Art Briles released by Baylor

[ricepig]

There needs to be a separate thread for all things UT/Butch Jones related.

Yep, this is the pile on Baylor thread.

[PonderinHog]

Yep, this is the pile on Baylor thread.

Who gonna win the Fulmer Cup now

[rljjr]

The Baylor fans are LIVID.

This gave me a chuckle. LIVID that their coach was fired, but very much silent -- as in to consent -- regarding Baylor's passive encouragement of all kinds of nefarious doings by football players, to include sexual assault.

At least now the odds of a sign saying the following are much less:

Baylor
Enables
Athletes
Raping
Students

[upperdeck_hawg]

Ole Miss is next. I cant wait.

[HamSammich]

This had to happen.

The crappy thing is that Briles will be coaching Texas, LSU, or Auburn next year... he needs a coaching death penalty.

[Karma]

This had to happen.

The crappy thing is that Briles will be coaching Texas, LSU, or Auburn next year... he needs a coaching death penalty.

I don't think Briles will ever have a P5 job again.  He's toxic.

[razorhead94]

I don't quite understand the whole Gus to Baylor thing...why?  He's at an SEC West school and why would he go to a school that is about to get the hammer?

[Justifiable Hogicide]

Gus and Briles are big buddies. Part of an ex-high school coaches clique along with the stained Hugh Freeze.
Wouldn't be surprised to see Briles end up on Gus's staff for a while IF Gus could get away with it.

[kodiakisland]

This had to happen.

The crappy thing is that Briles will be coaching Texas, LSU, or Auburn next year... he needs a coaching death penalty.

No, he needs to do a little time for his involvement for propagating and covering up crimes.  I hope the justice department takes a long look at what went on there and punishes all who had a hand in it.

[ALLVOL]

My original statement about you misdirecting from the over all narrative was in NO way about Tennessee.  Call me wrong all you want, asking football questions about a sexual assault investigation is what got Baylor into this mess to begin with.

So to recap, you said  "for those of you happy about this should realize it only helps Texas"  To which I say I don't care what football team it helps or hurts, they did the right thing.  Maybe if they had cared more about doing the right thing from the beginning instead about helping the football team they could have prevented more people from being hurt.  If your first reaction to Baylor firing Briles for helping to cover up multiple sexual assaults is to think of what other football teams this helps or hurts then the narrative hasn't changed.

You misunderstood my post big time. My post was clearly aimed at those saying "good maybe UA can get their recruits". You took it wrong.

[ricepig]

There has been ZERO claim of UT or KPD cover up at all. All players accused were dismissed immediately. So again you're just wrong. Baylor did none of that. So as I stated the two are not even close to being the same.

Recruited rapist?

[ALLVOL]

Recruited rapist?

No

[Vantage 8 dude]

Baylor players already tweeting about their soon to be former coach.  Presser at 11am

Ahh.....and just in time the Hooter Nutt made a major comment the other day about how he'd really prefer coaching in the Big 12. Houston, come on down and lead those Baptist bruisers to wonderful glory!!

[SemperHawg]

You misunderstood my post big time. My post was clearly aimed at those saying "good maybe UA can get their recruits". You took it wrong.

And you are still misunderstanding mine...The only football team that matters here is Baylor's and what price all of those wins cost.  Arkansas, Texas who the hell ever are irrelevant to what's going on at Baylor in this instance.  Until that thought process changes nothing is fixed.

[Rzbakfromwaybak]

HAHAHAHAHA ... you KNOW he's already got Sexton calling.

Lol.  Yeah, Hootie way be in Waco by now.....just happened to be passing thru the area...

[Wayne Watson]

Art was just discussed on Special Report on FOX News.  LMAO!

[ALLVOL]

And you are still misunderstanding mine...The only football team that matters here is Baylor's and what price all of those wins cost.  Arkansas, Texas who the hell ever are irrelevant to what's going on at Baylor in this instance.  Until that thought process changes nothing is fixed.

I don't disagree with that at all.
But my post was to those who were discussing Baylors recruits.

[Hoggish1]

Its the same thing here with the Petrino thing...how many of the Razorback media couldn't preach loud enough about the genius of Bobby.  The minute he is gone, all you hear about is what a recruiting liability he was and how they never liked him anyways. 

I am by no means taking up for Petrino, I just don't like the piling on mentality.  Say what you want about the guy now, but no one had a problem when we were winning 21 games in two years and finishing in the top ten.

Right.  But when he couldn't win 21 games because he thought only of himself, that's when people realized that regardless of his coaching ability, he screwed everyone, not just the blond...

[hoglady]

Sort of ironic for Kenneth Starr of all people to be knee deep in this mess.
Glad to know that my initial reaction to him years ago was spot on.

[Hogfaniam]

Seen at the presser

back to the .257 winning percentage

[East TN HAWG]

Briles won big at Baylor.  His winning combined with TCU winning and A$M move to the SEC assisted in keeping Texas down.  I really enjoy watching Texas lose 5 or more games a season.  I wish it was 12.

Now the Art is out of the picture, I feel that Texas will have an easier path to find success.  It may take two seasons and a coaching change, but it is much more likely now.  I hope whoever replaces Art will find enough success to keep the foot down on Texas.  The tea sips are where they deserve to be at the bottom of the Big12.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

Its the same thing here with the Petrino thing...how many of the Razorback media couldn't preach loud enough about the genius of Bobby.  The minute he is gone, all you hear about is what a recruiting liability he was and how they never liked him anyways. 

I am by no means taking up for Petrino, I just don't like the piling on mentality.  Say what you want about the guy now, but no one had a problem when we were winning 21 games in two years and finishing in the top ten.

It's not exactly the same thing and maybe part of the reason you didn't hear more criticism of Petrino was because,

1) he wasn't here long enough for anyone to realize what the future might have brought and in fact, left just before the crows came home to roost in recruiting,
2) or maybe those players were just a fit for his system and not a good transitional mix for a different system,
3) unless HC's have a prolonged tenure like that of HDN, there isn't time for a combination of disappointment and distrust to grow to such a level that they are willing to be tremendously negative of a sitting HC,
4) and also, the media was just getting clued in to some of his antics (the FU at Les Miles on Natl T.V., the lack of discipline within the program, alienating and getting cross-wise with Cotton Bowl Officials to the extent that we allegedly would never be invited back as long as he was the HC).

If we are to believe that which is being reported, Art Briles purposely looked the other way about events involving his players that negatively impacted the lives of other people outside the program, just to continue winning.

Hindsight is always 20-20, but Petrino's actions and mistakes aren't anywhere on the level of that which is being reported about Briles and the Baylor program. Is it really "piling on" when it is the truth? I'm pretty sure we still don't know the whole truth of what happened at Baylor.

[GoHogs1091]

Ole Miss is next. I cant wait.

There could be several jobs open after this upcoming season. 

Ole Miss-  If NCAA puts them on probation, I don't see how Freeze can survive.

Oklahoma-  The Mixon tape could cause a huge uproar, followed with 2 or 3 losses, and Stoops could be out.

Tennessee-  Off the field problems, and Jones not winning enough.

Texas A&M-  Sumlin not winning enough.

[Pig in the Pokey]

This gave me a chuckle. LIVID that their coach was fired, but very much silent -- as in to consent -- regarding Baylor's passive encouragement of all kinds of nefarious doings by football players, to include sexual assault.

At least now the odds of a sign saying the following are much less:

Baylor
Enables
Athletes
Raping
Students

you got it exactly right.

[Pig in the Pokey]

And you are still misunderstanding mine...The only football team that matters here is Baylor's and what price all of those wins cost.  Arkansas, Texas who the hell ever are irrelevant to what's going on at Baylor in this instance.  Until that thought process changes nothing is fixed.

I guess his point is that Baylor was getting a lot of recruits that picked them over Texas so now they'll go there instead of Arkansas, which is a fool's take if you ask me. It's not even close to right.

[Pig in the Pokey]

Briles won big at Baylor.  His winning combined with TCU winning and A$M move to the SEC assisted in keeping Texas down.  I really enjoy watching Texas lose 5 or more games a season.  I wish it was 12.

Now the Art is out of the picture, I feel that Texas will have an easier path to find success.  It may take two seasons and a coaching change, but it is much more likely now.  I hope whoever replaces Art will find enough success to keep the foot down on Texas.  The tea sips are where they deserve to be at the bottom of the Big12.

First part seems exactly right but i don't agree with the conclusion. There just isn't enough kids going to Baylor over UT to make that much difference. They only sign 20-25 kids a year. Could help the Hogs, though, and already is. Kedrick James' just decommitted today.

[MuskogeeHogFan]

I guess his point is that Baylor was getting a lot of recruits that picked them over Texas so now they'll go there instead of Arkansas, which is a fool's take if you ask me. It's not even close to right.

Well, the real beneficiaries seem to be TCU, OU and Okla State as it relates to offensive football in the Big 12. Texas has yet to establish a real (let alone impressive) offensive identity in the Big 12 and as far as Arkansas is concerned, kids who were previously interested in Baylor's style of football will gravitate more quickly to the three I mentioned before they consider Arkansas. Now defensive players might be a different question entirely, but that is how I see if from the offensive side of the ball in terms of recruiting. JMO

[Pig in the Pokey]

Well, the real beneficiaries seem to be TCU, OU and Okla State as it relates to offensive football in the Big 12. Texas has yet to establish a real (let alone impressive) offensive identity in the Big 12 and as far as Arkansas is concerned, kids who were previously interested in Baylor's style of football will gravitate more quickly to the three I mentioned before they consider Arkansas. Now defensive players might be a different question entirely, but that is how I see if from the offensive side of the ball in terms of recruiting. JMO

agree. Kedrick James notwithstanding. I'll take the 1 four * TE!

[The Hawg Marshal]

Old Butch is starting to get some attention because of the fallout from Briles.

http://thebiglead.com/2016/05/26/when-will-we-hear-more-about-the-allegations-that-butch-jones-called-player-a-traitor-and-called-accused-players-before-they-were-investigated-by-police/

[sickboy]

football coaches or staff met directly with a complainant and/or a parent of a complainant and did not report the misconduct."

Football staff conducted their own untrained internal inquiries, outside of policy, which improperly discredited complainants and denied them the right to a fair, impartial and informed investigation, interim measures or processes promised under University policy.

Football coaches and staff took affirmative steps to maintain internal control over discipline of players and to actively divert cases from the student conduct or criminal processes.

In essence -- the staff was knowingly and actively covering up sexual assault and other misconducts by athletes by interfering with and manipulating investigations.

[greghog]

I just wish some of these talking heads would make these statements when they actually occur, not when coaches are fired. 

I saw the same thing with fans and Arkansas reporters after we fired BP.  I was opposed to firing him.  From all I know NOW, I was wrong.  So much stuff about BP started getting talked about by both fans in the know and reporters AFTER the fact.  I knew nothing about him showing his butt at the Cotton Bowl until after he was gone.  I knew nothing about him being a lazy recruiter until after he was gone. Etc. etc. 

[j-mann]

Blake Anderson  Ark St Head Coach   would be a good hire for Baylor after 2016  runs the same Off   from west Tx i think  the only bad thing is he would bring Trooper Taylor with him   

[bondhue]

No, he needs to do a little time for his involvement for propagating and covering up crimes.  I hope the justice department takes a long look at what went on there and punishes all who had a hand in it.

I think the justice department currently has its hands full not prosecuting obvious breaches of national security.

[goodguytex]

 

I think the justice department currently has its hands full not prosecuting obvious breaches of national security.

[Boardon Hamsay]

Anyone else ever notice Art Briles resembles basically anyone depicted in Genesis' "Land of Confusion" video?

[12247]

I suspect this Baylor uprising went like it does at most schools.  At first no one gives a damn if the team is winning.  So Upper management isn't noticing we folks on the field are doing all we can to field the best team possible, be dammed the folks on that team and their misgivings.  So you just keep on defending your boys until the noise gets so loud that upper management must do something if for no other reason than to save their own asses.  Then you hire someone famous to look into the potential problems and swear you got right on it just as soon as you learned there even might be a problem.  You spend hundreds of thousands learning what you already knew and then get all up in the air about it just to reassure yourself that no one can lay any blame at your feet, fire a coach or 2 or 3 or more, hold a few news conferences assuring all that your school is a stand up organization and no stone will go  unturned, though you've spent hours on end making certain your emails and files cannot turn on you.  This kind of stuff doesn't just happen if everyone does their job. 

Running any business comes down to this:  Its not that you will never have a problem, its what and how you handle that problem that defines what kind of business you are.  Baylor ain't looking so hot as a business right now.  A division of their organization is afoul of the law and all at and above the level the problem happened at is to blame.

[greasy_corner]

I suspect this Baylor uprising went like it does at most schools.  At first no one gives a damn if the team is winning.  So Upper management isn't noticing we folks on the field are doing all we can to field the best team possible, be dammed the folks on that team and their misgivings.  So you just keep on defending your boys until the noise gets so loud that upper management must do something if for no other reason than to save their own asses.  Then you hire someone famous to look into the potential problems and swear you got right on it just as soon as you learned there even might be a problem.  You spend hundreds of thousands learning what you already knew and then get all up in the air about it just to reassure yourself that no one can lay any blame at your feet, fire a coach or 2 or 3 or more, hold a few news conferences assuring all that your school is a stand up organization and no stone will go  unturned, though you've spent hours on end making certain your emails and files cannot turn on you.  This kind of stuff doesn't just happen if everyone does their job. 

Running any business comes down to this:  Its not that you will never have a problem, its what and how you handle that problem that defines what kind of business you are.  Baylor ain't looking so hot as a business right now.  A division of their organization is afoul of the law and all at and above the level the problem happened at is to blame.

What in the hell are you rambling about? 

[Vantage 8 dude]

I suspect this Baylor uprising went like it does at most schools.  At first no one gives a damn if the team is winning.  So Upper management isn't noticing we folks on the field are doing all we can to field the best team possible, be dammed the folks on that team and their misgivings.  So you just keep on defending your boys until the noise gets so loud that upper management must do something if for no other reason than to save their own asses.  Then you hire someone famous to look into the potential problems and swear you got right on it just as soon as you learned there even might be a problem.  You spend hundreds of thousands learning what you already knew and then get all up in the air about it just to reassure yourself that no one can lay any blame at your feet, fire a coach or 2 or 3 or more, hold a few news conferences assuring all that your school is a stand up organization and no stone will go  unturned, though you've spent hours on end making certain your emails and files cannot turn on you.  This kind of stuff doesn't just happen if everyone does their job. 

Running any business comes down to this:  Its not that you will never have a problem, its what and how you handle that problem that defines what kind of business you are.  Baylor ain't looking so hot as a business right now.  A division of their organization is afoul of the law and all at and above the level the problem happened at is to blame.

Totally agree with you assessment concerning running a business. However, I'll go one step further and take it down to the individual level. Yep, because we're all imperfect we're going to screw up from time-to-time. Sometimes those mistakes are minor, sometimes major. However, it's HOW we deal with the issues and address them that ultimately determines what kind of a person we really are. Unfortunately in this case Baylor continually chose to ignore/sweep the issue under the rug. Whether it was because they didn't want to face the fact they had a major program on a school wide level or the athletic program, more specifically the football program, was running amok perhaps we'll never really know. However, the one thing that we DO know and has been proven once again: dealing with a problem is best done when it first occurs. Ignoring it or hoping it will just go away on its own accord rarely works. Having the guts to admit the mistake(s) and then dealing with them directly is always the best policy. Unfortunately the school failed the students, alumni, faculty and just as importantly, its own integrity.

[ChicoHog]

Art should be the first of many to lose their job at Baylor. 

You reap what you sew.  As BB says "you recruit your own problems" and Briles has constantly recruited questionable character players ala Urban Meyer at UF.  And not holding them responsible does not help either.    Like another poster said I hope the same thing happens in Oxford. 

[(notOM)Rebel123]

I think the justice department currently has its hands full not prosecuting obvious breaches of national security.

Exactly....

[HouSwine]

Exactly....

Powell, Rice...?

[bellavistamike]

Sort of ironic for Kenneth Starr of all people to be knee deep in this mess.
Glad to know that my initial reaction to him years ago was spot on.

I thought the same. And a Baptist minister friend of mine in Texas said pretty much the same thing too. And he is a Baylor grad...

[oldhawg]

Powell, Rice...?

Whomever it applies to, past and present.

[Grizzlyfan]

Read the post to which you responded.  Herbie's role is to give his opinion on college football.  But to do so in a professional way, he has to show some level of unbias and professionalism which leads to it being understandable he didn't publicly relay his experience at Baylor.  Would have made his future commenting on their program more questionable in the view of some.

I'll answer my own question.  In no sense is Herbie a journalist.  Just as you said, he's paid to give his opinion.  No matter how professionally he dresses, or behaves, or speaks.  He is an opinion giver.  Not a journalist.  Now, how he was treated personally while in Waco has nothing to do with his opinion of the Baylor football team. 

[Tyro3]

Whomever it applies to, past and present.

Personal server was the problem.

[Atlhogfan1]

I'll answer my own question.  In no sense is Herbie a journalist.  Just as you said, he's paid to give his opinion.  No matter how professionally he dresses, or behaves, or speaks.  He is an opinion giver.  Not a journalist.  Now, how he was treated personally while in Waco has nothing to do with his opinion of the Baylor football team. 

Herbie is a little different than a talk radio host.  He is more of a "journalist" in the sense he is to be unbiased.  And there is a certain professionalism.  I understand why he wouldn't have told the story publicly before.  It is obvious people in the media have known what Briles and Baylor are including ESPN.  Herbie probably relayed this story to some colleagues which may have fueled them a little to find the truth.  Next up hopefully: Oxford and Auburn.  Knoxville not in the clear either.

I was comparing him to a talk radio host as I also mentioned Cowherd's opinion and related story.  It is why I put journalist in quotations.  He does have to maintain a level of professionalism and objectivity higher than a talk radio shock jock who is an entertainer even more so than someone like Herbstreit.  It is understandable why he didn't tell his experience earlier. 

Apparently you have some issue with him that goes beyond this conversation. 

[Pig in the Pokey]

Old Butch is starting to get some attention because of the fallout from Briles.

http://thebiglead.com/2016/05/26/when-will-we-hear-more-about-the-allegations-that-butch-jones-called-player-a-traitor-and-called-accused-players-before-they-were-investigated-by-police/

But but but Vol said their were no allegations of any shady AT ALL

[Pig in the Pokey]

Old Butch is starting to get some attention because of the fallout from Briles.

http://thebiglead.com/2016/05/26/when-will-we-hear-more-about-the-allegations-that-butch-jones-called-player-a-traitor-and-called-accused-players-before-they-were-investigated-by-police/

I TOLD him it was the same, but he said "It is not the same AT ALL, " and called me all kinds of ignorant. Stew on this quote, slimeVols....

"Given the nature of the allegations, though, a finding or more evidence coming out puts Jones in a light similar to Baylor, showing a program where the football staff intermingled with local police in a way that is no doubt common but should be unacceptable. If the allegations of calling a player who helped a victim a traitor are accepted, then the culture itself would be under as much attack as that in Waco under Briles."

[navyhog24]

Got this funny thread from a Baylor message board, thanking Art Briles for his time. There's a few gems in it.

http://www.baylorfans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=307072

"Thank you from this Baylor fan. Thank you for all you have given and done for Baylor. Before you we would get so excited if we scored over 21 points a game and only got beat by 21. I stand beside you and will never disrespect your name or your legacy."

"Thank you, Art Briles. You built Baylor football into a national power, then left without rancor when a spineless gang of cowards put face-saving ahead of ethics. You have represented the school well, as anyone paying attention to more than media noise knows well."

"We still don't have the facts, all we have is accusations and we don't even know if they are from credible sources. You're free to believe that a coach who kicked players off for weed would protect rapists, but there's no evidence of that, there's no sense in firing the coach but leaving everyone who actually handled the Title IX responsibilities and the legal administration for Baylor alone is evidence of some messed-up bias at work."

[SemperHawg]

Got this funny thread from a Baylor message board, thanking Art Briles for his time. There's a few gems in it.

http://www.baylorfans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=307072

"Thank you from this Baylor fan. Thank you for all you have given and done for Baylor. Before you we would get so excited if we scored over 21 points a game and only got beat by 21. I stand beside you and will never disrespect your name or your legacy."

"Thank you, Art Briles. You built Baylor football into a national power, then left without rancor when a spineless gang of cowards put face-saving ahead of ethics. You have represented the school well, as anyone paying attention to more than media noise knows well."

"We still don't have the facts, all we have is accusations and we don't even know if they are from credible sources. You're free to believe that a coach who kicked players off for weed would protect rapists, but there's no evidence of that, there's no sense in firing the coach but leaving everyone who actually handled the Title IX responsibilities and the legal administration for Baylor alone is evidence of some messed-up bias at work."

That stuff is unreal man...After a few years ago watching Penn St. throw a fit about taking down the statue of a man who knowingly employed and covered for a child rapist for decades, I guess I shouldn't be surprised by anything.