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Jonathan Williams Found Not Guilty in Drunk Driving Case

Started by gdumont, June 08, 2017, 05:30:39 pm

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casken

Quote from: PorkSoda on June 11, 2017, 10:37:05 pm
right on, with such variances in how BAL affects people, you would think police would stick with field tests to determine impairment.  especially with pot being legal in some states now.



Anymore discretion is suffering a tremendous blow under the weight of liability and ever growing legislation.  And of course my favorite, court room gymnastics, it always takes a while to learn different judges and their leanings... We still give quite a few breaks across many areas in my neck of the woods. Usually many factors come into play, years in service of the officer, co operation by the person stopped, visibility of it (you would be surprised how many people complain when we do give breaks in one way or another)...etc.
"The human capacity to know the good and the right is distorted by the human will to fulfill desire."-Dallas Willard

HamSammich

There is a common myth being told here.... it actually is ok to drink and drive. It's legally not ok to drink impaired and drive.


Yuuug difference.

 

casken

Quote from: HamSammich on June 11, 2017, 11:16:30 pm
There is a common myth being told here.... it actually is ok to drink and drive. It's legally not ok to drink impaired and drive.


Yuuug difference.

FYI, it isn't legal in Arkansas to drink "while" driving at all...notta. Just so you don't get jammed up over it. I apologize if I misunderstood your post. You can have a drink and "then" drive if not too much.

The impairment is where the DWI comes in. The .08 comes in as a presumptive level. Technically it is supposed to be assumed the driver is impaired at that level or above, hence guilty. The presumptive level in an accident is half that. It often is not treated that way in actuality (court) but that is what the law states.

In my experience it is often a risky endeavor to assess one's own level of intoxication.
"The human capacity to know the good and the right is distorted by the human will to fulfill desire."-Dallas Willard

Dumb ole famrboy

Quote from: casken on June 11, 2017, 11:56:23 pm
FYI, it isn't legal in Arkansas to drink "while" driving at all...notta. Just so you don't get jammed up over it. I apologize if I misunderstood your post. You can have a drink and "then" drive if not too much.

The impairment is where the DWI comes in. The .08 comes in as a presumptive level. Technically it is supposed to be assumed the driver is impaired at that level or above, hence guilty. The presumptive level in an accident is half that. It often is not treated that way in actuality (court) but that is what the law states.

In my experience it is often a risky endeavor to assess one's own level of intoxication.
But you have individuals in this thread suggesting court mandated community service due to the fact of being charged with DUI.

DeltaBoy

Quote from: PorkRinds on June 11, 2017, 01:47:31 pm
We all have our opinions, officer.  He was not drunk driving according to the law that you are supposed to uphold. He had his day in court and proved he was not guilty. If you have an issue with people doing so, find another profession.

I'm with Porkrinds he fought the law and won. He was not drunk and that is all that matters. Your just going to Have to get over your po po butthurt!
If the South should lose, it means that the history of the heroic struggle will be written by the enemy, that our youth will be trained by Northern school teachers, will be impressed by all of the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors and our maimed veterans as fit subjects for derision.
-- Major General Patrick Cleburne
The Confederacy had no better soldiers
than the Arkansans--fearless, brave, and oftentimes courageous beyond
prudence. Dickart History of Kershaws Brigade.

KlubhouseKonnected

If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.

KlubhouseKonnected

Quote from: Pork Twain on June 11, 2017, 12:17:17 pm
I am so excited another Hog was irresponsible, put the lives of others at risk and got off.

Put lives at risk he did. So did you if you drove a car on n the public roads today. I'm hoping you weren't drunk either though.
If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.

KlubhouseKonnected

Quote from: casken on June 11, 2017, 03:20:10 pm
High horse...lol...wow! Seems you like to ride that pony.

Being found "not guilty" in a DWI case has little to do with whether one is drunk or not. You are out of your area of expertise. When convenience is valued over life and safety I would say you are on the wrong side of the argument here..

The same could be said in reverse. The conviction rates do not lie. The vast majority of those who are charged are convicted. Acquittals are exceedingly rare and generally stem from marginal cases lacking evidence of actual impairment.

You know that, I'd warrant.
If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.

KlubhouseKonnected

June 12, 2017, 10:13:29 am #58 Last Edit: June 14, 2017, 10:51:25 am by KlubhouseKonnected
It's interesting to think about, but not an excuse for getting drunk and choosing to get behind the wheel, the fact that we as a society have deemed it a crime to drive while "impaired" by alcohol, but with exceedingly few exceptions we condone driving with other impairments. Hell, we downright defend it as a right to drive with someone Impairments. See handicap plates. See also restricted license for drivers with poor eyesight. Notice that obese people, people who have been awake for 16 hours straight, people that have arthritis and people that like Gus Malzahn are all still free to drive as much as they like.

Its interesting to me at least
If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.

KlubhouseKonnected

Quote from: casken on June 11, 2017, 11:56:23 pm
FYI, it isn't legal in Arkansas to drink "while" driving at all...notta. Just so you don't get jammed up over it. I apologize if I misunderstood your post. You can have a drink and "then" drive if not too much.

The impairment is where the DWI comes in. The .08 comes in as a presumptive level. Technically it is supposed to be assumed the driver is impaired at that level or above, hence guilty. The presumptive level in an accident is half that. It often is not treated that way in actuality (court) but that is what the law states.

In my experience it is often a risky endeavor to assess one's own level of intoxication.

You are right on with that last sentence, especially when considering g the presumptive level of impairment
If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.

HamSammich

Well men... next time I get busted in Mexico with a car full of strippers, tequila, and blow I know where to find me some lawyers now.

hoglady

Quote from: RagingHawgOn on June 09, 2017, 09:38:34 am
I thought refusing to take a breathalyzer meant a presumption of guilt???  Maybe one of my drunk buddies told me that ha.

You'll get charged every time when you refuse. But if you fight the charge they still have to prove their case.
Inside every "older" person is a younger person wondering what the hell happened?

"Compassion for animals is intimately associated with goodness of character, and it may be confidently asserted that he who is cruel to animals cannot be a good man."
― Arthur Schopenhauer, The Basis of Morality

KlubhouseKonnected

Quote from: hoglady on June 12, 2017, 08:48:55 pm
You'll get charged every time when you refuse. But if you fight the charge they still have to prove their case.


Refusal is its own stand alone charge and what we call a "righteous refusal" pretty much has no defense. Occasionally people won't refuse but they either cannot provide a sample or pretend they are unable to provide a sample leading to the charge of refusal, and that's really the only common way the lawyers have something to fight about on that score.
Fight about
If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.

 

KlubhouseKonnected

Quote from: HamSammich on June 12, 2017, 04:15:40 pm
Well men... next time I get busted in Mexico with a car full of strippers, tequila, and blow I know where to find me some lawyers now.

Not sure how much good I could do you but I did take three years of Spanish 1.
If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.


Stephen Greene

Quote from: sevenof400 on June 09, 2017, 12:00:18 pm
I think I may have actually underestimated that price......I try not to order beer when dining out these days unless its on some sort of special.

Google says Guinness is good for your heart


in

lahawg1

Here in Louisiana if he would have refused the breath test when he got to booking they would have stuck him with a needle and drawn blood. Then there would be no doubt as to if he was legally drunk or not. The sheriff departments here have court orders to draw blood. 


KlubhouseKonnected

Quote from: lahawg1 on June 13, 2017, 08:10:59 am
Here in Louisiana if he would have refused the breath test when he got to booking they would have stuck him with a needle and drawn blood. Then there would be no doubt as to if he was legally drunk or not. The sheriff departments here have court orders to draw blood. 



They have to go get warrants though now. You aren't telling me that the have some kind of standing "general warrant" for refusals are you?
If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.

gchamblee

Quote from: KlubhouseKonnected on June 13, 2017, 09:27:54 am
They have to go get warrants though now. You aren't telling me that the have some kind of standing "general warrant" for refusals are you?

I would hate to think that a police force has a general  standing warrant that would allow them to draw blood from me without my consent.

KlubhouseKonnected

Quote from: gchamblee on June 13, 2017, 09:51:30 am
I would hate to think that a police force has a general  standing warrant that would allow them to draw blood from me without my consent.

Until last summer warrantless non-consensual blood draws were becoming fairly common practice in quite a few states.

Apparently there are a lot of smart people out there that need the U.S. Supreme Court to tell them that we have a fourth amendment right to privacy in the inside of our bodies....
If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.

Wildhog

Quote from: sevenof400 on June 13, 2017, 10:27:09 am
I'm going to post a question about this:

...over in the politics forum here in a moment so we don't totally side track this thread. 

The fourth amendment is constantly, blatantly, violated, and very few seem to care.  Drives me nuts.
Arkansas Razorbacks Football National Championships:
1909/1964/1965/1977

KlubhouseKonnected

Quote from: Wildhog on June 13, 2017, 10:32:05 am
The fourth amendment is constantly, blatantly, violated, and very few seem to care.  Drives me nuts.

I love fourth amendment law. It's fascinating. You are right also.
If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.

hoglady

Quote from: KlubhouseKonnected on June 12, 2017, 09:12:44 pm
Refusal is its own stand alone charge and what we call a "righteous refusal" pretty much has no defense. Occasionally people won't refuse but they either cannot provide a sample or pretend they are unable to provide a sample leading to the charge of refusal, and that's really the only common way the lawyers have something to fight about on that score.
Fight about

Don't you have the right to request a blood test instead of a breath test?
I would trust a blood test over a breath test.
Inside every "older" person is a younger person wondering what the hell happened?

"Compassion for animals is intimately associated with goodness of character, and it may be confidently asserted that he who is cruel to animals cannot be a good man."
― Arthur Schopenhauer, The Basis of Morality

lahawg1

Quote from: KlubhouseKonnected on June 13, 2017, 09:27:54 am
They have to go get warrants though now. You aren't telling me that the have some kind of standing "general warrant" for refusals are you?


Quote from: KlubhouseKonnected on June 13, 2017, 10:17:56 am
Until last summer warrantless non-consensual blood draws were becoming fairly common practice in quite a few states.



That I don't know, I had someone I know refuse to take a breath test 2-3 years ago and when he got to booking they were less than sympathetic when they drew blood on him.

 

popcornhog

Quote from: PorkRinds on June 11, 2017, 01:47:31 pm
We all have our opinions, officer.  He was not drunk driving according to the law that you are supposed to uphold. He had his day in court and proved he was not guilty. If you have an issue with people doing so, find another profession.

That's horrible. Drunk driving is one of the worst crimes IMO.

That said, it is my understanding that JWILL was not drunk driving.
WPS

PorkRinds

Quote from: popcornhog on June 13, 2017, 11:28:52 pm
That's horrible. Drunk driving is one of the worst crimes IMO.

That said, it is my understanding that JWILL was not drunk driving.

Exactly.

casken

Quote from: Wildhog on June 13, 2017, 10:32:05 am
The fourth amendment is constantly, blatantly, violated, and very few seem to care.  Drives me nuts.

It is an ongoing question of reasonableness within a tug of war between individual rights and compelling interest of the government. Some of the limitations drive me nuts but I wouldn't have it any other way. I am glad there are boundaries the government cannot cross. They are getting blurred though and that can be quite concerning.
"The human capacity to know the good and the right is distorted by the human will to fulfill desire."-Dallas Willard

KlubhouseKonnected

Quote from: lahawg1 on June 13, 2017, 07:44:03 pm

That I don't know, I had someone I know refuse to take a breath test 2-3 years ago and when he got to booking they were less than sympathetic when they drew blood on him.

Ah, ok. The Supreme Court did not weigh in on that until about a year ago as I recall.

By the way, I am just now realizing how badly I butcher my writing when using this new iPhone.
If Auburn is dirty so is Gus. You can't have it both ways. Deal with it.