A Question about a “Divided” or “Fractured” Fan Base

[hobhog]

You I'll never have 100% approve of any hire, but you don't want people booing and yelling at your new coach when gets off plane like Chizik was at AU. I'm worried that there would be some real push back like that if Gus were hired.

[Cinco de Hogo]

This is a serious question:  Who are you referring to?

It seems like we've missed out on some players from Central Arkansas (Crockett), River Valley (Norwood), and even NWA (Byers, Powell).  Who did we not offer or disrespect from eastern Arkansas?

My statement wasn't about a certain player it's about the eastern side of the state as a whole.  Think Little Rock expanded.  Neither is it about NWA.  The coaching staff at Arkansas itself has to decide how much influence it is going to have upon those programs going forward.  If the players come the interest in all things Razorback will remain solid. 

[Atlhogfan1]

My statement wasn't about a certain player it's about the eastern side of the state as a whole.  Think Little Rock expanded.  Neither is it about NWA.  The coaching staff at Arkansas itself has to decide how much influence it is going to have upon those programs going forward.  If the players come the interest in all things Razorback will remain solid.

What?

[hassettsportsman]

At my sporting club during hunting season....there is only one rule during meal time.  Electronic devices are turned off.  This encourages actual face to face conversations....provides for lively debate.  Thus, for a few precious minutes old-school is the school...again...just like going to a Hog game in person....minus the 10 empty seats near me. 

[Hawginj]

Your last sentence has nothing to do with the question asked. What difference does it make if a fan base is "divided?"

you asked quite a few questions in your op

[bob slydell]

I don't think it will make any difference if the next guy wins big.  I also think that Petrino united the fan base largely because it was an 'us vs. them' type of hire.  The fact that the media criticized the hire so ferociously helped to bring the fan base together.  I hoped that Bielema won big and I will wish for the same thing for the next guy and the next guy after that if necessary.  I think you can not be a big proponent of a hire but still root for the guy to be successful.

[TriHog]

Probably so.  I just want to win.  I don't care who the coach is.  I like Bret, but he hasn't won.  Not only that, we have not been competitive in several of our loses.  I wanted him to succeed just like every coach we have had, it just didn't happen.
[/quote
I think this is the biggest factor for all of us; CBB seems to be a great guy, for some

Probably so.  I just want to win.  I don't care who the coach is.  I like Bret, but he hasn't won.  Not only that, we have not been competitive in several of our loses.  I wanted him to succeed just like every coach we have had, it just didn't happen.

I think you've hit the nail on the head.  Most folks seem to like CBB, but for some reason the job just isn't working out.  I just want to have exciting games and to be something other than apathetic about football season.  Yes, I'll keep supporting no matter what, but come on, just give me something to believe in.

[mckinneyhog5]

I support the Hogs regardless of the coach. If BB stays will support the team which includes the coach, we get a new coach I'll support him. I'm a adult though so it's not that hard.

[bphi11ips]

Gus will be the closest thing we could do to get back into another Nutt situation.  Hope he wins more.

You want the university to have the football team play another 20 years in WMS and apologize constantly for it not being more often? 

You don't get it, but that's okay.  There are some who matter who do. 

[Cinco de Hogo]

What?

What?

[Atlhogfan1]

What?

Our staff is supposed to sign recruits from east Ark just to sign recruits from east Ark so the people will feel connected? 

You don't get it, but that's okay.  There are some who matter who do. 

I get it.  They want to be catered to and feel important.  Hogs have to come to them like it is the 1950s - 80s. 

[Cinco de Hogo]

Our staff is supposed to sign recruits from east Ark just to sign recruits from east Ark so the people will feel connected? 

I get it.  They want to be catered to and feel important.  Hogs have to come to them like it is the 1950s - 80s.

Simple answer as to my part of your quote, yes the Hogs have to/need to go to them.  You want spread your influence as far and wide as possible especially in your own state.  I swear some of ya'll would be fine with it if we never recruited a single player for this state.  Those of you that live out of state and run it down every chance you get.  I have different expectations and those expectations are that we first and foremost build up this state whenever and wherever possible. 

[Porked Tongue]

Fire Gus.

[bphi11ips]

Our staff is supposed to sign recruits from east Ark just to sign recruits from east Ark so the people will feel connected? 

I get it.  They want to be catered to and feel important.  Hogs have to come to them like it is the 1950s - 80s. 

When was the last time you were in Arkansas?  I was in Fayetteville in September and I swear saw billboards for three concerts - The Commodores, 38 Special and Clay Walker.  REO Speedwagon is coming up Friday.  It's still the 70's there.  Well, Clay was the 90's. 

Tuberville was right when he said every situation is different.  It really doesn't matter what you or I think.  What matters is the way things are.

[Porked Tongue]

My suspicion is that this argument is just a noble front for the real reason: "I don't like that guy."

It's more a product of not getting WHO THEY WANT and not getting it.  That is followed by unwarranted and selfish skepticism towards what might be a great hire.

But not liking someone for whatever reason they don't like them is very damn personable for some.

I've supported every single hiring in my lifetime for HC for UA football.  The only 2 hirings I didn't like were Sue G and Dykes.  Sue because she should have never had a job to apply for and Dykes cause he as a arrogant and overhyped jerk.

That being said, I'll take any coach we hire and accept it except for one.  Gus can take a flying farking leap off a cliff. 

[grayhawg]

It's more a product of not getting WHO THEY WANT and not getting it.  That is followed by unwarranted and selfish skepticism towards what might be a great hire.

But not liking someone for whatever reason they don't like them is very damn personable for some.

I've supported every single hiring in my lifetime for HC for UA football.  The only 2 hirings I didn't like were Sue G and Dykes.  Sue because she should have never had a job to apply for and Dykes cause he as a arrogant and overhyped jerk.

That being said, I'll take any coach we hire and accept it except for one. Gus can take a flying farking leap off a cliff. 

I'll bet you're safe if he job is his if he wants it, he will say no.

[Porked Tongue]

I'll bet you're safe if he job is his if he wants it, he will say no.

I'm inclined to agree though there are a lot of people thinking otherwise.  I just don't see it happening.

[factchecker]

When was the last time you were in Arkansas?  I was in Fayetteville in September and I swear saw billboards for three concerts - The Commodores, 38 Special and Clay Walker.  REO Speedwagon is coming up Friday.  It's still the 70's there.  Well, Clay was the 90's. 

Tuberville was right when he said every situation is different.  It really doesn't matter what you or I think.  What matters is the way things are.

There aren't any billboards in Fayetteville.

[3kgthog]

It won't really be any different will it? Some wanted Nutt while others wanted Tubs. Some wanted Petrino while others preferred anyone but.

Just win, baby. The rest takes cares of itself.

[Michael D Huff AIA]

Wonder what percentage of people want CBB to stay?

[Cinco de Hogo]

Wonder what percentage of people want CBB to stay?

A lot more than will admit it .

[bphi11ips]

There aren't any billboards in Fayetteville.

Uh huh.  And a one-legged duck don't swim in circles, son.

[factchecker]

Uh huh.  And a one-legged duck don't swim in circles, son.

There aren't.  If you saw a billboard then you must have been in Johnson or anywhere north of Fayetteville.

I'm guessing you saw the digital board off the interstate advertising concerts for the AMP.

[Porked Tongue]

Uh huh.  And a one-legged duck don't swim in circles, son.

You should probably yield here. 

Fayetteville didn't even allow Cracker Barrell to put their sign up so they built in Springdale.

Strict city on signs.  You will see some along the I-49 corridor on each side of Fayetteville.

That REO reference was for a concert at Downstream Casino and I saw it on the Johnson Exit billboard.

[bphi11ips]

There aren't.  If you saw a billboard then you must have been in Johnson or anywhere north of Fayetteville.

I'm guessing you saw the digital board off the interstate advertising concerts for the AMP.

I did.  And elsewhere on the way and in NWA in general.

[Dark Helmet Hog]

You should probably yield here. 

Fayetteville didn't even allow Cracker Barrell to put their sign up so they built in Springdale.

Strict city on signs.  You will see some along the I-49 corridor on each side of Fayetteville.

That REO reference was for a concert at Downstream Casino and I saw it on the Johnson Exit billboard.

And Springdale doesn't allow new ones. Billboards have been deemed unsightly. They will upon occasion allow an "existing" one to be moved for various zoning issues.

[jkstock04]

First of all, I think the fan base is going to be divided regardless of who we hire, because 100% of the fan base will never agree. Is what it is.

So, why does it matter? What difference does it make? We're not going to win as many games? Not going to enjoy game day as much? Not going to enjoy posting here as much?

My suspicion is that this argument is just a noble front for the real reason: "I don't like that guy."

Why does it matter? I would say the more division among the fan base the more general negativity towards the program. More negativity towards the program that's inevitably going to weigh on the players and coaches.

I still say winning cures all...but if the winning isn't there AND you have a majorly divided fan base? That just makes for more negativity. Less fan support is never good, especially on Saturdays. 

[Atlhogfan1]

Billboard derailed. A first?

[bphi11ips]

And Springdale doesn't allow new ones. Billboards have been deemed unsightly. They will upon occasion allow an "existing" one to be moved for various zoning issues.

Maybe you have a mess of UFOs in NWA hovering above the interstate advertising concerts for 70's bands.  Jefferson Starship?

[Hawg Life]

I was of that line of thinking for a little while. But now I don't think it will ever all be in the rear view until Malzahn is hired as head coach. At that point everybody will have had their way and nobody will ever be able to wonder "what if."

If Malzahn isn't hired then we will be rehashing the Nutt era for generations and Malzahn's name will be brought up in every coaching search we have until he is 20 years retired.

No, we need to start over, not go backwards. 2 weeks ago Gus was on the hotseat @ Auburn with several consecutive top 10 recruiting classes, and a Heisman dark horse QB transfer. Gus also benefited from Cam Newton who we wouldn't have paid to come here, and he wouldn't have come if we had. Truth is with all of that talent Gus hasn't developed a QB @ Auburn. He's averaged 8 wins the past 5 years with all of that talent. He wouldn't have the top 10 classes or the transfers here. Norvell doesn't have the baggage, is an offensive genius, just signed the best class in Memphis history, is currently in the top 25 @ Memphis which is extremely rare, wife is from Arkansas and not crazy like Kristi, played @ UCA, from Texas, and Arkansas is his dream destination job. I'm not sure we could create a better fit for the job. It'll be amazing what he'll be able to accomplish with the resources he'll have @ Arkansas. Best of all he has no baggage and no connection to the GOBN of the past.

[brenthog]

Fractured but whole.

Damn your black heart Barbara Streisand

[urkillnmesmalls]

No, we need to start over, not go backwards. 2 weeks ago Gus was on the hotseat @ Auburn with several consecutive top 10 recruiting classes, and a Heisman dark horse QB transfer. Gus also benefited from Cam Newton who we wouldn't have paid to come here, and he wouldn't have come if we had. Truth is with all of that talent Gus hasn't developed a QB @ Auburn. He's averaged 8 wins the past 5 years with all of that talent. He wouldn't have the top 10 classes or the transfers here. Norvell doesn't have the baggage, is an offensive genius, just signed the best class in Memphis history, is currently in the top 25 @ Memphis which is extremely rare, wife is from Arkansas and not crazy like Kristi, played @ UCA, from Texas, and Arkansas is his dream destination job. I'm not sure we could create a better fit for the job. It'll be amazing what he'll be able to accomplish with the resources he'll have @ Arkansas. Best of all he has no baggage and no connection to the GOBN of the past.

You make some good points, but there's still the underlying concern of whether or not he can sustain that level.  I'm not saying there's a better choice out there among candidates that I think will be interested in the job, but I would feel much better if he had just 2-3 more years of experience to see how he handles it when the chips don't fall just right. 

I am impressed with what he has done at Memphis, but he definitely came into a program that was in pretty good shape after Fuentes left.  With the facilites they have, and having to compete with recruits that aren't typically on everyone's wish list, that's not easy even when you are handed a nice hand to play.  I think he's taken a "rag tag" group of players and done very well. 

[Hawg Life]

You make some good points, but there's still the underlying concern of whether or not he can sustain that level.  I'm not saying there's a better choice out there among candidates that I think will be interested in the job, but I would feel much better if he had just 2-3 more years of experience to see how he handles it when the chips don't fall just right. 

I am impressed with what he has done at Memphis, but he definitely came into a program that was in pretty good shape after Fuentes left.  With the facilites they have, and having to compete with recruits that aren't typically on everyone's wish list, that's not easy even when you are handed a nice hand to play.  I think he's taken a "rag tag" group of players and done very well.

He's playing his QB now and 12 freshmen and sophomores that he recruited. Fuente's 2 classes @ Memphis were rated #88 and #90 compared to Norvell's who just signed the highest ranked class in Memphis history #50. The guys a winner and at only 36 the sky is the limit. We currently get killed in the second half due to getting out coached, and making no adjustments. Watch Memphis vs. Houston this year as an example of his adjustments. That's just one example.

[Hawg414]

I get it.  They want to be catered to and feel important.  Hogs have to come to them like it is the 1950s - 80s. 

no, they dont *have* to.  but when it has been the de facto arrangement for 50+ years... and you are who you are bc of those very people.... and then you tell em ya know what, we get SEC tv money now, go root for UALR... well, just lemme know what the actual attendance is this coming weekend.  not that bs "announced attendance" crap. 

[East Clintwood]

Any hire is going to have some small number of people that are unhappy with it.  Some coaches more than others.  Now, they may be mildly upset with it or they may downright hate it but there will be some.

Now. it they were to hire Nutt, Petrino, or Gus, you starrt off the new coaches rein with a huge number of people that are downright angry as hell about the hire.

It just seems to me that it would be better  to start off  a coaching hire without pissing so many people off right up front

[OneTuskOverTheLine™]

Your last sentence has nothing to do with the question asked. What difference does it make if a fan base is "divided?"

It doesn't... I believe that's a misnomer anyway. The fan base is only united once, and that is now. We can all agree this guy has got to go.

[NaturalStateReb]

First of all, I think the fan base is going to be divided regardless of who we hire, because 100% of the fan base will never agree. Is what it is.

So, why does it matter? What difference does it make? We're not going to win as many games? Not going to enjoy game day as much? Not going to enjoy posting here as much?

My suspicion is that this argument is just a noble front for the real reason: "I don't like that guy."

It doesn't.

The "united fan base" is a myth, like Bigfoot, or the Official Rules of Wrestling, or a Baptist that talks to you in a liquor store.

[The NewEra]

My $0.02....as others have already stated, you'll never unite everyone behind anyone.  The attempt to mend a fractured fan base should result in ultimately having a consensus among the majority.  Having read more than my fair share of comments on Hogville, there are some things that stick out to me as being key issues to many HV fans.  I don't think any of these are negotiable in healing the fracture in the base.

A surprising # of people think we are still fighting the civil war.  For them we need a coach with ties to the south.
A large # think that Arkansas is unique to every other state and that we need a coach with Arkansas ties.
Most seem to think a spread offense is required to win in this division and evens the talent discrepancies.
Many believe it's paramount the new coach be young and able to relate to young kids and motivate them.
We are an even more shallow minded society today than 30 years ago, so the coach's appearance is critical.  Must be a camera friendly face and well spoken.

If we get a coach who brings these skills and qualities I think the majority of fans will be united for the first three years.  In order to further unite the base he better have won at least nine games one year or we'll start all over with all the second guessing.  Everyone's got a voice these days with social media and 20% are sheep who follow the noise, 20% are always looking for something to be pissed about, 20% are touchy feely and follow their emotional ties to the coach and 40% go with the data.

[hawgon]

I realize that it is Arkansas so we have a lot to regret...Pearl Harbor and Bear Bryant, firing Holtz, not hiring Jimmy Johnson, Butch Davis, Gus Malzahn, and the whole Nolan fiasco.  That is a lot of "what could have beens" and room for regret.  But for once, I wish we would try to look forward instead of back.  To his credit, Jeff Long deserves a little credit for trying to do that with the Bert hire.  It was a bad hire for lots of other reasons, but he was trying to forge ahead instead of going back.

[hogsanity]

There is no fractured fan base. All 95% of the fans want is to win games. We, on Hogville, are a very very small part of the fans base yet we try to view the entire fan base through the eyes of people who take the time to get on a message board and post. Most days the  high of members on line at any one time is around 1700, maybe a few more on a big news days or during and right after a game, but for the most part it is under 2k.

Most fans just want to win. They thought BB was a good hire, and now they think he just has not worked out, so it is time to move on. Most do not know that Norvell's wife is from Ft Smith, or that Scott Frost was a hero at Nebraska as a player, or that Gus' parents are still alive and living in Ft Smith. All they know is they want the Hogs to win games, and right now that is not happening nearly often enough. They do not know how much Jeff Long makes, or that he allegedly said winning does not matter ( although that is not what he said at all ), or all the other stuff that is talked about here.

When BB is let go, and I think that happens sometime between next Sunday and Dec 3rd, people will have interest in the coaching search, then once a new coach is hired most Hog fans will either move on to basketball, or start the long wait for spring practice and then for fall camp to start. They won't sit around wondering how many passes the team will throw, or if Hammonds will become the feature back, etc. That is just not what most people do.

[PonderinHog]

The fan base was pretty darned united when Bobby Petrino was hired.
There were a few detractors but I don't recall very many.
Excitement by most everyone is what I remember.

Yeah, it was similar to when electricity came to Arkansas!

[DeltaBoy]

I am about the Wins! Bobby got us some and we not had any since to amount to much.

Long made bad hires, Coach done a poor job.  Clean them out.
As the end of the day I wear my hog hat and shirts and holler Woo Pig Sooie.

[PonderinHog]

Maybe you have a mess of UFOs in NWA hovering above the interstate advertising concerts for 70's bands.  Jefferson Starship?

Uh, you got a problem with '70's music, bub?   

[10thPlanet]

90% will be united with winning. Winning brings us together. 8% will have personal issues of sorts(still want Nutt, CBP, family member didn't get recruited, closet ASU fans etc). 2% can never be happy, love to try and find company.
This is a scientific study...

[bphi11ips]

There is no fractured fan base. All 95% of the fans want is to win games. We, on Hogville, are a very very small part of the fans base yet we try to view the entire fan base through the eyes of people who take the time to get on a message board and post. Most days the  high of members on line at any one time is around 1700, maybe a few more on a big news days or during and right after a game, but for the most part it is under 2k.

Most fans just want to win. They thought BB was a good hire, and now they think he just has not worked out, so it is time to move on. Most do not know that Norvell's wife is from Ft Smith, or that Scott Frost was a hero at Nebraska as a player, or that Gus' parents are still alive and living in Ft Smith. All they know is they want the Hogs to win games, and right now that is not happening nearly often enough. They do not know how much Jeff Long makes, or that he allegedly said winning does not matter ( although that is not what he said at all ), or all the other stuff that is talked about here.

When BB is let go, and I think that happens sometime between next Sunday and Dec 3rd, people will have interest in the coaching search, then once a new coach is hired most Hog fans will either move on to basketball, or start the long wait for spring practice and then for fall camp to start. They won't sit around wondering how many passes the team will throw, or if Hammonds will become the feature back, etc. That is just not what most people do.

Good post. 

[PonderinHog]

90% will be united with winning. Winning brings us together. 8% will have personal issues of sorts(still want Nutt, CBP, family member didn't get recruited, closet ASU fans etc). 2% can never be happy, love to try and find company.
This is a scientific study...

Now we're all blind.

Divided?  Fractured? Sounds too extreme. Maybe we all just need to re-learn how to agree to disagree.  I'm gonna work on that in the offseason.

[RexMentor]

There is no fractured fan base. All 95% of the fans want is to win games. We, on Hogville, are a very very small part of the fans base yet we try to view the entire fan base through the eyes of people who take the time to get on a message board and post. Most days the  high of members on line at any one time is around 1700, maybe a few more on a big news days or during and right after a game, but for the most part it is under 2k.

Most fans just want to win. They thought BB was a good hire, and now they think he just has not worked out, so it is time to move on. Most do not know that Norvell's wife is from Ft Smith, or that Scott Frost was a hero at Nebraska as a player, or that Gus' parents are still alive and living in Ft Smith. All they know is they want the Hogs to win games, and right now that is not happening nearly often enough. They do not know how much Jeff Long makes, or that he allegedly said winning does not matter ( although that is not what he said at all ), or all the other stuff that is talked about here.

When BB is let go, and I think that happens sometime between next Sunday and Dec 3rd, people will have interest in the coaching search, then once a new coach is hired most Hog fans will either move on to basketball, or start the long wait for spring practice and then for fall camp to start. They won't sit around wondering how many passes the team will throw, or if Hammonds will become the feature back, etc. That is just not what most people do.

WELL SAID +1,000

[OneTuskOverTheLine™]

Now we're all blind.

Divided?  Fractured? Sounds too extreme. Maybe we all just need to re-learn how to agree to disagree.  I'm gonna work on that in the offseason.

Well you certainly have achieved total disagreeability... I know for a fact that Pondwater Akbar sharpens his khanjar listening to your posts on that little Stephen Hawking type of talkulator that he stole out of OTR's trailer that OTR took from Rev who ganked it out of Harry Rex's hospital room when Big Daddy Doug pulled the plug...

[bphi11ips]

Well you certainly have achieved total disagreeability... I know for a fact that Pondwater Akbar sharpens his khanjar listening to your posts on that little Stephen Hawking type of talkulator that he stole out of OTR's trailer that OTR took from Rev who ganked it out of Harry Rex's hospital room when Big Daddy Doug pulled the plug...

Is that why Darrell Royal's flaming floating head fulminates?

[Ex-Trumpet]

Now we're all blind.

Divided?  Fractured? Sounds too extreme. Maybe we all just need to re-learn how to agree to disagree.  I'm gonna work on that in the offseason.

No you won't.