VA Benifits

[Old Tusk]

I figure I'll get slammed, but this is bothering me. A kid joins the Guard. spends four years and probably never leaves the state except for basic. So we pay for his education and owe him lifetime medical care. Really?
Also , retirees like me have Tricare , why are some going to VA a clogging up the system?

[Tejas_Pete]

Bothers me too. The abuse of the VA system is rampant. Pieces of darn do one tour in Iraq on a FOB, get fat, claim PTSD and draw disability benefits the rest of their lives. Unfortunately it is a byproduct of the shallow patriotism promoted during the Bush years where you can't say anything that could be construed as not supporting the troops so everyone just lets it happen.

[Tejas_Pete]

http://www.denverpost.com/voices/ci_26002740/when-ptsd-benefits-are-abused

[Boarcephus]

If you guys only knew how close you are to the actual truth it'd really piss you off even more. 

[Old Tusk]

I have a friend with a 10% disability for sleep apnea.

[Tejas_Pete]

I work with a retired 1SG who is 60% disabled yet spends more time in the gym and playing intramural sports than anyone I know. Standard sleep apnea, mental health, back pain bull everyone puts in for.

Also know a female NCO who got medically retired and now spends all her time playing roller derby.

Gave an NCO a 4 - 4 for being a height weight and APFT failure....he promptly dropped his MEDBOARD packet claimed PTSD and a bunch of other darn got medically retired.

It doesn't get press because everyone is afraid to say something and be labelled as not supporting the military but it's the biggest hustle out there right now.

[YankHog]

I have a friend with a 10% disability for sleep apnea.

he must've got screwed because some folks, if it's deemed they need a machine get 50%, which is insane, I believe that's one of the changes to the system they are trying to push through now..i've also seen soldiers claim PTSD who have never been inside a combat zone......things that make you scratch your head....

[majestic]

I know you all know this, but there are some legit PTSD sufferers. My brother is one, and they are constantly trying to figure out how to reduce/eliminate his benefits. 

[Old Tusk]

I know you all know this, but there are some legit PTSD sufferers. My brother is one, and they are constantly trying to figure out how to reduce/eliminate his benefits. 

The problem with bogus claims is that they take away from those that need help. Fifty percent of those who served in Iraq and Afghanistan are claiming disability. In Nan it was less than 20.

[Tejas_Pete]

I know you all know this, but there are some legit PTSD sufferers. My brother is one, and they are constantly trying to figure out how to reduce/eliminate his benefits.

That's why I'm so frustrated with the abuse of the system, it creates a stigma that makes it even harder to get those that need legit help to seek treatment.

[Ragnar Hogbrok]

To be honest, I think I may have some degree of PTSD, and have since 26 SEP 2006 (you can read the story a few threads down).  I still refuse to go to behavioral medicine because I don't think that I'm as bad as a lot of those vets out there. 

Fortunately, I have the good Lord on my side keeping me whole.  He has brought me out of my dark place and kept me in the light since I cast all of my cares on Him.

On one hand, I don't want anything from the Army.  On the other hand, it's because of Army that my wife and kids (not to mention myself) have had to struggle with my emotional outbursts and inexplicable depression in the past.  So, why shouldn't the Army compensate that to a degree?

It's a decision I'll have to make within the next eight years before I retire.

[Old Tusk]

I guess I'll just have to accept that the VA has become just another welfare program.

[Ragnar Hogbrok]

I guess I'll just have to accept that the VA has become just another welfare program.

If that was directed towards my post, please let me clarify.  By "compensate," I meant with either VA or private medical care, if needed.  I didn't necessarily mean, "the VA should cut me a fat check."  I, unlike some, won't need disability payments to succeed in life.

[Old Tusk]

It was not directed at you. I believe that anyone who has been in actual combat has PTSD. Each has varying ability to manage it. There is no question that the military should be treating you. The VA is swamped treating non service connected conditions.

[H&D]

To be honest, I think I may have some degree of PTSD, and have since 26 SEP 2006 (you can read the story a few threads down).  I still refuse to go to behavioral medicine because I don't think that I'm as bad as a lot of those vets out there. 

Fortunately, I have the good Lord on my side keeping me whole.  He has brought me out of my dark place and kept me in the light since I cast all of my cares on Him.

On one hand, I don't want anything from the Army.  On the other hand, it's because of Army that my wife and kids (not to mention myself) have had to struggle with my emotional outbursts and inexplicable depression in the past.  So, why shouldn't the Army compensate that to a degree?

It's a decision I'll have to make within the next eight years before I retire.

I understand what you mean.  On the physical side I have a torn meniscus that happened during mandatory pt. On the mental side, I'm sure it's some level of PTSD.  Before Iraq I was outgoing, no problem in crowds of people, clubs, loud noises.  Now it's my personal hell to in those situations. The other day we took our daughter to Chuckie Cheese and before it was over I was sitting in a corner booth with my back against the wall trying like everything to keep a fake smile on my face while I constantly scanned the crowd.

I didn't put in for any benefits, mostly because I had a job lined up at the end of my enlistment and they were threatening to medically board me for my knee if I filed for partial disability. The medical board would have taken months and delayed my exit. I'm starting to rethink it.  But just on the knee issue, the mental stuff is easily managed for me and I guess I don't want the stigma (silly I know).   

[kodiakisland]

I guess I'll just have to accept that the VA has become just another welfare program.

Just become?  When was it not?

I have never seen anything in writing or been told at any time in my military career that I would have health care for life.  I came in in '88 and have never seen or heard anything that would lead me to believe that.  Oh sure, I've heard people claim that was promised to them, but seems they never saw anything in writing either.  Any of you ever see or hear anything official that promised care after service?

[Old Tusk]

All I was told was the VA would treat any service connected medical issues. Never did anyone say you get total medical care for life.

[Pork Twain]

I would be hesitant to take anyone's word for what they are getting for sleep apnea, because it sounds like some are passing off BS...  I have sleep apnea and utilize a CPAP machine (I only bring this up because they attempted to use it as grounds to boot me out at 17.6), I also have migraines, high BP, and had an L5/S1 discectomy in 2010, L5/S1 fusion in 2012 and on 30 July an L4/L5, L5/S1 fusion with bolts put in my hips for stability.  I will cross my 20 year mark on convo leave recovering.  I went through the MEB process with my back and they threw the sleep apnea in there for a good measure.  I was informed that it would be about 10% for the sleep apnea and 5-10 for the migraines.  The back is its own story that will bump me up.  After seeing others who are collecting disability in my almost 20 years of service, ask me if I feel one bit guilty for collecting once I retire at 24.

[Old Tusk]

So you decided to become a welfare queen also?

[YankHog]

I would be hesitant to take anyone's word for what they are getting for sleep apnea, because it sounds like some are passing off BS...  I have sleep apnea and utilize a CPAP machine, I also have migraines, high BP, and had an L5/S1 discectomy in 2010, L5/S1 fusion in 2012 and on 30 July an L4/L5, L5/S1 fusion with bolts put in my hips for stability.  I will cross my 20 year mark on convo leave recovering.  I went through the MEB process with my back and they threw the sleep apnea in there for a good measure.  I was informed that it would be about 10% for the sleep apnea and 5-10 for the migraines.  The back is its own story that will bump me up.  After seeing others who are collecting disability in my almost 20 years of service, ask me if I feel one bit guilty for collecting once I retire at 24.

This is true PT, although a good forum to visit regarding medical ratings is the PEB Forum, and yes i'm with you having given 23+ years, 2 tours in Afghanistan, 1 in Iraq, 1+ in Kuwait, 1 in GTMO I won't feel bad about listing everything and anything on my VA screening here in 2-3 months when I drop my retirement packet...

[Pork Twain]

So you decided to become a welfare queen also?

Yup that is exactly right.  After giving over 20 years to serve my country, I will take what I can at the end (exactly like everyone else), which is exactly like getting on welfare.

[Old Tusk]

The military evolves over time to reflect the principles of the society. A welfare society will breed a welfare military. Now we have a whiny mititary who thinks they are entitled to sponge off the people they claim to have served. Sad

[Pork Twain]

The military evolves over time to reflect the principles of the society. A welfare society will breed a welfare military. Now we have a whiny mititary who thinks they are entitled to sponge off the people they claim to have served. Sad

Sorry you took all of that from what I said, but at the end of the day, I could care less what some random poster on Hogville thinks.

Maybe you can go start a thread about the abuses of the military disability program on the politics forum, where it belongs.

[YankHog]

Sorry you took all of that from what I said, but at the end of the day, I care much more about taking care less what some random poster on Hogville thinks.

Maybe you can go start a thread about the abuses of the military disability program on the politics forum, where it belongs.

I think Tusk was pointing more to those service members mentioned above who attempt to milk the system for everything they can who have never seen an actual deployment or felt the shake of a mortar or rocket attack or have seen things that can never be unseen,  those folks that are claiming PTSD from a mean drill sgt or field problem,  a service member who is getting out because of actual trauma caused by combat, such as what the good chief has seen deserves every penny he can get out of the system, people handle the stresses of war in much different ways,  they either run away from it and refuse to go out because of the stress, head out in total fear, or accept the fact that something may happen and run to the sound of gunfire, the more you hear it, the more immune you become, but I bet you all three are effected in one way or another, whether they tell you so or they deny it.....who's to say all three of those categories don't deserve something, or something more than a 10 pt veteran's preference for a job.

[Pork Twain]

Then he probably shouldn't have gone after me with his comments.  I have family members that live off of the government and their actions disgust me so I am a little touchy there.

I detest people that make up issues as much as anyone, but I do not begrudge anyone that has real issues resulting from their military service.  The government has shown a bad habit of not taking care of those who serve.

[Pork Twain]

This is true PT, although a good forum to visit regarding medical ratings is the PEB Forum, and yes i'm with you having given 23+ years, 2 tours in Afghanistan, 1 in Iraq, 1+ in Kuwait, 1 in GTMO I won't feel bad about listing everything and anything on my VA screening here in 2-3 months when I drop my retirement packet...

I have only been out of work for two weeks since my surgery and being out of work is driving me crazy.  Four more weeks till I start PT and then hopefully back to work shortly after.  I do not suffer from anything close to PTSD because my AFSC has not sent me anywhere worth mentioning, but I have deployed 6 times and had one remote.  I truly feel for those dealing with PTSD, as my dad did after Nam, because those hidden scars are so hard to get people to see.

Here is my new back, from a service related injury...

[attachment deleted by admin]

[YankHog]

Here is my new back, from a service related injury...

yowzers, i'm guessing sit-ups are out of the question, I feel for you...

[Pork Twain]

yowzers, i'm guessing sit-ups are out of the question, I feel for you...

I am healing fine but sit-ups are something I will never do again.

[Old Tusk]

PT I simply asked you a question which you answered in the affirmative. I spent 33 yrs. In the military which should gualify me to discuss military culture.

[Pork Twain]

PT I simply asked you a question which you answered in the affirmative. I spent 33 yrs. In the military which should gualify me to discuss military culture.

Sure you did but you were and are being a prick about another person's situation and throwing out a blanket statement.  For most, collecting the military disability is nothing close to welfare.

Shirty tactic on your part...

33 years AD, G or R?

[Old Tusk]

But you said it was.

[Pork Twain]

Obvious sarcasm, not obvious enough?

[Old Tusk]

Yup that is exactly right.  After giving over 20 years to serve my country, I will take what I can at the end (exactly like everyone else), which is exactly like getting on welfare.

[Pork Twain]

Obvious sarcasm, not obvious enough?

Like I said

[Pork Twain]

So OT, do you collect ANY disability?

[Old Tusk]

No. I declined my retirement physical. I always thought it was dishonest to be on flight status one day and claim to be disabled the next.

[Ragnar Hogbrok]

No. I declined my retirement physical. I always thought it was dishonest to be on flight status one day and claim to be disabled the next.

If I may ask, what year did you retire?  You cannot decline a retirement (or ETS) physical today.

[Boarcephus]

For most, collecting the military disability is nothing close to welfare.

Disagree with the "most"part of it.  I'm sure some need it but you can't believe the number of young, healty vets that we see every day trying to get disability because the either can't find a job or don't want one.  I agree with the poster who said the VA is is just another welfare program.

Saw a report not long ago that showed the average number of disabilities claimed per vet by the WWII vets was 2-3, that jumped to between 5-7 for the Korea/Viet Nam vets but that number is now in the 15-16 range for the newer vets. 

[Old Tusk]

If I may ask, what year did you retire?  You cannot decline a retirement (or ETS) physical today.

Retired in 2003.

[Pork Twain]

Disagree with the "most"part of it.  I'm sure some need it but you can't believe the number of young, healty vets that we see every day trying to get disability because the either can't find a job or don't want one.  I agree with the poster who said the VA is is just another welfare program.

Saw a report not long ago that showed the average number of disabilities claimed per vet by the WWII vets was 2-3, that jumped to between 5-7 for the Korea/Viet Nam vets but that number is now in the 15-16 range for the newer vets. 

Could be smarter vets and a change in the program in many cases.  As I said, my step-dad died shortly after he finally received his first disability check from PTSD and couple of other issues from Nam.  That fight was long and hard and it should not have been.  Have you seen any peer-reviewed studies on this subject?  PTSD was not even a possible diagnosis for anyone until the early 80's.  Our streets are filled with vets that should have been diagnosed with that.

Here is how disability was explained to me.  You volunteered to serve in a certain physical condition.  When you separate, you should be in a similar condition and should be compensated for any "disability" that is service-related.  Welfare on the other hand is given to those who cannot or will not work.  Big difference.  Also only a small number of the 1% of Americans that volunteer to serve will ever collect anything substantial from disability and that is even if you count NG.  Again, huge difference from welfare.

I will feel guilty about collecting my check as soon as they stop dicking with our retirement and tricare and the politicians take less retirement.  Not taking what you are entitled to at the end is foolish.  At the end of the day, the only person looking out for Vets are Vets.

[Old Tusk]

Nice rationalization.

[Boarcephus]

Here is how disability was explained to me.  You volunteered to serve in a certain physical condition.  When you separate, you should be in a similar condition and should be compensated for any "disability" that is service-related.  Welfare on the other hand is given to those who cannot or will not work.  Big difference.  Also only a small number of the 1% of Americans that volunteer to serve will ever collect anything substantial from disability and that is even if you count NG.  Again, huge difference from welfare.

Sounds like we're pretty much in agreement on the Nam vets.  Those folks got hosed, and IMO, many are still are getting hosed.  Most were just were dealt a ** hand they had to play but I've had guys try to claim PTSD for Nam who never went!  One guy I met who tried to claim it never left the state of Texas but he was due it because he was training like he was going.  Not buying that.

Guess we'll just have to disagree with this not being a form of welfare.  I've seen way too many 22-28 year old guys claiming DJD in their feet, ankles, knees, hips, elbows, wrists, hands, shoulders, etc, just hoping some quack of a doctor will agree with them so they can collect a check.  I've had guys actually tell me that extra 20% they get is the difference between just getting by and being "comfortable", their quote.  If you can get up to the 100% level it's worth, give or take, $3500-4000 a month and that's not chump change.  When a guy is healthy as a horse but just doesn't want to work or can't find a job he wants I can't help but see it as another from of welfare.

As I said, we're just going to have to disagree on this.

[Pork Twain]

People will abuse any and every system created but I do not believe it is anywhere close to the abuse of our welfare system.  That is one program that is in serious need of reform.  The people you are talking about piss me off as well, but I guess I have just been lucky enough in my career to not have come in contact with them.

[Pork Twain]

Can't fix everyone.

[Boarcephus]

People will abuse any and every system created but I do not believe it is anywhere close to the abuse of our welfare system.  That is one program that is in serious need of reform.  The people you are talking about piss me off as well.

Not saying it does but to claim that only a small percentage of vets abuse it is wrong.  I see it every day.  I  had a guy come up to me and tell me the VA is trying to kill him by cutting his pain medication in half.  I asked him what he was taking and he showed me his prescription bottle and he was taking 32 hydromorphones a day and they were cutting him back to 16!  Do you have any idea how much that is? 

I understand where you're coming from but you also have to put yourself in my shoes and deal with the abuse every day, year after year to see why I feel the way I do.    I find myself agreeing with Old Tusk on this issue.

Have a good one because my butt is going to bed and I get to deal with the same situation tomorrow. 

[Pork Twain]

Not saying it does but to claim that only a small percentage of vets abuse it is wrong.  I see it every day.  I  had a guy come up to me and tell me the VA is trying to kill him by cutting his pain medication in half.  I asked him what he was taking and he showed me his prescription bottle and he was taking 32 hydromorphones a day and they were cutting him back to 16!  Do you have any idea how much that is? 

I understand where you're coming from but you also have to put yourself in my shoes and deal with the abuse every day, year after year to see why I feel the way I do.    I find myself agreeing with Old Tusk on this issue.

Have a good one because my butt is going to bed and I get to deal with the same situation tomorrow. 

I would NEVER EVER want to work in any part of the VA system.  What you are describing, sounds very similar to my mom and my sister and their stupid fibromyalgia.

[Boarcephus]

I would NEVER EVER want to work in any part of the VA system.  What you are describing, sounds very similar to my mom and my sister and their stupid fibromyalgia.

Fibromyalgia....tells you just about all you need to know about a person. 

The VA is a great gig and does some wonderful things for a great many people who have no other place to turn.  Lot of good people work here and I've met some extraordinary vets but, having said that, it is the epitomy of big gov't complete with waste and abuse on both ends.

[Tejas_Pete]

Fibro-malingria

[zane]

Not saying it does but to claim that only a small percentage of vets abuse it is wrong.  I see it every day.  I  had a guy come up to me and tell me the VA is trying to kill him by cutting his pain medication in half.  I asked him what he was taking and he showed me his prescription bottle and he was taking 32 hydromorphones a day and they were cutting him back to 16!  Do you have any idea how much that is? 

I understand where you're coming from but you also have to put yourself in my shoes and deal with the abuse every day, year after year to see why I feel the way I do.    I find myself agreeing with Old Tusk on this issue.

Have a good one because my butt is going to bed and I get to deal with the same situation tomorrow.

I need my di-la-la, bro!!

Does that script come with a free side of narcan?

[Großer Kriegschwein]

Here is how disability was explained to me.  You volunteered to serve in a certain physical condition.  When you separate, you should be in a similar condition and should be compensated for any "disability" that is service-related.  Welfare on the other hand is given to those who cannot or will not work.  Big difference.  Also only a small number of the 1% of Americans that volunteer to serve will ever collect anything substantial from disability and that is even if you count NG.  Again, huge difference from welfare.

Yes. This is exactly what disability is for. Verbatim:

"Disability Compensation is a tax free monetary benefit paid to Veterans with disabilities that are the result of a disease or injury incurred or aggravated during active military service."

I have no problems claiming my injuries and ills from military service. (Mechanized & Light/Dismounted Cavalry x 20 years). In my time in service I have five deployments (1 x Iraq, 4 x Afghanistan). I have been part of a grand total of 4 years preparing for deployment (predeployment training at home station then CTC rotations), 5 years deployed in some of the most hostile environment known to man (Kandahar Province) and some of the most grueling (Nuristan). Survived invasions of cities filled full of foot-thick concrete dwellings defended by IEDs, RPGs and RPKs. Only fell out for heat exhaustion three times (master at recovery now). Lived thru more IEDs & RPGs than I care to remember but I am truly lucky that I didn't have to deal with the EFP (My only Iraq deployment was OIF 2 and they weren't around in Anbar yet). And lets not forget the jumping from airplanes bit that absolutely destroys your legs if you have an issue or two on a few controlled crashes.

So to sum it up I've been part of over 1200 patrols (more dismounted than mounted), been blown up 36 times(both dismounted and mounted, IED & RPG w/in 10 meters dismounted), 240 direct fire engagements.

I am not the same person that joined the military years ago. Highly excitable and can barely run out of my own shadow without Motrin 800s. Arms go numb when I lay down, both knees pop and ache from arthritis when I stand up, bone spurs in my ankles, severe obstructive sleep apnea, three plates and 12 screws in my face and moderate post traumatic stress disorder to go with my mild traumatic brain injuries.

The military told me if I join and be the hammer of our foreign policy they would take care of me when I came home. I'll go home in October of 2016. Hopefully they keep their promise to me and everyone else that sacrificed for the society's freedom.