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Long needs to face some tough questions. . .

Started by Feralhog, October 12, 2017, 12:46:48 pm

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Feralhog

First of all, I've spent quite a bit of time away from the board so I want to state upfront for the sake of full disclosure, I was totally behind the decision to hire Bielema.  That said, I think it's time for Long to 'splain some things, dating back to the day of infamy.  April 1, 2012.  Not necessarily from the viewpoint of answering tough questions, but rather a stroll down memory lane and critiquing the results of a few decisions he's made.  In fact, I'm struggling to identify the decisions made by Long that I could point to and or categorize in the "good decision" check box.  Mike Anderson is showing some potential for having the proverbial feather stuck in Jeff's hat, but short of that?  I'm not going to fault Long for hiring Bielema.  After all, He was a power 5 coach fresh off back to back Conference Championships, but I will and do question the amount of CBB's buyout, and would like a straight answer as to the motivation for Long to agree with the kind of numbers we keep hearing about?  For the first time in my life, the thought of replacing the Athletic Director offers more hope for the program than replacing it's head coach.   
Seer, Sage, Soothsayer and former coach finder for the Tejas Longhorns.......Feralhog the Magnificent

hogsanity

Umm, you do know the 15mil buyout has been proven to have been a delusion and is more like 5 mil.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

 

DeltaBoy

If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

hoghearted

Quote from: hogsanity on October 12, 2017, 12:48:13 pm
Umm, you do know the 15mil buyout has been proven to have been a delusion and is more like 5 mil.

I expect there will be legal wrangling over that, but yes, it is no where near what everyone thought. Thank goodness.
It really is this simple. Unchecked government power leads to corruption, and lack of accountability for it is drastically eroding confidence in our institutions.    aristotle


GuvHog

Quote from: Feralhog on October 12, 2017, 12:46:48 pm
First of all, I've spent quite a bit of time away from the board so I want to state upfront for the sake of full disclosure, I was totally behind the decision to hire Bielema.  That said, I think it's time for Long to 'splain some things, dating back to the day of infamy.  April 1, 2012.  Not necessarily from the viewpoint of answering tough questions, but rather a stroll down memory lane and critiquing the results of a few decisions he's made.  In fact, I'm struggling to identify the decisions made by Long that I could point to and or categorize in the "good decision" check box.  Mike Anderson is showing some potential for having the proverbial feather stuck in Jeff's hat, but short of that?  I'm not going to fault Long for hiring Bielema.  After all, He was a power 5 coach fresh off back to back Conference Championships, but I will and do question the amount of CBB's buyout, and would like a straight answer as to the motivation for Long to agree with the kind of numbers we keep hearing about?  For the first time in my life, the thought of replacing the Athletic Director offers more hope for the program than replacing it's head coach.   

Welcome back Feralhog! It's been a while since you've posted.

I agree with your post, by the way.
Bleeding Razorback Red Since Birth!!!

Feralhog

Quote from: hogsanity on October 12, 2017, 12:48:13 pm
Umm, you do know the 15mil buyout has been proven to have been a delusion and is more like 5 mil.

I'm not sure I'm buying that.  It may be where it ends up, but I find it hard to believe that major media outlets nationally would have gotten these numbers wrong. 
Seer, Sage, Soothsayer and former coach finder for the Tejas Longhorns.......Feralhog the Magnificent

hogsanity

Quote from: Feralhog on October 12, 2017, 12:51:01 pm
I'm not sure I'm buying that.  It may be where it ends up, but I find it hard to believe that major media outlets nationally would have gotten these numbers wrong. 

Well you should march right on up to the BAC and ask these tough questions that amount to nothing,
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

hoghearted

It certainly seems convenient timing.......but why so long before it was 'figured out'? Why are we just now hearing that the buyout isn't what has been portrayed?

Hmmm
It really is this simple. Unchecked government power leads to corruption, and lack of accountability for it is drastically eroding confidence in our institutions.    aristotle

Feralhog

Quote from: hogsanity on October 12, 2017, 12:52:27 pm
Well you should march right on up to the BAC and ask these tough questions that amount to nothing,

what's with the hostility?  Surely you're not still butthurtin over Nutt. 
Seer, Sage, Soothsayer and former coach finder for the Tejas Longhorns.......Feralhog the Magnificent


Feralhog

Quote from: hoghearted on October 12, 2017, 12:53:23 pm
It certainly seems convenient timing.......but why so long before it was 'figured out'? Why are we just now hearing that the buyout isn't what has been portrayed?

Hmmm

That was sort of my point.  I have all kinds of theories racing around my alzheimered mind.  Wait, what was I saying?
Seer, Sage, Soothsayer and former coach finder for the Tejas Longhorns.......Feralhog the Magnificent

ricepig

Quote from: hoghearted on October 12, 2017, 12:53:23 pm
It certainly seems convenient timing.......but why so long before it was 'figured out'? Why are we just now hearing that the buyout isn't what has been portrayed?

Hmmm

Because we aren't lawyers?

 

hoghearted

I read a portion of the article, and they mention the original contract. The question for me is, does the addendum invalidate or change the original language of the contract? Like hoglady says, seems like a gray area.
It really is this simple. Unchecked government power leads to corruption, and lack of accountability for it is drastically eroding confidence in our institutions.    aristotle

hoghearted

It really is this simple. Unchecked government power leads to corruption, and lack of accountability for it is drastically eroding confidence in our institutions.    aristotle

ricepig

Quote from: hoghearted on October 12, 2017, 12:57:57 pm
I read a portion of the article, and they mention the original contract. The question for me is, does the addendum invalidate or change the original language of the contract? Like hoglady says, seems like a gray area.

I linked the article, along with the original contract, and the extension. I didn't interrupt it as the ADG lawyers did, but I hire that stuff done for a reason, haha.

hoghearted

If I try to read a contract like that, I'm likely to slip into a coma. I will leave it to you business-like fellers to give me a synopsis. Now if you want me to explain a perioperative record to you, I'm down for that. :)
It really is this simple. Unchecked government power leads to corruption, and lack of accountability for it is drastically eroding confidence in our institutions.    aristotle

Feralhog

Quote from: ricepig on October 12, 2017, 12:56:40 pm
Because we aren't lawyers?

Ok, let's say for the sake of argument that Bielema isn't looking for an exit, and let's say Bielema isn't looking to do whatever possible to help smooth over what, on the surface would look like a horrific decision by the man that hired him.  Fine.  Back to the other point I made in the OP.  Show me a comprehensive list of decisions by Long that could be filed on the side of the ledger marked "GOOD".
Seer, Sage, Soothsayer and former coach finder for the Tejas Longhorns.......Feralhog the Magnificent

Hoggie17

Quote from: hogsanity on October 12, 2017, 12:48:13 pm
Umm, you do know the 15mil buyout has been proven to have been a delusion and is more like 5 mil.
Who all were/is involved in the cover up.  It was a lie, and by not setting the record straight, makes is worse.  Any way you look at it Long was involved.  At Arkansas we fire those who lie, just ask CBP. 

longpig

Quote from: Feralhog on October 12, 2017, 12:51:01 pm
I'm not sure I'm buying that.  It may be where it ends up, but I find it hard to believe that major media outlets nationally would have gotten these numbers wrong.

You'll just have to leave again and search for another reason to dislike our exceptional AD. 

Take Guvhog with you.
Don't be scared, be smart.

factchecker

Quote from: Hoggie17 on October 12, 2017, 01:05:41 pm
Who all were/is involved in the cover up.  It was a lie, and by not setting the record straight, makes is worse.  Any way you look at it Long was involved.  At Arkansas we fire those who lie, just ask CBP.

Holy hell.

There is no cover up.

The contract has been there this whole time.

Just because it took someone years to figure it out doesn't mean it was some conspiracy theory.
WORK FOR IT
PLAN ON IT
EARN IT
OMAHOGS

rhames

Quote from: factchecker on October 12, 2017, 01:09:08 pm
Holy hell.

There is no cover up.

The contract has been there this whole time.

Just because it took someone years to figure it out doesn't mean it was some conspiracy theory.


Don't even bother with that mental midget factchecker
"I'm too drunk to taste this chicken"

"Can we get some waffles after we get some ass?" - Aunt Tiffany Freeman

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The only down time my legs see is when seated in 1st Class.

longpig

Quote from: ricepig on October 12, 2017, 01:00:46 pm
I linked the article, along with the original contract, and the extension. I didn't interrupt it as the ADG lawyers did, but I hire that stuff done for a reason, haha.

Should have plugged in the numbers myself, assumed someone had considering it's basic finance.
Don't be scared, be smart.

Feralhog

Quote from: factchecker on October 12, 2017, 01:09:08 pm
Holy hell.

There is no cover up.

The contract has been there this whole time.

Just because it took someone years to figure it out doesn't mean it was some conspiracy theory.

At this point, it doesn't matter to me.  I'm willing to let Long be judged on his merits.  Still waiting on someone to post the list that is taking up ledger space marked "GOOD." 
Seer, Sage, Soothsayer and former coach finder for the Tejas Longhorns.......Feralhog the Magnificent

 

ricepig

Quote from: longpig on October 12, 2017, 01:12:43 pm
Should have plugged in the numbers myself, assumed someone had considering it's basic finance.

I figured after a contract year had occurred, that was no longer considered part of his Total Guarantee, he'd already banked it. Again, I know how deep to plant your corn and put it in moisture......

DoctorSusscrofa

Quote from: Feralhog on October 12, 2017, 12:51:01 pm
I'm not sure I'm buying that.  It may be where it ends up, but I find it hard to believe that major media outlets nationally would have gotten these numbers wrong.
Which national media outlets are you claiming misquoted the contract?  I just want this to be clear.  If a national media outlet, quoting the contract, got it wrong, which one or ones did that?
I expect to win the games we ought to win and be competitive in as many other games as possible. - M Barton

hogsanity

Quote from: rhames on October 12, 2017, 01:12:20 pm

Don't even bother with that mental midget factchecker

which mental midget? That description covers about 85% of the posters and 99% of all radio show callers.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

Razorbackers

Guys I crunched the numbers over here and my studies show that holy darn some people are stupid.

Feralhog

Quote from: DoctorSusscrofa on October 12, 2017, 01:16:20 pm
Which national media outlets are you claiming misquoted the contract?  I just want this to be clear.  If a national media outlet, quoting the contract, got it wrong, which one or ones did that?

I bet I heard it reported on the SEC Network at least a dozen times over the past couple of weeks.  Paul Finebaum brings up the 15M buyout almost as frequent as little girl on True Grit playing the Lawyer Daggit card.
Seer, Sage, Soothsayer and former coach finder for the Tejas Longhorns.......Feralhog the Magnificent

Feralhog

Quote from: hogsanity on October 12, 2017, 01:17:56 pm
which mental midget? That description covers about 85% of the posters and 99% of all radio show callers.

Shouldn't you be erecting some "Hire Nutt" banners?
Seer, Sage, Soothsayer and former coach finder for the Tejas Longhorns.......Feralhog the Magnificent

Drop the Mike

Quote from: hoghearted on October 12, 2017, 12:53:23 pm
It certainly seems convenient timing.......but why so long before it was 'figured out'?
Hmmm

Probably because my major was African studies at UNC

factchecker

WORK FOR IT
PLAN ON IT
EARN IT
OMAHOGS

DoctorSusscrofa

Quote from: Feralhog on October 12, 2017, 01:20:22 pm
I bet I heard it reported on the SEC Network at least a dozen times over the past couple of weeks.  Paul Finebaum brings up the 15M buyout almost as frequent as little girl on True Grit playing the Lawyer Daggit card.

Ok. But are they quoting the contract or just following the public buzz?
I expect to win the games we ought to win and be competitive in as many other games as possible. - M Barton

hogsanity

Quote from: Feralhog on October 12, 2017, 01:21:17 pm
Shouldn't you be erecting some "Hire Nutt" banners?

Why? I do not want him hired.
People ask me what I do in winter when there is no baseball.  I will tell you what I do. I stare out the window, and I wait for spring.

"Anything goes wrong, anything at all, your fault, my fault, nobodies fault, I'm going to blow your head off."  John Wayne in BIG JAKE

ricepig


Feralhog

Quote from: hogsanity on October 12, 2017, 01:24:37 pm
Why? I do not want him hired.

I know you didn't want him fired.  THUS the suggestion.  SMDH
Seer, Sage, Soothsayer and former coach finder for the Tejas Longhorns.......Feralhog the Magnificent

Tusks

Let's see, as a hog fan I need to:

Donate to the foundation to get season tickets.
Buy season tickets.
Spend money going to games.
Hire an attorney to review the programs contracts to get a straight answer to what means what.

Ok sounds reasonable.

I guess I'll spend $1000 to have my guys review the the bond issuance for the expansion.  I mean it's just part of the tab to participate in being a hog fan.
sometimes it's a good and some times it's a schit

ricepig

Quote from: tusked on October 12, 2017, 01:30:22 pm
Let's see, as a hog fan I need to:

Donate to the foundation to get season tickets.
Buy season tickets.
Spend money going to games.
Hire an attorney to review the programs contracts to get a straight answer to what means what.

Ok sounds reasonable.

I guess I'll spend $1000 to have my guys review the the bond issuance for the expansion.  I mean it's just part of the tab to participate in being a hog fan.

Here you go, read on.


http://media.arkansasonline.com/news/documents/2016/11/01/Download_of_Stadium_Expansion_bond_document.pdf

GuvHog

Bleeding Razorback Red Since Birth!!!

Tusks

sometimes it's a good and some times it's a schit

Vantage 8 dude

Quote from: Feralhog on October 12, 2017, 12:46:48 pm
First of all, I've spent quite a bit of time away from the board so I want to state upfront for the sake of full disclosure, I was totally behind the decision to hire Bielema.  That said, I think it's time for Long to 'splain some things, dating back to the day of infamy.  April 1, 2012.  Not necessarily from the viewpoint of answering tough questions, but rather a stroll down memory lane and critiquing the results of a few decisions he's made.  In fact, I'm struggling to identify the decisions made by Long that I could point to and or categorize in the "good decision" check box.  Mike Anderson is showing some potential for having the proverbial feather stuck in Jeff's hat, but short of that?  I'm not going to fault Long for hiring Bielema.  After all, He was a power 5 coach fresh off back to back Conference Championships, but I will and do question the amount of CBB's buyout, and would like a straight answer as to the motivation for Long to agree with the kind of numbers we keep hearing about?  For the first time in my life, the thought of replacing the Athletic Director offers more hope for the program than replacing it's head coach.   
And you're apparently assuming that Long hasn't already been? I mean whether he does anything or not I suspect he's most certainly aware of the general and growing anger and discontent amongst the fan base. And btw this is in no way a defense of JL.

Hog-Corleone

Quote from: hoghearted on October 12, 2017, 12:57:57 pm
I read a portion of the article, and they mention the original contract. The question for me is, does the addendum invalidate or change the original language of the contract? Like hoglady says, seems like a gray area.

The original contract, as i have read it, dictates the math on the buyout.  All the extension does is change the amount that is prorated, and i think the length of time it is prorated over.  So, the math on the buyout did not change from the original contract to the new one, only the amount that is prorated:

Original contract if fired in Dec, 2017:
Buy out amount $6.4MM / Term 72 Mos * Reminaing time 13 Mos = $1.16MM

Extension:
Buy out amount $15.4MM / Term  96 Mos * Remaining Time 37 Mos = $5.9MM

There it is from an accountant, who knows nothing about law, but has read many many contracts.  Now, my asterisk is this:  I only read the original contract clause that discusses the buyout, and the portion of the extension that discusses the buyout...

This is my word, and as such is beyond contestation.

factchecker

Quote from: DoctorSusscrofa on October 12, 2017, 01:24:17 pm
Ok. But are they quoting the contract or just following the public buzz?

Following buzz most likely.  The media has made statements with their lone source being Hogville.

Remember the lies about Whaley being out for the season and his jaw being wired shut?
WORK FOR IT
PLAN ON IT
EARN IT
OMAHOGS

Feralhog

Quote from: Vantage 8 dude on October 12, 2017, 01:48:32 pm
And you're apparently assuming that Long hasn't already been? I mean whether he does anything or not I suspect he's most certainly aware of the general and growing anger and discontent amongst the fan base. And btw this is in no way a defense of JL.

Problem is, his answers thus far doesn't offer up much hope for me to have a whole lot of confidence in his approach to problem solve. 
Seer, Sage, Soothsayer and former coach finder for the Tejas Longhorns.......Feralhog the Magnificent

elviscat

Jeff Long, is the first one to get a bus ticket out of Fayetteville. He is the person responsible for the mess in Fayetteville. He hasn't hired a great coach since his arrival. BP, was recommended by Jerry Jones. So what has fancy pants done?

grayhawg

Quote from: Feralhog on October 12, 2017, 04:52:49 pm
Problem is, his answers thus far doesn't offer up much hope for me to have a whole lot of confidence in his approach to problem solve. 
Good to see you posting

26.2Hog

Quote from: Hog-Corleone on October 12, 2017, 02:06:46 pm
The original contract, as i have read it, dictates the math on the buyout.  All the extension does is change the amount that is prorated, and i think the length of time it is prorated over.  So, the math on the buyout did not change from the original contract to the new one, only the amount that is prorated:

Original contract if fired in Dec, 2017:
Buy out amount $6.4MM / Term 72 Mos * Reminaing time 13 Mos = $1.16MM

Extension:
Buy out amount $15.4MM / Term  96 Mos * Remaining Time 37 Mos = $5.9MM

There it is from an accountant, who knows nothing about law, but has read many many contracts.  Now, my asterisk is this:  I only read the original contract clause that discusses the buyout, and the portion of the extension that discusses the buyout...

You are exactly right and thank you for explaining it in terms anyone can understand.

phadedhawg

Yesterday:  "Jeff Long should be fired because of a 15 million buyout"

Today:  "Jeff Long should be fired because he allowed me to be mistaken"

Tomorrow:  "Jeff Long should be fired because (insert hot take here)". 


Feralhog

Quote from: phadedhawg on October 12, 2017, 05:03:01 pm
Yesterday:  "Jeff Long should be fired because of a 15 million buyout"

Today:  "Jeff Long should be fired because he allowed me to be mistaken"

Tomorrow:  "Jeff Long should be fired because (insert hot take here)". 



[the only ones showing signs of success are the lady razorback golfers]
Seer, Sage, Soothsayer and former coach finder for the Tejas Longhorns.......Feralhog the Magnificent

ChicoHog

Quote from: factchecker on October 12, 2017, 01:09:08 pm
Holy hell.

There is no cover up.

The contract has been there this whole time.

Just because it took someone years to figure it out doesn't mean it was some conspiracy theory.
Exactly.  It was a 15M buyout but decreased each month as time went by and will continue to decrease.  Not that difficult to understand.