What justifies drunk in the "sin" sense?They did not have breathalyzers in biblical times or did they follw D.O.T. rules.

They still had the field sobriety tests.  You had to hop on one foot, and in sandals that is pretty hard. 

[flhog1]

Good for you because the theory of the alcoholism gene is relatively new in medical terms and it has not been conclusively proven as you would like people to think.  There are many theories out there and this is just the one you choose to support.

BP....based on what you just stated, don't you think your research on Dr. Peele is base on his theories?

There are dozens of other psychiatrist who are experts on addictions/diseases that would disagree with him....

[WindyCityHog]

Liquor shouldn't be equated with evil....

It's the choices that can be debated.

There are those that can't understand the difference.....whether it be drugs or alcohol.

It IS a disease....a mental disease.  I don't understand the argument here....Addiction is a mental disease.  I deal with drunks on a daily basis...along with drug addicts....They ARE one and the same....ALL=disease.

You can say they CHOOSE their path......I tend to think the same.

Some need help, whether they choose to do it is another thing entirely.

I totally agree with everything you just said if you will substitute addiction for disease.  I don't think alcohol or drugs are evil.  I think the way some use them are evil.

Depression is the disease. 

Drugs and alcohol are the medicine.

Addiction is a disease.  It's not a "comfortable" excuse.....it is what it is.

Trust me.....I have to deal with these "idiots" every damn day....whether they are stealing, robbing, or simply trying to live....

It's NEVER pretty.

I HATE them because they are weak (in my mimd)......but I also understand they need help....might be better off dead.

Yet, I see them for what they are......disesased.  Some accept the help,  most don't.

[roothogornotatall]

and it wen

What justifies drunk in the "sin" sense?They did not have breathalyzers in biblical times or did they follw D.O.T. rules.

They still had the field sobriety tests.  You had to hop on one foot, and in sandals that is pretty hard. 

and it a little somethin like thissss...

http://youtube.com/watch?v=RbhQSuVV0ZE

[kitshicker]

I'm not gonna start telling my life story here or anything, but I consider addiction a disease. A disease that CAN be treated....I don't know anything about the brain chemistry or the gene that causes addiction. But I believe that alot of times there are deeper psychological problems that lead to drug/alcohol abuse.

[Pork Twain]

Good for you because the theory of the alcoholism gene is relatively new in medical terms and it has not been conclusively proven as you would like people to think.  There are many theories out there and this is just the one you choose to support.

BP....based on what you just stated, don't you think your research on Dr. Peele is base on his theories?

There are dozens of other psychiatrist who are experts on addictions/diseases that would disagree with him....

I think it is ALL based on theories.  Who is to say which is right?  Just because a Medical Dr thinks one doesn't make it right.  I tend to go with the psychological theory.  I like learned behavior and conditioning more than some mythical gene that you can talk about but not see.

I think we are down to disagreeing on the word "is" now.  I think people are predisposed to it and that is not something I will argue.  I think it takes amazing strength to beat it and not a lot have it.

[HDale]

Does anyone else think that it's tough to do a roadside sobriety test with those police strobe lights going?

[flhog1]

BP,

I'll say one last thing regarding psychology and then I'll leave this topic.  I had the opportunity to work in the mental health field for a few years and worked with excellent mhp's, psychologist's and psychiatrist.  We worked with children, adolescents and adults.  The children as a rule were a victim of their environment who could be treated to the point of being cured.  The adolescents, as a rule were basically brats.  Mostly associated with the same environment that the children came from.  Unfortunately, the ado environment never changed when they were young and therefore they ended up as messed up brats.....

As for the adults.....In most situations, they were a result of the poor environment as a child/ado that never changed and therefore they ended up in a never ending addiction or disease. 

My point in all of this ranting is that it has been my experience that adults of mental addictions/diseases are never cured.  They usually end up coming to the professionals, getting a "tune up" and are good for a period of time.....then the cycle repeats.  Psychology (and the Dr. Peele's of the world) doesn't have all of the answers and if you look at the history of both psychology and physical medicine you will see that what is professed as gospel today becomes fallacies....tomorrow...

Now please excuse me because it is time for my martini......bless all

[Pork Twain]

BP,

I'll say one last thing regarding psychology and then I'll leave this topic.  I had the opportunity to work in the mental health field for a few years and worked with excellent mhp's, psychologist's and psychiatrist.  We worked with children, adolescents and adults.  The children as a rule were a victim of their environment who could be treated to the point of being cured.  The adolescents, as a rule were basically brats.  Mostly associated with the same environment that the children came from.  Unfortunately, the ado environment never changed when they were young and therefore they ended up as messed up brats.....

As for the adults.....In most situations, they were a result of the poor environment as a child/ado that never changed and therefore they ended up in a never ending addiction or disease. 

My point in all of this ranting is that it has been my experience that adults of mental addictions/diseases are never cured.  They usually end up coming to the professionals, getting a "tune up" and are good for a period of time.....then the cycle repeats.  Psychology (and the Dr. Peele's of the world) doesn't have all of the answers and if you look at the history of both psychology and physical medicine you will see that what is professed as gospel today becomes fallacies....tomorrow...

Now please excuse me because it is time for my martini......bless all

I agree with everything you just said.  I don't think Peele's word is gospel.  Just the first source I came across.  I agree it is ever changing and I know there is a very high recidivism rate.  My point is there is now physical proof of the gene...  Just theory which is no better than what the psychological field profess.  People that talk about this gene act like it is something that you can look at under a microscope.

[wacohog]

What I have stated is where the current Medical thinking is in this regard.

Medicine evolves, we don't bleed people anymore, leech them , release humours, etc.

I realize that my point of view challenges the opinions of some. I invite you to debunk anything you have seen me write. Most of it I have learned at one of the finest rehabs in the country, where I learned about my loved one and their DISEASE. I don't have the luxory to be uninformed...consider yourselves blessed to be able to remain so sure of your unsupported conclusions. Ignorance is bliss.

[PigPusher]

But we are still relieved that it was reported Coach Sutton was not drinking.