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Booked a trip to San Francisco last week.

Started by Boarcephus, June 26, 2014, 06:02:04 am

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Boarcephus

Plan on crossing another one off the bucket list in october.  Staying at the Argonaut and the only trips we have lined up are a tour through Yosemite and Alcatraz.  There's a Japanese Tea Garden that is supposed to be the finest in the country and other than that, just gonna wing it.  Any suggestions on nice seafood restaurants fairly close to the Fisherman's Wharf area?   
I need to be more like my dog...if you can't fight it, screw it, or eat it, then piss on it.

Boog41

June 26, 2014, 03:00:27 pm #1 Last Edit: June 26, 2014, 03:38:01 pm by Boog41
Boar, it's been too long since I've been to San Fran to help you on seafood restaurants. I would recommend you check out this Italian place though if you get a chance. North Beach Restaurant. http://www.northbeachrestaurant.com/

Absolutely go to Muir Woods for a walk through the big Redwoods. Don't forget wine country is just an hour or so north. It's an easy day trip.

Are you really doing a tour through Yosemite?? It isn't anywhere close to San Fran.

 

Boarcephus

Quote from: Boog41 on June 26, 2014, 03:00:27 pm
Boar, it's been too long since I've been to San Fran to help you on seafood restaurants. I would recommend you check out this Italian place though if you get a chance. North Beach Restaurant. http://www.northbeachrestaurant.com/

Absolutely go to Muir Woods for a walk through the big Red Woods. Don't forget wine country is just an hour or so north. It's an easy day trip.

Are you really doing a tour through Yosemite?? It isn't anywhere close to San Fran.

Yes we are.  14 hour tour and we get back deep into Yosemite.  You get back and see the huge waterfall, El Capitan (or whatever  ;) ) plus whatever else.  All day deal.  We'll check out the restaurant.  Thanks.
I need to be more like my dog...if you can't fight it, screw it, or eat it, then piss on it.

Old Tusk

miur woods is a must. Also take the ferry ride to sosellito. The Polynesian bar in the basement of the Fairmont. Only open certain days of the week so check before you go. The House of Prime Rib is a classic old steak house for a change of fair from seafood.

San Francisco is one of the World's greatest cities.
The Democrats are the party that says government can make you richer, smarter, taller and get the crabgrass out of our lawn. Republicans are the party that says government doesn't work, and then they get elected and prove it....P.J. O'Rourke

Boog41

Quote from: Boarcephus on June 26, 2014, 03:13:40 pm
Yes we are.  14 hour tour and we get back deep into Yosemite.  You get back and see the huge waterfall, El Capitan (or whatever  ;) ) plus whatever else.  All day deal.  We'll check out the restaurant.  Thanks.

Wow.... ok.... Yosemite is certainly beautiful and you will be awwwwed. I spent a week there and Sequoia Nat'l Parks once.

If the wine country for a day is something you'd be interested I'd be happy to give you recommendations.

Do you golf Boar?

Jackrabbit Hog

San Fran . . . one of my favorite cities to visit.  Strange, strange people there, but the city itself is possibly the most beautiful in the USA.

There are several seafood restaurants on Fisherman's Wharf and they are all excellent.  I've eaten at 2-3 of them, can't recall the names offhand, but all were great. 

Like others have said, Muir Woods is a must.  If you're driving, drive across the Golden Gate Bridge late afternoon and watch the fog roll over the hills toward you on the Sausalito side.  It's eerie and beautiful.  Great views of the city from there too.

Walk through Chinatown.  I think it's the original "Chinatown" of the US and the hustle and bustle on the street is amazing.  Great Chinese food there, too.

Napa Valley is a great experience, but IMHO you ought to take a couple of days for that to get the full experience.  And, to the south of San Fran, Big Sur and the Monterey Peninsula are great. 

Really, anywhere in northern California you can't go wrong for scenery.
Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on June 29, 2018, 03:47:07 pm
I'm sure it's nothing that a $500 retainer can't fix.  Contact JackRabbit Hog for payment instructions.

Boarcephus

Quote from: Boog41 on June 26, 2014, 03:41:44 pm
Wow.... ok.... Yosemite is certainly beautiful and you will be awwwwed. I spent a week there and Sequoia Nat'l Parks once.

If the wine country for a day is something you'd be interested I'd be happy to give you recommendations.

Do you golf Boar?

Love to golf but never do it on vacation.   Like to do stuff there we can't do here.

I've heard that if you do Yosemite there is no need to do Muir Woods.

Probably won't even rent a car this trip.  Gonna ride the trolley wherever we go and might rent a bike to ride across the GGB.
I need to be more like my dog...if you can't fight it, screw it, or eat it, then piss on it.

LSUFan

Bring a light jacket, it's 65 during the day and about 58 at night.

Went there 28 years ago, but I heard China Town is a must see.
I ain't saying you babysitting, but my kids are all over your couch.

Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on August 17, 2015, 02:46:52 pm
Sometimes, I think you're a wine-o who found a laptop in a dumpster.

cosmodrum

China Town is very cool. Check out Haight-Ashbury. Of course, it's a shell of it's former self, but still cool. There's a great chocolatier on the Pier. Get some good truffles, and go next door to it and get a bottle of wine or two. Chocolate and wine is nice unwind in the hotel room after a day of sightseeing/diddling around.

And yes, LSUFan is right. I went in mid-August back in 2005 and it was never above 70. It's just too windy to get warm.
Go away, batin'

ImHogginIt

If you rent a car get up early and drive from San Fran down Hwy 1 to Monterey and enjoy the gorgeous scenery of the Pacific Ocean. Stop in Santa Cruz and eat at one of the restaurants on the Pier. Or eat at the fisherman's wharf in Monterey

Boog41

Quote from: Boarcephus on June 26, 2014, 04:16:26 pm
Love to golf but never do it on vacation.   Like to do stuff there we can't do here.

I've heard that if you do Yosemite there is no need to do Muir Woods.

Probably won't even rent a car this trip.  Gonna ride the trolley wherever we go and might rent a bike to ride across the GGB.

If you make it to the part of Yosemite where you see some sequoia's you can make an argument for not going to Muir Woods. Sequoia's are bigger around, but redwoods are taller though.

I asked about golfing because Pebble Beach/Monterey are only about 1.5 hours south.

ImHogginIt

Quote from: Boarcephus on June 26, 2014, 04:16:26 pm
Love to golf but never do it on vacation.   Like to do stuff there we can't do here.

I've heard that if you do Yosemite there is no need to do Muir Woods.

Probably won't even rent a car this trip.  Gonna ride the trolley wherever we go and might rent a bike to ride across the GGB.

I enjoyed the drive to Monterey on Hwy 1 100 times better than walking around a bunch of trees in Muir Woods

Old Tusk

Been to both and can't buy that if you go to Yosemite, you don't need to go to Muir Woods.
The Democrats are the party that says government can make you richer, smarter, taller and get the crabgrass out of our lawn. Republicans are the party that says government doesn't work, and then they get elected and prove it....P.J. O'Rourke

 

Dropkick

We ate at Scoma's at fishermans wharf and it was excellent. Beautiful ballpark the giants play in if you are interested in that. I preferred Napa over Sonoma if you slide up to wine country.

Boarcephus

Quote from: Old Tusk on June 26, 2014, 05:06:14 pm
Been to both and can't buy that if you go to Yosemite, you don't need to go to Muir Woods.

Trust me, I don't know that's just what I was told.  We're toying around with a wine country trip but haven't decided yet.  If we like it as much as we think we will, we'll come back and rent a car and head up and down the coast and that's really what I'd like to do.  We'll have 5 nights and may do it anyway this trip.

Appreciate all you guys help.
I need to be more like my dog...if you can't fight it, screw it, or eat it, then piss on it.

Dropkick


Jackrabbit Hog

Quote from: cosmodrum on June 26, 2014, 04:25:22 pm
Check out Haight-Ashbury. Of course, it's a shell of it's former self, but still cool. There's a great chocolatier on the Pier.

Can't believe I forgot to mention Haight-Ashbury, cosmo.  I spent time in that area, bought a tie-dye Rolling Stones t-shirt and took a picture of my wife in front of the townhouse where Jagger and Janis Joplin shacked up during the Summer of Love.  Yeah, it's touristy now, but it's history.
Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on June 29, 2018, 03:47:07 pm
I'm sure it's nothing that a $500 retainer can't fix.  Contact JackRabbit Hog for payment instructions.

ImHogginIt

Quote from: Boarcephus on June 26, 2014, 06:19:18 pm
Trust me, I don't know that's just what I was told.  We're toying around with a wine country trip but haven't decided yet.  If we like it as much as we think we will, we'll come back and rent a car and head up and down the coast and that's really what I'd like to do.  We'll have 5 nights and may do it anyway this trip.

Appreciate all you guys help.

My wife and I took a balloon ride over Napa 4 years ago with these guys and it was awesome. This is a pic of our ride. That's me back right in black hat
http://www.napavalleyballoons.com/



[attachment deleted by admin]

ImHogginIt

Quote from: Boarcephus on June 26, 2014, 06:19:18 pm
Trust me, I don't know that's just what I was told.  We're toying around with a wine country trip but haven't decided yet.  If we like it as much as we think we will, we'll come back and rent a car and head up and down the coast and that's really what I'd like to do.  We'll have 5 nights and may do it anyway this trip.

Appreciate all you guys help.

You have to drive down Hwy 1 to Monterey, Pebble Beach and Carmel. You have to !

LSUFan

Quote from: ImHogginIt on June 26, 2014, 07:07:53 pm
My wife and I took a balloon ride over Napa 4 years ago with these guys and it was awesome. This is a pic of our ride. That's me back right in black hat
http://www.napavalleyballoons.com/
Photo shop.

The only person that could take that pic is Superman himself, and I know for a fact he don't live in Cali :-p
I ain't saying you babysitting, but my kids are all over your couch.

Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on August 17, 2015, 02:46:52 pm
Sometimes, I think you're a wine-o who found a laptop in a dumpster.

McKdaddy

Quote from: Old Tusk on June 26, 2014, 03:33:46 pm


San Francisco is one of the World's greatest cities.


Agreed. Also serves as a great break from the hot summers here.

I can't help you out w/ food options, Boar.  It's been many years since I've been to SF, just for SF visiting, as our more recent trips have been to hop in a rental and head to Pebble for golf, lodging, food, etc in the Carmel area.

+1 for your going to visit that great city!
Don't buy upgrades, ride up grades.

"You are everything that is wrong with this place . . . Ban me"

"CPI, ex-food and energy, is only good for an anorexic pedestrian"--Art Cashin

The Marmot

Download Uber on your phone. Use it to get around town. You're welcome.
I was booooorn to love you... I was booooorn to lick your face... I was booooorn to rub you... but you were born to rub me first - Ty Webb

Quote from: WilsonHog on October 28, 2014, 06:59:50 pm
The fact that you can type the words doesn't stop the thought behind those words from being horseshit.

GO HOGS!!!!!!!

Old Tusk

Boar since you haven't been to SF and only have four days there, I would suggest that you spend your time in SF. There is four days of fun in SF.
The Democrats are the party that says government can make you richer, smarter, taller and get the crabgrass out of our lawn. Republicans are the party that says government doesn't work, and then they get elected and prove it....P.J. O'Rourke

Boarcephus

Quote from: Old Tusk on June 27, 2014, 10:46:40 am
Boar since you haven't been to SF and only have four days there, I would suggest that you spend your time in SF. There is four days of fun in SF.

I think other than the trip to Yosemite, that's exactly what we'll do.  I want to eat the chowder and I want to find a little place that sells those bigass Dungeness Crabs and get it all over me.  We'll just tool around SF and enjoy ourselves.
I need to be more like my dog...if you can't fight it, screw it, or eat it, then piss on it.

 

PennHOG

I lived in an apartment in San Fran back in the mid 90's for almost a year. 

Some of my favorite things to do:

* Drive north on 1 then watch the fog roll in at Point Reyes Lighthouse.
* Rent a bike for a day and ride around Golden Gate Park and the surrounding areas.
* Take the BART up to Barkley and walk around the campus there.
* Walk aross the Golden Gate Bridge (don't just drive across it)
* Drive the 42 mile scenic drive
* Twin Peeks

Favorite Places to Eat:
* Tommy's joint.  Beer. Meat. Awesomeness! (http://www.tommysjoynt.com/)
* The Stinking Rose (http://thestinkingrose.com/about-sf.htm).  Keep away the vampires.
* Anywhere in Little Itally or China Town.  Just walk up and down these neighborhoods and just pick.  There's tons of great places.
When I die, I want to go peacefully in my sleep just like my grandfather, and not like the screaming passengers in his car!

The Marmot

I was booooorn to love you... I was booooorn to lick your face... I was booooorn to rub you... but you were born to rub me first - Ty Webb

Quote from: WilsonHog on October 28, 2014, 06:59:50 pm
The fact that you can type the words doesn't stop the thought behind those words from being horseshit.

GO HOGS!!!!!!!

bigstyx

Back to your original question Boar, I second Scoma's on Fisherman's Wharf. We lived in Reno for about 4 years and would get over to the Bay Area quite often. Scoma's was our favorite on the Wharf hands down.

ricepig

Well, I was going to recommend Aqua, but I did a search and it seems it has closed, although the chef has moved to another place. It had the best Chilean sea bass I'd ever eaten, I even had it at the restaurant they had inside the Bellagio.

Upon further looking, Michael Nina was the chef and he still has his restaurant in San Francisco, as well as other cities. It was great food, but expensive and kind of uppity, haha.

Old Tusk

Just a reminder not to miss the Tonga Room at the Fairmont Hotel.
The Democrats are the party that says government can make you richer, smarter, taller and get the crabgrass out of our lawn. Republicans are the party that says government doesn't work, and then they get elected and prove it....P.J. O'Rourke

Boarcephus

Quote from: bigstyx on June 27, 2014, 12:28:52 pm
Back to your original question Boar, I second Scoma's on Fisherman's Wharf. We lived in Reno for about 4 years and would get over to the Bay Area quite often. Scoma's was our favorite on the Wharf hands down.

Scoma's is the type of food I'm talking about!  Pulled up the menu and we're going there. 
I need to be more like my dog...if you can't fight it, screw it, or eat it, then piss on it.

Jackrabbit Hog

The wife and I had an outstanding seafood meal at this place the first time we were in San Fran.  Not Fisherman's Wharf; more in the Union Square area.

http://www.farallonrestaurant.com/
Quote from: JIMMY BOARFFETT on June 29, 2018, 03:47:07 pm
I'm sure it's nothing that a $500 retainer can't fix.  Contact JackRabbit Hog for payment instructions.

ImHogginIt

When we have stayed down near the wharf area we always have breakfast here. Never did lunch or dinner but I bet they are great too. About 4 blocks from the wharf

http://patscafesf.com/

They are highly recommended on tripadvisor too

http://www.tripadvisor.com/Restaurant_Review-g60713-d1056013-Reviews-Pat_s_Cafe-San_Francisco_California.html

hog.goblin

Loved it, but I wore shorts and t-shirts in that 50-60 degree weather.  'Twas awesome in July

Inhogswetrust

Quote from: Dropkick on June 26, 2014, 05:52:24 pm
We ate at Scoma's at fishermans wharf and it was excellent. Beautiful ballpark the giants play in if you are interested in that. I preferred Napa over Sonoma if you slide up to wine country.

I prefer Sonoma. Not nearly as pretentious and smug as Napa and wine just as good with better prices for the most part. The best for the money though in my opinion north of SF is in the mountain region between Sonoma and Napa.
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

Inhogswetrust

Quote from: ImHogginIt on June 26, 2014, 07:10:10 pm
You have to drive down Hwy 1 to Monterey, Pebble Beach and Carmel. You have to !

The aquarium at Cannery Row is really good fun especially for kids.
If I'm going to cheer players and coaches in victory, I damn sure ought to be man enough to stand with them in defeat.

"Why some people are so drawn to the irrational is something that has always puzzled me" - James Randi

DeltaBoy

If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

Boarcephus

Quote from: DeltaBoy on July 17, 2014, 09:02:26 am
Have a great time Boar.

Can't wait!  Saw on the news yesterday where the median price for a home in San Francisco has now topped $1 million.  Been checking out the restaurants you guys have mentioned and plan on hitting several of them.  Also looks like I'll need to take a pocket full of $$$ to eat at them but I'm doing it.  The Stinking Rose has my name written all over it!
I need to be more like my dog...if you can't fight it, screw it, or eat it, then piss on it.

Boarcephus

Made it back yesterday and had a blast!  That is one neat city.  Boog41, you were dead right, that is one long trip to Yosemite but we made it and glad we did. The pictures of El Capitain do not do it justice.  Didn't make it to the wine country but did walk across the GGB, toured the Japanese Teagarden, Alcatraz and went all over town on the  trolley and bus system.  We stayed at the Argonaut and all we did was walk out the front door, hang a right and walk 3 blocks and we were at FW.  Ate our fill of dungenous crab and clam chowder.

Loved the climate and the people.  Without a doubt one of the friendliest cities I've ever been to from the bus drivers to the average John Doe on the bus.  Lots of homeless but for the most part they left you alone.  Will go back and next time will rent a car and head up Hwy 1.

Thanks for everyones help.
I need to be more like my dog...if you can't fight it, screw it, or eat it, then piss on it.

Junkyard Hog

Quote from: Boarcephus on October 29, 2014, 02:41:51 pm
Made it back yesterday and had a blast!  That is one neat city.  Boog41, you were dead right, that is one long trip to Yosemite but we made it and glad we did. The pictures of El Capitain do not do it justice.  Didn't make it to the wine country but did walk across the GGB, toured the Japanese Teagarden, Alcatraz and went all over town on the  trolley and bus system.  We stayed at the Argonaut and all we did was walk out the front door, hang a right and walk 3 blocks and we were at FW.  Ate our fill of dungenous crab and clam chowder.

Loved the climate and the people.  Without a doubt one of the friendliest cities I've ever been to from the bus drivers to the average John Doe on the bus.  Lots of homeless but for the most part they left you alone.  Will go back and next time will rent a car and head up Hwy 1.

Thanks for everyones help.

Boar, we are heading to San Fran/wine country next March.  We will probably spend 2 days in San Fran and 2 days in Napa.  If you only had 2 days in San Fran, which things would you do?

Boarcephus

Quote from: Junkyard Hog on October 29, 2014, 03:02:41 pm
Boar, we are heading to San Fran/wine country next March.  We will probably spend 2 days in San Fran and 2 days in Napa.  If you only had 2 days in San Fran, which things would you do?

If I only had two days I'd probably do Alcatraz and Fisherman's Wharf in the morning and you can see the japanese Tea Garden that afternoon if you like that sort of stuff.  I will not do the 14 hour tour of Yosemite again but would do the Muir Woods/wine country tour.  As far as food, we enjoyed FW for crab and we found a little place we'd eat outside and eat fish tacos and steamed mussels and drink beer all for $20 during a 3-6:30 happy hour.
I need to be more like my dog...if you can't fight it, screw it, or eat it, then piss on it.

Boog41

Glad you had a good time Boar. Also glad they had the fires put out around Yosemite by the time you got there. It is one beautiful place.

I made an unexpected one day trip to San Fran myself back in August. Stayed at the St. Regis and was able to walk from there to ATT park to take in a Giants game. Can't wait to go back.

Junkyard, not sure if you've done the wine country thing before or not?? I've been several times if you have any questions, or suggestions.

Boarcephus

Quote from: Boog41 on October 29, 2014, 03:38:17 pm
Glad you had a good time Boar. Also glad they had the fires put out around Yosemite by the time you got there. It is one beautiful place.

Appreciate it.  Had some major damage from the fire and we saw a lot of it.  We saw several climbers in the process of climbing El Capitain.  Not enough Jack Daniels in Tennessee to make me want to climb that sucker.  They told us that the climbers would go as far as they could go, strap themselves down and spend the night on the side of it and resume the next day. 

Yosemite is one place we'll go back to and spend a couple days exploring it.
I need to be more like my dog...if you can't fight it, screw it, or eat it, then piss on it.

Boog41

Quote from: Boarcephus on October 29, 2014, 03:48:58 pm
Appreciate it.  Had some major damage from the fire and we saw a lot of it.  We saw several climbers in the process of climbing El Capitain.  Not enough Jack Daniels in Tennessee to make me want to climb that sucker.  They told us that the climbers would go as far as they could go, strap themselves down and spend the night on the side of it and resume the next day. 

Yosemite is one place we'll go back to and spend a couple days exploring it.

Just the thought of climbing that thing makes my man parts tingle. No way would I do it.

For those of you that don't know how high El Cap is, imagine the Arch in St. Louis or The Hoover Dam being five times taller than they are.

Boar, you need to put Yellowstone on your list also.

Junkyard Hog

Quote from: Boarcephus on October 29, 2014, 03:15:44 pm
If I only had two days I'd probably do Alcatraz and Fisherman's Wharf in the morning and you can see the japanese Tea Garden that afternoon if you like that sort of stuff.  I will not do the 14 hour tour of Yosemite again but would do the Muir Woods/wine country tour.  As far as food, we enjoyed FW for crab and we found a little place we'd eat outside and eat fish tacos and steamed mussels and drink beer all for $20 during a 3-6:30 happy hour.

Great.  Thanks.

Junkyard Hog

Quote from: Boog41 on October 29, 2014, 03:38:17 pm

Junkyard, not sure if you've done the wine country thing before or not?? I've been several times if you have any questions, or suggestions.

Thanks.  I think we have that part of the trip already planned out.  The San Fran part of the trip is what we haven't decided on yet.

Boarcephus

Quote from: Boog41 on October 29, 2014, 04:06:23 pm

Boar, you need to put Yellowstone on your list also.

After this trip to Yosemite we've done exactly that.  We had such a good time in the park we've just about decided we'd rather explore the parks in the US and keep our money is the good old USA rather than go overseas and blow our money in those countries.
I need to be more like my dog...if you can't fight it, screw it, or eat it, then piss on it.

DeltaBoy

My wife loves going to National Parks.   We hit Hot Springs every few years cause it about the least crowded on in the Region.
If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

Boog41

Quote from: DeltaBoy on November 03, 2014, 09:35:28 am
My wife loves going to National Parks.   We hit Hot Springs every few years cause it about the least crowded on in the Region.

I know this is taking this thread off topic, but since we are on Nat'l Parks......One of the neatest vacations I ever took was flying into Las Vegas and renting a car. Drove up into Utah and spent a week doing Bryce Canyon, Zion Nat'l Park and the north rim of The Grand Canyon. Seems like Bryce was the furthest away and was only a three hour drive. Zion was beautiful like Yosemite, just different.

flynhog

Napa is over rated. Eat at Mustards if you get to Napa.  Muir woods is good but get there when it opens and stay an hour.  Tadich Grill (fantastic sautéed scallops) is San Francisco downtown near the warf and is just down the hill from China town.

Wins are the only things that matter when the game ends.  The mistakes that happen in the game are corrected by good coaching during the week. A season of near losses means you won every game.

Boarcephus

Quote from: Boog41 on November 03, 2014, 09:44:25 am
I know this is taking this thread off topic, but since we are on Nat'l Parks......One of the neatest vacations I ever took was flying into Las Vegas and renting a car. Drove up into Utah and spent a week doing Bryce Canyon, Zion Nat'l Park and the north rim of The Grand Canyon. Seems like Bryce was the furthest away and was only a three hour drive. Zion was beautiful like Yosemite, just different.

You're not taking this off topic, just adding some good stuff to it!   What we may very well do the middle part of next year is fly to Reno then head to Lake Tahoe, spend 2-3 days there then head to see the giant sequoyahs  at Sequoyah National park and spend 2-3 days there.  Knock out a couple off the bucket list in a weeks time. 
I need to be more like my dog...if you can't fight it, screw it, or eat it, then piss on it.