Wally Hall confirms what we all know We are behind the 8 ball on recruiting.

[DeltaBoy]

http://www.arkansasonline.com/news/2016/nov/16/location-s-vital-as-arkansas-tries-to-a/?f=sports

There is no doubt that part of what is wrong with the Arkansas Razorbacks is geography.

First, they play in the Western Division of the SEC, the undisputed toughest division in all of football.

All four of their losses -- bad ones, too -- were to ranked teams in the SEC West.

[Hogwild]

There is no doubt that part of what is wrong with the Arkansas Razorbacks is geography.

Our location is a handicap, but it is one that can be over come. Arkansas ranks #26 in the Division 1 football players produced, basically the middle of the pack.  But we are the only P5 school in the state, our recruiting should be better than what it has been.

Louisville, Washington, Washington State, Wisconsin, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Utah, Colorado, West Virginia, Nebraska and Boise State are all in similar or worse situations with regard to location than us.  Yet all of those teams are ranked, most in the Top 15. Now before you say that those teams don't play in the SEC West, how many of those 11 teams would we be favored against on a neutral field?

[sowmonella]

Our location is a handicap, but it is one that can be over come. Arkansas ranks #26 in the Division 1 football players produced, basically the middle of the pack.  But we are the only P5 school in the state, our recruiting should be better than what it has been.

Louisville, Washington, Washington State, Wisconsin, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Utah, Colorado, West Virginia, Nebraska and Boise State are all in similar or worse situations with regard to location than us.  Yet all of those teams are ranked, most in the Top 15. Now before you say that those teams don't play in the SEC West, how of those 11 teams would we be favored against on a neutral field?

um......... 8.

[Hawgar The Horrible]

Our location is a handicap, but it is one that can be over come. Arkansas ranks #26 in the Division 1 football players produced, basically the middle of the pack.  But we are the only P5 school in the state, our recruiting should be better than what it has been.

Louisville, Washington, Washington State, Wisconsin, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Utah, Colorado, West Virginia, Nebraska and Boise State are all in similar or worse situations with regard to location than us.  Yet all of those teams are ranked, most in the Top 15. Now before you say that those teams don't play in the SEC West, how many of those 11 teams would we be favored against on a neutral field?

"Division 1 football players" does not equate to SEC level talent. And in Arkansas it's not even close.

[Piggfoot]

Our location is a handicap, but it is one that can be over come. Arkansas ranks #26 in the Division 1 football players produced, basically the middle of the pack.  But we are the only P5 school in the state, our recruiting should be better than what it has been.

Louisville, Washington, Washington State, Wisconsin, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Utah, Colorado, West Virginia, Nebraska and Boise State are all in similar or worse situations with regard to location than us.  Yet all of those teams are ranked, most in the Top 15. Now before you say that those teams don't play in the SEC West, how many of those 11 teams would we be favored against on a neutral field?

People on this site are always comparing apples to oranges, giving data from other confrences to compare with the SEC. You can't compare success in other confrences with the SEC. Particularly the West. Now to your answer. We may not be favored but I believe we could win all with the exception of Washington.

[NaturalStateReb]

The problem is easy to identify.  Part of what Arkansas is paying millions for, theoretically, is a solution.

[hogsanity]

"Division 1 football players" does not equate to SEC level talent. And in Arkansas it's not even close.

in the espn 300 for 2017 Just in the top 100 the state of Al has 2, TN 4, LA 12, Fla 20, MS 3, La 3, Ar 1.

But here is the rest of the story in the top 300 total, the state of Ar has 2, that is TWO out of the top 300 recruits. I did not even count how many the other states have in 101-300.

[scorekeeper]

People on this site are always comparing apples to oranges, giving data from other confrences to compare with the SEC. You can't compare success in other confrences with the SEC. Particularly the West. Now to your answer. We may not be favored but I believe we could win all with the exception of Washington.

I don't see us beating Louisville this season. The Hogs are over achievers when you look at out recruiting rankings versus the on field performance. We beat Florida and Ole Miss which are games that we shouldn't have won just looking at recruiting rankings. We also beat a TCU team that historically overachieved in their conference maybe had more to do with their offense and the lack of emphasis on defense in the Big "12". I think we could beat Washington, Oklahoma State, Utah, and Colorado.

[Hawgar The Horrible]

in the espn 300 for 2017 Just in the top 100 the state of Al has 2, TN 4, LA 12, Fla 20, MS 3, La 3, Ar 1.

But here is the rest of the story in the top 300 total, the state of Ar has 2, that is TWO out of the top 300 recruits. I did not even count how many the other states have in 101-300.

101-300
SC 2
MS 4
TN 5
LA 10
GA 23
FL 24

[Hog Fan...DOH!]

Here's what we need:  some new coach to come in here and promise championships.  I don't care about the plan.  If he says it, I'll believe it.

[Swine-as-wine]

in the espn 300 for 2017 Just in the top 100 the state of Al has 2, TN 4, LA 12, Fla 20, MS 3, La 3, Ar 1.

But here is the rest of the story in the top 300 total, the state of Ar has 2, that is TWO out of the top 300 recruits. I did not even count how many the other states have in 101-300.

How many are from the state of Texas, where we USED to get most of our studs?

[hobhog]

How many times can this be posted? Over and over and over and over and.....

[arslp]

Harbaugh could come here and have a top 5 class the next year. Is something like that what it takes? Is Michigan that much richer than us? Tens of millions later and we get curbstomped 56-3, 38-10 and 49-30? I'm tired of seeing the hogs get humiliated

[Piggfoot]

How many are from the state of Texas, where we USED to get most of our studs?

That's Used to. That changed when we went to the SEC. People disregard the fact that many and maybe most kids and parents want them to go to school close enough for a half a day drive. When we played in Texas, those Texas kids' parents had many opportunities to see their sons. Frank was looking at the money. I believe we should have gone to the Big 8 but that is water under the bridge.

[Piggfoot]

Harbaugh could come here and have a top 5 class the next year. Is something like that what it takes? Is Michigan that much richer than us? Tens of millions later and we get curbstomped 56-3, 38-10 and 49-30? I'm tired of seeing the hogs get humiliated

Where do people like you get this crap. Michigan had nine four stars and 46 three stars in the 2016 class. You should have never given up paper dolls.

[Biggus Piggus]

I DON'T WANT TO SEE EXCUSES LIKE THIS CRAP.

If our coaches are bleeding out this ssshhhhiiitttt, fire the lot of them. Today.

Let's try managing a competent recruiting process for several years in a row, before we [CENSORED] surrender FFS.

Let's recruit players to fill all the right roles and not go multiple seasons without signing players for some positions.

Let's put players in the right positions on the field.

Let's try recruiting a real rush end and a real middle linebacker and real safeties.

Let's bring in offensive tackles, guards and centers, not tweeners we have to shoehorn into positions.

And let's [CENSORED] catch up to the rest of the goddamned world and bring in a run-pass quarterback, especially when some great ones are begging to be [CENSORED] recruited damn it all to hell!

[arslp]

You really disagree that somebody like Harbaugh could dramatically improve recruiting?

[DeltaBoy]

How many times can this be posted? Over and over and over and over and.....

It will be restated until we get it fixed.

[zebradynasty]

It's pretty simple we need to do better getting recruits from TX and LA PERIOD. Doesn't matter what coach we get if he can't build that area as a strong recruiting base, UA will continue to struggle against SEC West power houses. A lot of people refuse to accept the fact this isn't 1960's you can't take teams with average to below average talent, size and speed coach them up and go beat teams like Bama. I mean you might catch a team like Bama slipping 1-2 times a decade but most years...

So our mission should be to close the gap we probably won't ever have as much talent as Bama but we can get closer and then with good coaching and a few breaks...we can be in the game in the 4 quarter.   

[Torqued pork]

That Wally is one sharp dude. Not even the smallest of details gets by that guy.

[zebradynasty]

You really disagree that somebody like Harbaugh could dramatically improve recruiting?

Why would somebody like Harbaugh come coach at Arkansas?

[arslp]

$$$$$$$$$$$

[zebradynasty]

$$$$$$$$$$$

It is reported that Harbugh's contract with Michigan could be as high as $9 million! UA won't/can't match that and some point money and the likely hood of failure would cross out any chance of a coach the caliber of Harbugh coming to Arkansas. Malzahn is about as close as we can get and that's only because of his Arkansas roots.

[hogsanity]

You really disagree that somebody like Harbaugh could dramatically improve recruiting?

Not to top 5 status, although that still might leave us 4th in the sec.

Where do people like you get this crap. Michigan had nine four stars and 46 three stars in the 2016 class. You should have never given up paper dolls.

Can't discuss this with some here. There sole mid set is " just coach em up, we'd be undefeated if the players just had the want to in them". They probably think every player on Harbaugh's roster comes from somewhere other than Michigan. HAlf their roster is Michigan kids, and over 60% is either michigan or states that border michigan.

Want to don't get it done when the other team is just made up of better players.

[Biggus Piggus]

You really disagree that somebody like Harbaugh could dramatically improve recruiting?

Arkansas is not [CENSORED] GETTING A HARBAUGH YOU WEEZILS!

Somebody has to build up a program. That in theory is the right idea. Now we need a coaching staff that is capable of doing it. Looks like the defensive staff needs to be massively reorganized, at best. On offense, we cannot tell whether we are headed the right way with the current OL coach, not with this two-deep. Will next year be better? Could be. But it will require a number of players to get stronger and learn.

Having a better offensive line without Skipper and likely Ragnow will be a challenge.

C Should be Rogers or Raulerson. Both should be improved.
G Froholdt should be much better. Gibson might be better. Heinrich should be ready to compete. Need more, powerful guards.
T Wallace should be improved. Jackson might be ready to go. Ramirez should be in the mix. Hall? Getting left tackle right will be a very important challenge.

Kirby Adcock and Shane Clenin are going to be midterm-eligible, but you still would like to see all the OL recruits redshirt.

[IronHog]

I DON'T WANT TO SEE EXCUSES LIKE THIS CRAP.

If our coaches are bleeding out this ssshhhhiiitttt, fire the lot of them. Today.

Let's try managing a competent recruiting process for several years in a row, before we [CENSORED] surrender FFS.

Let's recruit players to fill all the right roles and not go multiple seasons without signing players for some positions.

Let's put players in the right positions on the field.

Let's try recruiting a real rush end and a real middle linebacker and real safeties.

Let's bring in offensive tackles, guards and centers, not tweeners we have to shoehorn into positions.

And let's [CENSORED] catch up to the rest of the goddamned world and bring in a run-pass quarterback, especially when some great ones are begging to be [CENSORED] recruited damn it all to hell!

That means you might outperform recruiting rankings.

The current approach of loading up on TEs and TE/DE hybrids that don't actually play and naming DTs starters at positions they didn't earn is much better......

[Biggus Piggus]

BTW if Auburn got tired of Malzahn...would you make the switch?

[hogsanity]

Arkansas is not [CENSORED] GETTING A HARBAUGH YOU WEEZILS!

Somebody has to build up a program.

which means giving them 10 years because you can't build a PROGRAM in less time. You can build a team, you can work toward having all the pieces in place to have a really good team in year 4 or 5, but it takes a decade to build a program. Problem is, fans do not want to wait that long. They think a new coach should have them in the title game in 3 years.

[arslp]

No but after 25 mil or so I dont think we should be getting beat 56-3

[HogInThaGrove]

BTW if Auburn got tired of Malzahn...would you make the switch?

I would.

I think Bielema is a good guy.  But his laid back approach doesn't appear to get the best out of his players or his coaches and breeds inconsistency within the program.  I love the fact he cares deeply for the kids and I wish like hell he were winning, but the inconsistency in both on the field performance and recruiting is disconcerting to say the least.

[hogsanity]

The coach, WHOEVER it is, can not make SEC caliber linebackers come here. He can't make db's with sec speed come here. The issue is, 99 times out of 100 the coach at Arkansas is going to have to go out of state to get those players. Which means those players, if they come from Texas, are going to have to turn down, TX, A&M, Baylor, Houston, probably OU, LSU, and others to come here. If it is some kid out of LA, he will have to choose us probably over LSU, A&M, ole miss and who know who else ( all closer to home ). Same for FLa kids. And I am not even counting on Bama being involved in wanting them.

[hogsanity]

I would.

I think Bielema is a good guy.  But his laid back approach doesn't appear to get the best out of his players or his coaches and breeds inconsistency within the program.  I love the fact he cares deeply for the kids and I wish like hell he were winning, but the inconsistency in both on the field performance and recruiting is disconcerting to say the least.

Aub just lost 13-7 to a terrible GA team, Aub has been terribly inconsistent since Gus took over.

[Biggus Piggus]

No but after 25 mil or so I dont think we should be getting beat 56-3

Mississippi State has Dan Mullen and just got beat 51-3. Their fricking lost their season opener to South Alabama. Mullen is in his eighth season at Starkville. They won 19 games in the past two seasons. You'd think that would help their recruiting.

They lost Dak? Fine, we lost Brandon Allen. They are 4-6. Do you think anybody in Starkville wants to dump Mullen? Not a chance. They pray they don't lose him every offseason.

[Sportster365]

Alabama for example is a state with a population of 4.8 million people. Arkansas' at 3M. When we consider that Alabama has 2 major Div. 1 programs in the state battling over the same crop of in-state players it marginalizes the states overall population advantage over Arkansas' and the odds in turn favor the Univ. of Arkansas.

We're not Oregon. Its a lot easier to get kids from Florida to come to Arkansas than it would be to get them Oregon. We're not asking kids to travel clear across the country to come play for us. Nationally, we're actually in a great spot. We're also surrounded by 6 states. Texas, Louisiana, Mississippi, Tennessee, Missouri, Oklahoma. If we can improve the brand of our program then we can go into these states and bring out some of their best players.

There's absolutely nothing interesting about playing football in the state of Alabama for a young high school kid. But kids go there because they've reestablished a winning tradition. We're one great hire away from establishing similar success here in Arkansas.

[Biggus Piggus]

BTW it took Mullen until year six to have a season above .500 in the SEC. Think they were wrong for sticking with him?

[arslp]

Yes

[Biggus Piggus]

The coach, WHOEVER it is, can not make SEC caliber linebackers come here. He can't make db's with sec speed come here.

That is a load of crap. They don't have to be 5-stars to be SEC quality. It is not that hard. Bielema and staff did not put proper focus on LB recruiting until last year, so now they have a 1-year streak. They are still playing catchup.

[Biggus Piggus]

Yes

Then you know nothing. Mullen took over a team that had had seven losing seasons in eight years. Arkansas has not had more than two consecutive losing seasons since before World War II.

[Pork Twain]

I do not want to see BB go away anytime soon.  Love this guy but want Rhoads as our DC.

[Southpointhog]

How many times can this be posted? Over and over and over and over and.....

Yes!

[thefisher]

You really disagree that somebody like Harbaugh could dramatically improve recruiting?

Improve some, yes.  Improve to compete on recruiting levels with Bama, LSU, Michigan, or Ohio State... no. Not no how ... not no way.

Here is the key as to why Harbaugh can recruit over the top at Michigan but would not do so at Arkansas -

in THIS YEARS CLASS ALONE these are the numbers-

Michigan has 24 recruits rated at 4*-5* within about 175 miles of campus.
Arkansas has  2 recruits rated at 4*-5* within about 175 miles of campus.
                                                (One 4* pledged to Hogs  and one is academically ineligible to play)

Michigan further has 172 recruits rated at 3*-5* within about 175 miles of campus.
Arkansas only has 15 recruits rated at 3*-5* WITHIN THE ENTIRE STATE!

If that number has been fairly consistent then over the 4 year recruiting cycle -

Michigan would have 96 recruits rated at 4*-5* within about 175 miles of campus.
Arkansas would have  8 recruits rated at 4*-5* within about 175 miles of campus.

Michigan would have 688 recruits rated at 3*-5* within about 175 miles of campus.
Arkansas would have  32  recruits rated at 3*-5* within the entire state!

Do you think CBP or CBB might have been able to have better recruiting if there were -
LITERALLY 12 TIMES THE NUMBER OF ELITE 4*-5* RECRUITS WITHIN 175 MILES OF CAMPUS IN A RECRUITING CYCLE!!

Do you think CBP or CBB might have been able to have better recruiting if there were  -
LITERALLY 21.5 TIMES AS MANY 3*-5* RECRUITS WITHIN 175 MILES OF CAMPUS IN A RECRUITING CYCLE!!

[colbs]

Our location is a handicap, but it is one that can be over come. Arkansas ranks #26 in the Division 1 football players produced, basically the middle of the pack.  But we are the only P5 school in the state, our recruiting should be better than what it has been.

Louisville, Washington, Washington State, Wisconsin, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Utah, Colorado, West Virginia, Nebraska and Boise State are all in similar or worse situations with regard to location than us.  Yet all of those teams are ranked, most in the Top 15. Now before you say that those teams don't play in the SEC West, how many of those 11 teams would we be favored against on a neutral field?

I would bet that Arkansas would probably be ranked if they played in any other conference besides the SEC.  Heck if Arkansas was in the east they probably are ranked.  Arkansas' recruiting classes rank usually in around 20-25.  The problem is that 5 teams in the same division recruiting classes are ranked higher than Arkansas. 

IMO the big difference is depth between the teams that recruit in the top vs everyone else.  Any of the teams listed above would have a worse record if they played Arkansas' schedule and Arkansas would probably have a better record if they had any of their schedules.

[Biggus Piggus]

I do not want to see BB go away anytime soon.  Love this guy but want Rhoads as our DC.

How Bielema manages the next few weeks is pretty important, I think. Seems like a lot of things are going on that we can't see.

[ur]

No excuse to not recruit well in Texas. Over half of each freshman class at UA are Texans. Plenty of connections. Texas license plates everywhere here in Fay. Texas Recruits should feel at home plus they get to play in the conf. most likely to get them in the league.

[IronHog]

BTW if Auburn got tired of Malzahn...would you make the switch?

He'd find the Charles Clays and get the Dyers on the field.....

[IronHog]

No excuse to not recruit well in Texas. Over half of each freshman class at UA are Texans. Plenty of connections. Texas license plates everywhere here in Fay. Texas Recruits should feel at home plus they get to play in the conf. most likely to et them in the league.

Texas, OU, etc can't compete with Deep South teams....


Even ATM with their 5*'s gets knocked around pretty bad

[colbs]

Improve some, yes.  Improve to compete on recruiting levels with Bama, LSU, Michigan, or Ohio State... no. Not no how ... not no way.

Here is the key as to why Harbaugh can recruit over the top at Michigan but would not do so at Arkansas -

in THIS YEARS CLASS ALONE these are the numbers-

Michigan has 24 recruits rated at 4*-5* within about 175 miles of campus.
Arkansas has  2 recruits rated at 4*-5* within about 175 miles of campus.
                                                (One 4* pledged to Hogs  and one is academically ineligible to play)

Michigan further has 172 recruits rated at 3*-5* within about 175 miles of campus.
Arkansas only has 15 recruits rated at 3*-5* WITHIN THE ENTIRE STATE!

If that number has been fairly consistent then over the 4 year recruiting cycle -

Michigan would have 96 recruits rated at 4*-5* within about 175 miles of campus.
Arkansas would have  8 recruits rated at 4*-5* within about 175 miles of campus.

Michigan would have 688 recruits rated at 3*-5* within about 175 miles of campus.
Arkansas would have  32  recruits rated at 3*-5* within the entire state!

Do you think CBP or CBB might have been able to have better recruiting if there were -
LITERALLY 12 TIMES THE NUMBER OF ELITE 4*-5* RECRUITS WITHIN 175 MILES OF CAMPUS IN A RECRUITING CYCLE!!

Do you think CBP or CBB might have been able to have better recruiting if there were  -
LITERALLY 21.5 TIMES AS MANY 3*-5* RECRUITS WITHIN 175 MILES OF CAMPUS IN A RECRUITING CYCLE!!

This.  Without cheating there is probably no coach except maybe Saban that would start pulling top 10 classes at Arkansas.  It's been awhile back but I read where the majority of recruits sign with schools within a certain distance from where they live.  Of course there are some that go way off but majority don't go very home from where they are from.  Louisiana has about 70-80 kids sign with P5 schools.  Arkansas in a good year 12-13. Think about that.  How hard is it to get 25 really good players out of that many?  Not to mention they usually get some players from Texas. 

[hogsanity]

That is a load of crap. They don't have to be 5-stars to be SEC quality. It is not that hard. Bielema and staff did not put proper focus on LB recruiting until last year, so now they have a 1-year streak. They are still playing catchup.

So it is a load of crap that he can't make players sign here? So you are saying he can force players to sign here?


where did I say 5 stars? I said SEC calibre. He could only focus on so many areas at once. When he started here we were thin EVERYWHERE.

[ur]

Texas, OU, etc can't compete with Deep South teams....


Even ATM with their 5*'s gets knocked around pretty bad

Nobody can compete with Bama with their stud freshman QB from Texas and their other athletes. All the other schools from the deep south about even with Big 12. All kinda down right now because of weak QB play in both conferences.

[hogsanity]

Alabama for example is a state with a population of 4.8 million people. Arkansas' at 3M. When we consider that Alabama has 2 major Div. 1 programs in the state battling over the same crop of in-state players it marginalizes the states overall population advantage over Arkansas' and the odds in turn favor the Univ. of Arkansas.

We're not Oregon. Its a lot easier to get kids from Florida to come to Arkansas than it would be to get them Oregon. We're not asking kids to travel clear across the country to come play for us. Nationally, we're actually in a great spot. We're also surrounded by 6 states. Texas, Louisiana, Mississippi, Tennessee, Missouri, Oklahoma. If we can improve the brand of our program then we can go into these states and bring out some of their best players.

There's absolutely nothing interesting about playing football in the state of Alabama for a young high school kid. But kids go there because they've reestablished a winning tradition. We're one great hire away from establishing similar success here in Arkansas.

It is not just the in state kids. Look how many high level recruits are close by in neighboring states.