Things we learned today

[Niels Boar]

1.  Yes, the SEC, the West in particular, was that bad.  The out of conference record was no mirage.  LSU and Bama dominated the West and spent the whole first round down by double digits.  Guess Wisc-Mil didn't know Bama would be a "good" loss.  SEC teams are probably all seeded about 3 or 4 levels higher than they should be.  Any legit NCAAT team would have had 6 or 7 wins against the SEC cellar without breaking a sweat.  Clip the rest of the not-so-formidable conference at about a .500 clip and you are up around 11 conference wins. 

2. CUSA looks to have been underrated.  UAB and Cincy gave the two most dominating performances of the day.  Depaul, not Indiana or Notre Dame, may have been the best team left out.

3.  Perhaps Anderson can introduce Heath to the concept of the gameplan.  How many weak shooting teams were able to torch us inside this season?  UAB tripled Bass and Davis.  Half of LSU's attempts were from the arc, where they hit a barely measurable 18%.  UAB dared LSU to beat them from the perimeter.  LSU couldn't.  Anderson schooled Brady.  Both LSU and Bama were sliced and diced by pressure D.  Wasn't that what we were supposed to be working on in November?

4.  Illinois' less-than-dominating D stats were evident against Fairly Impressive, especially in the first half when they surrendered 50% to a #16 seed.  Iowa's performance looks like a warning that the Illini run may have been aided by a weak Big 10 conference. 

[JD_85]

8. If the Lady Backs defeat UNLV then there will be a game between ASU and UA. ASU beat MSU handily tonight.

[Fatty McGee]

7. Heart and determination can overcome talent.

No it can't.  If the talent is just a step up (a 12 seed beating a 5), it can get you to the Sweet 16, and once in a great while the Final 8.  But it almost never beats top flight talent. 

[hawkeyefan17]

Niels Boar,

I liked your post but I have to respond to some things...

I agree with you about DePaul. I was surprised when they were left out. Indiana and Notre Dame suck.

You use Cincinnati's performance against Iowa as reasoning that the Conference USA is underrated. Yes, I picked my Hawkeyes in this game but I was assuming Cincy's guards would not be able to shoot and when you have Jason Maxiell making 15 foot jumpers with ease, it is going to be a long day. Did you see how many white boys Iowa has on their team? I overlooked this factor when considering my pick for this game but should have lent more credence to this factor because Iowa was clearly the slower and less athletic team. Iowa got their asses handed to them and the only thing that this game showed was that while without their leading scorer Pierre Pierce Iowa may be a good team they clearly cannot compete in the upper echelon of college basketball.

Iowa's game will not and should not reflect on your feelings towards how Illinois will do in the tournament. Iowa barely made the tournament and finished 7th in the Big Ten with a 7-9 record. Iowa was the team that gave Illinois the most trouble in conference play (other than the loss to Ohio State) but Iowa has notoriously played up or down to their opponent all year depending upon the opponent (wins over Louisville, Texas, Texas Tech, Iowa State with Pierre Pierce and Michigan State with out him. The losses to NORTHWESTERN and Michigan with Pierre Pierce and the loss to Purdue without him.)

Don't use Iowa to assume things about Illinois or the rest of the conference for that matter. Iowa was too weird of a team this year to use as an example for anything.

[Lando Calrissian]

9.  Don't pick an SEC team, unless they're coached by Tubby Smith, to get past the 1st round.

I was 12/16 in my picks...no thanks to LSU and BAMA, who got completely ran into the ground by their opponents.

[Fatty McGee]

7. Heart and determination can overcome talent.

No it can't. If the talent is just a step up (a 12 seed beating a 5), it can get you to the Sweet 16, and once in a great while the Final 8. But it almost never beats top flight talent.

it can when Mark Gottfried is your coach

Mark Gottried went to the Final 8 last year.  You lose sometimes, even if you're a very good coach.  Boeheim, Olson, and Sampson have all been upset in the first round, and they're all pretty good coaches.

[Extra Point]

9. Don't pick an SEC team, unless they're coached by Tubby Smith, to get past the 1st round.

I was 12/16 in my picks...no thanks to LSU and BAMA, who got completely ran into the ground by their opponents.

No joke there.  What is this, the 4th year in a row a SEC team has been upset in round one?  I believe the last 3 were Florida twice and MSU.

Don't forget, we could see MSU go down in round one as well.  They are not that great at this point either.

I also think UK could go down to Cincy if Cincy plays like they did today.  UK has no one to shut Maxiel down.

[tophawg19]

GOT MIKE .anderson showed how to play SECbasketball . FRANK bend over most of us want to kick your butt . save ARK. fire stan hire mike then retire .

[bknight33]

1) Playing hard makes a tremendous difference.  UAB plays as hard as anyone I have seen all season.  They have great athletes, and they are all over the place.
2) John Brady is worse than Dale Brown.  Coach Brady did a poor job of emphasizing the importance of the interior game.  Bass and Davis barely touched the ball in the first half.  I was worried that LSU's guards would get caught up in that up tempo game.
3) Coach Knight is still the best offensive coach in the country.  His kids play extremely hard too. TTech runs a true motion offense.  Four men without the ball moving with a purpose.

[hawgjowls]

7. Heart and determination can overcome talent.

No it can't. If the talent is just a step up (a 12 seed beating a 5), it can get you to the Sweet 16, and once in a great while the Final 8. But it almost never beats top flight talent.

it can when Mark Gottfried is your coach

Mark Gottried went to the Final 8 last year. You lose sometimes, even if you're a very good coach. Boeheim, Olson, and Sampson have all been upset in the first round, and they're all pretty good coaches.

fatty is the ultimate sec homer.  you actually believe alabama should ever lose to the mighty univ of wisconsin at milwaukee, or who ever they are.  that is pitiful gottfired should fire himself.

[Amityvillehogger]

or we could just say LSU and Alabama came out thinking this was a cake walk...

[sooie dog]

Deep down you had to be laughing your ass off.  I know I was and it brings a smile to my face just thinking about it.  Piss on both of them.

[tophawg19]

may be lots of teams thinking of coaching changes . wonder whats on their int. sites this morning . may make ours look tame .

[Calvin N Hawgs]

Deep down you had to be laughing your ass off. I know I was and it brings a smile to my face just thinking about it. Piss on both of them.

I was too.  That UAB/LSU game really made me miss the good ol' days!

[Amityvillehogger]

I couldnt help but root against them...haha

[Tammany Tom]

Deep down you had to be laughing your ass off. I know I was and it brings a smile to my face just thinking about it. Piss on both of them.

At least we made it to the dance floor. It's easy to laugh when you are standing next to the wall, watching others dance, and you have no ability to make it off the wall and get on the dancefloor.

[tophawg19]

USUALLY I PULL for the SEC but i like mike . SEC looks worse than i thought makes us look even worse . HELP .NEEDED. Love the GYM;BACKS  LOOK LEFT TO SEE WHY .

[sooie dog]

Deep down you had to be laughing your ass off. I know I was and it brings a smile to my face just thinking about it. Piss on both of them.

At least we made it to the dance floor. It's easy to laugh when you are standing next to the wall, watching others dance, and you have no ability to make it off the wall and get on the dancefloor.

Maybe but I'm still laughing. 

I think Stan's going to have to find a fat and ugly bitch if we are ever going to dance again.

[Tammany Tom]

I think Stan's going to have to find a fat and ugly bitch if we are ever going to dance again.

I don't think Stan will ever find the dance. I know that it is very obvious, but I think you guys hired the wrong coach when you canned Nolan. Mike Anderson is one hell of a good coach. He has done an outstanding job with UAB and especially this year after losing several of his best players last year. I realize that your administration wanted to go in a new direction with your program, but it seems that by hiring Nolan's right hand man, Nolan would have backed off and not sued and you would have put a better product on the floor.

[sooie dog]

I think Stan's going to have to find a fat and ugly bitch if we are ever going to dance again.

I don't think Stan will ever find the dance. I know that it is very obvious, but I think you guys hired the wrong coach when you canned Nolan. Mike Anderson is one hell of a good coach. He has done an outstanding job with UAB and especially this year after losing several of his best players last year. I realize that your administration wanted to go in a new direction with your program, but it seems that by hiring Nolan's right hand man, Nolan would have backed off and not sued and you would have put a better product on the floor.

That's right.  I'd give anything to have Anderson come back but it will never happen.  You have to love that style of basketball.  Not only are we bad but we are boring and bad. 

[tophawg19]

tAMMANY quit trying to apply common sense to our staff they are clueless .

[Hoggimistic]

No one complained about the Heath hire at the time.  It's real easy to look back now and say it was a mistake.  You guys are so smart.  I'd don't see how none of you are ADs. 

[Niels Boar]

Iowa's game will not and should not reflect on your feelings towards how Illinois will do in the tournament. Iowa barely made the tournament and finished 7th in the Big Ten with a 7-9 record. Iowa was the team that gave Illinois the most trouble in conference play (other than the loss to Ohio State) but Iowa has notoriously played up or down to their opponent all year depending upon the opponent (wins over Louisville, Texas, Texas Tech, Iowa State with Pierre Pierce and Michigan State with out him. The losses to NORTHWESTERN and Michigan with Pierre Pierce and the loss to Purdue without him.)

Don't use Iowa to assume things about Illinois or the rest of the conference for that matter. Iowa was too weird of a team this year to use as an example for anything.

It wasn't just the Iowa game.  I posted several weeks ago that I was skeptical of just how good Illinois was.  Their perimeter defense has been suspect all year, which is surprising considering their record.  Their frontline is also far from dominating.  They struggled against some less than prime time opponents like Arkansas and Missouri, too.  My assumption was that, if Illinois is not as good as their record, the Big 10 must not be having a banner year, same as the SEC.  UK was not a team that should have been disappointed about not going undefeated in conference.   The performances on Day 1 jibed with my preconceptions.  Farleigh Dickinson is not a team that should have been able to hang around against a great #1 seed.  Illinois will probably have a difficult time getting past OSU if both advance.  Now watch OSU crash and burn.

[sooie dog]

No one complained about the Heath hire at the time. It's real easy to look back now and say it was a mistake. You guys are so smart. I'd don't see how none of you are ADs.

Maybe you can follow Stan at his new job starting  November of 2006.  It's a shame he can't start sooner.

[tophawg19]

sorry but i was for mike all along .ilove the style of play .although i wasn't crazy about it during nolans first 2 years at that time it didn't make sense to me .i've learned a lot sense then .lack of talent can be overcome with a good system '.

[bknight33]

I think Stan's going to have to find a fat and ugly bitch if we are ever going to dance again.

I don't think Stan will ever find the dance. I know that it is very obvious, but I think you guys hired the wrong coach when you canned Nolan. Mike Anderson is one hell of a good coach. He has done an outstanding job with UAB and especially this year after losing several of his best players last year. I realize that your administration wanted to go in a new direction with your program, but it seems that by hiring Nolan's right hand man, Nolan would have backed off and not sued and you would have put a better product on the floor.

Which key players did Coach Anderson lose?  Do you know that most of those kids would not be eligible even at your fine institution of learning?

[bknight33]

sorry but i was for mike all along .ilove the style of play .although i wasn't crazy about it during nolans first 2 years at that time it didn't make sense to me .i've learned a lot sense then .lack of talent can be overcome with a good system '.

Who doesn't have talent?  Coach Anderson and Coach Richardson's systems are all based on talent.  You cannot run and jump, double team the ball in advantageous situations (ie the scrammble) without athletes.  What exactly is his offensive system?  Chunk it and go get it.  I do not like it, but it is effective for them.  Athletes baby, athletes.

[gatecrasher]

7. Heart and determination can overcome talent.

No it can't. If the talent is just a step up (a 12 seed beating a 5), it can get you to the Sweet 16, and once in a great while the Final 8. But it almost never beats top flight talent.

Yes it can.  How else does an inferior team (on paper) outplay the SEC West champs in just about every phase of the game??  How does any big underdog roll up their sleeves and get the job done??  HEART!!  Any human (or group of) can do anything they want to do...it's fact.  It takes hard work and determination that they absolutely refuse to lose.  That's how you overcome talent alone.  If the team with all the talent has no moxie they ain't gonna win anything! 

[Jim Harris]

Iowa's game will not and should not reflect on your feelings towards how Illinois will do in the tournament. Iowa barely made the tournament and finished 7th in the Big Ten with a 7-9 record. Iowa was the team that gave Illinois the most trouble in conference play (other than the loss to Ohio State) but Iowa has notoriously played up or down to their opponent all year depending upon the opponent (wins over Louisville, Texas, Texas Tech, Iowa State with Pierre Pierce and Michigan State with out him. The losses to NORTHWESTERN and Michigan with Pierre Pierce and the loss to Purdue without him.)

Don't use Iowa to assume things about Illinois or the rest of the conference for that matter. Iowa was too weird of a team this year to use as an example for anything.

It wasn't just the Iowa game. I posted several weeks ago that I was skeptical of just how good Illinois was. Their perimeter defense has been suspect all year, which is surprising considering their record. Their frontline is also far from dominating. They struggled against some less than prime time opponents like Arkansas and Missouri, too. My assumption was that, if Illinois is not as good as their record, the Big 10 must not be having a banner year, same as the SEC. UK was not a team that should have been disappointed about not going undefeated in conference. The performances on Day 1 jibed with my preconceptions. Farleigh Dickinson is not a team that should have been able to hang around against a great #1 seed. Illinois will probably have a difficult time getting past OSU if both advance. Now watch OSU crash and burn.

No one is that good this year. The entire field is overrated!

[Fatty McGee]

3) Coach Knight is still the best offensive coach in the country. His kids play extremely hard too. TTech runs a true motion offense. Four men without the ball moving with a purpose.

Stop the madness.

[Fatty McGee]

7. Heart and determination can overcome talent.

No it can't. If the talent is just a step up (a 12 seed beating a 5), it can get you to the Sweet 16, and once in a great while the Final 8. But it almost never beats top flight talent.

Yes it can. How else does an inferior team (on paper) outplay the SEC West champs in just about every phase of the game?? How does any big underdog roll up their sleeves and get the job done?? HEART!! Any human (or group of) can do anything they want to do...it's fact. It takes hard work and determination that they absolutely refuse to lose. That's how you overcome talent alone. If the team with all the talent has no moxie they ain't gonna win anything!

"Moxie"?  Ok.

Illinois hasn't played that well the last half of the season, kinda got bored.  They still won every game but one despite being the #1 target for every team.  Why?  Because their talent is superior.

Sure, the occasional upset will happen, but 9 times out of 10, talent wins over mere "heart."  You can't extrapolate one upset into a certainty.

[Macgyver_Hawg]

sorry but i was for mike all along .ilove the style of play .although i wasn't crazy about it during nolans first 2 years at that time it didn't make sense to me .i've learned a lot sense then .lack of talent can be overcome with a good system '.

Who doesn't have talent?  Coach Anderson and Coach Richardson's systems are all based on talent.  You cannot run and jump, double team the ball in advantageous situations (ie the scrammble) without athletes. What exactly is his offensive system? Chunk it and go get it. I do not like it, but it is effective for them. Athletes baby, athletes.

What's odd, the '94 national championship team really wasn't all that "chunk it".  I watched the old tapes of the Razorbacks beating Kentucky with Day and then the '94 Corliss team and the 2 are pretty different.

[jabohog]

Just because a team has talent, doesn't mean they have no heart, and as they draw nearer the championship you will see more and more talented players showing heart. Especially, if the coach is a good motivator.

[Biggus Piggus]

UAB simply showed how bad and thin LSU's backcourt is.  UAB forces an ungodly huge number of turnovers.  They don't do most anything else very well, but it is the ideal skill to have against LSU.  How can Brady sign the big kids he gets without having any really skilled guards?  None, zero, zippo.  It was maddening to me that we played slowball against LSU twice when a simple zone press would have ripped them a new one. L S U  S U C K S and W E  S U C K  A T  H A L F C O U R T  S L O W B A L L  S T A N  O N L Y  A N  I D I O T  W O U L D  B E L I E V E  O T H E R W I S E.

[tophawg19]

what do you really think your holding it all in .

[NEAHAWG]

Hope we can get some help for the team next year.  I am getting tired of the loosing.

[muslimsdonteatme]

No one complained about the Heath hire at the time.

I did, but you fools were too stupid to listen.

[msudawgs64]

9. Don't pick an SEC team, unless they're coached by Tubby Smith, to get past the 1st round.

I was 12/16 in my picks...no thanks to LSU and BAMA, who got completely ran into the ground by their opponents.

No joke there. What is this, the 4th year in a row a SEC team has been upset in round one? I believe the last 3 were Florida twice and MSU.

Don't forget, we could see MSU go down in round one as well. They are not that great at this point either.

I also think UK could go down to Cincy if Cincy plays like they did today. UK has no one to shut Maxiel down.

maybe round 2 against Duke but we stomped a mudhole in Stanford's ass tonight.  Might not be great but it sure is nice to be there and not lose to Butler. LOL. 

[WindyCityHog]

Sorry MSU....In my brackets, I had Stanford....but the Bulldogs walked that mudhole dry....I don't know what to make of it...

[msudawgs64]

Sorry MSU....In my brackets, I had Stanford....but the Bulldogs walked that mudhole dry....I don't know what to make of it...

LOL, no worries bud, if I was not such a homer sometimes I would have picked Stanford too.  I have picked Duke to beat us in the next round though I will say if Duke plays like they played tonight and we do the same you never know, damn optimism gets the best of me sometimes. LOL

[WindyCityHog]

At least you have something to hang your "optimism" thoughts on.....I have to rely on such things as picking Vermont as an upset....I live in a sad, sad world

[Biggus Piggus]

No one complained about the Heath hire at the time.

I did, but you fools were too stupid to listen.

I seem to recall another guy who was disappointed that we reached for a rookie instead of hiring somebody who deserved to be on the same podium with his predecessors.

[muslimsdonteatme]

No one complained about the Heath hire at the time.

I did, but you fools were too stupid to listen.

I seem to recall another guy who was disappointed that we reached for a rookie instead of hiring somebody who deserved to be on the same podium with his predecessors.

I wasn't the only one, but in hindsight that hire was even worse than I thought at the time.

[Biggus Piggus]

Agreed, it has turned out to be astonishingly bad.  The way he set himself up for this by failing to get any guards, and the way even his third team collapsed in the time of year when the good teams want it bad, all of this is very hard to swallow.

To me, he has [CENSORED] up so bad, one wonders why he would be trusted a minute longer.  Some of his decisions have been awful.

[pioneerhog]

I must very sadly admit that at the time I thought that Heath was a good hire. Damn I am ashamed to say that, everyone can go ahead and slam me I deserve it.

[tophawg19]

no smites i think we all caught the mister goodguy theme . we were glad to get anyone .FB hid the truth about some things that happened at kent st .

[Fatty McGee]

Agreed, it has turned out to be astonishingly bad. The way he set himself up for this by failing to get any guards, and the way even his third team collapsed in the time of year when the good teams want it bad, all of this is very hard to swallow.

To me, he has fricked up so bad, one wonders why he would be trusted a minute longer. Some of his decisions have been awful.

This is so stupid.  "Astonishingly bad"?  You're an idiot.  Astonishingly bad is 12-18.  We were just average at 18-12.

The amazing thing is that for being "astonishingly bad", we were 8 points from having a great season.  Some of you are just born to bitch. 

[Kevin]

out of those 18 wins name three of them that were quality

[Kevin]

watching lowery, another pg we missed on

[Fatty McGee]

out of those 18 wins name three of them that were quality

What does that have to do with the issue of what you thought our record would be before the season started?