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Author Topic: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?  (Read 1760 times)

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Pancetta

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How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« on: October 12, 2017, 12:51:01 pm »

Have any of you went back and looked at the contract?  I just did and It 100% says we have to pay CBB $11.7 million if we fire him on Jan 2018. The extension is just an addendum to the original. Look for yourselves. Go to end and work your way backwards. https://2michy3wy0l30d34041dt1et-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/football/wp-content/uploads/coach-contracts/bretbielema-ua-employment-contract.pdf

I see now they are talking about page 25 of the original contract.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2017, 01:46:31 pm by Pancetta »
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ricepig

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #1 on: October 12, 2017, 12:52:35 pm »

Have any of you went back and looked at the contract?  I just did and It 100% says we have to pay CBB $11.7 million if we fire him on Jan 2018. The extension is just an addendum to the original. Look for yourselves. Go to end and work your way backwards. https://2michy3wy0l30d34041dt1et-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/football/wp-content/uploads/coach-contracts/bretbielema-ua-employment-contract.pdf

Did you read their article and their explanation??
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RyanMallettsEgo

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #2 on: October 12, 2017, 12:59:45 pm »

Did you read their article and their explanation??

Why would anyone do that when they can get all they need to know just from a headline?!?!
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Uncommon

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #3 on: October 12, 2017, 01:00:43 pm »

Why would anyone do that when they can get all they need to know just from a headline?!?!
+1
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Pig in the Pokey

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2017, 01:00:55 pm »

Math, baw. Something that is apparently beyond you. Simple math, too. x(Monthly buyout figure) times y(remaining months). Freaking REMEDIAL MATH.
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BorderPatrol

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2017, 01:02:31 pm »

Math, baw. Something that is apparently beyond you. Simple math, too. x(Monthly buyout figure) times y(remaining months). Freaking REMEDIAL MATH.

Math is hard for Italian baconites.

bp
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RzRbAcK18

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2017, 01:03:17 pm »

The formula they are talking about has been in the contract from the beginning. The addendum is just switching the new chart for the old. Go back to the new chart at the bottom it says "Employment Agreement is hereby amended by deleting the existing CHART set forth at the bottom of page 24 of section 15(a) of the Employment Agreement and inserting the following chart in lieu thereof"

Below the new chart it says "All other text, terms, and conditions set forth in Section 15 of the Employment Agreement shall remain the same and shall not be modified in any way by this First Amendment"

Referring back to the top with the original text you will find the formula they are talking about listed under the old chart.

I read that as the payment method stays the same just the dollar amount increases.

I may be way wrong though.

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hoghearted

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2017, 01:04:50 pm »

The formula they are talking about has been in the contract from the beginning. The addendum is just switching the new chart for the old. Go back to the new chart at the bottom it says "Employment Agreement is hereby amended by deleting the existing CHART set forth at the bottom of page 24 of section 15(a) of the Employment Agreement and inserting the following chart in lieu thereof"

Below the new chart it says "All other text, terms, and conditions set forth in Section 15 of the Employment Agreement shall remain the same and shall not be modified in any way by this First Amendment"

Referring back to the top with the original text you will find the formula they are talking about listed under the old chart.

I read that as the payment method stays the same just the dollar amount increases.

I may be way wrong though.



I guess that settles it.
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Pig in the Pokey

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2017, 01:06:26 pm »

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factchecker

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #9 on: October 12, 2017, 01:06:52 pm »


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Karma

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #10 on: October 12, 2017, 01:11:53 pm »

It's funny to read people on here who've talked about the buyout being $15 million now lecture others on not reading the contract.
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hawgon

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #11 on: October 12, 2017, 01:13:04 pm »

Have any of you went back and looked at the contract?  I just did and It 100% says we have to pay CBB $11.7 million if we fire him on Jan 2018. The extension is just an addendum to the original. Look for yourselves. Go to end and work your way backwards. https://2michy3wy0l30d34041dt1et-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/football/wp-content/uploads/coach-contracts/bretbielema-ua-employment-contract.pdf

I already told you in the other thread where you posted this mess.
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DeltaBoy

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #12 on: October 12, 2017, 01:28:43 pm »

They got a Lawyer to read it.
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rhames

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #13 on: October 12, 2017, 01:30:22 pm »

They got a Lawyer to read it.



This is by far your best post. Bravo.
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Pancetta

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #14 on: October 12, 2017, 01:31:28 pm »

Did you read their article and their explanation??
Yes and it makes no sense. He gets paid his yearly salary in monthly installments but they are currently $287,500 not the figure they gave. Starting January his monthly payment will be $295,333 per month based on 2018 annual salary of $3.55 million.
I know we all are hoping they are right and maybe they are but their explanation doesn’t make sense.
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Pancetta

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #15 on: October 12, 2017, 01:32:12 pm »

It's funny to read people on here who've talked about the buyout being $15 million now lecture others on not reading the contract.
So you read it?
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DoctorSusscrofa

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #16 on: October 12, 2017, 01:32:46 pm »

It's funny to read people on here who've talked about the buyout being $15 million now lecture others on not reading the contract.

Shouldn't that read: Hogville is always funny.
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ricepig

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #17 on: October 12, 2017, 01:35:35 pm »

Yes and it makes no sense. He gets paid his yearly salary in monthly installments but they are currently $287,500 not the figure they gave. Starting January his monthly payment will be $295,333 per month based on 2018 annual salary of $3.55 million.
I know we all are hoping they are right and maybe they are but their explanation doesn’t make sense.
Monthly salary, and buyout payments aren't the same thing.
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Ex-Trumpet

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #18 on: October 12, 2017, 01:39:05 pm »

I'm not a lawyer and didn't (won't) read the entire contract, but the contract states in the First Amendment...


5.  Termination of Convenience by the University.  Section 15 of the Employment Agreement is hereby amended by deleting the existing chart set forth at the bottom of page 24 of Section 15(a) of the Employment Agreement and inserting the following chart in lieu thereof:

Feb. 6, 2015, through Dec. 31,2015   $15,400,000.00
Jan. 1, 2016, through Dec. 31, 2016   $15,400,000.00
Jan. 1, 2017, through Dec. 31, 2017   $15,400,000.00
Jan. 1, 2018, through Dec. 31, 2018   $11,700,000.00
Jan. 1, 2019, through Dec. 31, 2019   $7,900,000.00
Jan. 1, 2020, through Dec. 31, 2020   $4,000,000.00

All other text, terms, and conditions set forth in Section 15 of the Employment Agreement shall remain the same and shall not be modified in any way by this First Amendment.



Is there another amendment?  I'm not seeing the $5.9M buyout.  Someone's gonna have to spell it out for me as clearly I'm not smart enough to figure it out.
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hoghearted

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #19 on: October 12, 2017, 01:41:42 pm »

hawgon explained that it extended the length of the contract from 72 to 94 (?) months. 15.4M is the value of the contract, divided by the number of months=multiplying factor or monthly value. Take that number and multiply by remaining months on contract, and that is the actual buyout.

hawgon, did I explain that right?
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DoctorSusscrofa

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #20 on: October 12, 2017, 01:42:52 pm »

I'm not a lawyer and didn't (won't) read the entire contract, but the contract states in the First Amendment...


5.  Termination of Convenience by the University.  Section 15 of the Employment Agreement is hereby amended by deleting the existing chart set forth at the bottom of page 24 of Section 15(a) of the Employment Agreement and inserting the following chart in lieu thereof:

Feb. 6, 2015, through Dec. 31,2015   $15,400,000.00
Jan. 1, 2016, through Dec. 31, 2016   $15,400,000.00
Jan. 1, 2017, through Dec. 31, 2017   $15,400,000.00
Jan. 1, 2018, through Dec. 31, 2018   $11,700,000.00
Jan. 1, 2019, through Dec. 31, 2019   $7,900,000.00
Jan. 1, 2020, through Dec. 31, 2020   $4,000,000.00

All other text, terms, and conditions set forth in Section 15 of the Employment Agreement shall remain the same and shall not be modified in any way by this First Amendment.



Is there another amendment?  I'm not seeing the $5.9M buyout.  Someone's gonna have to spell it out for me as clearly I'm not smart enough to figure it out.
I haven't seen it, but I suspect the "chart" is a chart of numbers that will be computed to figure out the buyout, rather the the numbers of the buyout itself.  Other posters have pointed out these large amounts as the "denominator" in the formula.  The chart in that paragraph doesn't say these numbers ARE the buyout.  It just says a previous chart is replaced by this one.
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Pancetta

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #21 on: October 12, 2017, 01:45:14 pm »

You guys are right. It’s on page 25 of the original contract.
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Pancetta

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #22 on: October 12, 2017, 01:48:50 pm »

Monthly salary, and buyout payments aren't the same thing.
You are right and I was wrong. Page 25 of the original contract. My apologies.
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Donny2665

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #23 on: October 12, 2017, 01:50:21 pm »

"The numerator shall be the full amount of the Guaranty Payment identified in the foregoing chart depending upon the year of termination and shall be divided by the denominator, which shall be the total number of months of the Term of the Employment Agreement (with any partial months being pro-rated), to yield the "Monthly Value of the Total Guaranty Payment."

"Divide buyout by the total number of months of the Term of Employment Agreement."


"The Monthly Value of the Total Guaranty Payment shall then be multiplied by the number of months remaining on the Term (with any partial months being prorated) as of the effective date of the termination to yield the "Total Guaranty Payment."

$15,400,000.00/72 months of employment agreement= $213,888.89 per month X remaining months of term from termination date(lets say 12/1/17 for S&G's) which would be 37 months X $213,888.89 =$7,913,888.93
*Corrected to 37 months.


« Last Edit: October 12, 2017, 03:51:48 pm by Donny2665 »
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Pancetta

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #24 on: October 12, 2017, 01:51:02 pm »

I'm not a lawyer and didn't (won't) read the entire contract, but the contract states in the First Amendment...


5.  Termination of Convenience by the University.  Section 15 of the Employment Agreement is hereby amended by deleting the existing chart set forth at the bottom of page 24 of Section 15(a) of the Employment Agreement and inserting the following chart in lieu thereof:

Feb. 6, 2015, through Dec. 31,2015   $15,400,000.00
Jan. 1, 2016, through Dec. 31, 2016   $15,400,000.00
Jan. 1, 2017, through Dec. 31, 2017   $15,400,000.00
Jan. 1, 2018, through Dec. 31, 2018   $11,700,000.00
Jan. 1, 2019, through Dec. 31, 2019   $7,900,000.00
Jan. 1, 2020, through Dec. 31, 2020   $4,000,000.00

All other text, terms, and conditions set forth in Section 15 of the Employment Agreement shall remain the same and shall not be modified in any way by this First Amendment.



Is there another amendment?  I'm not seeing the $5.9M buyout.  Someone's gonna have to spell it out for me as clearly I'm not smart enough to figure it out.
Hawgon and RicePig are right. Look at page 25 of the contract.
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Ex-Trumpet

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #25 on: October 12, 2017, 01:51:56 pm »

hawgon explained that it extended the length of the contract from 72 to 94 (?) months. 15.4M is the value of the contract, divided by the number of months=multiplying factor or monthly value. Take that number and multiply by remaining months on contract, and that is the actual buyout.

hawgon, did I explain that right?

Makes sense...so in effect, by accepting a contract extension he lowered his termination buyout?
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RazorChuck

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #26 on: October 12, 2017, 01:52:55 pm »

Well, in that case!
Where do I send the check?
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Darrell Royal's Floating Flaming Fulminating Spectral Head

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #27 on: October 12, 2017, 01:54:32 pm »

"The numerator shall be the full amount of the Guaranty Payment identified in the foregoing chart depending upon the year of termination and shall be divided by the denominator, which shall be the total number of months of the Term of the Employment Agreement (with any partial months being pro-rated), to yield the "Monthly Value of the Total Guaranty Payment."

"Divide buyout by the total number of months of the Term of Employment Agreement."


"The Monthly Value of the Total Guaranty Payment shall then be multiplied by the number of months remaining on the Term (with any partial months being prorated) as of the effective date of the termination to yield the "Total Guaranty Payment."

$15,400,000.00/72 months of employment agreement= $213,888.89 per month X remaining months of term from termination date(lets say 12/1/17 for S&G's) which would be 25 months X $213,888.89 =$5,347,222.25





Thanks! Was seriously about to put this in a spreadsheet so folks here could understand the math, lol
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hawgon

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #28 on: October 12, 2017, 01:55:46 pm »

Makes sense...so in effect, by accepting a contract extension he lowered his termination buyout?

Yes, which is why they took it up to $15.4.  The monthly buyout figure was $177,000 before the extension and is now about $160,000 even with the raise to $15.4 million.
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hogfan870

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #29 on: October 12, 2017, 01:56:48 pm »

"The numerator shall be the full amount of the Guaranty Payment identified in the foregoing chart depending upon the year of termination and shall be divided by the denominator, which shall be the total number of months of the Term of the Employment Agreement (with any partial months being pro-rated), to yield the "Monthly Value of the Total Guaranty Payment."

"Divide buyout by the total number of months of the Term of Employment Agreement."


"The Monthly Value of the Total Guaranty Payment shall then be multiplied by the number of months remaining on the Term (with any partial months being prorated) as of the effective date of the termination to yield the "Total Guaranty Payment."

$15,400,000.00/72 months of employment agreement= $213,888.89 per month X remaining months of term from termination date(lets say 12/1/17 for S&G's) which would be 25 months X $213,888.89 =$5,347,222.25





I have not spent a bunch of time studying this, but I think the contract is 96 months (8 years, not 6) and there would be more like 3 years left on it (ending December 2020), not 2 years.
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ricepig

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #30 on: October 12, 2017, 02:00:23 pm »

Well, in that case!
Where do I send the check?

ricepig.com. We also accept Paypal, hogs, chickens, and thoroughbreds.....
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Donny2665

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #31 on: October 12, 2017, 02:03:48 pm »

I have not spent a bunch of time studying this, but I think the contract is 96 months (8 years, not 6) and there would be more like 3 years left on it (ending December 2020), not 2 years.


The Employment Agreement attached amended by deleting the existing chart.


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Donny2665

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #32 on: October 12, 2017, 02:05:26 pm »

Original Employment Agreement attached.
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Uncommon

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #33 on: October 12, 2017, 02:10:08 pm »

It's funny to read people on here who've talked about the buyout being $15 million now lecture others on not reading the contract.
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WizardofhOgZ

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #34 on: October 12, 2017, 02:16:56 pm »

They got a Lawyer to read it.

Actually, Matt Jones (of WholeHogSports) re-read the contract, and - after arriving at the new interpretation - took up up his management chain.  They agreed with his interpretation, and asked their Legal Dept. to look at it before they ran with it.

So, it's Matt Jones who deserves the credit for breaking this story.
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HoginMemphis

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #35 on: October 12, 2017, 02:18:43 pm »

Have any of you went back and looked at the contract?  I just did and It 100% says we have to pay CBB $11.7 million if we fire him on Jan 2018. The extension is just an addendum to the original. Look for yourselves. Go to end and work your way backwards. https://2michy3wy0l30d34041dt1et-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/football/wp-content/uploads/coach-contracts/bretbielema-ua-employment-contract.pdf

I see now they are talking about page 25 of the original contract.
I have not went back but I have gone back several times.
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Großer Kriegschwein

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #36 on: October 12, 2017, 02:21:07 pm »

ricepig.com. We also accept Paypal, hogs, chickens, and thoroughbreds.....

And of course acreage in the Jonesboro area in lieu of monetary payment.
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moses_007

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #37 on: October 12, 2017, 02:30:28 pm »

Nowhere does the contract say the buyout amount is used to calculate the exact buyout.  What it does say is that if the U of A terminates him without cause, that it will pay the buyout amount specified at the time of termination.

Yes, it is $15 million right down, drops to $11.4 million Jan. 1.
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Hog-Corleone

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #38 on: October 12, 2017, 02:31:24 pm »

Thanks! Was seriously about to put this in a spreadsheet so folks here could understand the math, lol

i think the buyout needs to be over 96 months, not 72.  The addendum extends the original contract, so two years need to be added...
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Hog-Corleone

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #39 on: October 12, 2017, 02:32:01 pm »

Nowhere does the contract say the buyout amount is used to calculate the exact buyout.  What it does say is that if the U of A terminates him without cause, that it will pay the buyout amount specified at the time of termination.

Yes, it is $15 million right down, drops to $11.4 million Jan. 1.

The way the contract reads, this is incorrect...
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Hog-Corleone

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #40 on: October 12, 2017, 02:36:24 pm »

Directly from the contract, page 25, right under the chart with the buyout figures:

The foregoing amounts shall be paid on a non-cumulative basis beginning with the effective date of the termination for convenience in accordance with the foregoing schedule and subject to the terms and conditions of this provision (the "Total Guaranty Payment" as defined herein). The total amount of the Total Guaranty Payment owed to Coach as of the effective date of the termination shall be determined by the following formula: The numerator shall be the full amount of the Guaranty Payment identified in the foregoing chart depending upon the year of termination and shall be divided by the denominator, which shall be the total number of months of the Term of the Employment Agreement (with any partial months being pro-rated), to yield the "Monthly Value of the Total Guaranty Payment." The Monthly Value of the Total Guaranty Payment shall then be multiplied by the number of months remaining on the Term (with any partial months being prorated) as of the effective date of the termination to yield the "Total Guaranty Payment." The Total Guaranty Payment shall be paid to Coach in equal monthly installments on the last calendar day of each month (with any partial months being pro-rated) as determined from the effective date of the termination for convenience through the remaining balance of the Term. Notwithstanding any other term or condition in this Agreement, Coach shall have an affirmative duty of mitigation to diligently seek and accept other employment in the event this Employment Agreement is terminated for convenience as well as an obligation to comply with any mitigation and/or other conditions set forth in the Guaranty Agreement. No other amounts beyond the Total Guaranty Payment shall be owed to Coach.

This is pretty simple English and Math.  (not new math though, this is old math, so some of you younger kids might not grasp it.)
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Donny2665

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #41 on: October 12, 2017, 02:37:11 pm »

i think the buyout needs to be over 96 months, not 72.  The addendum extends the original contract, so two years need to be added...

Article 5. termination for convenience by the University.  Read that section again.
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hawg1221

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #42 on: October 12, 2017, 02:39:11 pm »

It's funny to read people on here who've talked about the buyout being $15 million now lecture others on not reading the contract.

+1...
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Darrell Royal's Floating Flaming Fulminating Spectral Head

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #43 on: October 12, 2017, 02:39:14 pm »

Nowhere does the contract say the buyout amount is used to calculate the exact buyout.  What it does say is that if the U of A terminates him without cause, that it will pay the buyout amount specified at the time of termination.

Yes, it is $15 million right down, drops to $11.4 million Jan. 1.

Clearly you did not read or understand page 25 of his contract.
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Hog Fan...DOH!

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #44 on: October 12, 2017, 02:40:20 pm »

Why would anyone do that when they can get all they need to know just from a headline?!?!



I get my news from people I want to believe.  And that's a fact.
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Hog-Corleone

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #45 on: October 12, 2017, 02:44:45 pm »

Article 5. termination for convenience by the University.  Read that section again.

I did, and I don't see where this addresses any possible extensions.  By definition, the extension added 24 months to the original contract.  So the "Contract Term" now becomes 8 years not 6.  You have to use 96 months to get to the $5.9MM number that the articles reported.  Using 72 months gets you $7.98MM at December...

I can see the argument both ways on this, regardless, the new calculation is much less than  what we originally thought.
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moses_007

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #46 on: October 12, 2017, 02:48:24 pm »

Clearly you did not read or understand page 25 of his contract.
Well evidently no one else did either.  Even Lanny has been saying it's $15 million.

If somewhere around $5 million is correct, give him his walking papers and send him up north somewhere.
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hawgon

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #47 on: October 12, 2017, 02:52:20 pm »

I did, and I don't see where this addresses any possible extensions.  By definition, the extension added 24 months to the original contract.  So the "Contract Term" now becomes 8 years not 6.  You have to use 96 months to get to the $5.9MM number that the articles reported.  Using 72 months gets you $7.98MM at December...

I can see the argument both ways on this, regardless, the new calculation is much less than  what we originally thought.

There is no argument both ways.  Go to the very first part of the amendment.  It clearly states that the only thing changed is the end date and the new 2020 date is substituted.  It specifically states that the rest of that section of the original contract is in place.  That makes the contract a 96 month contract. 
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Hog-Corleone

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #48 on: October 12, 2017, 02:54:28 pm »

There is no argument both ways.  Go to the very first part of the amendment.  It clearly states that the only thing changed is the end date and the new 2020 date is substituted.  It specifically states that the rest of that section of the original contract is in place.  That makes the contract a 96 month contract. 

Those are my thoughts as well...  That is why I suggested it to begin with.  If I was representing CBB I would argue for 72, but I think that would fail...
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Sivad

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Re: How did DemGaz come to that conclusion?
« Reply #49 on: October 12, 2017, 02:59:44 pm »

DemGaz = Fake News
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