AL.com-SEC Expansion: Why the Big 12 is the key to SEC adding more schools

[Hugo Bezdek]

Notre Dame has a great arrangement for them. They are "affiliated" to a degree with the ACC in football to a degree, also on a limited basis with their Field Hockey team and full membership with every other sport. ND doesn't play a full slate of 9 ACC football games, it only plays 5 and when it comes to bowl season, ND only has to abide by the ACC order of placement if it benefits them. If a certain higher ranked bowl that might normally go to an ACC #2 wants ND, Notre Dame can skip over their ACC brethren to that bowl. It's a heck of a deal for ND. Not so much for the ACC.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/colleges/in-notre-dame-deal-acc-got-short-end-of-the-stick/2012/09/16/21faded6-0013-11e2-9367-4e1bafb958db_story.html?utm_term=.92bc40b40350

Yeah I'm sure that arrangement heavily favors ND. Most of their media money still comes from NBC so I doubt their GOR is valued the same as the full members. The buyout is probably much more affordable.

Incidentally, ND has moved their Hockey program to the Big Ten.

[Cinco de Hogo]

Notre Dame has a great arrangement for them. They are "affiliated" to a degree with the ACC in football to a degree, also on a limited basis with their Field Hockey team and full membership with every other sport. ND doesn't play a full slate of 9 ACC football games, it only plays 5 and when it comes to bowl season, ND only has to abide by the ACC order of placement if it benefits them. If a certain higher ranked bowl that might normally go to an ACC #2 wants ND, Notre Dame can skip over their ACC brethren to that bowl. It's a heck of a deal for ND. Not so much for the ACC.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/colleges/in-notre-dame-deal-acc-got-short-end-of-the-stick/2012/09/16/21faded6-0013-11e2-9367-4e1bafb958db_story.html?utm_term=.92bc40b40350

I knew some of that and it exactly what I would expect from ND and Texass.  Why people say the sport needs either one of those schools I will never understand.

[HiggiePiggy]

I knew some of that and it exactly what I would expect from ND and Texass.  Why people say the sport needs either one of those schools I will never understand.

It doesn't. It's just fed to people by media darlings that were around when Notre Dame was the big thing. Really those two schools could go away and the sport would still be as great as it ever has been.

[tigers68]

I'd like OU and Kansas.  Kansas gives the west an easy football opponent and really ups the basketball in the conference.

LOL!  You really haven't had any interaction with kU fans/alums/administrators have you?  There's no way that they would join the SEC, simply because they still live in the Civil War era, and consider every school in the SEC to be slaveholding hillbillys.  Hell, they still call Missourians, "slavers" to this very day.

GuvHog couldn't be more wrong about expansion in regards to the Big 12.  The $EC is not going to take Oklahoma State, with or without OU.  And NO, the value that OU brings is NOT enough to offset splitting up the pie again for Okie State.  Oh and kU and kState are NOT joined at the hip.  The B1G is NOT going to take kState.  They are a cruddy little ag school with no AAU membership.  Lack of AAU membership also keeps OU out of the B1G as well.  Had NU lost their AAU membership prior to expansion, they wouldn't be in the B1G.  kU's most likely landing spot when the Big12-2 dies, is the B1G.  KSU, Tech, Baylor, Iowa State, TCU, & WVU are humped.  They'll be relegated to the Mountain West.

[GuvHog]

LOL!  You really haven't had any interaction with kU fans/alums/administrators have you?  There's no way that they would join the SEC, simply because they still live in the Civil War era, and consider every school in the SEC to be slaveholding hillbillys.  Hell, they still call Missourians, "slavers" to this very day.

GuvHog couldn't be more wrong about expansion in regards to the Big 12.  The $EC is not going to take Oklahoma State, with or without OU.  And NO, the value that OU brings is NOT enough to offset splitting up the pie again for Okie State.  Oh and kU and kState are NOT joined at the hip.  The B1G is NOT going to take kState.  They are a cruddy little ag school with no AAU membership.  Lack of AAU membership also keeps OU out of the B1G as well.  Had NU lost their AAU membership prior to expansion, they wouldn't be in the B1G.  kU's most likely landing spot when the Big12-2 dies, is the B1G.  KSU, Tech, Baylor, Iowa State, TCU, & WVU are humped.  They'll be relegated to the Mountain West.

You're wrong about the SEC not taking both OU and Okla state, even the SEC Commissioner has mention both as a possibility.

[medloh]

We will just have to agree to disagree. And while Oklahoma and Oklahoma State may be linked by politics by virtue of being in the same state, I can assure you that doesn't mean that the two of them always see things the same way when it comes to voting issues. There is no love lost between those two.

In any case, when the time comes to make theses decisions no one at the SEC office is going to ask me, (not sure about you since I don't know you) what my opinion is about adding those two schools or whichever two schools they choose to invite.

No one is asking me anything.  I'm just a long time Mizzou fan that  lived through the B12 days and I know its problems.  One big problem was that it had too many duplicate teams in small markets (ISU, KSU, OSU, a bunch of Texas little brothers).  That's a formula for disaster, just like the SWC.  You've got to have strong healthy flagships that dominate state markets and won't bend the knee to the conference bullies out of fear.

The last thing you want when adding teams is to introduce this kind of thing.  Especially when your conference is already strong, rich, and can be really selective.

[Inhogswetrust]

You're wrong about the SEC not taking both OU and Okla state, even the SEC Commissioner has mention both as a possibility.

I must have missed that. I'm sure you can provide proof.....................

[MuskogeeHogFan]

You're wrong about the SEC not taking both OU and Okla state, even the SEC Commissioner has mention both as a possibility.

I must have missed that. I'm sure you can provide proof.....................

Here's an article from just about a year ago written by a guy who writes for the Times-Picayune who makes a case for the addition of Oklahoma-Oklahoma State and while he says that Greg Sankey needs to be thinking ahead about this addition, there isn't any comment from Sankey about the possibility of it happening.

What is noteworthy however, is how the SEC came to issue invitations to Missouri and Texas A&M. Slive said that he waited until both schools had contacted him and indicated that they not only would come if they were invited to do so, but they really wanted to make the move, because Slive didn't want the SEC to be accused of "pilfering" another P-5 conference. That makes good sense.

This is probably why we haven't heard, nor seen a published quote from an SEC Commissioner with regard to possibility of the addition of Oklahoma and Oklahoma State. At least I haven't ever seen or heard of it having happened. Maybe someone else has and can provide a link?

I doubt that we will see the addition of any other P-5 teams to the SEC unless representatives of those schools from the very highest levels (able to make binding commitments on behalf of the schools) approach the SEC first and make clear their intentions that they want to join and definitely will accept an invitation if one is extended.

Anyway, here are quotes from the article, there is much more inside.

It's why Sankey needs to convince the presidents and chancellors of all the SEC members he needs to make strong recruiting pitches to Oklahoma and Oklahoma State to become the league's 15th an 16th members.

The schools fit the SEC demographic in every possible way, and not just the obvious fact both have great football programs that gave us College Football Hall of Fame coaches like Jimmy Johnson and Barry Switizer, and Heisman Trophy winners such as Barry Sanders and Billy Sims.

The SEC likes athletic programs that are successful in all sports. Oklahoma State has 51 national titles and Oklahoma has 30.

Both schools have magnificent athletic facilities that fit in the SEC landscape and both have rabid fan bases that would drive league TV viewership higher.

Finally, both are located in states that touch three other states with SEC members - Missouri, Arkansas and Texas (Texas A&M).

All current 14 members are in states that are linked. That's important for travel costs for the schools and for fans, and for the general feel that there's no member halfway across the country in a state far removed from other league teams.

http://www.nola.com/lsu/index.ssf/2016/07/when_the_big_12_expands_so_sho.html

[GuvHog]

Here's an article from just about a year ago written by a guy who writes for the Times-Picayune who makes a case for the addition of Oklahoma-Oklahoma State and while he says that Greg Sankey needs to be thinking ahead about this addition, there isn't any comment from Sankey about the possibility of it happening.

What is noteworthy however, is how the SEC came to issue invitations to Missouri and Texas A&M. Slive said that he waited until both schools had contacted him and indicated that they not only would come if they were invited to do so, but they really wanted to make the move, because Slive didn't want the SEC to be accused of "pilfering" another P-5 conference. That makes good sense.

This is probably why we haven't heard, nor seen a published quote from an SEC Commissioner with regard to possibility of the addition of Oklahoma and Oklahoma State. At least I haven't ever seen or heard of it having happened. Maybe someone else has and can provide a link?

I doubt that we will see the addition of any other P-5 teams to the SEC unless representatives of those schools from the very highest levels (able to make binding commitments on behalf of the schools) approach the SEC first and make clear their intentions that they want to join and definitely will accept an invitation if one is extended.

Anyway, here are quotes from the article, there is much more inside.

It's why Sankey needs to convince the presidents and chancellors of all the SEC members he needs to make strong recruiting pitches to Oklahoma and Oklahoma State to become the league's 15th an 16th members.

The schools fit the SEC demographic in every possible way, and not just the obvious fact both have great football programs that gave us College Football Hall of Fame coaches like Jimmy Johnson and Barry Switizer, and Heisman Trophy winners such as Barry Sanders and Billy Sims.

The SEC likes athletic programs that are successful in all sports. Oklahoma State has 51 national titles and Oklahoma has 30.

Both schools have magnificent athletic facilities that fit in the SEC landscape and both have rabid fan bases that would drive league TV viewership higher.

Finally, both are located in states that touch three other states with SEC members - Missouri, Arkansas and Texas (Texas A&M).

All current 14 members are in states that are linked. That's important for travel costs for the schools and for fans, and for the general feel that there's no member halfway across the country in a state far removed from other league teams.

http://www.nola.com/lsu/index.ssf/2016/07/when_the_big_12_expands_so_sho.html

Thanks Muskogee. I actually though Sankey mentioned OU and OSU as a possibility in that article but I was wrong. My bad.

[hobhog]

Here's an article from just about a year ago written by a guy who writes for the Times-Picayune who makes a case for the addition of Oklahoma-Oklahoma State and while he says that Greg Sankey needs to be thinking ahead about this addition, there isn't any comment from Sankey about the possibility of it happening.

What is noteworthy however, is how the SEC came to issue invitations to Missouri and Texas A&M. Slive said that he waited until both schools had contacted him and indicated that they not only would come if they were invited to do so, but they really wanted to make the move, because Slive didn't want the SEC to be accused of "pilfering" another P-5 conference. That makes good sense.

This is probably why we haven't heard, nor seen a published quote from an SEC Commissioner with regard to possibility of the addition of Oklahoma and Oklahoma State. At least I haven't ever seen or heard of it having happened. Maybe someone else has and can provide a link?

I doubt that we will see the addition of any other P-5 teams to the SEC unless representatives of those schools from the very highest levels (able to make binding commitments on behalf of the schools) approach the SEC first and make clear their intentions that they want to join and definitely will accept an invitation if one is extended.

Anyway, here are quotes from the article, there is much more inside.

It's why Sankey needs to convince the presidents and chancellors of all the SEC members he needs to make strong recruiting pitches to Oklahoma and Oklahoma State to become the league's 15th an 16th members.

The schools fit the SEC demographic in every possible way, and not just the obvious fact both have great football programs that gave us College Football Hall of Fame coaches like Jimmy Johnson and Barry Switizer, and Heisman Trophy winners such as Barry Sanders and Billy Sims.

The SEC likes athletic programs that are successful in all sports. Oklahoma State has 51 national titles and Oklahoma has 30.

Both schools have magnificent athletic facilities that fit in the SEC landscape and both have rabid fan bases that would drive league TV viewership higher.

Finally, both are located in states that touch three other states with SEC members - Missouri, Arkansas and Texas (Texas A&M).

All current 14 members are in states that are linked. That's important for travel costs for the schools and for fans, and for the general feel that there's no member halfway across the country in a state far removed from other league teams.

http://www.nola.com/lsu/index.ssf/2016/07/when_the_big_12_expands_so_sho.html

Why would the SEC want to go up to sixteen teams while Pac 10, ACC and Big 10 still only have 14? And what would the other 8 teams from Big 8 do? Seems to me it would get the SEC really out of whack with where NCAA football seems to be heading- Power 5 conference champions playing along with 3 at large teams in 8 team playoff?

Big 8 needs to get shite together and catch up with rest of country and keep Okies out of SEC.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Why would the SEC want to go up to sixteen teams while Pac 10, ACC and Big 10 still only have 14? And what would the other 8 teams from Big 8 do? Seems to me it would get the SEC really out of whack with where NCAA football seems to be heading- Power 5 conference champions playing along with 3 at large teams in 8 team playoff?

Big 8 needs to get shite together and catch up with rest of country and keep Okies out of SEC.

The SEC, Big Ten and ACC have 14 teams, the old Pac 10 is now the Pac 12 and they actually have 12 teams.

As for your other comment, I can see why the SEC would want to add Oklahoma and Oklahoma State, but for the reasons I mentioned, nothing has been put out for public consumption to support that notion. That's not to say that it ever will or won't happen.

As far as the remaining 8 teams in the current Big 12, when the time comes that they are closer to the end of their GOR's (2025) I don't think the SEC will care very much about where everyone else might land, unless of course they choose to go to 16 and pick off two other schools at the same time.