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Best Razorback Shooters in the 3Pt Era (1986/87- present)

Started by eusebius, November 30, 2014, 05:05:55 pm

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eusebius

Here's a look at the best shooters since the 86-87 season using four metrics: Fg%, 3pt%, Ft % and ppg. Only players who have completed their careers are listed.

FG %
1. Mayberry 49.5
2. Day 47.9
3. Johnson 46.6
4 Thurman 46.4
5. Pargo 45.5
6 . Rimac 44.8
7. Clarke 43.5
8. Beverly 42.0
9. McKellar 41.6
10. Bradley 40.8

3Pt %
1. Thurman 43.2
2. Pargo 42.5
3. Mayberry 42.4
4. McKellar 42.3
5. Clarke 42.0
6. Johnson 40.6
7. Bradley 40.0
8. Day 38.4
9. Beverly 38.2
10. Rimac 35.9

FT%
1. Clarke 86.3
2. Rimac 86.1
3. McKellar 86.0
4. Bradley 85.8
5. Pargo 82.0
6. Thurman 77.0
7. Johnson 75.3
8. Day 74.7
9. Beverly 73.0
10. Mayberry 72.4

PPG
1. Day 18.9
2. Thurman 16.2
3. Johnson 15.0
4. Pargo 14.4
5. Clarke 14.2
6. Mayberry 14.0
7. Bradley 13.4
8. Beverly 12.0
9. McKellar 7.3
10. Rimac 3.4

Avg Rank:
1. Thurman 3.25
2. Pargo 4
3. Clarke 4.5
4. Day and Johnson 4.75
6. Mayberry 5
7. McKellar 6.25
8 Bradley and Rimac 7
10. Beverly 8.5

Avg Rank without PPG factored in
1. Thurman 3.6
2. Pargo 4
3. Clarke 4.3
4. Mayberry 4.66
5. Johnson and McKellar  5.3
7. Day and Rimac 6
9. Bradley
10. Beverly 8.6

Some observations: Two players, Al Dillard and Tim Scott could have been looked at also, but Dillard's Fg% was under 40, so he would not have scored well over all. Scott's 3 pt % was in the 30's. McKellar had only one full season here, but it was a solid shooting season.  Bradley is the all-time leader in 3's made, but he had four full seasons to set that mark. Day and Mayberry score high on any offensive or defensive metric when compared to any Hog bb player in history.

Scotty Thurman is the best shooter I've seen in a Hog uniform and the metrics back that up. From clutch shots, to shooting percentage, to ppg, to mid -range game to all around shooting, Thurman is the best. Dillard and Clarke had some great performances, but night in and night out and in big games, Scotty was tops.   

Pargo was underrated and underappreciated. His career was overshadowed by Nolan's last games. But Pargo, could really shoot and the metric shows that. Johnson was solid here at the UofA but developed into an even better long range shooter in the pros.  Beverly was solid, but was not the shooter some of the other guys were, but was one of the best rebounding guards we've had. 

How would great college basketball shooters in that era compare to the best Razorbacks?

Allan Houston, Tennessee:    46 Fg% (less than Mayberry, Day,  Johnson , and Pargo)
42.4 3 Pt% (less than Thurman and Pargo),   84.9 FT % (less than Clark, Rimac, McKellar, and Bradley),  21.9 ppg (better than any Hog)

Chris Jackson, LSU:   47.4 FG% (lower than Mayberry and Day), 37.2 3pt % (only Rimac is lower),  86.3 FT% and 29 ppg  (tied with Clarke and higher than any Hog in ppg)

Dave Jamerson, Miami, OH:  48.8 FG% (less than Mayberry),  41.9 3pt % (6th on the Hog list) , 84.6 FT% (less than Clarke, Rimac, McKellar, and Bradley) , 20.3ppg (better than any Hog)

Steph Curry, Davidson: 46.7 FG% (less than Mayberry and Day),  41.2 3pt % (less than the top 5 Hogs) , FT 87.6, 25.3 ppg% (better than all Razorbacks).

Glen Rice, Michigan: 56.9 FG %,  48 3pt % (both better than any Hog),  79.7 FT % (lower than the top 5) ,  18.2 ppg (lower than Day)   

J.J. Redick, Duke: 43.3 FG %, 40.6 3PT %, 91.2 FT%, 19.9 ppg (only FT and ppg are better than the Hogs best)

The best the Hogs have put on the floor, stack up well against some of the best shooters in cbb since the 3 pt line was introduced. Mayberry's nearly 50% Fg, is in the Nash/Stockton category for point guards.   
 









These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.


 

eusebius

Quote from: Showtimehog on November 30, 2014, 05:15:44 pm
Relevance to 2014?

Just some historical perspective. There are a many Hogs fans that like these discussions.
These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

TomBigBeeHog

We need a couple of our current hogs to stake out a spot on that list.
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Pigga what?!
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Jackrabbit Hog

I know it's not possible but I would dearly love to see where Marvin Delph would rank on those lists had he played in that era and with the 3 point line.  Best pure outside shooter I have ever seen in a Hog uniform.
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I'm sure it's nothing that a $500 retainer can't fix.  Contact JackRabbit Hog for payment instructions.

eusebius

Quote from: TomBigBeeHog on November 30, 2014, 05:22:54 pm
We need a couple of our current hogs to stake out a spot on that list.

Bell is our best deep shooter, but even he is only in the 30's from the field and 3 Pt line in his career. He is over 80% at the line. Qualls is in the 40's from the field and 30's from 3pt. If they finish strong they can get those numbers up, but getting to those numbers is hard if you don't start out strong, as was Tim Scott's story. Strong senior numbers from three pt range. A lot of that was adjusting to the new rules and getting used to the line. Hog greats like Mayberry actually had better shooting seasons in their freshman and sophomore years. In Mayberry's Sophomore season he shot over 50 % from three point range and over 50% on FG's.   
These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

Hogwop

Quote from: TomBigBeeHog on November 30, 2014, 05:22:54 pm
We need a couple of our current hogs to stake out a spot on that list.

Beard looks like he could end up on this list by the end of his time on the hill. Dude has a sweet shot.
Pigga what?!
Quote from: PonderinHog on April 16, 2018, 10:27:02 amAn emoji is worth a hundred words.
9-07-1958 - 12-2-2011 R.I.P Mom, I will always miss you and love you.

ballz2thewall

Quote from: Showtimehog on November 30, 2014, 05:15:44 pm
Relevance to 2014?

what's wrong with some history?

i thoroughly enjoy eusebius' work. historical perspective is always good and sure can't hurt anything.  he's done some really impressive work over on mmqb. 

i'm all for it, if it matters.  if it doesn't, i still am.
The rest of the frog.

eusebius

Quote from: ballz2thewall on November 30, 2014, 06:52:25 pm
what's wrong with some history?

i thoroughly enjoy eusebius' work. historical perspective is always good and sure can't hurt anything.  he's done some really impressive work over on mmqb. 

i'm all for it, if it matters.  if it doesn't, i still am.

LOL, thanks. I do appreciate the compliment. I've been a Hog fan all my life, and I think our fans don't always know how to appreciate how good our players have been and how our current guys stack up. Take Lee Mayberry for example. He shot better from FG and  3pt range than Steve Nash in college. He averaged more assists and steals as well. Now Nash was a late bloomer, but it gives us some perspective on how he did in college vs a top five pt guard and two time NBA MVP.  He also averaged as many assists as John Stockton. Lee Mayberry was a player. He made Honorable Mention All American in 91 but couldn't crack the first three teams over Kenny Anderson, Jimmy Jackson or Steve Smith. The depth in college basketball at that time was unreal. He did crack the AA teams in 92.   
These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

Granny

I'll go with Al Dillard.  Haven't seen any shots taken (and going in regularly) from the hog tail lately.

*disclaimer--clutch shooting goes to Thurman.

eusebius

Quote from: Granny on November 30, 2014, 07:51:19 pm
I'll go with Al Dillard.  Haven't seen any shots taken (and going in regularly) from the hog tail lately.

*disclaimer--clutch shooting goes to Thurman.

Certainly when it comes to way way way downtown shooting and one game exploits like what he did vs Delaware St., Dillard is one of the best we have seen.  But statistically there are a few knocks on Dillard. He's not quite 40 percent from the field (39.5) and the lowest guy on my list is Bradley at 40.8. His 3 pt % is 40.1, which would be just above Bradley at 7th on the list and his ppg are just above McKellar at 7.8. He does score well on FT's at 83.1 which is fifth behind Bradley. If I figured him in, I think he would rank somewhere around Beverly or Rimac on the chart but no higher than 7th. But Al's wow factor is very high.

Case in point: 

   

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cEtCFqh7XoY
These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

 

HSVhogfan2

Great post. Big Dog at 57% FG? Damn that's insane considering he took a lot of very difficult shots.
"The post you have just read was used with the express written consent of HSVHogfan2."

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JenksHawg

Cannon Whitby was pre-'86 wasn't he?  I think he was the most fun shooter I've seen in a Razorback uniform. 

hog.goblin


HSVhogfan2

Quote from: JenksHawg on November 30, 2014, 10:37:01 pm
Cannon Whitby was pre-'86 wasn't he?  I think he was the most fun shooter I've seen in a Razorback uniform.

Came in with Ron Huery in Nolans first class. 1987
"The post you have just read was used with the express written consent of HSVHogfan2."

Veni Sancte Spiritus

Do you wish to rise? Begin by descending. You plan a tower that will pierce the clouds? Lay first the foundation of humility.

eusebius

Quote from: JenksHawg on November 30, 2014, 10:37:01 pm
Cannon Whitby was pre-'86 wasn't he?  I think he was the most fun shooter I've seen in a Razorback uniform. 


Quote from: HSVhogfan2 on November 30, 2014, 10:32:58 pm
Great post. Big Dog at 57% FG? Damn that's insane considering he took a lot of very difficult shots.

You are thinking of Glen "Big Dog" Robinson from Purdue. Glen Rice was at Michigan and led them to the title in 89. Glen Rice was a better shooter than Glen Robinson but Robinson could score and rebound well. He was at Purdue from 92-94. Robinson was no slouch for a big man. At 6'9, he could shoot the three and face up. Averaged over 30 per game one year. Rice had one of the NCAA tourneys best shooting runs in 89 when Michigan beat Seton Hall for the title.

Whitby was one of our first hired guns in 86-87. His 3 pt % is only in the 30's and his shots and minutes went down as Nolan brought in more elite guards. But we owe Cannon some major love because he hit some big shots in that NIT game vs Arkansas State. The Hogs were down by a bunch and Whitby helped key the comeback. Arkansas State had a really good team that year (John Tate, Greg Williams, Brad Goshen, Steve Weidower) but it would have been a major setback for the Hogs to lose at home to A-State.         

I watched his brother, Denver, play in High School (Obion County, TN). Denver took what seemed like 25 shots in the first half. I think he ended up taking 45 shots that game. 
These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

eusebius

These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

MemphisBossHog

I remember Clint McDaniel as a key part of some of Nolan's teams.  I guess his numbers werent so good?? 

Killean

Scotty Thurman said the only 3 point shooter better than him was Al Dillard.  Scotty said that Al was probably the best three point shooter ever.
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eusebius

Quote from: MemphisBossHog on December 01, 2014, 02:06:56 pm
I remember Clint McDaniel as a key part of some of Nolan's teams.  I guess his numbers werent so good??

McDaniel:
43.5% FG, 35.2 % 3pt, 73 % at the line, 8ppg. Percentage wise he is comparable to Beverly. Clint's main contribution was lock down defense. Over 100 steals in 94-95 season.


   
These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

eusebius

Quote from: Killean on December 01, 2014, 02:25:34 pm
Scotty Thurman said the only 3 point shooter better than him was Al Dillard.  Scotty said that Al was probably the best three point shooter ever.

That's high praise and I respect Thurman tremendously.  I assume he means best Hog ever. From three, Dillard certainly had greater range than any Hog. His 39.5 2pt percentage is 10 percentage points lower than Mayberry, so in my mind, the mid-range game factors into overall shooting and that effects my overall view of Dillard. Thurman was just so versatile. He was better than Day from three point range but he had the mid game range like Day. The Missouri game from Scotty's Freshman year is the best example of his versatility.
These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

 

eusebius

Quote from: Champs04 on December 01, 2014, 03:08:42 pm
Were any of them face guarded like Clarke was?

That's a fair point. Most of these guys played on the same team as another good shooter to take some of the pressure off and open up some looks




   
These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

ErieHog

Quote from: Champs04 on December 01, 2014, 03:08:42 pm
Were any of them face guarded like Clarke was?

No, but to be fair, Clarke wasn't corralled by hand checks or jersey grabs, like those who came before him
No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

eusebius

Quote from: ErieHog on December 01, 2014, 05:53:59 pm
No, but to be fair, Clarke wasn't corralled by hand checks or jersey grabs, like those who came before him

That's true and if we want to talk about competition, Day's/Mayberry's and Thurman's teams had much tougher schedules. The SEC was better and college basketball was much better from 88-95. In 94-95, the Hogs had the 7th toughest schedule in the country and from 90-95 they were routinely at 35-40 SOS. Clarke's team's highest SOS was around 75.     
These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

gdawg

Quote from: Granny on November 30, 2014, 07:51:19 pm
I'll go with Al Dillard.  Haven't seen any shots taken (and going in regularly) from the hog tail lately.

*disclaimer--clutch shooting goes to Thurman.
I agree 100%     Al Dillard had crazy range, and could single handedly go on a 15-0 run. Scotty Thurman was clutch and consistent!

hawgrunner


Mr. Porkleone


eusebius

Quote from: Mr. Porkleone on December 01, 2014, 09:10:40 pm
Where is Corlliss Williamson in these stats?

LOL,  I assume you are kidding. Corliss was 1/6 from 3 pt range in his career and shot 67 % from the FT line. Now I have plenty of other props for Corliss as well as some good AAU and basketball camp stories.   
These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

dhornjr1

Quote from: eusebius on December 01, 2014, 09:34:20 pm
LOL,  I assume you are kidding. Corliss was 1/6 from 3 pt range in his career and shot 67 % from the FT line. Now I have plenty of other props for Corliss as well as some good AAU and basketball camp stories.   

I remember that one three he hit. It was against Mississippi State at Bud Walton Arena in 1995. Top of the key. The crowd was deafening.

God, I'm old.

pigture perfect

Dillard had the best range. Clark had the best touch. In my humble opinion of course.
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hog.goblin

Robert Shepherd had to be close to 40% from 3pt range.  Not to mention the defense, though I think he only played 2 years after transferring in.

Warren Linn was another one of those deadly early shooters.  I saw him in Tulsa the other day.  He looks like he could play LB or TE for the Hogs now.

Modica and TJ Cleveland come to mind as good shooters, though not necessarily good enough for this list.

mykidsdad

Quote from: eusebius on November 30, 2014, 05:05:55 pm
Here's a look at the best shooters since the 86-87 season using four metrics: Fg%, 3pt%, Ft % and ppg. Only players who have completed their careers are listed.

FG %
1. Mayberry 49.5
2. Day 47.9
3. Johnson 46.6
4 Thurman 46.4
5. Pargo 45.5
6 . Rimac 44.8
7. Clarke 43.5
8. Beverly 42.0
9. McKellar 41.6
10. Bradley 40.8

3Pt %
1. Thurman 43.2
2. Pargo 42.5
3. Mayberry 42.4
4. McKellar 42.3
5. Clarke 42.0
6. Johnson 40.6
7. Bradley 40.0
8. Day 38.4
9. Beverly 38.2
10. Rimac 35.9

FT%
1. Clarke 86.3
2. Rimac 86.1
3. McKellar 86.0
4. Bradley 85.8
5. Pargo 82.0
6. Thurman 77.0
7. Johnson 75.3
8. Day 74.7
9. Beverly 73.0
10. Mayberry 72.4

PPG
1. Day 18.9
2. Thurman 16.2
3. Johnson 15.0
4. Pargo 14.4
5. Clarke 14.2
6. Mayberry 14.0
7. Bradley 13.4
8. Beverly 12.0
9. McKellar 7.3
10. Rimac 3.4

Avg Rank:
1. Thurman 3.25
2. Pargo 4
3. Clarke 4.5
4. Day and Johnson 4.75
6. Mayberry 5
7. McKellar 6.25
8 Bradley and Rimac 7
10. Beverly 8.5

Avg Rank without PPG factored in
1. Thurman 3.6
2. Pargo 4
3. Clarke 4.3
4. Mayberry 4.66
5. Johnson and McKellar  5.3
7. Day and Rimac 6
9. Bradley
10. Beverly 8.6

Some observations: Two players, Al Dillard and Tim Scott could have been looked at also, but Dillard's Fg% was under 40, so he would not have scored well over all. Scott's 3 pt % was in the 30's. McKellar had only one full season here, but it was a solid shooting season.  Bradley is the all-time leader in 3's made, but he had four full seasons to set that mark. Day and Mayberry score high on any offensive or defensive metric when compared to any Hog bb player in history.

Scotty Thurman is the best shooter I've seen in a Hog uniform and the metrics back that up. From clutch shots, to shooting percentage, to ppg, to mid -range game to all around shooting, Thurman is the best. Dillard and Clarke had some great performances, but night in and night out and in big games, Scotty was tops.   

Pargo was underrated and underappreciated. His career was overshadowed by Nolan's last games. But Pargo, could really shoot and the metric shows that. Johnson was solid here at the UofA but developed into an even better long range shooter in the pros.  Beverly was solid, but was not the shooter some of the other guys were, but was one of the best rebounding guards we've had. 

How would great college basketball shooters in that era compare to the best Razorbacks?

Allan Houston, Tennessee:    46 Fg% (less than Mayberry, Day,  Johnson , and Pargo)
42.4 3 Pt% (less than Thurman and Pargo),   84.9 FT % (less than Clark, Rimac, McKellar, and Bradley),  21.9 ppg (better than any Hog)

Chris Jackson, LSU:   47.4 FG% (lower than Mayberry and Day), 37.2 3pt % (only Rimac is lower),  86.3 FT% and 29 ppg  (tied with Clarke and higher than any Hog in ppg)

Dave Jamerson, Miami, OH:  48.8 FG% (less than Mayberry),  41.9 3pt % (6th on the Hog list) , 84.6 FT% (less than Clarke, Rimac, McKellar, and Bradley) , 20.3ppg (better than any Hog)

Steph Curry, Davidson: 46.7 FG% (less than Mayberry and Day),  41.2 3pt % (less than the top 5 Hogs) , FT 87.6, 25.3 ppg% (better than all Razorbacks).

Glen Rice, Michigan: 56.9 FG %,  48 3pt % (both better than any Hog),  79.7 FT % (lower than the top 5) ,  18.2 ppg (lower than Day)   

J.J. Redick, Duke: 43.3 FG %, 40.6 3PT %, 91.2 FT%, 19.9 ppg (only FT and ppg are better than the Hogs best)

The best the Hogs have put on the floor, stack up well against some of the best shooters in cbb since the 3 pt line was introduced. Mayberry's nearly 50% Fg, is in the Nash/Stockton category for point guards.   
 











I reply to this just to point out that you missed one of the better shooters, and since he is a very good friend of mine I will correct you.

Ron Huery had the following career stats:

GP-GS  Min--Avg  FG-FGA   Pct 3FG-FGA   Pct  FT-FTA   Pct  Off Def  Tot  Avg  PF FO   A  TO Blk Stl  Pts  Avg
134-70 3327 24.8 534-1156 .462  94-255  .369 388-494  .785  174 286  460  2.6 315  3 351 279  70 207 1550  11.6

so on your rankings above he was 5th in FG%, 9th in PPG, 10th in 3pt%, and 6th in FT%. He was therefore in the top 10 in all the shooting metrics from your above post, but yet you didn't mention him. Ron was a hell of a player so I find in hard to believe that people seem to forget about him.

dhornjr1

Quote from: hog.goblin on December 01, 2014, 11:32:21 pm
Warren Linn was another one of those deadly early shooters.  I saw him in Tulsa the other day.  He looks like he could play LB or TE for the Hogs now.

I saw Warren Linn and Michael Hogue at Godfather's Pizza one night after a game. The game had been against a cupcake team and the Razorbacks had struggled in the first half and then came out in the second half and blew the doors off the other team.

Linn and Hogue were telling their girlfriends what Nolan had said at halftime. They were laughing and saying Nolan stormed into the locker room and boomed, "GET OUT THERE AND KICK SOME ASS!" Then, just as quickly, he was gone.

That was the limit to his halftime strategy against the Sisters of the Poor.

dhornjr1

Quote from: mykidsdad on December 01, 2014, 11:35:21 pm
I reply to this just to point out that you missed one of the better shooters, and since he is a very good friend of mine I will correct you.

Ron Huery had the following career stats:

GP-GS  Min--Avg  FG-FGA   Pct 3FG-FGA   Pct  FT-FTA   Pct  Off Def  Tot  Avg  PF FO   A  TO Blk Stl  Pts  Avg
134-70 3327 24.8 534-1156 .462  94-255  .369 388-494  .785  174 286  460  2.6 315  3 351 279  70 207 1550  11.6

so on your rankings above he was 5th in FG%, 9th in PPG, 10th in 3pt%, and 6th in FT%. He was therefore in the top 10 in all the shooting metrics from your above post, but yet you didn't mention him. Ron was a hell of a player so I find in hard to believe that people seem to forget about him.


Haven't seen you post much lately, mkd. Good to see you around.

ErieHog

Quote from: hog.goblin on December 01, 2014, 11:32:21 pm
Robert Shepherd had to be close to 40% from 3pt range.  Not to mention the defense, though I think he only played 2 years after transferring in.

Warren Linn was another one of those deadly early shooters.  I saw him in Tulsa the other day.  He looks like he could play LB or TE for the Hogs now.

Modica and TJ Cleveland come to mind as good shooters, though not necessarily good enough for this list.


Shep was right at 40% for his career from 3;  .403;  Modica, only .358;   Cleveland, only .365

All 3 essentially shot 70% from the line (.699, .704, and .704);  Cleveland can be further eliminated, by a career FG% under 40.

They're solid shooters, all, but a half tick behind the Top 10s.
No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

eusebius

Quote from: mykidsdad on December 01, 2014, 11:35:21 pm
I reply to this just to point out that you missed one of the better shooters, and since he is a very good friend of mine I will correct you.

Ron Huery had the following career stats:

GP-GS  Min--Avg  FG-FGA   Pct 3FG-FGA   Pct  FT-FTA   Pct  Off Def  Tot  Avg  PF FO   A  TO Blk Stl  Pts  Avg
134-70 3327 24.8 534-1156 .462  94-255  .369 388-494  .785  174 286  460  2.6 315  3 351 279  70 207 1550  11.6

so on your rankings above he was 5th in FG%, 9th in PPG, 10th in 3pt%, and 6th in FT%. He was therefore in the top 10 in all the shooting metrics from your above post, but yet you didn't mention him. Ron was a hell of a player so I find in hard to believe that people seem to forget about him.

I remember Huery well and I appreciate you bringing him up and doing the stat work.
Based on the above he was  46.2 FG (which would put him behind Scotty I believe), 36.9 3 PT (ahead of Rimac) and 78.5 (ahead of Scotty). He could easily bump Rimac, but Davor shot better than 86 from the line. Probably Huery could bump Beverly (sorry Patrick as I think I saw Bev is on the board). As always I open to correction if there has been a stat or player omission.
These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

eusebius

Quote from: ErieHog on December 01, 2014, 11:59:22 pm
Shep was right at 40% for his career from 3;  .403;  Modica, only .358;   Cleveland, only .365

All 3 essentially shot 70% from the line (.699, .704, and .704);  Cleveland can be further eliminated, by a career FG% under 40.

They're solid shooters, all, but a half tick behind the Top 10s.

Erie, I always enjoy when the Day v Moncrief discussion comes around. Do you have those comparison charts in a link?
These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

ErieHog

Quote from: eusebius on December 02, 2014, 12:10:36 am
Erie, I always enjoy when the Day v Moncrief discussion comes around. Do you have those comparison charts in a link?

Not handy, no.
No cause, ever, in the history of all mankind, has produced more cold-blooded tyrants, more slaughtered innocents, and more orphans than socialism with power. It surpassed, exponentially, all other systems of production in turning out the dead. The bodies are all around us. And here is the problem: No one talks about them. No one honors them. No one does penance for them. No one has committed suicide for having been an apologist for those who did this to them. No one pays for them. No one is hunted down to account for them. It is exactly what Solzhenitsyn foresaw in The Gulag Archipelago: "No, no one would have to answer. No one would be looked into." Until that happens, there is no "after socialism."

hog.goblin

Quote from: mykidsdad on December 01, 2014, 11:35:21 pm
I reply to this just to point out that you missed one of the better shooters, and since he is a very good friend of mine I will correct you.

Ron Huery had the following career stats:

GP-GS  Min--Avg  FG-FGA   Pct 3FG-FGA   Pct  FT-FTA   Pct  Off Def  Tot  Avg  PF FO   A  TO Blk Stl  Pts  Avg
134-70 3327 24.8 534-1156 .462  94-255  .369 388-494  .785  174 286  460  2.6 315  3 351 279  70 207 1550  11.6

so on your rankings above he was 5th in FG%, 9th in PPG, 10th in 3pt%, and 6th in FT%. He was therefore in the top 10 in all the shooting metrics from your above post, but yet you didn't mention him. Ron was a hell of a player so I find in hard to believe that people seem to forget about him.


I think Huery gets somewhat forgotten because of the Big 3 and because of that year off.  But no doubt he was a great Razorback.  He and Darrell Hawkins were 2 of favorite all time Hogs because of their energy.

eusebius

Quote from: hog.goblin on December 02, 2014, 12:30:41 am
I think Huery gets somewhat forgotten because of the Big 3 and because of that year off.  But no doubt he was a great Razorback.  He and Darrell Hawkins were 2 of favorite all time Hogs because of their energy.

Landing Huery got the Memphis ball rolling. Then Day came and then year after year our roster was stocked with Memphis guys, Beck, Stewart, etc etc. Getting those guys out of the Bluff City and away from Finch was a big coup. And then Ole Miss started doing it to us. In the late 90's Ole Miss had some good runs with Arkansas players. Made for some good rivalries in those days.
These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

pignparadise

Quote from: Jackrabbit Hog on November 30, 2014, 05:32:52 pm
I know it's not possible but I would dearly love to see where Marvin Delph would rank on those lists had he played in that era and with the 3 point line.  Best pure outside shooter I have ever seen in a Hog uniform.
Marvin Delph was a career .529 fg shooter. Most of his shots were from what now would be 3 point range. I've seen em all from 1967-now. He was the best pure shooter in Arkansas history.
"The race is long.. and in the end it's only with yourself.....", Baz Luhrman "Sunscreen"

eusebius

Quote from: pignparadise on December 02, 2014, 11:42:08 am
Marvin Delph was a career .529 fg shooter. Most of his shots were from what now would be 3 point range. I've seen em all from 1967-now. He was the best pure shooter in Arkansas history.

Delph, Moncrief, and Brewer were all really high percentage shooters. Sidney is over 60 % for his career which is just unheard of for perimeter players. The three point shot has both helped and hurt the game. That's one of the reasons that guys like Mayberry, Day, Thurman, and Huery would be shoot high percentages in both eras. They had the in-between game, having not had the three point line all the way through their formative bb years. Day and Mayberry were in high school when it came in, and Huery was a freshman at Ark when college went to the 3 pt line (the ACC had been experimenting with it before full implementation). I'm a little bit younger than those guys, but I know that when the line first came in our coaches were skeptical and didn't really want us shooting threes. Bradley, Pargo, Clarke played when the line had been in existence almost a decade, and by then coaches mentality toward the line had changed considerably. 

The players that I find scoring best in my shooting matrices are guys who played in the late 80's and early 90's. Christian Laettner has the best career numbers for shooting I've come across. Better than the Price brothers, FG % is even better than Larry Bird in college.

Laettner: 57.4 FG %, 48.5 3pt% 80.6 FT %, 16.6 ppg.  His average score would be 2.5, which would be better than any Hog. 

These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

pignparadise

Quote from: eusebius on December 02, 2014, 12:16:22 pm
Delph, Moncrief, and Brewer were all really high percentage shooters. Sidney is over 60 % for his career which is just unheard of for perimeter players. The three point shot has both helped and hurt the game. That's one of the reasons that guys like Mayberry, Day, Thurman, and Huery would be shoot high percentages in both eras. They had the in-between game, having not had the three point line all the way through their formative bb years. Day and Mayberry were in high school when it came in, and Huery was a freshman at Ark when college went to the 3 pt line (the ACC had been experimenting with it before full implementation). I'm a little bit younger than those guys, but I know that when the line first came in our coaches were skeptical and didn't really want us shooting threes. Bradley, Pargo, Clarke played when the line had been in existence almost a decade, and by then coaches mentality toward the line had changed considerably. 

The players that I find scoring best in my shooting matrices are guys who played in the late 80's and early 90's. Christian Laettner has the best career numbers for shooting I've come across. Better than the Price brothers, FG % is even better than Larry Bird in college.

Laettner: 57.4 FG %, 48.5 3pt% 80.6 FT %, 16.6 ppg.  His average score would be 2.5, which would be better than any Hog. 


Sidney for the first three years of his career was a 6-4 forward. Most all his baskets come from the rim. It was only in his senior year that he became more of a guard. That's the reason his fg percentage is above .600. In no way was he a better shooter than Marvin.
"The race is long.. and in the end it's only with yourself.....", Baz Luhrman "Sunscreen"

Jackrabbit Hog

Quote from: pignparadise on December 02, 2014, 12:25:36 pm
Sidney for the first three years of his career was a 6-4 forward. Most all his baskets come from the rim. It was only in his senior year that he became more of a guard. That's the reason his fg percentage is above .600. In no way was he a better shooter than Marvin.

His senior year, Sidney was basically a guard/forward/center.  He literally carried a bunch of young guys on his back that year, all the way through the NCAA tournament.  But you are right, his first three years most of his shots came in the paint, on dunks and on layups.  He left the outside shooting to Delph and Brewer.
Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on June 29, 2018, 03:47:07 pm
I'm sure it's nothing that a $500 retainer can't fix.  Contact JackRabbit Hog for payment instructions.

PonderinHog


eusebius

Quote from: pignparadise on December 02, 2014, 12:25:36 pm
Sidney for the first three years of his career was a 6-4 forward. Most all his baskets come from the rim. It was only in his senior year that he became more of a guard. That's the reason his fg percentage is above .600. In no way was he a better shooter than Marvin.

Good pt. Sid did most of his damage around the rim. I assume everyone in this thread knows where to get these stats, but if not: 
http://www.hogstats.com/

Don't know who runs the site, but that and sports reference/college basketball will get you what you need. 
These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.

eusebius

These things I know: There's no doubt Gary Anderson was very underrated . . Ike Forte had the best number ever for a running back and the best thing about the option was that last second pitch right before the DE hits the quarterback.