Bill Parcells on HUNH?

[Carolinas Hog]

We only have 2 examples of WVU vs the S.E.C, that game and MSU game this year and they haven't had too much trouble in either game.  This was the same Georgia team we lost to, except when they played UGa had Shockey...thankfully we got Tereshinski...

You can thank Matt and C4 for the Ambush in Austin.  Oh, and Chance Mock.

Exactly, not enough to go on to use WV effectively as an example.  Not my point about Austin.  Using WV's win over Georgia to illustrate your point, would be like me trying to say the Hog '03 team was better than Texas.  Yes, we beat them on that day, badly.  But Arkansas went to the Indy bowl and finished with 9 wins, .500 in SEC.  For  the season, we were not better.

[Hong Kong Sooey]

West Virginia runs from a spread but doesn't really use a HUNH. In RR's version of the spread, the pass sets up the run. WVU is a running team that can pass. Bill Parcells is a great NFL coach who knows that defense wins Super Bowls.

Good thing Arkansas isn't going to be playing for a Super Bowl. 

[HoopS]

We only have 2 examples of WVU vs the S.E.C, that game and MSU game this year and they haven't had too much trouble in either game.  This was the same Georgia team we lost to, except when they played UGa had Shockey...thankfully we got Tereshinski...

You can thank Matt and C4 for the Ambush in Austin.  Oh, and Chance Mock.

Exactly, not enough to go on to use WV effectively as an example.  Not my point about Austin.  Using WV's win over Georgia to illustrate your point, would be like me trying to say the Hog '03 team was better than Texas.  Yes, we beat them on that day, badly.  But Arkansas went to the Indy bowl and finished with 9 wins, .500 in SEC.  For  the season, we were not better.

I hear ya.  I just went back and read your post and realized what your point was with Texas.  I post from my phone at times and have to go by memory in my responses... the '03 Hogs stumbled down the stretch, that's for sure.

[jhawg]

how's that hurry up offense working for West Virginia?

WV runs a spread offense but does not run a HUNH.

[Carolinas Hog]

Strawman strawman, strawman...

Seriously, I have never been able to come up with a team in college who achieves and sustains success (defined as BCS or near BCS caliber most every year) running the spread or the hurry up no huddle.

I am seriously looking for an example.

innovation is not a bad thing. just bc someone else is not doing it to the degree that malzahn will after this season does not mean it won't work.

how'd "40 Minutes of Hell" work for richardson in the hey-days? sure, it was a style that had been employed by others (G'Town, etc.) but not to the degree that nolan unleashed it. i was proud that arkansas had an aggressive, unique style.

what about jenkins and the run-and-shoot?

joe tiller's offense in the Big Ten?

option in the NFL? no way! never work! see the falcons this season?

i don't give a flip who has or has not run something similar to what malzahn intends.

i believe it will work and set college FB on its heels. i cannot wait to see it in real action, although we'll have to do just that until next season.

I am all for innovation.  My point was the spread has been around.  The no huddle has been around.  This doesn't show me a team in college who achieves and sustains success with it.

Now, if you want to sprinkle in this type of offense to "spice up" things, throw the D off balance, etc.  I am all for it.  Much like how Atlanta sprinkles some option type plays with Vick (see also the Titans with Young).

I think the spread formation, or the no huddle, or the hurry up, or the hurry and and get to the huddle house, as your base offense is not going to bring a high level of success for a sustainable period of time.  But if you use it as a tool, like the deep pass, mis-direction plays, screen passes, etc. great.  Mix it in.  Give your team more weapons to be successful with potentially.

I will have my doubts with it as a base offense until someone shows me a real example.  The spread has been around for a while, just like the no huddle.  Teams have been using it for a while.  No examples of sustainable, high level success...

[Hong Kong Sooey]

Strawman strawman, strawman...

Seriously, I have never been able to come up with a team in college who achieves and sustains success (defined as BCS or near BCS caliber most every year) running the spread or the hurry up no huddle.

I am seriously looking for an example.

innovation is not a bad thing. just bc someone else is not doing it to the degree that malzahn will after this season does not mean it won't work.

how'd "40 Minutes of Hell" work for richardson in the hey-days? sure, it was a style that had been employed by others (G'Town, etc.) but not to the degree that nolan unleashed it. i was proud that arkansas had an aggressive, unique style.

what about jenkins and the run-and-shoot?

joe tiller's offense in the Big Ten?

option in the NFL? no way! never work! see the falcons this season?

i don't give a flip who has or has not run something similar to what malzahn intends.

i believe it will work and set college FB on its heels. i cannot wait to see it in real action, although we'll have to do just that until next season.

I am all for innovation.  My point was the spread has been around.  The no huddle has been around.  This doesn't show me a team in college who achieves and sustains success with it.

Now, if you want to sprinkle in this type of offense to "spice up" things, throw the D off balance, etc.  I am all for it.  Much like how Atlanta sprinkles some option type plays with Vick (see also the Titans with Young).

I think the spread formation, or the no huddle, or the hurry up, or the hurry and and get to the huddle house, as your base offense is not going to bring a high level of success for a sustainable period of time.  But if you use it as a tool, like the deep pass, mis-direction plays, screen passes, etc. great.  Mix it in.  Give your team more weapons to be successful with potentially.

I will have my doubts with it as a base offense until someone shows me a real example.  The spread has been around for a while, just like the no huddle.  Teams have been using it for a while.  No examples of sustainable, high level success...

Yeah, that No Huddle attack Buffalo ran from a base "I" set for throughout the 90's sure didn't work.  I mean they never even won one of the Super Bowls they played in.  Three Super Bowls without a win obviously proves your offense sucks.

[excoach]

how's that hurry up offense working for West Virginia?

I think West Virginia is a very good team, but if they played more than 2-3 decent teams a year, they'd get beat.

they sure Kicked Georgia's butt in the Sugar Bowl last yr.

[Carolinas Hog]

Strawman strawman, strawman...

Seriously, I have never been able to come up with a team in college who achieves and sustains success (defined as BCS or near BCS caliber most every year) running the spread or the hurry up no huddle.

I am seriously looking for an example.

innovation is not a bad thing. just bc someone else is not doing it to the degree that malzahn will after this season does not mean it won't work.

how'd "40 Minutes of Hell" work for richardson in the hey-days? sure, it was a style that had been employed by others (G'Town, etc.) but not to the degree that nolan unleashed it. i was proud that arkansas had an aggressive, unique style.

what about jenkins and the run-and-shoot?

joe tiller's offense in the Big Ten?

option in the NFL? no way! never work! see the falcons this season?

i don't give a flip who has or has not run something similar to what malzahn intends.

i believe it will work and set college FB on its heels. i cannot wait to see it in real action, although we'll have to do just that until next season.

I am all for innovation.  My point was the spread has been around.  The no huddle has been around.  This doesn't show me a team in college who achieves and sustains success with it.

Now, if you want to sprinkle in this type of offense to "spice up" things, throw the D off balance, etc.  I am all for it.  Much like how Atlanta sprinkles some option type plays with Vick (see also the Titans with Young).

I think the spread formation, or the no huddle, or the hurry up, or the hurry and and get to the huddle house, as your base offense is not going to bring a high level of success for a sustainable period of time.  But if you use it as a tool, like the deep pass, mis-direction plays, screen passes, etc. great.  Mix it in.  Give your team more weapons to be successful with potentially.

I will have my doubts with it as a base offense until someone shows me a real example.  The spread has been around for a while, just like the no huddle.  Teams have been using it for a while.  No examples of sustainable, high level success...

Yeah, that No Huddle attack Buffalo ran from a base "I" set for throughout the 90's sure didn't work.  I mean they never even won one of the Super Bowls they played in.  Three Super Bowls without a win obviously proves your offense sucks.

Spread offense HK... SPREAD.  Do it the no huddle way, do it the hurry up way, whatever adjectives you want to associate with it...fine.  Bottom line is the offense is the Spread.  I just want to see examples of sustainable, high level success running the spread, or the run and shoot, or any other gimmicky funny named offense...

[Hong Kong Sooey]

Strawman strawman, strawman...

Seriously, I have never been able to come up with a team in college who achieves and sustains success (defined as BCS or near BCS caliber most every year) running the spread or the hurry up no huddle.

I am seriously looking for an example.

innovation is not a bad thing. just bc someone else is not doing it to the degree that malzahn will after this season does not mean it won't work.

how'd "40 Minutes of Hell" work for richardson in the hey-days? sure, it was a style that had been employed by others (G'Town, etc.) but not to the degree that nolan unleashed it. i was proud that arkansas had an aggressive, unique style.

what about jenkins and the run-and-shoot?

joe tiller's offense in the Big Ten?

option in the NFL? no way! never work! see the falcons this season?

i don't give a flip who has or has not run something similar to what malzahn intends.

i believe it will work and set college FB on its heels. i cannot wait to see it in real action, although we'll have to do just that until next season.

I am all for innovation.  My point was the spread has been around.  The no huddle has been around.  This doesn't show me a team in college who achieves and sustains success with it.

Now, if you want to sprinkle in this type of offense to "spice up" things, throw the D off balance, etc.  I am all for it.  Much like how Atlanta sprinkles some option type plays with Vick (see also the Titans with Young).

I think the spread formation, or the no huddle, or the hurry up, or the hurry and and get to the huddle house, as your base offense is not going to bring a high level of success for a sustainable period of time.  But if you use it as a tool, like the deep pass, mis-direction plays, screen passes, etc. great.  Mix it in.  Give your team more weapons to be successful with potentially.

I will have my doubts with it as a base offense until someone shows me a real example.  The spread has been around for a while, just like the no huddle.  Teams have been using it for a while.  No examples of sustainable, high level success...

Yeah, that No Huddle attack Buffalo ran from a base "I" set for throughout the 90's sure didn't work.  I mean they never even won one of the Super Bowls they played in.  Three Super Bowls without a win obviously proves your offense sucks.

Spread offense HK... SPREAD.  Do it the no huddle way, do it the hurry up way, whatever adjectives you want to associate with it...fine.  Bottom line is the offense is the Spread.  I just want to see examples of sustainable, high level success running the spread, or the run and shoot, or any other gimmicky funny named offense...

No one is asking for the Spread.  No one is asking for the Chuck and Duck.  Mouse Davis doesn't live here.  June Jones can't even get a job in Hawaii.  We want the HUNH philosophy.  The offense as currently constituted (with a little more play action downfield) would be fine.  The HUNH simply adds additional pressure on the D by limiting substitutions and creating match up problems.  Can you imagine what DMAc would do to an exhausted D-line?  Don't confuse the HUNH with the Spread.  Gus has proven that the HUNH is something he can use to make diametrically opposed offenses work better.  Check out the differences between Hughes and Springdale under Gus.  You might be surprised.

[silvertip]

there was a thread a few days ago that discussed the HUNH and the defense...the question was what effect does HUNH have ob the defense...

The HUNH supporters, said it would have little effect on the defense. I disagree, it would more than likely translate into more snaps on defense too.

doesn't seem like a particularly smart ploy for a team that is averaging over six yards per play on first down and is thinner than paper on defense.

couse what does Parcell's know...??....the HUNH crowd on here certainly knows more about football than parcells.....RIGHT

OK, this is the 2nd post that I have read saying we "average 6 yards on first down." Can you tell me where you got that stat? I don't believe it.

Maybe we got an "average" like that by padding stats vs the likes of SEMO and LA-Monroe. I can tell you I charted our 1st downs in 2 games this year---Vandy & Bama. Over 85% of 1st downs were runs out of the I formation. Over half of those were for 3 yards or less.

So, someone please tell me where this "6 yards per first down" comes from?

[Carolinas Hog]

Strawman strawman, strawman...

Seriously, I have never been able to come up with a team in college who achieves and sustains success (defined as BCS or near BCS caliber most every year) running the spread or the hurry up no huddle.

I am seriously looking for an example.

innovation is not a bad thing. just bc someone else is not doing it to the degree that malzahn will after this season does not mean it won't work.

how'd "40 Minutes of Hell" work for richardson in the hey-days? sure, it was a style that had been employed by others (G'Town, etc.) but not to the degree that nolan unleashed it. i was proud that arkansas had an aggressive, unique style.

what about jenkins and the run-and-shoot?

joe tiller's offense in the Big Ten?

option in the NFL? no way! never work! see the falcons this season?

i don't give a flip who has or has not run something similar to what malzahn intends.

i believe it will work and set college FB on its heels. i cannot wait to see it in real action, although we'll have to do just that until next season.

I am all for innovation.  My point was the spread has been around.  The no huddle has been around.  This doesn't show me a team in college who achieves and sustains success with it.

Now, if you want to sprinkle in this type of offense to "spice up" things, throw the D off balance, etc.  I am all for it.  Much like how Atlanta sprinkles some option type plays with Vick (see also the Titans with Young).

I think the spread formation, or the no huddle, or the hurry up, or the hurry and and get to the huddle house, as your base offense is not going to bring a high level of success for a sustainable period of time.  But if you use it as a tool, like the deep pass, mis-direction plays, screen passes, etc. great.  Mix it in.  Give your team more weapons to be successful with potentially.

I will have my doubts with it as a base offense until someone shows me a real example.  The spread has been around for a while, just like the no huddle.  Teams have been using it for a while.  No examples of sustainable, high level success...

Yeah, that No Huddle attack Buffalo ran from a base "I" set for throughout the 90's sure didn't work.  I mean they never even won one of the Super Bowls they played in.  Three Super Bowls without a win obviously proves your offense sucks.

Spread offense HK... SPREAD.  Do it the no huddle way, do it the hurry up way, whatever adjectives you want to associate with it...fine.  Bottom line is the offense is the Spread.  I just want to see examples of sustainable, high level success running the spread, or the run and shoot, or any other gimmicky funny named offense...

No one is asking for the Spread.  No one is asking for the Chuck and Duck.  Mouse Davis doesn't live here.  June Jones can't even get a job in Hawaii.  We want the HUNH philosophy.  The offense as currently constituted (with a little more play action downfield) would be fine.  The HUNH simply adds additional pressure on the D by limiting substitutions and creating match up problems.  Can you imagine what DMAc would do to an exhausted D-line?  Don't confuse the HUNH with the Spread.  Gus has proven that the HUNH is something he can use to make diametrically opposed offenses work better.  Check out the differences between Hughes and Springdale under Gus.  You might be surprised.

I'm not confusing them...look at my original post, and the question I asked.  I am not against using no huddle, or the spread formation some.  (See previous post in this thread).

Oh, and using the HUNH, Spread, West Coast, whatever offense to achieve success in football at the Arkansas high school level is worth a box of hair in terms of relevance.  There are high schools in Arkansas who have been very sucessful running the Wishbone or the Maryland I.  That does not mean a college should be running it.

[jabohog]

Strawman strawman, strawman...

Seriously, I have never been able to come up with a team in college who achieves and sustains success (defined as BCS or near BCS caliber most every year) running the spread or the hurry up no huddle.

I am seriously looking for an example.

innovation is not a bad thing. just bc someone else is not doing it to the degree that malzahn will after this season does not mean it won't work.

how'd "40 Minutes of Hell" work for richardson in the hey-days? sure, it was a style that had been employed by others (G'Town, etc.) but not to the degree that nolan unleashed it. i was proud that arkansas had an aggressive, unique style.

what about jenkins and the run-and-shoot?

joe tiller's offense in the Big Ten?

option in the NFL? no way! never work! see the falcons this season?

i don't give a flip who has or has not run something similar to what malzahn intends.

i believe it will work and set college FB on its heels. i cannot wait to see it in real action, although we'll have to do just that until next season.

I am all for innovation.  My point was the spread has been around.  The no huddle has been around.  This doesn't show me a team in college who achieves and sustains success with it.

Now, if you want to sprinkle in this type of offense to "spice up" things, throw the D off balance, etc.  I am all for it.  Much like how Atlanta sprinkles some option type plays with Vick (see also the Titans with Young).

I think the spread formation, or the no huddle, or the hurry up, or the hurry and and get to the huddle house, as your base offense is not going to bring a high level of success for a sustainable period of time.  But if you use it as a tool, like the deep pass, mis-direction plays, screen passes, etc. great.  Mix it in.  Give your team more weapons to be successful with potentially.

I will have my doubts with it as a base offense until someone shows me a real example.  The spread has been around for a while, just like the no huddle.  Teams have been using it for a while.  No examples of sustainable, high level success...

Yeah, that No Huddle attack Buffalo ran from a base "I" set for throughout the 90's sure didn't work.  I mean they never even won one of the Super Bowls they played in.  Three Super Bowls without a win obviously proves your offense sucks.

Spread offense HK... SPREAD.  Do it the no huddle way, do it the hurry up way, whatever adjectives you want to associate with it...fine.  Bottom line is the offense is the Spread.  I just want to see examples of sustainable, high level success running the spread, or the run and shoot, or any other gimmicky funny named offense...

I would like to see the offense we have now run out of the HUNH philosophy. The few times Nutt has allowed it to be run, it was very effective, resulting in scores. USC, was one of the better examples where Mitch and company took the ball 80 yards to the end zone in under two minutes. Pete Carroll said in the paper it was the only drive we had worth a hoot. It doesn't have to be run all the time, but I would like to see it some, especially if we get in a situation where nothing else is working ( like USC ). High school, college, NFL, in terms of relevance you are right, but that is how this thread began and you posted in it, so. Sustainable levels of success with gimicky offenses isn't what started this thread, it was the opinion of an NFL's coach on the HUNH.